When Loss Of Face,bites Your Bum

[rgs2001uk]

Defamation laws are real, plenty of people have been caught out buy them.

Lets assume I live and post from overseas on a Thai based form, who is going to sue me, where will I be sued and where would any trial take place?

[BookMan]

Defamation laws are real, plenty of people have been caught out buy them.

Lets assume I live and post from overseas on a Thai based form, who is going to sue me, where will I be sued and where would any trial take place?

I'm not sure about who will sue, but ThaiVisa has many able, willing and ready Judges and Jury members ready to do their duty at a moments notice!

[uptheos]

Defamation laws are real, plenty of people have been caught out buy them.

Can you name some or post some links?

[apetley]

The ops story is very believable and this kind of thing probably happens regularly. I resorted to purchasing a handgun as I feel Thailand has become very violent.

Do you carry the handgun at all the restaurants you eat at?

No of course not.

So what's the gun for? Very little violence actually occurs inside the home.

[stiggy]

Simple complaint made at police station claiming harm to reputation, and on return you could be picked up at airport.The scary thing is Thailand still has criminal defamation in place.

As for links try a simple google search, there are also thai visa members that have also been done with defamation normally business related.

Be as cynical as you like,but the fact is the threat in Thailand for defamation particularly criminal is very real.

Edited December 27, 2012 by stiggy

[govoner]

Lets say the op started a new thread and did a quick review of his meal while naming the bar. This could not be considered defamation and the 700 odd people who have read this thread would then know the place he was talking about

[Honkie]

How many such kind of establishments o 2nd Rd ? How about letting us know its not A , not B ........let members here figure out the rest . They ( ( the court ) cannot hold you responsible .

[SidJames]

I'd have thought that having a family living in Thailand would be reason enough to encourage people to stand up to this kind of treatment & of course I do understand how rigidly the laws in Thailand are imposed.

Slander, defamation & libelous actions only happen when you are wrong. If you're correct then it's a true statement & within the law.

As for people on here suggesting that the OP could be traced down by the local authorities or that TV may be prosecuted, I fully understand as tripadvisor was shut down years ago for all the negative comments on hotels etc in Thailand many in the Thailand language

[cbrer]

Pure Thainess.

[Exsexyman]

The ops story is very believable and this kind of thing probably happens regularly. I resorted to purchasing a handgun as I feel Thailand has become very violent.

Do you carry the handgun at all the restaurants you eat at?

No of course not.

Did you purchase it legally? Do you have a license for it? If you feel you have to have a gun to make you feel safe has it ever occurred to you that you are maybe living in the wrong place. Or perhaps you are an American citizen and are feeling homesick.

[endure]

I'd have thought that having a family living in Thailand would be reason enough to encourage people to stand up to this kind of treatment & of course I do understand how rigidly the laws in Thailand are imposed.

Slander, defamation & libelous actions only happen when you are wrong. If you're correct then it's a true statement & within the law.

As for people on here suggesting that the OP could be traced down by the local authorities or that TV may be prosecuted, I fully understand as tripadvisor was shut down years ago for all the negative comments on hotels etc in Thailand many in the Thailand language

The Thai authorities don't need to shut a website down to make it disappear from the Thai internet. They just get the MICT to block it. If that were to happen to Thaivisa it would deprive all our members who live in Thailand from using the site. We'd rather err on the safe side and keep our site available to all that want to read it.

[endure]

Re defamation in Thailand:

Criminal Defamation

Defamation as a criminal act in Thailand is defined by the Thai Criminal Code as a statement made by a person who imputes anything to another in a manner which is likely to impair the reputation of the latter or to expose him to hatred or contempt. Under the same Code, such person is liable for an imprisonment up to two years or he can be ordered by the court to pay a fine of 200,000 Baht or may be both.

Burden of Proof and Available Defenses

In Thailand, it is not the duty of the victim or the prosecution that the statement made by the defendant is false. Hence, the burden of proof lies on the defendant to prove that his statements are true. The defense that the defendant did not know his statements to be false is not acceptable in Thailand. Regardless of the truthfulness or falsehood of the statement, once it became a source of an injury which caused damage to the victim, the defendant is liable.

[Jayman]

Re defamation in Thailand:

Criminal Defamation

Defamation as a criminal act in Thailand is defined by the Thai Criminal Code as a statement made by a person who imputes anything to another in a manner which is likely to impair the reputation of the latter or to expose him to hatred or contempt. Under the same Code, such person is liable for an imprisonment up to two years or he can be ordered by the court to pay a fine of 200,000 Baht or may be both.

Burden of Proof and Available Defenses

In Thailand, it is not the duty of the victim or the prosecution that the statement made by the defendant is false. Hence, the burden of proof lies on the defendant to prove that his statements are true. The defense that the defendant did not know his statements to be false is not acceptable in Thailand. Regardless of the truthfulness or falsehood of the statement, once it became a source of an injury which caused damage to the victim, the defendant is liable.

I don't get it. You have to prove the truthfulness and even if you do then you are still liable.

[Payboy]

I don't really believe this over the top story but you could have called the police. Assuming, arguendo, that is true, I suggest you start eating at a better class of restaurant

Maybe that was the police!

My story from 2005: Took a girl who was my hairstylist out for a meal, drinks, bowling, and some closer inspection of my hotel room curtains. We had a great night from start to finish. Best of all, she has a normal job in a sea of murky water.

In the morning, turning serious, she holds out her hand, palm up. I was new to the kingdom so I asked for instruction. She wanted 1500 baht for her time. I reminded her she has a normal job and is a normal girl, not a prostitute. She said "nobody *firetrucks* for free!" I gave her 500 baht for her time and sent her packing.

She returned with the police and I coughed up 4000 baht more as I soiled my trousers.

One hell of a blow-dry, that.

[Kipperthai]

Other Thai forums name and shame ,never heard of them getting hauled before the courts...

[poanoi]

Re defamation in Thailand:

Criminal Defamation

Defamation as a criminal act in Thailand is defined by the Thai Criminal Code as a statement made by a person who imputes anything to another in a manner which is likely to impair the reputation of the latter or to expose him to hatred or contempt. Under the same Code, such person is liable for an imprisonment up to two years or he can be ordered by the court to pay a fine of 200,000 Baht or may be both.

Burden of Proof and Available Defenses

In Thailand, it is not the duty of the victim or the prosecution that the statement made by the defendant is false. Hence, the burden of proof lies on the defendant to prove that his statements are true. The defense that the defendant did not know his statements to be false is not acceptable in Thailand. Regardless of the truthfulness or falsehood of the statement, once it became a source of an injury which caused damage to the victim, the defendant is liable.

I recognised the corruption here in asia long ago,

for this reason, i bought a pen video recorder to catch the scum on record

[BlackPuddingBertha]

I don't get it. You have to prove the truthfulness and even if you do then you are still liable.

Actually you got it in one.

As far as I know Thailand is the only country on the planet that has a law like this. Basically you might be criminally liable for writing anything derogatory about anyone, if a complaint is made and if the police react to it.

[Yahooka]

The ops story is very believable and this kind of thing probably happens regularly. I resorted to purchasing a handgun as I feel Thailand has become very violent.

A handgun because Thailand has become very violent ??? For a farang Thailand is still the most safe place I can think of (and statistics will probably tell you the same).

If you wanna try VERY violent try places like South Africa,Nigeria,El Salvador and Venezuela.

Edited December 28, 2012 by Yahooka

[uptheos]

Simple complaint made at police station claiming harm to reputation, and on return you could be picked up at airport.The scary thing is Thailand still has criminal defamation in place.

As for links try a simple google search, there are also thai visa members that have also been done with defamation normally business related.

Be as cynical as you like,but the fact is the threat in Thailand for defamation particularly criminal is very real.

I'm just asking the name of a bar or restaurant, where a complaint has been on-line about the service, resulting is a conviction of libel in a country that has some of 'the strictest defamation laws'.

[BookMan]

Simple complaint made at police station claiming harm to reputation, and on return you could be picked up at airport.The scary thing is Thailand still has criminal defamation in place.

As for links try a simple google search, there are also thai visa members that have also been done with defamation normally business related.

Be as cynical as you like,but the fact is the threat in Thailand for defamation particularly criminal is very real.

I'm just asking the name of a bar or restaurant, where a complaint has been on-line about the service, resulting is a conviction of libel in a country that has some of 'the strictest defamation laws'.

Another poster mentioned tripadvisor...Having read through many hotel reviews and feedback when booking accommodation I can only assume there must be a lot of law suits being filed daily from that resulting libel-fest

[SidJames]

Simple complaint made at police station claiming harm to reputation, and on return you could be picked up at airport.The scary thing is Thailand still has criminal defamation in place.

As for links try a simple google search, there are also thai visa members that have also been done with defamation normally business related.

Be as cynical as you like,but the fact is the threat in Thailand for defamation particularly criminal is very real.

I'm just asking the name of a bar or restaurant, where a complaint has been on-line about the service, resulting is a conviction of libel in a country that has some of 'the strictest defamation laws'.

Surely the OP or TV can't get in trouble for reviewing a "certain" establishment with an extremely glowing review suggesting that the food & management are beyond reproach & that we should "all" frequent it as often as possible.

Are sarcasm & irony also covered under Thailand's draconian laws?

I, myself have never broken any laws of any country that I have ever visited (excluding grammatical ones)

Name & praise this place please

[uptheos]

Simple complaint made at police station claiming harm to reputation, and on return you could be picked up at airport.The scary thing is Thailand still has criminal defamation in place.

As for links try a simple google search, there are also thai visa members that have also been done with defamation normally business related.

Be as cynical as you like,but the fact is the threat in Thailand for defamation particularly criminal is very real.

I'm just asking the name of a bar or restaurant, where a complaint has been on-line about the service, resulting is a conviction of libel in a country that has some of 'the strictest defamation laws'.

Surely the OP or TV can't get in trouble for reviewing a "certain" establishment with an extremely glowing review suggesting that the food & management are beyond reproach & that we should "all" frequent it as often as possible.

Are sarcasm & irony also covered under Thailand's draconian laws?

I, myself have never broken any laws of any country that I have ever visited (excluding grammatical ones)

Name & praise this place please

Point taken

[Rimmer]

Defamation is the issuance of a false statement about another person, which causes that person to suffer harm. Libel involves the making of defamatory statements in a printed or fixed medium, such as a magazine or newspaper.

By way of additional information ... The law goes further than just affecting Thaivisa. If an aggrieved party presses the matter, YOU as a member will be the one taken to court for defamation. And YOU will be the one needing legal representation and YOU will be the one having to face the consequences of your posts. Thaivisa will be required by court order to provide your account information, including IP addresses, to enable the aggrieved party's lawyers to serve court papers on YOU.

The website owner is responsible for all content on his site in Thailand and posting information willfully intended to injure the reputation, causing economic damage or defaming a person in Thailand is a criminal offense punishable by two to five years in prison and a steep fine. In Addition, the defamed party can initiate a civil action to recoup any loss of income caused by the false and defaming statements.

[CWMcMurray]

Slander, defamation & libelous actions only happen when you are wrong. If you're correct then it's a true statement & within the law.

many in the Thailand language

Actually this is not so simple in Thailand...

You as the defendant actually have to prove what you said is true... So does the OP have pictures or videos or thermometer data on the heat of the burger ? Would guess not...

Also even if he can prove that his comments are truthful, it still does not mean that he is off the hook.

http://www.thailandlaw.org/defamation-in-thailand/

In Thailand, it is not the duty of the victim or the prosecution that the statement made by the defendant is false. Hence, the burden of proof lies on the defendant to prove that his statements are true. The defense that the defendant did not know his statements to be false is not acceptable in Thailand. Regardless of the truthfulness or falsehood of the statement, once it became a source of an injury which caused damage to the victim, the defendant is liable. Also, although the defendant proves that his statement is true, he still has the burden of proving to the court the propriety of such statement.

[Orac]

That is criminal assault, why have you not filed a complaint with the police?

Given that a number of popular bars on 2nd road that show football are owned by the police in Pattaya or have a police partner this might not be such a good idea.

[myfriendu]

no point and its a big venue

That is criminal assault, why have you not filed a complaint with the police?

no point only cause more trouble,the venue is a big place owned by thais,i live here with 2 kids so my families safety is more important

So why post this?

because i felt like it ,same as you.

i dont know about you but i dont get someone saying there going to kill me everyday if i complain about the food because some staff messed up and because of loss of face this sort of thing happens.

ive worked all over the world and this loss of face hang up only happens here,maybe you have a very exciting life and this sort of thing happens to you every day

[myfriendu]

That is criminal assault, why have you not filed a complaint with the police?

Given that a number of popular bars on 2nd road that show football are owned by the police in Pattaya or have a police partner this might not be such a good idea.

at least you get it,so many people on tv are blind to what goes on in the real thai world

[submaniac]

^^Unfortunately, I agree with you. Unfortunately.

[myfriendu]

Sounds like great customer service.

If you're not willing to at least PM the name of this crap box, then you're really wasting everyone's time.

pm your phone number ,i will call you we can meet and i will give you 500 baht to enjoy a slap up meal in the place on me for free,

then do a review and post ,so not to waste anyones time.

[LongTimeLurker]

Second Rd. is a long road, any clues as to which section of it?

Tai to Klang?

Klang to Nua?

Then we can feel safe about at least part of the street.

Edited December 28, 2012 by LongTimeLurker