Red-Shirt Leader Korkaew Warns Of Civil War If Court Rules Against Amendments

[waza]

Well one Shinawatra is heading for the airport, wheres the rest?

[nurofiend]

we'll find out friday, in a completely fair ruling of course.

i have my predictions.

My prediction is, a slap on the wrist to the politicians (ie don't have wholesale changes to the constitution), and no banning of parties.

Sent from my shoe phone

yeah, i think any banning of parties is out of the question.

[Roadman]

Wow...this is the system of governance from Red and Pheu Thai scumbags that many on here call democracy and defend as the democratic way. No wonder the Army has to come in occassionally and deal with this garbage.

[AleG]

there will be no civil war in Thailand, nobody is starving or dying. People only put their lives on the line if their lives are in danger. Besides theres too much money from foreign companies and thais in position of influence losing too much money if war broke out. You might get paid skirmishes but one plea from the privy council and then threats by the army would quell this. which Thai fathers do you know of who would sacrifice themselves for some politicians?

Get out from your paranoid computers and tell me who would sacrifice their lives and families for Korkaew or Jaturaporn? They'll happily cause aruckus for a free feed and 200 baht, but you could never mobilise half the population all because some millionaires aren't getting their way.

When was the last civil war in Asia? Whose living conditions in Thailand are so desperate that they're prepared to die to give their family a better life?

Don't underestimate the power of propaganda. I remember that point being very indelibly etched in my mind hearing a japanese man narrating how he, at the end of WWII, killed his own mother to keep the American GIs from doing whatever horrid thing the Japanese propaganda told him they would do.

You don't need poor or starving people to manipulate, keeping them scared and angry will in time turn them into a very malleable state.

If you see what the Red Shirt propaganda machine has been doing is precisely that, keeping them scared and angry, shortcircuiting any rationality and isolating them from alternative news and opinions; well primed to do their manipulator's wishes.

Not that I expect civil war, mind you, last time this bozo made predictions (10.000.000 Red Shirts to carry Thaksin across the border from Laos) it turned out to be wishful thinking to say the least.

[Roadman]

You don't honestly believe yourself, do you? Their only agenda here is to preserve their own positions, and those of the people who back them. 'Doing their jobs' would surely include upholding due process, which they subverted by accepting petitions directly. How can they rule in an unbiased manner when, 1. They are ruling on the future of their own court and priveleged positions and 2. They are ruling on whether to undo what they had a major hand in installing.

'Upholding the democratic integrity of Thailand' ... What a crock of ....

The judges are not distributing the home addresses of PTP members and advocating thugs to visit those familes at home to harm them. The judges are just going to work, they are not the problem nor are they the cause of this violent agitation, the source of all the current instability and theat to human life lies in Dubai, and ln Yingluck too, wherever she is hiding today.

I actually answered your earlier post in this thread, the one where you eloquently said "let their blood stain the judges hands" and other lovely sentiments about the potential civil war. I notice that your post and my reply both vanished. Did you regret posting those things?

You also mentioned that this type of civil war was justified because the judges stood in the way of "the will of the people". I replied that infact it was not the will of 'the people', only the will of 'some people' , and that PTP do not speak for the tens of millions of Thais who did not vote PTP, and don't want either Thaksin or PTP in office at all. It is not "the people" versus the judges. It is an out of control totalitarian regime against the institutions of law, order and democracy.

In your earlier and now phantom post, you also said that the judges were only interested in self-preservation, because they were "elites". I replied to that comment, that Thaksin the cowardly billionaire crimelord, and his sister the 'hard work is not suitable for me' Yingluck, are both also elites; billionaires who do not have to work at all. Yingluck has also left the country to avoid the consequences of her actions, she was happy enough to put incendiary bills through parliament, but doesn't like to be around to 'face the music'. She has much in common with her brother, a true elitist and coldhearted tyrant.

I certainly don't regret any posts and did not remove them. You and your friends are perfectly happy with a situation where the democratically elected government is undermined by the judiciary and the army. Not everyone voted for PT, but their victory was decisive and the fact that the Dems lost seats showed the public sentiment towards them. No one at all voted for the judges on the CC, So why now are the Dems and the judges the ones impeding the elected government's progress? PT openly campaigned on the platform they would rewrite the 2007 coup sponsored constitution. The unelected military junta were able to rewrite it to their own agenda with no obstruction from the court, so why would a government of the people not be allowed to do the same? PT are in fact only proposing to set up a drafting committee which would be followed by a national referendum. If this is cause for the dissolution of the party, those who voted for the party have valid and substantial reason to believe it is just another chapter in the suppression of their rights by groups who are unwilling to relinquish their profitable grip on power.

What they also campaigned on was Santa's bag of goodies. The uneducated poor Isaanites with their ฿500 vote pay off are not going to give an iota let alone understand what the word constitution is when they are getting cash on the day along with promises of wages doubled, free computers, increased rice prices and all the other promised but never to be delivered bull crap.

If they want a peoples constitution then take it as a referundum to the people.

[DoctorG]

banana republic

[nurofiend]

You don't honestly believe yourself, do you? Their only agenda here is to preserve their own positions, and those of the people who back them. 'Doing their jobs' would surely include upholding due process, which they subverted by accepting petitions directly. How can they rule in an unbiased manner when, 1. They are ruling on the future of their own court and priveleged positions and 2. They are ruling on whether to undo what they had a major hand in installing.

'Upholding the democratic integrity of Thailand' ... What a crock of ....

The judges are not distributing the home addresses of PTP members and advocating thugs to visit those familes at home to harm them. The judges are just going to work, they are not the problem nor are they the cause of this violent agitation, the source of all the current instability and theat to human life lies in Dubai, and ln Yingluck too, wherever she is hiding today.

I actually answered your earlier post in this thread, the one where you eloquently said "let their blood stain the judges hands" and other lovely sentiments about the potential civil war. I notice that your post and my reply both vanished. Did you regret posting those things?

You also mentioned that this type of civil war was justified because the judges stood in the way of "the will of the people". I replied that infact it was not the will of 'the people', only the will of 'some people' , and that PTP do not speak for the tens of millions of Thais who did not vote PTP, and don't want either Thaksin or PTP in office at all. It is not "the people" versus the judges. It is an out of control totalitarian regime against the institutions of law, order and democracy.

In your earlier and now phantom post, you also said that the judges were only interested in self-preservation, because they were "elites". I replied to that comment, that Thaksin the cowardly billionaire crimelord, and his sister the 'hard work is not suitable for me' Yingluck, are both also elites; billionaires who do not have to work at all. Yingluck has also left the country to avoid the consequences of her actions, she was happy enough to put incendiary bills through parliament, but doesn't like to be around to 'face the music'. She has much in common with her brother, a true elitist and coldhearted tyrant.

I certainly don't regret any posts and did not remove them. You and your friends are perfectly happy with a situation where the democratically elected government is undermined by the judiciary and the army. Not everyone voted for PT, but their victory was decisive and the fact that the Dems lost seats showed the public sentiment towards them. No one at all voted for the judges on the CC, So why now are the Dems and the judges the ones impeding the elected government's progress? PT openly campaigned on the platform they would rewrite the 2007 coup sponsored constitution. The unelected military junta were able to rewrite it to their own agenda with no obstruction from the court, so why would a government of the people not be allowed to do the same? PT are in fact only proposing to set up a drafting committee which would be followed by a national referendum. If this is cause for the dissolution of the party, those who voted for the party have valid and substantial reason to believe it is just another chapter in the suppression of their rights by groups who are unwilling to relinquish their profitable grip on power.

What they also campaigned on was Santa's bag of goodies. The uneducated poor Isaanites with their ฿500 vote pay off are not going to give an iota let alone understand what the word constitution is when they are getting cash on the day along with promises of wages doubled, free computers, increased rice prices and all the other promised but never to be delivered bull crap.

If they want a peoples constitution then take it as a referundum to the people.

"If they want a peoples constitution then take it as a referundum to the people."

yes, that's the plan.

[hellodolly]

banana republic

If Thaksin and the scum that back him get there way it will be a banana dictatorship.

[waza]

Maybe not depends on who gets their way......

I believe the current constitution should be amended but I also believe that other people should be given a chance to express their preference. That is why I believe the best way for the government to proceed on this issue is to hold a public referendum.

For now, the argument is a simple either-or.

On the one side are the nay-sayers, namely the red shirt faction in the ruling Pheu Thai government led by Tida Tawornseth, acting chairwoman of the United Front for Democracy against Dictatorship, and MP Natthawut Saikua. This group believes a referendum would be redundant. It reasons that amending the charter was an obvious campaign promise of the Pheu Thai Party during the July 3 election. Since it won the majority of votes, it has an automatic mandate to carry out its policy promises.

http://asiancorrespondent.com/72822/amending-the-constitution-when-should-the-referendum-be-held/

Election Commission member Sodsri Satayathum said the referendum on charter amendment could be done if the Cabinet, in consultation with the speakers of the House and the Senate, deemed it necessary to do so.........

A referendum vote could be done from 90 to 120 days, Sodsri said.

The EC would be tasked with organising the referendum, including holding a series of public hearings allowing proponents and opponents of the issue to air their views to enable voters to form a decision, she said.

She said in her personal opinion, the referendum should be held before the CDA formation to clarify whether or not the charter should be amended.

She said the voting outcome for the July 3 general election should not be construed as a mandate to amend the charter. Although 15 million voters chose the Pheu Thai, their numbers might increase or decrease if asked a specific question about charter amendment. http://www.nationmultimedia.com/politics/Debate-on-referendum-hoting-up-30172614.html

[ManOnTheRoad]

Yay ! Another long holiday no work no school can bring my kids to disneyland in HK hahaha

[PingManDan]

Like any rabid dog he needs to be put to sleep!

Boooooooooooooo just shows your intelligence on the matter

[Reasonableman]

The Lawyers Council of Thailand Wednesday called for an end to the threats and pressure directed at Constitution Court judges who will be handing down a verdict Friday on the charter amendment bills.

In a statement released Wednesday, the council also called on the judges to make their ruling in line with the Constitution and relevant laws, without any bias, be it based on love, hatred, delusion or fear.

"Some groups or members of certain political parties have either spoken publicly or rallied in a public place to make threats, put pressure or say things to influence the judges to make a ruling that will benefit them and their associates," the statement said.

"When the court makes a decision that benefits them, these people will praise the court as a champion of neutrality and justice, but if the verdict has a negative impact on them, then they will accuse the court of being biased and lacking in justice. The Lawyers Council of Thailand has been following developments about this matter with concern."

[ThaiOats]

Watching Red Shirt rallies and propaganda TV is sure educational. I can see how well informed these people are and much how fun it is to participate in an emotional gathering filled with joy and laughter. Every time a leader finishes an emotional (vulgar) sentence, they just go head over heels for that kind of stuff. Forget the facts, facts are boring. Forget the fact that these Government MPs who are supposed to represent the NATION and not only the Red-Shirts, are NOT supposed to incite chaos. Forget the fact that their income is from the tax payer's money and NOT only those who voted for them. Instead of working and taking care of the nation, these goons are out there holding rallies and worrying about how to gather their forces.

Also, what's the purpose of waiting for the verdict if Mrs. Thida herself said that it doesn't matter what the court decides, since they are useless and needed to be removed. I say just pull out the trump card and go through what they've always wanted to do. Settle it here and now. Prolonging the situation is just going to get worse. Either stop Thaksin from damaging the country or stop the ammarts from taking advantage of the people.

By the way, if the CC is REALLY, without any doubt, BIAS against the PTP, then you won't be able to find ANY ruling in favor of them right? But heyyyy, guess what! There have been many instances where the CC ruled in favor for PT, Thaksin and his cronies. So tell me, what the F are these people talking about?

Edited July 11, 2012 by ThaiOats

[GeorgeO]

So not content with handing out numbers and addresses of judges, this so called MP is threatening to mobilize a lynch mob to abduct the judges. This gets better everyday!

This is an attempt to coerce the decisions of the Constitutional Court judges, but worse still, it is "incitement to riot" for which he could be arrested immediately, and should be...!!

[Yunla]

I certainly don't regret any posts and did not remove them. You and your friends are perfectly happy with a situation where the democratically elected government is undermined by the judiciary and the army. Not everyone voted for PT, but their victory was decisive and the fact that the Dems lost seats showed the public sentiment towards them. No one at all voted for the judges on the CC, So why now are the Dems and the judges the ones impeding the elected government's progress? PT openly campaigned on the platform they would rewrite the 2007 coup sponsored constitution. The unelected military junta were able to rewrite it to their own agenda with no obstruction from the court, so why would a government of the people not be allowed to do the same? PT are in fact only proposing to set up a drafting committee which would be followed by a national referendum. If this is cause for the dissolution of the party, those who voted for the party have valid and substantial reason to believe it is just another chapter in the suppression of their rights by groups who are unwilling to relinquish their profitable grip on power.

The problem is that PTP are not 'ony proposing drafting committees'. In the process of forcing through their bills and amendment, without debate or consensus, PTP have also left democracy in the dust, and resorted to common fascism, threatening the lives of law-abiding working Thais. PTP are breaking human-rights laws, and Thai privacy-laws, and endangering the lives of innocent Thais by distributing home-addresses of dissenters to their angry street thugs.

PTP are trying to force through their own agenda, not a Thailand-improvement agenda, but a Freedom for Thaksin agenda, and they are willing to put this agenda as a higher priority than the lives of innocent Thais and their familes at home.

PTP are pushing through bills without any parliamentary debate, a corrupt PTP House Speaker who takes orders from foreign powers (treason) and rules in PTPs favour to hamstring the parliamentary process and neuter the central accountability-failsafes of democracy. Yingluck who doesn't even read the bills or attend debates, or vote, or visit parliament itself except on special occasions like birthdays and equinoxes. That is the background to your fallacious "only proposing draft committees". Background is very important. What they are 'only doing' is subverting democracy, and relying on threats and intimidation against anybody who opposes them, as a substitute for the due process of parliamentary debate and consensus-forming which they have avoided since they were elected.

Just because they included constitutional reform / Freedom for Thaksin etc. in their "openly campaigned platform" pre-election does not mean anything. That was just their campaign promises, along with "improving the lives of the poorest in society" which of course was just included for comedy-value , a sort of 'in-joke' among the PTP billionaire criminals in Dubai. "You think they'll believe this rural reform stuff? Who cares, it'll be a laugh. Send them some more dictator-face T-shirts, that seems to keep them happy."

Less than half of Thailand voted for PTP. I would say that means at least 50% of Thailand doesn't want any scabby PTP constitutional rewrites, or state-upheavals or the return of El Brigande as dictator. Most Thais certainly don't want human-rights abuse and overt law-breaking by the Government in the capital city, such as PTP are prone to.

You seem to mistake 'PTP getting 48% of the votes' for 'PTP being allowed to do whatever they want to do in office'. That is infact not the case. Being elected in democracy means you have a right to lead using the democratic tools of parliamentary debate and consensus-forming, reasoned discussion, bills and charters put through the state-system correctly and respectfully. It means (most importantly) that you have a solemn duty to protect ALL Thai citizens living within the democracy. It does not mean PTP can send fascist thugs round to the family homes of people who disagree with the regime, or threaten civil war when they don't get their way.

Edited July 12, 2012 by Yunla

[bikerider21]

Someone, please go and dust off any law anywhere, that forbids people from inciting civil war.

There has to be something somewhere, or did they forget to write that one?????

Think it's called Treason...

Treason against the king was known as high treason and treason against a lesser superior was petty treason. A person who commits treason is known in law as a traitor.

[Thai at Heart]

I suppose lawyers are like goalkeepers. They only really make headlines when they screw up.

[khunron13]

With politicians like this, Thailand will remain the hub of the Third World!

[Buchholz]

Scumbag words from a scumbag.

This is the face of the PTP - not the blithering bimbo

There's more of them ( Red Shirt Leaders ) in the government.

.

[ThaiOats]

By the way, if the military steps in... will it still be the fault of the Democrats?

[OzMick]

.....and there's 7.7 million reasons why they might. Push granny in front of a tank - JACKPOT!

[Crushdepth]

I'm sure he was just badly misquoted, he was actually inviting the judges around for tea and bickies...

Wake up you boneheads. How much reality has to slap you in the face before you give up your denial?

These people are thugs, and you will not be seeing any kind of democracy under their rule, other than the single party "Democratic Peoples Republic of" variety.

[ThaiOats]

Just listen to their rallies. It's all just show and inciting hatred without anything of substance!

[hemanrcr]

The 500 baht payments have started upcountry and the troops are being readied.

[Semper]

Sounds like he wants a favourable decision or a lynch mob/ civil war.

Hope he gets the war.

[SuneeTH]

Tell me which country receive freedom without struggle and blood bath.

Just tell me 1 country.

[GentlemanJim]

The 500 baht payments have started upcountry and the troops are being readied.

Can you elaborate on that?

[MILT]

As I see it Democracy and not following the letter of the law is a sham Democracy. When winning an election by the majority of the voters that are getting paid to vote is not Democracy. Judicial branches of the government are and should be independent of the legislative and Executive branches. The foundation of any true democracy is the rule of law, without the rule of law the world would be a real hell. These particular Courts are in place for keeping the checks and balances of government.

[SuneeTH]

As I see it Democracy and not following the letter of the law is a sham Democracy. When winning an election by the majority of the voters that are getting paid to vote is not Democracy. Judicial branches of the government are and should be independent of the legislative and Executive branches. The foundation of any true democracy is the rule of law, without the rule of law the world would be a real hell. These particular Courts are in place for keeping the checks and balances of government.

Correct.

Most of Thai votes are bought.

Hence it is better to select a leader than to vote for one.

This is exactly what PAD has been telling the "not so smart majority" Thai people.

I say move back history to 80 years ago, and undo the 1st coup.

[MILT]

I certainly don't regret any posts and did not remove them. You and your friends are perfectly happy with a situation where the democratically elected government is undermined by the judiciary and the army. Not everyone voted for PT, but their victory was decisive and the fact that the Dems lost seats showed the public sentiment towards them. No one at all voted for the judges on the CC, So why now are the Dems and the judges the ones impeding the elected government's progress? PT openly campaigned on the platform they would rewrite the 2007 coup sponsored constitution. The unelected military junta were able to rewrite it to their own agenda with no obstruction from the court, so why would a government of the people not be allowed to do the same? PT are in fact only proposing to set up a drafting committee which would be followed by a national referendum. If this is cause for the dissolution of the party, those who voted for the party have valid and substantial reason to believe it is just another chapter in the suppression of their rights by groups who are unwilling to relinquish their profitable grip on power.

The problem is that PTP are not 'ony proposing drafting committees'. In the process of forcing through their bills and amendment, without debate or consensus, PTP have also left democracy in the dust, and resorted to common fascism, threatening the lives of law-abiding working Thais. PTP are breaking human-rights laws, and Thai privacy-laws, and endangering the lives of innocent Thais by distributing home-addresses of dissenters to their angry street thugs. PTP are trying to force through their own agenda, not a Thailand-improvement agenda, but a Freedom for Thaksin agenda, and they are willing to put this agenda as a higher priority than the lives of innocent Thais and their familes at home. PTP are pushing through bills without any parliamentary debate, a corrupt PTP House Speaker who takes orders from foreign powers (treason) and rules in PTPs favour to hamstring the parliamentary process and neuter the central accountability-failsafes of democracy. Yingluck who doesn't even read the bills or attend debates, or vote, or visit parliament itself except on special occasions like birthdays and equinoxes. That is the background to your fallacious "only proposing draft committees". Background is very important. What they are 'only doing' is subverting democracy, and relying on threats and intimidation against anybody who opposes them, as a substitute for the due process of parliamentary debate and consensus-forming which they have avoided since they were elected. Just because they included constitutional reform / Freedom for Thaksin etc. in their "openly campaigned platform" pre-election does not mean anything. That was just their campaign promises, along with "improving the lives of the poorest in society" which of course was just included for comedy-value , a sort of 'in-joke' among the PTP billionaire criminals in Dubai. "You think they'll believe this rural reform stuff? Who cares, it'll be a laugh. Send them some more dictator-face T-shirts, that seems to keep them happy." Less than half of Thailand voted for PTP. I would say that means at least 50% of Thailand doesn't want any scabby PTP constitutional rewrites, or state-upheavals or the return of El Brigande as dictator. Most Thais certainly don't want human-rights abuse and overt law-breaking by the Government in the capital city, such as PTP are prone to. You seem to mistake 'PTP getting 48% of the votes' for 'PTP being allowed to do whatever they want to do in office'. That is infact not the case. Being elected in democracy means you have a right to lead using the democratic tools of parliamentary debate and consensus-forming, reasoned discussion, bills and charters put through the state-system correctly and respectfully. It means (most importantly) that you have a solemn duty to protect ALL Thai citizens living within the democracy. It does not mean PTP can send fascist thugs round to the family homes of people who disagree with the regime, or threaten civil war when they don't get their way.

That was a great read! The best comment on the truth of the matter