Pm Yingluck Fails To Impress Private Sector

[rixalex]

The overwhelming lack of honest journalism in the Thai English "press" this week was nauseating.

Honest journalism with regards political affairs is to me about being critical and challenging, and keeping on the pressure. The minute the journalists stop to start patting backs and giving praise, the minute politicians get lax and complacent. The best sort of journalism is that that gives politicians not a minute's rest, that unturns stones, that airs dirty laundry. Sadly nothing of that sort of investigative journalism exists here, hence one of the reasons why corruption is so rampant.

I appreciate that Yingluck and the PTP is under the spotlight more and facing more criticism than others, and that may pain you, but urge you to keep in mind that as the party with the job of running the country right now, it is they who need to be kept on their toes more than others, and it for the good of the country that they are, even at times when perhaps it is not warranted. Don't be nauseated. Save that for sychophantic, head-up-the-behind, leave-her-alone-she's-only-a-woman type crap that gets scattered amongst these threads.

[yoshiwara]

I'm sure you meant to say my "realistic" stance.

Only people to the right of the rising sun would call my positions "apologetic".

But then you seem to miss the fact that my comment was about Thai voters and not about the government, the PTP, or the UDD.

Not well done.

Enough of us to tilt the Earth on its axis I would think.

[Noistar]

- deleted for quote limits

55555555555555555555555

You obviously don't know Hasan so best you keep your opinion on how he would vote to yourself.

Aside from the obvious sexism in the thought that a woman would be somehow more reasonable, measured, etc, most people who actually deal with the PM see that she is potentially a good figurehead type leader with some leeway given as she is not a career politician, but on the flip side she has shown to have been a weak leader unable to instill a sense of urgency in her cabinet; one might guess this is due to a personal superficial understanding of most issues, being a poor public speaker, and lack of legitimacy since without her brother she would not have been able to get into power. Her work record at AIS and SC Asset reflects that; she got those jobs through family, not through merit. Looks have bought her some time, but results speak louder.

If she used this situation to made her cabinet and the civil service scared/respectful of her (as her brother or former sister in law did) then things would get done; instead she drifts along, with managed PR opportunities and meetings only. Hence the 'bang on the table' remark. It isn't about confrontation, it is about being an effective leader (instead we have the same situation as we have had since 2004, when the government internally argues and doesn't actually do much of anything).

no I don't know him which is why I said 'based on this comment' and 'it seems'. Not unlike your own use of the term "one might guess"... On the other hand you state point blank that she did not get her jobs within SC & AIS on merit - something you are very unlikely to actually know. You could have re-used your own phrasing, "one might guess"...

As for your obvious sexism, that might just be in your own mind. It is certainly not in mine. I was referring to how the candidate Yingluck positioned herself during the election campaign as potentially Thailand's first female PM and how her style differ from other candidates.

And you state that this government "doesn't actually do much of anything" which denies the fact that programs have been launched and/or implemented for every campaign promise. Minimum wage, corp tax reductions, tablet PCs, rice subsidies, car purchase incentives, women's fund, etc...

I still have a hard time recalling all the achievements of Abhisit's first year in office, but then again, he didn't have any campaign promises to fulfill, either...

"... - something you are very unlikely to actually know.... "

He is more likely than you to know for real, than you are giving any credit.

You are making an assumption on his lack of connections,

and I have met the man and can attest to his being extraordinarily well informed.

As to programs launched.

They've launched boat loads, but the percentage that are more the superficial fluff is very small.

you don't know me.

But then I admit that I don't know the man and just use reading comprehension skills to make a comment.

I did not make any assumptions about steverom...'s connections or lack of connections except for the statement about him being very unlikely to know in detail how it was that YS got the different jobs at AIS and SC - a perfectly reasonable claim to make about a random, anonymous poster on TVF - but Steve can come out and add more color to his comment that might make it credible rather than it seeming to just be the usual slam against the PM.

I don't know you nor steveromag and as you post anonymously, there is not any way that I can verify your statement.

And if Steve really knows him so well, then perhaps he could have pointed out how this comment is perhaps taken out of context given what he knows of Hasan, or he could have shed some additional light on the commentary since the information from The Drivel just included

"not just is the current premier considered weak but the country is frustrated with a lack of capable leader for quite long. What we need is a leader who can bang the table and get the job done."

which excuse me, without more information this sounds like someone who probably did not vote for YS, which is exactly what I said.

So maybe stevero knows Hasan better than the Drivel. Or maybe you, steve, and the nation have all watched his youtube video

and we all have the same level of information. But since there are only 3 views and one was me, I guess that can't be true.

As for programs launched, I notice that no one can point to a campaign promise that has not been started or implemented already. But since people can't actually just state the facts and appear to feel the need to denigrate this government, they just do their best to paint 1 year in office as insignificant. Exactly as The Nation, the paid anti-Yingluck, pro-Abhisit mouthpiece of the right, has done this last week.

The overwhelming lack of honest journalism in the Thai English "press" this week was nauseating.

The list of achievements isn't qualified by any 'unable to's'. So this is an even more impressive first year of the ruling party's first term, when one considers it's all been done under the 2007 Constitution.

Perhaps PM Yingluck and her ruling party don't need to pursue Charter amendments in order to deliver their policies for the benefit of Thailand.

[steveromagnino]

"Her work record at AIS and SC Asset reflects that; she got those jobs through family, not through merit."

OK, to clarify everything hereafter is my opinion, but in many cases an opinion strongly supported by evidence.

I do not believe she would have secured either job at AIS or at SC Asset were her family not the owners of the company; in both cases she appeared to have limited autonomy and decision making power.

I believe almost every person with some knowledge of Thailand is well aware MANY senior executives are placed in positions as the result of family, rather than merit. This is part of the Thai-Chinese mentality of not giving up control of a publically listed company, and particularly apparent in the way that AIS and Shin was run:

- monopoly businesses in various areas granted to Thaksin by (mostly) Chalerm/Chavalit

- monopoly was preserved by connections to the government, and other entrants to the market handicapped with worse concession deals

- Thaksin's first foray into politics resulted in a situation where at least AIS alone was somehow not being exposed to US debt when the Thai baht collapsed giving him a huge advantage

- As part of the 1997 Constitution, telecoms deregulation and the threats of number portability, foreign ownership, new concession agreements threatened his empire, so he entered politics and subsequently TRT blocked most telecoms deregulation, blocked most of the cashflow needed to finance his competitors from foreign investors/ownership, stalled 3G to protect his 2watt frequency headstart, blocked restrictions on phone use while driving, etc; he attempted to control prepaid/postpaid, margins on handsets, almost every aspect of the market through government policy and PR; the incumbent market leader normally enjoys an advantage and together with regulatory control he was able to manipulate to exit the market on a high prior to the 3G roll out when his money would not have been enough to compete without huge investment; referred to as 'crony capitalism' in many circles and also seen in other industries that TRT operated in

- Yingluck served as CEO of AIS during this period, enjoying substantial regulatory benefits and simultaneously capitalising on the huge growth in telecoms seen the world over as the world change, most innovations incidentally NOT introduced by AIS (prepaid by DTAC, fixed contract and handsets by Orange, low margin handsets by DTAC, massive pricewar by DTAC/True, number portability by the military govt)

- for AIS and Shin's other concession arms to keep going, it required careful control of government policy kept lockstep with company decision making; that's why the Thai Chinese way is to run a company; if you need to raise cash then sell debt first, then part ownership but control is given away last or never; if you have a concession business...then become the person who controls the concession

If I was in Thakins's position where I was not allowed to run a telecoms empire due to not being allowed to by the 1997 Constitution (due to conflict of interest), I would need an outstanding proxy who would follow all orders and commands as needed; as they say blood is thicker than water, and this was the case why almost anyone asked would say Yingluck ended up running AIS.

In the case of AIS major spending decisions were allegedly passed back to Thaksin to make decisions, and her role was principally one of execution and control. Given that she has not held a single job since her graduation as a result of merit alone (every job she has held since her intern days is either family or connection related and that is a matter of public record) it seems fair to say that she got the job at AIS with a CV quite short of Telecoms, leadership or senior management experience...so the fact that her brother owned the company seems to make it odds on she was put in there as a proxy.

Perhaps when she moved to SC Asset she had more experience, but SC Asset struggled to acheive certain goals in last 5 years given their financial strengths:

- quality land bank

- international partners to generate foreign sales

- leadership in the condo market

- expansion into hospitality and international markets

- expansion into major regional hubs

It is widely known that theoretically SC Asset and TCC should be two of the strongest real estate players due to enormous financial strength which can overwhelm LPN, Sansiri, Q House, L&H, AP, Preuksa etc.

I cannot comment as to whether another property company would hire her outside of the Shinwatra controlled companies, again, she has never worked outside of that group of connections (even now as PM she would be unable to be PM were she not the younger sister of Thaksin Shinwatra, I can name various other senior business people who would have similar name recognition to her and none of them would stand a chance of coming into politics fresh, and becoming PM with the way she came in). Perhaps even I could become PM were I to have the TS seal of approval, as Somchai, Yingluck and Samak all show (none on their own merits IMHO would be capable of being voted PM).

And lest you think I am singling her out, many of the Thai listed companies and political empires have family people in power rather than placement based on a meritocracy. Many of the politicians in the house are elected based on name rather than any proven performance. Many civil servants the same, unless you can think of some hidden qualities that people like Duangchalerm possess which the rest of us don't know about.

Regarding sexism, I stated "Aside from the obvious sexism in the thought that a woman would be somehow more reasonable, measured, etc," and I stand by what I said; in leading academic institutions such a comment is unacceptable and anyhow has been completely discredited in gender research. So whoever said it.....I think is as foolish to make such a point as former Deputy PM Chavalit when he was trying to stop usage of mobile phones while driving giving the example that a husband might lose concentration due to his nagging wife calling him while driving, and cause an accident. It was some very PR savvy handlers that positioned her this way taking advantage of common gender stereotypes, it doesn't make it any less stupid and it doesn't do her or women longterm any favors. I understand the definition of sexism, and the thought that a woman possesses specific characteristics not capable of standing the scrutiny of research...is sexism.

Regarding policy I will admit to this; yes they have done something. They have done the easy giving away things. I think all the parties had lousy policies last election on the freebies front, but I would say that I overstepped in suggesting they haven't done anything. They have done something. They haven't actually addressed, IMHO, any of the difficult ones nor were their promises the right promises in the first place, and so I get the very real sense, they haven't done anything meaningful.

PEUA THAI PROMISES

- Guarantee a uniform daily minimum wage of 300 baht ($10) throughout the country; this would rise to 1,000 baht by 2020.

NOT AS PROMISED, introduced in 7 provinces only, many employers working around it in those 7 provinces using well known loopholes none of which are even being attempted to be closed off; huge inflationary effect

- Raise salaries of civil servants and state workers

NOT DONE postponed to 2014

- Universal medical care; patients pay 30 baht ($0.97) per visit

NOT DONE(AFAIK), hugely unpopular with the people who actually know how to run healthcare to introduce 30b which costs more than 30b to administrate; current democrats/military system still running just fine

- Credit cards for farmers to buy fertiliser and other things needed for production

CANCELLED THEN REINTRODUCED BUT NOT DONE YET (giving away tax payer money and gauaranteed to fail anyhow)

- rice intervention scheme with a guaranteed 15,000-20,000 baht per tonne for unmilled rice

SORT OF DONE but widespread corruption, money not flowing to farmers, huge millstone for Thai taxpayers (but yes, has been done)

- Three-year household debt moratorium for those with up to 500,000 baht in debt, focusing on teachers, farmers and civil servants; debt restructuring for those with more than 500,000 baht.

SORT OF DONE debt moratorium but this is a standard election promise, isn't anything new and is giving away tax payer money to people who already are proven to not know how to use it; no debt restructuring for those with more than 500k

- Starting monthly salary of 15,000 baht ($500) for new university graduates, up from the current 10,640 baht.

NOT DONE (not done yet, revised to civil servants only and a work in progress maybe for 2014)

- Free tablet computers for about 800,000 new school children each year. Puea Thai says these would cost 5,000 baht ($160) each and operate with open-source software.

NOT AS PROMISED (actual value of unit more like 2000b per unit, not an apple as appeared to be in the ads, complete lack of infrastructure to support the policy, not up to 800,000 units given out yet, also again, the tax payer is funding it, so not really free for the them!)

- Corporate tax cut from 30 percent to 23 percent in first year, 20 percent in second year

DONE of course why not reward the grass roots people first, no no hold on, this is the corporates that people like the Shinawatras, banks and their supporters all own...easy so easy to give away money to the rich

- Tax cuts for buyers of first homes and first cars

SORT OF DONE - heavy restrictions on what is eligible, very low take up rates so scheme extended already, i.e. it's a dog with fleas

- A flat 20 baht fare for all 10 mass transit rail lines in Bangkok

HAHAHAHAHA

- Promote Bangkok's Suvarnabhumi airport as regional hub

HAAHAHAHAHAAHA nice we are just opening Don Muang again

- High-speed rail lines linking key cities in the north, northeast, east and upper south regions. Trains to link with outskirts of Bangkok and eastern tourism, industrial hubs

HAHAHAHAHA only progress is trying to take on the BMA for doing much the same

- Annual rural village development funds of between 300,000 and two million baht for each of Thailand's 73,000 villages.

EXISTING POLICY

- Free Wi-Fi and Internet connections in public places.

HAHAHAHAHA NO and not going to happen

- Build 30-km (18-mile) anti-flooding levees to protect Bangkok and satellite towns from tide surges around the Gulf of Thailand

HAHAHAHAHA other than being stupid, hardly anything has even been done yet to help protect Thailand from flooding again this year!

- Special administrative status for southern Muslim provinces

HAHAHAHA as restless as ever, and now under the control of Chalerm who knows his way around a gun, complete mess

- Campaign to wipe out illicit drugs

HAHAHAHAHAHA well I suppose they have tried but again, nothing acheived yet, complete mess

- Reconciliation

Trying to whitewash the actions of fraudsters, arsonists and criminals, trying to discredit the judiciary and refusing to confirm that they are attempting to return a convicted criminal to Thai jails where he belongs. So NO, NOT DONE

- Temporary removal of a levy on certain sorts of fuel for vehicles, allowing pump prices to fall.

ELECTION BRIBE DONE but now finished so currently energy prices are higher not lower

- Pledge to maintain prices of consumer goods and energy at a suitable level for the public.

NOT DONE, prices increasing rapidly (denied by government)

As for the logic of comments regarding Mr Hasan, yes i know him personally, suffice to say my intial comment stands.

You are correct, matters of opinion should be phrased as such, except when the black swan case arises (just because every swan we see is white, we cannot say all swans are white; if we see even just 1 black swan we can indeed state the reverse; not all swans are white).

Edited August 8, 2012 by steveromagnino

[steveromagnino]

The list of achievements isn't qualified by any 'unable to's'. So this is an even more impressive first year of the ruling party's first term, when one considers it's all been done under the 2007 Constitution.

Perhaps PM Yingluck and her ruling party don't need to pursue Charter amendments in order to deliver their policies for the benefit of Thailand.

Please outline how the 2007 Constitution makes implementing any of the promised policies of PT more or less difficult, when compared to (I presume) the 1997 Constitution?

Specific clauses and details of procedure would be appreciated, as I am not knowledgeable enough to comment on this, and so look forward to learning from you regarding this matter.

It is, superficially, very difficult to implement policies, but in practice, where policies are simply giving away cash, the actual implementation is very simple; the difficulty of giveaway policies is making them sustainable longterm. Again, I am unsure where, if anywhere, the 2007 Constitution places specific restrictions on this.

[h90]

Useless bla bla bla...

Popularity and status and face is what that politicians live and die by...

I would say money is more important than all of that

[Noistar]

The list of achievements isn't qualified by any 'unable to's'. So this is an even more impressive first year of the ruling party's first term, when one considers it's all been done under the 2007 Constitution.

Perhaps PM Yingluck and her ruling party don't need to pursue Charter amendments in order to deliver their policies for the benefit of Thailand.

Please outline how the 2007 Constitution makes implementing any of the promised policies of PT more or less difficult, when compared to (I presume) the 1997 Constitution?

Specific clauses and details of procedure would be appreciated, as I am not knowledgeable enough to comment on this, and so look forward to learning from you regarding this matter.

It is, superficially, very difficult to implement policies, but in practice, where policies are simply giving away cash, the actual

implementation is very simple; the difficulty of giveaway policies is making them sustainable longterm. Again, I am unsure where, if anywhere, the 2007 Constitution places specific restrictions on this.

My point has always been, why does the 2007 Constitution need to be amended if policies are being implemented successfully as it stands?

Any ideas? I remain bemused by what I consider to be the dis-proportionate effort the ruling party are putting into changing it.

It ain't broke, so let's deal with higher priorities before spending time fixing it - corruption for instance

[Bagwan]

Yingluck was only made PM candidate for PTP to "impress" a part of the uneducated electorate to win.Its no surprise she fails to impress anyone else

Sent from my LG-P350 using Thaivisa Connect App

people here like to talk about the "uneducated electorate" in Thailand.

Besides noting that uneducated and uninformed are not the same thing, and maybe KKV meant gullible instead...

Does anyone (Farang) really think that Thai voters are less informed that the electorate in their own countries?

Does anyone recall the youtube video at the height of the Iraq war where Americans were asked to find Iraq on a world map?

Get real... The Thai people I know, even the uneducated, are better informed about current events in their own country than a representative sample of Americans.

I bought a globe for the kids to help them understand the world that they live in. Not one member of the family , about 20 of them I guess, could point out where Thailand was. Nor could they point out on a map of Thailand where the province that they lived in was. On the other hand most of the adults have at one time of another told me that Thaksin was 'big Mafia'.

[philw]

"Her work record at AIS and SC Asset reflects that; she got those jobs through family, not through merit."

OK, to clarify everything hereafter is my opinion, but in many cases an opinion strongly supported by evidence.

I do not believe she would have secured either job at AIS or at SC Asset were her family not the owners of the company; in both cases she appeared to have limited autonomy and decision making power.

I believe almost every person with some knowledge of Thailand is well aware MANY senior executives are placed in positions as the result of family, rather than merit. This is part of the Thai-Chinese mentality of not giving up control of a publically listed company, and particularly apparent in the way that AIS and Shin was run:

- monopoly businesses in various areas granted to Thaksin by (mostly) Chalerm/Chavalit

- monopoly was preserved by connections to the government, and other entrants to the market handicapped with worse concession deals

- Thaksin's first foray into politics resulted in a situation where at least AIS alone was somehow not being exposed to US debt when the Thai baht collapsed giving him a huge advantage

- As part of the 1997 Constitution, telecoms deregulation and the threats of number portability, foreign ownership, new concession agreements threatened his empire, so he entered politics and subsequently TRT blocked most telecoms deregulation, blocked most of the cashflow needed to finance his competitors from foreign investors/ownership, stalled 3G to protect his 2watt frequency headstart, blocked restrictions on phone use while driving, etc; he attempted to control prepaid/postpaid, margins on handsets, almost every aspect of the market through government policy and PR; the incumbent market leader normally enjoys an advantage and together with regulatory control he was able to manipulate to exit the market on a high prior to the 3G roll out when his money would not have been enough to compete without huge investment; referred to as 'crony capitalism' in many circles and also seen in other industries that TRT operated in

- Yingluck served as CEO of AIS during this period, enjoying substantial regulatory benefits and simultaneously capitalising on the huge growth in telecoms seen the world over as the world change, most innovations incidentally NOT introduced by AIS (prepaid by DTAC, fixed contract and handsets by Orange, low margin handsets by DTAC, massive pricewar by DTAC/True, number portability by the military govt)

- for AIS and Shin's other concession arms to keep going, it required careful control of government policy kept lockstep with company decision making; that's why the Thai Chinese way is to run a company; if you need to raise cash then sell debt first, then part ownership but control is given away last or never; if you have a concession business...then become the person who controls the concession

If I was in Thakins's position where I was not allowed to run a telecoms empire due to not being allowed to by the 1997 Constitution (due to conflict of interest), I would need an outstanding proxy who would follow all orders and commands as needed; as they say blood is thicker than water, and this was the case why almost anyone asked would say Yingluck ended up running AIS.

In the case of AIS major spending decisions were allegedly passed back to Thaksin to make decisions, and her role was principally one of execution and control. Given that she has not held a single job since her graduation as a result of merit alone (every job she has held since her intern days is either family or connection related and that is a matter of public record) it seems fair to say that she got the job at AIS with a CV quite short of Telecoms, leadership or senior management experience...so the fact that her brother owned the company seems to make it odds on she was put in there as a proxy.

Perhaps when she moved to SC Asset she had more experience, but SC Asset struggled to acheive certain goals in last 5 years given their financial strengths:

- quality land bank

- international partners to generate foreign sales

- leadership in the condo market

- expansion into hospitality and international markets

- expansion into major regional hubs

It is widely known that theoretically SC Asset and TCC should be two of the strongest real estate players due to enormous financial strength which can overwhelm LPN, Sansiri, Q House, L&H, AP, Preuksa etc.

I cannot comment as to whether another property company would hire her outside of the Shinwatra controlled companies, again, she has never worked outside of that group of connections (even now as PM she would be unable to be PM were she not the younger sister of Thaksin Shinwatra, I can name various other senior business people who would have similar name recognition to her and none of them would stand a chance of coming into politics fresh, and becoming PM with the way she came in). Perhaps even I could become PM were I to have the TS seal of approval, as Somchai, Yingluck and Samak all show (none on their own merits IMHO would be capable of being voted PM).

And lest you think I am singling her out, many of the Thai listed companies and political empires have family people in power rather than placement based on a meritocracy. Many of the politicians in the house are elected based on name rather than any proven performance. Many civil servants the same, unless you can think of some hidden qualities that people like Duangchalerm possess which the rest of us don't know about.

Regarding sexism, I stated "Aside from the obvious sexism in the thought that a woman would be somehow more reasonable, measured, etc," and I stand by what I said; in leading academic institutions such a comment is unacceptable and anyhow has been completely discredited in gender research. So whoever said it.....I think is as foolish to make such a point as former Deputy PM Chavalit when he was trying to stop usage of mobile phones while driving giving the example that a husband might lose concentration due to his nagging wife calling him while driving, and cause an accident. It was some very PR savvy handlers that positioned her this way taking advantage of common gender stereotypes, it doesn't make it any less stupid and it doesn't do her or women longterm any favors. I understand the definition of sexism, and the thought that a woman possesses specific characteristics not capable of standing the scrutiny of research...is sexism.

Regarding policy I will admit to this; yes they have done something. They have done the easy giving away things. I think all the parties had lousy policies last election on the freebies front, but I would say that I overstepped in suggesting they haven't done anything. They have done something. They haven't actually addressed, IMHO, any of the difficult ones nor were their promises the right promises in the first place, and so I get the very real sense, they haven't done anything meaningful.

PEUA THAI PROMISES

- Guarantee a uniform daily minimum wage of 300 baht ($10) throughout the country; this would rise to 1,000 baht by 2020.

NOT AS PROMISED, introduced in 7 provinces only, many employers working around it in those 7 provinces using well known loopholes none of which are even being attempted to be closed off; huge inflationary effect

- Raise salaries of civil servants and state workers

NOT DONE postponed to 2014

- Universal medical care; patients pay 30 baht ($0.97) per visit

NOT DONE(AFAIK), hugely unpopular with the people who actually know how to run healthcare to introduce 30b which costs more than 30b to administrate; current democrats/military system still running just fine

- Credit cards for farmers to buy fertiliser and other things needed for production

CANCELLED THEN REINTRODUCED BUT NOT DONE YET (giving away tax payer money and gauaranteed to fail anyhow)

- rice intervention scheme with a guaranteed 15,000-20,000 baht per tonne for unmilled rice

SORT OF DONE but widespread corruption, money not flowing to farmers, huge millstone for Thai taxpayers (but yes, has been done)

- Three-year household debt moratorium for those with up to 500,000 baht in debt, focusing on teachers, farmers and civil servants; debt restructuring for those with more than 500,000 baht.

SORT OF DONE debt moratorium but this is a standard election promise, isn't anything new and is giving away tax payer money to people who already are proven to not know how to use it; no debt restructuring for those with more than 500k

- Starting monthly salary of 15,000 baht ($500) for new university graduates, up from the current 10,640 baht.

NOT DONE (not done yet, revised to civil servants only and a work in progress maybe for 2014)

- Free tablet computers for about 800,000 new school children each year. Puea Thai says these would cost 5,000 baht ($160) each and operate with open-source software.

NOT AS PROMISED (actual value of unit more like 2000b per unit, not an apple as appeared to be in the ads, complete lack of infrastructure to support the policy, not up to 800,000 units given out yet, also again, the tax payer is funding it, so not really free for the them!)

- Corporate tax cut from 30 percent to 23 percent in first year, 20 percent in second year

DONE of course why not reward the grass roots people first, no no hold on, this is the corporates that people like the Shinawatras, banks and their supporters all own...easy so easy to give away money to the rich

- Tax cuts for buyers of first homes and first cars

SORT OF DONE - heavy restrictions on what is eligible, very low take up rates so scheme extended already, i.e. it's a dog with fleas

- A flat 20 baht fare for all 10 mass transit rail lines in Bangkok

HAHAHAHAHA

- Promote Bangkok's Suvarnabhumi airport as regional hub

HAAHAHAHAHAAHA nice we are just opening Don Muang again

- High-speed rail lines linking key cities in the north, northeast, east and upper south regions. Trains to link with outskirts of Bangkok and eastern tourism, industrial hubs

HAHAHAHAHA only progress is trying to take on the BMA for doing much the same

- Annual rural village development funds of between 300,000 and two million baht for each of Thailand's 73,000 villages.

EXISTING POLICY

- Free Wi-Fi and Internet connections in public places.

HAHAHAHAHA NO and not going to happen

- Build 30-km (18-mile) anti-flooding levees to protect Bangkok and satellite towns from tide surges around the Gulf of Thailand

HAHAHAHAHA other than being stupid, hardly anything has even been done yet to help protect Thailand from flooding again this year!

- Special administrative status for southern Muslim provinces

HAHAHAHA as restless as ever, and now under the control of Chalerm who knows his way around a gun, complete mess

- Campaign to wipe out illicit drugs

HAHAHAHAHAHA well I suppose they have tried but again, nothing acheived yet, complete mess

- Reconciliation

Trying to whitewash the actions of fraudsters, arsonists and criminals, trying to discredit the judiciary and refusing to confirm that they are attempting to return a convicted criminal to Thai jails where he belongs. So NO, NOT DONE

- Temporary removal of a levy on certain sorts of fuel for vehicles, allowing pump prices to fall.

ELECTION BRIBE DONE but now finished so currently energy prices are higher not lower

- Pledge to maintain prices of consumer goods and energy at a suitable level for the public.

NOT DONE, prices increasing rapidly (denied by government)

As for the logic of comments regarding Mr Hasan, yes i know him personally, suffice to say my intial comment stands.

You are correct, matters of opinion should be phrased as such, except when the black swan case arises (just because every swan we see is white, we cannot say all swans are white; if we see even just 1 black swan we can indeed state the reverse; not all swans are white).

Thank you for all this effort Steve, which at over 2,000 words is almost bigger than the newspaper that inspired it.

Your initial paragraphs about the influence and control of Chinese dynastic families is well taken and very apposite.

A reference to Sterling Seagraves " Lords of the Rim " may have sufficed.

Regarding your other points about the effectiveness or not of the current administration and their specific election promises, HAHAHAHA rather gives the game away.

[OzMick]

Get real... The Thai people I know, even the uneducated, are better informed about current events in their own country than a representative sample of Americans.

Talk about "damned with faint praise".

Are you saying your red shirts mates watch red TV?

[philw]

Get real... The Thai people I know, even the uneducated, are better informed about current events in their own country than a representative sample of Americans.

Talk about "damned with faint praise".

Are you saying your red shirts mates watch red TV?

No, that's not quite the point, try again.

[bunuel]

The Prime Miniister was elected by an overwhelming margin in a free and fair election, Can one say the same for het undemocratically selectd predecessors? In the world of free market econonies, democracy is gpod for business . That is, unless you would rsther live in China - or Mynmar! Suggest the PMs detrsctors try winning the next election.

[Noistar]

The Prime Miniister was elected by an overwhelming margin in a free and fair election, Can one say the same for het undemocratically selectd predecessors? In the world of free market econonies, democracy is gpod for business . That is, unless you would rsther live in China - or Mynmar! Suggest the PMs detrsctors try winning the next election.

I'm not sure what point you're making.

The topic relates to her performance, has nothing to do with how previous Governments assumed control, and doesn't dispute the results of last year's elections.

If you want to include the Democratic aspect, perhaps her performance is even more relevant as the ruling party's significant majority means they can implement policies unopposed

[waza]

The Prime Miniister was elected by an overwhelming margin in a free and fair election, Can one say the same for het undemocratically selectd predecessors? In the world of free market econonies, democracy is gpod for business . That is, unless you would rsther live in China - or Mynmar! Suggest the PMs detrsctors try winning the next election.

No Yingluck wasnt, she was selected by Thaksin for a party list position. Then Thaksin appionted her a party leader and therefore PM. Yingluck wasnt elected by the people of Thailand.

[koosdeboer]

"Her work record at AIS and SC Asset reflects that; she got those jobs through family, not through merit."

OK, to clarify everything hereafter is my opinion, but in many cases an opinion strongly supported by evidence.

I do not believe she would have secured either job at AIS or at SC Asset were her family not the owners of the company; in both cases she appeared to have limited autonomy and decision making power.

I believe almost every person with some knowledge of Thailand is well aware MANY senior executives are placed in positions as the result of family, rather than merit. This is part of the Thai-Chinese mentality of not giving up control of a publically listed company, and particularly apparent in the way that AIS and Shin was run:

- monopoly businesses in various areas granted to Thaksin by (mostly) Chalerm/Chavalit

- monopoly was preserved by connections to the government, and other entrants to the market handicapped with worse concession deals

- Thaksin's first foray into politics resulted in a situation where at least AIS alone was somehow not being exposed to US debt when the Thai baht collapsed giving him a huge advantage

- As part of the 1997 Constitution, telecoms deregulation and the threats of number portability, foreign ownership, new concession agreements threatened his empire, so he entered politics and subsequently TRT blocked most telecoms deregulation, blocked most of the cashflow needed to finance his competitors from foreign investors/ownership, stalled 3G to protect his 2watt frequency headstart, blocked restrictions on phone use while driving, etc; he attempted to control prepaid/postpaid, margins on handsets, almost every aspect of the market through government policy and PR; the incumbent market leader normally enjoys an advantage and together with regulatory control he was able to manipulate to exit the market on a high prior to the 3G roll out when his money would not have been enough to compete without huge investment; referred to as 'crony capitalism' in many circles and also seen in other industries that TRT operated in

- Yingluck served as CEO of AIS during this period, enjoying substantial regulatory benefits and simultaneously capitalising on the huge growth in telecoms seen the world over as the world change, most innovations incidentally NOT introduced by AIS (prepaid by DTAC, fixed contract and handsets by Orange, low margin handsets by DTAC, massive pricewar by DTAC/True, number portability by the military govt)

- for AIS and Shin's other concession arms to keep going, it required careful control of government policy kept lockstep with company decision making; that's why the Thai Chinese way is to run a company; if you need to raise cash then sell debt first, then part ownership but control is given away last or never; if you have a concession business...then become the person who controls the concession

If I was in Thakins's position where I was not allowed to run a telecoms empire due to not being allowed to by the 1997 Constitution (due to conflict of interest), I would need an outstanding proxy who would follow all orders and commands as needed; as they say blood is thicker than water, and this was the case why almost anyone asked would say Yingluck ended up running AIS.

In the case of AIS major spending decisions were allegedly passed back to Thaksin to make decisions, and her role was principally one of execution and control. Given that she has not held a single job since her graduation as a result of merit alone (every job she has held since her intern days is either family or connection related and that is a matter of public record) it seems fair to say that she got the job at AIS with a CV quite short of Telecoms, leadership or senior management experience...so the fact that her brother owned the company seems to make it odds on she was put in there as a proxy.

Perhaps when she moved to SC Asset she had more experience, but SC Asset struggled to acheive certain goals in last 5 years given their financial strengths:

- quality land bank

- international partners to generate foreign sales

- leadership in the condo market

- expansion into hospitality and international markets

- expansion into major regional hubs

It is widely known that theoretically SC Asset and TCC should be two of the strongest real estate players due to enormous financial strength which can overwhelm LPN, Sansiri, Q House, L&H, AP, Preuksa etc.

I cannot comment as to whether another property company would hire her outside of the Shinwatra controlled companies, again, she has never worked outside of that group of connections (even now as PM she would be unable to be PM were she not the younger sister of Thaksin Shinwatra, I can name various other senior business people who would have similar name recognition to her and none of them would stand a chance of coming into politics fresh, and becoming PM with the way she came in). Perhaps even I could become PM were I to have the TS seal of approval, as Somchai, Yingluck and Samak all show (none on their own merits IMHO would be capable of being voted PM).

And lest you think I am singling her out, many of the Thai listed companies and political empires have family people in power rather than placement based on a meritocracy. Many of the politicians in the house are elected based on name rather than any proven performance. Many civil servants the same, unless you can think of some hidden qualities that people like Duangchalerm possess which the rest of us don't know about.

Regarding sexism, I stated "Aside from the obvious sexism in the thought that a woman would be somehow more reasonable, measured, etc," and I stand by what I said; in leading academic institutions such a comment is unacceptable and anyhow has been completely discredited in gender research. So whoever said it.....I think is as foolish to make such a point as former Deputy PM Chavalit when he was trying to stop usage of mobile phones while driving giving the example that a husband might lose concentration due to his nagging wife calling him while driving, and cause an accident. It was some very PR savvy handlers that positioned her this way taking advantage of common gender stereotypes, it doesn't make it any less stupid and it doesn't do her or women longterm any favors. I understand the definition of sexism, and the thought that a woman possesses specific characteristics not capable of standing the scrutiny of research...is sexism.

Regarding policy I will admit to this; yes they have done something. They have done the easy giving away things. I think all the parties had lousy policies last election on the freebies front, but I would say that I overstepped in suggesting they haven't done anything. They have done something. They haven't actually addressed, IMHO, any of the difficult ones nor were their promises the right promises in the first place, and so I get the very real sense, they haven't done anything meaningful.

PEUA THAI PROMISES

- Guarantee a uniform daily minimum wage of 300 baht ($10) throughout the country; this would rise to 1,000 baht by 2020.

NOT AS PROMISED, introduced in 7 provinces only, many employers working around it in those 7 provinces using well known loopholes none of which are even being attempted to be closed off; huge inflationary effect

- Raise salaries of civil servants and state workers

NOT DONE postponed to 2014

- Universal medical care; patients pay 30 baht ($0.97) per visit

NOT DONE(AFAIK), hugely unpopular with the people who actually know how to run healthcare to introduce 30b which costs more than 30b to administrate; current democrats/military system still running just fine

- Credit cards for farmers to buy fertiliser and other things needed for production

CANCELLED THEN REINTRODUCED BUT NOT DONE YET (giving away tax payer money and gauaranteed to fail anyhow)

- rice intervention scheme with a guaranteed 15,000-20,000 baht per tonne for unmilled rice

SORT OF DONE but widespread corruption, money not flowing to farmers, huge millstone for Thai taxpayers (but yes, has been done)

- Three-year household debt moratorium for those with up to 500,000 baht in debt, focusing on teachers, farmers and civil servants; debt restructuring for those with more than 500,000 baht.

SORT OF DONE debt moratorium but this is a standard election promise, isn't anything new and is giving away tax payer money to people who already are proven to not know how to use it; no debt restructuring for those with more than 500k

- Starting monthly salary of 15,000 baht ($500) for new university graduates, up from the current 10,640 baht.

NOT DONE (not done yet, revised to civil servants only and a work in progress maybe for 2014)

- Free tablet computers for about 800,000 new school children each year. Puea Thai says these would cost 5,000 baht ($160) each and operate with open-source software.

NOT AS PROMISED (actual value of unit more like 2000b per unit, not an apple as appeared to be in the ads, complete lack of infrastructure to support the policy, not up to 800,000 units given out yet, also again, the tax payer is funding it, so not really free for the them!)

- Corporate tax cut from 30 percent to 23 percent in first year, 20 percent in second year

DONE of course why not reward the grass roots people first, no no hold on, this is the corporates that people like the Shinawatras, banks and their supporters all own...easy so easy to give away money to the rich

- Tax cuts for buyers of first homes and first cars

SORT OF DONE - heavy restrictions on what is eligible, very low take up rates so scheme extended already, i.e. it's a dog with fleas

- A flat 20 baht fare for all 10 mass transit rail lines in Bangkok

HAHAHAHAHA

- Promote Bangkok's Suvarnabhumi airport as regional hub

HAAHAHAHAHAAHA nice we are just opening Don Muang again

- High-speed rail lines linking key cities in the north, northeast, east and upper south regions. Trains to link with outskirts of Bangkok and eastern tourism, industrial hubs

HAHAHAHAHA only progress is trying to take on the BMA for doing much the same

- Annual rural village development funds of between 300,000 and two million baht for each of Thailand's 73,000 villages.

EXISTING POLICY

- Free Wi-Fi and Internet connections in public places.

HAHAHAHAHA NO and not going to happen

- Build 30-km (18-mile) anti-flooding levees to protect Bangkok and satellite towns from tide surges around the Gulf of Thailand

HAHAHAHAHA other than being stupid, hardly anything has even been done yet to help protect Thailand from flooding again this year!

- Special administrative status for southern Muslim provinces

HAHAHAHA as restless as ever, and now under the control of Chalerm who knows his way around a gun, complete mess

- Campaign to wipe out illicit drugs

HAHAHAHAHAHA well I suppose they have tried but again, nothing acheived yet, complete mess

- Reconciliation

Trying to whitewash the actions of fraudsters, arsonists and criminals, trying to discredit the judiciary and refusing to confirm that they are attempting to return a convicted criminal to Thai jails where he belongs. So NO, NOT DONE

- Temporary removal of a levy on certain sorts of fuel for vehicles, allowing pump prices to fall.

ELECTION BRIBE DONE but now finished so currently energy prices are higher not lower

- Pledge to maintain prices of consumer goods and energy at a suitable level for the public.

NOT DONE, prices increasing rapidly (denied by government)

As for the logic of comments regarding Mr Hasan, yes i know him personally, suffice to say my intial comment stands.

You are correct, matters of opinion should be phrased as such, except when the black swan case arises (just because every swan we see is white, we cannot say all swans are white; if we see even just 1 black swan we can indeed state the reverse; not all swans are white).

Thank you for all this effort Steve, which at over 2,000 words is almost bigger than the newspaper that inspired it.

Your initial paragraphs about the influence and control of Chinese dynastic families is well taken and very apposite.

A reference to Sterling Seagraves " Lords of the Rim " may have sufficed.

Regarding your other points about the effectiveness or not of the current administration and their specific election promises, HAHAHAHA rather gives the game away.

So you agree that the current administration is ineffective.

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[rixalex]

The Prime Miniister was elected by an overwhelming margin in a free and fair election, Can one say the same for het undemocratically selectd predecessors? In the world of free market econonies, democracy is gpod for business . That is, unless you would rsther live in China - or Mynmar! Suggest the PMs detrsctors try winning the next election.

Overlooking for one moment the other glaring errors and false claims in your post, your suggestion for people to stop "detrscting" the PM and try winning the next election, seems rather strange. The job of winning the next election goes to the opposition parties. People commenting on the PM, here at least, are, as far as i am aware, just members of the public. It seems you are unhappy for members of the public to be expressing an opinion on the Prime Minister. Perhaps you would like them to shut up. Perhaps you think they should keep their criticisms to themselves. Certainly how it sounds. I think perhaps it is you who should be living in China or Mynmar.

Democracy isn't people having a say on one day every four years, or however long a government's term lasts. Democracy is people having a say every day.

[Nickymaster]

Yingluck was only made PM candidate for PTP to "impress" a part of the uneducated electorate to win.Its no surprise she fails to impress anyone else

Sent from my LG-P350 using Thaivisa Connect App

people here like to talk about the "uneducated electorate" in Thailand.

Besides noting that uneducated and uninformed are not the same thing, and maybe KKV meant gullible instead...

Does anyone (Farang) really think that Thai voters are less informed that the electorate in their own countries?

Does anyone recall the youtube video at the height of the Iraq war where Americans were asked to find Iraq on a world map?

Get real... The Thai people I know, even the uneducated, are better informed about current events in their own country than a representative sample of Americans.

The fact is that most Thais can be bought. Most Thais accept corruption. Most Thais are uneducated. Most Thais are poor. Most Thais have poor judgment skills (otherwise they wouldn’t have attacked security forces). Most Thais are easy to manipulate (otherwise they wouldn't have attacked and burned 36 sites in Bangkok).

11 million people voted for the DEMS, 15 million people voted for PT. Mostly the educated voted for the Dems and the un-educated vote PT.

If you let the 15 million PT voters and the 11 million Dems voters take an IQ test and ad the score of each group together, I bet you that the total score of the 11 million is higher than the total score of the 15 million.

(I might have the vote figures wrong but should be somewhere in that range).

Then the questions is, does a person with an higher IQ score and better education have better judgment skills in choosing a government.

No dis-respect to any group. Just facts.

Edited August 9, 2012 by Nickymaster

[rixalex]

The fact is that most Thais can be bought. Most Thais accept corruption. Most Thais are uneducated. Most Thais are poor. Most Thais have poor judgment skills (otherwise they wouldn’t have attacked security forces). Most Thais are easy to manipulate (otherwise they wouldn't have attacked and burned 36 sites in Bangkok).

11 million people voted for the DEMS, 15 million people voted for PT. Mostly the educated voted for the Dems and the un-educated vote PT.

If you let the 15 million PT voters and the 11 million Dems voters take an IQ test and ad the score of each group together, I bet you that the total score of the 11 million is higher than the total score of the 15 million.

(I might have the vote figures wrong but should be somewhere in that range).

Then the questions is, does a person with an higher IQ score and better education have better judgment skills in choosing a government.

No dis-respect to any group. Just facts.

I appreciate you aren't trying to be disrespectful, but i do feel there is a danger of that when you start making sweeping generalisations.

I'm also uncomfortable with labelling people. Take for example the "uneducated" label. It's a hard thing to label someone without it sounding derogatory. I'd feel more comfortable with finding a derogatory label for those in government over the years who have failed to offer one of the most basic of public services and rights - decent schooling.

[steveromagnino]

apologies for the length of the post, but it took on a bit of a life of its own!

Regarding the comment:

people here like to talk about the "uneducated electorate" in Thailand.

Does anyone (Farang) really think that Thai voters are less informed that the electorate in their own countries?

Get real... The Thai people I know, even the uneducated, are better informed about current events in their own country than a representative sample of Americans.

I would say certainly that the electorate in the country I grew up are substantially, on average, better informed and more aware of the concept of democracy than in Thailand; this is simply the result of having a working democracy for many more years than Thailand, a general higher level of education, and an awareness of the importance of real issues of a democracy based on hard learned experience rather than placing everything on the importance of a constitution and pieces of paper. Also constitutional monarchies in 2 of the 3 countries I grew up. Suffice to say, our experiences differ substantially.

There need to be checks and balances which most Thai governments historically have ignored, and the current government is attempting to remove, which protect the electorate, so debate in other countries tends to be perhaps more on the issues, with private members bills also able to circumvent the party, something that doesn't exist in Thai politics where the party machine is all powerful.

You also have a clear separation of powers between the executive legislative and judicial branches.

I am not sure how being able to place Thailand on the map makes Thailand more or less advanced than USA, but would further comment that the political system in USA while extremely non functional at the moment in many respects, is many, many steps beyond Thailand. The degree of personal enrichment on both sides of the house and conduct of our MPs is shameful, even when compared to the USA.

I am quite sure the majority of red shirt (and yellow shirt too) supporters, far more than half, have not read the constitution (supported by research by major newspapers), cannot name the differences between the 1997 and 2007 constitutions and cannot reference or debate most issues relating to democracy in Thailand vs democracy abroad. I also would expect the majority of any country to be the same; the difference is in other more developed countries the laws of how democracy are a lot more static (witness the number of constitutions Thailand has needed), so perhaps in those countries we wouldn't be seeing a group actually out on the streets appearing to drive the changes that the few people at the top (who do know exactly what they want out of a 'democracy') want to see happen - namely, a country run entirely based on who is most popular having complete power to do what they like - absolutism - which is not part of a true democracy except when presented by Thaksin.

In most democracies I am not sure how important the general awareness of the masses is, provided the people that are actually in the house and in positions of power are capable, able to communicate, and the checks and balances are there to keep them honest including electioneering policy; respect for the law and separation of powers. Given the ratbags we have on both sides of the house, I would challenge posters to name 50 (10%) of the house that are actually capable, well qualified individuals - I bet you get stuck closer to 10 than to 50; then take out the ones who are list MPs like the PM who were not directly elected, and you will see we have a VERY poorly functioning democracy in Thailand if the measure of how good a democracy is uses the measure of directly electing capable, quality individuals who are there to represent and work for the people.

This is no surprise, Thai democracy is still young, and it will be steps forward steps back. The question is, in my opinion, do we want to keep taking more steps back arguing the wrong issues?

I base my conclusions regarding the red shirts on my own interactions with many of them who, at a rank and file level, other than the thugs who resort to violence, I respect have legitimate grievances; many may have clear understanding of general concepts of democracy but these concepts can be manipulated and twisted as we see now in the so called reconciliation attempts to free criminals and fraudsters, in the willingness to accept comments of their leaders regarding breaking the law (including the real red fake red fiasco). The grievances are very real, the path to solve them, is not democratic, rather it is based on their leader's PR and goals, which are opinion and ideas packaged as democracy - hence the constantly repeated "more people voted for us than anyone else, so we can do what they want and anyone trying to stop us is undemocratic."

Edited August 9, 2012 by steveromagnino

[waza]

The fact is that most Thais can be bought. Most Thais accept corruption. Most Thais are uneducated. Most Thais are poor. Most Thais have poor judgment skills (otherwise they wouldn’t have attacked security forces). Most Thais are easy to manipulate (otherwise they wouldn't have attacked and burned 36 sites in Bangkok).

11 million people voted for the DEMS, 15 million people voted for PT. Mostly the educated voted for the Dems and the un-educated vote PT.

If you let the 15 million PT voters and the 11 million Dems voters take an IQ test and ad the score of each group together, I bet you that the total score of the 11 million is higher than the total score of the 15 million.

(I might have the vote figures wrong but should be somewhere in that range).

Then the questions is, does a person with an higher IQ score and better education have better judgment skills in choosing a government.

No dis-respect to any group. Just facts.

I appreciate you aren't trying to be disrespectful, but i do feel there is a danger of that when you start making sweeping generalisations.

I'm also uncomfortable with labelling people. Take for example the "uneducated" label. It's a hard thing to label someone without it sounding derogatory. I'd feel more comfortable with finding a derogatory label for those in government over the years who have failed to offer one of the most basic of public services and rights - decent schooling.

Despite the attraction of the conbahnock or country bumpkin stereotype I cant agree with your comments. I believe that any group of individuals no matter what location would conform to the intelligence quotient bell curve. The major difference would be ethnic, cultural, economic advantage and life chances. That is knowledge, education and life expierences.

[MunterHunter]

Yingluck was only made PM candidate for PTP to "impress" a part of the uneducated electorate to win.Its no surprise she fails to impress anyone else

Sent from my LG-P350 using Thaivisa Connect App

people here like to talk about the "uneducated electorate" in Thailand.

Besides noting that uneducated and uninformed are not the same thing, and maybe KKV meant gullible instead...

Does anyone (Farang) really think that Thai voters are less informed that the electorate in their own countries?

Does anyone recall the youtube video at the height of the Iraq war where Americans were asked to find Iraq on a world map?

Get real... The Thai people I know, even the uneducated, are better informed about current events in their own country than a representative sample of Americans.

The fact is that most Thais can be bought. Most Thais accept corruption. Most Thais are uneducated. Most Thais are poor. Most Thais have poor judgment skills (otherwise they wouldn’t have attacked security forces). Most Thais are easy to manipulate (otherwise they wouldn't have attacked and burned 36 sites in Bangkok).

11 million people voted for the DEMS, 15 million people voted for PT. Mostly the educated voted for the Dems and the un-educated vote PT.

If you let the 15 million PT voters and the 11 million Dems voters take an IQ test and ad the score of each group together, I bet you that the total score of the 11 million is higher than the total score of the 15 million.

(I might have the vote figures wrong but should be somewhere in that range).

Then the questions is, does a person with an higher IQ score and better education have better judgment skills in choosing a government.

No dis-respect to any group. Just facts.

OK, its pretty well known that i don't like PTP/Reds very much (and not that well known that i am not a yellow, but do support the Democrats) - and even i feel this is a crock of sh*t - sorry but this is just plain garbage. there are educated and uneducated on both sides of the political fence and sweeping generalizations like this say more about you than anything else.

[Thaddeus]

I'm also uncomfortable with labelling people. Take for example the "uneducated" label. It's a hard thing to label someone without it sounding derogatory. I'd feel more comfortable with finding a derogatory label for those in government over the years who have failed to offer one of the most basic of public services and rights - decent schooling.

I think brigands is a suitable label.

//edit/spolling

Edited August 9, 2012 by Thaddeus

[bunuel]

The Prime Miniister was elected by an overwhelming margin in a free and fair election, Can one say the same for het undemocratically selectd predecessors? In the world of free market econonies, democracy is gpod for business . That is, unless you would rsther live in China - or Mynmar! Suggest the PMs detrsctors try winning the next election.

I'm not sure what point you're making.

The topic relates to her performance, has nothing to do with how previous Governments assumed control, and doesn't dispute the results of last year's elections.

If you want to include the Democratic aspect, perhaps her performance is even more relevant as the ruling party's significant majority means they can implement policies unopposed

The point is that Denial is not a river in Egypt. The fact that THE NATION give the PM bad reviews should come as no surprise to anyone familiar with the newspaper. Now, if THE NATION had something good to say about her - that would be news!

[Nickymaster]

Yingluck was only made PM candidate for PTP to "impress" a part of the uneducated electorate to win.Its no surprise she fails to impress anyone else

Sent from my LG-P350 using Thaivisa Connect App

people here like to talk about the "uneducated electorate" in Thailand.

Besides noting that uneducated and uninformed are not the same thing, and maybe KKV meant gullible instead...

Does anyone (Farang) really think that Thai voters are less informed that the electorate in their own countries?

Does anyone recall the youtube video at the height of the Iraq war where Americans were asked to find Iraq on a world map?

Get real... The Thai people I know, even the uneducated, are better informed about current events in their own country than a representative sample of Americans.

The fact is that most Thais can be bought. Most Thais accept corruption. Most Thais are uneducated. Most Thais are poor. Most Thais have poor judgment skills (otherwise they wouldn’t have attacked security forces). Most Thais are easy to manipulate (otherwise they wouldn't have attacked and burned 36 sites in Bangkok).

11 million people voted for the DEMS, 15 million people voted for PT. Mostly the educated voted for the Dems and the un-educated vote PT.

If you let the 15 million PT voters and the 11 million Dems voters take an IQ test and ad the score of each group together, I bet you that the total score of the 11 million is higher than the total score of the 15 million.

(I might have the vote figures wrong but should be somewhere in that range).

Then the questions is, does a person with an higher IQ score and better education have better judgment skills in choosing a government.

No dis-respect to any group. Just facts.

OK, its pretty well known that i don't like PTP/Reds very much (and not that well known that i am not a yellow, but do support the Democrats) - and even i feel this is a crock of sh*t - sorry but this is just plain garbage. there are educated and uneducated on both sides of the political fence and sweeping generalizations like this say more about you than anything else.

So why does democracy work better in developed countries than in developing countries?

So why does propaganda work better in developing countries than in developed countries?

Why has this government implemented so many populist policies?

It is still a fact that MOSTLY educated people vote Dems, MOSTLY uneducated vote PT. That is just how it is. Don’t blame me for that. You can call me whatever you want and say that I generalise; fine. I just hope that people would get better education in order to make better decisions.

Thaksin has been in control of this country for 9 out of the last 12 years. Why hasn't he improved the education system? One of the biggest problems Thailand is facing at the moment is shortage of skilled labor and I still don't see any progress there. In stead, they give 1 million kids a tablet computer. Why?

Edited August 9, 2012 by Nickymaster

[moe666]

Some of her government's policies such as the minimum wage increase have destroyed Thai export competitiveness as well as created cost of living problems for the people.

pure unadulterated dogmatic BS offered up without a stitch of evidence... because the argument can't be made on a national, economic level...

When the problem is dogmatically keeping the baht high,

and pretending the election sops of excessive price controls and pledging schemes,

are not the core issues of economic decline in world market place competativeness.

They lazy Thais don't deserves 300 Baht/day, more like 120 baht/day due to the cheap food and housing in Thailand.

That is why the scheme fail.

Excuse me I get tired of hearing Thais are lazy. My girlfriend works 6 days a week 10 hours a day for 7,000baht a month if you think that is fair you have a problem. Her brothers and sisters are rice farmers in the Mae Hong Song area these people work very hard to support themselves and family. Thais are not much different than other people around the world, working to support themselves and their families. An old girlfriends brother developed a mushroom farm and he was always busy taking care of it. If you can throw out that statement because of the people you hang with then you hang with the wrong ones.

The lady who cooks my breakfast every day also works at the Chiang Mai airport as a security checker, she found a handgun in a farangs carry on. This lady starts work at 0700 in the morning finishes at the cafe around 1200 has a couple of hours off then goes to work at the airport around 1400 hours and works until 2400 hours this all for the huge sum of 20baht and hour at the cafe and 240baht an hour at the airport, please stop with the old tired reframe of Thais are lazy.

[mca]

^ It's OK Moe Sunee's posts ( if not a risible attempt at trolling) usually have the depth and insight of the average plank of wood..

[SOEYCHANLOY]

Everybody knows the level of the person in question.....

Not even able to get to parliament in 10% of the sessions!

Only in charge for spoil the Country and bring home (China) the stolen $$$$. For the rest. Better dont lose time with that window shopper.

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[Noistar]

The Prime Miniister was elected by an overwhelming margin in a free and fair election, Can one say the same for het undemocratically selectd predecessors? In the world of free market econonies, democracy is gpod for business . That is, unless you would rsther live in China - or Mynmar! Suggest the PMs detrsctors try winning the next election.

I'm not sure what point you're making.

The topic relates to her performance, has nothing to do with how previous Governments assumed control, and doesn't dispute the results of last year's elections.

If you want to include the Democratic aspect, perhaps her performance is even more relevant as the ruling party's significant majority means they can implement policies unopposed

The point is that Denial is not a river in Egypt. The fact that THE NATION give the PM bad reviews should come as no surprise to anyone familiar with the newspaper. Now, if THE NATION had something good to say about her - that would be news!

I must be having a bad day because I'm finding it very difficult to understand the point you are making, especially in the context of the topic.

The PM is in the position of being responsible for the Thai, her, Government's performance, and will therefore get press attention.

Or is your post that you don't like The Nation criticizing her. I believe reporting relates to her and her position as PM.

If she stepped down from her Government position, perhaps she'd get the glowing press coverage you appear to seek

[jerrysteve]

She does appear to be getting a bit chunky... well you know what they say, once on the lips, forever on the hips!

[bunuel]

Some people in Thailand are so blinded by hatref that they cannot see the obvious. So I shall spell it out: political instability is bad fir busiiness. And , in case you hadn't noticed,Thailand had a well-deserved reputation internationally for political instability. So if

Thailand does notf figure out a way to resolve political differences in a democratic fashion, the international community will take its businessl elsewhere. There seem some Thais who have no respect for the democratic process, and this is cause for concern.

The NATION writing something criical of the PM is like Fox News attacking Obama - what would you expect from them?

The NATIONs coverage of Thaksins visit to New York was more of the same. Red shirts cheer, yellow shirts boo - what do you expect?

The bottom line is this is not news - it is just dumb propaganda . Journalistic credibility has to be earned, and The NATIION lost

Its credibility some tine ago.