Street Micro-Violence As Social Norm Reinforcement

[Gaccha]

I feel there is more criminal violence in Thailand than the UK, but I also feel I am less threatened by it and less vulnerable to it.

My theory is that the violence is more often than not instigated to reinforce breached social norms rather than as a social norm breach.

The UK, like all nation-states, is intensely jealous of its monopoly on violence. They become awfully bothered by citizen's justice and can be quite vengeful in any signs of violence as retribution.

I am sure Thailand would be the same if it could. But I feel there is an understanding of the weakness of the state and the more conservative normative forces in Thailand to keep a lid on the violence in the street.

Clearly, there is political violence (the numbers of politicians shot at around election time is astonishing) but for the man walking his dog on the street the violence is unlikely to be directed his way. This violence in Thailand is to punish unwritten norms.

I thought this as I watched a scooter driver beat up three teenage boys. They offered little resistance as he gave them each black eyes. I thought it was interesting that the police officer I grabbed when he spoke to the boys used a similar terminology to my imagined 1950s British police officer; not the "what was the number of the scooter?", or "What did the scooter rider look like?", but rather, "what were you scallywags up to?".

Despite the heavily bloodied faces it soon became clear among the four of them that they had it coming-- they had not got out of the way of the scooter driver when he was attempting to pass them on the pavement. So the norms of respecting elders, not getting in others' ways, and other norms seemed to take priority.

I have never been threatened by violence here, except by a 'roid rager Briton in Khon Kaen. It seems a preferable place for those who just get on with their lives.

I can also imagine quite a few of the tattoed hothead Brits feeling very upset at this sort of violence since it will be precisely them it is directed at. While in the UK, they could beat people up who dared to look at them, Thais do the chivalrous act of ganging up on the norm-breaching troublemaker and reminding him of the norms. Their upset is revealed in their claims of experiencing Thai cowardice; Thais bravely and instinctively gather together in fighting these giant Brit thugs through sheer numbers.

I have read many times of Brits getting unfaily beaten up, but I have only ever seen Brits get fairly beaten up,

Thoughts?

Edited February 25, 2013 by Gaccha

[apetley]

Never seen a foreigner beaten up by crowd of Thais.

Seen two Thai on Thai fights in the village and one Thai student ruck.

If you keep seeing farangs getting a kicking by groups of Thais would suggest you change your social circle.

[Bangkokhatter]

Am guessing your GF cheated on you with a Brit .

[mrtoad]

A poor attempt at Brit bashing

[Munger]

Am guessing your GF cheated on you with a Brit .

I am guessing he is a thai apologist. (fairly beaten up) thats usually 10 one 1. Get a life OP

[impulse]

In fairness, a lot of avoiding fights is in knowing when things are escalating from irritation to violence.

Back home, I know the language and the customs and can recognize when things are escalating. Sometimes it's just some muttering that foretells a violent turn. Then it seems the prudent thing to do is to extricate myself from the situation before blows are struck, or weapons come out.

I'm not sure I'd recognize the same signs in a foreign land with different customs, Thai or otherwise.

I haven't taken a whopping since high school hi-jinx, nor have I ever had to run from a situation in my adult life. But I have crossed over to the other side of the street many times, and happily accepted the title of "coward" for doing so.

Not sure I'd know when that was prudent here in Asia.

[Slip]

Gaccha- despite all the naysayers, and as a Brit too, I think this is quite interesting. I certainly remember the sort of violence you are talking about happening in the UK 20 years ago. If we young lads got out of order then we got slapped right down by our seniors.

[britgent]

Gaccha she says you forgot to send her monthly income this month and my beer fridge isn't going to stock itself buddy.

[Slip]

Just to add though- I daresay these days that taxi driver would have come off much worse in the UK than he did in your story.

[LennyW]

I think the OP should go back to UK - obviously Thai drugs are far too strong for him!!

[Gaccha]

I should point out I'm a Brit. I could easily spread my point to cover most western countries.

I am talking about seeing street violence. How or what can that do with my social circle....

I don't understand the points about drugs and gfs. I felt the point I was making was pretty clear.

[MrHammer]

I think you're right that unacceptable thug behaviour gets punished harshly here. A thief will get a beating. A drunk driver killing someone will have a lynching mob after him. A tatooed troublemaker foreigner won't be able to bully his way around. All good. Where it isn't good is getting a bottle over your neck cause you talked to some girl without knowing she had a boyfriend. Jealousy is dangerous here.

[Gaccha]

I think you're right that unacceptable thug behaviour gets punished harshly here. A thief will get a beating. A drunk driver killing someone will have a lynching mob after him. A tatooed troublemaker foreigner won't be able to bully his way around. All good. Where it isn't good is getting a bottle over your neck cause you talked to some girl without knowing she had a boyfriend. Jealousy is dangerous here.

I agree with that.

The danger of creating a loss of face is pretty lethal. I think you might even get by with a handshake in the UK....

[robblok]

Not much violence.. hahahaha. There is enough violence here. This week gf was waiting at a bus stop and saw people feeling. Before she realized it a gang of schoolkids (technical education ones) were besieging guys of an other school smashing up 2 taxis and fire-ring a gun to boot. Sure they were after other schoolkids so you'd probably be safe but they were shooting a gun too. Police did not show up untill it was way to late they seemed reluctant to do a thing.

As for Brits getting a beating, you guys do have a reputation for violence and getting drunk, though id say that you got idiots in every country. Unlike the British guys in the Pattaya forum bashing the Russians I believe that every country including mine has its idiots that start fights and get too drunk. I don't mind one bit when they get a beating.

I still feel more safe here but if I read about all the violence that is happening here id say its a dangerous place too and we just don't notice it as much