Mother seeks safety advice for sons on motorbikes

[brfsa2]

On the jacket there will be tax for sure, about 30%

Since it's from the US, it will be labeled with the correct price (requirement Law), and taxed here.

I paid 30% on my Scorpion Recruit from US.

[RubberSideDown]

Note that the 320SP shop carries mostly fake reproductions of name brands. You can't get a real Alpinestars jacket for 2500 baht- the armor and safety stitching will be vastly inferior in comparison with the real thing.

As far as the back of the jacket goes, for most you need to buy a separate back protector if you want a higher level of protection.

Edited October 12, 2013 by RubberSideDown

[AllanB]

As I said, you know little about gear from a practical standpoint- bragging about knowledge of physics and heat absorption is kind of laughable in the face of actual, real-world experience.

The materials you're referring to offer very little in the way of airflow, which is more important than reflectivity.

I already tried to explain that the white section on the arms are a part of the jacket that's directly exposed to the sun (unlike the front, especially on a sport bike), as is a section of the back.

In any case, get back to me when you've got more than five minutes of experience on the street, and please rethink the use of your very arrogant signature line- "If I agreed with you we'd both be wrong"- when it's so easy to put you in your place.

Knowing a little about physics isn't exactly bragging, unless from the standpoint of knowing absolutely nothing. You don't want any black colouring on a summer jacket, it is easily the worst colour, if you doubt this go an put your hand on a black car at mid day, then do the same with a white, or silver car. When you have peeled your burnt hand off the black car, you will have learned a little about physics.

How do you know what materials I am referring to? Airflow can be either an an inherent part of the material used, or created in the tailoring process.

As to my biking experience, I have been in Thailand 6 years and ride a bike every day, I have done a couple of road trips. Basically I know when I am hot...and why. When I ride in the UK, I know when I am cold and why.

Around town here, you see no one wearing protective jackets, why, because all those available are unsuitable?

As to my signature, there is a thing called "humour", obviously lost on those during periods of aggression.

Lighten up mate.

PS. As far as I read, they are not referring to sports bikes, so the riding position will be upright.

Edited October 13, 2013 by AllanB

[RubberSideDown]

As I said, you know little about gear from a practical standpoint- bragging about knowledge of physics and heat absorption is kind of laughable in the face of actual, real-world experience.

The materials you're referring to offer very little in the way of airflow, which is more important than reflectivity.

I already tried to explain that the white section on the arms are a part of the jacket that's directly exposed to the sun (unlike the front, especially on a sport bike), as is a section of the back.

In any case, get back to me when you've got more than five minutes of experience on the street, and please rethink the use of your very arrogant signature line- "If I agreed with you we'd both be wrong"- when it's so easy to put you in your place.

Knowing a little about physics isn't exactly bragging, unless from the standpoint of knowing absolutely nothing. You don't want any black colouring on a summer jacket, it is easily the worst colour, if you doubt this go an put your hand on a black car at mid day, then do the same with a white, or silver car. When you have peeled your burnt hand off the black car, you will have learned a little about physics.

How do you know what materials I am referring to? Airflow can be either an an inherent part of the material used, or created in the tailoring process.

As to my biking experience, I have been in Thailand 6 years and ride a bike every day, I have done a couple of road trips. Basically I know when I am hot...and why. When I ride in the UK, I know when I am cold and why.

Around town here, you see no one wearing protective jackets, why, because all those available are unsuitable?

As to my signature, there is a thing called "humour", obviously lost on those during periods of aggression.

Lighten up mate.

PS. As far as I read, they are not referring to sports bikes, so the riding position will be upright.

Really? Because judging by your posting style, you seem to take it very seriously- you don't disagree with people, but rather you attack their opinions, which is why I'm addressing you in the current manner. Having read your views on gear (specifically helmets) on this thread, you obviously don't have a clue, yet you feel qualified to give advice- that's dangerous if someone is naive enough to listen to it.

When you have ridden for a while in quality gear (which you obviously haven't) your opinion might have some real-world value- right now it doesn't. The reasons people don't wear proper gear go beyond the gear itself- it has more to do with money and laziness than anything else. There is a lot of suitable gear, but it takes expense to obtain it, and proper will and dedication to wear it. Thais wear jackets all the time in direct sunlight to keep their skin from becoming darker, but they will happily ride a bike without a helmet- they're just not worried about the consequences- it's cultural more than anything else.

A properly made mostly black jacket with UV coating and strategically placed lighter colors will keep you as cool as an all-white jacket, yet will also last much longer before becoming embarrassingly filthy. How do I know this? Because I've been wearing those jackets for over a decade in Thailand.

As far as your reading comprehension goes, please work on it a bit- one of the bikes in question is a CBR-250, which is most certainly a sportbike.

Edited October 13, 2013 by RubberSideDown

[Shurup]

@ AllanB

Please stop this bickering, you're not contributing anything to this tread by arguing with the others, and if you haven't noticed, your opinion goes against quite a few other members' opinions. You can't possibly believe that everyone else is wrong but you, you're in minority. Give it up please.

[Beardog]

Note that the 320SP shop carries mostly fake reproductions of name brands. You can't get a real Alpinestars jacket for 2500 baht- the armor and safety stitching will be vastly inferior in comparison with the real thing.

As far as the back of the jacket goes, for most you need to buy a separate back protector if you want a higher level of protection.

Boy howdy that is for sure we would all have Alpinestars hanging in the wardrobe at that price!

[dogpoo]

Apart from learning many common sense things about driving a motorbike here the main thing is, keep your speed down to stay alive!! I have seen quite a few videos regarding idiots going far to fast, most of them end up being very dead or worse seriously injured!

[RubberSideDown]

Apart from learning many common sense things about driving a motorbike here the main thing is, keep your speed down to stay alive!! I have seen quite a few videos regarding idiots going far to fast, most of them end up being very dead or worse seriously injured!

I agree. At least ride within the limits of your vehicle- a lot of scooters can go considerably faster than their brakes can reasonably slow them down.

[dogpoo]

Apart from learning many common sense things about driving a motorbike here the main thing is, keep your speed down to stay alive!! I have seen quite a few videos regarding idiots going far to fast, most of them end up being very dead or worse seriously injured!

I agree. At least ride within the limits of your vehicle- a lot of scooters can go considerably faster than their brakes can reasonably slow them down.

Lots of people own Supersports bikes that can go insane speeds, this has to be one of the worst countries on this planet for driving a powerful bike extremely fast, I have owned many powerful bikes none of which I have ever taken to the limit, in fact even the 1000cc monster I had was only once taken to 140kph which is no where near its top speed, Personally I don't think it is necessary to wear expensive protection here( crash helmet is a must though, it's all about awareness and keeping your speed low but not so low as to be a hindrance to other road users! I am still here and drive my bike/scooter everyday, never had a serious accident, the 2 I have had were low speed(not my fault, no injuries whatsoever!!

[RubberSideDown]

'Expensive' is relative- you can achieve a certain protection level at a variety of price points- you can possibly survive a 150kph get-off relatively unscathed with proper gear, and you can get crippled or killed on a scooter if you have an accident at a fraction of that speed with no gear- there are no guarantees, of course- it's about maximizing your chances.

[Shurup]

By SLOW, I'd say the speed limit, or with the traffic flow. Do NOT go slower than that or you become a danger on the road, danger for yourself and others.

[dogpoo]

'Expensive' is relative- you can achieve a certain protection level at a variety of price points- you can possibly survive a 150kph get-off relatively unscathed with proper gear, and you can get crippled or killed on a scooter if you have an accident at a fraction of that speed with no gear- there are no guarantees, of course- it's about maximizing your chances.

Of course you can be killed at any speed, if you fall off into the path of another vehicle or something rear ends you, nothing you do or wear can be certain of saving you, it's up to the individual, as you say maximizing your chances will help, I keep my speed low and always drive with 100% concentration, it's dangerous riding a bike in any country!!

[dogpoo]

By SLOW, I'd say the speed limit, or with the traffic flow. Do NOT go slower than that or you become a danger on the road, danger for yourself and others.

Is there speed limits in this country? can't say I have ever noticed a speed sign, by driving slow you only become a danger if you are blocking other vehicles, my gf drives slow but she is always as far left as possible, she is no danger to anyone!

[Shurup]

You didn't look hard, there're speed limits in Thai.

How fast does your GF drive on the 2 line HWY? If there's a long lane of vehicles lined up behind her - she's driving too slow and she creates a dangerous situation for herself and other drivers!

[RubberSideDown]

Of course it's not about 'certainty'- it's about minimizing the chances of death or injury.

Riding at a reasonable speed (which I don't always do) can help increase your chances of avoiding an accident, but your gear is what will come between you and the road in a get-off. The best gear is made to have higher abrasion resistance (and it's built to not come apart at the seams) and will disperse the force of the impact.

If you're riding something like a Monster where you're not keeping to the left of the road edge and are instead in the traffic flow (as it has the power to be in that position) you need a decent helmet, and armored jacket, good gloves, knee and hip protection (if you're wearing jeans) and reasonable footwear (with at least a minimum of ankle support).

Dress for the crash.

Edited October 13, 2013 by RubberSideDown

[dogpoo]

You didn't look hard, there're speed limits in Thai.

How fast does your GF drive on the 2 line HWY? If there's a long lane of vehicles lined up behind her - she's driving too slow and she creates a dangerous situation for herself and other drivers!

She doesn't drive on any highways, she drives between 40/60kph she drives around Phuket/Patong

[dogpoo]

Of course it's not about 'certainty'- it's about minimizing the chances of death or injury.

Riding at a reasonable speed (which I don't always do) can help increase your chances of avoiding an accident, but your gear is what will come between you and the road in a get-off. The best gear is made to have higher abrasion resistance (and it's built to not come apart at the seams) and will disperse the force of the impact.

If you're riding something like a Monster where you're not keeping to the left of the road edge and are instead in the traffic flow (as it has the power to be in that position) you need a decent helmet, and armored jacket, good gloves, knee and hip protection (if you're wearing jeans) and reasonable footwear (with at least a minimum of ankle support).

Dress for the crash.

In over 40 yrs of riding extremely powerful bikes I have never worn the type of gear you describe, I just don't drive like a lunatic! I am sensible, keep up with the traffic, always aware of what is around me and most importantly what is behind me! it's not wrong to wear lots of protection, it's up to the individual, no one is right and no one is wrong!

[Shurup]

40-60 kph is a normal speed for driving in town, don't know why you think it's slow. I wouldn't go faster than that myself in any city other than BKK where the traffic flows faster on a number of HWYs.

[dogpoo]

40-60 kph is a normal speed for driving in town, don't know why you think it's slow. I wouldn't go faster than that myself in any city other than BKK where the traffic flows faster on a number of HWYs.

It's the speed I go around Phuket, it's a sensible speed, I see so many ER6n's going way to fast here, people are just plain crazy!!

[Shurup]

Of course it's not about 'certainty'- it's about minimizing the chances of death or injury.

Riding at a reasonable speed (which I don't always do) can help increase your chances of avoiding an accident, but your gear is what will come between you and the road in a get-off. The best gear is made to have higher abrasion resistance (and it's built to not come apart at the seams) and will disperse the force of the impact.

If you're riding something like a Monster where you're not keeping to the left of the road edge and are instead in the traffic flow (as it has the power to be in that position) you need a decent helmet, and armored jacket, good gloves, knee and hip protection (if you're wearing jeans) and reasonable footwear (with at least a minimum of ankle support).

Dress for the crash.

In over 40 yrs of riding extremely powerful bikes I have never worn the type of gear you describe, I just don't drive like a lunatic! I am sensible, keep up with the traffic, always aware of what is around me and most importantly what is behind me! it's not wrong to wear lots of protection, it's up to the individual, no one is right and no one is wrong!

This is what defensive driving all about and it's the best investment a person can do to stay safe.

However a good defensive driving school will also tech you to Dress for the crash!

I mentioned in another topic that most of the accidents can be avoided/prevented with good driving/riding skills, however some accidents can't and if you get involved into one of those, you'd wish you had a better protection on...

[dogpoo]

Of course it's not about 'certainty'- it's about minimizing the chances of death or injury.

Riding at a reasonable speed (which I don't always do) can help increase your chances of avoiding an accident, but your gear is what will come between you and the road in a get-off. The best gear is made to have higher abrasion resistance (and it's built to not come apart at the seams) and will disperse the force of the impact.

If you're riding something like a Monster where you're not keeping to the left of the road edge and are instead in the traffic flow (as it has the power to be in that position) you need a decent helmet, and armored jacket, good gloves, knee and hip protection (if you're wearing jeans) and reasonable footwear (with at least a minimum of ankle support).

Dress for the crash.

In over 40 yrs of riding extremely powerful bikes I have never worn the type of gear you describe, I just don't drive like a lunatic! I am sensible, keep up with the traffic, always aware of what is around me and most importantly what is behind me! it's not wrong to wear lots of protection, it's up to the individual, no one is right and no one is wrong!

This is what defensive driving all about and it's the best investment a person can do to stay safe.

However a good defensive driving school will also tech you to Dress for the crash!

I mentioned in another topic that most of the accidents can be avoided/prevented with good driving/riding skills, however some accidents can't and if you get involved into one of those, you'd wish you had a better protection on...

Yep I agree with you, but as an individual you have to do what you think is best, I don't want to wear hot and sweaty protective gear, I prefer to use my awareness, hoping to stay safe for many more years! but you never know what is waiting the next time you venture out!

[RubberSideDown]

My gear AND my awareness will keep me safer than awareness alone.

Saying you've been fortunate not to have a serious crash for 40 years will mean nothing if some idiot blows a stop sign or traffic light (or turns right in front of you when he's in the oncoming lane, which is always a favorite) tomorrow.

I ride an extremely powerful bike and I gear up every time I'm on it, and not because I have any doubt in my skill or situational awareness as a rider, but rather my 20+ years on the road (with one serious accident that I walked away from due to my quality gear) have shown me that sooner or later, if you ride long enough it's your turn. I also wear decent (though not the same) gear on my scooter- I've got my 'A' 'B' and 'C' gear set-ups, and all are extremely protective and work in a variety of conditions.

Edited October 13, 2013 by RubberSideDown

[Addonvalue]

Note that the 320SP shop carries mostly fake reproductions of name brands. You can't get a real Alpinestars jacket for 2500 baht- the armor and safety stitching will be vastly inferior in comparison with the real thing.

As far as the back of the jacket goes, for most you need to buy a separate back protector if you want a higher level of protection.

Point 1: Oh, great. Thanks for the tip about 320sp -- guess I won't be going there. So I am thinking of having a friend in the US buy it and send it via a container of his other stuff or bring it personally. That being the case, if I am getting something from the US, what can I get -- suitable for Bangkok -- with adequate back protection -- without having to buy inserts or modifying it. I was recommended Joe Rocket from cyclegear, for the US$189 jacket. Anyone have suggestions of stuff in the US I can get for around US200 or less?

Point 2: Is it better to get good airflow light jacket and put in your own back inserts, for use here?

Sorry I'm asking so many questions about all the variables available.

Point 3: On another point, I checked with Honda Training for big bikes and it's only in Thai. Would anyone in Bangkok be wiling to spend a couple of hours on a Sunday -- we live by a large empty carpark -- and just share 'from the voice of experience' some safety pointers about big bikes? It'd be my two sons and one of their girlfriends who also rides a CBR 250. In return, beers and a barbeque -- food fest of some sort....??

I'm sure there are some seasoned hands in this forum who could help -- could be the first TV motorbike safety meet! Ha!

[RubberSideDown]

Personally, I always use either a back protector insert (that fits in the jacket pocket) or a stand-alone protector (usually bigger and always more of a hassle) as few companies supply their jackets with one (RS Taichi is one that usually does, but they're pricey).

I'm a big fan of the Forcefield CE-level 2 inserts (and it's what I would recommend)- they run less than $100- for stand-alone, I like the Alpinestars Bionic Race back protector for ~$100, but it's not what you want. Either way they add some weight and bulk to the jacket- note that different manufacturers use different shapes for their insert pockets, so you have to find a back protector that's compatible.

Joe Rocket is a decent manufacturer from what I've read, but I've never owned any of their gear.

I'll look around a bit to see what's worth buying in the US at the moment- it's a good time to find close-out summer gear.

Edited October 13, 2013 by RubberSideDown

[Garry]

Personally, I always use either a back protector insert (that fits in the jacket pocket) or a stand-alone protector (usually bigger and always more of a hassle) as few companies supply their jackets with one (RS Taichi is one that usually does, but they're pricey).

I'm a big fan of the Forcefield CE-level 2 inserts (and it's what I would recommend)- they run less than $100- for stand-alone, I like the Alpinestars Bionic Race back protector for ~$100, but it's not what you want. Either way they add some weight and bulk to the jacket- note that different manufacturers use different shapes for their insert pockets, so you have to find a back protector that's compatible.

Joe Rocket is a decent manufacturer from what I've read, but I've never owned any of their gear.

I'll look around a bit to see what's worth buying in the US at the moment- it's a good time to find close-out summer gear.

A good site in the US for good deals on gear.

http://www.motorcyclegear.com/

http://www.motorcyclegear.com/street/closeouts/mesh_jackets_and_pants

Edited October 13, 2013 by Garry

[RubberSideDown]

If you have someone in the States to buy it for you, Revzilla is closing out the Teknic Aquavent mesh jacket for $89- they still have several sizes left.

I have a Teknic Violator leather jacket (in fact, I wore it on a ride this morning;)) and it's excellent quality (I'd say one step below Dianese)- they went out of business a few months ago, so their gear can be found very cheaply (though it's in limited quantities). I've also hot a pair of their Chicane leather riding pants, and I would have bought more of their gear if I were in the US when the sale was going on.

Here's the link- note there are many customer reviews as well as a video- also note you'll need to upgrade the back protection:

http://www.revzilla.com/product/teknic-aquavent-mesh-jacket

Edited October 13, 2013 by RubberSideDown

[RubberSideDown]

Personally, I always use either a back protector insert (that fits in the jacket pocket) or a stand-alone protector (usually bigger and always more of a hassle) as few companies supply their jackets with one (RS Taichi is one that usually does, but they're pricey).

I'm a big fan of the Forcefield CE-level 2 inserts (and it's what I would recommend)- they run less than $100- for stand-alone, I like the Alpinestars Bionic Race back protector for ~$100, but it's not what you want. Either way they add some weight and bulk to the jacket- note that different manufacturers use different shapes for their insert pockets, so you have to find a back protector that's compatible.

Joe Rocket is a decent manufacturer from what I've read, but I've never owned any of their gear.

I'll look around a bit to see what's worth buying in the US at the moment- it's a good time to find close-out summer gear.

A good site in the US for good deals on gear.

http://www.motorcyclegear.com/

http://www.motorcyclegear.com/street/closeouts/mesh_jackets_and_pants

I just bought an AGV Sport perforated Topanga leather jacket on close-out from them a couple months ago for $150- for the price, it was a steal. Edited October 13, 2013 by RubberSideDown

[KRS1]

I was riding my mountain bike yesterday and flipped the bike doing a wheelie at about 15 kph, knees have 2 nice gouges now, and my Addidas got ripped.

Was a friendly reminder to start dressing more properly on the 'real' bike, as ive been getting too relaxed lately.

[dogpoo]

You can't force people to wear things they don't want to wear, you can give your opinion, you can pass on your knowledge, it's then up to the individual to make a choice! If a big lorry runs over you it will make no difference how good the protective gear is that you are wearing! with gear or without gear you are dead, most fatalities are caused by excessive speed, I absolutely stand by my choice to wear a good crash helmet, shorts, tee shirt and crocs to drive my Forza, never had a problem of any note and my awareness and skill level will hopefully continue to keep me safe, but!! anything can happen to anyone at any time, it does not matter how good a driver you are, wearing protective gear is a good thing but it's not for me and it will not be for many people, freedom of choice is a great thing!!

[dogpoo]

I was riding my mountain bike yesterday and flipped the bike doing a wheelie at about 15 kph, knees have 2 nice gouges now, and my Addidas got ripped.

Was a friendly reminder to start dressing more properly on the 'real' bike, as ive been getting too relaxed lately.

If you intend doing wheelies on the real bike, good luck!