Mounting Heavy Weights

[tropo]

If you're interested in the Mr Olympia contest, the webcast for prejudging is now up.

http://www.bodybuild...st-replays.html

Kai Greene and Phil Heath are 1st and 2nd unless something dramatic happens tonight in the final judging.

Edited September 29, 2012 by tropo

[robblok]

Got the powerhooks over the mail today. They look great an other nice addition to my home gym. I will do a write up later, too bad that i wont be using them until Thursday or so.

I really think they will help a lot.

[Kalbo]

Got the powerhooks over the mail today. They look great an other nice addition to my home gym. I will do a write up later, too bad that i wont be using them until Thursday or so.

I really think they will help a lot.

Can you post a photo or two, please Rob ?

[likewise]

My shoulder day exists out of : Standing military press 1 x 10 - 2 x 8 to 10 ( about 30 kilo), Seated front press same sets and reps (30 to 40 kilo)

upright rowing narrow grip same sets/reps about 20 kilo, side lateral raises same sets/reps about 15 kilo. Sometimes I do the seated DB lifts instead of standing military press.

[robblok]

My shoulder day exists out of : Standing military press 1 x 10 - 2 x 8 to 10 ( about 30 kilo), Seated front press same sets and reps (30 to 40 kilo)

upright rowing narrow grip same sets/reps about 20 kilo, side lateral raises same sets/reps about 15 kilo. Sometimes I do the seated DB lifts instead of standing military press.

Your shoulder routine looks an awfully lot like mine. Those are the exercises i use, i might ad in shrugs too for my traps.

[robblok]

Below a picture basically they are hooks you put the handle of the dumbell on them and put some velcro around it (not really needed but makes you feel safer). Then you got some dumbells with hooks.

You can mount those on your barbell that you place at the desired hight, below a picture from the site. I will make some pictures of mine in use later Kalbo and send them to you but this way you got the idea

[tropo]

My shoulder day exists out of : Standing military press 1 x 10 - 2 x 8 to 10 ( about 30 kilo), Seated front press same sets and reps (30 to 40 kilo)

upright rowing narrow grip same sets/reps about 20 kilo, side lateral raises same sets/reps about 15 kilo. Sometimes I do the seated DB lifts instead of standing military press.

There's unlikely to be a problem at these light weights, but upright rows (narrow or wider) are extremely bad for the wrists. Have a good look at your wrist angle next time you're doing them. You really should be kind to your wrists in the gym. If you have access to a low cable and a rope, use that because you can keep your wrists straight through the entire movement... otherwise I'd suggest dropping them.

[Kalbo]

My shoulder day exists out of : Standing military press 1 x 10 - 2 x 8 to 10 ( about 30 kilo), Seated front press same sets and reps (30 to 40 kilo)

upright rowing narrow grip same sets/reps about 20 kilo, side lateral raises same sets/reps about 15 kilo. Sometimes I do the seated DB lifts instead of standing military press.

There's unlikely to be a problem at these light weights, but upright rows (narrow or wider) are extremely bad for the wrists. Have a good look at your wrist angle next time you're doing them. You really should be kind to your wrists in the gym. If you have access to a low cable and a rope, use that because you can keep your wrists straight through the entire movement... otherwise I'd suggest dropping them.

Seconded, although the reason being that I buggered my shoulder up and not the wrist.

[tropo]

Seconded, although the reason being that I buggered my shoulder up and not the wrist.

Old habits die hard. It's universally accepted by exercise physiologists as a bad exercise yet everyone still does them. I've done my fair share of them too. When you go heavy you'll really notice the stress on the wrists. It's an ok exercise with DBs though - and a lot harder.

Edited October 10, 2012 by tropo

[likewise]

My problem seem to be that my shoulders develop a lot harder then chest ? Here's my chest day : Flat bench press 1 x 10 2 x 8 to 10 - Incline bench press same reps/sets - incline flies 1 x 12 3 x 10 - incline dumbbell press 1 x 10 2 x 8 to 10. Weight I use, about 70 to 80 kilo for flat BP, 60 for incline BP, 12.5 for flies - 25 kilo for DB press.

I do feel the pressure on shoulders with every single exercise I do though !

I don't use the gym, do it all at home with powerrack + olympic barbell, EZ barbell and dumbbells.

[robblok]

My problem seem to be that my shoulders develop a lot harder then chest ? Here's my chest day : Flat bench press 1 x 10 2 x 8 to 10 - Incline bench press same reps/sets - incline flies 1 x 12 3 x 10 - incline dumbbell press 1 x 10 2 x 8 to 10. Weight I use, about 70 to 80 kilo for flat BP, 60 for incline BP, 12.5 for flies - 25 kilo for DB press.

I do feel the pressure on shoulders with every single exercise I do though !

I don't use the gym, do it all at home with powerrack + olympic barbell, EZ barbell and dumbbells.

I train at home too, got my own powerrack and olympic barbell like you. I think what muscles grow easier is genetically pre determined. Unless your routine is real bad it wont influence growth as much as geneticis a friend of mine almost does not train his back but has a great back.

[likewise]

I'm going to try a narrower grip when doing bench press, I noticed with the wide grip that I feel more tension on shoulders then chest.

Edited October 10, 2012 by likewise

[tropo]

I'm going to try a narrower grip when doing bench press, I noticed with the wide grip that I feel more tension on shoulders then chest.

Wide grip bench presses are one of the fastest ways to injure your shoulders. Bring the grip inside the rings if you use an olympic bar and draw your elbows forwards. Better yet, find some good bench press instruction articles because if you were doing them wide grip you have lot to learn about the movement besides grip width.

[tropo]

My problem seem to be that my shoulders develop a lot harder then chest ? Here's my chest day : Flat bench press 1 x 10 2 x 8 to 10 - Incline bench press same reps/sets - incline flies 1 x 12 3 x 10 - incline dumbbell press 1 x 10 2 x 8 to 10. Weight I use, about 70 to 80 kilo for flat BP, 60 for incline BP, 12.5 for flies - 25 kilo for DB press.

I do feel the pressure on shoulders with every single exercise I do though !

I don't use the gym, do it all at home with powerrack + olympic barbell, EZ barbell and dumbbells.

I train at home too, got my own powerrack and olympic barbell like you. I think what muscles grow easier is genetically pre determined. Unless your routine is real bad it wont influence growth as much as geneticis a friend of mine almost does not train his back but has a great back.

No muscles grow easily for most people, but the deltoids are one of the hardest to grow. One of the main reasons is that most people only train the front delts whatever they do - they don't isolate the medial and rear delts properly. Most people do too much for the chest by comparison and the joints are too fried to work the shoulder well. They injure themselves in the bench press by trying to push too much weight - once the rotator cuff is injured, quality shoulder work becomes nearly impossible.

[likewise]

I'm going to try a narrower grip when doing bench press, I noticed with the wide grip that I feel more tension on shoulders then chest.

Wide grip bench presses are one of the fastest ways to injure your shoulders. Bring the grip inside the rings if you use an olympic bar and draw your elbows forwards. Better yet, find some good bench press instruction articles because if you were doing them wide grip you have lot to learn about the movement besides grip width.

I was holding the bar on the rings of the barbell, going to keep them on the inside now, lots of vids I watched did mention to use a wide grip ! Maybe I took it a bit too wide . But thanks for the info Tropo and Robblok.

[likewise]

Today going to do legs and back; front, back and over head squats - back will be wide and narrow grip chin ups, and an ex. kinda like up right rowing bit with body slightly bended position and wider grip on the barbell.

[Kalbo]

My problem seem to be that my shoulders develop a lot harder then chest ? Here's my chest day : Flat bench press 1 x 10 2 x 8 to 10 - Incline bench press same reps/sets - incline flies 1 x 12 3 x 10 - incline dumbbell press 1 x 10 2 x 8 to 10. Weight I use, about 70 to 80 kilo for flat BP, 60 for incline BP, 12.5 for flies - 25 kilo for DB press.

I do feel the pressure on shoulders with every single exercise I do though !

I don't use the gym, do it all at home with powerrack + olympic barbell, EZ barbell and dumbbells.

I train at home too, got my own powerrack and olympic barbell like you. I think what muscles grow easier is genetically pre determined. Unless your routine is real bad it wont influence growth as much as geneticis a friend of mine almost does not train his back but has a great back.

No muscles grow easily for most people, but the deltoids are one of the hardest to grow. One of the main reasons is that most people only train the front delts whatever they do - they don't isolate the medial and rear delts properly. Most people do too much for the chest by comparison and the joints are too fried to work the shoulder well. They injure themselves in the bench press by trying to push too much weight - once the rotator cuff is injured, quality shoulder work becomes nearly impossible.

Tropo, are there any exercises other than lateral raises (either dumbell or cable) that will work the medial deltoid well ? Along with what you've said above, my shoulders (delts) and biceps are the two muscle groups that I find very hard to get results with. I've always assumed that this is because I'm tall-ish (6'2"), but is there any way to work around this ? My hat goes off to Lou Ferrigno who managed to get as big as he did, and he's about 6' 5".

[Orac]

My problem seem to be that my shoulders develop a lot harder then chest ? Here's my chest day : Flat bench press 1 x 10 2 x 8 to 10 - Incline bench press same reps/sets - incline flies 1 x 12 3 x 10 - incline dumbbell press 1 x 10 2 x 8 to 10. Weight I use, about 70 to 80 kilo for flat BP, 60 for incline BP, 12.5 for flies - 25 kilo for DB press.

I do feel the pressure on shoulders with every single exercise I do though !

I don't use the gym, do it all at home with powerrack + olympic barbell, EZ barbell and dumbbells.

I train at home too, got my own powerrack and olympic barbell like you. I think what muscles grow easier is genetically pre determined. Unless your routine is real bad it wont influence growth as much as geneticis a friend of mine almost does not train his back but has a great back.

No muscles grow easily for most people, but the deltoids are one of the hardest to grow. One of the main reasons is that most people only train the front delts whatever they do - they don't isolate the medial and rear delts properly. Most people do too much for the chest by comparison and the joints are too fried to work the shoulder well. They injure themselves in the bench press by trying to push too much weight - once the rotator cuff is injured, quality shoulder work becomes nearly impossible.

Your comment on 'too much weight' has me concerned. I am fairly new to weights (8 months in and just getting the hang of it) but the new routine I have just started on taken from book by Michael Mathews suggests low reps and heavy weights - chest day is 3 x 4/6 bench press 3 x 4/6 incline press (doing both on smith machine for the moment) and 3 x 4/6 dumbell press also 3 abs exercises in between. It says that once you can do 6 reps with good form then up the weight and aim for 4 reps. It makes no mention of joint problems though having done it for a few days now I can certainly feel the extra strain on my muscles that I wasn't getting on the 12 rep routines with more exercises I was doing before.

Given the expertise on this forum I would appreciate comments on if you think this could be putting shoulders at risk.

Edited October 11, 2012 by Orac

[robblok]

My problem seem to be that my shoulders develop a lot harder then chest ? Here's my chest day : Flat bench press 1 x 10 2 x 8 to 10 - Incline bench press same reps/sets - incline flies 1 x 12 3 x 10 - incline dumbbell press 1 x 10 2 x 8 to 10. Weight I use, about 70 to 80 kilo for flat BP, 60 for incline BP, 12.5 for flies - 25 kilo for DB press.

I do feel the pressure on shoulders with every single exercise I do though !

I don't use the gym, do it all at home with powerrack + olympic barbell, EZ barbell and dumbbells.

I train at home too, got my own powerrack and olympic barbell like you. I think what muscles grow easier is genetically pre determined. Unless your routine is real bad it wont influence growth as much as geneticis a friend of mine almost does not train his back but has a great back.

No muscles grow easily for most people, but the deltoids are one of the hardest to grow. One of the main reasons is that most people only train the front delts whatever they do - they don't isolate the medial and rear delts properly. Most people do too much for the chest by comparison and the joints are too fried to work the shoulder well. They injure themselves in the bench press by trying to push too much weight - once the rotator cuff is injured, quality shoulder work becomes nearly impossible.

Tropo, are there any exercises other than lateral raises (either dumbell or cable) that will work the medial deltoid well ? Along with what you've said above, my shoulders (delts) and biceps are the two muscle groups that I find very hard to get results with. I've always assumed that this is because I'm tall-ish (6'2"), but is there any way to work around this ? My hat goes off to Lou Ferrigno who managed to get as big as he did, and he's about 6' 5".

Like i said before its genetecs for a large part. You can only push your body that much. But you should try the best workouts possible. I can't really advise you just to spice it up once in a while try dropsets ect.

[robblok]

My problem seem to be that my shoulders develop a lot harder then chest ? Here's my chest day : Flat bench press 1 x 10 2 x 8 to 10 - Incline bench press same reps/sets - incline flies 1 x 12 3 x 10 - incline dumbbell press 1 x 10 2 x 8 to 10. Weight I use, about 70 to 80 kilo for flat BP, 60 for incline BP, 12.5 for flies - 25 kilo for DB press.

I do feel the pressure on shoulders with every single exercise I do though !

I don't use the gym, do it all at home with powerrack + olympic barbell, EZ barbell and dumbbells.

I train at home too, got my own powerrack and olympic barbell like you. I think what muscles grow easier is genetically pre determined. Unless your routine is real bad it wont influence growth as much as geneticis a friend of mine almost does not train his back but has a great back.

No muscles grow easily for most people, but the deltoids are one of the hardest to grow. One of the main reasons is that most people only train the front delts whatever they do - they don't isolate the medial and rear delts properly. Most people do too much for the chest by comparison and the joints are too fried to work the shoulder well. They injure themselves in the bench press by trying to push too much weight - once the rotator cuff is injured, quality shoulder work becomes nearly impossible.

Your comment on 'too much weight' has me concerned. I am fairly new to weights (8 months in and just getting the hang of it) but the new routine I have just started on taken from book by Michael Mathews suggests low reps and heavy weights - chest day is 3 x 4/6 bench press 3 x 4/6 incline press (doing both on smith machine for the moment) and 3 x 4/6 dumbell press also 3 abs exercises in between. It says that once you can do 6 reps with good form then up the weight and aim for 4 reps. It makes no mention of joint problems though having done it for a few days now I can certainly feel the extra strain on my muscles that I wasn't getting on the 12 rep routines with more exercises I was doing before.

Given the expertise on this forum I would appreciate comments on if you think this could be putting shoulders at risk.

I think as a beginner (depending on your age) you can go up in weights pretty much and have no problem. The problems arise when you get closer to your potential. Personally i have been on a 5 x 5 program of starting strenght and i did feel it in the end. For me 8 reps is nicer, some times even more. But in general i always did 8 reps. Its what Arnold did not that that makes it magic.

I think things to consider here are age and how far your from your potential and how heavy the real weights are. I for one have had one major training injury (could have been because of desk work too) But could not move my neck much for over a month as the muscles in the upper back were cramped up. Had to take loads of muscle relaxant and in the end lost a lot of strength that i never really got back.

[likewise]

@ Tropo, been having a look a bench press grips and they are wide grips, well they are as how I hold the bar :

Gripping the barbell

Experiment between narrower and wider grip from the barbell and figure out which muscle group of the two, triceps or chest, is most powerful. A good rule of thumb is that the wider you grip the more you activate your chest muscles. The widest possible grip shortens the distance of the lift.

How you grip the barbell, whether it is thumbs over or thumbs under the barbell is up to you and a matter of personal preference. “Thumbless” grip is more popular, but also more dangerous; not using the full grip increases the risk of dropping the weight during the lift and risking a serious injury. However the “monkey grip” can improve your maximums and give you a better stretch on your pectoral muscles. Feel free to try both grips and see if the other works better.

ar :

[likewise]

Another site says the same, grip should be wider then shoulder width, so nothing wrong with my technique and in my book that is a wide grip !

[Kalbo]

Another site says the same, grip should be wider then shoulder width, so nothing wrong with my technique and in my book that is a wide grip !

I am seconding Tropo here, and advising against a wide grip when bench pressing. There are better exercises (flyes etc) that will work the same muscle band without tearing the rotator cuff.

If you bugger your shoulder up, especially one of the rotator cuff muscles, then it takes a looooong time to heal.

[likewise]

Will keep that in mind. So do you guys use a narrow grip ?

[robblok]

To be honest i do wide grip.. my arms make a 90 degree angle once im like 20cm from my chest with the barbel. I have done the exercise ages and i keep it in my program.

I respect you guys but i just love my bench press that way.

[robblok]

I worked out today for the first time with the power hooks, its a great invention mounting the weights for shoulders was easy and putting them back also great. Of course the real test will come with incline db press. But still it was great. Some pictures.

I know the weights are not set up good.. but was lazy to switch it all.

Edited October 11, 2012 by robblok

[likewise]

Nice set up man

[likewise]

same here, do wide grip do feel some pressure on shoulder but nothing injury related, it's just that I seem to develop shoulder muscles a lot easier then chest.

[robblok]

Nice set up man

Thanks, and i did not even take pictures of my 2 cardio machines, my rower and spinning bike. With this setup i can do it all. Some things are better in gyms for sure but its nice to workout at home. No need to wait, can setup stuff for the next exercise. My own music and no travel time. I also have a preacher bench. But i might sell it as my workbench has a preacher bench extension.

Depends a bit if i can keep it in the hall where it is now, doesn't look so good outside of my gym room.

[tropo]

To be honest i do wide grip.. my arms make a 90 degree angle once im like 20cm from my chest with the barbel. I have done the exercise ages and i keep it in my program.

I respect you guys but i just love my bench press that way.

Yes, but this is not a matter of respect for different techniques, it's about pressing the safest way possible and developing the most muscle and strength from the movement.

I have developed shoulder injuries from wide-grip. I was going quite heavy at that time.

Generally the reason why people like to push with a wide grip (outside the rings on an olympic bar) is because they can push more weight because the range of motion is shorter. Some people also think it isolates the pecs more (which it doesn't).

To get maximum strength development one should push the bar with a hand spacing which keeps the forearms in a vertical position throughout the movement, (this will vary depending on arm length). Vertical forarms give the maximum range of motion possible and also keeps the muscles under tension the longest, and maxiumum time under tension is the way to develop muscles. As a major compound movement the correct spacing (vertical forearm) spreads the load more evenly between pecs, triceps and shoulders, making it more of a compound strength movement. In a wide grip the shoulders are extremely vulnerable to injury because the weight is not being supported in a mechanically safe way.

Here's some good advice from the man himself, Mark Rippetoe:

Once you've checked out those videos I would recommend watching "Episode #3: Chest training" by Charles Glass. Charles is a world renowned personal trainer (was a champion bodybuilder when younger). He's particularly concerned about preventing injuries and he's really worth listening to.

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/glasscut0.htm