Printing Business Failing... Any Advice Or Remedies To Kick It Up ?

[Holysteel]

Hi there everyone,

I have been operating a outdoor printing business for quite awhile..Doing outdoor adverting signs, billboards, banners & such.

It has been not very promising..The profit margin is not much as per se..And the markets are fickly. Wanting dirt cheap, fast & superb quality. Its impossible to cater to such demands.. They do not understand that, with quality. Comes with a price.. But they dun.

There is fierce competitions in the area where i operate the print biz. There is even to the extent that 1-2 print companies monopolized the whole print market in the province.

Be it, the municipal, city hall, amphur, tesaban, governor elections. You name it. They will get all the contracts. Leaving the small odd jobs for the rest of the printing shops to fight over the left overs..

I hope some wise biz veterans will share some light & guidance on this. Or perhaps we can brainstorm something out of this. Making it a success.

Thank you very much

Steel

[MegaRanter]

Any relation to SteelyJoe?

[Holysteel]

Any relation to SteelyJoe?

Nope.

[breadbin]

Seems like all the decent contract are all sewn up and you get very little.

Before opening/buying the business did you not do any market research?

Have you considered, dare I say it, offering free printing as a loss leader to get business? It may be the only way to win decent contracts, otherwise I say take the hit and put it down to a bad experience.

[meatboy]

any inderpendant business in thailand will find it hard,they only know one word cheap,and if you sell cheap and do well someone else will soon do the same near you,if your not making much and working long hours and relying on living off the profit call it a day.

you might try and contact mervyn king at the boe.he will soon be looking for a printer.

[CharlieH]

Easy for people to say why didnt yiu do this or that before, but thats not helpful now,.

There are many questions that need answering and alot more information needed to explore possibilities.

If you want to brainstorm ideas pm me and i,ll chip in my penny worth to try and help.

Best of luck whatever you decide.

[Khun Jean]

Find out what you can do that others cant.

Maybe create some new market, like wall decorations for at home, maybe add a nice frame.

Do custom wallpapers. Maybe look into if it is possible to do prints on car skins, etc.

Get highly specialized, experience and knowledge is the best way to outmaneuver others.

Dare to ask good prices!

[Paul888]

I remember when you originally asked about setting this business up http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/554718-is-running-a-billboard-printing-business-profitable-here-in-thailand/

A lot of people gave you good advice, which was pretty much summed up with "don't do it unless you have specific knowledge of the industry or something special that you can bring to the market"

You were recently asking about setting up prawn farms also? Another business idea you had but appeared to have zero specific knowledge of the business? I don't want to be rude, but you really need to do more research and get some better advice before you start businesses here, and LISTEN to it. No matter how much capital you have, you can still blow it all on wrong investments.

Bottom line is nobody will ever beat a Thai business on price or connections, only chance you have is to beat them on quality or added value and even then plan ahead for when people copy your ideas.

I don't know anything about your background or circumstances, but I suspect that as the machines to this job are pretty expensive, your choices are turn this around quickly, which will be very difficult or look at the best way to salvage as much of your money out of this business. Unless you get lucky and can get some specialist knowledgeable help quickly, selling the business or the equipment may be your best choice.

[simple1]

I used to work in sales for http://www.salmat.com.au Is their an opportunity to move to online distribution of pdf or HTML format documentation and expand to government agencies & corporates within & outside your geographic area of operations? The challenge would be to identify and motivate a proven well connected Thai who fully understands customer communication and the financial benefits

Traditional print has been hammered in western markets with very low profit margins, with a great deal of consolidation. Many have moved to internet based distribution for the likes of high volume markets such as government, telco, insurance & banks. Do not know if this is feasible in Thailand.

[54321]

No one can offer dirt cheap , fast and quality and make money in a competative enviroment. Choose a niche, specialise in one of the three, you ideally need a USP (unique selling point)

be cheap

or

be fast

or

offer high quality

or

(here is a fourth) greese palms.

or

(here is a fifth) deal with foreigners who may appreciate the ease in which they can communicate with you and are prepeared to pay for it (canvas local foreign business owners)

Just my thoughts

In all seriousness, I suspect few people/organisations will give their business to a foreigner (which I am guessing you are) when there is a Thai alternative unless you can offer something that they cannot. The hard facts of business here.

[samran]

Sounds like you aren't in the printing game, you are in the relationships game.

Spend more time cultivating those relationships and then things will start to flow your way. Whether it is enough is a more difficult question.

[davejones]

You started a business where customers want quality at a cheap price, and where 1-2 companies have a monopoly in the whole province. How did you originally plan/expect to make money? You need to do some market research - how many companies have a monopoly, 1 or 2? If you don't know these basic facts, then you will find it very difficult to make money. Customers like sticking with companies they know. If they have had good service and good prices from these 1 or 2 companies for many years, you might find it very difficult to compete with them. Finally, why did you enter this particular industry? Just wondering what experience you have. If you have past experience, then what has worked for you in the past. If you don't have experience, then it may be time to consider a different business.

I think in Thailand, building relationships is much more important than in the West, so you need to have the right contacts.

Edited March 8, 2013 by davejones

[yoshiwara]

I remember when you originally asked about setting this business up http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/554718-is-running-a-billboard-printing-business-profitable-here-in-thailand/

A lot of people gave you good advice, which was pretty much summed up with "don't do it unless you have specific knowledge of the industry or something special that you can bring to the market"

You were recently asking about setting up prawn farms also? Another business idea you had but appeared to have zero specific knowledge of the business? I don't want to be rude, but you really need to do more research and get some better advice before you start businesses here, and LISTEN to it. No matter how much capital you have, you can still blow it all on wrong investments.

Bottom line is nobody will ever beat a Thai business on price or connections, only chance you have is to beat them on quality or added value and even then plan ahead for when people copy your ideas.

I don't know anything about your background or circumstances, but I suspect that as the machines to this job are pretty expensive, your choices are turn this around quickly, which will be very difficult or look at the best way to salvage as much of your money out of this business. Unless you get lucky and can get some specialist knowledgeable help quickly, selling the business or the equipment may be your best choice.

Next stop cash in the machines and open a bar.

[Holysteel]

You started a business where customers want quality at a cheap price, and where 1-2 companies have a monopoly in the whole province. How did you originally plan/expect to make money? You need to do some market research - how many companies have a monopoly, 1 or 2? If you don't know these basic facts, then you will find it very difficult to make money. Customers like sticking with companies they know. If they have had good service and good prices from these 1 or 2 companies for many years, you might find it very difficult to compete with them. Finally, why did you enter this particular industry? Just wondering what experience you have. If you have past experience, then what has worked for you in the past. If you don't have experience, then it may be time to consider a different business.

I think in Thailand, building relationships is much more important than in the West, so you need to have the right contacts.

We have done market research all right. we also have a team of very qualified & experienced crews & latest quality machines to run the operations. One thing is we overestimated our marketing prowess.

We have underestimated our opponents.

We thought that we have all the potential connections covered. And we do have big connections in the govt sector. But in reality, when in comes & get down to results. These govt people can say yes to you now, promising huge contracts. They could change faces with a blink of an eye, or act non chalantant way. Brushing you off in a either yes or no way, the thai style way. either way, its not a 100% guarantee.

Problem with the 1-2 companies that has monopolized the market share, They have a very unique under the table system in place. They give out 2-3 million baht, sometimes even more worth of prints & services to potential election candidate. Or any high rank officials.

Once the guy is elected into powers. That guy is obligate to return the favour to the print companies by sending them continuously govt contracts. & also they (govt) get a cut of the sales too each time.

And that is what we lose out on. We cant afford to throw 2-5 mill baht away, praying & hoping someone will get elected.

We have everything in hand. We are just losing out to the competitors on sales.

Edited March 9, 2013 by Holysteel

[monty]

You started a business where customers want quality at a cheap price, and where 1-2 companies have a monopoly in the whole province. How did you originally plan/expect to make money? You need to do some market research - how many companies have a monopoly, 1 or 2? If you don't know these basic facts, then you will find it very difficult to make money. Customers like sticking with companies they know. If they have had good service and good prices from these 1 or 2 companies for many years, you might find it very difficult to compete with them. Finally, why did you enter this particular industry? Just wondering what experience you have. If you have past experience, then what has worked for you in the past. If you don't have experience, then it may be time to consider a different business.

I think in Thailand, building relationships is much more important than in the West, so you need to have the right contacts.

We have done market research all right. we also have a team of very qualified & experienced crews & latest quality machines to run the operations. One thing is we overestimated our marketing prowess.

We have underestimated our opponents.

We thought that we have all the potential connections covered. And we do have big connections in the govt sector. But in reality, when in comes & get down to results. These govt people can say yes to you now, promising huge contracts. They could change faces with a blink of an eye, or act non chalantant way. Brushing you off in a either yes or no way, the thai style way. either way, its not a 100% guarantee.

Problem with the 1-2 companies that has monopolized the market share, They have a very unique under the table system in place. They give out 2-3 million baht, sometimes even more worth of prints & services to potential election candidate. Or any high rank officials.

Once the guy is elected into powers. That guy is obligate to return the favour to the print companies by sending them continuously govt contracts. & also they (govt) get a cut of the sales too each time.

And that is what we lose out on. We cant afford to throw 2-5 mill baht away, praying & hoping someone will get elected.

We have everything in hand. We are just losing out to the competitors on sales.

It's a well known fact that for getting government contracts, kick backs in the order of 30% are required.

Lots of articles around on how it's killing quality...

[Phronesis]

Forget Thailand.

Market your printing services in high yield markets such as Australia, New Zealand, Germany, Holland and the Scandies.

Focus on high quality niche products such as wedding albums, or modelling portfolios.

But none of these strategies are short term fixes.

Owning printing hardware is a mugs game to begin with, here in Thailand there is little in the way of worthwhile technical or maintanence support...so your machines will depreciate in value far more rapidly than in the west...and you have nothing to offset this depreciation against...

Also the printing hardware model is inherently flawed as there is little opportunity for the business to be scaled, even if it gets busy.

Yep...the advice given to you earlier in this thread is correct...sell up now...

Edited March 9, 2013 by Phronesis

[Khun Jean]

Europe is already taken, as is most of the rest of the world.

Just look at a website like foto.com and you will forget about starting a business making photo albums etc.

Other printing opportunities are also 'taken', because of webshops offering super cheap prices while maintaining high quality.

You would be dependent on a customer that does not do his homework.

Finding a niche is difficult, i also do some printing in a small niche, and not for a Thai market. It goes ok, the main point is that for me it is a side earner and the machine i use is used for many other things. Obviously i am not telling as only 2-3 internet shops offer it.

Low quantity, superior quality, good prices. That combination works for me.

Even if that niche dries up as it probably will one day it will not a be problem. Will just find another.

[rgs2001uk]

You started a business where customers want quality at a cheap price, and where 1-2 companies have a monopoly in the whole province. How did you originally plan/expect to make money? You need to do some market research - how many companies have a monopoly, 1 or 2? If you don't know these basic facts, then you will find it very difficult to make money. Customers like sticking with companies they know. If they have had good service and good prices from these 1 or 2 companies for many years, you might find it very difficult to compete with them. Finally, why did you enter this particular industry? Just wondering what experience you have. If you have past experience, then what has worked for you in the past. If you don't have experience, then it may be time to consider a different business.

I think in Thailand, building relationships is much more important than in the West, so you need to have the right contacts.

We have done market research all right. we also have a team of very qualified & experienced crews & latest quality machines to run the operations. One thing is we overestimated our marketing prowess.

We have underestimated our opponents.

We thought that we have all the potential connections covered. And we do have big connections in the govt sector. But in reality, when in comes & get down to results. These govt people can say yes to you now, promising huge contracts. They could change faces with a blink of an eye, or act non chalantant way. Brushing you off in a either yes or no way, the thai style way. either way, its not a 100% guarantee.

Problem with the 1-2 companies that has monopolized the market share, They have a very unique under the table system in place. They give out 2-3 million baht, sometimes even more worth of prints & services to potential election candidate. Or any high rank officials.

Once the guy is elected into powers. That guy is obligate to return the favour to the print companies by sending them continuously govt contracts. & also they (govt) get a cut of the sales too each time.

And that is what we lose out on. We cant afford to throw 2-5 mill baht away, praying & hoping someone will get elected.

We have everything in hand. We are just losing out to the competitors on sales.

Didnt you partner explain the patronage system that exists here?

Being cheaper and more honest doesnt guarantee more success than your competitors.

Edited March 9, 2013 by rgs2001uk

[ThaidDown]

Problem with the 1-2 companies that has monopolized the market share, They have a very unique under the table system in place. They give out 2-3 million baht, sometimes even more worth of prints & services to potential election candidate. Or any high rank officials.

Once the guy is elected into powers. That guy is obligate to return the favour to the print companies by sending them continuously govt contracts. & also they (govt) get a cut of the sales too each time.

I would not agree that their under the table system is 'unique', I think the more appropriate word is 'normal'. (and well known).

Not defending the practice, just saying what is. This should have been picked up in the initial research and factored into the business model.

Hope you find ways to improve business in other areas.

[Chao Lao Beach]

I dont know if you can do goo image quality, but BLURB is very popular and high end & labor intensive I would imagine.

ie, Made in Thailand at western prices.

[simple1]

You started a business where customers want quality at a cheap price, and where 1-2 companies have a monopoly in the whole province. How did you originally plan/expect to make money? You need to do some market research - how many companies have a monopoly, 1 or 2? If you don't know these basic facts, then you will find it very difficult to make money. Customers like sticking with companies they know. If they have had good service and good prices from these 1 or 2 companies for many years, you might find it very difficult to compete with them. Finally, why did you enter this particular industry? Just wondering what experience you have. If you have past experience, then what has worked for you in the past. If you don't have experience, then it may be time to consider a different business.

I think in Thailand, building relationships is much more important than in the West, so you need to have the right contacts.

We have done market research all right. we also have a team of very qualified & experienced crews & latest quality machines to run the operations. One thing is we overestimated our marketing prowess.

We have underestimated our opponents.

We thought that we have all the potential connections covered. And we do have big connections in the govt sector. But in reality, when in comes & get down to results. These govt people can say yes to you now, promising huge contracts. They could change faces with a blink of an eye, or act non chalantant way. Brushing you off in a either yes or no way, the thai style way. either way, its not a 100% guarantee.

Problem with the 1-2 companies that has monopolized the market share, They have a very unique under the table system in place. They give out 2-3 million baht, sometimes even more worth of prints & services to potential election candidate. Or any high rank officials.

Once the guy is elected into powers. That guy is obligate to return the favour to the print companies by sending them continuously govt contracts. & also they (govt) get a cut of the sales too each time.

And that is what we lose out on. We cant afford to throw 2-5 mill baht away, praying & hoping someone will get elected.

We have everything in hand. We are just losing out to the competitors on sales.

Have you looked at the Universities? Unis always have a need for high volume printing, including high quality output. Is their an opportunity to establish a sole joint marketing initiative, linked with an onsite managed services contract, with one of the larger equipment vendors - good margin for them and you with consumables. Alternatively leased, pay as you use laser printers, on site - again good profit from consumables.

[FarmerJoe]

Have you tried adding advertising to your business. You already have the printers. If you wish, you can p.m. me and I can give you some ideas that will help that have either little or no competition in Thailand.

[samran]

You started a business where customers want quality at a cheap price, and where 1-2 companies have a monopoly in the whole province. How did you originally plan/expect to make money? You need to do some market research - how many companies have a monopoly, 1 or 2? If you don't know these basic facts, then you will find it very difficult to make money. Customers like sticking with companies they know. If they have had good service and good prices from these 1 or 2 companies for many years, you might find it very difficult to compete with them. Finally, why did you enter this particular industry? Just wondering what experience you have. If you have past experience, then what has worked for you in the past. If you don't have experience, then it may be time to consider a different business.

I think in Thailand, building relationships is much more important than in the West, so you need to have the right contacts.

We have done market research all right. we also have a team of very qualified & experienced crews & latest quality machines to run the operations. One thing is we overestimated our marketing prowess.

We have underestimated our opponents.

We thought that we have all the potential connections covered. And we do have big connections in the govt sector. But in reality, when in comes & get down to results. These govt people can say yes to you now, promising huge contracts. They could change faces with a blink of an eye, or act non chalantant way. Brushing you off in a either yes or no way, the thai style way. either way, its not a 100% guarantee.

Problem with the 1-2 companies that has monopolized the market share, They have a very unique under the table system in place. They give out 2-3 million baht, sometimes even more worth of prints & services to potential election candidate. Or any high rank officials.

Once the guy is elected into powers. That guy is obligate to return the favour to the print companies by sending them continuously govt contracts. & also they (govt) get a cut of the sales too each time.

And that is what we lose out on. We cant afford to throw 2-5 mill baht away, praying & hoping someone will get elected.

We have everything in hand. We are just losing out to the competitors on sales.

Taking a step back, to be able to offer contracts to the government you have to be a formally recognised supplier to government, which requires registration at the Public Debt Management Office, Ministry of Finance. Look them up, there is a online registration tool.