Hand To Mouth.........

[theblether]

I've seen some things and I've been some places, however I've never seen so many "expats" living hand to mouth as I see in Thailand.

What's going on with that?

ps. When I say hand to mouth I mean literally waking up in the morning with next to no food or money.

It ain't Heaven if every day is a Hell of poverty

[473geo]

How many have you actually encountered that brings you to this conclusion? Most of the ones I come into contact with always appear to be spending...

[theblether]

On my last trip four......I noticed a couple of things last time round that stuck in my mind, and this was one of them. There seems to be an explosion of long tern farangs in Chiang Mai and equally, there seems to be an explosion of people scraping by......I don't think it will be long before we see farang vagrants on the streets of CM, in fact the CM community may know of some already.

[mauGR1]

There is at least one foreign vagrant on the once quiet and lovely island, i reckon there must be a few in a city..i just hope it doesn't become a trend.

[theblether]

There is at least one foreign vagrant on the once quiet and lovely island, i reckon there must be a few in a city..i just hope it doesn't become a trend.

Me too, but it seems to be heading that way. There's a particular cafe that I frequent in CM and I find the expats that use it to be a delightful and stable crew, however every day in life I see certain farangs coming in to be fed at their expense. You hear all the same stories about waiting on money being sent etc but in this day and age that's not a long process, these people seem to be able to play this card day after day after day.

Have any of you happened across this type?

[473geo]

On my last trip four......I noticed a couple of things last time round that stuck in my mind, and this was one of them. There seems to be an explosion of long tern farangs in Chiang Mai and equally, there seems to be an explosion of people scraping by......I don't think it will be long before we see farang vagrants on the streets of CM, in fact the CM community may know of some already.

Ah ok, I don't tend to hang around in cities, did all that years ago......but it is long walk home if things go awry financially.....

[NeverSure]

How do they stay without the bank balance, income, or combination? Do they lie to the embassy, or are the staying illegally or...?

[theblether]

On my last trip four......I noticed a couple of things last time round that stuck in my mind, and this was one of them. There seems to be an explosion of long tern farangs in Chiang Mai and equally, there seems to be an explosion of people scraping by......I don't think it will be long before we see farang vagrants on the streets of CM, in fact the CM community may know of some already.

Ah ok, I don't tend to hang around in cities, did all that years ago......but it is long walk home if things go awry financially.....

I've noticed on previous trips the people ( almost always guys ) that have the usual litany of problems such as alcoholism, substance abuse and the like, and these guys by dint are always on the edge. This time I noticed more people with no obvious problems that seem determined to hold on to their meagre lives in Thailand. I don't understand it.

[theblether]

How do they stay without the bank balance, income, or combination? Do they lie to the embassy, or are the staying illegally or...?

I have seen examples of extraordinary overstays however so far these tend to be in the alcoholic / dependent category, rather than this new category that I noticed. The worst example of overstay that I have encountered was 4 years, that guy was a chronic alcoholic and was eventually jailed twice before being deported.

[473geo]

On my last trip four......I noticed a couple of things last time round that stuck in my mind, and this was one of them. There seems to be an explosion of long tern farangs in Chiang Mai and equally, there seems to be an explosion of people scraping by......I don't think it will be long before we see farang vagrants on the streets of CM, in fact the CM community may know of some already.

Ah ok, I don't tend to hang around in cities, did all that years ago......but it is long walk home if things go awry financially.....

I've noticed on previous trips the people ( almost always guys ) that have the usual litany of problems such as alcoholism, substance abuse and the like, and these guys by dint are always on the edge. This time I noticed more people with no obvious problems that seem determined to hold on to their meagre lives in Thailand. I don't understand it.

I guess it would depend on their choices, did they offer any explanation other than temporary cash flow.....maybe it was the end of their economic month so the days you viewed their dining habits the money had just run out before the days in the month, maybe for the first 20 days life was great?

[HughJass]

On my last trip four......I noticed a couple of things last time round that stuck in my mind, and this was one of them. There seems to be an explosion of long tern farangs in Chiang Mai and equally, there seems to be an explosion of people scraping by......I don't think it will be long before we see farang vagrants on the streets of CM, in fact the CM community may know of some already.

Ah ok, I don't tend to hang around in cities, did all that years ago......but it is long walk home if things go awry financially.....

I've noticed on previous trips the people ( almost always guys ) that have the usual litany of problems such as alcoholism, substance abuse and the like, and these guys by dint are always on the edge. This time I noticed more people with no obvious problems that seem determined to hold on to their meagre lives in Thailand. I don't understand it.

if they are holding onto little enough here then what have they got to look forward to back in the West where living costs are extortionate,the weather sucks and the women are mostly fat and ugly

[theblether]

Fair point, but surely it's a hellish existence living in Thailand with no money?

[theblether]

@Geo.....could be, but one of the individuals told me that had been penniless for two months, another made no bones about the fact that not only were they penniless they had no prospect of an income at all.

Possibly caught in a trap of their own making.

[smokie36]

Fair point, but surely it's a hellish existence living in Thailand with no money?

Better with some at least.....yet people survive on next to nothing. Usually these people have nothing to return to back home so leave them alone I reckon.

Of course bad decisions are partly responsible and some have been ripped off too.

A book and its cover etc....

[theblether]

Aha Smokie, do you know some of the individuals of whom I speak?

[MrWorldwide]

I think the answer is simple - once they start begging / cajoling people for money, deport them. Till then, who gives a shit ? Having survived on the streets of BKK on 2-300 baht a day for 6 days of the week so that I could get merry on the 7th, I know what its like to have to control my spending (please, unless you are Thai (or eating rice exclusively) don't tell me you could do BKK on 50 baht a day ..) - no excuse for dressing like a homeless person, but as long as they aren't hurting anyone, is 'hand to mouth' such a sin ? .I actually woke up feeling better about myself on those extended 3-month stays than I did when I blew anywhere up to 20K baht a night (6K most nights) boozing it up for 2 weeks straight .... spending over half a million baht on a 3-month binge in LOS was never going to happen.

[theblether]

spending over half a million baht on a 3-month binge in LOS was never going to happen.

That's not a lot of money over three months.

[473geo]

@Geo.....could be, but one of the individuals told me that had been penniless for two months, another made no bones about the fact that not only were they penniless they had no prospect of an income at all.

Possibly caught in a trap of their own making.

Then I guess those you mention are/become professional beggars......it's a life in the sun I suppose......riddled with uncertainty......but a life.......I don't see too many taking this option in the future so I doubt too many will just arrive and throw themselves on the mercy of others.

[smokie36]

spending over half a million baht on a 3-month binge in LOS was never going to happen.

That's not a lot of money over three months.

I hope that doesn't include accomodation costs and bills.If it does then it seems way short for an appropriately enjoyable time in Thailand.

Frankly that is budget travel.

[HeavyDrinker]

Load of dribble written by tosspots who have never been short of a bob or two thanks to Mummy and Daddy...

[smokie36]

Load of dribble written by tosspots who have never been short of a bob or two thanks to Mummy and Daddy...

Good point this for many expats....making sure that the family back home are ready to bale you out with at least ten million when things go wrong.

[HeavyDrinker]

Well it's written by an 'expat' who can't afford to live here....

[MAJIC]

spending over half a million baht on a 3-month binge in LOS was never going to happen.

That's not a lot of money over three months.

Now come on theblether,now I know you are exagerating! half a million baht @ 46 baht to the GBP = £10,869 divide 3 = £3623 x 46 = 166,666 baht per month,and it's "not a lot of money over three months" your having a laugh,surely?

[MAJIC]

Well it's written by an 'expat' who can't afford to live here....

And it's now turned into a Tag Team effort

[MAJIC]

Load of dribble written by tosspots who have never been short of a bob or two thanks to Mummy and Daddy...

Until you have been really broke a time or two,with nowhere much to turn to, except yourself,the value of money and lack of planning ahead gives you a much needed kick up the A** . And I for one needed it,and was dealt a valuable lesson in life.

[MrWorldwide]

Guys, that would have been half a million purely on nightlife - not hard to do, granted, but how many of us would be happy to see that sort of money go straight down a urinal or into some of the horrendous hangovers I've suffered in LOS ? I expect that the tough guys here dont suffer hangovers, but I sure as hell do and the following day is usually a queit one - its the day after that things usually go back to 'party' mode and those thousand baht notes disappear very quickly. Cabs, restaurants, women - its very easy to burn throiugh 6K baht a day in holiday mode.

Out of interest, did anyone think my '2-300 baht a day' estimate included accommodation or things like laundry ? Seriously ?

[MAJIC]

Guys, that would have been half a million purely on nightlife - not hard to do, granted, but how many of us would be happy to see that sort of money go straight down a urinal or into some of the horrendous hangovers I've suffered in LOS ? I expect that the tough guys here dont suffer hangovers, but I sure as hell do and the following day is usually a queit one - its the day after that things usually go back to 'party' mode and those thousand baht notes disappear very quickly. Cabs, restaurants, women - its very easy to burn throiugh 6K baht a day in holiday mode.

Out of interest, did anyone think my '2-300 baht a day' estimate included accommodation or things like laundry ? Seriously ?

Burning 6,000 baht a day,well even young guys don't have the energy to be partying every night, and can also need a few quieter/cheaper nights,if only to sober up! and get their head straight.

2-300 baht a day inc accomodation = No.

[MrWorldwide]

I just knew at the start of my first 3-month stay that I wasn't going to be able to maintain 'party mode', either financially or in terms of my health, and I also realised that if I was serious about retiring in LOS eventually I needed to start showing some discipline. There were bloiwout days in there, but at the end of my trip I didn't have to scrape together cabfare to the airport and live on baked beans back in Oz until I found another job. My parents are dead and I have no other 'lifeline' back in Oz - on both occasions, it was a case of stepping into the unknown and being willing to back myself when I got back with a 3-month hole in my CV and nowhere to live. I had a car in storage in Cairns, a few possessions in the back, and the remainder of my bank account - I challenge anyone here to do something similar in the current job market. Doesnt make me Superman - in some respects I guess it makes me an irresponsible idiot - but there were some very interesting moments with headhunters in those initial interviews - 'So, I see you've had a break ...'

I find it interesting that every Thai-based board has folks who can live on far less than me (the 50-baht crowd I referred to earlier..), and folks who claim to have access to far more on a daily basis. End of the day, we all make the most of the resources we have - financial, physical and intellectual - but being tagged a 'tightwad' AND a 'spendthrift' on the same board seems a little rich for my blood. It seems that anyone who strays from the norm is either a backpacker or a pseudo-billionaire - its an amusing generalisation, but one that I completely reject. Anyone who doesnt agree that flushing half a million baht down a Bangkok sewer every 3 months is a waste of money is more than welcome to regale us with tales of their own lavish lifestyle - I'm all ears.

[theblether]

Seriously, 5500 baht a day is not a lot of money in Thailand for a guy on holiday. I'm amazed at anyone doubting that.

[MrWorldwide]

Guys, that would have been half a million purely on nightlife - not hard to do, granted, but how many of us would be happy to see that sort of money go straight down a urinal or into some of the horrendous hangovers I've suffered in LOS ? I expect that the tough guys here dont suffer hangovers, but I sure as hell do and the following day is usually a queit one - its the day after that things usually go back to 'party' mode and those thousand baht notes disappear very quickly. Cabs, restaurants, women - its very easy to burn throiugh 6K baht a day in holiday mode.

Out of interest, did anyone think my '2-300 baht a day' estimate included accommodation or things like laundry ? Seriously ?

Burning 6,000 baht a day,well even young guys don't have the energy to be partying every night, and can also need a few quieter/cheaper nights,if only to sober up! and get their head straight.

2-300 baht a day inc accomodation = No.

On a 2-week holiday, particularly when the next one is 9-12 months away, I tend to go very hard. Ok - too hard. Even on the days where my alcohol intake was moderated, I would go to Emporium and try to buy my way out of the malaise that inevitably follows a big night on the turps. Technically, it may not all have been alcohol and girls, but a very large percentage was.