Southern Myanmar journey....good idea? Or difficult?

[harleyclarkey]

Having seen a good bit of Northern Myanmar we plan this time on having a look at the southern end.

Which would be a better plan in mid January?

1. Enter via Ranong to Kawthoung then take the express boat up to Myeik. A day or two here and on up to Dawei by bus and onwards to Rangoon, via Mawlamine, before west to the beaches.

2. Enter Mae Sot to Myawaddy which brings us more north to start the trip.

I am assuming that accomodation, whilst scarce, should be fine and that the express boat is still operating. I believe it is The Fortune Express. Is it a busy route and is there any need to buy tickets in advance?

Is the bus journey (we have ridden buses before in Myanmar) a nightmare?

I would be really grateful for any suggestions and things not to miss if we enter by Kawthoung. Lioke how do we get to the islands and is there still the park entry fee. I guess the hotels on the islands are a nightmare price??

[SeaVisionBurma]

Hello Hayleyclarkey

I think the trip into Kawthoung and northwards via Myeik is well worth the effort - it is an interesting journey with plenty to see, and something which still to this day has not been travelled by many foreigners.

I am assuming that accomodation, whilst scarce, should be fine and that the express boat is still operating. I believe it is The Fortune Express. Is it a busy route and is there any need to buy tickets in advance?

Accommodation in Kawthoung and Myeik should be fine - there are several guest houses in Kawthoung, and a couple in Myeik. You should be able to arrive at the Kawthoung jetty and find accommodation.

Fortune tickets are normally purchased the day before for travel the following day - it may not travel every day, so it allows you some flexibility to look around Kawthoung.

When you arrive to Kawthoung - go to the main jetty and there is a small office for Myanmar Travel & Tours. Ask the immigration officers opposite if the office is closed - their main office is up the hill opposite the Kawthoung Motel, but they will happily call them to come down, or point you in the right direction. They can also assist in information/bookings for the ferry and hotels.

The ferry trip takes around 6 hours and travels straight up through the islands of the Mergui Archipelago - you'll find the waters not so clear near the mainland but you'll still see plenty of interesting sites on the way up. Keep an eye out for dolphins too.

Is the bus journey (we have ridden buses before in Myanmar) a nightmare?

I haven't caught the bus between Myeik and Dawei - have always used the ferry or flown. My advice would be to stop in Myeik for a day or two, then take the ferry north again to Dawei, and continue the remainder of your journey overland from there via Mawlamyaing (Moulmyein).

I guess the hotels on the islands are a nightmare price??

There is only one island with a hotel - and that is Thahtay Kyunn right on the border between Ranong and Kawthoung - home to the Andaman Club casino resort. Not outrageous, but its just a hotel and can be skipped.

As for getting to the islands - the cost of this is still prohibitive unless you are booking on to a liveaboard through a company such as A-One Dive (Ranong) or Moby Dick (Kawthoung) or similar companies. Chartering a vessel is expensive, and travel to the islands isn't something which can be done on budget. PM me for further details and contacts if you want more info.

Hope this helps.

SVB

[harleyclarkey]

Hello Hayleyclarkey

I think the trip into Kawthoung and northwards via Myeik is well worth the effort - it is an interesting journey with plenty to see, and something which still to this day has not been travelled by many foreigners.

I am assuming that accomodation, whilst scarce, should be fine and that the express boat is still operating. I believe it is The Fortune Express. Is it a busy route and is there any need to buy tickets in advance?

Accommodation in Kawthoung and Myeik should be fine - there are several guest houses in Kawthoung, and a couple in Myeik. You should be able to arrive at the Kawthoung jetty and find accommodation.

Fortune tickets are normally purchased the day before for travel the following day - it may not travel every day, so it allows you some flexibility to look around Kawthoung.

When you arrive to Kawthoung - go to the main jetty and there is a small office for Myanmar Travel & Tours. Ask the immigration officers opposite if the office is closed - their main office is up the hill opposite the Kawthoung Motel, but they will happily call them to come down, or point you in the right direction. They can also assist in information/bookings for the ferry and hotels.

The ferry trip takes around 6 hours and travels straight up through the islands of the Mergui Archipelago - you'll find the waters not so clear near the mainland but you'll still see plenty of interesting sites on the way up. Keep an eye out for dolphins too.

Is the bus journey (we have ridden buses before in Myanmar) a nightmare?

I haven't caught the bus between Myeik and Dawei - have always used the ferry or flown. My advice would be to stop in Myeik for a day or two, then take the ferry north again to Dawei, and continue the remainder of your journey overland from there via Mawlamyaing (Moulmyein).

I guess the hotels on the islands are a nightmare price??

There is only one island with a hotel - and that is Thahtay Kyunn right on the border between Ranong and Kawthoung - home to the Andaman Club casino resort. Not outrageous, but its just a hotel and can be skipped.

As for getting to the islands - the cost of this is still prohibitive unless you are booking on to a liveaboard through a company such as A-One Dive (Ranong) or Moby Dick (Kawthoung) or similar companies. Chartering a vessel is expensive, and travel to the islands isn't something which can be done on budget. PM me for further details and contacts if you want more info.

Hope this helps.

SVB

Many thanks SVB....you do a fantastic job here.

Decision made...we will head in and cross over south to see a bit of non touristy Burma and take the ferries as much as we can....Good advice for the ferry to Dawei. The roads are a bit of an adventure!

What a pity there is no accomodation on the islands as I belive theye are paradise.

We will head towards the delta and Ngwe Saung beach as well.

[SeaVisionBurma]

Glad to be of assistance - I have spent a good part of my life in this area and am happy to encourage anyone to visit.

Myeik is a delight if you are after something off the usual tourist track.

Tonnes of history - great old buildings, a Japanese cemetery with some very interesting history circa WWII, a beautiful pagoda situated on a hill overlooking the main Myeik harbour, and a great insight into daily life in a bustling coastal fishing & trading port where foreigners are seldom seen.

There is a yachtie who has put together an informative 2 page guide for Kawthoung and Myeik - http://www.seal-superyachts.com/superyacht-agent-myanmar/guide/

It is geared towards yachts and superyachts visiting Myanmar, but the info will be useful for anyone heading to the area.

As for the Delta and Ngwe Saung - I put together a couple of trip reports late last year for this area, and these can be seen here:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/592850-ngwe-saung-beach-myanmar-trip-report/

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/592799-bus-services-to-ngwe-saung-and-chaungtha-tofrom-yangon-trip-report/

Happy travels

SVB

[Halfaboy]

Glad to be of assistance - I have spent a good part of my life in this area and am happy to encourage anyone to visit.

Myeik is a delight if you are after something off the usual tourist track.

Tonnes of history - great old buildings, a Japanese cemetery with some very interesting history circa WWII, a beautiful pagoda situated on a hill overlooking the main Myeik harbour, and a great insight into daily life in a bustling coastal fishing & trading port where foreigners are seldom seen.

There is a yachtie who has put together an informative 2 page guide for Kawthoung and Myeik - http://www.seal-superyachts.com/superyacht-agent-myanmar/guide/

It is geared towards yachts and superyachts visiting Myanmar, but the info will be useful for anyone heading to the area.

As for the Delta and Ngwe Saung - I put together a couple of trip reports late last year for this area, and these can be seen here:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/592850-ngwe-saung-beach-myanmar-trip-report/

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/592799-bus-services-to-ngwe-saung-and-chaungtha-tofrom-yangon-trip-report/

Happy travels

SVB

Thank you SVB. Again great ideas for one of the next trips !

[stickylies]

i've travelled southern myanmar (tenasserim) numerous times between '98 and 2011. i don't have much to add to the info above except that accomodation for foreigners is relatively expensive. little to zero budget places. many hotels cater to business people (burmese, chinese, singapore) and start at 35$-45$. the seafood is considered the best of myanmar and even the thai think myeik area is culinary TOP (since the thai have a history there!).

as long as i remember (and that is as recent as 6 months ago last time i was in myeik) foreigners were not allowed to travel the bus between Myeik and Dawei (or onward: busses head to rangoon). road travel has always been restricted for several reasons. particularly the DAWEI to YE area is "delicate" for several reasons you should know if you have visited myanmar several times. anyway, i'm not sure if foreigners are allowed nowadays. the ferry between kawthoung and myeik does NOT go out in rainy season, january is no problem though.

oddly i've never met SVB there although i know most westerners (very **very** little) who (quote) "have spent a good part of their life in this area", even just a handful of foreigners who entered or left via kawthoung...

where did you stay SVB ? what did you do ? actual "travelling" in Tenasserim was very difficult between the year 2000-2010, unless you flew into dawei or myeik (hopping from one city to another) and then not much travelling outside these townships was allowed due to ongoing harassment towards karen, mon, thai tenasserim, muslim and moken people - and other things the burmese didn't want us to see.

at OP: note that the southern part of myanmar still hosts active mon armies controling small (border) communities and protecting their rights. a seriously impaired (but armed) KNU is also still active in tenasserim. people visiting this part of myanmar should keep in mind that non-bamar living more remotely (where foreigner cannot go of course since there is nothing to see there except for poor villagers and forest/jungle) there have suffered a lot and continue to suffer a lot thanx to plans for hydroelectric plants, (coal) mining, land confiscation, forced labor, rape, etc.

[Hardie]

So you can cross overland into Burma now and continue on to Rangoon and elsewhere? That's news to me and apparently Lonely Planet, too; great news in fact! Any idea which are the land borders where that can be done? Is transportation from Myawaddy to Rangoon easy and straightforward?

[SeaVisionBurma]

oddly i've never met SVB there although i know most westerners (very **very** little) who (quote) "have spent a good part of their life in this area", even just a handful of foreigners who entered or left via kawthoung...

where did you stay SVB ? what did you do ? actual "travelling" in Tenasserim was very difficult between the year 2000-2010, unless you flew into dawei or myeik (hopping from one city to another) and then not much travelling outside these townships was allowed due to ongoing harassment towards karen, mon, thai tenasserim, muslim and moken people - and other things the burmese didn't want us to see.

I looked after a group of pearl farms in several island groups through the Mergui Archipelago so was nearly always out on the islands, especially in the early period of my time there. In 1999 I spent 6 and 1/2 months in one trip just on a boat, doing a complete survey of every island from the south near Kawthoung, all the way up to the northern islands past Myeik. That was my favourite stint. Me, my Burmese boat & dive crew, my dog, and 5 Navy soldiers who were terrified of the water. Pure frontier stuff, I don't think there had been a complete survey of the whole archipelago for a long long time, and some of the remote islands looked as if they hadn't had human visitors in a loooong time.

There were heavy restrictions on my movements in the early years - they didn't stop me from going where I needed to go - but I was required to have an armed security escort at all times. This got quite frustrating at first - but after nearly running into some armed insurgency groups, and narrowly avoiding a few gunfights - it made sense.

Things calmed down from 2003-2004 onwards. I could get in the speedboat on my own and go for a trip without an escort, to go from pearl farm to pearl farm. Or if I had to fly up to Yangon, just drive myself into Myeik on the boat so I could hop on the plane.

Visits to the mainland were usually via Myeik, either to fly to Yangon or Kawthoung, or to meet with the Tanintharyi Division commander there. We also had an office in Myeik.

So yes, you're right about actual "travelling" in Tennasserrim being very difficult - the difference was my local area was the islands - not the mainland.

And you never know - we may have met. Send me a PM some time.

SVB

[SeaVisionBurma]

So you can cross overland into Burma now and continue on to Rangoon and elsewhere? That's news to me and apparently Lonely Planet, too; great news in fact! Any idea which are the land borders where that can be done? Is transportation from Myawaddy to Rangoon easy and straightforward?

Hardie - Myanmar opened up 4 key borders for overland travel back in August. There has been a fair amount of media coverage about this in the last couple of months. *overland - meaning you can enter at one entry point, and leave via another*

We have also run various threads on the subject:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/657462-myanmar-opening-3-overland-routes-to-foreigners-in-august/

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/663321-four-overland-myanmar-thai-border-crossings-to-open-date-set-as-28th-august/

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/621452-overland-travel-in-myanmar-kawthoung-to-yangon-commencing-soon/

A quick search on google shows some info on this on the LP forums also....I won't post the links here.

The trick is to make sure you have an embassy-issued visa before arriving at the border.... You cannot just show up and be allowed to continue overland.

[Hardie]

So you can cross overland into Burma now and continue on to Rangoon and elsewhere? That's news to me and apparently Lonely Planet, too; great news in fact! Any idea which are the land borders where that can be done? Is transportation from Myawaddy to Rangoon easy and straightforward?

Hardie - Myanmar opened up 4 key borders for overland travel back in August. There has been a fair amount of media coverage about this in the last couple of months. *overland - meaning you can enter at one entry point, and leave via another*

We have also run various threads on the subject:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/657462-myanmar-opening-3-overland-routes-to-foreigners-in-august/

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/663321-four-overland-myanmar-thai-border-crossings-to-open-date-set-as-28th-august/

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/621452-overland-travel-in-myanmar-kawthoung-to-yangon-commencing-soon/

A quick search on google shows some info on this on the LP forums also....I won't post the links here.

The trick is to make sure you have an embassy-issued visa before arriving at the border.... You cannot just show up and be allowed to continue overland.

Thanx. Any idea when/if any borders into Bangladesh and/or India will be opened?

[SeaVisionBurma]

Thanx. Any idea when/if any borders into Bangladesh and/or India will be opened?

Sorry, no idea about India & Bangladesh borders. These areas are politically sensitive and I imagine they won't progress on these areas until close to 2015 (if at all)

[stickylies]

@SVB:

1/ pearl farms is that mining department?

2/ do u speak burmese?

3/ '98 was the year of "Christie Island" - were u on a boat then or in 1999?

[SeaVisionBurma]

@SVB:

1/ pearl farms is that mining department?

2/ do u speak burmese?

3/ '98 was the year of "Christie Island" - were u on a boat then or in 1999?

1. Ministry of Mines JV

2. Yes

3. Not in Myanmar in 1998. On a boat for most of 1999.

[stickylies]

India & Bangladesh borders are not open for foreigners, locals cross everyday (legal/illegal).

india/myanmar: insurgents on BOTH sides. also, in india the eastern states are still pretty restricted (due to political turmoil and stuff). i was in tamu in 2011. a highway is intended to connect india with mae sot and beyond (cf car several rallies in recent years, last year too).

bangladesh/myanmar: too much rohingya related issues there, even UN has major issues to get to visit the "refugee" camps. and very poor roads. i've never been deep inside rakhine border lands, never got permission.

[stickylies]

@SVB:

1/ pearl farms is that mining department?

2/ do u speak burmese?

3/ '98 was the year of "Christie Island" - were u on a boat then or in 1999?

1. Ministry of Mines JV

interesting, but why did they need one sole westerner for that job?

is mojo still in kawthoung?

[stickylies]

it might be worth to point out that several "mergui" adverted diving trips never actually get into myeik "waters". it's a long ongoing scam between the burmese themselves, haha. diving trips versus mtt versus immigration versus local-whatever-in-charge.

[SeaVisionBurma]

interesting, but why did they need one sole westerner for that job?

is mojo still in kawthoung?

Wasn't only me, I just stayed longer than anyone else.

In the beginning there were several foreigners there at any one time - biologists, technicians etc - but mostly they didn't stay long. Some couldn't handle it, others were only contractors.

Mojo has recently been transferred out of Kawthoung - end of an era....

[stickylies]

Mojo has recently been transferred out of Kawthoung - end of an era....

enriched himself enough by now (and fed up with hot and rainy kawthoung anyway).

[harleyclarkey]

i've travelled southern myanmar (tenasserim) numerous times between '98 and 2011. i don't have much to add to the info above except that accomodation for foreigners is relatively expensive. little to zero budget places. many hotels cater to business people (burmese, chinese, singapore) and start at 35$-45$. the seafood is considered the best of myanmar and even the thai think myeik area is culinary TOP (since the thai have a history there!).

as long as i remember (and that is as recent as 6 months ago last time i was in myeik) foreigners were not allowed to travel the bus between Myeik and Dawei (or onward: busses head to rangoon). road travel has always been restricted for several reasons. particularly the DAWEI to YE area is "delicate" for several reasons you should know if you have visited myanmar several times. anyway, i'm not sure if foreigners are allowed nowadays. the ferry between kawthoung and myeik does NOT go out in rainy season, january is no problem though.

oddly i've never met SVB there although i know most westerners (very **very** little) who (quote) "have spent a good part of their life in this area", even just a handful of foreigners who entered or left via kawthoung...

where did you stay SVB ? what did you do ? actual "travelling" in Tenasserim was very difficult between the year 2000-2010, unless you flew into dawei or myeik (hopping from one city to another) and then not much travelling outside these townships was allowed due to ongoing harassment towards karen, mon, thai tenasserim, muslim and moken people - and other things the burmese didn't want us to see.

at OP: note that the southern part of myanmar still hosts active mon armies controling small (border) communities and protecting their rights. a seriously impaired (but armed) KNU is also still active in tenasserim. people visiting this part of myanmar should keep in mind that non-bamar living more remotely (where foreigner cannot go of course since there is nothing to see there except for poor villagers and forest/jungle) there have suffered a lot and continue to suffer a lot thanx to plans for hydroelectric plants, (coal) mining, land confiscation, forced labor, rape, etc.

Many thnaks for all this info Sticky.

I am fairly certain I can travel by ferry to Myeik and noward to Dawei and this is the best way for us. I have traveklled on busses in Burma and really enjoyed the travel but it can be ardous.!

[harleyclarkey]

............. through the Mergui Archipelago so was nearly always out on the islands, especially in the early period of my time there. In 1999 I spent 6 and 1/2 months in one trip just on a boat, doing a complete survey of every island from the south near Kawthoung, all the way up to the northern islands past Myeik.

Do you think there is any way I could get a local to take us around a couple of islands or are they totally out of bounds for us foreigners. Even if for a day at a time to explore?

Thanks again!

[Tomtomtom69]

i've travelled southern myanmar (tenasserim) numerous times between '98 and 2011. i don't have much to add to the info above except that accomodation for foreigners is relatively expensive. little to zero budget places. many hotels cater to business people (burmese, chinese, singapore) and start at 35$-45$. the seafood is considered the best of myanmar and even the thai think myeik area is culinary TOP (since the thai have a history there!).

as long as i remember (and that is as recent as 6 months ago last time i was in myeik) foreigners were not allowed to travel the bus between Myeik and Dawei (or onward: busses head to rangoon). road travel has always been restricted for several reasons. particularly the DAWEI to YE area is "delicate" for several reasons you should know if you have visited myanmar several times. anyway, i'm not sure if foreigners are allowed nowadays. the ferry between kawthoung and myeik does NOT go out in rainy season, january is no problem though.

oddly i've never met SVB there although i know most westerners (very **very** little) who (quote) "have spent a good part of their life in this area", even just a handful of foreigners who entered or left via kawthoung...

where did you stay SVB ? what did you do ? actual "travelling" in Tenasserim was very difficult between the year 2000-2010, unless you flew into dawei or myeik (hopping from one city to another) and then not much travelling outside these townships was allowed due to ongoing harassment towards karen, mon, thai tenasserim, muslim and moken people - and other things the burmese didn't want us to see.

at OP: note that the southern part of myanmar still hosts active mon armies controling small (border) communities and protecting their rights. a seriously impaired (but armed) KNU is also still active in tenasserim. people visiting this part of myanmar should keep in mind that non-bamar living more remotely (where foreigner cannot go of course since there is nothing to see there except for poor villagers and forest/jungle) there have suffered a lot and continue to suffer a lot thanx to plans for hydroelectric plants, (coal) mining, land confiscation, forced labor, rape, etc.

That area is now quite safe. Everything has changed since AUg 28 and I believe even a little bit earlier on - overland travel north of Myeik to Yangon is definitely OK. Numerous foreign travelers have made the journey recently including a few in the last 3-5 months as documented by their reports on Lonely Planet's Thorntree forum. Only Myeik to Kawthoung requires a ferry I believe - and Prachuab, Thailand to Myeik has been OK for Thais to travel since May and while Prachuab is not an international crossing yet, it's OK for foreign travellers from other countries too at least as far as the border. Since Phu Nam Ron is now open as an international crossing, the nearest town being Dawei, it is obvious that overland access needs to be allowed and it now is.

[Tomtomtom69]

India & Bangladesh borders are not open for foreigners, locals cross everyday (legal/illegal).

india/myanmar: insurgents on BOTH sides. also, in india the eastern states are still pretty restricted (due to political turmoil and stuff). i was in tamu in 2011. a highway is intended to connect india with mae sot and beyond (cf car several rallies in recent years, last year too).

bangladesh/myanmar: too much rohingya related issues there, even UN has major issues to get to visit the "refugee" camps. and very poor roads. i've never been deep inside rakhine border lands, never got permission.

I don't really think the Myanmar-Bangladesh borders are open for locals either - there's too many problems there with illegal immigrants from Bangladesh and security related issues. This border will be the last to open as an international crossing I think - now numerous Thai crossings are open with 2-3 more likely to open fairly soon and the main Chinese crossing will reportedly open within a couple of months too. A second crossing at Mongla/Daluo (access to Jinghong) may also open fairly soon too. Next will be the Lao-Myanmar crossing where a bridge is currently under construction over the Mekong.

One day fairly soon, the main Indo-Myanmar border may open as an international crossing but now Indians are allowed to cross during the day only into the Burmese border town of Tamu and Burmese traders are allowed to cross during the day into the Indian border town. Perhaps the new Imphal-Mandalay bus service will signal a change in regulations but one must not forget that only international crossings allow both locals and foreigners to cross freely into another country without restrictions in this part of the world. Locals crossings are only for short border trade purposes and don't allow full access to the other countries' territory.

[stickylies]

@ 69: I never said it's NOT safe, what i say is that numerous locals, non-bamar, still suffer there. I travelled MAWDOUNG pass from Prachuap 2x last 18 months and met a lot of seriously affected MON, KAREN, THAI TENNASSERIM.

[Tomtomtom69]

So you can cross overland into Burma now and continue on to Rangoon and elsewhere? That's news to me and apparently Lonely Planet, too; great news in fact! Any idea which are the land borders where that can be done? Is transportation from Myawaddy to Rangoon easy and straightforward?

Hardie - Myanmar opened up 4 key borders for overland travel back in August. There has been a fair amount of media coverage about this in the last couple of months. *overland - meaning you can enter at one entry point, and leave via another*

We have also run various threads on the subject:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/657462-myanmar-opening-3-overland-routes-to-foreigners-in-august/

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/663321-four-overland-myanmar-thai-border-crossings-to-open-date-set-as-28th-august/

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/621452-overland-travel-in-myanmar-kawthoung-to-yangon-commencing-soon/

A quick search on google shows some info on this on the LP forums also....I won't post the links here.

The trick is to make sure you have an embassy-issued visa before arriving at the border.... You cannot just show up and be allowed to continue overland.

Thanx. Any idea when/if any borders into Bangladesh and/or India will be opened?

As SVB has said, 2015 or so, same as what I've been told by Burmese immigration but these dates are merely tentative. Basically, the main crossing to India is on the cards but Bangladesh isn't, at this stage. Although that could change over time.

I would rather be keeping my ears tuned for the opening of the Chinese border at Muse/Ruili, which I have reported on in a separate thread as it has been announced by the media. That will likely happen in a couple of months. Another brand new border crossing between Myanmar and Laos may also open fairly soon, once the bridge there has been completed. That could happen sometime next year. A couple of other Thai-Myanmar crossings that are currently open only for day visits, mostly visited by Thais such as the Singkorn Pass and the Three Pagodas Pass will also open as international crossings soon, probably in the new year.