Giving the extended family a piece of my mind

[SinglePot]

Ain't just your bone that is different. Play your cards carefully kimroe or you might just end up in the Bangkok hilton

[digibum]

anyone telling a 5 year old that they are fat & ugly needs a slap, so you did well to just give them a bollocking.

I don't care who they are or what country they come from, saying stuff like that to a child is out of order. I am tiger mother where my son is concerned & my husbands family know that the rules start & end with me when it comes to my boy. They all respect that, if they like it or not I don't know nor do I really care.

I show appropriate respect to them but also expect it back. It is not a one way street. Had the same happened in my family I would have done the same as op .

Parenting achieved.

Boo, brilliant answer and spot on. I think all the advice of "when" you should have put a stop to this is irrational. Wisdom in hindsight is a marvelous thing, but sadly we have not developed the skills to turn the clocks back - yet! As a human being, the OP was pushed to his limit and by God under the circumstances, I would have felt exactly the same way. Life should be full of fun and happiness, not eroded by frequent snide remarks, gradually cutting away people's confidence, to be replaced by frustration and depression. Ozzy111, I and many others are completely on side with you and if the wider Family can't or won't understand the damage they have the potential to cause, then they are not worth worrying about. In time it might be worth testing the ground by offering the "olive branch" in some way. If it is rejected, move on and live your happy Family life without them. Good luck.

Why is it that because you can't do it, all humans are not evolved enough? Go to New York City and see how far you get by letting people push you around until you explode. Try that in a corporate business environment.

I mean, when you go to a restaurant and they bring you the wrong order there are (at least) two types of people in the world, those that send the food back and those who say, "Oh, it's okay, I'll eat it. I don't want to be a bother." You don't have to be a jerk about it. You can be extremely polite while asserting yourself.

People have learned to do it. It's a matter of understanding that you're likely doing it because you don't have the confidence to stick up for yourself so it's easier to seek harmony by accepting it and hoping they don't do it again. But they will. And the more you don't say anything, the more people will do it.

You're actually helping yourself by sticking up for yourself each and every time someone wrongs you. I'm not talking about taking them outside for a fight or anything. I'm not even talking about creating a scene. Often, just letting someone know that you don't approve or are unwilling to accept their behavior is all it takes.

I mean, would you rather have a boss who steers you towards the type of employee they want or would you rather they say nothing and then call you into their office one day and fire you because they were too afraid to say anything?

OP did wait way too long to address the issue, IMHO. Had he done it sooner he could have saved himself 10 years of biting his tongue and becoming frustrated. The incident in his home would never have even occurred because the rules would have already been established. And most importantly, his daughter would have avoided several years of snide remarks from her relatives that went totally unchecked.

Yes, he was right in sticking up for himself but by waiting 10 years to do it, 10 years worth of frustration was released in a single incident. All I'm saying is that he could have had 10 frustration-free years had he nipped it in the bud earlier and on each occurrence

[SinglePot]

Australians do not have a clue when it comes to Thais.

they play Australian rules. Thais play a different game.

[dao16]

anyone telling a 5 year old that they are fat & ugly needs a slap, so you did well to just give them a bollocking.

I don't care who they are or what country they come from, saying stuff like that to a child is out of order. I am tiger mother where my son is concerned & my husbands family know that the rules start & end with me when it comes to my boy. They all respect that, if they like it or not I don't know nor do I really care.

I show appropriate respect to them but also expect it back. It is not a one way street. Had the same happened in my family I would have done the same as op .

Parenting achieved.

Boo, brilliant answer and spot on. I think all the advice of "when" you should have put a stop to this is irrational. Wisdom in hindsight is a marvelous thing, but sadly we have not developed the skills to turn the clocks back - yet! As a human being, the OP was pushed to his limit and by God under the circumstances, I would have felt exactly the same way. Life should be full of fun and happiness, not eroded by frequent snide remarks, gradually cutting away people's confidence, to be replaced by frustration and depression. Ozzy111, I and many others are completely on side with you and if the wider Family can't or won't understand the damage they have the potential to cause, then they are not worth worrying about. In time it might be worth testing the ground by offering the "olive branch" in some way. If it is rejected, move on and live your happy Family life without them. Good luck.

Why is it that because you can't do it, all humans are not evolved enough? Go to New York City and see how far you get by letting people push you around until you explode. Try that in a corporate business environment.

I mean, when you go to a restaurant and they bring you the wrong order there are (at least) two types of people in the world, those that send the food back and those who say, "Oh, it's okay, I'll eat it. I don't want to be a bother." You don't have to be a jerk about it. You can be extremely polite while asserting yourself.

People have learned to do it. It's a matter of understanding that you're likely doing it because you don't have the confidence to stick up for yourself so it's easier to seek harmony by accepting it and hoping they don't do it again. But they will. And the more you don't say anything, the more people will do it.

You're actually helping yourself by sticking up for yourself each and every time someone wrongs you. I'm not talking about taking them outside for a fight or anything. I'm not even talking about creating a scene. Often, just letting someone know that you don't approve or are unwilling to accept their behavior is all it takes.

I mean, would you rather have a boss who steers you towards the type of employee they want or would you rather they say nothing and then call you into their office one day and fire you because they were too afraid to say anything?

OP did wait way too long to address the issue, IMHO. Had he done it sooner he could have saved himself 10 years of biting his tongue and becoming frustrated. The incident in his home would never have even occurred because the rules would have already been established. And most importantly, his daughter would have avoided several years of snide remarks from her relatives that went totally unchecked.

Yes, he was right in sticking up for himself but by waiting 10 years to do it, 10 years worth of frustration was released in a single incident. All I'm saying is that he could have had 10 frustration-free years had he nipped it in the bud earlier and on each occurrence

I totally agree, but I do understand the guy's situation with the wife. Mine is the same -- don't say anything.....just let it pass, or there will be a big problem. So, I find I end up either finessing my way through (usually the best) or, at worst, holding back and then exploding. I try to avoid the latter. Get your dissatisfaction out there early, but in a way that is subtle enough to not cause a scene. Anyway, just my experience.

[xenophon]

A few ideas:

1. If relevant, turn off the money (to the in-laws) and let them know why. But after 10 yrs probably too late for that. May have been a good idea in the first 6 mths.

2. Just chill and then later, casually let a third party, possibly the yai, know about the chat your niece (?) had with your daughter. Let the family sort it.

3. Unless they are all a**holes, let someone senior know how upset you are. Let them sort it within their own culture. If they don't, well, consider the mental welfare of your kids.

But, unfortunately, I agree with earlier poster who said you need to establish your place in the pecking order earler.

[xenophon]

Australians do not have a clue when it comes to Thais.

they play Australian rules. Thais play a different game.

Obviously an intercultural sage, unburdened by ethnocentricity or fettered by learning. All germans are ... Brits are.. Americans are ...etc., etc.

Edited July 1, 2013 by xenophon

[SinglePot]

feeling better OP.

You have the whole of Australia on your side.

[SinglePot]

Australians do not have a clue when it comes to Thais.

they play Australian rules. Thais play a different game.

Obviously and intercultural sage, unburdened by ethnocentricity or fettered by learning. All germans are ... Brits are.. Americans are ...etc., etc.

The problems expressed by OP are either because the extended thai family is not playing by Australian rules or he is not understanding the dynamics. Thai uncle calls his niece fat. 2 reasons. Either it is playful teasing which Thais do a lot or there is a serious underlying issue. As I posted earlier, Thai wife is central to this dynamic between nuclear and extended family. OP needs to talk to wife before he talks to TV forum.

Possibility exists that the extended family are just plain bad. Doubtful if the OP married into it?

All of my experience in Thailand is it is rare for extended family to give nuclear family grief. Plenty of times the farang gets the short straw but what OP is saying is not an example of this. Or maybe it is.

[meatboy]

whats my wf.like?if any of her family[bros/sister] need a hand out if she has it ok,but when if they ask to borrow thats when she says no have,they all know the meaning of the word to"borrow" but not the meaning of"to pay it back".

she for me is one of a kind,we moved onto a new moo-ban bigest house and land all the nosey neighbours wanted to know why married to a farang yet for the past 3yrs,no bike,no new car,just a rusty old bike in a drive that 4cars can park.

they all got the message eventually mind your own business,i did by her a bike[march] i was fed up with hearing the squeaky bike peddling up and down the road,then we did promise our beloved that we would buy a car [sept]so he could go out with us for rides,

but if anyone asks about the car they soon shut up when she say's its only to take our boy for a ride.

[ozzy111]

Australians do not have a clue when it comes to Thais.

they play Australian rules. Thais play a different game.

Just wondering what Nationality are you Single Pot?

[ABCer]

Never had any similar situations facing me. My wife is from BKK and has only 2 daughters which she manages herself.

I can feel your concern and pain.

You did a good job. Now keep your ground. Do not succumb to your wife's wishes to make up and smooth out the wrinkles - you will loose all the gains. Convince her that you are right.

She must be on your side! - make a good job of this too, it's important for you.

Most importantly - not a cent to any of them, including parents.

As a little bit of criticism:

- Why did you take 10 years to do this?

- Why do you need our approval?... (you've got it from most people here, but Why do you need it?... if it feels right - it must be right! ... trust yourself)

Best of luck

Edited July 2, 2013 by ABCer

[bangkokfanatic]

Your own 5 year old is much more important to you than your wife's uncle's daughter.

You defended your family and your wife should be rightfully proud you did.

Well said!

... and you should take the opportunity to calmly sit down with wifey & carefully explain that to her, including making her understand that your kids are the most important asset that the two of you have together....

[ABCer]

Australians do not have a clue when it comes to Thais.

they play Australian rules. Thais play a different game.

Just wondering what Nationality are you Single Pot?

Ozzy, do not listen to SP. It does not matter where is he from. Nobody knows Thais, not even other Thais.

This is not a game. It is your life. And if you cannot convince yourself and your wife to live it the way you think is right - you will have to live it the way her Thai Family wants it.

Edited July 2, 2013 by metisdead
Unnecessary usage of bold font remove. Please stop using bold font when posting.

[bangkokfanatic]

....... But after a while I started to get irritated as wife's sister would do wash and laundry for her and daughter, but never helped clean the rest of the house, would cook and leave everything dirty for my wife to clean up. One evening I had a quiet conversation with my wife and told her that her sister either had to start helping around here, or she couldn't live here any more. Much to my surprise, my wife said she had been thinking the same thing..... She told me that she would "handle it".

..... there was a not so polite, one way conversation from my wife to her sister, which ended with sister storming back upstairs. I asked my wife what she had said, as back then I didn't understand a word of Thai, and she informed me that she had told her sister she was tired of her sister's lazy, disrespectful attitude, and that either she start helping to keep this house clean, or get out. Sister and daughter were gone the next day. ...... if I had said anything it would have caused problems in the family, but since she is pretty much the "matriarch" of the family, it was her "right" to do so, and that no one would question it.....

Change "sister" for "young brother" and you have my situation exactly. We live in 12 acres in Chaiyaphum province and have the extended family living in another house 40m away. After a blow-up over washing dishes followed by young brother parking the truck in our carport (which he'd been told not to happen under any circumstances) my GF told them to get out. ALL of them, including her own mother (who stupidly sided with young brother)!

They packed up & sat in the carport of the other house for 4 days as they had no-where to go. GF waited until they came with tail between legs. She rules the roost & made it very clear that's how it was going to stay.

Things have gone very quiet now and everybody pitches in. I certainly agree though - when it comes to the inter-Thai family dynamics it does seem better for farangs to remain 2 steps behind the wife. We tend to put our size 12 feet in it!

[ozzy111]

Never had any similar situations facing me. My wife is from BKK and has only 2 daughters which she manages herself.

I can feel your concern and pain.

You did a good job. Now keep your ground. Do not succumb to your wife's wishes to make up and smooth out the wrinkles - you will loose all the gains. Convince her that you are right.

She must be on your side! - make a good job of this too, it's important for you.

Most importantly - not a cent to any of them, including parents.

As a little bit of criticism:

- Why did you take 10 years to do this?

- Why do you need our approval?... (you've got it from most people here, but Why do you need it?... if it feels right - it must be right! ... trust yourself)

Best of luck

Thanks for your opinion, answers to your questions

- Why did you take 10 years to do this?

Mostly because I let my wife deal with her family and try to keep my distance from their family business, also I have never had them so blatantly insult my kid within ear shot of me.

.

- Why do you need our approval?... (you've got it from most people here, but Why do you need it?... if it feels right - it must be right! ... trust yourself)

Didn't ask for or need any approval just told my story had a bit of a vent and asked if anyone had experienced something similar.

[His Masters Voice]

How have you dealt with your daughter since this happened?

How has your wife dealt with your daughter since this happened?

Why do you think that your wife's uncles his daughter think that your daughter is fat?

If your daughter is used to having the extended family around, she might be feeling a little lost as why they don't visit any more and may blame herself.

[ozzy111]

How have you dealt with your daughter since this happened?

How has your wife dealt with your daughter since this happened?

Why do you think that your wife's uncles his daughter think that your daughter is fat?

If your daughter is used to having the extended family around, she might be feeling a little lost as why they don't visit any more and may blame herself.

How have you dealt with your daughter since this happened?

How has your wife dealt with your daughter since this happened?

Wife and I have just got on with life as normal, no problems

Why do you think that your wife's uncles his daughter think that your daughter is fat?

I feel that it is because she is a head taller than anyone else her age in the village, obviously bigger and well feed not like some of the kids families who struggle to support their basic needs. When she goes to school with other half/half kids (our kids go to an international school) they are all of similar size. Anyway it's not about whether she is or isn't fat they just like to tease her, my wife has been subject to this her whole life from them. She was then the nerdy girl that loved school and instead of getting married and knocked up at 17 like various other family members she decided to study and they (some extended family not her parents) gave her heaps for it as she had a couple of opportunities to get married to "wealthy men" (crazy I know) so maybe it's really her fathers in a way. I'm glad he backed her as far as her education was concerned instead of just marring her off like often happens, anyway but after high school she got excepted into Sydney UNI which is where we met and now her success is what they put her down for.

If your daughter is used to having the extended family around, she might be feeling a little lost as why they don't visit any more and may blame herself.

My wife and kids go around to see the relo's and she plays with her little cousins etc as normal still so she is really none the wiser they just don't come to mine at the moment, which suits me I have to work from home and prefer the peace and quite.

[patongphil]

Hope you have a work permit

[ozzy111]

Hope you have a work permit

LOL. I was waiting for that, yes all good on that front.

[Munger]

Australians do not have a clue when it comes to Thais.

they play Australian rules. Thais play a different game.

Just wondering what Nationality are you Single Pot?

My guess is "Single Pot" is Thai. or would like to be

[Straight8]

Your own 5 year old is much more important to you than your wife's uncle's daughter.

You defended your family and your wife should be rightfully proud you did.

You could be correct, but its a big if, and i sense from the OP's comment [ my wife although she feels we/she have lost face in some way] that it's not in some way, sounds like a big way.

That type of behaviour is simply disgusting & unforgivable, and I would have a good chat with the wife, if she feels a loss of face in the ever so slightest.

Your wife should be backing you & the kids 110%, loss of face should not even be murmured here.

[bigdod]

Your own 5 year old is much more important to you than your wife's uncle's daughter.

You defended your family and your wife should be rightfully proud you did.

You could be correct, but its a big if, and i sense from the OP's comment [ my wife although she feels we/she have lost face in some way] that it's not in some way, sounds like a big way.

That type of behaviour is simply disgusting & unforgivable, and I would have a good chat with the wife, if she feels a loss of face in the ever so slightest.

Your wife should be backing you & the kids 110%, loss of face should not even be murmured here.

This whole "face" thing boils my pi$$... I tend to agree with Straight8 here - I'd say you need to be explaining to your ol' lady that they were causing YOU to lose face by belittling your family and that comment to your daughter, which is the type of comment that could damage her emotionally - was the last straw. For you to consider yourself a man, you had to react. She then needs to be letting her family know that it cuts both ways and she has your 6. For me, I'd have said something long before now, but thats just the way I am.. but either way, you did the right thing sticking up for your kid. If they cant get over that, f*** them.

I'm pretty lucky in that her immediate family stick up for me 100% (although in 5yrs have NEVER asked me for one penny) but the extended family are not so enamoured with me coz they're not on my hand-out list. She just tells anyone with any shitty comments to come with her and tell me to my face, which they never do, coz they all know what they'll get. I could care less if any of them ever came round my place again...

Well done mate - just you stick by your guns.

[ABCer]

OK Ozzy, I see what you mean. Good luck.

Now, for a kind of entertainment and for the benefit of others I will tell you a short story.

Two mates of the same age and similar standing got married to two girls and each came to live into the girl's family.

After 6 months they have met shared their life stories.

One guy was really happy, well fed, cleanly dressed and couldn't stop praising his wife and her mother.

Second guy was depressed, shabby, malnourished and had scratched hands, face and head.

The first asked what has happened. " It's the bloody cat who runs the family. He hates me, they love this cat and there is little I can do".

- Poor sod, - said the first guy. - My wife also had a cat. But I do not like them. So, the very first time it came near me I gave it a good thrashing and threw it out of the house.

I told my wife and her mother that it's me or the cat... We are all happy now, her mother is dotting over me and the cat happily lives with her brother's family.

I was told this tale by my father when I was 12 years old. Anything you do not like - 'kill it' the very first day, or suffer for the rest of your life.

BTW - I am a cat lover.

[SinglePot]

Here's a shorter story.

Thai girl says to me in London: 'Me happy you love Thailand'.

Learnt that lesson long before I came here.

I had a bit of a head start so to speak.

Edited July 2, 2013 by SinglePot

[chuckd]

Your own 5 year old is much more important to you than your wife's uncle's daughter.

You defended your family and your wife should be rightfully proud you did.

You could be correct, but its a big if, and i sense from the OP's comment [ my wife although she feels we/she have lost face in some way] that it's not in some way, sounds like a big way.

That type of behaviour is simply disgusting & unforgivable, and I would have a good chat with the wife, if she feels a loss of face in the ever so slightest.

Your wife should be backing you & the kids 110%, loss of face should not even be murmured here.

I don't understand your post. You say my quoted post is "a big if" and "could be correct"..

I thought I was farily explicit in saying that his daughter is more important to him than a somewhat distant relative of his wife and his wife should be proud of his actions.

What part of that is open for speculation? Just curious.

[Straight8]

Your own 5 year old is much more important to you than your wife's uncle's daughter.

You defended your family and your wife should be rightfully proud you did.

You could be correct, but its a big if, and i sense from the OP's comment [ my wife although she feels we/she have lost face in some way] that it's not in some way, sounds like a big way.

That type of behaviour is simply disgusting & unforgivable, and I would have a good chat with the wife, if she feels a loss of face in the ever so slightest.

Your wife should be backing you & the kids 110%, loss of face should not even be murmured here.

I don't understand your post. You say my quoted post is "a big if" and "could be correct"..

I thought I was farily explicit in saying that his daughter is more important to him than a somewhat distant relative of his wife and his wife should be proud of his actions.

What part of that is open for speculation? Just curious.

chuckd,

When I say you "could be correct", what I mean is you are spot with everything you say up until you say "your wife should be rightfully proud you did" and if you read my post I quote where he says "[my wife although she feels we/she have lost face in some way]".

Now was she really proud or suffered a loss of face or both ??? . Again I hope for the OP's sake its the former, but I sense the loss of face is of bigger importance, which is what I was centering my attention on.

Under a circumstance of this natures, if I sensed my wife had a loss of face over something like this, I would really have given her a reason to lose face, in no uncertain terms.

Edited July 3, 2013 by Straight8

[SinglePot]

'Houston, we have a problem.'

Looks like nuclear extended separation.

[chuckd]

Your own 5 year old is much more important to you than your wife's uncle's daughter.

You defended your family and your wife should be rightfully proud you did.

You could be correct, but its a big if, and i sense from the OP's comment [ my wife although she feels we/she have lost face in some way] that it's not in some way, sounds like a big way.

That type of behaviour is simply disgusting & unforgivable, and I would have a good chat with the wife, if she feels a loss of face in the ever so slightest.

Your wife should be backing you & the kids 110%, loss of face should not even be murmured here.

I don't understand your post. You say my quoted post is "a big if" and "could be correct"..

I thought I was farily explicit in saying that his daughter is more important to him than a somewhat distant relative of his wife and his wife should be proud of his actions.

What part of that is open for speculation? Just curious.

chuckd,

When I say you "could be correct", what I mean is you are spot with everything you say up until you say "your wife should be rightfully proud you did" and if you read my post I quote where he says "[my wife although she feels we/she have lost face in some way]".

Now was she really proud or suffered a loss of face or both ??? . Again I hope for the OP's sake its the former, but I sense the loss of face is of bigger importance, which is what I was centering my attention on.

Under a circumstance of this natures, if I sensed my wife had a loss of face over something like this, I would really have given her a reason to lose face, in no uncertain terms.

Thanks for the clarification. Cheers.

[Espen]

I would say that you had a chance to nip this in the bud 10 years ago and the opportunity is now lost. You didn't establish your place in the pecking order and have been relegated to your present position. Face was lost a long time ago but your recent outburst has just crystalised it for everybody concerned.

How to remedy it? I haven't got a clue, but I doubt the situation will improve much with time.

I am trying to understand this point of view, but no matter how hard I try I can`t get my head up my ass.

You did the right thing. Don`t worry about the face-thing. They seem to grow new faces each morning. Since they stopped trying to put your family down you can be proud of what you did.

[krisb]

Good on ya op! How dare they tell YOUR daughter that the rude pigs. Id rather the loose face thing then have them around anyday. Its jealousy and the tall poppy syndrome.