Fish Farming ... When It Goes Belly Up

[RedBullHorn]

ray23, 30% protein are medium size pellets...

[ray23]

Thanks RBH that might help in the search

[ozzydom]

16-20-0 That is what I had to look up this morning, should have just waited:whistling:

Thanks RBH, I will continue to try to find 30%, thanks I will stick with 25% after the 45 day period adn we will see what happens. It seems when the Thai's locally Buy Pla Mor they are about four inches in length. If I don't have that in five months going to be a lot of cat fish food in that pond.

That may happen earler depening on what I see. I will do a test catch three months out, then hopefully I will know what to do. I'm intent on trying the overstocking method with cat fish. People make a few baht at it I just have to find what will work for me. The Pla Mor don't seem to be heavy eaters. The food floats through the day they eat it. But no swarming it like you see with pla Duk and Pla Nin

I think the best I can do for the moment is see if the shop will order 30% in large pellets for me.

Any 30% in your area Dom?

I'm really gun shy of trying to store a 100 bags for a year.

My supplier stocks 30% Centagrow brand locally

[ray23]

16-20-0 That is what I had to look up this morning, should have just waited:whistling:

Thanks RBH, I will continue to try to find 30%, thanks I will stick with 25% after the 45 day period adn we will see what happens. It seems when the Thai's locally Buy Pla Mor they are about four inches in length. If I don't have that in five months going to be a lot of cat fish food in that pond.

That may happen earler depening on what I see. I will do a test catch three months out, then hopefully I will know what to do. I'm intent on trying the overstocking method with cat fish. People make a few baht at it I just have to find what will work for me. The Pla Mor don't seem to be heavy eaters. The food floats through the day they eat it. But no swarming it like you see with pla Duk and Pla Nin

I think the best I can do for the moment is see if the shop will order 30% in large pellets for me.

Any 30% in your area Dom?

I'm really gun shy of trying to store a 100 bags for a year.

My supplier stocks 30% Centagrow brand locally

If your in that area can you ask what price he would give me on 30 bags. might just rent a pickip and buy from there

[DonaldBattles]

OD: I need to know more about the 5000 Baht aerator. For sure I will need to aerate.

When the fish have strep how do you know that this is the problem.

[DonaldBattles]

From having read the posting before, I understand that when you see them swimming in a circle before they die that this is a good indication. What was the age of the fry when they died?

I have 3 phase electricity available and would like to know how to make a 5000 Baht aerator.

[ray23]

You can do it for less then that, buy am Ap 180- pump around 3K, a section of garden hose a link of PVC pipe. Driil very small holes in the pipe weight it down anter hook up the connections. Put the pipe in the pond where you want it. Turn it on and yuor done.

Not fancy but mine has worked vrey well for about three years now.

I will check the brand name when I go out there today.

Edited August 31, 2013 by ray23

[tingtong]

Donald,

I read it the way that Ozzydom meant +5000thb cost of electricity aerationg your lake why rearing the tilapia.

I dont read the way he meant 5000 baht aerator.

[ray23]

The system I metioned is low volatge electric, might cost between 500 and 750 month to run. I think Dom uses a deisle pump. But his ponds are a lot bigger then mine. If I want more 02 in it I have back ups, they are all small low voltage pumps. What i saw last year around April I needed more 02.

Along with pond methods I learned on here. Salt, Lime ect.

We didn't have much rain in that year, so I could replace the water as I will do this year, been three years on the big pond so overdue.

Edited August 31, 2013 by ray23

[DonaldBattles]

Ray, if I understand your concept you are using the pump and hoses to recirculate the water. I assume that you mean to take water from the pond to the pump intake and then it gets discharged thru the holes in the PVC pipe. I have several 3 hp pumps that I can use. They hook up is very simple.

Now my lakes are cascading a bit because of the rainy season. The upper lake is about 1.5 m higher than the lower lake. The upper has a discharge (overflow) pipe into the second lake. The second lake has an overflow into the rice field. I have screens on the intake and discharge 10 inch pipes to keep the fish from going through. This movement of water will continue until the rainy season is over. I can also push water from lake to another.

[ozzydom]

OD: I need to know more about the 5000 Baht aerator. For sure I will need to aerate.

When the fish have strep how do you know that this is the problem.

DB, the pumps I am now using are chinese made "whirl charging" air pumps ,I have found that 1 x 370 watt pump will run 40 x 2 inch stones at 70 cm depth.

I am running 2 x 1 rai ponds off that pump with no problem.I am not aware of the actual dimensions of your pond but the ponds I am using that pump on are side by side ,so I mounted the pump in the casa between them and run the pipes diaganally (sp)from corner to corner with 20 x 2inch stones off each , droppers are at 2 metre spacings.

That pump would be great for your application , the pump outlet is 1 1/4inch so you could use 20 x 3 inch stones on 1/4 inch droppers.

The brand I have are Yuting whirl charge hi pressure ,they are available from larger aquarium supplies

the 370 watt pump was 4500 baht and the pvc pipes ,barbs ,stones etc should be about 500 baht ,hence the 5000 baht I mentioned.

I am so pleased with the pumps performance ,I have ordered 2 more.

One will replace a 180 watt which I fitted to a slightly bigger pond but is not quite up to the task as that pond is 125 met long, the 180 watt will then be used to aerate the holding net for sales fish . and the hapas for new stock.

I will try to post a photo of those two ponds,and the aeration layout.

Hopefully someone will give me instructions on posting pics as I have forgotten .

[ozzydom]

From having read the posting before, I understand that when you see them swimming in a circle before they die that this is a good indication. What was the age of the fry when they died?

I have 3 phase electricity available and would like to know how to make a 5000 Baht aerator.

DB as fry there were indications from day of delivery,fry spinning and swimming in in tight circles.

There are many types of streptococcus bacteria but symptoms in larger fish (100 gram upwards ) include popeye,red lesions usually on belly and around tail and fins.sudden mortality which can range from a few fish a day to 50-100% overnight.

Regards the aeration,my primary unit which does all the ponds is based on a 3 hp driven bus aircon circulating rotary pump, but it runs to 10k baht per month running costs, since fitting the new pumps my elecricity bill for pumps and security lighting has come back to less than 2k pm.

[DonaldBattles]

OD, this sounds exactly what I need. I have a large sala between the two ponds and it can sit there and serve one pond at a time. The big question is where in Chiang Rai I will be able to find the air pump. So far, I have not had much luck in finding anything here except feed and small fry. Any help you or others can give me will be greatly appreciated.

[DonaldBattles]

OD, can you tell me what you mean by stones for the air pump set up?

[DonaldBattles]

OD, the stones that I know of are the ones that I use in my aquarium. They are about 2 inches by 2 inches, porous and attach to 1/4 air lines from the compressor. Is this the type of stone you are talking about?

[ozzydom]

OD, can you tell me what you mean by stones for the air pump set up?

Stones are the bubbler stones you see hanging in aquariums on tubing, they are available in sizes from 1 inch to 6 inch diameter.they break the air flow up into thousands of tiny bubbles

[ozzydom]

OD, the stones that I know of are the ones that I use in my aquarium. They are about 2 inches by 2 inches, porous and attach to 1/4 air lines from the compressor. Is this the type of stone you are talking about?

Thats it mate, the idea is to try to replicate what you do in your aquarium as thats all a fish pond is, a bloody big aquarium

If you google" sun sun hi pressure whirl charging air pumps" and scroll down to HG Series you will see the pumps I am referring too.

Edited August 31, 2013 by ozzydom

[DonaldBattles]

OD, can you E-mail me at [email protected] or call me at 081 894 6401. Probably better if I can have a talk with you concerning the air pump.

[ray23]

No Donald I'm piumping air into the water.

I have used the pumps used now for long can't read the labels anymore

[David48]

OD, can you E-mail me at [email protected] or call me at 081 894 6401. Probably better if I can have a talk with you concerning the air pump.

DB ... we are all mates on this tread ... and friendly in the Farming Forum... but best not to post your email or phone number directly ... always best through a Private Message (PM)

[RedBullHorn]

OD: I need to know more about the 5000 Baht aerator. For sure I will need to aerate.

When the fish have strep how do you know that this is the problem.

DB, the pumps I am now using are chinese made "whirl charging" air pumps ,I have found that 1 x 370 watt pump will run 40 x 2 inch stones at 70 cm depth.

I am running 2 x 1 rai ponds off that pump with no problem.I am not aware of the actual dimensions of your pond but the ponds I am using that pump on are side by side ,so I mounted the pump in the casa between them and run the pipes diaganally (sp)from corner to corner with 20 x 2inch stones off each , droppers are at 2 metre spacings.

That pump would be great for your application , the pump outlet is 1 1/4inch so you could use 20 x 3 inch stones on 1/4 inch droppers.

The brand I have are Yuting whirl charge hi pressure ,they are available from larger aquarium supplies

the 370 watt pump was 4500 baht and the pvc pipes ,barbs ,stones etc should be about 500 baht ,hence the 5000 baht I mentioned.

I am so pleased with the pumps performance ,I have ordered 2 more.

One will replace a 180 watt which I fitted to a slightly bigger pond but is not quite up to the task as that pond is 125 met long, the 180 watt will then be used to aerate the holding net for sales fish . and the hapas for new stock.

I will try to post a photo of those two ponds,and the aeration layout.

Hopefully someone will give me instructions on posting pics as I have forgotten .

David~ You're up.

[David48]

No Donald I'm piumping air into the water.

I have used the pumps used now for long can't read the labels anymore

Donald ... there is literally a dozen way to aerate your pond.

The suggestions you have been given thus far are excellent ... but try to understand what you are trying to achieve ... that is getting oxygen to the fish, when they need it the most.

One method is the 'venturi effect' ... see ...

You can do that quite simply when you exchange water into your pond.

Remember also that the oxygen doesn't last for a month, a week ... or even a day.

Just to educate yourself, have a look at ... fish-farming-paddle-wheel-aerators ... it is how the local Farmers do round these parts. Definitely read post #22 from that thread as it discusses about when the oxygen levels, on a daily basis are at their lowest.

EDITED to add ... RBH ... ... same time, thinking the same thing ...

Plus, that thread shows RBH's home made, cheap but efficient solutions.

EDIT #2 ... here I am thinking that RBH wants me to add my 2 cents worth on Pond Aeration ... only to discover that he just want me to give photo posting guidelines ... and

Edited August 31, 2013 by David48

[David48]

I will try to post a photo of those two ponds,and the aeration layout.

Hopefully someone will give me instructions on posting pics as I have forgotten .

od ... currently, I am having only success with the older style where you upload 1 photo at a time.

Tywais has this helpful guide ... posting-images-guidelines

[DonaldBattles]

I really enjoy this forum. I was just afraid that people would get board with my questions and I was over

doing it. this is my first year at fish farming and I am trying hard not to go belly up. There are so many unknown situations and I need all the help I can get from you experienced guys. So far so good. I Just have to get an air pump and get it installed. My over stocking of catfish in the 1 Rai pond may be a problem for me later on. Thanks for all of your help.

[ray23]

First let me say Dom,.has a lot more experience then I do.

When I want additional oxygen I use the stone method. I have three pumps. If the lines are not to long the AP180 will easily run six outlets. ( you have to modify the manifold where the lines attach) to run that many I have small ones I use for holding tanks, when we have fish in them. That is usually for a few days when we first get them.

You think you hvae odd questions you should se the ones I asked before and after we dug that " Bloody Big hole "

Lat year I killed more then I sold trying differernt things. I just try not to make the same mistakes twice. The year it sounds like moving into Pla Mor was a mistake. Lesson learned. I will salvage waht I can from it even if it means cat fish eating them. I will do a test net this mont if they are not an inch, then the cat fish go in using RBJ method.

When I empty nest time I will cement it is so the catfish can't hide in the mud, when we try to catch them.

[RedBullHorn]

First let me say Dom,.has a lot more experience then I do.

When I want additional oxygen I use the stone method. I have three pumps. If the lines are not to long the AP180 will easily run six outlets. ( you have to modify the manifold where the lines attach) to run that many I have small ones I use for holding tanks, when we have fish in them. That is usually for a few days when we first get them.

You think you hvae odd questions you should se the ones I asked before and after we dug that " Bloody Big hole "

Lat year I killed more then I sold trying differernt things. I just try not to make the same mistakes twice. The year it sounds like moving into Pla Mor was a mistake. Lesson learned. I will salvage waht I can from it even if it means cat fish eating them. I will do a test net this mont if they are not an inch, then the cat fish go in using RBH method.

When I empty nest time I will cement it is so the catfish can't hide in the mud, when we try to catch them.

You can try out my Maximizing method but before you do ray, you need to get the rest of the plan right too like planning on how you will sell them, retail means or bulk wholesale, time harvest colliding with market price and conditions.

My method and formula works well...but after 3 trial & error. So you will need tailor-to-suit for your own best result.

Cement and concrete up earthen pond floor is like rearing fishes in above ground concrete tank.

Why would you consider doing that ? Final pond clearing is part of any fish farming. If your mud bed is too much and causes inconvenient during pond clearing, then hire a backhoe to clear it out. I did mine once very three years.

Earthen floor bed is part of the advantages of farming fishes in an earthern pond. It regulates water temperature in the lower half of a pond by absorbing heat during the day and releasing it back during the night. This is an important mechanism applied (especially) during cold season farming.

Edited September 1, 2013 by RedBullHorn

[ray23]

I intend to try your method first. One way to get around the problem might be just putting netting around and on the bottom. That could be a better option and less expensive better for the fish. They couldn't hide in the mud. We don't sale in bulk so daily netting. It's small pond do that wouldn't break the bank.

Thanks for bringing that up I hadn't thought of it

Edited September 1, 2013 by ray23

[RedBullHorn]

Have you heard of the phrase... " Do it once, do it good."

Net in the mud bed !?!!

As you said it is a small pond, bring in the backhoe... Doesn't cost much.

ray23... Thick mud bed are actually fishes' waste and decay matters... Amornia, methyl, nitrogen = nitrite, algea bloom and poor growth performance.

Edited September 1, 2013 by RedBullHorn

[DonaldBattles]

I have reviewed the venturi approach to aeration. I have several 3 horse motors available and to put the venturi tube in line is no problem. However, I believe that the Yuting Whirl air pump is a better approach. At 375 watts it is pulling about 1.56 amps. This has to be a lot more efficient than the 3 hp water pump-venturi combination.

Does anyone have an opinion on this issue of venturi water pump vs air pump and stone distribution.

[David48]

Does anyone have an opinion on this issue of venturi water pump vs air pump and stone distribution.

My opinion is that you employ what works best for you, given the amount of air you need to move and the location of the pond.

The reason that this Farm uses mechanical aeration is that we are near to the end of the power line, when Pa Farmer hits the arc welder ... the personal fan in the Farm House audibly slows due to the voltage drop.

The reason that you might consider the is that not only does it produce the oxygenated water that you want but also disturbs and, if you are lucky, mixes the stratification within the Pond.

If you don't know about 'stratification' then you have read all of the posts recommended here.

We don't use it (venturi water pump) at the Farm because it's all low tech here ... stuff that doesn't break.

Depending on your stocking rates, rainfall, depth of pond and wind, you may not even need aeration.

But you do need to find the best solution for you.

.