Homeless foreigners in Thailand 'lack assistance'

[asupeartea]

What about making swindling a crime? Then, the foreign husband would have a recourse to getting the money he was robbed of by his Thai ex-wife.

Oh, TiT. If swindling foreigners was made illegal, then half the population would be imprisoned.

[connda]

What's is 'homeless' and how can you tell? Really? If it's just because I'm hanging out, relaxed and half-asleep, with a weeks worth of stubble growing on my face, picking though the lint in my pocket to find enough baht for a plate of Kaow Soi or a bowl of Jok -- does that make me homeless?

I might look homeless to some expats who lives in an overpriced box out in a Chiang Mai "Gated Community" which they only leave in order to venture to the relative safety of Robinsons at the Mall or Rim Ping market, or perhaps to the monthly CM Expat Club meeting.

Yep, on some days I'm sure I look homeless as I lay on the cement seats next to the moat, just sucking up the sunshine, the birds chirping, the fish breaking the water, and the smell and ambiance that is just Chiang Mai. Yep just laying there, looking at the sky and sucking it all up -- drinking a coke or bottle of water, I might look homeless.

But I'm not! My House Book says I'm not 'hee, hee, hee'. Looks are deceiving, especially after you spend most of your life dressing neat and proper for the military or the corporate world -- and now in my retirement, I can just say, "The heck with it -- I'm letting what hair I have left Down!!!" So in my flip flops and raggy shorts and ripped, comfortable T-shirt that I bought for less than 99 baht at a second store, sitting by the moat without a care -- happy! -- eating fresh pineapple and drinking a cold Nam Singh..and reading the Thai signs on the building, looking a little glassy-eyed. Yep, I might look homeless. I'm completely sober and enjoying life the way I define my life. So out of those 20 or 30 folks in Chiang Mai you identified as homeless, you might be surprised that many are doing just fine -- living well -- although, just not living by your standards. Give it some thought.
Homeless looking, happy, and content in Chiang Mai

Edited August 19, 2013 by connda

[GuestHouse]

It is instructive to see how far down into the depths of human misery and dispair so many TV members have descend to before they can find someone they can look down upon.

Edited August 19, 2013 by GuestHouse

[metisdead]

A post using overly large font has been removed, post using the normal default forum font just like everybody else, if not, your posts will just continue to be removed.

[tingtongfarang]

UPDATE:

Foreigners Being Financially Ruined by Thai Wives

Posted By Editor In Asia

FOREIGNERS BEING FINANCIALLY RUINED BY THAI WIVES – It appears that the Human Rights of a foreign national living in Thailand merely extend only as far as the size of one’s bank account; that is if a foreigner runs out of money, for whatever reason, they can be and should be deported.

Last week we published an article that was sent to us; it floated the idea that maybe Thailand should change its laws regarding Marriage Visas so that a foreigner could not be deported or required to leave simply if he or she couldn’t provide proof of sufficient income.

Foreigners Homeless in Thailand

According to some Government officials there is a growing number of foreign national’s now living rough on the streets. Many, they think, are tourists who ran out of money and are unable to return to their home countries; some are retirees who have fallen on hard times or worst duped or robbed of their possessions by unscrupulous Thai wives.

“In some cases, these foreigners – mostly male Westerners – arrived as tourists or retirees and fell into poverty or neglect after settling down in Thailand, often having being duped or robbed by Thai former wives or partners.” Natee Saravari, secretary-general of the Issarachon Foundation

Natee Saravari believes that some system should be set up in order to aid these people as it is often the case that people just pass them by; even other foreign national’s appear to avoid giving them money when they are begging.

While Natee Saravari comments are commendable, in that he wants to set up a system to provide assistance there is a very unnerving development here.

Full story: http://meebal.com/foreigners-being-financially-ruined-by-thai-wives/

-- Meebal 2013-08-19

Well I read the whole article and you seemed to over look some obvious things.

For instance you related a man's experiance with getting ripped off and followed it up with this.

"Considering this is the case I’m not surprised Thailand has a mounting problem with homeless people but surely a simple change in the law could prevent foreign nationals from being duped and robbed and in the process give Thailand’s image a bit of a shine?

So what does a foreigner do if they fall foul and lose everything? Certainly most foreign embassies are not interested in getting involved in what is nothing more than a civil matter and unlikely to provide any financial assistance."

You first said

"She said she was too ashamed to tell me of her habit which is why she kept silent. I came back from my work offshore to find that the house had been taken by a certain police officer for just a 2 million bath debt."

If he was working why did he have to live on the street he still had an income. There are very few foreigners ripped off so bad that they have to live on the streets of Thailand. The fellow just lost 15,000,000 baht and still was working. He was still able to afford to house himself with the income coming in.

I suspect this is the case in most of the situations where foreigners get ripped of to the tune of a house. They still have an income.

Yes there is probably the exception but they are few and far between. Most of them on the streets are their because of their drug and alcohol habits.

If you want to do a meaningful in depth article why don't you check around and see what the different embassies and consulates really do for there down and out citizens. Notice I said what they do not what can they do.

It did,nt occur to you that many of these foreigners come out of these situations battle scared and mentally damaged? I can imagine some of them not being in a fit mental state to carry on earning an income,

I once met an irish guy in cambodia who seemed to be down at the end after losing it all,

He started to tell me about the house in the north of thailand which he lost along with his life savings, i asked...did it have a blue roof? he answered....how do you know my house has a blue roof? i know these things.

Edited August 19, 2013 by tingtongfarang

[GuestHouse]

But then again perhaps the gloating zeal in condeming homeless farangs which so many here have taken to is explained in the observation that

"we despise in others most that which we fear in ourselves"

[snot goblin]

I too am really disheartened at those on this forum that have no sympathy for the plight of some less fortunate than themselves, be it with money, or the braincells to make it or hold on to it. Hows this for a scenario. Come to Thailand, with a view to a better life, but be sensible and retain your house in the UK, being held in trust for you by a family member...they then steal that property from you in the UK and your left without a home in your name? In otherwords your left homeless except for your Thai home which we all know we can never fully own. Even sensible people can come unstuck, all it needs is for you to a few bad people around you, be they Thai or Farang....even your own flesh and blood can screw up your life!

Maybe you can start a fund to help I know I will help by sending money so they can be saved

leave now. youre heading for their ranks. its just a matter of time.

[malakmd]

Good to see such topic posted here, I think there are some positive solution for this problem.

1- Use these foreigners to community work and utlize their's skills or language to teach Thai in exchange of food, living and one way ticket to their respective country. they must earn before going back and no space for skipping.. Must do stuff.. it will be better than living in IDC and become another burden for tax payer money.. utilize them for good and just send them back.

2- Tourism sector may can create a commercial using these foreigners and educate all foriegners " Don't be homeless when you can have your home at your country".

3- The tourist those has habbit to be overstay or become homeless no matter whatever reason they give, Thai authorities may can ask their respective government not to issue passport for Thailand, this may can control the situtaion.

I do feel sympatthy with them, but how to justify who is realy got trouble and who is not?? It does not matter how many tourist bring how much foreign exchagne to Thailand, Thailand offer so much good to us, so it does matter that you must know the law of visiting country and abide it, just don't become a burdon.. going back home is the best solution..

Edited August 19, 2013 by malakmd

[Loptr]

what is the moral of this story?

The moral, make sure you know the game, if not, enter at your own risk .

If you enter a game of chance and don't realize who the "mark" is within 5 minutes, it's you.

[connda]

Sorry folks habitual homeless people especially those on drugs or alcohol do not seem to want to get off the street. I know a Swede, boy friend of sister of my ex-girlfriend, gave him 2,000 baht for food and ticket to Bangkok and Swedish Embassy, guess what the last time I saw him he is passed out on Sukhumvit Rd. near soi nana.

The notion that these people have been duped by girlfriend or partner is dubious at best. We had one fella here in CM who went thru several million baht and then spent a few days in the local mental hospital, total alcoholic, I believe he is back in England now bad mouthing Thailand.

A few of the street people who hung out in my neighbor hood back in the states always had money from panhandling and their monthly check, it seemed to be a life style they were comfortable with. Yes I know there are exceptions to the rule but that is true in many other facets of life.

These type of folk generally resolve their own problems one way or another: They end up dead, in jail, or eventually make it back to their home country.

[yourauntbob]

if they want to help foreigners then level the playing field for them. how about when a man gets divorced he has rights to the half the proceeds of the sale of the land and half the other assets. Also, how about actually trying to recoupe the money that foreigners are duped out of through their businesses when they are forced to put up 100% of the capital and only get to keep 49% of the company. this is not to mention all the money that is swindled out of guys via their girlfirend. if i was to believe all the stories i hear, then being a buffalo veterinarian must be awefully profitable with how often they get sick and all the care they recieve. how many people out their on TV purchased a car in Thailand but no longer have access to it?

the list goes on and on but i dont see it changing anytime soon

[giggles]

what is the moral of this story?

The moral, make sure you know the game, if not, enter at your own risk .

many will end up sans a pot to pee in ,as we see here .

from comfortably off to badly off

[zydeco]

If I'm going to be homeless, I'm going to do it in Honolulu.

[connda]

But then again perhaps the gloating zeal in condeming homeless farangs which so many here have taken to is explained in the observation that

"we despise in others most that which we fear in ourselves"

Here is something else to dwell on. Proportionally are their more (or less) farang living off the Thai Social Welfare system than there are impoverished Thais living in farang countries living off their host country's Social Welfare System.

That an easy one. There is no Social Welfare System. for a farang to live off of in Thailand. However, in my home country, if a Thai or other foreigners can set foot on our sovereign land , especially with their kids in tow, that family will be well cared for by the State. And if you stay in my country long enough, even illegally, your on a fast track to citizenship.

I love the most vehemently self righteous TVs who have never had to struggle financially during their lives. Having a silver spoon jammed up your posterior all your life tends to deflate the level of compassion you can accumulate over your lifetime. 'Eh? Just saying.

[connda]

Especially in the case of these unfortunate souls who have spent their last savings on scooping up those cute, young bar girls, only to find that they are less loved and admired than that first, special night, I believe positive corrective action must be implemented. Perhaps, in addition to forced health insurance, it would be wise for the Thai government to insist on anti-stupidity insurance. Additionally, a 3 day course on how to outwit those pretty young things before you invest in prenuptial Sin Sod agreements, home purchases and automobile down payments. Bar fine and Short time Records should be posted and updated on the internet hourly. If these steps are implemented, Thailand will not only generate income on the anti-stupidity insurance, but will also save money on their efforts to get these unfortunate souls of the street.

The Thai government should insist that expats intending to stay in Thailand and require an O visa must attend a similar program as the Philippines, the Pre-Departure Registration and Orientation Seminars, prior to the O visa being issued

http://www.cfo.gov.ph/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=1378%3Apre-departure-registration-and-orientation-seminars&catid=145%3Aintegration-and-reintegration&Itemid=833

Just what is needed: more bureaucracy to make the system function so much better. Ya'll are making a mountain out of a molehill. Virtually everyone here meets that financial requirements. Hell, we go through that same song and dance every year during immigration extensions and review. Yes! I've been married to the same Thai women for over 6 years, I support her, her son, her extended family, but crap, let's add more paperwork just to make sure.

Dumb idea imho.

[connda]

I wonder how many Thai citizens are homeless in the US, UK or Australia? Probably not that many.

The difference could be in my opinion is people are treated as equals and allowed to find jobs wherever

anybody will hire them. In the kingdom, foreigners, actually "white" people are not allowed to work other than

teaching and that's not for everybody considering the state of the public school system.

If you're Asian, you can work just about anywhere they will hire you. I see people from Africa at

Chatuchak market selling gems and all kinds of things. I don't see any farang getting any normal

basic jobs. Money is not everything, quality of life is. Not all of us are about making 5 times more than the Thai

but rather having a sense of security and a place to call home.

Strength comes from diversity, and due to the homogenous nature of Thailand it's not a strong country and

should be aware of the dangers that could bring. Just my opinion of course.

asia is for asians.

I think Jim Rogers and Marc Faber would beg to disagree with you. (Me too)

[simple1]

Especially in the case of these unfortunate souls who have spent their last savings on scooping up those cute, young bar girls, only to find that they are less loved and admired than that first, special night, I believe positive corrective action must be implemented. Perhaps, in addition to forced health insurance, it would be wise for the Thai government to insist on anti-stupidity insurance. Additionally, a 3 day course on how to outwit those pretty young things before you invest in prenuptial Sin Sod agreements, home purchases and automobile down payments. Bar fine and Short time Records should be posted and updated on the internet hourly. If these steps are implemented, Thailand will not only generate income on the anti-stupidity insurance, but will also save money on their efforts to get these unfortunate souls of the street.

The Thai government should insist that expats intending to stay in Thailand and require an O visa must attend a similar program as the Philippines, the Pre-Departure Registration and Orientation Seminars, prior to the O visa being issued

http://www.cfo.gov.ph/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=1378%3Apre-departure-registration-and-orientation-seminars&catid=145%3Aintegration-and-reintegration&Itemid=833

Just what is needed: more bureaucracy to make the system function so much better. Ya'll are making a mountain out of a molehill. Virtually everyone here meets that financial requirements. Hell, we go through that same song and dance every year during immigration extensions and review. Yes! I've been married to the same Thai women for over 6 years, I support her, her son, her extended family, but crap, let's add more paperwork just to make sure.

Dumb idea imho.

relax, you overlooked the smile icon

[tigergrl]

a little compassion would go a long way.. folks get into trouble through various means.. sometimes not of their own fault. someone robs you or steals your lifesavings.. it's a hard row to hoe. sometimes people do have mental or addiction issues. for some folks it might be too late to start over.. maybe they have no family or friends.. assistance should be given through a combination of identifying those in need by the Thai authorities with cooperation from the individual embassy. seems very harsh to abandon ones citizens who may just need a little hand to get back on their feet.

[ThePinkPanther]

All and ALL now here been said, this is NOT such a difficult problem to take care of at all is it? Thailand should just STOP their stupid attitude of "Thai-Law helps Thai people only" and apply realistic moral law equally to EVERYBODY residing here in this country Thailand. If you're Thai and steel from anybody, you either PAY back or go to jail. If you're pharang and you steel from anybody, you either PAY back or you go to jail. Plain and simple. Whatever could be the problem?

[GuestHouse]

I love the most vehemently self righteous TVs who have never had to struggle financially during their lives. Having a silver spoon jammed up your posterior all your life tends to deflate the level of compassion you can accumulate over your lifetime. 'Eh? Just saying.

.

That's a big chip you are hauling around.... Fabricated from your own ill founded assumptions.

[ThePinkPanther]

WHAT?

what is the moral of this story?

[connda]

If I'm going to be homeless, I'm going to do it in Honolulu.

I believe that Honolulu has a $1/4 million program that will offer you a free ticket back to the Mainland. Lol.

[connda]

Especially in the case of these unfortunate souls who have spent their last savings on scooping up those cute, young bar girls, only to find that they are less loved and admired than that first, special night, I believe positive corrective action must be implemented. Perhaps, in addition to forced health insurance, it would be wise for the Thai government to insist on anti-stupidity insurance. Additionally, a 3 day course on how to outwit those pretty young things before you invest in prenuptial Sin Sod agreements, home purchases and automobile down payments. Bar fine and Short time Records should be posted and updated on the internet hourly. If these steps are implemented, Thailand will not only generate income on the anti-stupidity insurance, but will also save money on their efforts to get these unfortunate souls of the street.

The Thai government should insist that expats intending to stay in Thailand and require an O visa must attend a similar program as the Philippines, the Pre-Departure Registration and Orientation Seminars, prior to the O visa being issued

http://www.cfo.gov.ph/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=1378%3Apre-departure-registration-and-orientation-seminars&catid=145%3Aintegration-and-reintegration&Itemid=833

Just what is needed: more bureaucracy to make the system function so much better. Ya'll are making a mountain out of a molehill. Virtually everyone here meets that financial requirements. Hell, we go through that same song and dance every year during immigration extensions and review. Yes! I've been married to the same Thai women for over 6 years, I support her, her son, her extended family, but crap, let's add more paperwork just to make sure.

Dumb idea imho.

relax, you overlooked the smile icon

Oppss! My bad!

[metisdead]

A post in violation of this forum rule has been removed:

3) Not to post in a manner that is vulgar, obscene or profane.

[ThePinkPanther]

Okay Connda, granted. What you are in fact saying here is actually 100% correct seeing absolutely ANY state of being happens to be pure human perception. However then, could you please be kind enough as to enlighten all here exactly WHAT being "homeless" in reality is? Just as a matter of interest, who says that the specific individual referred to in this article at all HAS a yellow book indicarting his residential address or status? In fact, regarding his case he very well could really be homeless. Or don't you agree with me on this?

What's is 'homeless' and how can you tell? Really? If it's just because I'm hanging out, relaxed and half-asleep, with a weeks worth of stubble growing on my face, picking though the lint in my pocket to find enough baht for a plate of Kaow Soi or a bowl of Jok -- does that make me homeless?

I might look homeless to some expats who lives in an overpriced box out in a Chiang Mai "Gated Community" which they only leave in order to venture to the relative safety of Robinsons at the Mall or Rim Ping market, or perhaps to the monthly CM Expat Club meeting.

Yep, on some days I'm sure I look homeless as I lay on the cement seats next to the moat, just sucking up the sunshine, the birds chirping, the fish breaking the water, and the smell and ambiance that is just Chiang Mai. Yep just laying there, looking at the sky and sucking it all up -- drinking a coke or bottle of water, I might look homeless.

But I'm not! My House Book says I'm not 'hee, hee, hee'. Looks are deceiving, especially after you spend most of your life dressing neat and proper for the military or the corporate world -- and now in my retirement, I can just say, "The heck with it -- I'm letting what hair I have left Down!!!" So in my flip flops and raggy shorts and ripped, comfortable T-shirt that I bought for less than 99 baht at a second store, sitting by the moat without a care -- happy! -- eating fresh pineapple and drinking a cold Nam Singh..and reading the Thai signs on the building, looking a little glassy-eyed. Yep, I might look homeless. I'm completely sober and enjoying life the way I define my life. So out of those 20 or 30 folks in Chiang Mai you identified as homeless, you might be surprised that many are doing just fine -- living well -- although, just not living by your standards. Give it some thought.
Homeless looking, happy, and content in Chiang Mai

[zydeco]

If I'm going to be homeless, I'm going to do it in Honolulu.

I believe that Honolulu has a $1/4 million program that will offer you a free ticket back to the Mainland. Lol.

Even when I encounter panhandlers in Honolulu, they're usually dressed well--some even in blazers. Upscale homeless in Honolulu.

[spoonJammed]

like most other stuff splashed over the media, this has nothing to do with concern or compassion. it has everything to do with some scumbag company tilting the playing field in their favour. in this case some scumbag insurance company paying of the oh so bought media to push it. refer:http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/625628-thai-health-ministry-considering-plan-to-force-foreign-tourists-to-buy-insurance/

[The Blot]

simply a case for the embassies...

[GentlemanJim]

Honestly, for people from Western countries, getting sent back to their home country is probably the best thing that can happen in that situation. There there are social welfare services available, and many of them would have a chance to get a job and get back on their feet.

A much tricker situation is homeless from Burma, Lao, etc., many of whom are stateless and could face persecution if sent back.

If Thailand isn't going to help out Rohingya, Hmong etc. why would they be bothered to help out broke westerners?

I think there is a misunderstanding amongst readers here. When it says 'they are deported', what it actually means is that they are taken to the Immigration Detention Center and kept in jail until they or someone they know provides the money for their ticket home. Thailand does not pay for the 'deportation' nor does any respective embassy. These guys have been known to be in jail in the IDC for many many years. This is something that everyone needs to understand, if you get in the s**t out here then unless you are insured or have a well heeled relative back home, you are on your own!

[hannahc]

Hi guys,

I'm an Australian freelance journalist living in Pattaya, and this story really interested me as well. Foreign retirees being ripped off by Thai spouses seems to be a pretty common story in this region, as are reports of suicides in the area, and I think the issue deserves further exploration.

I'm planning to write a longer feature story about it for a publication back home, and was wondering if any of you know someone this has happened to who would like to speak to me about it, to share their experience? I will approach this topic with the sensitivity it deserves, of course, and do not judge.

If you or a friend would like to get in touch, please email me at: ****Email removed per forum rule****.

Alternatively, if you have any information you think would be relevant, please send that through as well.

Kind regards,

Hannah

Edited August 19, 2013 by metisdead
13) Not to post email addresses in posts due to potential spam problems.