Thailand...Land Of Hot Hatches...What'S Coming Up In The Next 2 Years?

[mjj]

Found it - A2, my bad.

[VocalNeal]

Skoda fabia exterior and interior styling is just awfully plain and grand dad like; the inards of the car are awesome

But I didn't buy a hot hatch for reliability, I bought it to score (joking)

All guys buy cars to score and well this is where so called grand dad but maybe not the styling is important. Grand dad knew then, and still would today, that to score you have to spend money on the woman to impress her, not simply have a flash motor with no substance. Women don't really care what the car is only maybe the colour and that it is clean. Buying the car is for you not for her. A woman would rather you had simply a nice car and spent money on her rather than spending money on the flash car. It is about who is more important her or the car.

Really want to score? Spend the money on a nicer apartment or living space, take the woman to an expensive club or resort. As an example spend money on champagne to impress. When you are in a club trying to score no one inside knows what car you have outside, so by the time she has made the decision to come with you in your car it doesn't rally matter if is is a Skoda or an Audi or a Toyota.

At least this is what my grand dad told me.

[frankphuket]

Skoda fabia exterior and interior styling is just awfully plain and grand dad like; the inards of the car are awesome and a worked one, if it even looked like a suzuki swift, I would have got one.

Also the so far yet to be seen dealer support is less strong than VW and other brands.

Frank I saw the DS3 with my own eyes and it was an auto with paddle shifters. Last weekend. A horrid 'metrosexual' colour combo as well, both that and the Skoda they are very close to a category leading car, but just need a few tweaks to make it work and a dealer network.

I do see quite a few DS3s, maybe just a few less than Audi A1s these days.

I sure believe you, but you know there are 2 DS3: the lesser engine with auto and the more powerful one with manual gear....anyway...it also came close in my choice, but the styling was a bit too feminine for me as well.

[steveromagnino]

Skoda fabia exterior and interior styling is just awfully plain and grand dad like; the inards of the car are awesome

But I didn't buy a hot hatch for reliability, I bought it to score (joking)

All guys buy cars to score and well this is where so called grand dad but maybe not the styling is important. . least this is what my grand dad told me.

I

I'm joking on the scoring bit; those who know me are well aware I am already taken. IN fact SWMBO (she who must be obeyed) is the one pushing for me to get a decent car, and now a 2nd decent one so she gets one also.

I describe the Skoda as a car with the styling of yesteryear, because it is, compared to stable mates the Audi A1 and VW Polo.

Frank, the one I saw had the same prince? motor with a turbo as the mini R56, but on paper is a little slower due to the way it is tuned.

[Tanaka]

A two-seater and not a hatch but definetly one with some of the most fun in Thailand. A Westfield. It will outrun just about everything here on a twisting road. Price around 1,3M I think.

[ignis]

The Subaru Impreza Hatch starts @ 1.1 million, the 2.5 WRX hot hatch being 2.4 million..........

Far cheaper and bigger than a Mini

[steveromagnino]

If you factor in depreciation, I am not sure if the WRX is 'cheaper' than a Mini Cooper S. The std impreza and cooper or One minis are not even close to 'hot' so we can take them off the list.

That said, the Subarus definitely have their fans and the 4WD plus big motors make them clean out the category of hot hatches for the most part. Easily modified as well.

Impreza 2.5 WRX 2.42m (best value for money; vs. approx 2.6m baht for the Mini Cooper S look 1)

Impreza 2.5 WRX STI 3.96m

Impreza 2.5 WRX STI A-line (whatever that is) 3.85m

If my understanding is correct, the Impreza is actually a 2011 model (around about) here, so relatively new in the scheme of things when most of the other hatches are anywhere from 2006/7 onwards.

Is it true that they require 95 octane and cannot run on gasohol>? I have been told this in the past.

Edited June 27, 2012 by steveromagnino

[frankphuket]

If you factor in depreciation, I am not sure if the WRX is 'cheaper' than a Mini Cooper S. The std impreza and cooper or One minis are not even close to 'hot' so we can take them off the list.

That said, the Subarus definitely have their fans and the 4WD plus big motors make them clean out the category of hot hatches for the most part. Easily modified as well.

Impreza 2.5 WRX 2.42m (best value for money; vs. approx 2.6m baht for the Mini Cooper S look 1)

Impreza 2.5 WRX STI 3.96m

Impreza 2.5 WRX STI A-line (whatever that is) 3.85m

If my understanding is correct, the Impreza is actually a 2011 model (around about) here, so relatively new in the scheme of things when most of the other hatches are anywhere from 2006/7 onwards.

Is it true that they require 95 octane and cannot run on gasohol>? I have been told this in the past.

About Subies: to my knowledge the excisting WRX is at least a couple of years old model (in other markets) as the NEW model looks like a STI with bigger wheel arches, etc....they won't bring it into Thailand, otherwise they can't sell the STI anymore.

The STI A-Line is the automatic version....but than again, why would somebody buy an auto STI....

The issue for me with Subies is that they rather look bland interior design wise...like the Fabia vRS or even worse.

I was interested in the Forester XT, with the WRX engine and a better interior...should be quite fun here, but they don't sell it anymore....of course it is still on their website...but their website is as good as Skodas.... ....

It really bugs me if a Car company investing millions in Thailand can't even put a ok website together. Look even at volvo... Must say Benz, BMW, Toyota, Nissan and Honda are miles above the rest.

Poor are in my view: Subaru, Citroen, Skoda, VW....and the worse MTM own website...updated maybe 2 years ago!

[steveromagnino]

Actually, I completely agree; the Subaru and motorimage have all this cash to advertise on TV...but can't do a decent website or carry the latest model, what's up with that?

Doesn't surpise me that the Impreza is older; that would explain the pricing. This would make it the facelift 2007 generation, so similar to the Mini Cooper S R56 (running to the end of its life, and actually replaced elsewhere).

I did go and take a look at the Skoda Fabia in person; actually interior wise it isn't bad, with 200HP it would be a beast...but just that exterior shape, for goodness sake! more space than a Mini, more power at 1/2 the price of a JCW....I did ask when they would be bringing out the next generation shape (the A1 and the polo is already a generation ahead of the Fabia it seems) but sounds like the Fabia we see now is there for a while longer. I have taken a look at the polo GTI but the lack of cars on the road and no servicing arrangement (since VW in their wisdom don't bring them in) means its mini time for a bit longer yet and SWMBO is out of luck for now.

The thing that mostly puts me off the Subaru other than the rather ugly boyracer massive air intake taking up the entire bonnet space, is the fear I would probably push it hard enough to end up on the side of the road somewhere :-) That said if the Impreza XV does actually start getting made in Malaysia, I presume that will be a cost saving and might make the Subie very hard to say no to as a sort of SUV forrester type vehicle.

[frankphuket]

Steve, agree with you completely, i could (if i have to) live with the interior of the Fabia, but the exterior is harder to get used to. it just stands so high and even a Ford Fiesta looks nicer (IMHO). I tried to look into options design wise and found a few things which would make it better. Eibach springs to lower it by 10mm or so, taking away a little on the height, than doing something with stickers to give a bit of a cooler look, or rather to hide the fact it does look to high....but in the end, it can be slightly improved, but not to my design liking.

....i keep on looking to, hope there is light on the horizon...some time.

[steveromagnino]

If Polo GTI with 208HP was available here legitimately via ABT/VW (MTM doesn't do VW here) that would be my ride; the A1 is essentially a smaller version of the same car for more money.

Mini is very nice, but the interior is a bit plasticky but nice in the 53 but not so great in the R56 (the integrated speedo and stereo is simply wrong and horrid), although the seats are better in the newer ones than the 53.

I know the Toyota 86 is up there too and would be a fun car to drift around a bit despite the relatively mild amount of grunt, but the concept of a hot hatch is that it really needs the pep of a supercharger, turbo charger or best of all both to make the car sprint around town.

Like you, I'm waiting for the 'killer app' of hot hatches to come around; I reckon in the next 18 months for sure we will find something we both can sink our teeth into :-)

[VocalNeal]

It really bugs me if a Car company investing millions in Thailand can't even put a ok website together.

Are you buying a car or a website?

I did go and take a look at the Skoda Fabia in person; actually interior wise it isn't bad, with 200HP it would be a beast...but just that exterior shape, for goodness sake! more space than a Mini, more power at 1/2 the price of a JCW....

I quite like the understated cloth cap look. Says self confessed Mr. Understatement. it has a Q-car written all over it! . As I said before take the vRS badges (2) off. Put a black Monte Carlo grill on it?

You and I might know what it is but to the average person they wouldn't know unil the back of it started getting smaller and smaller and smaller.....

Audi is nice but a bit gaudy and girly. I foresee this as the next Mia Noi car.

Edited June 28, 2012 by VocalNeal

[mjj]

What are you guys looking for in a car, without stating the obvious?

I ask, as fun for me in a car in order would be acceleration, twisties, then top speed. Acceleration for the green factor and overtaking and seeing someone disappear in your rear view. Next is the twisties which I believe is more fun in a rear wheel drive car. Last but not least is top speed. I driven at over 150 mph and it's fun and a rush of adrenalin, but it isn't a patch on the fun to be had on a twisting road.

With this is mind I'm wondering why some of you would opt for a hot hatch instead of the Toyota. Horses for courses I know and not meant as a slight on any of you, just curious to know where you get most enjoyment from.

[frankphuket]

What are you guys looking for in a car, without stating the obvious?

I ask, as fun for me in a car in order would be acceleration, twisties, then top speed. Acceleration for the green factor and overtaking and seeing someone disappear in your rear view. Next is the twisties which I believe is more fun in a rear wheel drive car. Last but not least is top speed. I driven at over 150 mph and it's fun and a rush of adrenalin, but it isn't a patch on the fun to be had on a twisting road.

With this is mind I'm wondering why some of you would opt for a hot hatch instead of the Toyota. Horses for courses I know and not meant as a slight on any of you, just curious to know where you get most enjoyment from.

To the other question: buy car or website....? of course car, but it would make it easier if info about the cars are provided in the website, like pricing, etc. Can you find pricing on the Volvo website, or Skoda website or Citroen. well no....this is what i am complaining about.

I am with you on the fun in twisties part and of course acceleration...there the Skoda or Polo GTI or the hot hatches mentioned would surely be more fun than the GT-86....in twisties, not sure...have not driven the GT-86, so verdict to be seen. I am not going drifting, so that is not really an important factor to me. Practicality however is, would like 4 seats, easy access, etc.

Sure, once the GT-86 is in the showrooms I will closely look at it....but never was a Toyota fan...which can change. Never was a Ford fan in my youth, yet my last car was one. Did not think i would buy a VW either 10 years ago...but have one now.

Would i buy it in Europe, maybe not! So much more choice....we just have to get what we can here, which is rather limiting.

So, let's all keep our eyes and ears open for the 'right' hot hatch or sport car coming our ways...for less than 2m if possible! haha

[mjj]

I'm sure it's just a matter of time before more fun cars are to arrive here. Any news on the copy gt86? There is a Scooby one and the Scion. Then there is the Hyundai's Veloster...... I miss fun cars :-(

The most fun car I've been in was the Honda s2000, that car SCREAMS to its redline.

[steveromagnino]

For me as I mostly drive in the city, and weekly down the beach/out of town, I know roughly how I drive and what I enjoy.

- should zippily accelerate well up to about 120km (don't generally drive much quicker than that)

- small enough to park easily, small car type handling

- sit low on the road, not too much body roll, predictable when it lets go (which I will push it to do often) and plenty of feedback in the corners

- look reasonably decent, can seat 3 including a full size person in the back, also room to carry luggage etc

- can handle Thai fuel, roads, etc without major problems

- not unacceptable resale (I am not a charity)

- manual or DSG (no autos)

Top speed not so important; drifting or front wheel led sliding both enjoyable part of the whole cornering charm of a car.

My favourite past car I owned were 2 modified Daihatsu Charade GtTI....so you can see where this is heading.

I don't buy a website, true. But if they can't run a decent website, they usually have not great resale because they don't have a good marketing strategy; not so good on the resale issue and possibly service also.

Toyota I will definitely try out when it comes out; but probably not quite what I am looking for; great value though no question. Subie will probably cost more, resale worse and reviews say the toyota is slightly better (from what I have seen), but will wait and see. If I understand correctly, the GT86 is doing 0-100 in around 7.5 seconds...the mini, golf, Polo etc are all quicker than that and you can modify a little for even more pop, plus they feel small so the perception of speed is even better.

Veloster looks the part, but AFAIK is actually relatively small engined.

[funcat]

This Skoda looks good to me...

[ignis]

[VocalNeal]

For me as I mostly drive in the city, and weekly down the beach/out of town, I know roughly how I drive and what I enjoy.

- should zippily accelerate well up to about 120km (don't generally drive much quicker than that)

- small enough to park easily, small car type handling

- sit low on the road, not too much body roll, predictable when it lets go (which I will push it to do often) and plenty of feedback in the corners

- look reasonably decent, can seat 3 including a full size person in the back, also room to carry luggage etc

- can handle Thai fuel, roads, etc without major problems

- not unacceptable resale (I am not a charity)

- manual or DSG (no autos)

Top speed not so important; drifting or front wheel led sliding both enjoyable part of the whole cornering charm of a car.

Well that's pretty much it for me as well and as long as it doesn't look butt ugly. Less attractive is OK and long as it produces. For unselfish reasons rather than monetary it should have reasonable fuel economy. That is what draws me to Skoda regardless of what others think. Now where is that lottery ticket?

[ignis]

Not sure if it will be 'Hot' but next year built in Thailand will be the Chevy Trax confirmed will use normal 1.6 and the 140hp 1.4-litre petrol-turbo.. Baby SUV

If the price is right maybe an option ?

Edited June 29, 2012 by ignis

[steveromagnino]

No one puts Baby (SUVs) in a corner. Could be interesting, for sure. The world seems to be embracing turbos etc...which is always a good thing for getting more power out of things. 140HP seems a bit on the low side though, but then again who knows what you can fiddle.

Those images of 3 door modified Skodas look a million times better than the 5 door Fabia I saw at Paragon with the geriatric Lexus IS250 style grill...however the more I look at it the more I am convinced I will have to take one for a test drive, if they have an MTM 204HP one to try out. At 1.5m that has to be the best bang for bucks, with DAD's new 100k/5 years BSI equivalent, it really is a no brainer. It isn't that much uglier than the R56 minis (which i don't really like so much vs the R53/GP obviously) but looks just so much nicer as a 3 door than the 5 door.

But I still feel it is kind of like dating the girl with the 'perfect personality', dad owns a brewery, but a body and face made for radio. Yes, sure she is up for anything and your parents love her to death, but at the end of the day, one day, when a skanky perfect 10 model offers you her body, and you have to turn it down because you already made a commitment to the 'great personality', won't you want to gnaw your own arm off the next time she falls asleep on it, dreaming of InNOut monster style?

[frankphuket]

Happy to hear that now a few of you are taking a liking to the Fabia vRS, which I believe i have brought into the discussion in different threads.

Go and test it and I truly believe you will feel even better about it....as you sit inside, not looking at the exterior design flaws, and there it goes like skunk...in the 180hp version (they don't have a test drive on the modded one). As said i compare it to my tuned to 260 hp GTI and can say that the feeling in the first 2 gears is as strong or even stronger than the GTI due to the supercharger (my test was about 30 min in Bangkok....so, hard to test suspension for 'fun in twisties' factor. It is a smaller car and probably more noise comes in, so the feeling is of more speed. This is similar in the comparison of my MINI GP to the GTI, at same speed I think i am doing much more in the GP. If I would not have decided on the GTI (the deal at 1.9m new was just to good) i would have gone to Skoda. The vRS comes surely closer in character to my GP than the GTI....and I would say this is not a bad thing! it has less 'toys' inside, which i don't think is a bad thing, coz sometimes even the GTI with all the different options are a bit fuzzy. Seats in the Fabia by the way are very nice, same level as the excellent GTI seats - and i need a good seat (screwed up back).

Bang for the buck....FABIA vRS...no doubt. I think in white with black roof and a little creative ideas like blackening the font grill and the rear pillar and it might not be as 'ugly' anymore.

[steveromagnino]

U got a NEW GTI Golf for 1.9m????? An ex demo one, or actually brand brand new???

yes, would never have considered a skoda if not for you.....If you feel like giving me your GP as a tip I will accept also ;-)

[frankphuket]

U got a NEW GTI Golf for 1.9m????? An ex demo one, or actually brand brand new???

yes, would never have considered a skoda if not for you.....If you feel like giving me your GP as a tip I will accept also ;-)

NEW, was lucky as the grey importer F1 bought more than 10 of this model and mine was the last one in stock and they wanted to make space for new cars and sold it at loss...their loss, my gain. It had 25km on it! full spec, but no warranty, which I thought was ok for the price...how much can go wrong to justify the price difference to official dealer of 600000.

My GP is for sales, as i can't keep 3 cars and my wife won't touch the GP as it is manual. Will have quite heavy loss on it, as i bought it for 2.1m last year and put in another 180,000 to make it perfect and put in a high end sound system. It is advertised now for 1.8m....and anyway I should get something from you for the good tip!

[funcat]

I know that nobody here is going to get to excited about it,but I saw a All-New Focus last weekend and this thing looks great IMO...and I hope that the stock 170 HP can be "tweaked " to much more(RS has 300HP I believe)...the 5DR Sport is 969K !!

[steveromagnino]

Both the ST Fiesta and the the Focus RS/ST?(cannot recall the names) get Polo GTI/Golf GTI beating reviews, it is possible although unlikely we might see one or both coming in at some point, but not as locally assembled cars. I would definitely be more up for a Fiesta ST than the big brother.

Actually the Focus is on the possible list for the GF, for the price you can't really go wrong. I have had however a fairly poor experience with Ford as have many, the last 18 months waiting for the wildtrack 3.2 Ranger and being dicked around; personally I think they are just inept at a senior planning/production level, at a dealer level, well my dealer anyhow, they seem very customer focused (and just as frustrated).

Not sure where you saw the Focus, I was told they would be in showrooms in another month?

What exactly is the duratech engine? Is it the ecoboost turbo engine or not? If not, then maybe not so easy to slightly tweak to get an extra 20HP like a turboed or supercharged car. A couple of small parts in a mini (15% supercharger pulley), exhaust, air intake, and you can get an extra 20HP easy. 200HP in a focus, now that would start to be real fun.

This model here isn't badly specced, presumably being built in Thailand?

http://www.ford.com.au/cars/focus/models/titanium-hatch

[Big Guns]

The top model Focus Sport+ which I've now ordered comes with the full spec of the Australian model as standard i.e it also includes the sunroof, Xenons, cruise, City stop and the self parking system. It has 17 inch wheels not the Aussie models 18 inchers. The wife's new Focus arrives 1st week in August. It might just tempt me to get off my new Ducati

[funcat]

Both the ST Fiesta and the the Focus RS/ST?(cannot recall the names) get Polo GTI/Golf GTI beating reviews, it is possible although unlikely we might see one or both coming in at some point, but not as locally assembled cars. I would definitely be more up for a Fiesta ST than the big brother.

Actually the Focus is on the possible list for the GF, for the price you can't really go wrong. I have had however a fairly poor experience with Ford as have many, the last 18 months waiting for the wildtrack 3.2 Ranger and being dicked around; personally I think they are just inept at a senior planning/production level, at a dealer level, well my dealer anyhow, they seem very customer focused (and just as frustrated).

Not sure where you saw the Focus, I was told they would be in showrooms in another month?

What exactly is the duratech engine? Is it the ecoboost turbo engine or not? If not, then maybe not so easy to slightly tweak to get an extra 20HP like a turboed or supercharged car. A couple of small parts in a mini (15% supercharger pulley), exhaust, air intake, and you can get an extra 20HP easy. 200HP in a focus, now that would start to be real fun.

This model here isn't badly specced, presumably being built in Thailand?

http://www.ford.com..../titanium-hatch

It looked like this Australian model...there was a mini pre-show at the Airport Plaza in CM over the weekend...I've even tested that Self Parking thingy...and it worked ...the engines are special 2L direct injection..sorry no knowledge of the rest..

[steveromagnino]

Value for money the Fords sound pretty good.

Took a good hard look at a Citroen last night, in fact I stand corrected and realise it is important to speak to a sales person with full knowledge. The Citroen DS3 with decent HP (around 160, sporting the detuned prince mini engine turbo) is available both as a manual and an auto/paddleshifter, for around 1.699m baht. No idea why it should be so much cheaper than a Mini given it is roughly the same price abroad and has the same engine although with less power.

Had a good look at an R53 and JCW R56 mini (the first and 2nd gen one) parked next to eachother last night; the first gen really is (and I am not biased in saying this) the better looking of the two, lower, less boxy, more refined. odd.

Which basically means that anyone wanting the best possible 2nd hand sportscar about now with a spare 1.8m....should be buying Frank's GP. One of 2 in Thailand (I think), one of 2000 worldwide.

New GP is out this year again, 2000 being produced, Thailand will not see any of them officially (according to Millenium) but I am guessing maybe a grey market one or two may come in via Sooper Garage or someone.

[steveromagnino]

So have a slight update.

VW Thailand have a pretty decent campaign running at the moment, Sciroccos reduced in price 15% down to 2.25m NEW (from around 2.65m) as a result of wanting to shift stock prior to the new beetle (yawn) coming in later this year (probably for the motor show) which is already available in the grey market now. With KW springs, ABT tuning, reicher body kit the 2 litre 'Roc is a nice looking fwd with an easy 240 HP and at that price, makes the Mini look pretty expensive (3 year old JCWs and R56s are around that 2.25m price now).

The Benz A Class is now getting reviews and details coming in from abroad suggest it is, as expected, probably only worth waiting for the AMG worked version; the A250 is the only one that really could be considered a hot hatch, the A200 may be a bit of a slug since it will end up as an entry level baby benz; apparently Benz may launch it at the motor show. Good resale, good entry level Benz, but not sure it will be really a hot hatch.

VW Thailand confirm that the new golf GTI Mark 7 won't be reaching Thai shores in 2013, early 2014 maybe.

Sooper Garage claim the grey market price of the new Mini GP will be right around 3m; Millenium have confirmed to me they won't bring any in. With the new GP coming in, seems like a lot of the current GP owners are coming out of the woodwork; from what I can tell, there are actually at least 4 possibly 6 of them in Thailand (hard to know since not all of them are for sale), which when you consider there are only 450 right hand drives the world over, is a pretty decent percentage of them. Priced from 1.55 - 1.88m (depends a lot on the mileage, the 1.55 one has done 4X more kms than the other ones) value for money makes this a pretty sweet albeit manual and also a grey market only car (Millenium were unable to bring any in).

There are a couple in other parts of the world with a backseat conversion, it also doesn't have to be a 2 seater only either.

Seeing a bunch of 1 series, A1s and various other grey market beasts......the hot hatch market is hotting up! (slightly).