Should We Learn The Language?

[StreetCowboy]

Which Thai language will you learn?

Southern, Issan, Central or Lanna?

City or village or Hill-tribe?

Chances of your loved one or her family speaking Central Thai as a first language are practically zero.

Speaking some backwoods dialect will do you no good at all in any city or other area of the country.

I don;'t see why you assume that all TV posters are the same as yourself. My wife is university educated, about the same age and me, and certainly not from the boondocks of Isaan or somesuch. Lao or Isaan dialect would do me no good whatsoever with the in-laws - they'd look .at me like I was mad!

to be honest, I think reading is as important as speaking. Speaking you can replace with pointing and sign language. Reading is irreplaceable.

SC

i think reading is optional but most important is speaking. since quite some time i have the urge to discuss with our gardener the latest technical publications on "increasing gas turbine efficiency". i would be also very interested to hear his opinions whether "quantitative easing in combination with the financial crisis in Cyprus will break up the European Union".

that's why i have set my mind on learning Thai, no matter how many decades it will take. after all, our gardener is still a young man and most probably still alive once i master the required level.

So long as uyou can point out the Merc that you want, why do you need to speak? He's a bloody gardener - it's his job to speak the necessary languages to complete his duties. I hope he's a mason, as well

SC

[Neeranam]

Which Thai language will you learn?

Southern, Issan, Central or Lanna?

City or village or Hill-tribe?

Chances of your loved one or her family speaking Central Thai as a first language are practically zero.

Speaking some backwoods dialect will do you no good at all in any city or other area of the country.

I don;'t see why you assume that all TV posters are the same as yourself. My wife is university educated, about the same age and me, and certainly not from the boondocks of Isaan or somesuch. Lao or Isaan dialect would do me no good whatsoever with the in-laws - they'd look .at me like I was mad!

to be honest, I think reading is as important as speaking. Speaking you can replace with pointing and sign language. Reading is irreplaceable.

SC

i think reading is optional but most important is speaking. since quite some time i have the urge to discuss with our gardener the latest technical publications on "increasing gas turbine efficiency". i would be also very interested to hear his opinions whether "quantitative easing in combination with the financial crisis in Cyprus will break up the European Union".

that's why i have set my mind on learning Thai, no matter how many decades it will take. after all, our gardener is still a young man and most probably still alive once i master the required level.

"speaking Thai is very important!" i was told. a Farang (aka Farong, Falung, Ferang, Foleng, Furlong...) ordering his noodle soup with a street vendor using Thai gets a discount of 5 Baht. if he uses any other language, including sign language, he will pay a hefty surcharge of 5 Baht added to the base price of 25 Baht and the soup served in a bowl that was not washed in dirty water.

i was also told speaking Thai to a barber during a haircut, will cause the barber to return any generous tip, say 5 or even 10 Baht, with the remark "you keep it Khun Farang".

with all that good advice i might try today to greet my wife (after she gets up) with a thundering "gooood morning crap, Khun Mia!" notwithstanding the fact that she might answer "have you finally gone completely bonkers or do you keep some illegal booze hidden somewhere?"

I really can't understand your need to show your financial standing in so many posts. It certainly doesn't impress me but might those in the Banking forum.

Your gardener is a human being and we all possess different qualities. Wouldn't you like to talk to him about how you want the rose bed around your summer house, or your maze hedge height? Or ask him about his family?

What you're really saying is that you are better educated, financially better off and better than these pesky Siamese. Why on earth should someone so elevated lower themselves to learning their language, as they have nothing to say.

This divide that you widen with your refusal or inability to learn Thai is just going to get wider and wider.

Why not simply say what you mean - that you/we shouldn't learn Thai as we are above them educationally, financially and culturally.

[bifftastic]

Which Thai language will you learn?

Southern, Issan, Central or Lanna?

City or village or Hill-tribe?

Chances of your loved one or her family speaking Central Thai as a first language are practically zero.

Speaking some backwoods dialect will do you no good at all in any city or other area of the country.

You end up learning central Thai, and all her relatives chat away with each other in another dialect that you still can't speak or understand.

Once you learn central Thai, and begin to speak with Thai people in Thai, you will begin to discover the other dialects.

This becomes possible because you will hear the difference and can ask "What does that mean?" (in Thai) and then you will get an explanation as in "In Central Thai it would be x y or z, but in <insert dialect> they say a b or c.

This then broadens your knowledge and understanding.

That is, of course, only applicable if you wish to broaden your knowledge and understanding.

If you're content to continue thinking that people who speak different Thai dialects are 'lo so' and not worth talking to because they haven't learned your language, then don't bother learning any of it and sit bemused whilst life goes on around you.

Personally, I find that people who can speak two or more languages are usually very bright and have a lot of interesting things to say, it just so happens that one of those languages might not be English.

My neighbour, for instance, speaks, reads, and writes Thai, Lao (mainly Laos Lao but knows some of the Isaan variations as well), Kammeuang (Northern Thai, which has a very beautiful and distinct script) and it's only since I have been able to speak some Thai that we have had the chance to talk about anything more than "hot isn't it?" "yes, very hot".

Talking to people is good for you, listening to them is even better. Understanding them is priceless.

[topt]

I couldnt live here without speaking thai and I really wonder how people that dont speak manage to live here, not get frustrated or riped off all the time

i wonder how frustrated Thais get who would like to rip me off and find out that "no business and therefore rip off no can do" if they don't master a language in which i can communicate too.

In English, we say "browned off", not "riped off", but luckily, English is a very forgiving language, and you can make yourself understood even if your pronunciation, spelling and grammar are that of a Johnny Foreigner. Chinese is not like that. I don't know about Thai.

Talking of pidgen English, has anyone seen Jake?

SC

SC - unlike you or is there a meaning I am not seeing as it is too early

browned off = fed up, frustrated

ripped off = taken advantage off, normally paying too much for something

or are you talking Scottish........

[Neeranam]

I couldnt live here without speaking thai and I really wonder how people that dont speak manage to live here, not get frustrated or riped off all the time

i wonder how frustrated Thais get who would like to rip me off and find out that "no business and therefore rip off no can do" if they don't master a language in which i can communicate too.

In English, we say "browned off", not "riped off", but luckily, English is a very forgiving language, and you can make yourself understood even if your pronunciation, spelling and grammar are that of a Johnny Foreigner. Chinese is not like that. I don't know about Thai.

Talking of pidgen English, has anyone seen Jake?

SC

SC - unlike you or is there a meaning I am not seeing as it is too early

browned off = fed up, frustrated

ripped off = taken advantage off, normally paying too much for something

or are you talking Scottish........

I'm Scottish and never heard anyone use browned off.

[theblether]

Fluency is difficult, the tonal aspect of Thai ( and other Asian languages ) is effectively a cunning barrier against learning for we of a Western extract.

This issue has been the topic of conversation a few times in the last few days in my residence/hotel. My attitude is that it's retarded not to be able to count to 10 in Thai, not to know the words for left and right, not to be able to return a greeting in Thai.

Seriously, think about it........" I've lived here for three years and I can't count to 10 ".

Shocking and ignorant.......shame can be a good motivator to learn.

[gpdjohn]

I'm getting pretty good at conversational Thai and living in a small village it has helped me beyond bounds. I'm trying to learn how to read but find it's difficult.

As other have stated it has opened up a whole new world.

Some funny little things along the way in my learning adventures... Master monk at my MIL's temple who speaks English well, told my mother in law "You should learn English so that you may speak with him.."

Another time I went to the little market in the center of the village to buy dog food and some smokes. No problem until the owner's daughter asked me as to home much in weight did I want...ah..ah..a.. I stuttered, she walked over to me ( I was sitting on my Vespa ) and in perfect English asked "how much do you want?"

I was dumbfounded at first..I actually thought she has said it in Thai and I had become so good in understanding it but within a nano second it then registered in my pea brain. "Where did you learn to speak English" I asked...

"University of Oklahoma" she replied.

My cousin told me he wouldn't talk to me until I spoke Thai, but turned out he was one of my best teachers.

[toybits]

A Thai woman married to a German and lives is Germany is expected to learn Deutsch. Same with the Netherlands - Immigrants are expected to learn Dutch. If the immigrant is living in the UK, they are also expected to learn English. So why should Thailand be any different? Live in Thailand? Then learn to at least speak THAI. No rocket science required there....

[asiaexpat]

Turn the question on its head. Do you expect foreigners who live in your home country as residents rather than as tourists to try and learn your language? Do you complain about those who won't?

That was addressed in the OP, yes i expect foreigners in my home country to speak the native language. It just seems many foreigners here in Thailand dont think the should learn the language and my question was to gauge that sentiment.

You have carefully avoided saying which language variant you think foreigners should learn.

It's like saying everyone that moves to Canada should learn English, not much use if you live in Quebec (they speak French).

Or everyone that moves to Belgium should learn French, not much use if you move to Flanders (they speak Flemish).

Even countries like Italy spoke 3 completely separate languages until the 1950s

(A situation very similar to modern day Thailand)

But everyone of those countries has a legal language and all the people speak and understand it. You seem to have a very limited knowledge of any place other than USA. And as for Thailand, even the hill tribe people speak and understand central Thai if you take the time to actually meet them rather than accepting your very wrong bias as truth. I speak from 45 years experience working and living around the world (much of that time in Thailand.) You also seem to only be able to associate with bar crowds, which can influence your thinking. Try a new crowd.

[metisdead]

Posts using all caps have been removed. Turn off your Caps Lock button when posting.

[Naam]

I speak and read/write Thai not fluently but it was not the first Asian language that I learned -- none fluently.

That said, learning a language is a proclivity like music, math, or some sports. And some could spend good money and long hours per week and never feel comfortable speaking even rudimentary Thai. So, that many who have lived here even long-term and still cannot speak more than a few words of Thai doesn't surprise me nor do I think it is necessary for their overall well-being.

you are totally wrong Khun Crab! any Farang who masters in Thai

"teelak, you make chow pad thai leo leo cause me hungly too mutt!"

will look down on you with sympathy because surely Thais have riped (sic!) you off many times.

[thaicbr]

A Thai woman married to a German and lives is Germany is expected to learn Deutsch. Same with the Netherlands - Immigrants are expected to learn Dutch. If the immigrant is living in the UK, they are also expected to learn English. So why should Thailand be any different? Live in Thailand? Then learn to at least speak THAI. No rocket science required there....

One slight but important difference. In those situations the person would probably be getting citizenship.... also i believe the Governments of these countries have qualified language tutors available for the task...here???

[manly100]

it took a long time for me to learn thai, then i realised i thai isn't thai, its siam, if i knew then what i know now i wouldn't bother. hearing tourist being called white pigs is something i could do without. as for work, it's either on site with mayanmars or in the office with bangkok elite who never talk anything but perfect english. learning thai is debatable because most outsiders will stay outsiders by law. learning spanish in the usa is learning one more language to get on in a country where you can become a citizen. in thailand you'd need to learn up to 15 languages and work magic to become a citizen to achieve the same,

[TexasRanger]

I always feel sorry for the guys who have to have their partner go with them to help them accomplish the simplest of tasks, I can't imagine not being able to go to the DIY store yo get what I need by myself. Also when in a social environment where people are jabbering away and joking anf you have to sit there like a dummy unable to join jn. But by far the most important thing for me is being able to react in an emergency. What if your wife ends up in hospital, can you understand whats going on, can you explain where it hurts if you are ill? Many bad things can happen where speaking and understanding could save a life.

[yourauntbob]

Turn the question on its head. Do you expect foreigners who live in your home country as residents rather than as tourists to try and learn your language? Do you complain about those who won't?

That was addressed in the OP, yes i expect foreigners in my home country to speak the native language. It just seems many foreigners here in Thailand dont think the should learn the language and my question was to gauge that sentiment.

You have carefully avoided saying which language variant you think foreigners should learn.

It's like saying everyone that moves to Canada should learn English, not much use if you live in Quebec (they speak French).

Or everyone that moves to Belgium should learn French, not much use if you move to Flanders (they speak Flemish).

Even countries like Italy spoke 3 completely separate languages until the 1950s

(A situation very similar to modern day Thailand)

I have not specified because each nation has their own national languages. I think that people living (settling) in a country should learn the national language what ever it might be. If there is more than one language, learn the regional one where you live.

If you choose to live somewhere, then you are choosing more than just the location but also the culture to some extent and the language.

[Naam]

A Thai woman married to a German and lives is Germany is expected to learn Deutsch. Same with the Netherlands - Immigrants are expected to learn Dutch. If the immigrant is living in the UK, they are also expected to learn English. So why should Thailand be any different? Live in Thailand? Then learn to at least speak THAI. No rocket science required there....

do i care who or what expects me to learn a language which (in my personal view) is a waste of time? no, i don't!

i master half a dozen languages fluently and if i desire to brush up my Farsi to read and understand old persian poetry i will do so inspite of living in Thailand.

[jayboy]

Fluency is difficult, the tonal aspect of Thai ( and other Asian languages ) is effectively a cunning barrier against learning for we of a Western extract.

This issue has been the topic of conversation a few times in the last few days in my residence/hotel. My attitude is that it's retarded not to be able to count to 10 in Thai, not to know the words for left and right, not to be able to return a greeting in Thai.

Seriously, think about it........" I've lived here for three years and I can't count to 10 ".

Shocking and ignorant.......shame can be a good motivator to learn.

The tonal aspect of Thai is often invoked by those who don't know it as being a major obstacle to learning the language.It isn't.

Thai is not among the easiest languages (French, Italian, Indonesian) for Westerners but it is very far from being the most difficult (Chinese, Japanese, Arabic)

The language test you set (counting up to 10 etc) for foreigners after 3 years is absurd.After a fortnight - if that - seems about right.

[lemoncake]

Which proves one of my points

Which point? Can you speak Thai?

no where near as good as you

[Naam]

I always feel sorry for the guys who have to have their partner go with them to help them accomplish the simplest of tasks, I can't imagine not being able to go to the DIY store yo get what I need by myself. Also when in a social environment where people are jabbering away and joking anf you have to sit there like a dummy unable to join jn. But by far the most important thing for me is being able to react in an emergency. What if your wife ends up in hospital, can you understand whats going on, can you explain where it hurts if you are ill? Many bad things can happen where speaking and understanding could save a life.

i always feel sorry for the guys who have the impertinence of judging the way of life of people they don't know. i am also amused when a foreigner brags that he knows the Thai technical terms/names of parts he requires for a do-it-youself job whereas the salesman will give him a dumb look because he has not the faintest idea what the Foreigner is talking about.

quite surprising is the assumption that medical staff in a proper hospital does not speak English and that it might save a life if one can explain in Thai "where it hurts".

[Naam]

Thai is not among the easiest languages (French, Italian, Indonesian)
for Westerners but it is very far from being the most difficult
(Chinese, Japanese, Arabic)

no offence meant Khun Jayboy but i think you possess a wealth of no idea when

it concerns the languages you mentioned.

[lemoncake]

I always feel sorry for the guys who have to have their partner go with them to help them accomplish the simplest of tasks, I can't imagine not being able to go to the DIY store yo get what I need by myself. Also when in a social environment where people are jabbering away and joking anf you have to sit there like a dummy unable to join jn. But by far the most important thing for me is being able to react in an emergency. What if your wife ends up in hospital, can you understand whats going on, can you explain where it hurts if you are ill? Many bad things can happen where speaking and understanding could save a life.

i always feel sorry for the guys who have the impertinence of judging the way of life of people they don't know. i am also amused when a foreigner brags that he knows the Thai technical terms/names of parts he requires for a do-it-youself job whereas the salesman will give him a dumb look because he has not the faintest idea what the Foreigner is talking about.

quite surprising is the assumption that medical staff in a proper hospital does not speak English and that it might save a life if one can explain in Thai "where it hurts".

If medical staff do not speak English-RUN.

Not because the inability to explain, but because if they have not learned basic English, i doubt they learned anything else much better, especially when English is compulsory.

Even more worrying is inability to speak latin terms, when much of medicine is based on that

[kennedy]

Thai is not among the easiest languages (French, Italian, Indonesian)

for Westerners but it is very far from being the most difficult

(Chinese, Japanese, Arabic)

no offence meant Khun Jayboy but i think you possess a wealth of no idea when

it concerns the languages you mentioned.

I agree, and I also like Ice Cream.

[rsokolowski]

Try to look at it this way, how would you feel about foreigners coming to your home country and never learning to speak your language. More importantly how well would they fit in if they do not even attempt to learn the language. In my opinion, if you live in a foreign country, you need to learn as much of the native language as possible. Anything less is rude, disrespectful and will cause problems down the road.

Also I suspect that it will also turn you into one of the TV posters that always has a negative outlook, and many issues, but this is just an opinion.

[jayboy]

Thai is not among the easiest languages (French, Italian, Indonesian)

for Westerners but it is very far from being the most difficult

(Chinese, Japanese, Arabic)

no offence meant Khun Jayboy but i think you possess a wealth of no idea when

it concerns the languages you mentioned.

No offence taken because it's not my original thought.It's the view of many professional linguists including the astonishingly accomplished J.Marvin Brown whom many older hands will remember as the main developer of the AUA Thai Course.

[Johnniey]

A Thai woman married to a German and lives is Germany is expected to learn Deutsch. Same with the Netherlands - Immigrants are expected to learn Dutch. If the immigrant is living in the UK, they are also expected to learn English. So why should Thailand be any different? Live in Thailand? Then learn to at least speak THAI. No rocket science required there....

do i care who or what expects me to learn a language which (in my personal view) is a waste of time? no, i don't!

i master half a dozen languages fluently and if i desire to brush up my Farsi to read and understand old persian poetry i will do so inspite of living in Thailand.

You're personal view is wrong.

Learn how to speak Thai when living in Thailand or learn an out of date foreign language that none in your adopted country speak is not difficult.

[Time Traveller]

The irony is that the OP is posting this all in English. If you want to speak Thai go ahead. If people don't want to then so be it. It's a decision they make, not based on what other people tell them they should do. And I have no concern whatsoever if people want to speak Spanish in the USA. Or Chinese or French or whatever. Why should it bother you what language other people speak? Do you also believe foreigner in Thailand should become a buddhist also??

[uptheos]

Up to you if you learn the language, you can survive without it. Just remember a large percentage of people telling you that you should in order to integrate and understand more etc, probably don't speak it themselves.

[eeeya]

I'm surprised that ThaiVisa, the biggest forum for foreigners in thailand has such an inactive language forum.

I guess this is the answer to the ops question.

Most people can't be bothered

[TexasRanger]

quite surprising is the assumption that medical staff in a proper hospital does not speak English and that it might save a life if one can explain in Thai "where it hurts".

Have you been to any rural Thai hospitals? I can assure you the level of English is woeful.

[jackr]

It won't stop them calling you the "f" word either.

I would hope so, I don't like being called a f***wit.