Three Hurt In U S Helicopter Hard Landing In Thailand

[GentlemanJim]

Phuketjock, edit your post above correctly, so that my name is not quoted as saying what you have done.

You just said in the post above.

The last time I served in the Army Air Corp Jim there were no such things as Squadrons, only flights or workshops, so

much for your knowledge then. I have no gripe whatsoever with the pilots I have met and worked with in my time as many

were real good and decent people, but unfortunately there were too many like yourself who could not see past their own

percieved greatness and arrogance which I would venture to suggest probably goes a long way to contribute to the sadly

high accident percentage caused by pilots in aviation today. I think IMHO that the people that worked with/under you in

your day probably had similar feelings about your abyssmal attitude. But I can't be sure I wasn't there, thank god.

Are you SURE you had no Squadrons? When was it you were in?

None of these ones ring a bell ? There are more!

• 1 Regiment, Army Air Corps^[16] (organic to 1st Armoured Division)
  • 652 Squadron (until September 1957 No. 652 Squadron RAF)
  • 661 Squadron (until March 1957 No. 661 Squadron RAF)
  • 
    
• 
  

• 2 (Training) Regiment, Army Air Corps
  • 668 (Training) Squadron (until November 1945 No. 668 Squadron RAF)
  • 676 (Training) Squadron
  • 
    
• 
  

• 3 Regiment, Army Air Corps (part of 16 Air Assault Brigade)
  • 653 Squadron (until September 1945 No. 653 Squadron RAF)
  • 662 Squadron (until March 1957 No. 662 Squadron RAF)
  • 
    
  • 663 Squadron (until March 1957 No. 663 Squadron RAF)
  • 
    
• 
  

• 4 Regiment, Army Air Corps (part of 16 Air Assault Brigade)
  • 654 Squadron (until June 1947 No. 654 Squadron RAF)
  • 656 Squadron (until September 1957 No. 656 Squadron RAF)
  • 
    
  • 664 Squadron (until March 1957 No. 664 Squadron RAF)
  • 
    
• 
  

• 5 Regiment, Army Air Corps
  • 651 Squadron (until September 1957 No. 651 Squadron RAF)
  • 665 Squadron (until July 1945 No. 665 Squadron RCAF)
  • 
    
• 
  

• 6 (Volunteer) Regiment, Army Air Corps
  • 677 Squadron (Suffolk and Norfolk Yeomanry)
  • 655 Squadron (V) The Scottish Horse a sub unit based at Middle Wallop
  • 
    
• 
  

• 7 (Training) Regiment, Army Air Corps
  • 670 (Training) Squadron (until July 1946 No. 670 Squadron RAF)
  • 671 (Training) Squadron (until July 1946 No. 671 Squadron RAF)
  • 
    
  • 673 (AH Training) Squadron (until October 1945 No. 673 Squadron RAF)
  • 
    
• 
  

• 9 Regiment, Army Air Corps
  • 659 Squadron (until August 1947 No. 659 Squadron RAF)
  • 669 Squadron (until November 1945 No. 669 Squadron RAF)
  • 
    
  • 672 Squadron (until July 1946 No. 672 Squadron RAF)
  • 
    
• 
  

Edited February 23, 2013 by GentlemanJim

[BoonToong]

Ok PhuketJock, my turn.

I had the distinct pleasure of serving in 662 Sqn, 3 Reg't AAC (Army Air Corps) for 3 years so I can, therefore, comment on AAC life a little (but granted it is limited). During that time I was a Lynx Flight Commander (not bad for a matelot). Not to blow my own trumpet, but to qualify what I am about to say; the 'lads' all loved the way that I did not follow an 'officers and the rest' mentality and I mucked in with them, stood stag, scrubbed the aircraft with them. That, I think, qualifies me to say that there is nothing wrong with use of the word 'ours' by GJIm. I agree that it is a term of endearment and respect. 'Our aircraft', 'our kit', 'our engineers', 'our pilots'. Perhaps your reaction to his use of the word is more testament to your perception of it (based on your own experiences).

In my time serving with the AAC, I did see,generally, a strong divide between the engineers, groundcrew and pilots, far, far more than exists in any RAF or RN aviation unit that I served in, where I only ever encountered the odd individual who had a 'problem' with Pilots.

Your earlier comment about 'big aircraft'? Come on, as a qualified engineer (which I am by the way, starting off as a 'ranker' before becoming a pilot), you know it's all to do with mass rather than size. As GJIm says, this thread was an opportunity to inform and discuss, not to spread 'aviation verbal garbage'. If a similar thread had been running about a specific engineering problem, I'm damn sure you wouldn't have had a similar number of so-called experts chipping their tuppence worth in; why is it then, that when it comes to flying, everyone seems to be an expert? Your expertise is about engineering Jock; not piloting.

In summary, it is my direct experience and observation that the only guys that were bitter and twisted towards pilots usually harboured a secret desire to want to be a pilot themselves and dragged around a burden of insecurity because they lacked the ability or medical fitness to do so. I'll let you decide if you fall into that category.

When the beers happen next week I'm sure we will be swapping stories about the many great men, of all ranks, services, nations and trades, that we have served with over the years. We will also no doubt talk about the occasional tossers we have encountered over the years. Thanks for the extra ammunition

Back to Topic; I hope the guys are all recovering well and that the engineers are enjoying clearing up the mess.

[Scott]

Posts deleted. Please stick to the topic. The topic isn't about bragging or insulting other members.

[phuketjock]

Well GJ and BT you have gone past my boredom threshhold so all I can say is I too

hope all are well and make a full recovery from any injuries incurred in the accident.

I also hope in the near future that the standard of piloting skills will rise significantly

and hopefully bring the number of accidents caused by pilot error to a more acceptable

level.

[oldsailor35]

I hope the injured personnel make a full recovery, the fact that no one was killed is a testament to the pilot's skill and training, well done!

The pilot made a hard landing, they are trained not to, so the skill must have failed for a minute there.

The hard landing may have been caused by a mechanical failure, military pilots are trained to a very high standard.

And they are trained in what to do in a hard landing as are commercial helecopter pilots.

[oldsailor35]

I hope the injured personnel make a full recovery, the fact that no one was killed is a testament to the pilot's skill and training, well done!

The pilot made a hard landing, they are trained not to, so the skill must have failed for a minute there.

I was a wildland fire fighter in the U.S. and flew on many, many helecopters...I noticed that they never say a helecopter "crashed"..it is always refered to as a "hard landing". even if the ship is totaly destroyed and all are killed.....still a "hard landing".

Yeh ! but thats in America.

[oldsailor35]

I hope the injured personnel make a full recovery, the fact that no one was killed is a testament to the pilot's skill and training, well done!

Or far more likely a testament to the sturdy design and construction of the helicopter, a very high percentage of

aviation accidents are caused by pilot error, rather than mechanical failure.

Yes, thats they always try to say, especially when he is dead.

[BoonToong]

I hope the injured personnel make a full recovery, the fact that no one was killed is a testament to the pilot's skill and training, well done!

Or far more likely a testament to the sturdy design and construction of the helicopter, a very high percentage of

aviation accidents are caused by pilot error, rather than mechanical failure.

Yes, thats they always try to say, especially when he is dead.

[BoonToong]

Well GJ and BT you have gone past my boredom threshhold so all I can say is I too

hope all are well and make a full recovery from any injuries incurred in the accident.

I also hope in the near future that the standard of piloting skills will rise significantly

and hopefully bring the number of accidents caused by pilot error to a more acceptable

level.

Thank you Jock, I agree, the Pilots are not as good as we were back then

[phuketjock]

Well GJ and BT you have gone past my boredom threshhold so all I can say is I too

hope all are well and make a full recovery from any injuries incurred in the accident.

I also hope in the near future that the standard of piloting skills will rise significantly

and hopefully bring the number of accidents caused by pilot error to a more acceptable

level.

Thank you Jock, I agree, the Pilots are not as good as we were back then

Ah BT it would be great if your assumption were correct, but the stats say that the frequency

of pilot error caused accidents has actually decreased since you and GJ were in the flying game

and hopefully that trend will continue. Sorry it was not my intention to burst you bubble but it is

difficult to dispute the facts.

[BoonToong]

[canman]

"A US Marine helicopter on Wednesday made a "hard landing""

No landing where all can basicly walk or be carried away from alive is a bad landing. Mind you, it's either the weather, those military pilots or just the bloody flying contraption itself, but helicopters seem somewhat less safe than other means of transportation (even though in these heli's you don't need to open a door to get rid of your cigar stomp)

Statistics show that this is not actually true; but I agree, the common perception amongst the general public is that helicopters 'are dangerous'

I'd be interested in seeing those statistics. I have been a passenger in hundreds of helo flights and my impression has always been that the helo flight was much more dangerous then the plane flight to get there. Although I don't have any hard stats to back it up I am fairly sure that more oil workers die in helo crashes then are killed in airplane crashes.

If its off shore you refer to, there's a reason for that. Fixed wing aircraft don't do the transport. Either by sea or helicopter.

When refering to 'the plane flight to get there' what I meant was the plane flight to get to the country where they then boarded a helo to fly offshore. Apologies if this wasn't clear.

[55Jay]

This thread sure made a "hard landing", nice to see rivalry between pilots and all other functions which are present only to enable them to fly - - - is alive and well.

Brings to mind yet another cliche an airbus manipulator once told me as we discussed B v A automation, and the future of unmanned or minimally staffed flight decks in commerical aviation. Went something like this:

"Pilots are not necessarily paid for what they do. They are paid for what they can do (when the shit hits the fan)".

I don't think we'll see a follow up on this Marine bird incident since there were no deaths, at least not at the time of story release, there's no money in it.

However, if one of our esteemed google journos would keystroke CH46, might find all sorts of juicy fodder to continue this TV-TSB investigation.

Edited February 25, 2013 by 55Jay

[rikkie]

I am sure the Thai military needs to remain ever ready at the beckon call of the US or is this a 'comply' order or else? What ever happened to Utapao revamp in favour of the US 'weather balloons'?

What are you possibly bleating on about....Cobra Gold has been a joint military exercise for decades and at the invitation of Thailand. It includes Singapore, Indonesia, Malaysia, Thailand, USA, Japan and Korea. Thailand and The US have been treaty allies since 1833 and routinely train together across different military platforms.

Yes

[rikkie]

I hope the injured personnel make a full recovery, the fact that no one was killed is a testament to the pilot's skill and training, well done!

The pilot made a hard landing, they are trained not to, so the skill must have failed for a minute there.

I was a wildland fire fighter in the U.S. and flew on many, many helecopters...I noticed that they never say a helecopter "crashed"..it is always refered to as a "hard landing". even if the ship is totaly destroyed and all are killed.....still a "hard landing".

Helecopter????

[BoonToong]

I did find some stuff Jay.

Looks like the 'hard landing' was a long stretch of the imagination and that at least one person was quite badly injured

[55Jay]

Was referring to the age of the venerable '46 fleet, thought it might spark a new direction in the investigation. LOL.

Man, sure is hot today.

BTW, love your avatar photo. I snapped one on my cell phone just like it in a bar out east pattaya a few years ago, made me recall a story or two the ex wife told me on her runs between Bangladesh and Middle East. She would of appreciated one of these signs in the lav.

Cheers,

J

Edited February 25, 2013 by 55Jay