Hospitals Bleeding To Death As Thai Govt Stands Dithering

[webfact]

EDITORIAL

Hospitals bleeding to death as govt stands dithering

The Nation

Thousands of state-employed nurses, fed up with their temporary contracts, are threatening to quit

BANGKOK: -- It seems ironic that while the government has been quick to use give-aways to buy its way out of other problems, it has chosen to drag its feet over the critical issue of 17,000 state-employed nurses on temporary contracts.

The nurses are asking the Public Health Ministry to fulfil its pledge to improve their job security by giving them permanent status. Otherwise, say the nurses, they will have to quit in January and find work at private hospitals.

If the nurses do quit, it will take a huge toll on the quality of healthcare in the public hospitals where they currently work. And even if some of them decide to stay, the lack of job security afforded by their temporary status would affect their morale, which would likely affect the quality of their care.

Despite this, the ministry has so far been unable to provide clear answers to the nurses or to the public - who would obviously suffer too should the level of healthcare in state hospitals be allowed to deteriorate.

The main obstacle to resolution of the issue is an order by the Office of the Civil Service Commission to freeze permanent employment so as to curb public spending. The government is trying to cut its budget by rehiring state employees on a temporary basis. In fact, many of the nurses have been working on temporary contracts for a decade or more.

No, the issue is not a new one, but finding a solution has been put on the backburner by a government more concerned with eye-catching schemes. In addition, the solution would likely require the removal of the Civil Service Commission's prohibition against hiring new permanent staff.

Such a change would require a decision from the top, since both the Health Ministry and the Finance Ministry would be involved.

Last week the nurses rallied outside Government House to draw public attention to their plight. The protest was only the latest manifestation of a chronic shortage of nursing staff that has affected healthcare in public hospitals for years.

Each year, nurses on the temporary contracts quit in search of better job security, as offered by private hospitals. The Thailand Nursing and Midwifery Council reports that demand for nursing staff from private hospitals has doubled, to 2,000 per year over the past five years, and that private hospitals pay as much as Bt40,000 a month for nurses with more than four years' experience.

The result is a shortage of staff in public hospitals, with nurses who have chosen to remain forced to work longer hours to make up the shortfall.

The situation needs to be resolved soon if further damage is to be avoided.

First, the government has a duty to set a standard for other employers by taking good care of employees who do their job well.

Second, the issue threatens Thailand's growing reputation abroad as an international hub for medical care.

Meanwhile, the 2015 launch of the Asean Economic Community will put yet more pressure on our state hospitals, with nurses given the freedom to work in other Asean countries where welfare benefits are better. Nurses are among the skilled workers who will be given freedom of movement within the Community.

The Yingluck government is mandated to provide a healthcare service that is adequate to the public's needs. Given its massive misspending on populist policies, it cannot complain about the fiscal burden of providing such a service.

This issue is a wake-up call for the government. It must be more cautious in its spending, focusing on sustainable projects that are in the best interests of the public, rather than wasting taxpayers' money on quick fixes.

-- The Nation 2012-10-25

[hellodolly]

There is only two ways this issue will be settled.

The first one is if the Government can figure out a way to put more money in their pocket. That is the first condition on any settling of difficulties here in Thailand.

The second one is if the Nurses stop threatening to walk out and just do it. The Government would soon mskr changes and if they are not the right ones they would be changing their place of business. Maybe Dubai. It seeems to be a nice place for -people wo are more interested in getting richthan they are in the People.

[OzMick]

A wonderful free (almost) health care for the people of Thailand (those who can't afford private hospitals) with insufficient funding to allow it to function properly. It seems history does repeat itself.

[MaxLee]

For the Pheu Thai government, this issue is just another fart in the wind;

Irrelevant and a****boring.

[siampolee]

Got to keep the pocket money flowing for the convicted bail jumping renegade in Dubai so as he can still channel funds to an organisation that likes to cause riots.so as to ensure his investments are safe and as an aid to his return.

[asiawatcher]

Nurses are not farmers and most likely not red shirt supporters but they do vote and that is 17,000 against PTP immediately.

[Fozfromoz]

Previous topic had the nurses protesting, demanding resolution within 3 Months. Health Ministry says they will resolve in 1 Month.

That was less than a couple of weeks ago.

Lets see.

[JurgenG]

Got to keep the pocket money flowing for the convicted bail jumping renegade in Dubai so as he can still channel funds to an organisation that likes to cause riots.so as to ensure his investments are safe and as an aid to his return.

You don't have a clue how to solve this problem, do you ? Probably don't even understand what the problem is and obviously don't care. Just blame it on Thaksin with totally out of contest remarks, it doesn't matter, you do your part for the "cause" ... so you think

As a Thaksin supporter, I say Thank You

Recent polls have shown it's because of this kind of attitude that people place Pheu Thai ahead of the democrats *. The democrats talk (BS), PT acts ...What people want to hear is how to solve this nurse problem. If the opposition doesn't have a clue how to do it, it should stop embarassing itself and just shut up.

* : And don't even bother to reply it's because they are paid, nobody ever heard of people being paid to answer polls.

[marshbags]

While ever their is a two tier system appertainting to the private and public hospitals and the rich and poor access to them, it will never be any different.

The fact that the rich are not effected and have more than enough qualified staff to take care of them why should they put their much needed influence / support to help make it more secure for these dedicated public health workers..

The nurses working in state hospitals deserve and have earned the right to a long term commitment job wise.

They should get at the very least similar guarantees of employment ( the existing ones are blatantly inadequate ) especially when you compare other governmental departments offer whereby *** non qualified personel receive so much more and continue to do so big time without any fear of loosing their jobs, no matter how inept or neglegent they are *** based on nothing more than privilidge and nepotism

The *** can expect at worst being moved to an inactive position while still retaining their unearned and undeserved status, salaries and pensions in recognition of their self first dedication first and only.

Sadly those who are not can expect dismissal, no pension and certainly no retention of their salary or recognition of their previous selfless dedication. ect. ect. ect.

marshbags and

Edited October 25, 2012 by marshbags

[hellodolly]

Got to keep the pocket money flowing for the convicted bail jumping renegade in Dubai so as he can still channel funds to an organisation that likes to cause riots.so as to ensure his investments are safe and as an aid to his return.

You don't have a clue how to solve this problem, do you ? Probably don't even understand what the problem is and obviously don't care. Just blame it on Thaksin with totally out of contest remarks, it doesn't matter, you do your part for the "cause" ... so you think

As a Thaksin supporter, I say Thank You

Recent polls have shown it's because of this kind of attitude that people place Pheu Thai ahead of the democrats *. The democrats talk (BS), PT acts ...What people want to hear is how to solve this nurse problem. If the opposition doesn't have a clue how to do it, it should stop embarassing itself and just shut up.

* : And don't even bother to reply it's because they are paid, nobody ever heard of people being paid to answer polls.

So according to you people place the PT ahead of the Dems because they don't like the Dems attitude not because the PT has done any thing good.

I would have to agree with you.

I like living here in Thailand I like the Thai people and there culture.

But the facts are they are not known for their high intelligence. That is why they do not like the Dems. The Dems are more concerned with their long range well being. Where as the PT is more popular because they don't care about their long range well being. Just buy them a sucker today and they will shut up until tomorrow when we will buy them another one.

Of course the people don't realize the money will run out and the tax's will have to be raised causing more inflation. All ready the PT has had to shift the burden of expenses from the 1997 crises over to the banking system.

Edited October 25, 2012 by hellodolly

[siampolee]

Jurgen reminds one of the one eyed man in the land of the blind.

Please offer us your solutions to the health care problem if you can master Jurgen.

I am not paid to reply and I read your posts for their comedy value,.

Edited October 25, 2012 by siampolee

[Nickymaster]

Got to keep the pocket money flowing for the convicted bail jumping renegade in Dubai so as he can still channel funds to an organisation that likes to cause riots.so as to ensure his investments are safe and as an aid to his return.

You don't have a clue how to solve this problem, do you ? Probably don't even understand what the problem is and obviously don't care. Just blame it on Thaksin with totally out of contest remarks, it doesn't matter, you do your part for the "cause" ... so you think

As a Thaksin supporter, I say Thank You

Recent polls have shown it's because of this kind of attitude that people place Pheu Thai ahead of the democrats *. The democrats talk (BS), PT acts ...What people want to hear is how to solve this nurse problem. If the opposition doesn't have a clue how to do it, it should stop embarassing itself and just shut up.

* : And don't even bother to reply it's because they are paid, nobody ever heard of people being paid to answer polls.

"You don't have a clue how to solve this problem, do you" ? Do you? Please explain.

"Probably don't even understand what the problem is and obviously don't care." Do you? Please explain.

And don't even bother to reply: because PT won and the Dems lost the election.

[bigbamboo]

Judging by the way the government is throwing money around as if it is going to be devalued tomorrow you would have thought there was enough spare cash to do something that would actually be of genuine benefit to the country. Most nurses are women and Yingluck did say she wanted to improve the lot of women in Thailand.

Or did she just mean in the boardroom?

[Jim walker]

There is always a solution to every problem, just that both side need to sit down together and come to a compromise so that both sides feel they have come out with some sort of benefit from the negotiations, and if the government only want to curb public spending then Health and Education are both very important to the general public,

I am sure there are more extravagant spends on unimportant projects with less priority things from the public purse that could be cut.

[h90]

There is only two ways this issue will be settled.

The first one is if the Government can figure out a way to put more money in their pocket. That is the first condition on any settling of difficulties here in Thailand.

The second one is if the Nurses stop threatening to walk out and just do it. The Government would soon mskr changes and if they are not the right ones they would be changing their place of business. Maybe Dubai. It seeems to be a nice place for -people wo are more interested in getting richthan they are in the People.

The Shinawatra mafia invested a lot in private hospitals, at the time they started with the 30 Baht policy.

So now everything is working very well. Destroy the public hospitals and get rich with the private one.

[thaicbr]

Got to keep the pocket money flowing for the convicted bail jumping renegade in Dubai so as he can still channel funds to an organisation that likes to cause riots.so as to ensure his investments are safe and as an aid to his return.

You don't have a clue how to solve this problem, do you ? Probably don't even understand what the problem is and obviously don't care. Just blame it on Thaksin with totally out of contest remarks, it doesn't matter, you do your part for the "cause" ... so you think

As a Thaksin supporter, I say Thank You

Recent polls have shown it's because of this kind of attitude that people place Pheu Thai ahead of the democrats *. The democrats talk (BS), PT acts ...What people want to hear is how to solve this nurse problem. If the opposition doesn't have a clue how to do it, it should stop embarassing itself and just shut up.

* : And don't even bother to reply it's because they are paid, nobody ever heard of people being paid to answer polls.

I have to ask you as you are a Thaksin supporter. WHAT have successive Thaksin governments done to improve the situation???

They are after all the longest running successive government in the history of Thailand!

IF SHINAWATRA governments had ACTED then WHY is this a problem now????????

sent from my ..................#

[Mobi]

Having had the misfortune to stay in a major government hospital in Bangkok earlier this year, I can testify the the professionalism and dedication of all the nursing staff I encountered there - from the highly trained OR nurses, to the equally professional ICU nurses to the equally dedicated ones in the general wards, and even the humble auxiliaries who transported me around the hospital to have x-rays etc.

I have never experienced such care and dedication - and believe me I have been around a bit in quite a few hospitals duirng my time.

I would even say they werer better than the nurses I have experienced in the private sector in BKK hospitals through the years.

These nurses even gave me their contact numbers to call I had any problems after discharge; and I did, and they were extremely helpful.

I think it is scandalous that these wonderful women (and men), are not looked after and given permanent employment contracts to give them some level of security - it really is beyond the pale.

Yet our wonderful government keeps throwing literally billions of Baht into a scandalous, rice price maintenance scheme which mainly benefits the rice millers, wholesalers and other 'influential' folk and does little to improve the humble farmer's lot in life.

[JurgenG]

And don't even bother to reply: because PT won and the Dems lost the election.

Exactly ! A number of fellow Thaksin supporters complain because they found this forum biased in favors of the opposition. To that I reply : Who cares ?!

It's true we have here a number of die hard Thaksin opponents who keep on ressassing the same old boring arguments since 2005. They haven't realized people have moved on. People don't care about Thaksin anymore, they see people who still insist on blaming Thaksin for everything as the same nuts who whisper about the free masons, the Opus Dei or the Elders of Zion. No wonder we have a Bedlam here

Regarding the nurse problem, unfortunately I don't have a solution. It's a worldwide problem, nurse is a very demanding job, people who are here to help you in some of the worst situation of your life. It's a very stressful job and unfortunately not paid enough in regard of the moral and physical difficulties of the job. But it's a worldwide problem, why do you think you have so many third world nurses in first world hospitals ? Nurses have all my support but unfortunately I don't have the solution of their problem.

Edited October 26, 2012 by JurgenG

[marshbags]

RE the last paragraph from Mobi's post,

" Yet our wonderful government keeps throwing literally billions of Baht into a scandalous, rice price maintenance scheme which mainly benefits the rice millers, wholesalers and other 'influential' folk and does little to improve the humble farmer's lot in life."

This says much about the objectives of the PT government and sums up their priorities and to quote the infamous " honest / dishonest intentions " the exiled PM used while pathetically excusing his initial exposure for lying and miipulation of constintutional laws this still applies and is pertinent to everything they are presently getting away with.

If a scheme can be corruptly manipulated to benefit this self serving individual and his flock of unprincipled coherts, the money / funding is not a problem, indeed it is available in obscene multiples going into billions.

Commonly referred to as cash cows / feeding bowls and troughs ect.ect. for these unprincipled self enriching, self only individuals of so called carers of Thailand and it,s more deserved citizens who,s honest endeavours are continually ignored and neglected.

Giving the nurses their deserved contracts, along with financial incentives their dedication and loyalty to public service warrants, is a non starter, because sadly for them, it is not a cash cow kind of policy maker.

Rather than distribute what is left from populist programmes after Thaksin and his coherts have skimmed off their percentages and in many cases wasted for one.

Then stopping the corrupt initiatives or at the very least reducing them to an achievable level.

Funds that do not reach those that need them.if honestly utilised will immediately produce funding and with an ongoing roll over will go a long way to providing the required finance needed.

The genuinely needy will not only continue to get their present allocations of the vote catching pot of plenty but will continue to benefit from the governmental hospital programmes with further enhancements from a contented medical staff who would / will now feel appreciated and encouraged to dedicate their services and experienced caring of the lesser privilidged.

Eventually the cash cow the government feeds off will grow large enough to burst and destroy their self rewarding greedy intiatives along with themselves.

The draining of the coffers cannot continue, not if Thailand is to prosper and grow economically in the longer term that,s for sure.

As for all the misled and brainwashed supporters of the real PM in exile they can be content in the realisation that their beloved leader has more than enriched his coffers during his illegal occupancy as PM in exile, while leaving them with sod all.

marshbags

Edited October 26, 2012 by marshbags

[thaicbr]

And don't even bother to reply: because PT won and the Dems lost the election.

Exactly ! A number of fellow Thaksin supporters complain because they found this forum biased in favors of the opposition. To that I reply : Who cares ?!

It's true we have here a number of die hard Thaksin opponents who keep on ressassing the same old boring arguments since 2005. They haven't realized people have moved on. People don't care about Thaksin anymore, they see people who still insist on blaming Thaksin for everything as the same nuts who whisper about the free masons, the Opus Dei or the Elders of Zion. No wonder we have a Bedlam here

Regarding the nurse problem, unfortunately I don't have a solution. It's a worldwide problem, nurse is a very demanding job, people who are here to help you in some of the worst situation of your life. It's a very stressful job and unfortunately not paid enough in regard of the moral and physical difficulties of the job. But it's a worldwide problem, why do you think you have so many third world nurses in first world hospitals ? Nurses have all my support but unfortunately I don't have the solution of their problem.

The Thai nurses know the pay is bad BEFORE they even go to university. BUT they do expect to get a proper employment contract with all the benefits .. but here there are 17000 who are on yearly contracts.. that is the main thing they are complaining about. And this can be fixed. Also its not exactly blaming Thaksin. Its more asking what did he and ALL his government do about the problem .. you all say he has done wonders for the normal people. Where?

sent from my ..................#

[Mobi]

And don't even bother to reply: because PT won and the Dems lost the election.

Exactly ! A number of fellow Thaksin supporters complain because they found this forum biased in favors of the opposition. To that I reply : Who cares ?!

It's true we have here a number of die hard Thaksin opponents who keep on ressassing the same old boring arguments since 2005. They haven't realized people have moved on. People don't care about Thaksin anymore, they see people who still insist on blaming Thaksin for everything as the same nuts who whisper about the free masons, the Opus Dei or the Elders of Zion. No wonder we have a Bedlam here

Regarding the nurse problem, unfortunately I don't have a solution. It's a worldwide problem, nurse is a very demanding job, people who are here to help you in some of the worst situation of your life. It's a very stressful job and unfortunately not paid enough in regard of the moral and physical difficulties of the job. But it's a worldwide problem, why do you think you have so many third world nurses in first world hospitals ? Nurses have all my support but unfortunately I don't have the solution of their problem.

The Thai nurses know the pay is bad BEFORE they even go to university. BUT they do expect to get a proper employment contract with all the benefits .. but here there are 17000 who are on yearly contracts.. that is the main thing they are complaining about. And this can be fixed. Also its not exactly blaming Thaksin. Its more asking what did he and ALL his government do about the problem .. you all say he has done wonders for the normal people. Where?

sent from my ..................#

Yes, this is not about Thaksin per se.

Another Nation article recently pointed out that all recent governments have only been interested in short term, 'populace' policies. Nurse issues simply don't register very high on their radars.

The main issue with nurses is that they deserve to have better pay and benefits (i.e security), and because they aren't getting them, they are leaving in droves to work in the private sector (or are being lost to the profession completely).

There is already a serious shortage of nurses nationwide and it will soon reach crisis proportions if the government don;t do something about it. It is well within the power to improve the lot of nurses, but they don't see it as a vote winner, or something which has the potential to line their avaricious pockets further.

This is a disaster waiting to happen and where will the government's much vaunted nationwide healthcare policy be then?