Thousands More Join P-Move Rally In Bangkok

[webfact]

Thousands more join P-Move rally
TANPISIT LERDBAMRUNGCHAI
THE NATION



BANGKOK: -- Some 300 Pak Mool Dam villagers under the Assembly of the Poor, were among the thousands to join the People's Movement for a Just Society (P-Move) protesters camping outside Government House and calling for Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra's to keep her promises.

The Pak Mool villagers want the dam's sluice gates to be kept open all year round so they can continue with their traditional profession of fishing as the dam blocks the path for fish. However, the dam is only opened four months a year.

"We were told to make brooms instead, but that's more difficult because brooms go for Bt9 per piece compared to fish, which yields Bt30-Bt40 per kilo. The Pak Mool Dam affects our way of life and income," Malee Tamsriwan, a 45-year-old fisherwoman Ubon Ratchathani's Sirindhorn district

Sompal Keundee, 40, from Ubon Ratchathani's Khong Chiam district, recalled that the group had rallied in Bangkok in January and that Deputy Prime Minister Chalerm Yoobamrung had promised on February 22 to table this issue with the Cabinet, but nothing happened. The group is still in the dark as to whether anything will be done this time after Chalerm promised on Tuesday to table the issue on May 14. This time the villagers hope that the government will set up a committee to help compensate them and keep the dam permanently open, Sompal said.

These protesters were among the 2,000 people who joined the P-Move rally to demand concrete government action.

Trang rubber farmer Kalaya Mankitti from the Network for Banthat Mountain Range Land Reform said she had been driven out of her 50-rai plantation as it allegedly encroached on forestland even though she had been living in the area long before it was named a national park. She said the group had rallied four times during this government's term and each and every time they had been promised a solution but nothing was done. Hence, she said, this time they would stay put until the Cabinet actually orders action to be taken to tackle their woes.

Rasita Suiyang, a member of the network of displaced Thais in Ranong-Prachuap Khiri Khan seeking Thai nationality, said her ancestors were Thai and lived on Thai soil, but the 1868 border map put them on Myanmar territory. In Myanmar she was considered a minority and forced to join labour camps, which prompted her to move in with her relatives in Thailand. However, in Thailand she is viewed as a migrant and state officials have been refusing to grant her Thai nationality.

Meanwhile, the Northern Farmers Federation is calling for a fund to be established so villagers can purchase land from private firms. Lamphun's community land-title deed cooperative president Rangsan Saensongkwai, 56, said he and other poor villagers were being sued by a private firm for farming on abandoned land.

Surapol Songrak, a rubber farmer from Surat Thani's Phrasaeng district, who is part of the Southern Farmer Federation, said they had been having a land dispute with a private firm because the villagers want land to farm on, while the company has won a concession to grow oil palm there. This dispute has resulted in death threats, and so far, two villagers have allegedly been killed over it.

The Four-Region Slum Network member Prathin Vekhavakhayanont from Nakhon Pathom said the "Ban Mankhong" housing for low-income people had many problems ranging from application for house plan to getting construction permits. He said his house had been completed two years ago, but it still did not have household registration documents due to the lack of a construction permit.

"It is impossible to do anything without household registration documents," he said, adding that the removal of residents out of the red-line train area will also leave him homeless.


-- The Nation 2013-05-09

[A Member]

A total of 300 hundred protesters is a realistic figure unlike the reds and yellows who only seem to operate with figures of 100,000. I'm no expert in Thai culture, language or superstitions so can anyone tell me if 100,000 has some special meaning or magical property because the red / yellows don't consider they have a protest without quoting that figure.

[kimamey]

A total of 300 hundred protesters is a realistic figure unlike the reds and yellows who only seem to operate with figures of 100,000. I'm no expert in Thai culture, language or superstitions so can anyone tell me if 100,000 has some special meaning or magical property because the red / yellows don't consider they have a protest without quoting that figure.

Didn't they always quote 1,000,000 before and never achieve it. Maybe it's creeping realism.

Of course the cynical view regarding some of these groups might be that they're not getting paid as much to protest as before. Assuming some of them are poor farmers they must find it difficult.

Edited May 9, 2013 by kimamey

[Thaddeus]

Compared to some others, these people have a genuine grievance.

[Thait Spot]

These are the type of people that need a hero.

The two legs better red shirts and 4 legs trough snuffling PTP are in no way it.

[brd199]

calling for Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra to keep her promises

"We were told to make brooms."


A 2013 Thai government update to, "Let them eat cake."

Edited May 9, 2013 by brd199

[Locationthailand]

Compared to some others, these people have a genuine grievance.

Absolutely and this is really a pathetic expose on the Government - supposedly the peoples champion. Promise the world, give nothing and steal from those they reportedly represent. These people need serious support.

[OzMick]

I think that it would be interesting to hear the other side of the story before accepting thse protester's claims as genuine. The concept of "abandoned land" is novel; national parks encroachers claiming ownership because of length of illegal tenancy is a bit old; and the demand to waste valuable national energy and water resources so that someone can go fishing borders on the sublime.

[Bellweather]

Compared to some others, these people have a genuine grievance.

Absolutely and this is really a pathetic expose on the Government - supposedly the peoples champion. Promise the world, give nothing and steal from those they reportedly represent. These people need serious support.

Unfortunately the populist party for the people are totally distracted by a single priority issue and make no bones about it.

[hellodolly]

Compared to some others, these people have a genuine grievance.

Absolutely and this is really a pathetic expose on the Government - supposedly the peoples champion. Promise the world, give nothing and steal from those they reportedly represent. These people need serious support.

Unfortunately the populist party for the people are totally distracted by a single priority issue and make no bones about it.

Even if they were to succeed in their drive to bring Thaksin back a hero would they care or do any thing about the poor.

[chainarong]

I fully support LocationThailand comments ,but will add , these people should be taking this to where it hurts , where the tourists arrive , let the tourists know how this government treats it's people, all peaceful and in order, signs in proper English, embarrass the numb nuts into action , so that the making of broom sticks are confined to Sunday, over time.

[JetsetBkk]

A total of 300 hundred protesters is a realistic figure unlike the reds and yellows who only seem to operate with figures of 100,000. I'm no expert in Thai culture, language or superstitions so can anyone tell me if 100,000 has some special meaning or magical property because the red / yellows don't consider they have a protest without quoting that figure.

Congratulations on bringing "reds vs. yellows" into the very first comment in a topic that has absolutely nothing to do with them.

[mrtoad]

Sold down the river by The DL and crew.

[indyuk]

The issue here is the falure of all former Thai governments to deal with the thorny issue of land registration. Until all Land within the internationally accepted legitimate borders of Thailand is registrered poverty will pravail among the underclasses of Thailand. Thailand promised the World bank that it would resolve this issue as far back as 2004. A good example of the complexity of the issue are the traditional Hmong lands in the Phetchabun Highlands which were exappropriated to facillitate land transfer to landless Thai farmers who after 60 years continue to await the issue of title documents.

[jcb2001]

My heart goes out to this P-Move group, some of whom truly have a legitimate complaint. PTP has turned their backs on these poor of Thailand. They were promised help when PTP needed them, but now are ignored because they are no longer needed. Thai politics at its best.

[waza]

and that's the way the PTP cookie crumbles, not from coups or impeachments but through ineptitude and broken promises.

Edited May 9, 2013 by waza

[Familyonthemove]

I guess there may be other knock-on impacts from changing the processes at the dam - water supply or irrigation problems perhaps? .... but these people seem to have a case that needs a considered, effective response. How can people make any sort of a decent living from 9 THB brooms?

I used to live in India where you need to become immune to the heart breaking poverty you see every day or you'd go crazy - but I don't remember seeing many Ferraris, Lamborghinis. Range Rovers, Porsches, Bentleys or even Minis in Mumbai but they seem to be common in Bangkok.

I'm not anti-rich at all and believe that if you run a successful business you'll benefit the economy and deserve the rewards - but the gap between the 'haves' and 'have-not-much' seems to be wide in Thailand ( Off topic comments edited out, this is not about India ).

Edited May 9, 2013 by metisdead

[geriatrickid]

My heart goes out to this P-Move group, some of whom truly have a legitimate complaint. PTP has turned their backs on these poor of Thailand. They were promised help when PTP needed them, but now are ignored because they are no longer needed. Thai politics at its best.

The PTP has not turned its backs on these people, nor has the PTP anything to do with a dam that was planned in the 1980's and completed in 1994. The issues have been simmering for almost 3 decades. This was a mini mega project financed by the World Bank and was part of a project intended to address flooding problems associated with the Mekong and Mun river systems. Unfortunately, for these plaintiffs, there are tens of thousands on the other side of the dam that benefit from the dam and the reservoir. As well, the dam generates electricity that is used in the region. To all those clueless people seeking to blame the current government for a problem that owes its origins to the development plans of the 1980's long before Thaksin was in office, please provide your solution.

There is no doubt that the dam has caused significant environmental damage and displaced many people. That's how dams work in Thailand. I can't wait for all of the engineering geniuses making their negative comments to provide their solutions that will also address the needs of the tens of thousands residents downstream who will suffer flooding and a lack of water for agriculture if the dam and reservoir are removed.

[brd199]

My heart goes out to this P-Move group, some of whom truly have a legitimate complaint. PTP has turned their backs on these poor of Thailand. They were promised help when PTP needed them, but now are ignored because they are no longer needed. Thai politics at its best.

The PTP has not turned its backs on these people

That's not how they justifiably see it. Rather than mumble about the past, they were looking to the future based upon what this government told them.

calling for Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra's to keep her promises.

and

Deputy Prime Minister Chalerm Yoobamrung had promised on February 22 to table this issue with the Cabinet, but nothing happened.

please provide your solution.

The government already did.

"We were told to make brooms instead... for Bt9 per piece"

[metisdead]

Off topic posts have been removed.

[Soutpeel]

and that's the way the PTP cookie crumbles,

would saying thats the way the PTP's rice rots be more applicable ?

[khunken]

My heart goes out to this P-Move group, some of whom truly have a legitimate complaint. PTP has turned their backs on these poor of Thailand. They were promised help when PTP needed them, but now are ignored because they are no longer needed. Thai politics at its best.

The PTP has not turned its backs on these people, nor has the PTP anything to do with a dam that was planned in the 1980's and completed in 1994. The issues have been simmering for almost 3 decades. This was a mini mega project financed by the World Bank and was part of a project intended to address flooding problems associated with the Mekong and Mun river systems. Unfortunately, for these plaintiffs, there are tens of thousands on the other side of the dam that benefit from the dam and the reservoir. As well, the dam generates electricity that is used in the region. To all those clueless people seeking to blame the current government for a problem that owes its origins to the development plans of the 1980's long before Thaksin was in office, please provide your solution.

There is no doubt that the dam has caused significant environmental damage and displaced many people. That's how dams work in Thailand. I can't wait for all of the engineering geniuses making their negative comments to provide their solutions that will also address the needs of the tens of thousands residents downstream who will suffer flooding and a lack of water for agriculture if the dam and reservoir are removed.

Your take on the Pak Moon dam is almost half-right.

Yes, the problem has been going on for decades, ever since the dam was built. The dispute is really with EGAT who have consistently lied to the local people. The sluice gates issue has had various government involvement with promises made that were not kept by EGAT and not followed up by the governments (of all shapes).

The Pak Moon people have not called for the removal of the dam (this is demonising them) but a fair solution in allowing the sluice gates to open for enough time for them to catch fish.

The dam produces a very small amount of electricity (which was it's supposed purpose) and has been heavily criticised by outside activists who include it in the World Bank's formerly excessive support for dams.

[crazygreg44]

I think that it would be interesting to hear the other side of the story before accepting thse protester's claims as genuine. The concept of "abandoned land" is novel; national parks encroachers claiming ownership because of length of illegal tenancy is a bit old; and the demand to waste valuable national energy and water resources so that someone can go fishing borders on the sublime.

what if someone told them how to do sustainable fishing ? These people fish everything that moves in water with nets so tight that no baby fish can escape. It would be better if they breed fish in small tanks, then set them free in the above dam waters, and give them time to grow to a size acceptable to sustainable fishing. When netting, they must throw back all fish that are smaller than a thumb. If just anyone told them. But these people are uneducated and fish until the last baby fish has disapeared from the reservoir and the adjacent rivers, and then start to demonstrate in front of parliament "give us back the fish"

Indeed, bordering the sublime . . . . .

Edited May 9, 2013 by crazygreg44

[khunken]

I think that it would be interesting to hear the other side of the story before accepting thse protester's claims as genuine. The concept of "abandoned land" is novel; national parks encroachers claiming ownership because of length of illegal tenancy is a bit old; and the demand to waste valuable national energy and water resources so that someone can go fishing borders on the sublime.

what if someone told them how to do sustainable fishing ? These people fish everything that moves in water with nets so tight that no baby fish can escape. It would be better if they breed fish in small tanks, then set them free in the above dam waters, and give them time to grow to a size acceptable to sustainable fishing. When netting, they must throw back all fish that are smaller than a thumb. If just anyone told them. But these people are uneducated and fish until the last baby fish has disapeared from the reservoir and the adjacent rivers, and then start to demonstrate in front of parliament "give us back the fish"

Indeed, bordering the sublime . . . . .

Total rubbish.

Many Thai communities have relied on fishing to at least partially feed themselves & their families for generations. If they wiped the rivers, lakes & resevoirs clean, they wouldn't have survived. They know better than any outsider how much fish to take so that they don't destroy their own livlihood.

The exception is the larger trawlers with their gill-net type of fishing which is unsustainable. They are mostly owned by influential people too big to touch.

[waza]

I think that it would be interesting to hear the other side of the story before accepting thse protester's claims as genuine. The concept of "abandoned land" is novel; national parks encroachers claiming ownership because of length of illegal tenancy is a bit old; and the demand to waste valuable national energy and water resources so that someone can go fishing borders on the sublime.

what if someone told them how to do sustainable fishing ? These people fish everything that moves in water with nets so tight that no baby fish can escape. It would be better if they breed fish in small tanks, then set them free in the above dam waters, and give them time to grow to a size acceptable to sustainable fishing. When netting, they must throw back all fish that are smaller than a thumb. If just anyone told them. But these people are uneducated and fish until the last baby fish has disapeared from the reservoir and the adjacent rivers, and then start to demonstrate in front of parliament "give us back the fish"

Indeed, bordering the sublime . . . . .

The Pak Mool villagers want the dam's sluice gates to be kept open all year round so they can continue with their traditional profession of fishing as the dam blocks the path for fish.