If you witness a heart attack victim

[jko]

What will you do if someone collapses with a heart attack in your presence - and everybody else is just flapping around in a panic? Can you take over, and maybe save a life?

If you don't already know what to do, it's worth watching this 6-min video which explains a new, CPR technique which does not require mouth-to-mouth - just very quick action.

http://ahsc.arizona.edu/node/730

Hope it helps someone to help someone.

[jrtmedic]

This technique is not "new".

It has been supported for some time now as an effective means of enabling life support to be provided by "Lay" members of the public.

Some movement of air in/out of the lungs will take place if the compressions are adequate.

Providing compressions at a rate of 100/min can be tiring and should if possible be shared by 2/-3 persons thus maintaining effective resuscitation.

Thanks for providing a link to that excellent video!

[jmccarty]

New to me! Probably 30 years since I last took a CPR course.

[jrtmedic]

OK !

It was the "P" (Pulmonary ) part of CPR which proved to be difficult for general public to implement involving as it did a requirement for "mouth to mouth" breathing.

With the emphasis now just being on CR (Cardiac Resus) more effective resuscitation efforts can be made by the public.

[I Like Thai]

When doing chest compressions, you need to apply enough force to break the breast bone and some ribs. Not effective otherwise

Edited August 7, 2013 by I Like Thai

[jrtmedic]

I Like Thai

Not necessarily true!

"Chest compressions should be carried out at a depth of 5cm to 6cm, at a rate of 100 to 120 compressions per minute."

​It is important to learn about correct hand placement on the chest .

Ref. Resuscitation Council (UK)

Edited August 7, 2013 by jrtmedic

[Tywais]

Good video. I had emergency medical and CPR training in the military but that has been a long time ago. Just a bit puzzled about the 'don't clear the airway' part though. Even though the video says the body has enough oxygen there is going to be a limit to that and if the airway is not clear, such as vomiting, then that seems it would be an issue.

[jrtmedic]

Tyswais

The modified technique was evolved essentially for use within urban areas where Emergency service personnel are able to respond within a very short time span.

For those living/working in more rural locations learning "traditional" CPR may be wise .

[NCC1701A]

I am curious what Thai law says about rendering aid. I could see doing CPR on a Farang tourist, but I would be concerned what might happen to me if the person who I was trying to help died. Would a Thai family blame you for the family members death? All I read on Thai Visa is don't get involved with anything.

Edited August 7, 2013 by NCC1701A

[I Like Thai]

Doing CPR is basically ineffective in attempting to restart the heart in any case and it would be very rare that anyone has any success with it. That is why variations to the procedure are frequent. It is basically an attempt at something different, that might work.

Blowing smoke up someones a_se might be more effective

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6uEJbwGYaDs

[NCC1701A]

Doing CPR is basically ineffective in attempting to restart the heart in any case and it would be very rare that anyone has any success with it. That is why variations to the procedure are frequent. It is basically an attempt at something different, that might work.

Blowing smoke up someones a_se might be more effective

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6uEJbwGYaDs

you are not restarting the heart.

[jrtmedic]

I Like Thai

The aim of CPR is to maintain a circulation Not to "re-start the heart !

The most common cause of out of hospital "cardiac arrest" is ventricular fibrillation. This disturbance of cardiac rhythm can be reversed by the use of a defibrillator.

Effective CPR coupled with early defibrillation has resulted in long term survival rates of somewhere between 2-15%(from memory)

So a bit more effective than "blowing smoke"

[I Like Thai]

Doing CPR is basically ineffective in attempting to restart the heart in any case and it would be very rare that anyone has any success with it. That is why variations to the procedure are frequent. It is basically an attempt at something different, that might work.

Blowing smoke up someones a_se might be more effective

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6uEJbwGYaDs

you are not restarting the heart.

That is the crux of it. If the heart doesn't restart, then the victim is brown bread. pumping blood manually around the system is not effective, therefore CPR is not effective.

[jrtmedic]

I Like Thai

Have you got the "Do Not Attempt CPR On Me" tattoo (large letters !) inked on your chest ?

Just asking

[I Like Thai]

I Like Thai

Have you got the "Do Not Attempt CPR On Me" tattoo (large letters !) inked on your chest ?

Just asking

No, but a person drowning will also clutch at a straw

[NCC1701A]

Doing CPR is basically ineffective in attempting to restart the heart in any case and it would be very rare that anyone has any success with it. That is why variations to the procedure are frequent. It is basically an attempt at something different, that might work.

Blowing smoke up someones a_se might be more effective

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6uEJbwGYaDs

you are not restarting the heart.

That is the crux of it. If the heart doesn't restart, then the victim is brown bread. pumping blood manually around the system is not effective, therefore CPR is not effective.

are you serious? i can't tell.

[I Like Thai]

Doing CPR is basically ineffective in attempting to restart the heart in any case and it would be very rare that anyone has any success with it. That is why variations to the procedure are frequent. It is basically an attempt at something different, that might work.

Blowing smoke up someones a_se might be more effective

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6uEJbwGYaDs

you are not restarting the heart.

That is the crux of it. If the heart doesn't restart, then the victim is brown bread. pumping blood manually around the system is not effective, therefore CPR is not effective.

are you serious? i can't tell.

The low success rate of CPR may be an example of how a medical myth is perpetuated by the media because it is more appealing than the truth. Unfortunately, sugar-coating the concept of CPR leads to unrealistic expectations when a loved one requires CPR or is ill, and heroic measures are under consideration.

http://www.intelihealth.com/IH/ihtIH/wsihw000/35320/35323/372221.html?d=dmtHMSContent

[NCC1701A]

Wow this just happened right here in Thailand!

"Nattawadee rushed out to perform CPR, which was successful at restarting the man's heart.

The man was then taken to a nearby hospital."

http://bangkok.coconuts.co/2013/08/08/video-bride-be-saves-mans-life-pre-wedding-photoshoot

[Tywais]

Showing continuous cpr in a real emergency. Video below.

Bride-to-be saves man's life ...

//edit - simultaneous posting.

[Chonburiram]

The man died later in hospital.

[I Like Thai]

Doing CPR is basically ineffective in attempting to restart the heart in any case and it would be very rare that anyone has any success with it. That is why variations to the procedure are frequent. It is basically an attempt at something different, that might work.

Blowing smoke up someones a_se might be more effective

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6uEJbwGYaDs

you are not restarting the heart.

Wow this just happened right here in Thailand!

"Nattawadee rushed out to perform CPR, which was successful at restarting the man's heart.

The man was then taken to a nearby hospital."

http://bangkok.coconuts.co/2013/08/08/video-bride-be-saves-mans-life-pre-wedding-photoshoot

If the heart restarts then the victim has a cjance, buy as you outlined yourself, the objective of CPR is not to restart the heart, it is to manually pump the blood.

[Sheryl]

The objective is to maintain enough circulation to keep the person alive until medical personnel are able to address the underlying problem and restore a normal heartbeat.

CPR was never meant to be a routine measure employed when people's hearts stop as the result of a sustained illness...though it has become common to misused fit thus in many hospitals.

Its greatest utility is situations when otherwise healthy people experience cardiac arrest from potentially reversible causes, e.g. drowning, electrocution and the cardiac arrythmias that often follow a heart attack.

[I Like Thai]

I have done two first aid courses over the last ten years. The courses were provided by paramedics who are an ambulance crew. After the CPR part of the course. The two paramedics who had 20 years experience each in the ambulance service, said that they had never attended a situation where CPR had been administered and been successful, not one time and they had been to many many incidents where members of the public had tried to help the casualty with CPR.

[JDGRUEN]

One of the best things to do for a person who is experiencing a heart attack is to administer aspirin.. crushed and placed under the tongue for fast absorption.is what I recommend...

During Heart Attack
Taking aspirin also helps during a heart attack. In fact, people having a heart attack are often given an aspirin by emergency medical services. This may take place in the ambulance or in a hospital emergency room.
Taking an aspirin as soon as symptoms start greatly improves the chance of survival.

http://www.heart.org/HEARTORG/Conditions/HeartAttack/PreventionTreatmentofHeartAttack/Aspirin-and-Heart-Disease_UCM_321714_Article.jsp

[Sheryl]

I've personally administered CPR many times with success.

But in all cases I was there when the person arrested. One of the big problems for paramedics is that they get called to the scene after the acute event.