Thai Society Sees Women ' As Lowly'

[chooka]

I showed this to my husband and he just told me to shush and go make him a sandwich

and I can see that you are dawdling by stopping off at the computer on your way to the kitchen. Have you no respect for your man, woman?

And don't forget the mayonaise.

[animatic]

If she has sold her country out,

by selling her good name and actions to her older brother in self-exile

as his puppet for controlling the country through her from abroad,

what other name fits; male or female?

If she was a he and called a whore for doing this, they would have the same result,

but not have the feminist card to play Not surprising there are a few feminist voices

to side with her, simply because of her gender. But it also is as easy to find voices for sale

that come with agenda's they want pushed, no matter the circumstances,

as long as their line gets out there.

I personally think, if he would say the same thing about a man in the political world,

then it is prejudiced to NOT be equally even handed towards women in power.

Why should someone of any gender get a free pass on the satirist front,

to do a perceived wrong, because their gender is one or the other?

Edited May 10, 2013 by animatic

[Tomtomtom69]

hm. Kinda. I guess.

Personally, I think sex work is as legitimate a vocation as any other unskilled labor.

Why isn't anyone talking about how this insults sex workers?

I mean, they didn't accidentally call her a whore because she happened to be female. It was an intentional insult. When you insult someone you need to use language that will hit it's target. "Whore" is an historical insult for women. They could just as well have called a male minister a whore but it wouldn't have quite the same sting, don't ya think.

Not to defend misogyny, but, what were they supposed to call her? A fag? A sissy? Impotent? ... Any of the other insults that are historical insults to males the world over.

Exactly.

Anyway, I disagree with these 3 women's viewpoints. Firstly, the prime minister is as despised by a large segment of Thai society as her brother was at the time - nothing to do with her sex. It's simply convenient to use certain "female" slang to degrade her just as more "male" slang was (and still is) used to criticize Thaksin.

As for sex worker's rights - well, I don't think they are viewed in a lower position than say, migrant MALE fishermen from Myanmar, Laos or Cambodia that are exploited when working on fishing boats off the coast of Thailand. Society often makes scapegoats out of poorer, less fortunate people especially those working in controversial industries like prostitution.

In general, women's rights have come quite far in Thailand in recent decades. 55% of university enrollments are female, a significant portion of managers in Thailand are women, even if men still predominate. Women also have pretty much equal rights according to the law even if their traditional cultural standing wasn't quite as it is now. However, in general women in Thailand have every reason to be confident about the future and they can thank the Lord Buddha or whoever they believe in that they weren't born in Saudi Arabia, Afghanistan or even India, where women's rights basically don't exist.

[Theoutsider]

Where's my beer

[parmo1]

In thewest and in Thailand, men have kept women alive since the start of human history, men have worked long hours in Dirty, Dangerous, Difficult jobs, while women , in general, have stayed out of harm's way while their personal slave, their husband toils . WHO has been lowly, slave husband or wife ?

If you go to any shopping mall in Thailand, or anywhere else in the world, one thing is obvious, most of the shops/stores are for women, at the entrance to the most prestigious department stores, there are cosmetics, jewelry. Women do the spending, men do the earning, who is lowly, the spenders or the workers ?

Academic feminists ALWAYS use "toxic victimhood" (viz. rape, domestic violence etc) to further their hate, feminism has become, even in Thaialand, a VIOLENT HATE MOVEMENT. If you delve into men's rights, you will soon discover how evil feminists are, they want SUPREMACY not equality.

In the west feminism is beginning to be finally turned back, many of us are here in Thailand because of the results of the feminist jurisprudence , secret courts, paying for the stealing of your kids etc etc. Feminism has gone unchallenged by men for 40 years, you don't really see there is a problem until it affects YOU.

But it is all just silliness and hate, men are and always have been responsible for males, females, and our kids, together with women who value their families, we will defeat this hateful hateful movement.

Edited May 12, 2013 by parmo1

[marstons]

" ...Many Thai men are hypocritical, said Virada, as they use the service of sex workers and push the notion of prostitute to elevate themselves and degrade women at the same time."

Could also be said, "Many Thai people are hypocritical, as they use the financial support of farangs and push the notion of farang=kohn-mai-dee to elevate themselves and degrade farangs at the same time."

( Welcome to our world. )

Please be informed that without farangs, the Thais and Thailand can still survive and move on. Do not carry yourself so highly. It's the farangs who want to come to Thailand. Please have some decent respect for the country. Anyway if you feel you are short changed, you are always welcome to look elsewhere.

If every Farang and his business pulled out of Thailand, Thailand would struggle. its is the farnangs who buy Thai products with whom there would not be a market. Thailand cannot survive without farangs, take a look around mega size industrial estates and see how many farang companies are there and how many Thai companies are there. You give a good example of many Thai people who think the world revolves around them. The world can survive without Thailand, Thailand cannot survive without farangs and its business. Respect is earned not given.

[parmo1]

However, in general women in Thailand have every reason to be confident about the future and they can thank the Lord Buddha or whoever they believe in that they weren't born in Saudi Arabia, Afghanistan or even India, where women's rights basically don't exist.

QUOTE END

Even in Saudi Arabia,Afghanistan women still have an easy life compare to men, if a country treats women badly, men will be always be treated 10 times worse

[EyesWideOpen]

What an odd headline. Anyone who has spent a fair amount of time here quickly realizes that Thai women are far smarter than the men.....

[Travel2003]

All countries in the world has an one stage in their history looked upon women as lowly.

So called male dominated societies have been around for ages.

This, or as I like to call it, "Macho Bullshit" attitude is about to die in modern civilized countries, although it still might take some time before it is eradicated.

Many countries still practice this, but will sooner or later catch up with rest of the modern world.

Can I ask you where you got your facts from?

What exactly do many countries practice?

I hope the animal kingdom also realizes this as one gender (male or female) of a particular species is mainly dominant

I think what the world needs eradicating is people who believe they know the facts or as I like to call it "Mucho Bullshit"

Hate me or not, because we all know your real agenda here, but you do realize what I talked about is actually general knowledge among anyone who has finished elementary school, right?

[rametindallas]

Baerboxer, on 09 May 2013 - 00:22, said:

indyuk, on 08 May 2013 - 23:04, said:

Locationthailand, on 08 May 2013 - 20:24, said:

Does anyone really care? Yingluck 'has' sold out Thailand and the buck stops at the top with her. As is often quoted - madam we know what you are, we are now just negotiating the price.

Sir you should respect Yingluck's position as Prime Minister. Second you should respect all women so that you may become a 'real man'. It is also important that you recognise that we men are interllectually inferior when compared scientifically to the females of our species. Finally you might consider discussing your irrational fear of women with a psycologist.

You want to do more research mate. Recent neurological research concluded that women's brains have a higher mental processing capacity than man's.

One of the manifestations of this is their ability to multi task.

too bad their hormones overwhelm their superior brains once a month. Women are superior to men in social skills and multi-tasking but inferior to men in spacial conceptualization and high level mathematics so you don't see many women in engineering, computer sciences, architecture, and related fields. Having higher capacity does not mean ability to utilize that capacity. Edited May 12, 2013 by rametindallas

[rametindallas]

If you cannot see the misogyny in the cartoon and the attending remarks it simply means you're not looking deeply enough. Most of the respondents in TV are male, and it isn't surprising that many are incapable of looking past their own narrow, paternalistic view of society. No judgment intended. It's just a fact of life. But misogyny is there, and glaringly so in this instance. Most societies thrive on hypocrisy and double standards. They represent the marked differences between what we are convinced we should be, and what we really are. We live in a physical world and our actions are mostly driven by our bodies and the natural chemicals that enable us to function and survive. Religion and philosophy have given us aspirations. But (particularly) religious rhetoric has turned those aspirations into weapons with which to attack those who do not conform to the dominant doctrines. Put simply, we often say one thing yet are 'driven' to do another.

I don't know if Chai Rachawat has ever used a sex worker of either gender in his long life. But even if he hasn't he should have had enough life experience at the age of 72 to understand that all in any society is not as it seems, and Thailand is no different. But it would not be unreasonable to suggest that he is probably no different to most of us. While he may understand the 'truth' of the society in which he lives he chooses to conveniently forget such truths in the pursuit of either political capital or professional aggrandizement. Either way his remarks about Yinluck should be challenged at least as strongly as his personal attack on her.

Disingenuous attitudes abound in all areas of societal conflict.

DIG

'If you cannot see the misogyny in the cartoon and the attending remarks it simply means you're not looking deeply enough.' I think you totally missed the point of K. Chai's comment. He said 'Prostitutes are not bad people'. explanation: because prostitutes own their bodies, they are free to sell them; they are not doing a bad thing. On the other hand, 'someone' sold-out their country by trashing it in front of others. Thailand is not the property of this 'someone' so this 'someone' had no right to sell-out their country thus making this 'someone' a bad person. There was no slur of any kind against prostitutes or women; in fact, they were referred to as behaving honorably. This was only and exclusively a slur against 'someone' who would trash the country in front of foreigners. If Madam PM sees herself as 'someone', that is her problem and cannot be construed a slur against women. That is a ploy to get women to take on the bad thing that 'someone' did. Edited May 12, 2013 by rametindallas

[rametindallas]

I consider this to be a typical response to a society that has men that are of very low value. The majority of Thai men are very unimpressive beings. I know I will be hated for saying something so sweeping, and so general, but I have never encountered a society that has less impressive men. When was the last time one won a gold medal, a pulitzer, a nobel, an oscar, a golden globe, or any other measure of achievement, or greatness? When was the last time one was lauded for making a great contribution to mankind? Also, I believe that Thai women run the country. Behind the scenes. No family would be able to operate without one. They are the reason the society operates. They are the most dynamic aspect of the country. Many men know this, and they do not like admitting that they are inferior to their women. So, you have such responses. It is the act of an unthinking being. Thai society has to figure out a way to stop convincing male youngsters that they are special, in any way. They are not. Quite the contrary, their sisters and their mothers are far, far more special. These are just my opinions, but I see it every day.

To further you point, I know of several very successful businesses that, on the face of it, are owned/run by men but in actuality the men are just 'beards' for their sisters who make the real decisions and hold ownership of the business. Thais are so sexist the business does better if a man is 'seen' to be boss.

[rametindallas]

Hypocrites and charletons, Perhaps if the government would do more to eliminate the rife prostitution that exists in this country then they would be better served that attacking this cartoonist.

I note that these ambassadors of rightousness use the term Sex Worker as they consider it less offensive than Whore, hooker or Prostitute, however, a rose is still a rose by any other name, furthermore prostitution is" illegal" in Thailand which would deem Sex workers under the same category.

You can not simply use a descriptive name change in order to vindicate your argument.

If you truly wish to stablish a society in which women can atain a better form of equality then simply remove the protensious sponsored sex industr that allow them to be shown in this light.

This will never happen until the government can provide gainful employement for its citizens and the tourist ministry will have much to worry about. BLOODY HYPOCRITES.

So, you think prostitutes are BAD. With less than 1% unemployment these women could all find work outside the sex trade. They choose a profession that has easy hours, little work and the skills necessary come naturally; no special training required. Human beings are sexual beings they don't have sex just to procreate. Not everyone is in a loving. sharing relationship so there is a real need in the world for sex workers. While I understand you, personally, have no use for the services of a prostitute, there are many, less attractive men in the world who have needs that cant otherwise be satisfied. Being sexual is part of being a complete human. Would you deny these men the ability to be complete humans? Would you deny these women the ability to sell what is rightfully theirs to control? Many kind-hearted women give their sexual gifts for free but there are not enough of them to satisfy the great need out there. Business is business and providing a service that is valuable, wanted, and needed is good for society and the economy. What the world doesn't need is a bunch of sexually frustrated men.

[philw]

If she has sold her country out,

by selling her good name and actions to her older brother in self-exile

as his puppet for controlling the country through her from abroad,

what other name fits; male or female?

If she was a he and called a whore for doing this, they would have the same result,

but not have the feminist card to play Not surprising there are a few feminist voices

to side with her, simply because of her gender. But it also is as easy to find voices for sale

that come with agenda's they want pushed, no matter the circumstances,

as long as their line gets out there.

I personally think, if he would say the same thing about a man in the political world,

then it is prejudiced to NOT be equally even handed towards women in power.

Why should someone of any gender get a free pass on the satirist front,

to do a perceived wrong, because their gender is one or the other?

Please can you do this again in a format that can be understood ??

[BeforeTigers]

hm. Kinda. I guess.

Personally, I think sex work is as legitimate a vocation as any other unskilled labor.

Why isn't anyone talking about how this insults sex workers?

I mean, they didn't accidentally call her a whore because she happened to be female. It was an intentional insult. When you insult someone you need to use language that will hit it's target. "Whore" is an historical insult for women. They could just as well have called a male minister a whore but it wouldn't have quite the same sting, don't ya think.

Not to defend misogyny, but, what were they supposed to call her? A fag? A sissy? Impotent? ... Any of the other insults that are historical insults to males the world over.

Seeing sex work as a vocation is an interesting worldview. I'm sure many sex workers would regard themselves as being very skilled. Classing them as unskilled labour is more of an insult.

The word whore is a legitimate word, as is harlot or prostitute. It is not a slang or swear word and is not in itself an insult. The insult is that people think lowly of sex workers, which is also has illegal connotations in many countries, and to be called one or compared to one is therefore deemed an insult.

"Unskilled worker" is common English vernacular for a person with no specialized education or training.

That's all I meant by it.

[MaxYakov]

I consider this to be a typical response to a society that has men that are of very low value. The majority of Thai men are very unimpressive beings. I know I will be hated for saying something so sweeping, and so general, but I have never encountered a society that has less impressive men. When was the last time one won a gold medal, a pulitzer, a nobel, an oscar, a golden globe, or any other measure of achievement, or greatness? When was the last time one was lauded for making a great contribution to mankind? Also, I believe that Thai women run the country. Behind the scenes. No family would be able to operate without one. They are the reason the society operates. They are the most dynamic aspect of the country. Many men know this, and they do not like admitting that they are inferior to their women. So, you have such responses. It is the act of an unthinking being. Thai society has to figure out a way to stop convincing male youngsters that they are special, in any way. They are not. Quite the contrary, their sisters and their mothers are far, far more special. These are just my opinions, but I see it every day.

An amazing and well-written appraisal, IMHO.

[cup-O-coffee]

If Thai society sees women as lowly, then this suggests that Thai women ( who make up a large part of Thai society) view themselves as lowly, yes? Isn't that a contradiction unto itself?

The only other view would be that Thai society sees women as lowly, and subsequently Thai women accept and condone this view in their silence?

Either way then, the view that this article suggests now becomes nothing more than a moot point, does it not?

Edited May 26, 2013 by cup-O-coffee

[DocN]

If Thai society sees women as lowly, then this suggests that Thai women ( who make up a large part of Thai society) view themselves as lowly, yes? Isn't that a contradiction unto itself?

The only other view would be that Thai society sees women as lowly, and subsequently Thai women accept and condone this view in their silence?

Either way then, the view that this article suggests now becomes nothing more than a moot point, does it not?

In deed they do and often accept that role.

My ex- GF was 27, so a bit on the "younger" side.

I was almost NVER allowed to do laundry, washing the dishes or any kind of housework, because "you are a man"!