Kentucky: Boy, 5, Accidentally Kills Sister With His Own Gun

[lomatopo]

To quote myself..."Here we go again".

Chukd

Your comment really does belittle the gravity and seriousness of the incident. Isn't there anything that would make even the pro Gun lobby hang their heads and say 'interpretation of constitution or not, this is plain wrong and SO easily avoidable.

Agreed. The parents were remiss in not providing the two-year old with a firearm to defend herself..

[chuckd]

To quote myself..."Here we go again".

Chukd

Your comment really does belittle the gravity and seriousness of the incident. Isn't there anything that would make even the pro Gun lobby hang their heads and say 'interpretation of constitution or not, this is plain wrong and SO easily avoidable.

I have intentionally limited myself to the cryptic comment you find so offensive simply to keep from responding to troll posts from the anti-gun brigade.

Of course it was a tragedy, but so are the millions of children that die each year because of hunger or neglect. Where is your respective outrage over that? Since there is absolutely NOTHING you can do as non-Americans about the 2nd Amendment, why not put your collective energy and resources to solve the world hunger problem, conceivably a subject which you would have a legitimate complaint about.

And with that, I am outta here.

[kblaze]

To quote myself..."Here we go again".

Chukd

Your comment really does belittle the gravity and seriousness of the incident. Isn't there anything that would make even the pro Gun lobby hang their heads and say 'interpretation of constitution or not, this is plain wrong and SO easily avoidable.

Im assuming your "SO easily avoidable" comment alludes to a solution that includes IQ-based sterilization. Because if your solution is simply "make guns illegal" then Im going to have a lot of fun playing the hypothetical game.

[lomatopo]

Our Founding Fathers wanted everyone to have a gun - Blacks can have three-fifths of a gun - actually any sort of weapon with no limit whatsoever on type, quantity , size, magazine capacity or increased penetrating power.

If they wanted everyone to have a car they would have provided for that with an Amendment; hence it is OK to require a license to operate a motor vehicle, and OK to require mandatory insurance (Obamacare be damned), OK to have to pay sales tax on a car sale (where applicable), pay excise tax (where applicable) and require registration.

Cars don't kill people. People with cars might occasionally kill people. People with guns and cars also occasionally kill people.

If you outlaw guns only outlaws will have guns.

[GentlemanJim]

Chukd

Your comment really does belittle the gravity and seriousness of the incident. Isn't there anything that would make even the pro Gun lobby hang their heads and say 'interpretation of constitution or not, this is plain wrong and SO easily avoidable.

I have intentionally limited myself to the cryptic comment you find so offensive simply to keep from responding to troll posts from the anti-gun brigade.

Of course it was a tragedy, but so are the millions of children that die each year because of hunger or neglect. Where is your respective outrage over that? Since there is absolutely NOTHING you can do as non-Americans about the 2nd Amendment, why not put your collective energy and resources to solve the world hunger problem, conceivably a subject which you would have a legitimate complaint about.

And with that, I am outta here.

I own a gun, I am responsible. This thread is not about children dying from hunger, start a thread and I will be outraged for you. (Are you seriously saying my post displays outrage?). This is about children OWNING lethal weapons. There may indeed be nothing I can do as a non American about the 2nd Amendment, but as a non Iraqi and non Afghani that didn't stop you guys trying to change their concept of governance did it, but don't let setting precedence get in the way of others trying eh!

Chukd

Your comment really does belittle the gravity and seriousness of the incident. Isn't there anything that would make even the pro Gun lobby hang their heads and say 'interpretation of constitution or not, this is plain wrong and SO easily avoidable.

Im assuming your "SO easily avoidable" comment alludes to a solution that includes IQ-based sterilization. Because if your solution is simply "make guns illegal" then Im going to have a lot of fun playing the hypothetical game.

It's true what they say about Assuming then isn't it.

Don't you find it quite ironic that coming from someone who claims that gun ownership is your God given right the argument that you think sterilization based on IQ is an acceptable form of solution. In fact the more I think about that the more deeply telling and disturbing it is about certain aspects of the culture of the 'home of the free and the land of the brave'. Isn't it more acceptable to simply 'make guns illegal' rather than forcibly sterilize people of a low IQ? You know what, don't answer that because I know what the reply would be and that WOULD be offensive. Even more ironic is that 99.9% of the NRA who would vote for such a solution would claim to be Christian as well.

[Scott]

Let's get back to the topic and stay away from speculative nonsense.

Use more sense and less emotion in your posts, please.

[kblaze]

Jim - I don't think having guns is a God-given right. I believe its a constitutional right that comes with restrictions (i.e. criminal history check, age requirements..etc)

My comment about IQ sterilization was not serious (im sad you thought it was). I was referring to my earlier post wherein I posited my belief that poor parenting is the primary culprit in this case of the 4 year old with a rifle. I assumed that your claim that the solution would be "SO easy" was because you believe the solution is simply "make guns illegal". So, in an apparently failed attempt to counter your solution (which I find ridiculous) with a little bit of humor, I countered with what I consider an equally crazy solution - IQ-based sterilization.

Edited May 16, 2013 by kblaze

[LomSak27]

Perhaps we should ban cars. They kill more people accidentally than guns.

Usual con job soundbite

But not something Wayne NRA L wants his minions to say these days

- we license cars

. we tax them

we register owners and have records of sales

and have laws how they can be used ................. and we don't allow drunk people to use them - not the same with guns

In fact we don't do any of that with guns hahahhah

We don't want our freedom infringed, godblessit

[GentlemanJim]

Jim - I don't think having guns is a God-given right. I believe its a constitutional right that comes with restrictions (i.e. criminal history check, age requirements..etc)

My comment about IQ sterilization was not serious (im sad you thought it was). I was referring to my earlier post wherein I posited my belief that poor parenting is the primary culprit in this case of the 4 year old with a rifle. I assumed that your claim that the solution would be "SO easy" was because you believe the solution is simply "make guns illegal". So, in an apparently failed attempt to counter your solution (which I find ridiculous) with a little bit of humor, I countered with what I consider an equally crazy solution - IQ-based sterilization.

My solution that would be SO Easy to avoid would have been responsible, governed gun ownership rules, and not rules that allow a child, well at 4, almost an infant to be given their own weapon with zero security. Your reply was definitely not one in jest and you know it. You replied like all threatened US gun owners do when anyone questions weapon ownership and rules in the US. Unable to think or criticize the legislation as it currently stands you just stick by it whatever the cost. Your 'right to bear arms' as many of you now interpret is not what the founding fathers intended and it was written at a time of huge domestic insecurity, but go ahead and stretch it as far as you like. I know many a right winger who would opt for the IQ solution without hesitation.

Don't worry though the gun laws will never change. Whilst you have your guns the Government ensures that you all believe you are free, This in a country where in many states you cannot put a well on your own land and take the earths water on an as you need basis, and you can't grow your own vegetables in case you might give them away or sell them therebye taking away business from the food corporations.

Edited May 16, 2013 by GentlemanJim

[kblaze]

I want to keep the discussion civil, so please use only what I have posted as that is all you know about me.

Why do you say; "Unable to think or criticize the legislation as it currently stands you just stick by it whatever the cost."

When I said; "I believe its a constitutional right that comes with restrictions (i.e. criminal history check, age requirements..etc)"

Here I'll give you an example of my thinking/criticizing regarding the legislation; Gun ownership restrictions should be left to counties/states to decide. Sweeping federal laws are a bad idea because of huge geographic/demographic/cultural differences between states/counties.

I'm curious what other US-related grievance you carry will be pushed into your argument. (you've already brought up Iraq/Afghanistan/Christians/US water and food freedom failings)

[GentlemanJim]

I want to keep the discussion civil, so please use only what I have posted as that is all you know about me.

Why do you say; "Unable to think or criticize the legislation as it currently stands you just stick by it whatever the cost."

When I said; "I believe its a constitutional right that comes with restrictions (i.e. criminal history check, age requirements..etc)"

Here I'll give you an example of my thinking/criticizing regarding the legislation; Gun ownership restrictions should be left to counties/states to decide. Sweeping federal laws are a bad idea because of huge geographic/demographic/cultural differences between states/counties.

I'm curious what other US-related grievance you carry will be pushed into your argument. (you've already brought up Iraq/Afghanistan/Christians/US water and food freedom failings)

No need to take it personally, I have just as many grievances over the UK and it's Government. It's just there we are not under an illusion of being in the land of the free when we are not, and you are not in the US.....25 years ago absolutely, but no longer. I agree with you concerning states/counties being responsible for the varying differences in gun law due to the differences in socio/Geo influences. Should any state be condoning the issue of a lethal weapon to an infant? At birthdays a 4 year old should be given lego. This does not preclude you from teaching a youngster how to shoot/hunt at an appropriate age, but in my opinion 'child' weapons should be illegal. A child/youth is likely to be old enough to be taught responsible gun skills when they can handle a normal weapon of whatever calibre that is designed to be used by adults. Although a sweeping statement, many children do not fully grasp the concept of what death really is and stories of Grandma is now a star with Grandpa looking down on us and dancing with angels does not help the child come to terms with the true consequences of pointing a gun and pulling a trigger - so your gonna be a star and dance with angels....cool! I applaud you for being responsible in terms of gun ownership, but sadly as with many aspects of life, laws have to be imposed to take care of the lowest common denominator. For every responsible gun owning parent in the US, there is an irresponsible one, and they are the ones who are going to cause the tradgedy. You will never hear stories of the responsible parent going hunting with his child 500 times with no breaches of safety, but there are lots of irresponsible ones ready to fill the pages of the magazines. Laws have to be made to protect their children and that makes it tougher for the good people, but that's the price that good people must be willing to pay.

[F430murci]

Perhaps we should ban cars. They kill more people accidentally than guns.

Usual con job soundbite

But not something Wayne NRA L wants his minions to say these days

- we license cars

. we tax them

we register owners and have records of sales

and have laws how they can be used ................. and we don't allow drunk people to use them - not the same with guns

In fact we don't do any of that with guns hahahhah

We don't want our freedom infringed, godblessit

Nah, I think we should just ban all people with guns. Then there would be no more gun people to pull the triggers on guns. In fact, touch a gun, off to inhabit Mars, but let them take their guns to Mars. They will need a militia there.

[JemJem]

Police: 'Too early to know' about charges in death of 2-year-old shot by brother, 5

Published: May 1, 2013 Updated 6 hours ago

By Greg Kocher — [email protected]

Kentucky State Police said Wednesday it is too early to say whether charges will be filed in the case of a 5-year-old boy who accidentally shot and killed his 2-year-old sister.

Trooper Billy Gregory, spokesman for the Columbia post, initially said Wednesday that he didn't anticipate charges.

"We don't see that there was neglect on anyone's part," Gregory said.

Read more here: http://www.kentucky.com/2013/05/01/2622315/no-charges-expected-in-death-of.html#storylink=misearch#storylink=cpy

I am speechless ! Very saddening and annoying !

[kblaze]

No need to take it personally, I have just as many grievances over the UK and it's Government. It's just there we are not under an illusion of being in the land of the free when we are not, and you are not in the US.....25 years ago absolutely, but no longer. I agree with you concerning states/counties being responsible for the varying differences in gun law due to the differences in socio/Geo influences. Should any state be condoning the issue of a lethal weapon to an infant? At birthdays a 4 year old should be given lego. This does not preclude you from teaching a youngster how to shoot/hunt at an appropriate age, but in my opinion 'child' weapons should be illegal. A child/youth is likely to be old enough to be taught responsible gun skills when they can handle a normal weapon of whatever calibre that is designed to be used by adults. Although a sweeping statement, many children do not fully grasp the concept of what death really is and stories of Grandma is now a star with Grandpa looking down on us and dancing with angels does not help the child come to terms with the true consequences of pointing a gun and pulling a trigger - so your gonna be a star and dance with angels....cool! I applaud you for being responsible in terms of gun ownership, but sadly as with many aspects of life, laws have to be imposed to take care of the lowest common denominator. For every responsible gun owning parent in the US, there is an irresponsible one, and they are the ones who are going to cause the tradgedy. You will never hear stories of the responsible parent going hunting with his child 500 times with no breaches of safety, but there are lots of irresponsible ones ready to fill the pages of the magazines. Laws have to be made to protect their children and that makes it tougher for the good people, but that's the price that good people must be willing to pay.

Absolutely a rifle designed for a toddler is ridiculous and I would support a law banning their sale, we agree there! A ban would stop some sales, but its not going to stamp out the problem of "kids with guns" because there will always be stupid parents. But hey, if it prevents some accidents thats better than nothing. The whole reason "air" rifles and bb guns exist is to cater to the non-rifle market.

I got a Daisy Red Ryder bb gun when I was around 9 and would shoot cans and boxes behind the house, and a couple years later my neighbor put me on pigeon duty as they were crapping all over his barn. My dad had a rifle, but as a kid, it was intimidating, loud and heavy and I was more than happy with my little pea-shooter.

Edited May 17, 2013 by kblaze

[Scott]

A warm, fuzzy post about a walk down memory land and teaching a child to shoot a gun is offensive and off-topic in a thread abut a child who has been killed.

Continued off-topic discussion is going to result in suspensions.

[qdinthailand]

Perhaps we should ban cars. They kill more people accidentally than guns.

No one's talking about banning guns, but we sure do regulate the sh*t out of cars - titles, registration, insurance, plates, seat belts, airbags, crash standards, recalls for faulty equipment and engineering, safety/emissions testing, operator license, national and state data gathering on crash/accident statistics, and on and on.

So why is it gun owners object to any kind of regulation, when they kill plenty.

Oh, guns don't kill people - 5 year olds kill people.

[Chicog]

If you outlaw guns only outlaws will have guns.

Then you'd only have to worry about outlaws (do they still use that word?!) killing your two year olds, and not their five year old siblings.

[Scott]

Off-topic posts have been deleted. Please stay on topic.

[lomatopo]

If you outlaw guns only outlaws will have guns.

Then you'd only have to worry about outlaws (do they still use that word?!) killing your two year olds, and not their five year old siblings.

Correct, that's why we can't or shouldn't outlaw guns.

[Morden]

If you outlaw guns only outlaws will have guns.

Then you'd only have to worry about outlaws (do they still use that word?!) killing your two year olds, and not their five year old siblings.

Correct, that's why we can't or shouldn't outlaw guns.

For the umpteenth time, no-one has suggested outlawing guns. Please stop using that diversionary fallacy. The issue is who should have what gun and where.

[Scott]

Off-topic posts have been deleted. There have been a number of threads on gun control; this thread isn't one of them.

[lomatopo]

Kentucky, where this accident occurred, does have fairly liberal gun laws, so this might put a parents' choice to introduce firearms at what some might deem an early age, in perspective.

Guns & Ammo magazine recently ranked it #5 in a recent review, with a score of 48 out of 50.

Laws for Firearms: Best States for Gun Owners in 2013

5. Kentucky

CCW/Open Carry: 8

MSRs: 10

Class 3/NFA: 10

Castle Doctrine: 10

Miscellaneous: 10

TOTAL: 48

Kentucky is a Shall-Issue CCW state with no permit needed for open carry, and its CCW law covers all deadly weapons—not just handguns. Kentucky has a Stand Your Ground law with no restrictions on MSRs or magazine capacity.

http://www.gunsandammo.com/2013/03/14/ga-ranks-the-best-states-for-gun-owners-in-2013/

[Scott]

A whole bunch more off-topic posts have been deleted.

The topic isn't about gun control. It's about a boy who was accidentally shot. Re-read the OP, if you bothered to read it in the first place, and post accordingly.

[7by7]

At the risk of incurring the wrath of a moderator and subsequent sanctions; surely gun control is a big part of this topic?

If proper gun controls had been in place then this boy would not have owned a rifle and this tragedy would not have occurred!

Other than expressing regret at the tragedy, hope that the parents are feeling guilty for buying their son a gun and sympathy for the boy who will have to live with killing his sister for the rest of his life, what other comments are there to make?

[Scott]

Perhaps this answers your question.

If you use the search function, you can find several topics about gun control.

//Closed//