State Hospitals Crisis: Cost Will Limit Positions For Nurses In Thailand

[webfact]

STATE HOSPITALS CRISIS

Cost will limit positions for nurses

CHULARAT SAENGPASSA,

PONGPHON SARNSAMAK

THE NATION

NURSES at Chai Badan Hospital in Lop Buri keep busy with patient registration. A shortage of staff caused by low pay and heavy workloads has hurt state hospitals across the country, with many nurses opting to take better paid jobs at private hospitals

Thousands to rally today for full-time jobs and better working conditions

BANGKOK: -- Government agencies appear unlikely to agree to all 17,000 temporary nurses who are demanding permanent positions, saying this would be a huge financial burden. But an effort looks likely to be made to alleviate the shortage in health staff at state hospitals.

Today, about 3,000 temporary nurses will gather in front of Government House to call for a change in their job conditions. They want the government to improve their job security - to offer them permanent contracts and reduce their workloads.

According to Kanniga Panya-Amornwat, a committee member of the Nursing and Midwifery Council, about 17,000 temporary nurses were threatening to resign from state hospitals, if their demands are not met within three months.

Office of the Civil Service Commission secretary-general Nontigorn Kanchanachitra said the Public Health Ministry has asked the government to allocate over 70,000 civil servant positions as the ministry will be able to employ more medical workers with permanent employment contracts.

"This is a huge amount of employment by state agencies. It is impossible to hire all 70,000 positions as civil servants. Maybe we could hire only 17,000 positions but let’s see that we can or cannot do," he said.

To date, the health ministry has more than 160,000 civil servants who work as officials and medical workers. The number of civil servants is the second largest in the country, followed Education and Finance Ministry.

"If we employ all of 70,000 people [demanded] as civil servants that means we have to spend about Bt14 billion per year," Nontigorn told The Nation in an exclusive interview.

"The budget amount for employment will be double next year," he said.

Increasing the number of state civil servants depends on the urgent need and priority of each state agency. Moreover, civil servants have to work in the rural areas not in central areas.

But for the ministry's request to allow more civil servant positions, Nontigorn said the ministry had never informed it of the exact number of health personnel it needs. The ministry just reported its demand to increase health personnel but it never disclosed the number of patients they serve or how its workload will be increase in the future.

"We need to know which health professionals are most important to designate as civil servants, but in the past the ministry only gave us an overview figure and there was no answer for us," he said.

"Do you think there is a nursing shortage? The answer may be yes in rural areas but when we allocate civil servant positions to rural hospitals, they suddenly ask to move to work at other state hospitals in the big cities. We are now sure that if we give civil servant positions to them, they will move to other areas or not," he explained.

Krisada Sawaengdee, second vice-president of the Nursing and Midwifery Council, said if the government couldn't allocate civil servant positions to the health ministry, it should improve the welfare and benefit for temporary nurses such as medical benefits for their family and should allow them to continue education without leaving their current positions.

However, she said most civil servant positions that government had given to the health ministry were allocated to physicians not nurses.

Dr Suphan Srithamma, deputy permanent secretary for health, said the ministry was studying an appropriate number and approach to employ health personnel. Some may be employed as civil servants, public officials, or public health officials depending on the results of a study.

For health officials, the ministry will upgrade medical benefits, which will be similar to civil servant medical benefits.

"We expect that we will get a clear answer for health personnel employment within three months," he said.

-- The Nation 2012-10-16

[zakk9]

Total chaos:

- They don't know how many nurses they need

- Not enough nurses are educated

- Those who get education don't want to work in rural areas

- Since there is a shortage, nurses can choose where they will work, and working at a highly paid position at an urban, private hospital is more attractive than working at a government owned rural hospital.

And this country is exporting health services to rich foreigners

14 billion baht for 70,000 positions? Sounds like a modest amount compared to some other costs this country has. Some rice pledging scheme springs to my mind.

[asiawatcher]

I repeat my thoughts from yesterday - take some of the billions of baht skimmed from other areas by the corrupt idiots and put it into decent pay and conditions for essential services. Even the Justice Minister 'little' amount he transferred to HK - 16Bn covers the entire bill.

[jaltsc]

"14 billion baht for 70,000 positions? Sounds like a modest amount compared to some other costs this country has".

And since these nurses are overworked and too tired to go to the polls and vote, they don't even receive the 200 baht to buy their votes

[lizardtongue]

There was a chap who recently spent 7 million THB out of the Government coffers on a holiday the reason given for using the money was because if it wasn't spent it would go back into the Gov. coffers.

Maybe just maybe if he and his entourage did not take that holiday there would be some funds available to pay these nurses?

[canopus1969]

If they got rid of 99% of the Generals and Admirals (who would not be missed) then there would be more than enough money to pay the nurses

[jcw]

If they got rid of 99% of the Generals and Admirals (who would not be missed) then there would be more than enough money to pay the nurses

Pure Logic

[Bender]

... and they claim to be a world class medical hub

[trainman34014]

My Wife was a Midwife at State Hospitals for 25 years before retirement. They have to do the 25 years minimum to obtain their 10,000 baht per month pension. They work them like slaves with many a double and triple shift, unkind working conditions, quite often no breaks for many hours, and of course, lousy salaries. They get a maximum 10 days leave a year and if they don't say they are going away then the Hospital will call them and ask them to return to work as they are short handed. No days off in lieu will be offered later. Basically they have a work, eat and sleep life with time for little else, that's why there are large numbers of 40 something Nurses that remain unmarried. In my Wifes former Hospital there are large numbers of Nurses who have never even been on a holiday outside of Chiang Mai, and those that have normally travel on arranged tours with their workmates, so as my wife put it, it's kind of work away from work, as you are not meeting anyone you don't already know from the daily grind.

Meanwhile; the Hospital management are having a great time doing next to nothing apart from appearing at sporadic interludes when they are not running their 'on the side' business's. Many of said management don't even appear at their desks in their Airconned offices for days on end whilst the Nurses put up with the stifling heat of Un-Airconned Common rooms. Only the wards where the babies are have Aircon, the Mothers live with the heat for most of the day as the Nurses do.

Another problem is the number of Admin' staff. There are offices galore all around Hospital complex's and dozens of 'civil servants' doing very little occupy them. Many of them will be seen walking around with one piece of paper, in many cases going nowhere, other than to stem boredom of find someone to have a chat with. Nurses complain bitterly about these armies of useless jobsworths being paid more than them whilst doing far less work of any use to anyone. To make matters worse, should a Nurse need assistance of some sort and actually require these people to do something they are met with derision and downright hostility in some situations. The attitude is ''how dare you come in here and expect us to do any work which may involve the use of a brain''.

I know the medical services in the countries we come from are not perfect but at least medical staff have decent working conditions, plenty of vacation time and are fairly well paid. Yes; this is Thailand and this is just another example of how ordinary working folk are trampled underfoot on a daily basis by their own succeeding Government's, no matter what colour flag they fly. Maybe the Nurses will be the first people to stand up for themselves, and I hope a good many others follow as Thailand has a long way to go before it can ever call itself 'Developed'.

[bigbamboo]

Money spent on nurses to care for and benefit the people. You can't get any more popularist than that and the amounts talked about are a drop in the ocean compared to the government's overall budget.

So what's the problem?

[NCFC]

I repeat my thoughts from yesterday - take some of the billions of baht skimmed from other areas by the corrupt idiots and put it into decent pay and conditions for essential services. Even the Justice Minister 'little' amount he transferred to HK - 16Bn covers the entire bill.

Read today's other English newspaper and you will find that the HK authorities confirmed that no such transfers took place. Unless you have evidence that you would like to share with us?

[carib102]

Didn't they just spend Bt300 Billion on flood prevention throughout the Kingdom? They found that money quick enough after last year's disaster situation. It seems to me that these monies which were allocated to protect just a small part of the Kingdom (Bangkok CBD IMO), could have been reduced by Bt14 Billion in order to provide needed health care services throughout the entire Kingdom. Flood prevention for Bangkok may be necessary, but tbh the city is on a flood plain and is sinking besides...how much money do you continue to throw away for the short term benefit of the elite before enough is enough?

I also find it hard to believe that this is the first time that the Public Health Ministry has reported a shortage of nurses and requested an increased budget. Based on conversations with my wife (a former nurse) this shortage has been ongoing for decades.

[zakk9]

Didn't they just spend Bt300 Billion on flood prevention throughout the Kingdom? They found that money quick enough after last year's disaster situation.

Ah, but there's a difference:

Salaries have to be paid out to those who are hired to fill the positions.

[kerrysum]

Money spent on nurses to care for and benefit the people. You can't get any more popularist than that and the amounts talked about are a drop in the ocean compared to the government's overall budget.

So what's the problem?

Agreed bigbamboo...... Good point.....

Kerry

[kerrysum]

Didn't they just spend Bt300 Billion on flood prevention throughout the Kingdom? They found that money quick enough after last year's disaster situation. It seems to me that these monies which were allocated to protect just a small part of the Kingdom (Bangkok CBD IMO), could have been reduced by Bt14 Billion in order to provide needed health care services throughout the entire Kingdom. Flood prevention for Bangkok may be necessary, but tbh the city is on a flood plain and is sinking besides...how much money do you continue to throw away for the short term benefit of the elite before enough is enough?

I also find it hard to believe that this is the first time that the Public Health Ministry has reported a shortage of nurses and requested an increased budget. Based on conversations with my wife (a former nurse) this shortage has been ongoing for decades.

Yes, and that was to save face......

Kerry