Honda Pcx 125 Help Requested

[patekatek]

First off, I am no motorcycle guru. I am hoping that there are some gurus on this forum to help with a couple questions I have regarding a used Honda PCX Prestige. The bike was purchased new in May of 2011 and has 2,679 original km on it. The owner upgraded the headlights to halogen, installed a "OVER Racing Project-Japan" exhaust that has an adjustable baffle in it. He told us he paid over 7,000 baht for the muffler. He also indicated it has ABS for brakes. Custom handle bars and mirrors, and he has a custom seat on it.

I forgot to ask him if the shocks are stock or custom. I may have to call him about that question.

My Thai wife looked at the green book and the dealer service book. 1,000 km service was done at the dealership. No loan on the bike.

My questions are:

1) Will this custom performance exhaust increase the performance or is it for show?

2) Would this Honda have the EsP engine?

3) Are ABS brakes available for this bike and if so, are they an expensive add-on?

And, lastly, he is firm at 60,000 baht with the add-ons/upgrades. Or, he will reinstall the original equipment and drop down to 55,000 baht.

I have to make a decision within a day or two so any timely information would be appreciated.

Thanks!

don

[MrJ]

just but the brand new PCX 150Cc for 76.5k with 3 years warranty - better bike and no headache at all, this modified bike consumes more fuel and lost all warranties. I owned a 125 and 150Cc and now on a Forza 300Cc

[Thailaw]

just but the brand new PCX 150Cc for 76.5k with 3 years warranty - better bike and no headache at all, this modified bike consumes more fuel and lost all warranties. I owned a 125 and 150Cc and now on a Forza 300Cc

The PCX that the OP is looking at should have a full year left on the Mfg's warranty, and the kilometers are very low. And I see/feel very little difference between the PCX125 and the 150 -- I have both (and a Forza). With a B20,000 lower price, a full year's warranty and very low kilometers on the clock, the PCX125 the OP is looking at is probably a better buy than a new 150 IMHO. The shocks on the PCX pictured are not stock, but I am not sure what they are . They look pretty good and should be much better than the stock PCX shocks. The PCX did not come with ABS brakes and I have bever heard of them being added. The PCX comes with "combi brakes", which is probably what the seller meant. So, I would assume if I were you that it does not have ABS brakes.

Almost everything else that has been added is strictly "for show" and does nothing for the performance of the bike. The seat is probably better than the stock seat, but the design is not especialy comfortable for a taller person (you can't slide back in the seat), and the brown trim really looks like crap (literally). You can change that to black for very little money, but you would need to have the seat recovered also, which could be B1000+ if it is done right. But if you like the seat and the style add-ons, the B5,000 difference in price is pretty good when considering what they cost to buy. I am not sure about the exhaust, but I can't imagine it does too much to improve the performance of the PCX. But the performamce of the PCX125 is pretty good in any event. All considered, assuming that it looks as good as the pictures indicate, I think that the price is "reasonable" for what the bike is. I am not into all of the "styling add-ons" and chrome plated plastic parts, but I would probably buy it "as shown" or I wouldn't buy it.

Edited April 13, 2013 by Thailaw

[MrJ]

just but the brand new PCX 150Cc for 76.5k with 3 years warranty - better bike and no headache at all, this modified bike consumes more fuel and lost all warranties. I owned a 125 and 150Cc and now on a Forza 300Cc

The PCX that the OP is looking at should have a full year left on the Mfg's warranty, and the kilometers are very low. And I see/feel very little difference between the PCX125 and the 150 -- I have both (and a Forza). With a B20,000 lower price, a full year's warranty and very low kilometers on the clock, the PCX125 the OP is looking at is probably a better buy than a new 150 IMHO. The shocks on the PCX pictured are not stock, but I am not sure what they are . They look pretty good and should be much better than the stock PCX shocks. The PCX did not come with ABS brakes and I have bever heard of them being added. The PCX comes with "combi brakes", which is probably what the seller meant. So, I would assume if I were you that it does not have ABS brakes.

Almost everything else that has been added is strictly "for show" and does nothing for the performance of the bike. The seat is probably better than the stock seat, but the design is not especialy comfortable for a taller person (you can't slide back in the seat), and the brown trim really looks like crap (literally). You can change that to black for very little money, but you would need to have the seat recovered also, which could be B1000+ if it is done right. But if you like the seat and the style add-ons, the B5,000 difference in price is pretty good when considering what they cost to buy. I am not sure about the exhaust, but I can't imagine it does too much to improve the performance of the PCX. But the performamce of the PCX125 is pretty good in any event. All considered, assuming that it looks as good as the pictures indicate, I think that the price is "reasonable" for what the bike is. I am not into all of the "styling add-ons" and chrome plated plastic parts, but I would probably buy it "as shown" or I wouldn't buy it.

wrong - all warranty is lost after modification

[Greeen]

That Over exhaust is actually priced at around 5,500 baht and it is just for sound and show, it will actually decrease the bikes performance considerably!

upgraded exhausts and air filters are a bad idea on the PCX, don't waste your money on them...

PCX has combi brakes not ABS

in my experience it is not worth 60k, the only upgrade I can see are the shocks and they don't look too good either, and those wing mirrors are too small to see out of, especially at night!

get the bike back to standard for 55k but don't waste your money on the upgraded bike as it will be really slow and use a lot of fuel

or for a little more money you could buy a 150 as it has a better fuel injection system and is faster

Edited April 14, 2013 by Greeen

[loserlazer]

Go for a pcx 150. You can find a second hand one for 50 - 55 k as one of my friends got one pcx 150 for 50 k flat recently.

125 is underpowered and mods does not worth anything.

Check mocyc.com.

[Shurup]

That's true, don't look at the upgrades when buying a bike, while they may cost a lot to do them, they don't add much value during resale. Compare it to other similar stock bikes to see if it's priced fairly.

If the 150 model can really be had for the same amount, go with 150 as it in stock form will have more power than the modded 125.

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[Thailaw]

just but the brand new PCX 150Cc for 76.5k with 3 years warranty - better bike and no headache at all, this modified bike consumes more fuel and lost all warranties. I owned a 125 and 150Cc and now on a Forza 300Cc

The PCX that the OP is looking at should have a full year left on the Mfg's warranty, and the kilometers are very low. And I see/feel very little difference between the PCX125 and the 150 -- I have both (and a Forza). With a B20,000 lower price, a full year's warranty and very low kilometers on the clock, the PCX125 the OP is looking at is probably a better buy than a new 150 IMHO. The shocks on the PCX pictured are not stock, but I am not sure what they are . They look pretty good and should be much better than the stock PCX shocks. The PCX did not come with ABS brakes and I have bever heard of them being added. The PCX comes with "combi brakes", which is probably what the seller meant. So, I would assume if I were you that it does not have ABS brakes.

Almost everything else that has been added is strictly "for show" and does nothing for the performance of the bike. The seat is probably better than the stock seat, but the design is not especialy comfortable for a taller person (you can't slide back in the seat), and the brown trim really looks like crap (literally). You can change that to black for very little money, but you would need to have the seat recovered also, which could be B1000+ if it is done right. But if you like the seat and the style add-ons, the B5,000 difference in price is pretty good when considering what they cost to buy. I am not sure about the exhaust, but I can't imagine it does too much to improve the performance of the PCX. But the performamce of the PCX125 is pretty good in any event. All considered, assuming that it looks as good as the pictures indicate, I think that the price is "reasonable" for what the bike is. I am not into all of the "styling add-ons" and chrome plated plastic parts, but I would probably buy it "as shown" or I wouldn't buy it.

wrong - all warranty is lost after modification

Nonsense -- a waranty is "lost" (voided) by a modification to the bike to the extent that the modification caused or added to the damage for which repair is claimed under the warranty. If I change the wheels that will have no effect on the warranty if the engine blows up; likewise, if I change the exhaust it will have no effect on the warranty if the front fork collapses. And most people will keep the stock exhaust and replace it before taking the bike back to the dealer for any warranty work on the engine.

[patekatek]

Thanks to all who have shared their experiences and knowledge about upgrades, add-ons, warranty info, etc.

Based on the feedback I think I will wait with cash in hand for a good buy on a used, original, PCX 150 and hopefully one will show up in the next few weeks.

I hope everyone stays safe on the roads during the Songkran mayhem.

don

[Shurup]

Nonsense -- a waranty is "lost" (voided) by a modification to the bike to the extent that the modification caused or added to the damage for which repair is claimed under the warranty. If I change the wheels that will have no effect on the warranty if the engine blows up; likewise, if I change the exhaust it will have no effect on the warranty if the front fork collapses. And most people will keep the stock exhaust and replace it before taking the bike back to the dealer for any warranty work on the engine.

Logically you're correct, but logic doesn't apply in Thailand. I'm sure it will be up to a particular dealer to decide if the warranty is void or not. I've read a story when a big car maker was voiding the warranty just because a customer didn't do the scheduled oil change at their shop. I don't remember what the issue with vehicle was but not engine related.

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Edited April 14, 2013 by Shurup

[VocalNeal]

7,000 is right for the exhaust but not worth 7000 when on the bike maybe 1/2. Same goes for all the other bits. Exhaust will improve performance if the variator is modified to allow the engine to fullfill its full potential.

Probably yes to the voided warranty.

[BSJ]

All the bling on a second hand bike is worth a grand total of.......0. That's a zero. So that puts it's value at somewhere around 50k baht.

[patekatek]

It seems as though everyone selling something, Thai or farang, gets caught up in notion that their used vehicle is worth just about the same as a new vehicle or what they originally paid for it. I really appreciate everyone's feedback and hope to end up with a PCX 150 that is a reasonable deal. If I can't get that, then I go to the dealer and order one.

[guzzi850m2]

It seems as though everyone selling something, Thai or farang, gets caught up in notion that their used vehicle is worth just about the same as a new vehicle or what they originally paid for it. I really appreciate everyone's feedback and hope to end up with a PCX 150 that is a reasonable deal. If I can't get that, then I go to the dealer and order one.

That's sounds like a good idea getting a 150 and as stock as possible.

My 150 from last year is still 100% stock and I find no need to spend thousand's of bath on extra's.

I see a lot of heavy modified PCX's in Pattaya, some look quite cool.

I will buy after market rear absorbers later as the original ones are too soft and bottoms out easily but since I ride in Pattaya not a major problem.

It is also best to do all your modifications after your own taste so you get exactly the look you want.

I was just about to buy a 125 but then I read about the 150 coming out so I decided to wait (6-8 month) and I am glad I did.

[Thailaw]

It seems as though everyone selling something, Thai or farang, gets caught up in notion that their used vehicle is worth just about the same as a new vehicle or what they originally paid for it. I really appreciate everyone's feedback and hope to end up with a PCX 150 that is a reasonable deal. If I can't get that, then I go to the dealer and order one.

That's sounds like a good idea getting a 150 and as stock as possible.

My 150 from last year is still 100% stock and I find no need to spend thousand's of bath on extra's.

I see a lot of heavy modified PCX's in Pattaya, some look quite cool.

I will buy after market rear absorbers later as the original ones are too soft and bottoms out easily but since I ride in Pattaya not a major problem.

It is also best to do all your modifications after your own taste so you get exactly the look you want.

I was just about to buy a 125 but then I read about the 150 coming out so I decided to wait (6-8 month) and I am glad I did.

While most of the "bling" on a PCX is not worth much, there are three items that have real value -- a good, well designed seat, better shocks and the rear grab bar. The standard seat and shocks on the PCX have real problems, and the upgrades provide much improvement in the ride. There are no hooks or places to hook bungee cords on the PCX, which can be a real problem. By adding the grab bar to the rear, you have 4 strong anchors to carry extra cargo and secure with bungee cords. And it looks really good also (IMHO). I, and I think most buyers that know what they are doing, would pay at least half of the new cost for a good comfortable seat, upgraded shocks and the rear grab bar, assuming that they are in very good condition, as the buyer would want to add these items soon after purchase in any event. The rest of the stuff is worth little and the modified exhaust is best to avoid.

[guzzi850m2]

While most of the "bling" on a PCX is not worth much, there are three items that have real value -- a good, well designed seat, better shocks and the rear grab bar. The standard seat and shocks on the PCX have real problems, and the upgrades provide much improvement in the ride. There are no hooks or places to hook bungee cords on the PCX, which can be a real problem. By adding the grab bar to the rear, you have 4 strong anchors to carry extra cargo and secure with bungee cords. And it looks really good also (IMHO). I, and I think most buyers that know what they are doing, would pay at least half of the new cost for a good comfortable seat, upgraded shocks and the rear grab bar, assuming that they are in very good condition, as the buyer would want to add these items soon after purchase in any event. The rest of the stuff is worth little and the modified exhaust is best to avoid.

I find the original seat good enough and like the little bump which give slight back support.

I never do major shopping on mine so don't need bungee cords.

The rear shocks are no good I agree, with my wife & I (app 150 kg) they bottom out way too easily.

[patekatek]

I continue to thank everyone for their input. Some topics or suggestions are things I have not even thought about and they make good sense to consider in regards to either a new or used 150 PCX.

At our local Honda dealer.....now 2 month wait but the price is still about 74,000 baht all in. The biggest problem is the continuing decline of the U.S. dollar against the baht. Unbelievable how the baht continues its' march towards the edge of the cliff.

[englishteacher556]

You can buy my Honda PCX 150 for 60,000 - just 6 months old with 4,600 kilometres. I listed it yesterday.

[englishteacher556]

I have kept my PCX 150 totally stock. You need to bear in mind that when Honda design a bike the components they use are for a reason. This reason is to enhance the bikes performance in the best way possible. This is HONDA remember. My Father, now deceased, was a Warranty Engineer for BMW. They wold not cover any vehicle with modifications on the basis that the modification may cause another component to not work correctly leading on that an associated component, not connected to the modification, may fail. I had a PCX 125 first and then upgraded to the PCX 150 and there is no comparison with performance. I am moving up again now and although not sure which to bike to buy next, it will definitely be a Honda. I have also bought my Thai Girlfriend a Honda Zoomer X which is great fun.

[Shurup]

I have kept my PCX 150 totally stock. You need to bear in mind that when Honda design a bike the components they use are for a reason. This reason is to enhance the bikes performance in the best way possible.

...

Actually if Honda or any other big name were making their bikes, cars, etc, with the best performance in mind, there would be no room for aftermarket performance enhancing companies...

Manufacturers have the reliability in mind and it's on the opposite end of the balance scales.

[englishteacher556]

Shurup I don't disagree with you at all but enhancements often need complimentary parts which are an additional cost. I and my Son am famed for initially organising the ONLY BMW Mini Show in the UK with acknowledgements in the national press and TV. My son is fanatical about upgrades and modifications. The last cost him dearly. What should have been, in his mind simple, has lead to his car being off the road for 6 months with qualified Technicians scratching their heads how to make complimentary adjustments to a car which should have been left as stock. But, boys will be boys and Sons never listen to their Dads. Leave it as stock and keep the reliability is my motto

[marstons]

Quite a few of these mod exhausts ending up in the police pounds confiscated and exhaust removed as not standard equipment and may effect emissions levels etc. Putting these kind of mods on gives the BIB another reason to stop you.

[Thailaw]

I have kept my PCX 150 totally stock. You need to bear in mind that when Honda design a bike the components they use are for a reason. This reason is to enhance the bikes performance in the best way possible. This is HONDA remember. My Father, now deceased, was a Warranty Engineer for BMW. They wold not cover any vehicle with modifications on the basis that the modification may cause another component to not work correctly leading on that an associated component, not connected to the modification, may fail. I had a PCX 125 first and then upgraded to the PCX 150 and there is no comparison with performance. I am moving up again now and although not sure which to bike to buy next, it will definitely be a Honda. I have also bought my Thai Girlfriend a Honda Zoomer X which is great fun.

Your post with respect to warranty coverage and voiding the warranty by modification of the vehicle is too vague and has too many "and's, or's, if's and but's" to be useful, and as regards BMW is purely wrong. From the 2010 (US) BMW "Service and Warranty" Information pamphlet that specifies exclusions from the warranty on a new BMW: "“Damage which results from negligence, improper operation of the vehicle, wear and tear or deterioration due to driving habits or conditions, improper repair, environmental influences, flood, accident or fire damage, road salt corrosion, alteration, installation of non-genuine BMW accessories, or use of improper, poor quality or contaminated fuel.” (emphasis added). The damage must "result from" -- there must be a reasonable relationship between the modification that has been made and the damage for which warranty coverage repair is being sought. "Reasonable relationship " is usually accepted to mean "a relationship that a reasonable person with knowledge and experience would believe exists under similar circumstances; that which is according to reason; not arbitrary or capricious". To deny a warranty claim because an added part "could have affected another part in some unknown or unexplained way" is not reasonable and would not be allowed.

If I replace a screw in the door handle of my new BMW which has fallen out with a 2 Cent screw from the local hardware store, because the BMW dealer is an hour's drive from my home and requires an appointment 1 week in advance, and as a result the dealer denies a warranty claim on my engine, he would without question lose in court. He might be able (if he was a real butt) to deny my warranty claim to replace the cracked door handle because the screw was too long and cracked the handle (I seriously doubt he would do so and lose a potential customer, but he probably could).

Warranties are part of the vehicle sales contract, and must be administered in accordance with that agreement and with applicable law. And, in general, the contract terms must be "reasonable" or it would be seen a a "contract of adhesion" (see Unfair Contract Terms Act, B.E. 2540 (1997)). Denying a warranty claim when there is no reasonable relationship between a modification made to the vehicle and the damage to the vehicle for which a warrany repair is being sought is wrong, unreasonable, and will not stand. Dealers can get away with it in Thailand (and other places) because the cost of pursuing a warranty claim that has been denied is in most cases far greater than the cost of the repair itself. In most cases, customer "good will" will ensure the right result occurs, but not always.

I won't comment on Honda and its choice of components to "enhance the bikes performance in the best way possible". It's out of my field. You should do the same on warranties. I will say, however, that the rear shocks and seat on the PCX suck, and, Honda or not, really do need to be replaced (at least most owners/riders think so, including me). And I have no worry that by changing my rear shocks on my PCX that I have (Buddha forbid) voided my warranty. Next.....

Edited April 23, 2013 by Thailaw

[Thailaw]

I have kept my PCX 150 totally stock. You need to bear in mind that when Honda design a bike the components they use are for a reason. This reason is to enhance the bikes performance in the best way possible.

...

Actually if Honda or any other big name were making their bikes, cars, etc, with the best performance in mind, there would be no room for aftermarket performance enhancing companies...

Manufacturers have the reliability in mind and it's on the opposite end of the balance scales.

Manufacturers try to balance many variables in designing and building a motorbike -- performance, reliability, style and curb appeal, and also cost. Honda could probably make a bike that performs as well as (or better than) a BMW if it wanted to charge a BMW price. But they have chosen, I think rightly, to target the middle of the market and sell ten times as many bikes as BMW. The balance between all of the variables is sometimes not "perfect" -- at least it may not suit a particular owner/rider. So, that owner modifies the bike to better suit his own tastes and preferences -- he gets a bike that is closer to what he wants and is happy -- that's great. And sometimes manufacturers <deleted> up -- yes, even Honda! There are many manufacturers' recalls on bikes every year -- why did Honda change the PCX from 125cc to 150cc after having only introduced it 2+ years earlier? You mean that the 125cc wasn't "perfect"? -- but it's a Honda! To think that what comes from the manufactures is perfection reincarnated and cannot be improved is nonsense -- even Honda will improve its bikes year-on-year.

You need to know (or get some advice from someone that does know) what the total effect on the bike is from a particular modification and do it correctly, but if you are comfortable that the modification will improve the performance and not damage the bike in the process, go for it! And yes, maintaining the warranty's validity is also a issue to be considered, as has been mentioned earlier in this thread. Many PCX owners change the variator and I hear that change adds a lot to performance. I haven't done that as I am very happy with the acceleration and handling of my PCX (both my 125 and my 150). But if I thought that the acceleration was inadequate, I would seriously check into it. I have changed the shocks and seat on my PCX and it makes a real difference in the ride. I don't like all the bling, but riding a stylish bike does add to the fun, which is largely what having a bike is all about (at least to me).

Edited April 23, 2013 by Thailaw

[englishteacher556]

Wow! You just reminded me why I stopped using this forum a couple of years ago. Zzzzzzzz.... Bye

[Shurup]

I have kept my PCX 150 totally stock. You need to bear in mind that when Honda design a bike the components they use are for a reason. This reason is to enhance the bikes performance in the best way possible.

...

Actually if Honda or any other big name were making their bikes, cars, etc, with the best performance in mind, there would be no room for aftermarket performance enhancing companies...

Manufacturers have the reliability in mind and it's on the opposite end of the balance scales.

Manufacturers try to balance many variables in designing and building a motorbike -- performance, reliability, style and curb appeal, and also cost. Honda could probably make a bike that performs as well as (or better than) a BMW if it wanted to charge a BMW price. But they have chosen, I think rightly, to target the middle of the market and sell ten times as many bikes as BMW. The balance between all of the variables is sometimes not "perfect" -- at least it may not suit a particular owner/rider. So, that owner modifies the bike to better suit his own tastes and preferences -- he gets a bike that is closer to what he wants and is happy -- that's great. And sometimes manufacturers <deleted> up -- yes, even Honda! There are many manufacturers' recalls on bikes every year -- why did Honda change the PCX from 125cc to 150cc after having only introduced it 2+ years earlier? You mean that the 125cc wasn't "perfect"? -- but it's a Honda! To think that what comes from the manufactures is perfection reincarnated and cannot be improved is nonsense -- even Honda will improve its bikes year-on-year.

...

Not sure if this is in response to my post or if this is just a general response to the tread, but Honda (especially Honda) is known for it's reliability, not the performance so they aren't really that much balanced and that's why I don't buy Honda products. Sure they also make the high performance vehicles and sure every manufacturer has a <deleted> up once in a while, even Honda. I never said anything about any perfection (which can vary from a user to a user) so which part of my reply is a nonsense?

[Thailaw]

I have kept my PCX 150 totally stock. You need to bear in mind that when Honda design a bike the components they use are for a reason. This reason is to enhance the bikes performance in the best way possible.

...

Actually if Honda or any other big name were making their bikes, cars, etc, with the best performance in mind, there would be no room for aftermarket performance enhancing companies...

Manufacturers have the reliability in mind and it's on the opposite end of the balance scales.

Manufacturers try to balance many variables in designing and building a motorbike -- performance, reliability, style and curb appeal, and also cost. Honda could probably make a bike that performs as well as (or better than) a BMW if it wanted to charge a BMW price. But they have chosen, I think rightly, to target the middle of the market and sell ten times as many bikes as BMW. The balance between all of the variables is sometimes not "perfect" -- at least it may not suit a particular owner/rider. So, that owner modifies the bike to better suit his own tastes and preferences -- he gets a bike that is closer to what he wants and is happy -- that's great. And sometimes manufacturers <deleted> up -- yes, even Honda! There are many manufacturers' recalls on bikes every year -- why did Honda change the PCX from 125cc to 150cc after having only introduced it 2+ years earlier? You mean that the 125cc wasn't "perfect"? -- but it's a Honda! To think that what comes from the manufactures is perfection reincarnated and cannot be improved is nonsense -- even Honda will improve its bikes year-on-year.

...

Not sure if this is in response to my post or if this is just a general response to the tread, but Honda (especially Honda) is known for it's reliability, not the performance so they aren't really that much balanced and that's why I don't buy Honda products. Sure they also make the high performance vehicles and sure every manufacturer has a <deleted> up once in a while, even Honda. I never said anything about any perfection (which can vary from a user to a user) so which part of my reply is a nonsense?

My post was not in response to your post, but to that of Nicktaylor, whose posts (at least on this thread) have been "nonsense" (or worse). Sorry if I confused you on that point. I am generally a Honda fan, and value reliability, but I also like performance. I think I get both from Honda, and to my taste, Honda balances reliability, performamce and cost/price pretty well. I might tinker around the edges, but the basic product that Honda provides is pretty solid IMHO. YMMV.