Any Alternative To Frozen Salmon?

[Rancid]

Have you tried a chilled Plaa Thuum (goes well with a nice Chardonay), much cheaper and widely available.

[giddyup]

Have you tried a chilled Plaa Thuum (goes well with a nice Chardonay), much cheaper and widely available.

I think it's Plaa Tuu. I tried it once, too fishy for me and it's only small. I like big fillets.

Edited July 2, 2012 by giddyup

[Ricardo]

"Let Them Eat Cake Hake"

Edited July 2, 2012 by Ricardo

[Lopburi99]

Update: The Makro store here sells 'fresh' Norwegian salmon which supposedly was caught less than 4 days prior. If you time it right you can buy it before they put it all in the freezer (evidently it is shipped on ice). For some time now we've been buying the full salmon, about 4-5 kg, and having it scaled, fillet sliced and packaged while we wait. Only 289฿/kg. My wife cooks it in her wok (or whatever it is called here) in canola oil (low cholesterol), marinating only a few minutes first then adding only salt substitute (NoSalt from the U.S.) and ground pepper. She sautees cut garlic and serves it with the salmon. Absolutely "bloody delicious!" to quote somebody here. I have this wonderful, healthy dinner 5-6 times a week and recommend it to you all. Thanks to PattayaParent for the Makro tip!

Edited November 27, 2012 by Lopburi99

[NeverSure]

I'll try the Makro's here in Lopburi. The salmon we get at either Big C or Tesco Lotus varies from being delicious to tasteless on any given day.

i used to be a game fisherman and i can tell you trout & salmon once they have been frozen for more than 2months they will deteriate.oh fresh salmon and scrambled eggs.

I agree, unless it's vacuum packed. I don't use a frost free freezer either. The defrost cycles dry out food. I get a good year from frozen salmon. We have Chinook Salmon in the river which is the same as Alaska's King Salmon. It's awesome. We also have steel head trout (ocean going and returning rainbows) that are just as good that way.

We have to freeze them because we get too much at once to eat fresh.

[rene123]

I don't eat fish here in Thailand because I'm spoiled for 6 months of the year when I'm back on Vancouver Island. I have shelves full of smoked and canned salmon. In the deep freezer there's smoked salmon in air tight bags and flash frozen salmon in air tight bags. I have so much fresh salmon each season I'm almost sick of it. So, I alternate that with fresh halibut, cod, tuna, crab and prawns. I find the fish here in Thailand to be too bland and tasteless, and I refuse to eat farmed salmon, fresh or otherwise. Sorry I can't be of any help finding salmon for you here in Thailand. I've never, ever seen it in the markets except once and that was the farmed crap that was raised on pellets.

[tinfoilhat]

I was told by Macro Samui that the salmon comes in on ice indeed I have seen whole salmon which does not appear to have been frozen. Most produce is flown worldwide within hours of being killed or picked.

I am sure that somewhere in Thailand there has to be a salmon farm run by a falang and his Thai wife !!!!

cold water fish, aint gonna happen

[Travel2003]

villa always has farm salmon as well.

Farm salmon is pretty sad in comparison to wild though.

but then i come from BC.

Then you have a different type of salmon.

[Travel2003]

Most of the Salmon eaten in Japan has most likely been imported from Norway.

The farmed salmon is in my opinion as good as the wild one.

It is more red in the meat actually.

They also have less bone, as they are gene-manipulated that way.

By the way, to make the meat more red and delicious looking, one doesn't need to use any chemicals, as many think.

Feed the farmed salmon with shrimp peel, and they get the color naturally.

PS,

everyone might not know this, but there is huge difference between the Atlantic salmon and the Pacific salmon.

Pacific salmon is normally a bit bigger and more coarse in the meat, and very good for grilling.

The Atlantic salmon is better for smoking.

[Travel2003]

I was told by Macro Samui that the salmon comes in on ice indeed I have seen whole salmon which does not appear to have been frozen. Most produce is flown worldwide within hours of being killed or picked.

This is correct.

They are put on ice and have the temperature lowered to an acceptable level, which is below the danger zone.

One can keep food this way for a certain time frame, as long one do not move out of the temperature zone.

Once one move out of the zone, one has only a certain window of opportunity to consume it.

They are put in trucks and sent to nearest airport, then to another and into a sizable cargo plane.

Done with the flight schedules in mind.

[NeverSure]

Fresh salmon is good - but have you ever eaten fresh Arctic Char ?? They are salmon that return to the ocean after spawning in fresh water.

Lived on the Arctic coast for four years, and my arms used to get tired reeling them in.

I thought they all died in the river?

They do.

it is quite a sight. and by the time they have gotten upstream they are battered and have undergone serious colour changes. you would not want to eat one.

Artic Char are freshwater as far as i can discern, and closely related to both salmon and trout.

http://en.wikipedia....iki/Arctic_char

It is true that by the time they spawn they are no longer good, but on the way from the ocean to their spawning place they are just fine. Here's an example of what we catch, in our river, but none are me. This is all very close to my home.

Link

[NeverSure]

Most of the Salmon eaten in Japan has most likely been imported from Norway.

The farmed salmon is in my opinion as good as the wild one.

It is more red in the meat actually.

They also have less bone, as they are gene-manipulated that way.

By the way, to make the meat more red and delicious looking, one doesn't need to use any chemicals, as many think.

Feed the farmed salmon with shrimp peel, and they get the color naturally.

PS,

everyone might not know this, but there is huge difference between the Atlantic salmon and the Pacific salmon.

Pacific salmon is normally a bit bigger and more coarse in the meat, and very good for grilling.

The Atlantic salmon is better for smoking.

Hmmm. Most salmon are pink naturally. I agree the best is in the Pacific, but there are several varieties starting with Chinook and King, then Coho, then Silver, then...

The Japanese run huge fishing trawlers off Canada and Alaska. That is international water. They have complete processing and freezing facilities on board and stay out there until they are full.

[Travel2003]

Most of the Salmon eaten in Japan has most likely been imported from Norway.

The farmed salmon is in my opinion as good as the wild one.

It is more red in the meat actually.

They also have less bone, as they are gene-manipulated that way.

By the way, to make the meat more red and delicious looking, one doesn't need to use any chemicals, as many think.

Feed the farmed salmon with shrimp peel, and they get the color naturally.

PS,

everyone might not know this, but there is huge difference between the Atlantic salmon and the Pacific salmon.

Pacific salmon is normally a bit bigger and more coarse in the meat, and very good for grilling.

The Atlantic salmon is better for smoking.

Hmmm. Most salmon are pink naturally. I agree the best is in the Pacific, but there are several varieties starting with Chinook and King, then Coho, then Silver, then...

The Japanese run huge fishing trawlers off Canada and Alaska. That is international water. They have complete processing and freezing facilities on board and stay out there until they are full.

Actually, I prefer the Atlantic salmon.

Then again, we all prefer different things.

[jonnyscot]

Quite a high % of exported fish and shellfish from many european countries whether from farms or from the sea do have chemical additive in some form or other to prolong freshness, these additives can be added at the washing stage or added to the manufactured process of the ice covering the fish whilst in storage or both, these additives can more than double the shelf life(freshness) by way of containing or reducing the bacterial process.

Jonny

Sent from my iPhone using ThaiVisa app

[lujanit]

I was told by Macro Samui that the salmon comes in on ice indeed I have seen whole salmon which does not appear to have been frozen. Most produce is flown worldwide within hours of being killed or picked.

I am sure that somewhere in Thailand there has to be a salmon farm run by a falang and his Thai wife !!!!

cold water fish, aint gonna happen

There is no salmon farm here in Thailand however their is a trout farm neat Doi Intanon (in One of the Royal Projects I believe). I was stunned when I found out however the water is cold enough to support trout. The farm was set up with Finnish expertize quite a while back (more than 10 years). The project was co-ordinated by FinPro, the commercial arm of the Finnish Embassy here in BKK.

The only reason there is no salmon is due to the fact that there is no cold marine water at Doi Intanon, otherwise salmon would grow there just fine

[lujanit]

If there is any imported that way, it'll be a Siam Paragon, most likely Norwegian.

I've got a kind-of brother-in-law in the business I can ask he'd know.

He says some countries import salmon as "fresh" when it's actually been frozen but at a lower temperature than the usual rock-hard, but AFAHC that only makes a difference with texture and appearance not taste.

Boy am I going to get into some trouble here. With all due respect your 'kind of brother in law' sounds clueless. I hope he is not a QC manager in some freezing plant. For any product to retain as much freshness as possible it is quick frozen (as quickly as possible, liquid nitrogen is great but a tad expensive for some products) and not at some low temperature. The normal commercial holding temperature is -30°C which equals rock hard. There is sound reasoning behind this. If a product is frozen slowly and at low temperature the water in between the cells forms as large ice crystals. These crystals pierce the cell wall and when the product is thawed the contents of the cell become 'drip loss'. Bye bye flavour and texture.

[lujanit]

Quite a high % of exported fish and shellfish from many european countries whether from farms or from the sea do have chemical additive in some form or other to prolong freshness, these additives can be added at the washing stage or added to the manufactured process of the ice covering the fish whilst in storage or both, these additives can more than double the shelf life(freshness) by way of containing or reducing the bacterial process.

Jonny

Sent from my iPhone using ThaiVisa app

Would you please supply me with a reference so I can check this out? I can't find anything on the net. The only chemical that can be added to promote shelf life by retarding bacterial growth would be some form of salt (makes moisture unavailable), usually common table salt (NaCl) however that can affect the taste markedly.

[rene123]

Salmon farms in the open ocean destroy the natural environment. It takes 5 kilos of ground up fish and crustacean parts to provide one kilo of farmed salmon. The salmon farmers get their fish food from Chili where there are no environmental laws. The waters off the Chiean coast have been devastated by foreign boats killing everything, and the local fishermen can no longer find fish for their own use. The fish pellets are filled with antibiotics to prevent disease in the farmed salmon. The excess food falls to the ocean floor beneath the pens and turns the area into a dead zone. This the same zone that the native wild species of salmon are trying to survive in. It has had a terrible result in every place these fish farms have been situated. Wild salmon and sea trout no longer return to inlets where these salmon farms have been placed.

[chiangmaikelly]

The major advantage of refrigerated pasteurized food vs. frozen food? Mainly, it is convenience. Frozen food will have a shelf life of 6 months or more. However, frozen food must be thawed. The thawing process requires time and energy. Expensive, energy-intensive equipment is also required to freeze and hold the food products frozen. Normally, foodservice operations do not need the long shelf life of frozen food. Chilled foods, some of which can have a shelf life of 60 days, are much more efficient to handle. For example foods quick chilled to close to freezing but not frozen 1.7 C have a shelf life of 19.3 days as opposed to 4.4 C shelf life of 7.5 days and frozen 123 days.

http://www.hi-tm.com/Documents/Chillfd.html

[rene123]

The major advantage of refrigerated pasteurized food vs. frozen food? Mainly, it is convenience. Frozen food will have a shelf life of 6 months or more. However, frozen food must be thawed. The thawing process requires time and energy. Expensive, energy-intensive equipment is also required to freeze and hold the food products frozen. Normally, foodservice operations do not need the long shelf life of frozen food. Chilled foods, some of which can have a shelf life of 60 days, are much more efficient to handle. For example foods quick chilled to close to freezing but not frozen 1.7 C have a shelf life of 19.3 days as opposed to 4.4 C shelf life of 7.5 days and frozen 123 days.

http://www.hi-tm.com...ts/Chillfd.html

Thankyou for researching that. It is good to know and explains a lot of things. Most home refrigerators just dry things out. So do deep freezers unless items have been shrink wrapped in air tight plastic containers.

[chiangmaikelly]

Salmon farms in the open ocean destroy the natural environment. It takes 5 kilos of ground up fish and crustacean parts to provide one kilo of farmed salmon. The salmon farmers get their fish food from Chili where there are no environmental laws. The waters off the Chiean coast have been devastated by foreign boats killing everything, and the local fishermen can no longer find fish for their own use. The fish pellets are filled with antibiotics to prevent disease in the farmed salmon. The excess food falls to the ocean floor beneath the pens and turns the area into a dead zone. This the same zone that the native wild species of salmon are trying to survive in. It has had a terrible result in every place these fish farms have been situated. Wild salmon and sea trout no longer return to inlets where these salmon farms have been placed.

Largest Aquaculture Company in British Columbia

Marine Harvest produces one-fifth of the world’s farm-raised salmon at facilities in Norway, Scotland, Canada, Chile, Ireland and the Faroes.

In Canada, they operate salmon farms on the coast of beautiful British Columbia and Vancouver Island, where 500 people produce 40,000 tonnes of sustainable Atlantic farm-raised salmon each year.

Marine Harvest Canada salmon are raised in freshwater hatcheries before being transferred to the cold, clear Pacific waters of their marine fish farms sites. From there, the salmon are harvested and processed fresh for shipment to customers in Canada, the United States and Asia.

Since 2002, Marine Harvest Canada has been certified according to ISO 14001 environmental management standards.

http://www.marineharvestcanada.com/

[rene123]

Marine Harvest Canada has been certified according to ISO 14001 environmental management standards.

http://www.marineharvestcanada.com/

And the standards are set by the companies doing the farming, and approved by our big business pro Prime Minister, Harper. If you can believe what the fish farmers say you then would also believe everything told to you by "big Oil" ... ie, "Pollute? Heavens no, we would never pollute."

If there was ever a bigger hypocrite than Canada's present Prime Minister, then I can't think of one.

[phuturatica]

Big C have imported Norwegian Salmon...

[NeverSure]

I'm not sure I understand how farming salmon or steelhead trout could hurt anything much. The farmers build the holding pens and initially buy very young fish (fingerlings or frys.) These are fish which migrate out into the ocean for a very few years and feed and grow until they are ready to mate and lay eggs. Then they return to exactly the spot they were when they were fingerlings and mate and lay eggs. This would be right back in the farm. These farmers get back very big fish, and they also get the new fertilized eggs to begin over. The farmers I know don't let the females lay eggs. They butcher them for the filets, remove the eggs, and hand fertilize them by squeezing the males over the eggs.

Fish thrash around so much in the mating and laying, that they beat themselves up. They also die after that, but I don't know why.

[jonnyscot]

Check out this company from the below link,

http://www.xyrex.com/

I know about their product since I was involved in promoting it to the fishing industry a number of years back,, the products I worked with and supplied to my customers at that time were Ice-Active, Prawn Fresh and U500 I think if I remember correctly, we did various trials on the fish and prawns at various stages including taste,, amazing product,,

Jonny

quote name='lujanit' Would you please supply me with a reference so I can check this out? I can't find anything on the net. The only chemical that can be added to promote shelf life by retarding bacterial growth would be some form of salt (makes moisture unavailable), usually common table salt (NaCl) however that can affect the taste markedly.

Jonny

Sent from my iPhone using ThaiVisa app

[tinfoilhat]

The major advantage of refrigerated pasteurized food vs. frozen food? Mainly, it is convenience. Frozen food will have a shelf life of 6 months or more. However, frozen food must be thawed. The thawing process requires time and energy. Expensive, energy-intensive equipment is also required to freeze and hold the food products frozen. Normally, foodservice operations do not need the long shelf life of frozen food. Chilled foods, some of which can have a shelf life of 60 days, are much more efficient to handle. For example foods quick chilled to close to freezing but not frozen 1.7 C have a shelf life of 19.3 days as opposed to 4.4 C shelf life of 7.5 days and frozen 123 days.

http://www.hi-tm.com...ts/Chillfd.html

Apropos of what?

you are aware the topi is about S A L M O N.

Eating salmon, and whether there is anywhere to buy fresh salmon.

It is not about the distinctions between food processing methods, though that would have been fine, had you made the slightest attempt to relate your point back to the topic which is S A L M O N.

Edited November 29, 2012 by tinfoilhat

[chiangmaikelly]

The major advantage of refrigerated pasteurized food vs. frozen food? Mainly, it is convenience. Frozen food will have a shelf life of 6 months or more. However, frozen food must be thawed. The thawing process requires time and energy. Expensive, energy-intensive equipment is also required to freeze and hold the food products frozen. Normally, foodservice operations do not need the long shelf life of frozen food. Chilled foods, some of which can have a shelf life of 60 days, are much more efficient to handle. For example foods quick chilled to close to freezing but not frozen 1.7 C have a shelf life of 19.3 days as opposed to 4.4 C shelf life of 7.5 days and frozen 123 days.

http://www.hi-tm.com...ts/Chillfd.html

Apropos of what?

you are aware the topi is about S A L M O N.

Eating salmon, and whether there is anywhere to buy fresh salmon.

It is not about the distinctions between food processing methods, though that would have been fine, had you made the slightest attempt to relate your point back to the topic which is S A L M O N.

You don't have to freeze salmon. You can store it at 1.7 C and it has a shelf life of 19 days. You can ship it anywhere without freezing it for 19 days. It tastes better if it was never frozen.

[tinfoilhat]

You don't have to freeze salmon. You can store it at 1.7 C and it has a shelf life of 19 days. You can ship it anywhere without freezing it for 19 days. It tastes better if it was never frozen.

The major advantage of refrigerated pasteurized food vs. frozen food? Mainly, it is convenience. Frozen food will have a shelf life of 6 months or more. However, frozen food must be thawed. The thawing process requires time and energy. Expensive, energy-intensive equipment is also required to freeze and hold the food products frozen. Normally, foodservice operations do not need the long shelf life of frozen food. Chilled foods, some of which can have a shelf life of 60 days, are much more efficient to handle. For example foods quick chilled to close to freezing but not frozen 1.7 C have a shelf life of 19.3 days as opposed to 4.4 C shelf life of 7.5 days and frozen 123 days.

http://www.hi-tm.com...ts/Chillfd.html

Apropos of what?

you are aware the topi is about S A L M O N.

Eating salmon, and whether there is anywhere to buy fresh salmon.

It is not about the distinctions between food processing methods, though that would have been fine, had you made the slightest attempt to relate your point back to the topic which is S A L M O N.

You don't have to freeze salmon. You can store it at 1.7 C and it has a shelf life of 19 days. You can ship it anywhere without freezing it for 19 days. It tastes better if it was never frozen.

Oh come off it.

you are aware that pasteurization means that the salmon would for all intensive purposes be cooked.

Salmon tastes better if it were never frozen. It tastes better yet if it was not for all intensive purposes pre-cooked

kind of defeats the purpose, when what the OP essentially wants is higher quality salmon

[chiangmaikelly]

Well you could pasteurize it. Take a look at the video and tell me what you think.

[WilliaminBKK]

OP fresh salmon is wonderful, some helpful posts have already mentioned where you can hopefully find fresh salmon in BKK. If you're not able to locate and frozen is the only thing on offer I've found there are a few things you can do to take frozen up a notch.

Brine the fish (salt, sugar, water) you can add lemon zest, lemongrass anything that you like - brine for 4 hours

Wrap the fillet in prosciutto/parma ham and bake - wrapping the fish seems to enhance & lock in the flavour

Gravlax dry cure with any flavours you like as above and slice,

Fish cakes

Planking on cedar - I saw boards at Central World a few months back -brine method first

The above ideas are certainly no substitution for fresh but in a pinch IMHO makes frozen passable.