What Was Thailand Like Years Ago

[chonabot]

Recently, while in Bangkok, I went to the Thermae Bar, for old times sake. I used to drink there a lot 11 years ago(but it was in a different location).

I was amazed - the same woman was working there as years before and guess what she remembered me clearly. The atmosphere in the bar was not nearly as good as it used to be, when we stayed in the bar until daylight.

Is it me that has changed or did it used to be better. The girls were not nearly as 'friendly', and there weren't any fights. Bangkok is getting boring, or maybe I am.

I used to frequent the original Thermae, I had a room in the Miami Hotel , from the balcony you could see the action happening around the back door of the Thermae.

Bloody awful Hotel in retrospect. The Woman you saw again Neeranam , was she the older one with thinning hair?

Edited February 5, 2006 by chonabot

[Stephen Cleary]

op

Edited February 5, 2006 by stevesuphan

[Stephen Cleary]

Ahem . . . any recommendations yet on reading material?

Hi Tippaporn:

From the top of my head 'Democracy, Shaken and Stirred' by Win Lyovarin (Translated to Eng)

This book was winner of the SEA Write Award 1997 and Thai National Book Award 1995.

The book, like i personally mentioned before argues that 'Thailand has never known a true democracy'

The book also delves into a couple of so-called taboo issues of modern Thai history but due to legal reasons touches on them very 'implyingly'

What is very interesting is that he argues that The Oct 1973 incident was 'a political farce' and the riots and killings were orchestrated by politicians. His arguement is a good one too.

He also writes a lot about the CPT and their activities. Then he goes into Gen Prem and 1980, the end of the CPT etc.....Unfortunately for Cassandra though, he too fails to mention one word about The Chinese being involved in their demise. This is contrary to what Cassandra 'completely made up' with his 'most historians say........'

Type the name into a google search to read a review or two. Happy reading!

Steve

Oh dear I had previously taken you seriously as your previous post was generally plausible but it seems my original scepticism was spot on.For the uninitiated,Win Lyovarin is melodramatic novelist not a historian, and not a particularly good one at that..I had to restrain a snigger at your reference to his winning the Thai National Book Award.(The Booker Prize it ain't).More comical still is your reference to his insight that the 1973 riots were orchestrated by politicians.How original!!! I do however agree he is worth reading but for sociological reasons rather than anything else.

Not sure why you are so concerned to downplay the Chinese realpolitik which cut the ground from underneath the CPT.Chris Baker for example would make the point even stronger than I have.Maybe you should tell him and other historians they are making things up.Or maybe you can just ring up one of your (imaginary?) ex-jungle/CPT friends for a supportive story if they can spare the time from share trading.

QUOTE: May be you can just ring up one of your (imaginary?) ex-jungle/CPT friends for a supportive story if they can spare the time from share trading

It is advised that when trying to take the pish to firstly verify the authenticity of some facts!!

It was in fact another member who posted that he had a friend who was CPT, pls check back!! Sabaijai was it!?

Sorry to remind you like.

Tippaporn is still waiting for Thailand's finest honoured historian named Cassandram to recommend him a book! Seems to do a lot of moaning and bickering so let's now see some action!!

Quickly quickly.....and no cheating! we know you have been using a quick google search recently to find a fault to criticise someone! Sorry but the likes of 'Hello, my big big honey' or 'The Rough Guides To Thailand' won't be accepted!

Pls Tippaporn don't listen to Cassandrum's book reviews! He probably never even heard of the author til he did a google search! LOL............

Here is a review of the book/author etc.... i mentioned above (The Nation Newspaper)

http://www.winbookclub.com/interview_detail.php?id=39

Edited February 5, 2006 by stevesuphan

[Cassandra]

Ahem . . . any recommendations yet on reading material?

Hi Tippaporn:

From the top of my head 'Democracy, Shaken and Stirred' by Win Lyovarin (Translated to Eng)

This book was winner of the SEA Write Award 1997 and Thai National Book Award 1995.

The book, like i personally mentioned before argues that 'Thailand has never known a true democracy'

The book also delves into a couple of so-called taboo issues of modern Thai history but due to legal reasons touches on them very 'implyingly'

What is very interesting is that he argues that The Oct 1973 incident was 'a political farce' and the riots and killings were orchestrated by politicians. His arguement is a good one too.

He also writes a lot about the CPT and their activities. Then he goes into Gen Prem and 1980, the end of the CPT etc.....Unfortunately for Cassandra though, he too fails to mention one word about The Chinese being involved in their demise. This is contrary to what Cassandra 'completely made up' with his 'most historians say........'

Type the name into a google search to read a review or two. Happy reading!

Steve

Oh dear I had previously taken you seriously as your previous post was generally plausible but it seems my original scepticism was spot on.For the uninitiated,Win Lyovarin is melodramatic novelist not a historian, and not a particularly good one at that..I had to restrain a snigger at your reference to his winning the Thai National Book Award.(The Booker Prize it ain't).More comical still is your reference to his insight that the 1973 riots were orchestrated by politicians.How original!!! I do however agree he is worth reading but for sociological reasons rather than anything else.

Not sure why you are so concerned to downplay the Chinese realpolitik which cut the ground from underneath the CPT.Chris Baker for example would make the point even stronger than I have.Maybe you should tell him and other historians they are making things up.Or maybe you can just ring up one of your (imaginary?) ex-jungle/CPT friends for a supportive story if they can spare the time from share trading.

QUOTE: May be you can just ring up one of your (imaginary?) ex-jungle/CPT friends for a supportive story if they can spare the time from share trading

It is advised that when trying to take the pish to firstly verify the authenticity of some facts!!

It was in fact another member who posted that he had a friend who was CPT, pls check back!! Sabaijai was it!?

Sorry to remind you like.

Tippaporn is still waiting for Thailand's finest honoured historian named Cassandram to recommend him a book! Seems to do a lot of moaning and bickering so let's now see some action!!

Quickly quickly.....and no cheating! we know you have been using a quick google search recently to find a fault to criticise someone! Sorry but the likes of 'Hello, my big big honey' or 'The Rough Guides To Thailand' won't be accepted!

Pls Tippaporn don't listen to Cassandrum's book reviews! He probably never even heard of the author til he did a google search! LOL............

Here is a review of the book/author etc.... i mentioned above (The Nation Newspaper)

http://www.winbookclub.com/interview_detail.php?id=39

Yes it was Sabaijai who had the ex-commy friend.We've already heard about your academic background in some detail.I have my suspicions based on what you have stated that some of this is imaginary but let's not get into that.I never claimed, as you did, to be a Thai specialist but I do have an academic history background (Edinburgh University, M.A).I am aware of the consensus view on post WW2 Thai history based on secondary local and foreign sources.You strangely have come up with a rather lurid novelist as reading matter for our friend Tippaporn yet assuming you are what you say you are, you should have been able to come up with decent list of accessible books.Do a Google search if you can't manage!(Actually although you were trying to be cutting I don't have a problem with using Google intelligently.That's what it's there for)

[sabaijai]

Hey guys time to take a chill pill, OK? This thread is going nowhere at this point. A return to civil discussion please.

Cassandra, it was me not stevesuphan with the academic background in Thai history, and it's me with the ex-PLAT friends. Feel free to believe it's all imaginary. You still have to make your argument on the basis of fact-based analysis and have only quoted one writer thus far, Chris Baker.

Let's try to lay off the ad hominem attacks and stick with facts. Better yet, let's stick with the original spirit of this thread, which was not focussed on how the CPT fizzled out in the 1980s.

How about we get back to warm reminiscences of Thailand in days gone by. Cassandra, feel free to start a separate thread dedicated to the history of the CPT.

[sabaijai]

Sabaijai, any idea as to why the roundabout near Hualampong railway station is named 'The July 22 Roundabout'? What happened on that particular day one July 22?

Congratulations, by the way, on showing true Thai restraint when goaded needlessly by a recent supercilious post.

I remember asking a friend who lives within walking distance of that roundabout that very question three or four years ago. He told me the event it commemorated, but I'm now drawing a blank as to what it might have been. Just taking a wild guess based on the history of that area, it might have been the day the Japanese left - or agreed to leave, at least - Siam at the end of WWII.

The Thais call it Wong Wian 22 Karakada (or 'Wongwian 22' for short).

I'm sure someone here probably knows why.

On the restraint, thanks.

[meadish_sweetball]

Ahem . . . any recommendations yet on reading material?

Hi Tippaporn:

From the top of my head 'Democracy, Shaken and Stirred' by Win Lyovarin (Translated to Eng)

This book was winner of the SEA Write Award 1997 and Thai National Book Award 1995.

The book, like i personally mentioned before argues that 'Thailand has never known a true democracy'

The book also delves into a couple of so-called taboo issues of modern Thai history but due to legal reasons touches on them very 'implyingly'

What is very interesting is that he argues that The Oct 1973 incident was 'a political farce' and the riots and killings were orchestrated by politicians. His arguement is a good one too.

He also writes a lot about the CPT and their activities. Then he goes into Gen Prem and 1980, the end of the CPT etc.....Unfortunately for Cassandra though, he too fails to mention one word about The Chinese being involved in their demise. This is contrary to what Cassandra 'completely made up' with his 'most historians say........'

Type the name into a google search to read a review or two. Happy reading!

Steve

Oh dear I had previously taken you seriously as your previous post was generally plausible but it seems my original scepticism was spot on.For the uninitiated,Win Lyovarin is melodramatic novelist not a historian, and not a particularly good one at that..I had to restrain a snigger at your reference to his winning the Thai National Book Award.(The Booker Prize it ain't).More comical still is your reference to his insight that the 1973 riots were orchestrated by politicians.How original!!! I do however agree he is worth reading but for sociological reasons rather than anything else.

Not sure why you are so concerned to downplay the Chinese realpolitik which cut the ground from underneath the CPT.Chris Baker for example would make the point even stronger than I have.Maybe you should tell him and other historians they are making things up.Or maybe you can just ring up one of your (imaginary?) ex-jungle/CPT friends for a supportive story if they can spare the time from share trading.

QUOTE: May be you can just ring up one of your (imaginary?) ex-jungle/CPT friends for a supportive story if they can spare the time from share trading

It is advised that when trying to take the pish to firstly verify the authenticity of some facts!!

It was in fact another member who posted that he had a friend who was CPT, pls check back!! Sabaijai was it!?

Sorry to remind you like.

Tippaporn is still waiting for Thailand's finest honoured historian named Cassandram to recommend him a book! Seems to do a lot of moaning and bickering so let's now see some action!!

Quickly quickly.....and no cheating! we know you have been using a quick google search recently to find a fault to criticise someone! Sorry but the likes of 'Hello, my big big honey' or 'The Rough Guides To Thailand' won't be accepted!

Pls Tippaporn don't listen to Cassandrum's book reviews! He probably never even heard of the author til he did a google search! LOL............

Here is a review of the book/author etc.... i mentioned above (The Nation Newspaper)

http://www.winbookclub.com/interview_detail.php?id=39

Yes it was Sabaijai who had the ex-commy friend.We've already heard about your academic background in some detail.I have my suspicions based on what you have stated that some of this is imaginary but let's not get into that.I never claimed, as you did, to be a Thai specialist but I do have an academic history background (Edinburgh University, M.A).I am aware of the consensus view on post WW2 Thai history based on secondary local and foreign sources.You strangely have come up with a rather lurid novelist as reading matter for our friend Tippaporn yet assuming you are what you say you are, you should have been able to come up with decent list of accessible books.Do a Google search if you can't manage!(Actually although you were trying to be cutting I don't have a problem with using Google intelligently.That's what it's there for)

Please observe standard punctuation rules and leave a space after your full stops. It makes posts much easier to read. Thank you.

[Stephen Cleary]

Sabaijai, any idea as to why the roundabout near Hualampong railway station is named 'The July 22 Roundabout'? What happened on that particular day one July 22?

Congratulations, by the way, on showing true Thai restraint when goaded needlessly by a recent supercilious post.

I remember asking a friend who lives within walking distance of that roundabout that very question three or four years ago. He told me the event it commemorated, but I'm now drawing a blank as to what it might have been. Just taking a wild guess based on the history of that area, it might have been the day the Japanese left - or agreed to leave, at least - Siam at the end of WWII.

The Thais call it Wong Wian 22 Karakada (or 'Wongwian 22' for short).

I'm sure someone here probably knows why.

On the restraint, thanks.

The name 22 July comes from World War 1.

July 22 was the day that Thailand declared war upon Germany(1917), Thailand sent a total of 1,600 troops to fight along the allies.

The Thai troops were shipped off to France and Belgium 1918.

Hope that was of help.

Steve

Edited February 6, 2006 by stevesuphan

[sabaijai]

Ahem . . . any recommendations yet on reading material?

Sabaijai and Cassandra, I would still be interested in your recommendations. Steve, thank you for yours.

If you mean reading specifically on CPT history, I don't know of any book-length works that focus on it in much detail, though any modern history of Thailand carries some treatment of the subject. The best all-around reference to the general political issues of that era, that I know of, is David Morell's and Chai-Anan Samudavanija's Political Conflict in Thailand: Reform, Reaction, Revolution , 1988. That might be the best place to start in fact. Dr Chai-Anan still teaches (in Thailand and the USA) and is a vocal critic of TRT.

There are plenty of academic theses on the CPT available if you have access to universities with Asian studies libraries or inter-university loan privileges. Most of my research was original, based on the VOPT broadcasts and interviews with monks and PLAT members. I found the work of Thai historian Somboon Suksamran very helpful since my sole interest was the interaction of Buddhism and communism in Thailand. His theses from around 77-78, originally in Thai, were what I started with but he later was translated and his papers have been collected in various books that are still available. Somboon's central focus was the politicisation of Thai monks, but within that context there was some interesting historical detail on the CPT, details glossed over by other writers (such as opposition to Maoist/Leninist atheism almost from the start). If you Google for "Somboon Suksamran" you'll find plenty of his material. The easiest work to find is Political Buddhism in Southeast Asia: the role of the Sangha in the modernization of Thailand edited by Trevor Ling. 1977.

Silkworm Books here in Chiang Mai publishes Democratization in Southeast and East Asia, which contains an essay by Surin Maisrikrod entitled “The Making of Thai Democracy: A Study of Political Alliances among the State, the Capitalists and the Middle Class.” The essay covers the national reconciliation effort in the late 70s and early 80s, including the amnesty program and other efforts to quash the CPT.

Other works of potential interest:

Buntrigswat, Sanchai. "Thailand: The Dual Threats to Stability in a Study of Communist Insurgency and Problems of Political Development". Bangkok: Borpit. v+467 pp. (xxx same title, no author, 16 pp. TH320.959.3.Tb364) (xxxbibl 458-467 TH322.4.S211T) 1980.

Jeamteerasakul, Soksak. “The Communist Movement in Thailand.” Ph.D. thesis, Monash University, 1993.

Stuart-Fox, Martin. “Factors Influencing Relations Between the Communist Parties of Thailand and Laos .” Asian Survey 19 (4): 333-352, 1979.

The CPT itself published a history of the party in 1974 but it's very difficult to find (I've never read it myself) and since it covers an era well before the events under discussion here it's not that relevant. They issued a revised version in 77 (which I've read) but it likewise sheds no light on the effect of external pressures. There was a split within the CPT between Marxist and Leninist factions in the late 70s, which should also be counted as a factor in the party's dissolution.

[Tippaporn]

Khorpkhun mak khrup, sabaijai!

Off topic but . . . can't we have a wai-ing smilie available. Most apropos for this site, don't you think?

[sabaijai]

Khorpkhun mak khrup, sabaijai!

Off topic but . . . can't we have a wai-ing smilie available. Most apropos for this site, don't you think?

If someone could design one, I'm sure it could be added to the smiley menu.

[bannork]

Sabaijai, any idea as to why the roundabout near Hualampong railway station is named 'The July 22 Roundabout'? What happened on that particular day one July 22?

Congratulations, by the way, on showing true Thai restraint when goaded needlessly by a recent supercilious post.

I remember asking a friend who lives within walking distance of that roundabout that very question three or four years ago. He told me the event it commemorated, but I'm now drawing a blank as to what it might have been. Just taking a wild guess based on the history of that area, it might have been the day the Japanese left - or agreed to leave, at least - Siam at the end of WWII.

The Thais call it Wong Wian 22 Karakada (or 'Wongwian 22' for short).

I'm sure someone here probably knows why.

On the restraint, thanks.

The name 22 July comes from World War 1.

July 22 was the day that Thailand declared war upon Germany(1917), Thailand sent a total of 1,600 troops to fight along the allies.

The Thai troops were shipped off to France and Belgium 1918.

Hope that was of help.

Steve

Thanks Steve for that, I've asked many Thais about the origin and a few mentioned WW1 but couldn't pinpoint why; if I remember rightly the Thai soldiers arrived too late for any fighting, a wise move.

Rama 6 would have been the king sending them off, but I wonder if they built the roundabout during his lifetime.

[sabaijai]

Ditto, Steve, thanks. How did you find out what the 22 July referred to? With your info in hand, I found this detailed article the web:

Thailand in WWI

One of the interesting factoids in the article: "There was also a medical unit which included nurses and it is claimed these were the only women to serve in the trenches of the Western Front."

[Stephen Cleary]

QUOTE SABAIJAI:Ditto, Steve, thanks. How did you find out what the 22 July referred to? With your info in hand, I found this detailed article the web:

Thailand in WWI

One of the interesting factoids in the article: "There was also a medical unit which included nurses and it is claimed these were the only women to serve in the trenches of the Western Front."

Thanks, glad you found the info of help. I got the info only after a thorough 'search' in Thai Language.

http://www.search-thais.com/thaihis/worldwar1.htm

For those who can't read Thai here is a very brief overview of what it says (Pls forgive some my direct Thai>Eng trans, im trans for free not getting paid!)

Important benefits Thailand received from its participation in WW1 are as follows:

>Honour and prestige was bestowed upon the nation

>Afforded participation in the 'Treaty of Versailles'

> Afforded membership of (The League of Nations....was it?) and so Thailand became a securer and safer country

> Solved the problems of treaties made with Germany, Hungary and Austria etc...during the reign of King Rama IV. New treaties with the Allied powers were made.

> unsure of the meaning (repossessed assets from prisoners of war?)

> The Thai flag was changed (no more elephant) so as to be used by the Thai armed forces during the war (HISTORICAL NOTES: Thailand thought an elephant on its flag looked less admirable)

> A monument was erected to honour the soldiers who fought (July 22)

>The Thai army thereafter was to be developed into a 'more European-style'. It also led to the establishment of a National Royal Air Force.

Hope the readers learnt something from that - i did!

Steve

Edited February 8, 2006 by stevesuphan

[zzap]

Ahemm...., sorry to barge in with some rather unqualified reminiscing after the academic, yet very informative and enjoyable comments.

Recently, while in Bangkok, I went to the Thermae Bar, for old times sake. I used to drink there a lot 11 years ago(but it was in a different location).

I was amazed - the same woman was working there as years before and guess what she remembered me clearly. The atmosphere in the bar was not nearly as good as it used to be, when we stayed in the bar until daylight.

Is it me that has changed or did it used to be better. The girls were not nearly as 'friendly', and there weren't any fights. Bangkok is getting boring, or maybe I am.

It was much better. It's lost some of it flair with the move to the new premises, and the increasingly earlier closing hours killed the very unique atmosphere which developed during the night.

It was a 5-star "cult" venue...

Before 11pm, it was almost empty, only a few very aged 'girls' on the game idling away time, most of whom would still be there at 5-6 in the morning.

After the other bars closed, 2-3am, the gogo-girls looking for a punter would arrive and the place be buzzing with activity for a short while.

3-4am would be the witching hour at which another "type" would make the Thermae their home for a few hours- guys and girls who were intoxicated by something or other, and there could be fights, people spilling their beers or throwing up down your trousers...

I used to have a nightcap there regularly when I lived in Bangkok, and it's still an interesting experience to take visiting friends for a drink there these days.

[camerata]

> The Thai flag was changed (no more elephant) so as to be used by the Thai armed forces during the war (HISTORICAL NOTES: Thailand thought an elephant on its flag looked less admirable)

Interesting. A better known explanation (from the book Thailand - The Enchantment of the World and other sources) is that in 1915 King Vajiravudh (Rama IV) was upset at seeing the elephant flag flying upside down while on a trip up the Chao Phaya and so he himself designed a more modern flag that could not be flown upside down. It was made official in 1917.

The blue band in the modern flag represents the monarchy but I've also seen it claimed that it was added to the original red and white to show solidarity with the allies during the war. Anyway, I prefer the exotic look of the old flags.

[bannork]

I think you'll find it was Rama VI not Rama IV, camerata.

[camerata]

I think you'll find it was Rama VI not Rama IV, camerata.

Thanks. You're absolutely right. I guess my source had the number wrong.

[sabaijai]

On the subject of what the blue represents, here's what Wikipedia says.

In 1916 the flag was changed to the current design, but with the middle color being the same red as the outer stripe. The story goes that during a flood King Vajiravudh (Rama VI) saw the flag hanging upside-down, and to prevent this from happening again created a new flag which was symmetrical. In 1917 the middle color was changed to blue, the color for Friday, the day king Rama VI was born. According to other sources the blue color was chosen to show solidarity with the Allies of World War I, which also had the colors blue-red-white in their flags.

Wiki flag

I've also heard it said, or read it somewhere, can't remember which, that the elephant was removed after the king heard that some Europeans mistook the image, at a distance, for a rat.

[Tippaporn]

Here's a link to an interesting in-depth article about the Thai flag by "Thailand Pai Nai."

http://thailand.pai-nai.com/thai-national-flag-01.html

Ahemm...., sorry to barge in with some rather unqualified reminiscing after the academic, yet very informative and enjoyable comments.

<snip>

No need to apologize, zzap. You're right on target!

Edited February 8, 2006 by Tippaporn

[Swelters]

> The Thai flag was changed (no more elephant) so as to be used by the Thai armed forces during the war (HISTORICAL NOTES: Thailand thought an elephant on its flag looked less admirable)

Interesting. A better known explanation (from the book Thailand - The Enchantment of the World and other sources) is that in 1915 King Vajiravudh (Rama IV) was upset at seeing the elephant flag flying upside down while on a trip up the Chao Phaya and so he himself designed a more modern flag that could not be flown upside down. It was made official in 1917.

This is an interesting period of Thai history and I've done a little research on the topic. Any interest in a new thread "Thailand in the WW I era" or the like?

[Tippaporn]

I'm not in the habit of reviving old topics, but the subject matter has come up elsewhere. Gary A. has posted an excellent photo link which I thought would be well included in this thread, if for no other reason than posterity and that it might reach a few more members in the General forum. Hearty thanks, Gary.

Interesting link. If you're looking for sexy pictures, forget it.

Korat Bar Girls

Edited March 25, 2006 by Tippaporn

[katana]

I'm not in the habit of reviving old topics, but the subject matter has come up elsewhere. Gary A. has posted an excellent photo link which I thought would be well included in this thread, if for no other reason than posterity and that it might reach a few more members in the General forum. Hearty thanks, Gary.

Interesting link. If you're looking for sexy pictures, forget it.

Korat Bar Girls

The photos are also set to music here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pSsKXkubER8

[Pakboong]

Also, wondering if anyone caught an article in a local magazine about the early days of Patters. I hate to be so sketchy since I can't remember the magazine or the particular guy's name who was featured in the article (Jim ??, I believe) since I was browsing it in Sunbelt Asia's lobby while waiting for my appointment back in June /July of '05/'48. I'm sure, though, that once I relate the main details of the story it'll ring someone's bell rather loudly.

This was a story about Bill Jones, a Texan born Vietnam veteran, who arrived in Pattaya in 1971.

He married Lek, a local girl, and in 1974 set up one of the first bars on Walking Street. BJ Discotheque and Coffee House. (Later known only as 'BJ Bar.')

There was not much competition in those days, only six other similar bars. Today more than 1,000.

BJ Bar was a landmark and remained at the same location till only a few years ago when he closed it down. The adjoining Soi was named after him..'Soi BJ.'

Bill was a genius at attracting customers. He could talk the talk and walk the walk. He was always known to have a folded hand towel hanging over his shoulder and a toothpick that never left the corner of his mouth. American military personal on R and R flocked to his bar at every available opportunity, and he built up a large clientel of regular drinkers from all nationalities. He was always on hand to have a conversation with each and every customer. He was generous with free drinks too.

His sister-in-laws opened other bars along Walking Street and although fairly successful, they lacked the magic of the BJ Bar.

The early BJ Bar had only an ice box. Electricity in the early days konked out most nights and the whole of the strip (Walking Street) was lit up by lanterns and candles only. Electric refrigerators had not come into being at that time and would have been wasted anyway without electricity.

Bill had trained his bar staff to dig to the bottom of the ice blocks and serve only the coldest bottles of beer.

He brought in VCR tapes of various bands from around the world that he would play on a TV positioned over his bar. He compiled many other tapes himself and these were great entertainment for his customers.

These were the days when the only shows on TV were Thai. There was no cable TV in those days.

He played the latest music over his PA system and it wasn't long before other bars started copying Bill's entertainment ideas.

He also served a mean pizza, and this was long before Pizza hut came to town.

As well as the bar, he also had a guesthouse in north Pattaya. (BJ Guesthouse) He and Lek can be found there today where they continue to run a successful business. Their good service and interesting conversation is a vibrant as ever.

Great memories. I too was in Pattaya. Stationed at Camp Samae San for a year. The main dance bar in Pattaya was the Fantasy Club on walking street where the Lobster Pot now sits. The best restaurant in town was the Coral Reef. The Nipa Lodge may have been the most popular hotel. I remember mostly the huge fish tanks in the restaurant area of the hotel. Lots of fun. The Baht was 20 to $1 so prices adjusted for time have not changed all that much.

[camerata]

Sukhumvit then and now. These photos are looking East from the footbridge outside Unesco towards Ekkamai. The building under construction on the left at the corner of Soi 61 is the Major Cineplex cinema.

1995:

2006:

[Tippaporn]

Thanks, camerata. The wifey and kids and I go to Major quite often to see movies and go bowling. Nice to catch a glimpse of it as it was being built. I'll have to show the wifey, as I'm sure she'll remember it.

[Backpack_thailand]

I first arrived in the 90's, initially for a 3 month backpacking trip...that was 8 years ago!

My "home" when I thought of staying on for a while was Ao Nang, Krabi. Back then it was a really small old fishing village where the locals had allowed a few bungalows to be built for travellers. The atmosphere was really laid back and a true "new Thailand" kind of place.

has anyone been to Ao Nang lately...??? Jeez, don't recognize the place! I left in 2001 to live nearer to Bangers (due to work!) and went back periodically. The place has been ruined forever due to toursim.

In evitable I suppose but looking at it now and thinking back to how it was brings a tear to the eye I can tell you! Move over Phuket, Ao Nang / Krabi is coming to get ya!

[ColPyat]

My "home" when I thought of staying on for a while was Ao Nang, Krabi. Back then it was a really small old fishing village where the locals had allowed a few bungalows to be built for travellers. The atmosphere was really laid back and a true "new Thailand" kind of place.

Not really.

I remember Ao Nang from somewhere around '91/'92.

Already then there was an inbred circle of western misfits running shitty restaurants/beachbars. One of the sadest stories i have come across there was the end of the life of that German bloke who ran a music bar together with his ex-wife and her new Thai husband.

I think he died somewhere around '93/'94 from a heart attack induced by too much alcohol/downers/uppers while swimming. I am not gonna bore you with the whole desastrous story. But the day after he died, that Dutch lesbian running a restaurant went to his grieving ex-wife and her Thai husband asking them to give her their furniture cheaply as they would most likely close down anyhow. Disgusting.

Not long after the German's ex-wife and her husband packed up and left after they have lost their business to the mafia machinations there, and had to return to Germany pennyless.

I stayed in Ao Nang for a while. It was rather interesting to observe the constant back stabbing and infighting going on between those western business operators, all set in an athmosphere of natural local mafia dominance.

Edited June 4, 2006 by ColPyat

[Backpack_thailand]

I certainly agree with you about the mafia element in Ao Nang and Krabi generally. There are some really unsavoury characters down there, a lot "imported" in from Nakhon Si Thammarat which is the most notorious mafia HQ in the south!

Also agree that the westerners there are always trying to shaft each other, unlike anywhere I've seen in the whole country. The Thais love it because while the foreigners are fighting amongst themselves they retain control.

If the expats actually got together and worked as a team then the locals would be a little concerned for sure.

[egeefay]

I went to Thailand along with about 50 other college grads in 1969.

We were all Peace Corps volunteers signed up for two years of English teaching in Thailand

Back then the population of Bangkok was only about 3 million

The beaches in Phuket were beautiful...and deserted.

Houses didn't have air condition

There was no hot water

and teachers got paid 1200 baht a month

Here's some of the pictures we took of our lives back then

http://www.thai27.com/thai27/gallery/album03

There's little left of the Thailand we used to know.