Common scam by estate agency websites, beware! The unfortunate true of Real Estate in Pattaya...

[ttthailand]

They call this scam " Bait and switch"

You bring them in with a good deal and tell them " sorry sold out '" and show them something else.

I think however in Pattaya it is called being lazy. Same in Bangkok...

[PattayaPhom]

Apart from contacting each owner on a weekly basis which would take all week to do with over 1,000 listings there isn't anything that the agent can do.

Sending out a weekly or fortnightly bulk email would take only a few minutes.

Tried that and guess how many owners replied. Will stress again onus is on the owners to inform agents if current situation. And lets suppose 1000 replied, time consuming. Lazy owners is the cause if the OPs problem, not conduct of agents. Example owner needs to send one email, agent needs to check 1000. Seriously lets be realistic here

Sent from my ST27a using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Edited October 5, 2013 by PattayaPhom

[brummiebob]

never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity

[Naam]

i have a house advert for rent running on a free classifieds website

it was rented in February

i asked them to take it down then and many times sice

its still there and i still get responses which i answer

i am sympathetic to those who call and email but what can i do?

i assume its left up to make the site look bigger with more selection than it really has

on the other hand i had an advert for a house sale on Seaboard properties

i sold it privately, i called and she amended its status within hours

left it up there but marked sold

i expect this was done to reflect a successful sale

maybe sometimes the sellers don't tell them and allow an update to happen

so it may not always be the agents at fault

Seaboard is one of the very few RE companies in Pattaya which is properly managed. i recommended it over the last decade to more than a dozen friends (buying and renting) and everybody was happy with the results.

[Naam]

its called bait and switch. used by scammers and conmen all over the world. you don't get much slimier than real estate agents, more than half are conmen and scammers so why does this kind of thing surprise anyone?

your judgment is based on how many dealings with how many real estate agents "all over the world"?

in Texas they refer to people like you "all hats, big mouth, but no cattle!"

[Billmont]

Christ!!!!!!! Is that the moan of the day?????? What would you like, to be led by naked virgins throwing rose petals in front of you as you walk up tp your dream house??? Listen..............................Oh boll**ks, I can't be bothered!

Sometimes I wonder why I bother to read TV and then occasionally a gem like above. Had me in stiches.

[DD13]

i have a house advert for rent running on a free classifieds website

it was rented in February

i asked them to take it down then and many times sice

its still there and i still get responses which i answer

i am sympathetic to those who call and email but what can i do?

i assume its left up to make the site look bigger with more selection than it really has

on the other hand i had an advert for a house sale on Seaboard properties

i sold it privately, i called and she amended its status within hours

left it up there but marked sold

i expect this was done to reflect a successful sale

maybe sometimes the sellers don't tell them and allow an update to happen

so it may not always be the agents at fault

Seaboard is one of the very few RE companies in Pattaya which is properly managed. i recommended it over the last decade to more than a dozen friends (buying and renting) and everybody was happy with the results.

Klingon................you are advertising.......anymore of that and you will be repremanded by

"Star Fleet Command"

[anon8]

Tried that and guess how many owners replied. .

Lazy owners is the cause if the OPs problem, not conduct of agents. Example owner needs to send one email, agent needs to check 1000. Seriously lets be realistic here

So as an agent you are selling a house, but the owner of property isn't even replying to your email.

What are you selling then exactly? How can you have property listed, if you don't even have way to contact the seller?

[breadbin]

Any agent that didn't do what the op says would be closed!!

Its a marketing tool.

Anyway, why would you think someone would sell a property so cheap???

[NanLaew]

Tried that and guess how many owners replied. .

Lazy owners is the cause if the OPs problem, not conduct of agents. Example owner needs to send one email, agent needs to check 1000. Seriously lets be realistic here

So as an agent you are selling a house, but the owner of property isn't even replying to your email.

What are you selling then exactly? How can you have property listed, if you don't even have way to contact the seller?

Umm... this may be a bit of a stretch and hard for some to comprehend, but reckon the PHONE is the primary form of contact in pretty much any business dealing? Email is convenient but it isn't guaranteed to be received, acknowledged or responded to. Using a phone is a very fast way of sussing out if you are barking up the wrong tree.

As someone pointed out on the FIRST PAGE, even the glossy cards in the front window of agencies NOT in Thailand aren't current. It's their 'front page' so to speak.

If someone is so clueless to forego the search for a quiet, new, 3-bed villa in Naklua area for under 20k and instead settle for the agencies recommendation of an ancient 5-bed 'mansion' in a farang ghetto off Watsomboon for 30k.... well, they didn't have any idea in the first place.

As someone pointed out on this page, if the home owners don't advise the agencies when the place is no longer available and DO NOT respond to emails requesting an update, what do you do? I doubt that any agency thinks it is cost effective to have someone phoning ALL those with their property listed just so they can update the website once a week.

The websites are for lazy buggers anyway IMHO. All those options to filter and search for exactly what you want with a couple of pictures of the best rooms but several of the communal swimming pool?! Then you find your gem and go see it and it has a mosque next door and a 24-hour panel beaters out the back.

Did I mention the flooding?

[KittenKong]

Umm... this may be a bit of a stretch and hard for some to comprehend, but reckon the PHONE is the primary form of contact in pretty much any business dealing? Email is convenient but it isn't guaranteed to be received, acknowledged or responded to. Using a phone is a very fast way of sussing out if you are barking up the wrong tree.

I avoid using the phone wherever possible. It is an ultimately pointless tool as it leaves behind no record of the information communicated. Give me email every time.

[JSixpack]

Umm... this may be a bit of a stretch and hard for some to comprehend, but reckon the PHONE is the primary form of contact in pretty much any business dealing? Email is convenient but it isn't guaranteed to be received, acknowledged or responded to. Using a phone is a very fast way of sussing out if you are barking up the wrong tree.

I avoid using the phone wherever possible. It is an ultimately pointless tool as it leaves behind no record of the information communicated.

And its owner can't remember anything said and is too lazy to take any notes.

[Asiantravel]

Umm... this may be a bit of a stretch and hard for some to comprehend, but reckon the PHONE is the primary form of contact in pretty much any business dealing? Email is convenient but it isn't guaranteed to be received, acknowledged or responded to. Using a phone is a very fast way of sussing out if you are barking up the wrong tree.

I avoid using the phone wherever possible. It is an ultimately pointless tool as it leaves behind no record of the information communicated.

And its owner can't remember anything said and is too lazy to take any notes.

KittenKong is completely correct on this issue. There is absolutely no comparison regarding the clarity and certainty in writing of e-mail, compared to verbal discussions. Anyone that has a serious business mind should never even consider not having things in writing because it confirms what is being discussed based on a clear chronological timeline. Any disagreement in phone calls then becomes a huge job of trying to sort out who is telling the truth when it's a contest between " I said " versus " she or he said ". The Thai’s hate using e-mails because it doesn't give them any wiggle room later.

Edited October 8, 2013 by Asiantravel

[KittenKong]

Anyone that has a serious business mind should never even consider not having things in writing because it confirms what is being discussed based on a clear chronological timeline. Any disagreement in phone calls then becomes a huge job of trying to sort out who is telling the truth when it's a contest between " I said " versus " she or he said ". The Thais hate using e-mails because it doesn't give them any wiggle room later.

Yes indeed. Everything in writing is the only way to go.

[petercool]

Indeed. A verbal contract is not worth the paper it's written on .....

[Turkleton]

The "average" moron realtor is useless and a waste of time.

It might be a different thing, if you are looking for a 20 million Baht Villa or a property for commercial use.

Otherwise: DIY.

I had similar experiences like the OP with one of these suckers. (and yes the "bargain" is still advertised in TV and Bahtsold and regularly reposted)

Than I decided to look around by myself.

It was no fun, because May/June are not the coolest time for such a project.

However, I visited ~15 or more moobans the first day, made pictures from every more or less interesting object, using my smartphone camera with activated GPS (to find the houses again).

After three days, I had around 10 houses in my shortlist.

Wife (if advertised in Thai), or me rang the owners and made an appointment. Worked absolutely flawlessly.

The third house, we have looked at, was perfect.

Made a contract on a monthly base and moved in three days later.

[NanLaew]

Umm... this may be a bit of a stretch and hard for some to comprehend, but reckon the PHONE is the primary form of contact in pretty much any business dealing? Email is convenient but it isn't guaranteed to be received, acknowledged or responded to. Using a phone is a very fast way of sussing out if you are barking up the wrong tree.

I avoid using the phone wherever possible. It is an ultimately pointless tool as it leaves behind no record of the information communicated.

And its owner can't remember anything said and is too lazy to take any notes.

KittenKong is completely correct on this issue. There is absolutely no comparison regarding the clarity and certainty in writing of e-mail, compared to verbal discussions. Anyone that has a serious business mind should never even consider not having things in writing because it confirms what is being discussed based on a clear chronological timeline. Any disagreement in phone calls then becomes a huge job of trying to sort out who is telling the truth when it's a contest between " I said " versus " she or he said ". The Thais hate using e-mails because it doesn't give them any wiggle room later.

Haud oan a wee minut heer pal!

I am talking in the context of THIS thread where someone is trying to make primary, that's FIRST contact with someone else regarding renting or buying a property. You see many signs with a phone number. I have never yet seen a sign with a bloody email address!

Now dealing with these agencies, even establishing contact via email or phone can be a challenge with the smaller ones but there's more chance of finding out of there's a bloody pulse on the other end with a phone call versus an unread email.

Email in a western business context has indeed MOSTLY replaced traditional written form of communications as a hard-copy can be made. But we are in LOS where for most low-order Indians on the totem pole, email is what the company provides for messaging and you would be foolish to think that email inquiries in Thailand have any semblance of the urgency or import that a similar email has in our home countries. Witness how many people in various forums here express dismay that their emails are ignored, be it with airlines, customer service desks and even government entities. Use the bloody phone <deleted>!

As for that last assertion that Thai's don't like using email because it limits their scope to scam farangs... Christ on a bike! It's all about "they hate us" for some of you isn't it?

[NanLaew]

The "average" moron realtor is useless and a waste of time.

It might be a different thing, if you are looking for a 20 million Baht Villa or a property for commercial use.

Otherwise: DIY.

I had similar experiences like the OP with one of these suckers. (and yes the "bargain" is still advertised in TV and Bahtsold and regularly reposted)

Than I decided to look around by myself.

It was no fun, because May/June are not the coolest time for such a project.

However, I visited ~15 or more moobans the first day, made pictures from every more or less interesting object, using my smartphone camera with activated GPS (to find the houses again).

After three days, I had around 10 houses in my shortlist.

Wife (if advertised in Thai), or me rang the owners and made an appointment. Worked absolutely flawlessly.

The third house, we have looked at, was perfect.

Made a contract on a monthly base and moved in three days later.

There you go, another success story similar to my own. Just required doing some work instead of thinking that someone can read your mind (or let someone change your mind) and deliver exactly what you want.

Also note that neither Turkleton nor his wife appear to have used email to find a house either.

[Turkleton]

^^

E-mail is absolutely useless when you look around yourself, because 95% of the rent/sale signs have a phone no. only.

But that's ok, you can make an appointment within a few minutes.

And not forget, most of the landlords are Thais, so a mail in English language won't help that much...

[KittenKong]

Also note that neither Turkleton nor his wife appear to have used email to find a house either.

I thought that this thread and the comments in it were to do with using agents, not to do with avoiding the agent by doing the rounds oneself.

Either way, my comments were entirely related to how clients should deal with agents and how agents should deal with their clients. And as I mentioned I would want everything in writing when dealing with these agents. They are too dishonest and/or incompetent for anything else.

Even if I was finding a place for myself without an agent I would still want all the details written down in English (by me) before handing any money over.

[norrona]

Also note that neither Turkleton nor his wife appear to have used email to find a house either.

I thought that this thread and the comments in it were to do with using agents, not to do with avoiding the agent by doing the rounds oneself.

Either way, my comments were entirely related to how clients should deal with agents and how agents should deal with their clients. And as I mentioned I would want everything in writing when dealing with these agents. They are too dishonest and/or incompetent for anything else.

Even if I was finding a place for myself without an agent I would still want all the details written down in English (by me) before handing any money over.

nothing like a broad sweeping generalization....

please tell us your experience where they have all lied and let you down by being incompetent and how you overcome it? A problem shared and all that.....

[KittenKong]

please tell us your experience where they have all lied and let you down by being incompetent and how you overcome it?

You really want to read a long list of occasions when I have asked an agent to find a particular sort of place, or get back to me with some particular information about something and they have failed to do so for whatever reason?

Well I'm sorry but I have better things to do that type all that out. But you can probably just ask anyone who has ever had any dealings with an estate agent in Pattaya as I'm sure most of them will have had similar experiences at some point.

As for how to overcome the tribulations of dealing with most agents here I think the answer is just not to bother with them and do it yourself.

Any way, none of that makes any difference to the fact that I prefer to give and receive my information in writing rather than waste my time on the phone. And I will continue to do so. Other people can do as they wish, of course.

[PattayaPhom]

Tried that and guess how many owners replied. .

Lazy owners is the cause if the OPs problem, not conduct of agents. Example owner needs to send one email, agent needs to check 1000. Seriously lets be realistic here

So as an agent you are selling a house, but the owner of property isn't even replying to your email.

What are you selling then exactly? How can you have property listed, if you don't even have way to contact the seller?

If the owner chooses not to reply because they have already sold their property what do you propose as a solution. On listing a property and signing a contract with the company providing proof of ownership and contact details what else should be done.

[norrona]

please tell us your experience where they have all lied and let you down by being incompetent and how you overcome it?

You really want to read a long list of occasions when I have asked an agent to find a particular sort of place, or get back to me with some particular information about something and they have failed to do so for whatever reason?

Well I'm sorry but I have better things to do that type all that out. But you can probably just ask anyone who has ever had any dealings with an estate agent in Pattaya as I'm sure most of them will have had similar experiences at some point.

As for how to overcome the tribulations of dealing with most agents here I think the answer is just not to bother with them and do it yourself.

Any way, none of that makes any difference to the fact that I prefer to give and receive my information in writing rather than waste my time on the phone. And I will continue to do so. Other people can do as they wish, of course.

for someone who has better things to do you certainly took time out to vent just then....

by the way I used to work as an estate agent in Pattaya for 8 years and have clients that were so happy with how I treated them they are now friends...

perhaps you come across as a know it all type or a time waster/tyre kicker when being qualified or maybe a really tricky customer who is going to be hard to please....

or perhaps you have visited the wrong agent and just tar them all with the same brush....bit like someone whose been ripped off by a Thai lady and considers them all as bad....

[KittenKong]

for someone who has better things to do you certainly took time out to vent just then....

No vent involved, just information. All I did was take a minute to answer your question, out of politeness.

[norrona]

for someone who has better things to do you certainly took time out to vent just then....

No vent involved, just information. All I did was take a minute to answer your question, out of politeness.

But you said you had better things to do than type............then typed a load of other stuff out???

Good day

You see people....those estate agents certainly do have their fair share of nut jobs to contend with, especially in Pattaya!!!