Thailand...Land Of Hot Hatches...What'S Coming Up In The Next 2 Years?

[steveromagnino]

So Bangkok definitely seems to be a nice city to drive a decent sportie hatch back, so I am now snooping around to consider where to next spend my money for SWMBO who has decided that my own little hatch is fun but not new enough (fair enough) and wants me to either get a new one for her, or a new one for myself and she will take mine.

So this is the list I can see exists at the moment. Cut off for a hot hatch is 0.100km in around 7.5sec and at least about 160HP preferably around 185 - 210hp is the sweet spot. I know a few others in the same situation as me from past conversations.

AUDI A1

mostly available grey market, the A1 s line 122HP is about 1.8-1.9m (waste of time but could be modified easily enough); the A1 s line 185HP is about 2.7m and the A1 mtm (a 122hp pushed up to about 175HP) is 2.3m and is the sole legit one coming from the distributor of Audi/VW/etc in Thailand and covered by warranty 100,000km/5 years (supposedly). Luxurious, but apparently drives a bit averagely...worth a test drive when the next batch reach Thailand I think

Audi A3

Just released worldwide; will take a little time to reach Thailand (guess end of 2012) for some reason S line 2 litre is slower than the current golf GTI but hard to get accurate data at this point; looks not so different to the previous version externally

BMW 1 series

Not made locally, not readily available, not exactly Beemer's forte to produce decent hot hatches anyhow

Citroen DS3

same motor as the mini but with less HP and a price of almost half at about 1.6m baht

Ford Fiesta RS

Doubt we'll see it here

Mercedes A Class

A huge departure from the A class honda jazz looking thing, it looks very very sweet but will it be made/priced similarly to the C200 or priced as an import?

Mini Cooper S

Of course a great little car (I am biased:-) with a plasticky non luxury interior yet holding outstanding resale, easy to modify, 2.8m baht but about to made obsolete with the new cooper s coming next year; will it be another step backwards from the R53 like the R56 was towards more BMW like heavier and bigger, will it still be impossible to get a manual and instead get stuck with the very average paddle shifters? Only time will tell

Peugoet

Not made locally, will the 208 reach Thailand?

Skoda

Fabia RS; polo/A1's little sister off the same platform; ugly little swine from some angles, but what a great deal 1.5m baht also MTM modified available (according to the earlier posts in the last thread)

Subaru Impreza

A beast of a 4WD, but definitely a niche brand. Any changes coming soon?

VW Golf GTI

No point in getting the Mark VI with the mark VII coming next year; a few facelifts floating around now 2.6m and Rs from the grey market similar price; the new mk7 sounds lighter, more powerful, better LSD. Supposedly VW is about to launch 100k/5 year BSI service equivalent....if it is across all Yontrakit brands this would change things a bit

VW Polo GTI

Only available grey market, why is this car not available here? Nice little beast, and more of a looker in some ways than the A1, but less plasticky than the Skoda

VW Scirocco

The Roc now has the GTS coming out in other parts of the world, same car with different graphics; just like Malcolm Maclaren packaging up the sex pistols with Sid Vicious, image masks any actual performance reflecting the GTS heritage...when will the Mk4 come out and adopt the same platform as the A3 and Golf GTI?

So...seems like the next 12 months could potentially see some pretty nice hot hatches released around the world...how many will come here?

[richard_smith237]

Audi A3 when it comes out - MTM should pimp it up nicely.

The new A Class Merc looks great...

[steveromagnino]

Audi A3 when it comes out - MTM should pimp it up nicely.

The new A Class Merc looks great...

Yeah, that new benz is the first time I really thought, man I want one. Will wait to see in person of course and for my budget, benz is usually an exec comfort car rather than an out and out sportie car (for more money obviously there are some fantastic benzes). A3 or Golf VII though? that's a tougher call!

[jay1980]

Toyota FT-86 is the same sort of money for an officially imported RWD hatchback coupe, proper 6 speed manual box available

http://www.toyota.co.th/models/86GT/86GT_Brochure.pdf

surely got to make the shortlist?

[bino]

Nissan Fairlady 370Z ? In my opinion this is a serious contender for "hot hatch", but might be "OTT" in the lineup you describe above...?

I'd be curious to know what you are driving now, that your S / O stands to inherit !

[steveromagnino]

Bina she would be getting a modified mini cooper S with a manual shift; nice little car and enjoyable to drive, but not a new car and a stop gap while I wait for the next batch of cars to come in (I chose the mini instead of a Scirocco/Golf ex demo basically). Toyota 86 absolutely should be on here, not quite a hot hatch in the traditional sense, but definitely worth considering. Nissan would be out the top end price wise and is the next rung of cars (beyond the scope of a hot hatch list I think).

The newspaper we don't mention says Benz are considering making the hatch A over here at SUB 2m, and will import prior so that is very interesting news indeed....

AUDI A1

grey A1 s line 122HP is about 1.8-1.9m (waste of time std but could be modified easily enough);

grey A1 s line 185HP is about 2.7m

A1 mtm (a 122hp pushed up to about 175HP) is 2.3m

Audi A3 TBC

BMW 1 series TBC

Citroen DS3 1.6m baht

Ford Fiesta ST unseen in Thailand so far

Mercedes A Class rumour says end of 2012 as import; possibly manufactured here in future sub 2m

Mini Cooper S 2.8m R56 replaced in 2013/14

Peugoet unseen in Thailand

Skoda Fabia RS 1.5m baht

Legit MTM modified available price unknown (I think around 1.8m)

Subaru Impreza

Toyota FT-86 2.49m a real rear wheel drive sports car no turbo though so a little slower than some of the others on this list (but a true drivers car)

VW Golf GTI Mark VI facelifts 2.6m

grey VW Golf mark VI Rs 2.6m;

new mk7 coming 2013 sounds lighter, more powerful, better LSD with 100k/5 year BSI service equivalent

grey VW Polo GTI 1.8m

VW Scirocco mark 3 2.6m

[KeyserSoze01]

Mini Cooper S

Of course a great little car (I am biased:-) with a plasticky non luxury interior yet holding outstanding resale, easy to modify, 2.8m baht but about to made obsolete with the new cooper s coming next year; will it be another step backwards from the R53 like the R56 was towards more BMW like heavier and bigger, will it still be impossible to get a manual and instead get stuck with the very average paddle shifters? Only time will tell

I priced a Mini JCW in Bangkok and about fell out of my chair. In farangland I have a modified R53 and IMO is second only to sex on the fun meter. I would love to import one, but have been advised that the duties and headaches make it a non-starter.

[frankphuket]

To add to this:

The Skoda RS (I test drove it 2 weeks ago in Bangkok): Nice drive, in low revs I would say it is even more entertainining than my Mk VI GTI (bought 1 1/2 month ago). A bit stiffer and more involving than the GTI. Looks, well, inside quality is ok, not the most creative design wise, but good value with 5 years free maintenance and warranty. MTM tuned to 205 hp cost is 1.65m incl. tuning i would guess.

I also test drove a very lightly (3,500 km POLO GTI) for about 1.55m. Surely nicer in design, a bit stiffer than the RS.

The Toyota GT 86 will surely be nice, but worry it won't be 'fast enough'.

Merc A class, nice but not sure price range....

Really pretty dim what is available here....

[frankphuket]

I am still selling my MINI GP though, in case if somebody is interested. 16000miles and in perfect condition. 1.8m! Cheers, Frank

[devilish]

I sat inside the Toyota 86 at the Bkk auto show: was really impressed with the seating/steering wheel/position. It just felt perfect. This is a 2-door sports-car more than a hot hatch, tho

[KeyserSoze01]

I sat inside the Toyota 86 at the Bkk auto show: was really impressed with the seating/steering wheel/position. It just felt perfect. This is a 2-door sports-car more than a hot hatch, tho

You have a GP, in Thailand? Those things are as rare as hen's teeth in the west, much less in Thailand.

Edited June 19, 2012 by KeyserSoze01

[mjj]

I would pick the Toyota 86 just because it's rear wheel drive. True, my car ownership history has not been all that illustrious, mk1 scirocco, mk 1 and 2 crx's and a seat Leon Cupra R with 265 bhp to name a gew of the highlights. Now I have a Ford Ranger (2011 model) with a plug in tuning box. Sure the Cupra was quite quick, but I do love power sliding the Ranger around corners with a handful of opposite lock and the occasional 4 wheel drift.

Even though I haven't driven the cars named in the previous posts, I would bet I would be grinning more after getting out of the Toyota.

Is it the same price for the Subaru and Scion clones?

[steveromagnino]

I think there are 2 GPs in Thailand, one in Phuket, one in Bangkok, but not 100% sure on that. No doubt even though there is another 2000 units production run GP coming out this year based on the R56 platform, the original 2006 GP is going to be the collector's car in the future.

KeyserSoze; the new minis here are expensive and the R53 holds its value VERY well, my brother is looking at buying one abroad for a fraction of what they cost here. While it hurts upfront, the resale is strong also as the original minis from 20-30 years ago are now close to 1m baht for a mint one as well. Relatively cheap to run through the usual mods (cat back exhaust, supercharger pulley, ECU etc). The interior of the R53 really is a bit average though, and the R56 dash is even worse!

[frankphuket]

I sat inside the Toyota 86 at the Bkk auto show: was really impressed with the seating/steering wheel/position. It just felt perfect. This is a 2-door sports-car more than a hot hatch, tho

You have a GP, in Thailand? Those things are as rare as hen's teeth in the west, much less in Thailand.

Yep, I do, there are a few here in Thailand....but mine is the nicest.

Problem is Thais don't like manuals...or most of them, so not really value the GP as this special model it is.

It is an absolute blast to drive...but financially I just can't keep it plus my GTI and practically I need 4 seats...which the GP does not have.

The GP is definitely more fun than the GTI....just so raw and pure!

[frankphuket]

Ahem, not exactly hot hatch....would kill anything above mentioned though and seems in good condition:

http://www.siamspeed.com/index.php/topic,218209.0.html

By the way, additional input for manual lovers: The Citroen DS3 with the detuned MINI Cooper S engine comes only in manual! Should be a nice drive (looking at reviews), a tad small though.

Wish the new DS4 would have a bit more power and a stick than this would be one great looking car....

[ignis]

Seen new here on red plates.......

It is a hatch, with sport car name...... Is it a hot hatch ?

2012 Aston Martin Cygnet

[Big Guns]

You've missed out the only affordable 'warm' hatch which is the new 170 bhp 969,000- 1,079,000 THB Ford Focus available from August. Unfortunately Thailand isn't the land of hot hatches because of zero local demand, crap roads and the government's protectionist policies. Thailand is the land of diesel pickups and scooters

[frankphuket]

You've missed out the only affordable 'warm' hatch which is the new 170 bhp 969,000- 1,079,000 THB Ford Focus available from August. Unfortunately Thailand isn't the land of hot hatches because of zero local demand, crap roads and the government's protectionist policies. Thailand is the land of diesel pickups and scooters

Not quite sure how 'warm' this Focus will be, have read rather 'dull' reviews of it. Shame they don't bring the ecoboost engines, that should be nice....but this normal aspired 2.0 Ford engine isn't the greatest performer if I believe those reviews out there....on paper the 170hp look good....but than i have not driven one yet to give a decent opinion.

[steveromagnino]

yeah, wouldn't have thought the 170HP version was enough to get into hot territory as that's not much power for a medium sized car and no turbo/supercharger to play around with; the fiesta ST and focus ST? high performance turboed ones and mazda 3 speed all would rate highly in my list, but you can't get them here.

I looked at the DS3 over the weekend, and it was definitely a paddle shifter car, not a manual; still amazingly cheap if you ask me compared to the Mini R56; would worry a little on the resale due to lack of cars in the market; interior easily more luxurious than most if a bit 'metrosexual', mind you I am not sure how manly any tiny hatch can be other than the GP (assuming people know what it is).

With about 2,000+ cooper s's on the road, a few hundred VWs, and now an increasing number of Audis and the like, while it isn't hot hatch heaven here, you can at least get a few decent cars these days. I still remember the theory that 'Thai people don't buy hatchbacks' until Honda launched the Jazz which crushed that sized category.....hopefully through the AEC we are going to see some cheaper performance hatches in the near future.....

AUDI A1

grey A1 s line 122HP is about 1.8-1.9m (waste of time std but could be modified easily enough);

grey A1 s line 185HP is about 2.7m

A1 mtm (a 122hp pushed up to about 175HP) is 2.3m

Audi A3 TBC

BMW 1 series TBC

Citroen DS3 1.6m baht

Fiat Abarth 500 2.9m baht

Ford Fiesta ST unseen in Thailand so far

Mercedes A Class rumour says end of 2012 as import; possibly manufactured here in future sub 2m

Mini Cooper S 2.8m R56 (replaced in 2013/14)

Peugoet unseen in Thailand

Skoda Fabia RS 1.5m baht

Legit MTM modified available price unknown (I think around 1.8m)

Subaru Impreza 2.9m baht (will paste pretty much all the other cars here with only the Golf R 4WD holding close)

Toyota FT-86 2.49m a real rear wheel drive sports car no turbo though so a little slower than some of the others on this list (but a true drivers car)

VW Golf GTI Mark VI facelifts 2.6m

grey VW Golf mark VI Rs 2.6m;

new mk7 coming 2013 sounds lighter, more powerful, better LSD with 100k/5 year BSI service equivalent

grey VW Polo GTI 1.6 - 1.8m

VW Scirocco mark 3 2.6m

[VocalNeal]

Disappointing that DAD want 150,000 extra for the MTM if this info is correct. Sure it has to be sent here and there is duty to pay but 3.0 times what MTM in Germany want, retail? Maybe they have to carry the warranty risk? Who knows? I don't object to a business making money but.....

Still my money would be on Skoda.

Edited June 21, 2012 by VocalNeal

[ignis]

Guess the Honda Jazz could be the cheaper option, drive down to Malaysia and a visit to Mugen, a Jazz with the power plant from the Civic Mugen RR 2 lt engine, upgrade brakes and wheels, with body kit as you want, if you want..

[frankphuket]

yeah, wouldn't have thought the 170HP version was enough to get into hot territory as that's not much power for a medium sized car and no turbo/supercharger to play around with; the fiesta ST and focus ST? high performance turboed ones and mazda 3 speed all would rate highly in my list, but you can't get them here.

I looked at the DS3 over the weekend, and it was definitely a paddle shifter car, not a manual; still amazingly cheap if you ask me compared to the Mini R56; would worry a little on the resale due to lack of cars in the market; interior easily more luxurious than most if a bit 'metrosexual', mind you I am not sure how manly any tiny hatch can be other than the GP (assuming people know what it is).

With about 2,000+ cooper s's on the road, a few hundred VWs, and now an increasing number of Audis and the like, while it isn't hot hatch heaven here, you can at least get a few decent cars these days. I still remember the theory that 'Thai people don't buy hatchbacks' until Honda launched the Jazz which crushed that sized category.....hopefully through the AEC we are going to see some cheaper performance hatches in the near future.....

AUDI A1

grey A1 s line 122HP is about 1.8-1.9m (waste of time std but could be modified easily enough);

grey A1 s line 185HP is about 2.7m

A1 mtm (a 122hp pushed up to about 175HP) is 2.3m

Audi A3 TBC

BMW 1 series TBC

Citroen DS3 1.6m baht

Fiat Abarth 500 2.9m baht

Ford Fiesta ST unseen in Thailand so far

Mercedes A Class rumour says end of 2012 as import; possibly manufactured here in future sub 2m

Mini Cooper S 2.8m R56 (replaced in 2013/14)

Peugoet unseen in Thailand

Skoda Fabia RS 1.5m baht

Legit MTM modified available price unknown (I think around 1.8m)

Subaru Impreza 2.9m baht (will paste pretty much all the other cars here with only the Golf R 4WD holding close)

Toyota FT-86 2.49m a real rear wheel drive sports car no turbo though so a little slower than some of the others on this list (but a true drivers car)

VW Golf GTI Mark VI facelifts 2.6m

grey VW Golf mark VI Rs 2.6m;

new mk7 coming 2013 sounds lighter, more powerful, better LSD with 100k/5 year BSI service equivalent

grey VW Polo GTI 1.6 - 1.8m

VW Scirocco mark 3 2.6m

What I understand, and I only have been once to Citroen Bangkok, that the120 VTI engine (non-turbo) has a 4 speed auto and the 156 THP (Mini Cooper S detuned engine) has only a 6 speed manual. This would also confirm in the UK website. At that time, about half year ago i did ask about an auto option for the turbo engine and the answer was a clear "Mai Mee"! Not that I would bet any big money on this...as we all know car sales staff are not the most informed people about what they are selling.

Agree with you that the DS3 has certainly that little "hairdresser" or slightly "metrosexual" image....and compare it to the GP (which I would agree is pretty manly) would probably better suit a lady. For me in the end it was just a little too small, i could have lived with the design and liked the interior. Did you have a look at the DS4, not much more expensive, but wow, what an interior for this price! Shame about the gearbox...otherwise quite stunning.

....and in another subject: I found the 'perfect' caretakers car.... ..... Skoda Superb VAN....this is one BIG car, in black with black windows i am sure you get a coffin inside!

[frankphuket]

Disappointing that DAD want 150,000 extra for the MTM if this info is correct. Sure it has to be sent here and there is duty to pay but 3.0 times what MTM in Germany want, retail? Maybe they have to carry the warranty risk? Who knows? I don't object to a business making money but.....

Still my money would be on Skoda.

Info I got from Skoda Sales last 2 weeks ago, during my test drive of the Fabia RS: Price: 1,539,000, tuning 80,000. Discount without pushing 50,000 cash or free tuning. I ask if i could get both please....and he said need to discuss....so I would say there would be a good change of getting the car to around 1,489,000 and free tuning to 205hp. 5 years warranty and free maintenance.... This is one sweet hot hatch deal, if you can live with the desing and brand name! For Me: Brand i could, design I would need to do some tweaking....

[VocalNeal]

.if you can live with the desing and brand name! For Me: Brand i could, design I would need to do some tweaking....

Something wrong with Skoda?

Very old and established European auto company. Got the sh1t kicked out of them during the brief experience under Soviet rule but that wasn't their fault. They were the best Soviet built cars. Then got scooped up by VW 18 years ago.. Current IRC champions ahead of Ford(M-sport), Peugeot, Renault, Citroen, Subaru, Abarth.

People who would diss a vRS are either ill-informed, jealous or mistakenly bought a Ford! If you are worried what people think be safe and join the Mercedes society. Boring as sh1t but a safe choice.

As for design well as the song goes "If you wanna be happy for the rest of your life. Never make a pretty woman your wife"

Remove the vRS badges and people may think what they want, from behind!

spot the troll?

Edited June 22, 2012 by VocalNeal

[frankphuket]

.if you can live with the desing and brand name! For Me: Brand i could, design I would need to do some tweaking....

Something wrong with Skoda?

Very old and established European auto company. Got the sh1t kicked out of them during the brief experience under Soviet rule but that wasn't their fault. They were the best Soviet built cars. Then got scooped up by VW 18 years ago.. Current IRC champions ahead of Ford(M-sport), Peugeot, Renault, Citroen, Subaru, Abarth.

People who would diss a vRS are either ill-informed, jealous or mistakenly bought a Ford! If you are worried what people think be safe and join the Mercedes society. Boring as sh1t but a safe choice.

As for design well as the song goes "If you wanna be happy for the rest of your life. Never make a pretty woman your wife"

Remove the vRS badges and people may think what they want, from behind!

spot the troll?

I guess you missed my point: I DO like Skodas, i believe the vRS is great, especially for the price, but yes for Thailand Skoda has yet to make an impact and need more customer awareness. I was actually on the verge to buy the vRS, but finally ended up with a Golf MK6 GTI.

My issue with the vRS was not the brand, but the rather bland interior and not very interesting exterior. Let's say i drove the vRS first and than the POLO GTI....i can tell you the POLO was on the same level as my GOLF GTI, but the vRS was definitely a class lower.

I am all for Skodas, they have some very interesting products at the price level: the Fabia vRS, the Superb (a class leader if you just spend a couple of hundered more than for a Camry or Teana...in my opinion), the YETI (although i wish they would bring the 1.8TSI engine and 4WD and if they could keep it under 2m, than this would be the SUV for the Thai market to beat.....but they don't, already checked and the 1.2 engine without 4WD at 1.5m something is just not really doing it for me).

So, yes to Skoda....keep it up, get your website organized, better awareness and they could be on to something good!

[steveromagnino]

Skoda fabia exterior and interior styling is just awfully plain and grand dad like; the inards of the car are awesome and a worked one, if it even looked like a suzuki swift, I would have got one.

Also the so far yet to be seen dealer support is less strong than VW and other brands.

Frank I saw the DS3 with my own eyes and it was an auto with paddle shifters. Last weekend. A horrid 'metrosexual' colour combo as well, both that and the Skoda they are very close to a category leading car, but just need a few tweaks to make it work and a dealer network.

I do see quite a few DS3s, maybe just a few less than Audi A1s these days.

[mjj]

About 8 years ago I had an Audi A1 as a hire car in Germany. At the time I confidently said that it was the worst car I have ever driven - and I've driven some right old junk. Now, I can't remember what was wrong in particular, just that nothing was right about it.

[richard_smith237]

About 8 years ago I had an Audi A1 as a hire car in Germany. At the time I confidently said that it was the worst car I have ever driven - and I've driven some right old junk. Now, I can't remember what was wrong in particular, just that nothing was right about it.

An A1 8 Years ago ?

[steveromagnino]

a3 more likely?

My brother and many friends were adamant I should not buy an Audi due to the big spend on nice interiors, and lousy mechanicals. I am not sure how much I believe that.

The mini mechanicals are a bit average, but then again so was my Beemer; some odd ideas for cost effective engineering in 'Yeraman' (closed systems you cannot repair, large parts needed to replace small parts, etc). But I think it's all a much of a muchness, modern cars are for the most part all pretty decent unless you give them severe thrashings. When they break down you cannot fix much yourself unless you know what you are doing, which I don't.

The pick up truck I owned is the least fragile; I've given that thing death for 8 years and it's still mint. But I didn't buy a hot hatch for reliability, I bought it to score (joking)

Edited June 22, 2012 by steveromagnino

[mjj]

Not an A1 huh? Maybe I'm a bit stoopid this afternoon. What was the smallest Audi around 2002. It was like a tiny mpv thingy. Done a little google and nothing......maybe I was on a parallel

Universe or something.