Australian Pensioner Wins The Right To Claim His Pension In Se Asia (Including Thailand)

[terrychris]

It's very difficult to get the Disability Pension in Australia,just recently a man with kidney failure took the dept of social security to Court and lost.

This man the OP talks about was under the "old" system,now its very difficult to get .

They rate you on a 20 points medical scale AND if they think you can work at least 4 hours a week then you have to.

As i said i know of cases where a man had 1/ Kidney Failure ,applied for Disability pension,refused by centrelink/social security,took it to the Tribunal and lost.

They said it can be treated".,so in other words he can work at least part time.

Case number 2 was a guy who had Szpherinea and was in a mental hospital but they refused him because he was being treated,yes they said,take your meds and you will be ok,so when he took his meds he was under the 20 point impairment scale,so he lost in Court and now has to look for a job.

So please dont think getting Disability pension is easy,you have to have 20 points impairment AND then they still assess if you can work up to 3 to 20 hours a week.There are many many cases even 1 guy who had 2 knees missing who couldnt get it.

I recently,last year had a friend called back from Cambodia,aussie guy ,who had been living there on a disability pension,they called him back to be "assessed" for his condition,they sent him to a private contractor job service who some 21yo girl assessed him as can work 4 hours a week and so he had to live in australia until he could try to get it full time again.

i know of another case where this guy got refused Disability pension and he had Psychiatric,diabetes,hypertensipn,muscular problems and ASThma too but still they refused him,took it to court and LOST

aND I KNOW another case where this lady from Queensland in Australia had psych problems and back problem,centrelink/dss refused her disability pension so she took it to court and lost,they said you can work at least 8 hours a week.and keep taking your meds and you will be under the 20 points impairment scale.

So dont think its easy to get .

Edited January 3, 2013 by terrychris

[BookMan]

Guys guys guys...

You do not have to have been working , ever, to fulfil the requirements for an OAP. You do not even have to have paid one cent in tax.

AWLR - Australian Working Life Residence

http://guidesacts.fa...-1.1.a.340.html

Definition

AWLR refers to any and all periods from the age of 16 to pension age when a person was an Australian resident (section 7(2)).

It is a measure of a person's POTENTIAL working life and does NOT mean that a person had to have worked or paid taxes.

Act reference: SSAct section 7(2) An Australian resident is..., section 1221-B2 Australian working life residence (general)

Calculating AWLR

A person's AWLR is used to calculate the rate of proportional pension. The AWLR used in a proportional portability (1.1.P.310) rate calculation is the number of WHOLE months of working life residence, PLUS one. The extra month is added once only, after totalling all working life residence including broken periods of months and days. When adding days, 30 days are equal to one whole month.

Edited January 3, 2013 by BookMan

[terrychris]

Yes OAP, old age pension is easy to get at 65yo currentlywill behave to be 67 in a few years.to get it though,actually they dont call it old age pension now anyway.AND then you have the right to live overseas after telling centrelink/dept social security.you dont get rent allowance though if you move overseas.

BUT you must of been living in Australia the past 2 years, to apply for it though so thats why you see blokes pissing off back to OZ at 63 to await the 2 years.living in Australia THEN apply for old age pension,which by the way is not called that now.

As for the DSP ,which is disability pension it pays about 750 dollars a fortnight 40,000 45k b roughly a month and despite what some tell you on here,it aint easy to get no more.you must have 20 point impairment.AND unlike the OAP you MUST get permission to live overseas.IF they centrelink /social security dept says your condition is permanent and you cant work even 3 hours a week.

And listen you never ever had to work to receive the OAP at 65yo,you could of been on the Dole all your life,once you hit 65yo you have the right to get it.

Edited January 3, 2013 by terrychris

[Tolley]

It's very difficult to get the Disability Pension in Australia,just recently a man with kidney failure took the dept of social security to Court and lost.

This man the OP talks about was under the "old" system,now its very difficult to get .

They rate you on a 20 points medical scale AND if they think you can work at least 4 hours a week then you have to.

As i said i know of cases where a man had 1/ Kidney Failure ,applied for Disability pension,refused by centrelink/social security,took it to the Tribunal and lost.

They said it can be treated".,so in other words he can work at least part time.

Case number 2 was a guy who had Szpherinea and was in a mental hospital but they refused him because he was being treated,yes they said,take your meds and you will be ok,so when he took his meds he was under the 20 point impairment scale,so he lost in Court and now has to look for a job.

So please dont think getting Disability pension is easy,you have to have 20 points impairment AND then they still assess if you can work up to 3 to 20 hours a week.There are many many cases even 1 guy who had 2 knees missing who couldnt get it.

I recently,last year had a friend called back from Cambodia,aussie guy ,who had been living there on a disability pension,they called him back to be "assessed" for his condition,they sent him to a private contractor job service who some 21yo girl assessed him as can work 4 hours a week and so he had to live in australia until he could try to get it full time again.

i know of another case where this guy got refused Disability pension and he had Psychiatric,diabetes,hypertensipn,muscular problems and ASThma too but still they refused him,took it to court and LOST

aND I KNOW another case where this lady from Queensland in Australia had psych problems and back problem,centrelink/dss refused her disability pension so she took it to court and lost,they said you can work at least 8 hours a week.and keep taking your meds and you will be under the 20 points impairment scale.

So dont think its easy to get .

This is what happens when so many people start rorting the system. The disability pension has been rorted for years and now there is pressure on the govt to reduce welfare spending as tax receipts dwindle.

As a result stricter rules are brought in and those who have genuine need maybe excluded where in the past they would have qualified.

When the mining boom fades away and all the baby boomers start applying for pensions things are going to get really messy because there just wont be the money there to fund so many people on welfare.

[simple1]

Yes OAP, old age pension is easy to get at 65yo currentlywill behave to be 67 in a few years.to get it though,actually they dont call it old age pension now anyway.AND then you have the right to live overseas after telling centrelink/dept social security.you dont get rent allowance though if you move overseas.

BUT you must of been living in Australia the past 2 years, to apply for it though so thats why you see blokes pissing off back to OZ at 63 to await the 2 years.living in Australia THEN apply for old age pension,which by the way is not called that now.

As for the DSP ,which is disability pension it pays about 750 dollars a fortnight 40,000 45k b roughly a month and despite what some tell you on here,it aint easy to get no more.you must have 20 point impairment.AND unlike the OAP you MUST get permission to live overseas.IF they centrelink /social security dept says your condition is permanent and you cant work even 3 hours a week.

And listen you never ever had to work to receive the OAP at 65yo,you could of been on the Dole all your life,once you hit 65yo you have the right to get it.

Can you please provide the source link to your claim that you must be resident in Australia for two years prior to claiming the Aged Pension. The only comment from Human Services website that I can locate that refers to the two year period is "After you return, to be paid outside the country, you must have been living in Australia for two years since your last arrival for residence"

Edited January 3, 2013 by simple1

[lemoncake]

Well Im presuming you all know Australia

This seems to be a case by case scenario & Disability pension helping a bit

PIGS WILL FLY IF AN AUSSIE WHO HAVE WORKED ALL HIS LIFE this would open the gate On What Grounds

DESCRIMANATION

He seems to be long term unemployed and never contributed income tax.

Life long tax payers should be afforded the same right if a mentally ill bludger can.

Lets save the bogan level debates for web forums such as the daily telegraph or he herald sun. Mental health issues are important and grouping them with dole bludgers is inappropriate.

Drug addicts claim mental illness and float on pension and methadone for life.

So any homeless drunk can jump on this. Terrific precedent Australia is setting. Welfare nanny state.

No wonder people just breed and bludge in Australia.

Your statement is grossly incorrect. It is very very difficult to receive disability pension and requires a number of reports from the doctors.

My mother suffers from scaleredema which is a very rare disease , as a result she she also has bad heart, collapsed lungs, pinched nerves just to name a few and it took her over a year to pass all interviews and doctor appointments to get disability pension.

She was then harassed every year for health updates until she presented a report from the only professor in Australia dealing with this disease.

So do not be so sure that its easy and all are scammers

[Phronesis]

If you are able to support yourself financially you should never take money from any government as all you’re doing is taking funds away from people who are unable to financially take care of themselves.

Oh dear...

So when you have your tax done each year do you say to your accountant: "Don't worry about claiming any deductible expenses on my return. I don't want to take money away from the government".

Edited January 3, 2013 by Phronesis

[BookMan]

Your statement is grossly incorrect. It is very very difficult to receive disability pension and requires a number of reports from the doctors.

My mother suffers from scaleredema which is a very rare disease , as a result she she also has bad heart, collapsed lungs, pinched nerves just to name a few and it took her over a year to pass all interviews and doctor appointments to get disability pension.

She was then harassed every year for health updates until she presented a report from the only professor in Australia dealing with this disease.

So do not be so sure that its easy and all are scammers

When you say harrassed?

[lemoncake]

Your statement is grossly incorrect. It is very very difficult to receive disability pension and requires a number of reports from the doctors.

My mother suffers from scaleredema which is a very rare disease , as a result she she also has bad heart, collapsed lungs, pinched nerves just to name a few and it took her over a year to pass all interviews and doctor appointments to get disability pension.

She was then harassed every year for health updates until she presented a report from the only professor in Australia dealing with this disease.

So do not be so sure that its easy and all are scammers

When you say harrassed?

Every year to provide update of her illness. Mind you her illness was and still is incureable

[BookMan]

Your statement is grossly incorrect. It is very very difficult to receive disability pension and requires a number of reports from the doctors.

My mother suffers from scaleredema which is a very rare disease , as a result she she also has bad heart, collapsed lungs, pinched nerves just to name a few and it took her over a year to pass all interviews and doctor appointments to get disability pension.

She was then harassed every year for health updates until she presented a report from the only professor in Australia dealing with this disease.

So do not be so sure that its easy and all are scammers

When you say harrassed?

Every year to provide update of her illness. Mind you her illness was and still is incureable

Once a year only? That is hardly harassment.

Do you mean Scleredema?

[krisb]

All this topic has done is start political arguments between members. Ive been quite offended by some of the posts made and I can see some others feeling the same way all over some guy with schizophrenia walking around Thailand without his medicine paid for by Australian govt and its tax payers. Pfff.

Hope Mods decide to close it.

[lemoncake]

Your statement is grossly incorrect. It is very very difficult to receive disability pension and requires a number of reports from the doctors.

My mother suffers from scaleredema which is a very rare disease , as a result she she also has bad heart, collapsed lungs, pinched nerves just to name a few and it took her over a year to pass all interviews and doctor appointments to get disability pension.

She was then harassed every year for health updates until she presented a report from the only professor in Australia dealing with this disease.

So do not be so sure that its easy and all are scammers

When you say harrassed?

Every year to provide update of her illness. Mind you her illness was and still is incureable

Once a year only? That is hardly harassment.

Do you mean Scleredema?

Sorry am not too sure on the spelling, the i consider it a harassment when you have an incurable disease, which surely is not going to go away year by year, collapsed lungs are not going to open up, especially when doctors reports clearly indicated the condition and future prospects.

The disease has many stages and attacks different vital organs, any stress worsens the condition, and having to re-report and go through all the tests is stressful.

Also as i mentioned there is only professor in Australia who specializes in this while large majority of GP have no idea at all

[BookMan]

Sorry am not too sure on the spelling, the i consider it a harassment when you have an incurable disease, which surely is not going to go away year by year, collapsed lungs are not going to open up, especially when doctors reports clearly indicated the condition and future prospects.

The disease has many stages and attacks different vital organs, any stress worsens the condition, and having to re-report and go through all the tests is stressful.

Also as i mentioned there is only professor in Australia who specializes in this while large majority of GP have no idea at all

Yes, I am sorry for your mothers condition.

However, symptoms do get better for some people with Scleredema, as with many diseases, so a once a year medical check, while inconvenient, seems quite reasonable.

There needs to be checks and balances in the system, but they are normally there to stop people rorting the system, not to harass people. Obviously your mother is not rorting the system, but the bureaucrats can hardly take her word for that , can they?

[IrishIvan]

All this topic has done is start political arguments between members. Ive been quite offended by some of the posts made and I can see some others feeling the same way all over some guy with schizophrenia walking around Thailand without his medicine paid for by Australian govt and its tax payers. Pfff.

Hope Mods decide to close it.

Im astonished at how much hatred there is for this guy.

[lemoncake]

Sorry am not too sure on the spelling, the i consider it a harassment when you have an incurable disease, which surely is not going to go away year by year, collapsed lungs are not going to open up, especially when doctors reports clearly indicated the condition and future prospects.

The disease has many stages and attacks different vital organs, any stress worsens the condition, and having to re-report and go through all the tests is stressful.

Also as i mentioned there is only professor in Australia who specializes in this while large majority of GP have no idea at all

Yes, I am sorry for your mothers condition.

However, symptoms do get better for some people with Scleredema, as with many diseases, so a once a year medical check, while inconvenient, seems quite reasonable.

There needs to be checks and balances in the system, but they are normally there to stop people rorting the system, not to harass people. Obviously your mother is not rorting the system, but the bureaucrats can hardly take her word for that , can they?

i agree with you and she has 2 yearly check ups but with professor NOT a GP appointed by centerlink who has no clue at all.

also you may find the stages of disease vary and vital organs damaged also change, ie while liver improves, lungs go down.

there are moments when everything seems ok, but lapses are unpredictable so is the extent of each one.

The point i was making was that it is not easy as some claim to get disability pension and is just as hard to keep it, unless one is really disabled.

[wildorchid]

The guy is getting a disability pension, not OAP as he's 62. Under current rules, once he's 65 the disability pension rolls over to a OAP, so long as he is resident in Australia at that time & would then be able to receive the OAP whilst living overseas full time.

Did you read the article? He has no address so how can he reside in Australia?

Streets arent an address.

Look out Pattaya, a influx of methadone addicts from australia that claim 'DISABILITY' pensions due to their 'Illness'.

Its too easy to claim disabilty in Australia.

I think it you who didn't read the article! where did it say he has never payed any tax? where did it say he is a bludger? also he has been on the "DISABILITY pension since 1984 so it is quite possible he has worked and payed tax, also people have been residing in australia for thousands of years that did not have a fixed address!

so your claims have no credibility.

[advancebooking]

I personally have no problem with it, but most Australians have a genetic fault quite similar to Thais, they get jelous very easily. Whenever someone has a good deal the ordinary Australians come out of the woodwork and want to cut them down. There was an article on an Australian politician that earns $6000 per week and stated she could live on the dole on $260 a week in Australia. Now I saw many comments that were more infuriated about the Politicians salary than the actual main issue of the story!!. Whenever a particular trade group, teachers or others get a pay rise the howling of the general public can be heard in Thailand.

In this case I think good on him, I don't mind my taxes paying for an older bloke to have fun romping around Asia, I might end up like that one day.

Well said... I couldn't agree more

[manly100]

If you are able to support yourself financially you should never take money from any government as all you’re doing is taking funds away from people who are unable to financially take care of themselves.

Oh dear...

So when you have your tax done each year do you say to your accountant: "Don't worry about claiming any deductible expenses on my return. I don't want to take money away from the government".

quite right, I was strictly writing about taking welfare from the government, not claiming tax deductions.

[samran]

If you are able to support yourself financially you should never take money from any government as all you’re doing is taking funds away from people who are unable to financially take care of themselves.

Oh dear...

So when you have your tax done each year do you say to your accountant: "Don't worry about claiming any deductible expenses on my return. I don't want to take money away from the government".

quite right, I was strictly writing about taking welfare from the government, not claiming tax deductions.

What, like baby bonus, private health care rebate, first home buyers grant, diesel fuel rebate? I wish oz could get rid of all these things, but at the moment, the main welfare 'rorts' to worry about are all of the middle class variety.

[BookMan]

If you are able to support yourself financially you should never take money from any government as all you’re doing is taking funds away from people who are unable to financially take care of themselves.

Oh dear...

So when you have your tax done each year do you say to your accountant: "Don't worry about claiming any deductible expenses on my return. I don't want to take money away from the government".

quite right, I was strictly writing about taking welfare from the government, not claiming tax deductions.

What, like baby bonus, private health care rebate, first home buyers grant, diesel fuel rebate? I wish oz could get rid of all these things, but at the moment, the main welfare 'rorts' to worry about are all of the middle class variety.

I had forgotten about the first home buyers grant

[simple1]

First home buyers grant is to stimulate the housing construction industry as many trade people were losing their jobs. Benefits the government with people staying in work, companies being viable and paying tax. You could be cynical in also saying vote buying as is middle class welfare

Edited January 5, 2013 by simple1

[watcharacters]

Good for him. I've never really understood why pensioners need to be penalised for living OS.

Need a fixed residential address in Australia to claim the pension.

This will set precedent for old sex pests who dont need to maintain an address back which in turn gives them more income to spend here.

What do you consider a "sex pest"?

[IrishIvan]

@ bookman...Ive heard of a construction grant, If you build a house or something you get $14000, this is newer that the first home buyers and newer that the combined home buyers/builders grant. Its like an investment grant. I think it finished up last year, but it was only in WA or something. I will have to look at this on google. Also its true in Oz that no-one questions middle class welfere. Just the high end payments to pollies and tax breaks for the rich and the low end people on pensions. This is probably perhaps that the majority of the population in Australia is middle class and they are getting more handouts than anyone else and they want to keep it on the QT because they are benefiting

In regards to the OP and the comments in there. Id like to know from the people that disagree with this issue, how long is acceptable for a pensioner to be out of the country??

Edited January 5, 2013 by IrishIvan

[IrishIvan]

Good for him. I've never really understood why pensioners need to be penalised for living OS.

Need a fixed residential address in Australia to claim the pension.

This will set precedent for old sex pests who dont need to maintain an address back which in turn gives them more income to spend here.

Ease up, He isnt a sex pest. I doubt whether he could afford much from his pension to have much of a bar-scene life. It would be hard to live on 7-8000 baht a week anywhere in Thailand. Plus he has to fly back to Australia to go to the dole office

What do you consider a "sex pest"?

[samran]

First home buyers grant is to stimulate the housing construction industry as many trade people were losing their jobs. Benefits the government with people staying in work, companies being viable and paying tax. You could be cynical in also saying vote buying as is middle class welfare

Dumb policy is when good intentions have unintended consequences.

At best, all that happens is that home prices went up by $7000, he value of the first home buyers grant. At worse, was when that $7000 was used as part of the 10% leverage to the bank, allowing you to borrow $70,000 more than you otherwise would, pushing the price of a house up by that much again.

Lose lose situation for everyone.

[mickjn]

He seems to be long term unemployed and never contributed income tax.

Life long tax payers should be afforded the same right if a mentally ill bludger can.

I think he is sick isnt he.I dont think they will just give you then pension you have to be assessed my a doctor

[IrishIvan]

First home buyers grant is to stimulate the housing construction industry as many trade people were losing their jobs. Benefits the government with people staying in work, companies being viable and paying tax. You could be cynical in also saying vote buying as is middle class welfare

Dumb policy is when good intentions have unintended consequences.

At best, all that happens is that home prices went up by $7000, he value of the first home buyers grant. At worse, was when that $7000 was used as part of the 10% leverage to the bank, allowing you to borrow $70,000 more than you otherwise would, pushing the price of a house up by that much again.

Lose lose situation for everyone.

Yes but I didnt see any of the middle income welfare recipients give it back. What it did do is allow people on lower incomes more borrowing power. Thus stimulating an industry and getting more houses built for Towns in mining communities which need more housing. The high end of town didnt qualify for this. It wasnt really a lose lose situation as Australia was the only country in the world to not fall into a recession when the GFC hit.

Its all about sharing the wealth and if the person who is mentioned in the OPs original article is aborigional then he is a traditional land owner and is probably entiltled to a house in his own country. The amount of money being siphoned off by big business in that country is shocking

[IrishIvan]

First home buyers grant is to stimulate the housing construction industry as many trade people were losing their jobs. Benefits the government with people staying in work, companies being viable and paying tax. You could be cynical in also saying vote buying as is middle class welfare

Dumb policy is when good intentions have unintended consequences.

At best, all that happens is that home prices went up by $7000, he value of the first home buyers grant. At worse, was when that $7000 was used as part of the 10% leverage to the bank, allowing you to borrow $70,000 more than you otherwise would, pushing the price of a house up by that much again.

Lose lose situation for everyone.

Yes but I didnt see any of the middle income welfare recipients give it back. What it did do is allow people on lower incomes more borrowing power. Thus stimulating an industry and getting more houses built for Towns in mining communities which need more housing. The high end of town didnt qualify for this. It wasnt really a lose lose situation as Australia was the only country in the world to not fall into a recession when the GFC hit.

Its all about sharing the wealth and if the person who is mentioned in the OPs original article is aborigional then he is a traditional land owner and is probably entiltled to a house in his own country. The amount of money being siphoned off by big business in that country is shocking

On another note, you say that all houses would increase hby 10% wouldnt that in fact mean that all Australians go 10% wealthier? Probably why more Australians are travelling. If they got poorer then they wouldnt be boosting money into Thailand while they are on holidays along with the pensioners that reside in Thailand

[simple1]

First home buyers grant is to stimulate the housing construction industry as many trade people were losing their jobs. Benefits the government with people staying in work, companies being viable and paying tax. You could be cynical in also saying vote buying as is middle class welfare

Dumb policy is when good intentions have unintended consequences.

At best, all that happens is that home prices went up by $7000, he value of the first home buyers grant. At worse, was when that $7000 was used as part of the 10% leverage to the bank, allowing you to borrow $70,000 more than you otherwise would, pushing the price of a house up by that much again.

Lose lose situation for everyone.

Yes but I didnt see any of the middle income welfare recipients give it back. What it did do is allow people on lower incomes more borrowing power. Thus stimulating an industry and getting more houses built for Towns in mining communities which need more housing. The high end of town didnt qualify for this. It wasnt really a lose lose situation as Australia was the only country in the world to not fall into a recession when the GFC hit.

Its all about sharing the wealth and if the person who is mentioned in the OPs original article is aborigional then he is a traditional land owner and is probably entiltled to a house in his own country. The amount of money being siphoned off by big business in that country is shocking

On another note, you say that all houses would increase hby 10% wouldnt that in fact mean that all Australians go 10% wealthier? Probably why more Australians are travelling. If they got poorer then they wouldnt be boosting money into Thailand while they are on holidays along with the pensioners that reside in Thailand

No, all it means more value in the house asset that can only be realised by selling and moving in to a lower cost property or cashing in and move to somewhere like Thailand. The challenge is in timing as house value can depreciate, as has happened in the past few years in some areas in Australia.

Middle class welfare is not "no questions asked", It is based upon household income and number of children and accordingly scaled . It is true that some (e.g. self employed) understate their income, but government is using sophisticated data mining techniques to assist in identifying such behaviour. e.g. matching vehicle purchase value against declared income.

[BookMan]

Its all about sharing the wealth and if the person who is mentioned in the OPs original article is aborigional then he is a traditional land owner and is probably entiltled to a house in his own country.

Come on mate. It has been discussed that there is zero evidence of of him being aboriginal at this stage. I know you want to keep this thread going, but really, clutching at straws now IrishIvan