American Tourist Found Dead In The Irrigation Canal

[elektrified]

Would be interesting to hear some theories on why Thai people don't rush to get involved in accidents etc.

Lack of morals? But probably not, 'cos that's applying my logic, thinking, standards, so probably barking up the wrong tree

I was told by the wife to keep going after seeing an accident, a young bike rider ran into a tree on the side of the moat, she said that if we stopped and helped that we would be liable to pay for his ambulance if we called one for him, also medical bills. So that may be a reason why Thai's don't stop to help. Maybe they could be sued if anything went wrong after trying to help an injured person?

(I did stop and Taepai gate and told a policeman there was an accident back up the road, he just told me to get back in the car and move off).

Your wife has an odd attitude. I've seen Thais stop many times over the years and help people who have been in accidents. One particular one comes to mind many years ago in Phuket. Many people stopped to help the victims who were seriously injured. One guy even ripped his shirt off to use as a compress for one of the victims head. I've seen them stop many times here in Chiang Mai. I think they are very good about helping others. Not all of course, but most.

Edited November 16, 2012 by elektrified

[Loaded]

Would be interesting to hear some theories on why Thai people don't rush to get involved in accidents etc.

Lack of morals? But probably not, 'cos that's applying my logic, thinking, standards, so probably barking up the wrong tree

I was told by the wife to keep going after seeing an accident, a young bike rider ran into a tree on the side of the moat, she said that if we stopped and helped that we would be liable to pay for his ambulance if we called one for him, also medical bills. So that may be a reason why Thai's don't stop to help. Maybe they could be sued if anything went wrong after trying to help an injured person?

(I did stop and Taepai gate and told a policeman there was an accident back up the road, he just told me to get back in the car and move off).

Great attitude that of your wife.

If ever I see someone smashed up on the side of the road possibly dying, I must remember not to get carried way and not stop to assist him/her, but rather just turn a blind eye and continue on with my journey just in case I may get lumbered with any ambulance or medical fees.

After reading your post and that of the conspiracy man, I really feel like I want to vomit. Pray be that it`s never one of my or one of your family members, a close friend, you, your wife or myself lying there in the dirt somewhere desperately in need of help and how quickly the help arrives could mean life or death. Now I really am thinking that it was highly possible that the American guy’s tragic accident was witnessed and people just ignored the situation, could be Thais or farangs, exactly the same as when that girl was being raped and murdered and nobody wanted to know.

What else is there to say? Because this just about sums it all up. Outrageous.

As for the conspiricy man, let me tell you that I have contacts in the police force and you are completely wrong. Trust me on this one.

I stopped at an accident to help 3 young drunk Thais who had fallen off their motorbike. They grabbed hold of me, hailed a policeman, claimed I had caused the accident and demanded compensation. I spent my evening in PuuPing Police station before being released. I won't make this mistake again.

[Paagai]

Two people are dead. The best Thai Visa's Chiang Mai forum can come up with is The Vicar's conspiracy theories and "Beetlejuice's usual I know everything because my son's a policemen rhetoric. Pathetic, you people should be ashamed of yourselves.

RIP to the deceased and condolences to their families.

[Ulysses G.]

I've seen Thais stop many times over the years and help people who have been in accidents. One particular one comes to mind many years ago in Phuket. Many people stopped to help the victims who were seriously injured. One guy even ripped his shirt off to use as a compress for one of the victims head. I've seen them stop many times here in Chiang Mai. I think they are very good about helping others. Not all of course, but most.

That is my experience too. When I first came here, the conventional farang wisdom was that Thais will not help accident victims, but I have seen them help a lot more often than not.

[rene123]

When I was back packing in Thailand in 1998 with some other girls one of the gang got injured riding a scooter and there were several thais there to help almost instantly. One gave her a ride to the hospital and didn't ask for compensation. I think there is good and bad everywhere.

[CobraSnakeNecktie]

Let's see what did we learn here.

Motorcycles, tourists and alcohol are dangerous combination

Thai's may or may not offer assistance at accident scenes

and

The Vicar might or may not have brain termites

[mamborobert]

Just to clear up one aspect...deceased did have trousers on:

http://www.chiangmainews.co.th/page/wp-content/uploads/%E0%B8%A8%E0%B8%9E%E0%B8%A5%E0%B8%AD%E0%B8%A2%E0%B8%99%E0%B9%89%E0%B8%B3-1.jpg

[coma]

I have just read up on this story in the Chiang Mai news and this is what it says happened which contradicts the OP to a certain extent.

1. The deceased is 56 year old JERRY LESTER DOW from Abu Dhabi, UAE. He was a tourist that frequented the Chiang Mai Beer Bar scene and that he rented a big bike from in town.

2. On the evening of the 11th he had hooked up with a Beer Bar girl and they went for a ride around the city. At 2am on the morning of the 12th the two on the motorbike had lost control on the canal rd and hit the wall throwing them into the canal. They died instantly. Her body was recovered the following day.

3. At 10am on the 14th a passer-by seen the body of Mr Jerry Lester Dow floating face down in the canal. The forensic crew believed he had been dead no less that 2 days. His wallet and Iphone 3 were still on his person. The police therefore believe that the two deceased, even though thier bodies were discovered on different days were both victims of the same motorbike accident.

http://www.chiangmai.../page/?p=132556

WARNING !! Graphic image in this link. http://www.chiangmainews.co.th/page/wp-content/uploads/ศพลอยน้ำ-1.jpg

Edited November 16, 2012 by coma

[kjhbigv]

I have just read up on this story in the Chiang Mai news and this is what it says happened which contradicts the OP to a certain extent.

1. The deceased is 56 year old JERRY LESTER DOW from Abu Dhabi, UAE. He was a tourist that frequented the Chiang Mai Beer Bar scene and that he rented a big bike from in town.

2. On the evening of the 11th he had hooked up with a Beer Bar girl and they went for a ride around the city. At 2am on the morning of the 12th the two on the motorbike had lost control on the canal rd and hit the wall throwing them into the canal. They died instantly. Her body was recovered the following day.

3. At 10am on the 14th a passer-by seen the body of Mr Jerry Lester Dow floating face down in the canal. The forensic crew believed he had been dead no less that 2 days. His wallet and Iphone 3 were still on his person. The police therefore believe that the two deceased, even though thier bodies were discovered on different days were both victims of the same motorbike accident.

http://www.chiangmai.../page/?p=132556

WARNING !! Graphic image in this link. http://www.chiangmai...7;ำ-1.jpg

The most realistic and sensible post so far!

We now know he was wearing trousers as well.

I don't believe there is anything suspicious about the accident, it does not take much to kill you coming off a bike at speed, especially if you hit something solid, like a concrete wall!

Would not necessarily make that much noise either.

Edited November 16, 2012 by kjhbigv

[jambco984]

R.I.P

Sent from my GT-N7000B using Thaivisa Connect App

[mickmac]

Would be interesting to hear some theories on why Thai people don't rush to get involved in accidents etc.

Lack of morals? But probably not, 'cos that's applying my logic, thinking, standards, so probably barking up the wrong tree

I was told by the wife to keep going after seeing an accident, a young bike rider ran into a tree on the side of the moat, she said that if we stopped and helped that we would be liable to pay for his ambulance if we called one for him, also medical bills. So that may be a reason why Thai's don't stop to help. Maybe they could be sued if anything went wrong after trying to help an injured person?

(I did stop and Taepai gate and told a policeman there was an accident back up the road, he just told me to get back in the car and move off).

Your wife has an odd attitude. I've seen Thais stop many times over the years and help people who have been in accidents. One particular one comes to mind many years ago in Phuket. Many people stopped to help the victims who were seriously injured. One guy even ripped his shirt off to use as a compress for one of the victims head. I've seen them stop many times here in Chiang Mai. I think they are very good about helping others. Not all of course, but most.

In reply to you post, We were one of many cars and motorbikes that passed as this accident happened, and no one, be they foreigner or Thai stopped. The only person that did stop was myself, a little further down the road, when trying to get the policeman to call an ambulence for the guy.

Edited November 16, 2012 by mickmac

[elektrified]

In reply to you post, We were one of many cars and motorbikes that passed as this accident happened, and no one, be they foreigner or Thai stopped. The only person that did stop was myself, a little further down the road, when trying to get the policeman to call an ambulence for the guy.

That is sad. But good on you. You did the right thing.

[TheVicar]

I have just read up on this story in the Chiang Mai news and this is what it says happened which contradicts the OP to a certain extent.

1. The deceased is 56 year old JERRY LESTER DOW from Abu Dhabi, UAE. He was a tourist that frequented the Chiang Mai Beer Bar scene and that he rented a big bike from in town.

2. On the evening of the 11th he had hooked up with a Beer Bar girl and they went for a ride around the city. At 2am on the morning of the 12th the two on the motorbike had lost control on the canal rd and hit the wall throwing them into the canal. They died instantly. Her body was recovered the following day.

3. At 10am on the 14th a passer-by seen the body of Mr Jerry Lester Dow floating face down in the canal. The forensic crew believed he had been dead no less that 2 days. His wallet and Iphone 3 were still on his person. The police therefore believe that the two deceased, even though thier bodies were discovered on different days were both victims of the same motorbike accident.

http://www.chiangmai.../page/?p=132556

WARNING !! Graphic image in this link. http://www.chiangmai...7;ำ-1.jpg

Thanks for the links. After reading the messages here and especially some posts from the dead mans' friends, I'm now convinced this was little more than an accident and that the BP reporter made huge mistakes in his/her original story. I'll mention again that I posted only because of the tremendous variation in the story lines between the newspaper accounts. The last picture you posted clearly shows he had trousers on (that were likely removed by the body recovery team).

Edited November 17, 2012 by TheVicar

[onthedarkside]

One inflammatory post and the reply removed. Let's keep the topic on track and cease with the insults.

[lizardtongue]

Two people are dead. The best Thai Visa's Chiang Mai forum can come up with is The Vicar's conspiracy theories and "Beetlejuice's usual I know everything because my son's a policemen rhetoric. Pathetic, you people should be ashamed of yourselves.

RIP to the deceased and condolences to their families.

Well said sir!

[binjalin]

shall I clear up some of the tripe on here?

I have knowledge of this incident and know people who were contacted by the Police etc.

The guy rented a room at Convention condo - the girl was not a bar girl (or was not for the past 2 years or more)

It appears, and not all is know yet, that she died on the back of the bike and he then crashed into the moat as a result. No one knows why he was found 3 days later - it is possible that the Police found her dead at the scene and assumed she was riding alone

RIP

Edited November 17, 2012 by binjalin

[HaleySabai]

We live off canal road in Suthep district, the locals today were talking about this accident and the farang male was found near B2 hotel. According to what my wife heard the female passenger survived and is in hospital in very bad condition. Also that the bike is thought to have apparently hit a concrete blockade that was placed slightly less than perpendicular to the canal wall (at a defunct canal crossing).

[Awk]

In reply to you post, We were one of many cars and motorbikes that passed as this accident happened, and no one, be they foreigner or Thai stopped. The only person that did stop was myself, a little further down the road, when trying to get the policeman to call an ambulence for the guy.

I believe that is what is referred to as the "sheep mentality" unfortunately so common amongst us. I remember reading about several experiments where researchers staged various different "need for help" scenarios, and one common and very quantifiable factor was that most people did what other people did. If somebody stopped to help, it was much more likely that others following would also stop to help. If noone stopped, it was much more likely that others following would not stop to help either. Doesn't make those not stopping to help any better people in my opinion however.

Sorry to hear about Loaded's experience with those lowlifes, though I think I'd still stop next time. After all, how could I be sure the people bleeding to death on the road were lowlifes, rather than one of the Thais who came running to help when I myself skidded off the road once many years ago? One (or three) lowlife does not a nation make.

Edited November 17, 2012 by Awk

[coma]

In reply to you post, We were one of many cars and motorbikes that passed as this accident happened, and no one, be they foreigner or Thai stopped. The only person that did stop was myself, a little further down the road, when trying to get the policeman to call an ambulence for the guy.

I believe that is what is referred to as the "sheep mentality" unfortunately so common amongst us. I remember reading about several experiments where researchers staged various different "need for help" scenarios, and one common and very quantifiable factor was that most people did what other people did. If somebody stopped to help, it was much more likely that others following would also stop to help. If noone stopped, it was much more likely that others following would not stop to help either. Doesn't make those not stopping to help any better people in my opinion however.

Sorry to hear about Loaded's experience with those lowlifes, though I think I'd still stop next time. After all, how could I be sure the people bleeding to death on the road were lowlifes, rather than one of the Thais who came running to help when I myself skidded off the road once many years ago? One (or three) lowlife does not a nation make.

@ Mickmac : If you were present at the scene when this accident occoured then why didn't anybody know that there was another victim in the canal with the female victim ? And why did it take the authorities more than 2 days to discover the body of the second victim that had floated a long way from the scene by the water current ? Just curious that's all.

[elektrified]

In reply to you post, We were one of many cars and motorbikes that passed as this accident happened, and no one, be they foreigner or Thai stopped. The only person that did stop was myself, a little further down the road, when trying to get the policeman to call an ambulence for the guy.

I believe that is what is referred to as the "sheep mentality" unfortunately so common amongst us. I remember reading about several experiments where researchers staged various different "need for help" scenarios, and one common and very quantifiable factor was that most people did what other people did. If somebody stopped to help, it was much more likely that others following would also stop to help. If noone stopped, it was much more likely that others following would not stop to help either. Doesn't make those not stopping to help any better people in my opinion however.

Sorry to hear about Loaded's experience with those lowlifes, though I think I'd still stop next time. After all, how could I be sure the people bleeding to death on the road were lowlifes, rather than one of the Thais who came running to help when I myself skidded off the road once many years ago? One (or three) lowlife does not a nation make.

@ Mickmac : If you were present at the scene when this accident occoured then why didn't anybody know that there was another victim in the canal with the female victim ? And why did it take the authorities more than 2 days to discover the body of the second victim that had floated a long way from the scene by the water current ? Just curious that's all.

He's talking about another accident.

[binjalin]

In reply to you post, We were one of many cars and motorbikes that passed as this accident happened, and no one, be they foreigner or Thai stopped. The only person that did stop was myself, a little further down the road, when trying to get the policeman to call an ambulence for the guy.

I believe that is what is referred to as the "sheep mentality" unfortunately so common amongst us. I remember reading about several experiments where researchers staged various different "need for help" scenarios, and one common and very quantifiable factor was that most people did what other people did. If somebody stopped to help, it was much more likely that others following would also stop to help. If noone stopped, it was much more likely that others following would not stop to help either. Doesn't make those not stopping to help any better people in my opinion however.

Sorry to hear about Loaded's experience with those lowlifes, though I think I'd still stop next time. After all, how could I be sure the people bleeding to death on the road were lowlifes, rather than one of the Thais who came running to help when I myself skidded off the road once many years ago? One (or three) lowlife does not a nation make.

@ Mickmac : If you were present at the scene when this accident occoured then why didn't anybody know that there was another victim in the canal with the female victim ? And why did it take the authorities more than 2 days to discover the body of the second victim that had floated a long way from the scene by the water current ? Just curious that's all.

please... guys? this was NOT a tourist nor was it a bar girl on the back but his GF please show some respect. He was not found as SHE died on the bike and he went into the canal, it's horrific, the Police came and assumed it was just her on the bike - got it? the funeral took place in Korat. Please show some respect for a fellow farang and his GF.

[mamborobert]

Thanks for that binjalin.

I gave an undertaking not to post some information about this to another forum member as some details were not public knowledge.

I was, quite simply horrified at some of the posts. In particular those by Vicar, in another post he wrote :

"I'm sure that was the motto of the dead farang who died in his motorcycle crash (taking someone with him) at the age of 56 when he was drunk/stoned out of his mind and crashed into the Canal barrier. You're a deadbeat. The trouble with deadbeats is they cause trouble (and even death) for others."

Virtually everything about this is wrong n so many levels. What happens when the family search for details by Bud's full name and come up with this crap. Its here for every folks, please be a lot more judicious when names are being mentioned.

Just because someone is on a Tourist visa doesn't mean that they are actually a tourist. I know quite a few guys with fly in fly out jobs that LIVE here on tourist visas.

Anyhow there is a response to the Citynews article which I have pasted below. Some salient points is the young lady is Lemon (of Number 1 Bar), they have been in a loving relationship for some time, and the man had his family here when the crap on this post was written.

"This report is incorrect. Jerry Dow (Bud) arrived in Chiang Mai on October 31st. The female passenger was his girlfriend and they had been together for around 2 years. If the bike they were riding was a Honda PCX it was theirs and not a rental bike. Dow's son and son's girlfriend were here visiting. I'm unsure if they are still in Chiang Mai."

Its an absolute tragedy for all involved.

[Mapguy]

I appreciate comments of the above two posters. I choose to take them at face value.

I have tuned in on this thread from time to time because it is really appalling in cheap conjecture, spurious assumptions,vacuous remarks and the occasional tossed-off "RIP" --- just like most such threads that have appeared in the past. The fascination with this sort of news on TV Chiang Mai is truly amazing.

This accident was reported locally (as well as nationally --- why the latter, I don't know). Local coverage is to be expected. But other local news and events are also reported --- not always PR releases from the governor's office. Unfortunately, sometimes the reportage is as poor as it was this time. The Thai press is not always, shall we say, noted for accurate reportage, especially when it is translated into English. So, what about the news reported in English? I attempted to start a thread inviting posters to comment on three local sources of English-language news: good, bad or indifferent. Got about as much interest as attention in a 60-year-old Loi Kroh katoi! You'll find it on page 3 or 4, maybe 5 of our chatter: "English Language News..."

Thai Visa's "effort" --- "News and Events" --- is really lacking. It features such things as month-old notices of ladies' group meetings! And what to do when you have to bury someone who dies in Chiang Mai!

I invite people to come out of their caves. Most people who post here appear to live here. Are you only interested in bodies or cars found in the moat, etc.? How cathartic !!!!

Edited November 19, 2012 by Mapguy

[elektrified]

Not really. I find the Thai news to be an excellent source of news. After all this is Thailand. I also like the Chiang Mai City News for English language news which is current and well-translated.