Is Thailand Ready For The Great U S-China Rivalry?

[webfact]

REGIONAL PERSPECTIVE

Is Thailand ready for the great US-China rivalry?

Kavi Chongkittavorn

The Nation

BANGKOK: -- The intersection of geo-strategic and geo-economic occurred in Bangkok early last week within hours of departure of US President Barack Obama and the arrival of Chinese Premier Wen Jiabao. The first has been re-elected for four more years, the latter was on the way out after a decade of leadership. It was not a coincidence that Obama and Wen were wooing Thailand, which occupied the strategic hub in mainland Southeast Asia.

The two leaders had very short time to make their presence felt and long lasting by utilizing hard and soft powers. It is difficult to avoid comparison. US came in with demands and visions while China came in with offers and action plans. Strategies for strategies, dollars for dollars, it seemed China came out on top. Thai public opinion polls also showed that the public generally felt warmer to Thai-China friendship and Wen's visit. The Chinese leader was in Thailand previously three times but never on a state-visit liked this one—which was arranged after the conclusion of the National Party Congress in Beijing last week.

It was clear Thailand was under pressure from the US to give in on key issues such as the Proliferation Strategic Initiative (PSI), Trans Pacific Partnership (TPP) and access to Utapao airbase during emergency for humanitarian and disastrous assistance. These three conditions are prerequisite for Obama's visit. Kudos must be given to Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra's brother, Thaksin, who was active behind the scene since July to see to it that Obama made a stopover, rain or shine. After all, Obma's landing was considered a sort of rubber stamp of Thaksin's long held self-aggrandizement, which the US is willing to play. After all, he and his Pheu Thai won the elction and brought stability to Thailand for the past 15 months. When Thaksin was the prime minister, he wanted to trade off the PSI signatory with more US concessions but it did not work out. This time he helped push through the decision to join Trans Pacific Partnership, which was initially opposed by Ministry of Commerce. The decision was essentially a tactical and necessary move to ensure the smooth presidential visit. It is doubtful if the future negotiation will yield any result given the bitter experience of the failed Thai-US free trade agreement in 2003-05. Thailand and Asean strongly supports the newly launched regional trading bloc known as Regional Comprehensive Economic Partnership at the Phnom Penh Summit. If it is successful, RCEP will be a bigger trade bloc than the TPP.

To be fair, the best thing was the Thai-US joint vision statement that outlines the future of the region's oldest but ailing alliance. The four-point vision would reinvigorate and make full use of the Thai-US military alliance. This would inevitably lead to the revision and update of archaic Thanat-Rush agreement of 1962. The 50-year-old defence treaty was concluded at the time when the US was fighting against communism and the former Soviet Union. For decades, Thailand and the US shared common security threats. Now the new strategic landscape in the region rendered the whole spirit of past cooperation obsolete. Rising China and India are dominant headlines in this part of the world.

Wen's visit demonstrated the growing interdependency of China's economic power with the rest of mainland Southeast Asia, which covers Southern China, Myanmar, Vietnam, Laos, Cambodia and Thailand with population far exceeding those of Asean. Unlike the Western colonial powers using of guns and cannons in the past centuries of conquests, China is using high-speed trains as a new instrument to outreach all four corners southward. Within 2018 if all go well, all major cities in China will be connected to Kunming, Vientiane, Nong Khai, Bangkok, Sugai Kolok, Kuala Lumpur and Singapore through 230-km an hour high-speed trains.

As such, the most often asked question today is how can Thailand play both powers to preserve and promote national interests? Almost all public opinions in recent days pointed to one direction—Thailand must be neutral. But none of them explained what neutrality means in the age of heighten competition and cooperation between US-China rivalry.

Even senior officials at Ministry of Foreign Affairs were unable to be more specific when pressed on to explain what neutrality actually means and can be deployed within the present strategic environment. In the past, when Thailand said it was neutral it meant that it did not choose side. That was obvious because Thailand literally the only country in the region that was free and independent. Other counties were just gained independent and some remained close-society due to their political systems. So, Thailand had all the cards it could play, especially to stay on the fence as long as possible without siding with anyone. This strategy is proving valueless in the time of fast-moving political event, aided by online social media and 24-hour information society. Timeliness is everything

For instance, Thailand's decision to back the Palestinian statehood at the UN was kept under wrap for nine months even though the decision was affirmation at the very beginning. But none of the officials both at the desk and middle levels wanted to make a decision when a more senior official refused to do so. When Thailand made the decision, it was among the very last and no diplomatic value—just liked the decision to sign the PSI, which came after nine years. It was 102nd country to sign. Thailand could score much higher value if it acceded in 2003 when it could be part of top 24 countries.

Thai officials must get rid of the old mindset of "neutrality" which equates to "play it safe" or worse, it means "irresponsibility". From now on, the Thais must take the bulls by the horns. It can say a clear "yes" or "no" on issues concerned national interests and those of our alliances. To be neutral in the rapid shifting strategic order is to understand its limit and potentials. Thailand is an open and dynamic society and share common perspectives across multi-issues with countries around the world. With some humility, Thailand can do that very well.

But truth be told, Prime Minister Yinluck Shinawatra and her trusted lieutenant Foreign Minister Surapong Tohvijakchaikul were cueless. They have failed to articulate the ideal regional order and maximize it to strength the country's position and bargain power. In the globalized world, ambiguity is the worse diplomatic enemy as it could not help in any strategic planning regardless of countries. Just look around, our neighboring countries are getting bolder. Myanmar has said "no" to China and the US previously. Nayphidaw has gained respects that way. Vietnam and the Philippines are no longer playing the second fiddler. Thailand can be neutral by being frank with friends and foes and understand its national interests clearly.

-- The Nation 2012-11- 26

[asiawatcher]

Who writes this rubbish? "wooing Thailand, which occupied the strategic hub in mainland Southeast Asia." AND

"US came in with demands and visions while China came in with offers and action plans." China is truly Asian and US in its usual arrogance would not have a clue. China knows how to play the game. AND

"Thaksin, who was active behind the scene since July to see to it that Obama made a stopover, rain or shine. After all, Obma's landing was considered a sort of rubber stamp of Thaksin's long held self-aggrandizement, which the US is willing to play."

Another example of one power broker backing another. An endorsement Thailand does not need. A real slap in the face for Yingluck - "Barry - go meet my sister - la famille - you understand..."

Edited November 26, 2012 by asiawatcher

[Thai at Heart]

Thai officials must get rid of the old mindset of "neutrality" which equates to "play it safe" or worse, it means "irresponsibility"

I think that translates better as lacking principles, hedging ones bets or playing both sides as fools.

[kurtgruen]

The way I see it, Thailand is doing just fine. It's nationalist policies have helped it to grow strong, economically. It would be foolish, to align itself too closely with the US. This is Asia and we all know, what happens, when the US looses in Asia...they pull out and leave the locals to pay the price for their actions, with no protection whatsoever.

Besides, the US signs trade agreements and then does not honor them. For example the North American Free Trade Agreement, with Canada, which they constantly violate, when it suits them.

I would stay on the fence as long as possible and in the end, if need be, align with China. US is old news. Bankrupt, jobless, warmongers. The Western Democracies are falling apart, economically and socially/morally, who in his right mind, would want to tie himself to a sinking ship?

[Thai at Heart]

The way I see it, Thailand is doing just fine. It's nationalist policies have helped it to grow strong, economically. It would be foolish, to align itself too closely with the US. This is Asia and we all know, what happens, when the US looses in Asia...they pull out and leave the locals to pay the price for their actions, with no protection whatsoever.

Besides, the US signs trade agreements and then does not honor them. For example the North American Free Trade Agreement, with Canada, which they constantly violate, when it suits them.

I would stay on the fence as long as possible and in the end, if need be, align with China. US is old news. Bankrupt, jobless, warmongers. The Western Democracies are falling apart, economically and socially/morally, who in his right mind, would want to tie himself to a sinking ship?

Because the buying power of 300mn usa customers still out weighs 1bn Chinese.

[Publicus]

The CCP-PRC presents to the world 21st century fascism, i.e., national socialism with Chinese characteristics. The CCP hate democracy because, well, democracy is democratic. For more than 3000 years the Chinese people have obeyed warlords, emperors, dynasties of emperors and now the present dynasty of emperors in business suits, the CCP. However, the CCP is a young and therefore a nervious dynasty. At the recent 18th party congress the CCP had 1.4 million security personnel to keep the people away from the CCP gathered in the Great Hall of the People and to keep the people of the People's Republic throughout China in line so that Jiang Zemin could load up the Politburo Standing Committee with his reactionary cronies. Beijing is ruled by censoring, punishing, fascist dictators. The CCP-PRC is the only government of the world to have a Nobel Peace Prize Laureate, Dr. Lui Xiaobo imprisoned because, inter alia, he openly advocates democracy. The United States under the visionary leadership of Pres Barack Obama has made its "Pivot to the Pacific" in order to begin America's Asian Century. As a response Beijing wants to divide Asean to conquer it so it can control the Southeast Asia Sea (aka: the South China Sea.). Beijing wants Thailand in its back pocket as another tributary state and the Democrat Party here seems intent to deliver Thailand to Beijing. However, Thais have given their lives for democracy in the streets of Bangkok and throughout Thailand so Thais are not about to see their sovereignty subjugated to yet another of history's powerful, corrupt, oppressive, repressive dictatorship which wrongheadedly believes it is destined to lord and rule over the world. The Chinese, as we have recently seen in their ugly and racist riots over Japan's nationalization of the Senekau Islands, are the same as the (early )Showa Japanese (1926 - 45) but are unable to know or see they have become what it is they continue to hate, i.e., small minded people who are arrogant, vengeful, eternally determined to "settle old scores" and brutally to rule the world.

The OP from the Nation newspaper fails to mention that, as reported earler this month in the New York Times - which now is censored by Beijing's Great Internet Firewall - Wen's wife controls the Chinese market in precious jems, a control that has amassed Wen's family more than USD $2 billion as "Grandpa" Wen now enters his retirement after a career of sacrifice - everyone's sacrifice except Wen and his family and friends. We well remember the sacrificed Chinese youth made at Tienaman Square on June 4th 1989 when the CCP and its People's 'Liberation' Army massacred its own youth so that the CCP could continue to exercise absolute control and absolutely corrupt power over the PRC ecomony and its newfound wealth.

Edited November 26, 2012 by Publicus

[chiangmaikelly]

Thai officials must get rid of the old mindset of "neutrality" which equates to "play it safe" or worse, it means "irresponsibility"

I think that translates better as lacking principles, hedging ones bets or playing both sides as fools.

I always thought the Swiss were dummies.

[zydeco]

The CCP-PRC presents to the world 21st century fascism, i.e., national socialism with Chinese characteristics. The CCP hate democracy because, well, democracy is democratic. For more than 3000 years the Chinese people have obeyed warlords, emperors, dynasties of emperors and now the present dynasty of emperors in business suits, the CCP. However, the CCP is a young and therefore a nervious dynasty. At the recent 18th party congress the CCP had 1.4 million security personnel to keep the people away from the CCP gathered in the Great Hall of the People and to keep the people of the People's Republic throughout China in line so that Jiang Zemin could load up the Politburo Standing Committee with his reactionary cronies. Beijing is ruled by censoring, punishing, fascist dictators. The CCP-PRC is the only government of the world to have a Nobel Peace Prize Laureate, Dr. Lui Xiaobo imprisoned because, inter alia, he openly advocates democracy. The United States under the visionary leadership of Pres Barack Obama has made its "Pivot to the Pacific" in order to begin America's Asian Century. As a response Beijing wants to divide Asean to conquer it so it can control the Southeast Asia Sea (aka: the South China Sea.). Beijing wants Thailand in its back pocket as another tributary state and the Democrat Party here seems intent to deliver Thailand to Beijing. However, Thais have given their lives for democracy in the streets of Bangkok and throughout Thailand so Thais are not about to see their sovereignty subjugated to yet another of history's powerful, corrupt, oppressive, repressive dictatorship which wrongheadedly believes it is destined to lord and rule over the world. The Chinese, as we have recently seen in their ugly and racist riots over Japan's nationalization of the Senekau Islands, are the same as the (early )Showa Japanese (1926 - 45) but are unable to know or see they have become what it is they continue to hate, i.e., small minded people who are arrogant, vengeful, eternally determined to "settle old scores" and brutally to rule the world.

The OP from the Nation newspaper fails to mention that, as reported earler this month in the New York Times - which now is censored by Beijing's Great Internet Firewall - Wen's wife controls the Chinese market in precious jems, a control that has amassed Wen's family more than USD $2 billion as "Grandpa" Wen now enters his retirement after a career of sacrifice - everyone's sacrifice except Wen and his family and friends. We well remember the sacrificed Chinese youth made at Tienaman Square on June 4th 1989 when the CCP and its People's 'Liberation' Army massacred its own youth so that the CCP could continue to exercise absolute control and absolutely corrupt power over the PRC ecomony and its newfound wealth.

I think it is glorious that the Chinese are asserting themselves and doing so in a way that does not dance to the American piper. In fact, today's PRC is much closer to Chiang Kai-shek's KMT. And that is for the good. America is not the be all and end in all in political ideas or economic ones. Should have put a boot to Obama's backside when he came over here.

Edited November 26, 2012 by zydeco

[chiangmaikelly]

The CCP-PRC presents to the world 21st century fascism, i.e., national socialism with Chinese characteristics. The CCP hate democracy because, well, democracy is democratic. For more than 3000 years the Chinese people have obeyed warlords, emperors, dynasties of emperors and now the present dynasty of emperors in business suits, the CCP. However, the CCP is a young and therefore a nervious dynasty. At the recent 18th party congress the CCP had 1.4 million security personnel to keep the people away from the CCP gathered in the Great Hall of the People and to keep the people of the People's Republic throughout China in line so that Jiang Zemin could load up the Politburo Standing Committee with his reactionary cronies. Beijing is ruled by censoring, punishing, fascist dictators. The CCP-PRC is the only government of the world to have a Nobel Peace Prize Laureate, Dr. Lui Xiaobo imprisoned because, inter alia, he openly advocates democracy. The United States under the visionary leadership of Pres Barack Obama has made its "Pivot to the Pacific" in order to begin America's Asian Century. As a response Beijing wants to divide Asean to conquer it so it can control the Southeast Asia Sea (aka: the South China Sea.). Beijing wants Thailand in its back pocket as another tributary state and the Democrat Party here seems intent to deliver Thailand to Beijing. However, Thais have given their lives for democracy in the streets of Bangkok and throughout Thailand so Thais are not about to see their sovereignty subjugated to yet another of history's powerful, corrupt, oppressive, repressive dictatorship which wrongheadedly believes it is destined to lord and rule over the world. The Chinese, as we have recently seen in their ugly and racist riots over Japan's nationalization of the Senekau Islands, are the same as the (early )Showa Japanese (1926 - 45) but are unable to know or see they have become what it is they continue to hate, i.e., small minded people who are arrogant, vengeful, eternally determined to "settle old scores" and brutally to rule the world.

The OP from the Nation newspaper fails to mention that, as reported earler this month in the New York Times - which now is censored by Beijing's Great Internet Firewall - Wen's wife controls the Chinese market in precious jems, a control that has amassed Wen's family more than USD $2 billion as "Grandpa" Wen now enters his retirement after a career of sacrifice - everyone's sacrifice except Wen and his family and friends. We well remember the sacrificed Chinese youth made at Tienaman Square on June 4th 1989 when the CCP and its People's 'Liberation' Army massacred its own youth so that the CCP could continue to exercise absolute control and absolutely corrupt power over the PRC ecomony and its newfound wealth.

I think it is glorious that the Chinese are asserting themselves and doing so in a way that does not dance to the American piper. In fact, today's PRC is much closer to Chiang Kai-shek's KMT. And that is for the good. America is not the be all and end in all in political ideas or economic ones. Should have put a boot to Obama's backside when he came over here.

Why did Obama invade? Didn't they ask him to come. Him being whoever you wanted to boot his backside. Who is that btw?

[farang000999]

This is all very silly.

[osiboy]

if the OP is asking if the thai people are ready , then NO of course they aren't , 99% either dont know or dont give two sh*ts , if its asking if the poiticians care , well ..........if it means more kick-backs and brown envelopes then im sure they care alot ,..............as always .

[Morakot]

I like her new Klingon uniform.

[chiangmaikelly]

Since you brought it up. Did you notice the color of the new Thai dress military uniform in the left of the photo?

[Pimay1]

I like her new Klingon uniform.

Yes but she needs to back away from the table a little sooner. You can always tell when someone is porking up by the hands.

[Morakot]

Since you brought it up. Did you notice the color of the new Thai dress military uniform in the left of the photo?

You mean the redcoats?

[Publicus]

The CCP-PRC presents to the world 21st century fascism, i.e., national socialism with Chinese characteristics. The CCP hate democracy because, well, democracy is democratic. For more than 3000 years the Chinese people have obeyed warlords, emperors, dynasties of emperors and now the present dynasty of emperors in business suits, the CCP. However, the CCP is a young and therefore a nervious dynasty. At the recent 18th party congress the CCP had 1.4 million security personnel to keep the people away from the CCP gathered in the Great Hall of the People and to keep the people of the People's Republic throughout China in line so that Jiang Zemin could load up the Politburo Standing Committee with his reactionary cronies. Beijing is ruled by censoring, punishing, fascist dictators. The CCP-PRC is the only government of the world to have a Nobel Peace Prize Laureate, Dr. Lui Xiaobo imprisoned because, inter alia, he openly advocates democracy. The United States under the visionary leadership of Pres Barack Obama has made its "Pivot to the Pacific" in order to begin America's Asian Century. As a response Beijing wants to divide Asean to conquer it so it can control the Southeast Asia Sea (aka: the South China Sea.). Beijing wants Thailand in its back pocket as another tributary state and the Democrat Party here seems intent to deliver Thailand to Beijing. However, Thais have given their lives for democracy in the streets of Bangkok and throughout Thailand so Thais are not about to see their sovereignty subjugated to yet another of history's powerful, corrupt, oppressive, repressive dictatorship which wrongheadedly believes it is destined to lord and rule over the world. The Chinese, as we have recently seen in their ugly and racist riots over Japan's nationalization of the Senekau Islands, are the same as the (early )Showa Japanese (1926 - 45) but are unable to know or see they have become what it is they continue to hate, i.e., small minded people who are arrogant, vengeful, eternally determined to "settle old scores" and brutally to rule the world.

The OP from the Nation newspaper fails to mention that, as reported earler this month in the New York Times - which now is censored by Beijing's Great Internet Firewall - Wen's wife controls the Chinese market in precious jems, a control that has amassed Wen's family more than USD $2 billion as "Grandpa" Wen now enters his retirement after a career of sacrifice - everyone's sacrifice except Wen and his family and friends. We well remember the sacrificed Chinese youth made at Tienaman Square on June 4th 1989 when the CCP and its People's 'Liberation' Army massacred its own youth so that the CCP could continue to exercise absolute control and absolutely corrupt power over the PRC ecomony and its newfound wealth.

I think it is glorious that the Chinese are asserting themselves and doing so in a way that does not dance to the American piper. In fact, today's PRC is much closer to Chiang Kai-shek's KMT. And that is for the good. America is not the be all and end in all in political ideas or economic ones. Should have put a boot to Obama's backside when he came over here.

The Chinese, as you call them, are the Boyz in Beijing as I call them. The Boyz in Beijing are, as I point out above, 21st century fascists who have devised a new national socialism, one with Chinese characteristics. The single and defining resemblance between the Boyz in Beijing and Chaing Kai Shek's KMT is dictatorship. There's nothing good about that.

The United States does not claim perfection nor does the United States try to demand that other democracies be clones of U.S. democracy. Democracy takes many forms, as we see here in Thailand, next door in Malaysia, and in Singapore and in India etc. Indeed, the United States likes to speak of its own self-defined exceptionalism as a democracy. We in the United States do advocate democracy, and we have had to destroy fascism in the past, both in Europe and in East Asia.

Check out the Boyz in Beijing and the new electronic passport map they have just put out of what in fact is the South East Asia Sea but is misnamed the South China Sea - here's the link to the latest to this new provocation by Beijing against its East and SE Asia "neighbors."

http://www.marketora...ticle37704.html

The OP is accurate in the respect that it is long past the time for Thailand to get its butt off the fence before something uncomfortable happens to it during a shoving match between the several big guys on the block. Japan is one of the big guys on this block so it is not straddling the fence at all, as we can see in this link that discusses joint U.S.-Japan military exercises this month to practice reclaiming a disputed island of Japan seized illegally and unlawfully by force by a foreign government: http://www.yomiuri.c...21015001953.htm

Edited November 26, 2012 by Publicus

[Tatsujin]

But truth be told, Prime Minister Yinluck Shinawatra and her trusted lieutenant Foreign Minister Surapong Tohvijakchaikul were cueless.

OK, obvious thing first . . . they are playing snooker?

Secondly (assuming the spelling is corrected to "clueless"), that's about the most accurate statement I've heard so far concerning Thai Politicians.

[thatswhatuthought]

Wow. This is a very poorly writen article. The obvious one sided propaganda that is outlined in it shows the writers intentions.( If you can understand it with all the mistakes.)

@Publicus Well said. Do you think you could give the writer of this a few history lessons and an update on current events. Ohhh nevermind.

[thatswhatuthought]

The way I see it, Thailand is doing just fine. It's nationalist policies have helped it to grow strong, economically. It would be foolish, to align itself too closely with the US. This is Asia and we all know, what happens, when the US looses in Asia...they pull out and leave the locals to pay the price for their actions, with no protection whatsoever.

Besides, the US signs trade agreements and then does not honor them. For example the North American Free Trade Agreement, with Canada, which they constantly violate, when it suits them.

I would stay on the fence as long as possible and in the end, if need be, align with China. US is old news. Bankrupt, jobless, warmongers. The Western Democracies are falling apart, economically and socially/morally, who in his right mind, would want to tie himself to a sinking ship?

"Who in his right mind, would want to tie himself to a sinking ship?" I would have to guess the leaders of the great country you're from.

[Unkomoncents]

The way I see it, Thailand is doing just fine. It's nationalist policies have helped it to grow strong, economically. It would be foolish, to align itself too closely with the US. This is Asia and we all know, what happens, when the US looses in Asia...they pull out and leave the locals to pay the price for their actions, with no protection whatsoever.

Besides, the US signs trade agreements and then does not honor them. For example the North American Free Trade Agreement, with Canada, which they constantly violate, when it suits them.

I would stay on the fence as long as possible and in the end, if need be, align with China. US is old news. Bankrupt, jobless, warmongers. The Western Democracies are falling apart, economically and socially/morally, who in his right mind, would want to tie himself to a sinking ship?

That's the most quixotic interpretation of geopolitics I've read in recent months. Good luck Mr. Gruen. I'm sure Asia and Asian countries will welcome you with open arms, as Asia is known for its openness to foreigners and its progressive attitude towards multiculturalism.

Based on this excerpt alone, I would give this article about as much salt as a press statement from Mr. Thaksin Shinawatra himself:

Thailand is an open and dynamic society and share common perspectives across multi-issues with countries around the world.

This as The Nation just published an interview with investor Marc Faber in which the latter stated rather matter-of-factly: "Thailand will never have a dynamic economy like South Korea or Taiwan." This is widely acknowledged in economic circles. The editorial reeks of PAD rabid nationalism. The exact same nationalism that is at the heart of the crippled education system (Thailand's public schools, according the World Economic Forum's Global Competitiveness Survey, rank below every country in ASEAN except Cambodia, Laos, and Burma; this will certainly eat into Thailand's future competitiveness). Thailand is an unstable, developing country, with a regressive, cynical attitude towards social development (which is at the heart of economic development). Money is king in the Kingdom.

I look forward to the slow disillusionment among Chinese businessmen about the climate of corruption, incompetence and general malfeasance in Laos and Thailand. The idea that they would be able to breezily construct an international high-speed rail link in countries like Thailand without delays, political catfights, and lack of oversight, coordination, and competence is absurd. The Hopewell Project, the recent BTS extension-delays (the rumors suggested a catfight between Bangkok's neighboring Eastern province and the Bangkok administration itself was the cause), the Mahanakorn Project, etc. provide ample evidence of the complexities of doing business in a country like Thailand. Be prepared for delays; in a noticeable fraction of cases, nothing will happen at all, and portions or more of investments can evaporate like a puddle in Samui's sun. More than a few condo investors have purchased their lot and hardly a year or two pass before an expressway link is built right next door. The sounds of poo yai racing their overpriced, overtaxed European cars can be heard all hours of the morning.

Edited November 26, 2012 by Unkomoncents

[hellodolly]

The CCP-PRC presents to the world 21st century fascism, i.e., national socialism with Chinese characteristics. The CCP hate democracy because, well, democracy is democratic. For more than 3000 years the Chinese people have obeyed warlords, emperors, dynasties of emperors and now the present dynasty of emperors in business suits, the CCP. However, the CCP is a young and therefore a nervious dynasty. At the recent 18th party congress the CCP had 1.4 million security personnel to keep the people away from the CCP gathered in the Great Hall of the People and to keep the people of the People's Republic throughout China in line so that Jiang Zemin could load up the Politburo Standing Committee with his reactionary cronies. Beijing is ruled by censoring, punishing, fascist dictators. The CCP-PRC is the only government of the world to have a Nobel Peace Prize Laureate, Dr. Lui Xiaobo imprisoned because, inter alia, he openly advocates democracy. The United States under the visionary leadership of Pres Barack Obama has made its "Pivot to the Pacific" in order to begin America's Asian Century. As a response Beijing wants to divide Asean to conquer it so it can control the Southeast Asia Sea (aka: the South China Sea.). Beijing wants Thailand in its back pocket as another tributary state and the Democrat Party here seems intent to deliver Thailand to Beijing. However, Thais have given their lives for democracy in the streets of Bangkok and throughout Thailand so Thais are not about to see their sovereignty subjugated to yet another of history's powerful, corrupt, oppressive, repressive dictatorship which wrongheadedly believes it is destined to lord and rule over the world. The Chinese, as we have recently seen in their ugly and racist riots over Japan's nationalization of the Senekau Islands, are the same as the (early )Showa Japanese (1926 - 45) but are unable to know or see they have become what it is they continue to hate, i.e., small minded people who are arrogant, vengeful, eternally determined to "settle old scores" and brutally to rule the world.

The OP from the Nation newspaper fails to mention that, as reported earler this month in the New York Times - which now is censored by Beijing's Great Internet Firewall - Wen's wife controls the Chinese market in precious jems, a control that has amassed Wen's family more than USD $2 billion as "Grandpa" Wen now enters his retirement after a career of sacrifice - everyone's sacrifice except Wen and his family and friends. We well remember the sacrificed Chinese youth made at Tienaman Square on June 4th 1989 when the CCP and its People's 'Liberation' Army massacred its own youth so that the CCP could continue to exercise absolute control and absolutely corrupt power over the PRC ecomony and its newfound wealth.

kurtgruen

Are you getting all this?

[hellodolly]

The CCP-PRC presents to the world 21st century fascism, i.e., national socialism with Chinese characteristics. The CCP hate democracy because, well, democracy is democratic. For more than 3000 years the Chinese people have obeyed warlords, emperors, dynasties of emperors and now the present dynasty of emperors in business suits, the CCP. However, the CCP is a young and therefore a nervious dynasty. At the recent 18th party congress the CCP had 1.4 million security personnel to keep the people away from the CCP gathered in the Great Hall of the People and to keep the people of the People's Republic throughout China in line so that Jiang Zemin could load up the Politburo Standing Committee with his reactionary cronies. Beijing is ruled by censoring, punishing, fascist dictators. The CCP-PRC is the only government of the world to have a Nobel Peace Prize Laureate, Dr. Lui Xiaobo imprisoned because, inter alia, he openly advocates democracy. The United States under the visionary leadership of Pres Barack Obama has made its "Pivot to the Pacific" in order to begin America's Asian Century. As a response Beijing wants to divide Asean to conquer it so it can control the Southeast Asia Sea (aka: the South China Sea.). Beijing wants Thailand in its back pocket as another tributary state and the Democrat Party here seems intent to deliver Thailand to Beijing. However, Thais have given their lives for democracy in the streets of Bangkok and throughout Thailand so Thais are not about to see their sovereignty subjugated to yet another of history's powerful, corrupt, oppressive, repressive dictatorship which wrongheadedly believes it is destined to lord and rule over the world. The Chinese, as we have recently seen in their ugly and racist riots over Japan's nationalization of the Senekau Islands, are the same as the (early )Showa Japanese (1926 - 45) but are unable to know or see they have become what it is they continue to hate, i.e., small minded people who are arrogant, vengeful, eternally determined to "settle old scores" and brutally to rule the world.

The OP from the Nation newspaper fails to mention that, as reported earler this month in the New York Times - which now is censored by Beijing's Great Internet Firewall - Wen's wife controls the Chinese market in precious jems, a control that has amassed Wen's family more than USD $2 billion as "Grandpa" Wen now enters his retirement after a career of sacrifice - everyone's sacrifice except Wen and his family and friends. We well remember the sacrificed Chinese youth made at Tienaman Square on June 4th 1989 when the CCP and its People's 'Liberation' Army massacred its own youth so that the CCP could continue to exercise absolute control and absolutely corrupt power over the PRC ecomony and its newfound wealth.

I think it is glorious that the Chinese are asserting themselves and doing so in a way that does not dance to the American piper. In fact, today's PRC is much closer to Chiang Kai-shek's KMT. And that is for the good. America is not the be all and end in all in political ideas or economic ones. Should have put a boot to Obama's backside when he came over here.

I take it you are for the Chinese and their aggressive polices.

First Tibet now other countries territorial seas.

They have even gone so far as to put a map of China on their passports that in no way resembles the real China. Yes good idea Thailand join in with North Korea and Burma two of China's allies.

[beautifulthailand99]

I always thought the reason that Thailand didn't suffer similar fates to those of its neighbours was they allowed the country to be used as an airbase for the yanks during the Vietnam war and the ruling elites were well rewarded for their efforts and a blind eye turned to their anti-democratic so I expect it's still probably business as usual there's a reason why the US Embassy in Bangkok is the biggest in SE Asia.

[KuhnPaen]

The way I see it, Thailand is doing just fine. It's nationalist policies have helped it to grow strong, economically. It would be foolish, to align itself too closely with the US. This is Asia and we all know, what happens, when the US looses in Asia...they pull out and leave the locals to pay the price for their actions, with no protection whatsoever.

Besides, the US signs trade agreements and then does not honor them. For example the North American Free Trade Agreement, with Canada, which they constantly violate, when it suits them.

I would stay on the fence as long as possible and in the end, if need be, align with China. US is old news. Bankrupt, jobless, warmongers. The Western Democracies are falling apart, economically and socially/morally, who in his right mind, would want to tie himself to a sinking ship?

Funny, I'm an American. I have a job. I'm far from bankrupt, and I love puppy dogs and ice cream, and non-violence. Where did you buy that huge paint brush you slapped my cherished homeland with? Jealous much?

[driedmango]

umm.. I am shocked how many sheltered westerners wish for the downfall of the USA and are super stoked to live in a Communist controlled world, I like me freedoms as they are, maybe even want more, that is why I don't live in China, I need my rights to things like facebook and I like western enviro laws better (as bad as they are, hope they could get better)