United Airlines Cancelling Tokyo- BKK flights next year

[prog]

I think the issue is that with demand fixed (one could argue it will increase), supply (of seats) will decrease leading to an increase in fares. Also mis-alignment with connections at NRT, poor seating pitch on NH (767), no upgrades, no FF bonuses. If UA code-shared with TG this might be more palatable, but the UA/NH JV means just code-shares with NH for NRT-BKK.

Am now hearing the last flight in is 8 May, last flight out is 9 May.

Everything I am reading is saying end of March, where did you get May 9? That is the difference between me dumping UA and hanging on for another year because I do not like the idea of a 1 hour NRT transfer switching airlines with a 3 year old. The ANA morning flight really needs to move back to make UA connections work.

[rotary]

This is a real personal thing here, and there will be different opinions but, from flying quite a bit since 1981.........if it has an American flag on the tail I try to not use it. Poor service, ugly hostess that are hostile in many cases, some sectors charging for a beer, excessive lost baggage, etc are just a few of the reasons. Every time I break that rule to save $200 I regret it at flight time.

How about to save 2k on the transpacific routes?

I have never seen it make 2K difference on one ticket. More like $200 or $300 dollars. This may sound crazy but...........I get a set amount of vacation travel money from my employer every year that has nothing to do with the cost of a ticket. I can spend it all or spend part of it and put the remainder in my pocket. 2 years ago United would not let us carry on any baggage (sorry sir the people boarded before you have too many bags so you must check your hand carry which are within airline regulations) and then they lost my bags that had a USA Birth Abroad document in it then at our arrival airport in lost baggage they told me United was #1 in lost baggage I might just have to pay that $2K. I promised myself no more breaking down to save $200 and then putting up with a US carrier floor show.

[OMGImInPattaya]

This is a real personal thing here, and there will be different opinions but, from flying quite a bit since 1981.........if it has an American flag on the tail I try to not use it. Poor service, ugly hostess that are hostile in many cases, some sectors charging for a beer, excessive lost baggage, etc are just a few of the reasons. Every time I break that rule to save $200 I regret it at flight time.

How about to save 2k on the transpacific routes?

I have never seen it make 2K difference on one ticket. More like $200 or $300 dollars. This may sound crazy but...........I get a set amount of vacation travel money from my employer every year that has nothing to do with the cost of a ticket. I can spend it all or spend part of it and put the remainder in my pocket. 2 years ago United would not let us carry on any baggage (sorry sir the people boarded before you have too many bags so you must check your hand carry which are within airline regulations) and then they lost my bags that had a USA Birth Abroad document in it then at our arrival airport in lost baggage they told me United was #1 in lost baggage I might just have to pay that $2K. I promised myself no more breaking down to save $200 and then putting up with a US carrier floor show.

Maybe I misunderstood...in business class, the difference between UA or Delta on BKK/USA flights and most Asian carriers is 2-3000. UA I can get for about $3000 whereas Cathay, Korean, ANA are in the $4-5000 range. Only EVA comes close at around $3800 or so.

I think fares vary less in economy for some reason.

[lomatopo]

Schedule changes (will) get loaded on the weekend, maybe 12 midnight Zulu/Houston/Chicago? These have not yet been loaded, so don't bother quoting the web-site booking engine, or any other GDSes.

Some say the first NH departure will be pulled in to accommodate connections at NRT; not sure if we can book the NH code-share, which is operated by TG? Or we can 016 plate a TG flight? That would partially ameliorate this cessation of UA service to BKK.

Some are saying BR (Eva) via TPE might be a possible consideration.

[prog]

Schedule changes (will) get loaded on the weekend, maybe 12 midnight Zulu/Houston/Chicago? These have not yet been loaded, so don't bother quoting the web-site booking engine, or any other GDSes.

Some say the first NH departure will be pulled in to accommodate connections at NRT; not sure if we can book the NH code-share, which is operated by TG? Or we can 016 plate a TG flight? That would partially ameliorate this cessation of UA service to BKK.

Some are saying BR (Eva) via TPE might be a possible consideration.

I really want to know what they are going to do because I may want to use KE instead for my flight. Better product all together, and I may be willing to let my *A gold go away for 2015 and just take best price/product available.

[lomatopo]

I really want to know what they are going to do

Understand, many of us are in the same boat.

The FT thread may have more up to date details, but see you are following that thread. wxguy is well-informed, he is saying 30/31 March 2014, so for now would base decisions on that date. Apologies if my 8/9 June dates caused any issues for anyone - a local employee gave me those but now am not sure if these were accurate as he was getting updates remotely.

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/united-mileageplus-consolidated/1523590-ua-eliminate-nrt-bkk-747-service-ua837-ua838.html

Edited November 22, 2013 by lomatopo

[lomatopo]

The good ones always stay in my memory banks

Will never forget Iris Peterson, flew with her many times. Think she retired at age 85!

[loumaripol]

Hi, I am a retired UA Continental / UA employee. Sorry to say the flight is going March 2014. I hate to admit it, but the decsion is rational. Bangkok is a low fare market and the use of 747-400 or 777-200 has a cost of 14 hours flight time and 7 hours ground is tooo much for the yields out of Bangkok. I will miss this flight too!

[JLCrab]

I miss the ThaiAirways non-stop BKK to JFK 18 hours polar route A340.

[GAS]

Really enjoyed reading everyone's comments here! I am going to look at Eva, especially the new Laurel Class, I hear it is good.

I will miss my ritual plane change at NRT where I grab a shower and a draft from the beer machine and then look forward to landing somewhere warm and friendly in a few hours...

Have been a 1K for a lot of years with UA, rarely missed an upgrade on the BKK-NRT sector, even if I only would clear at the gate...planes were always full so a bit shocked to have heard this.

I can understand the economics but it still hurts, UA has been pretty good to me over the years and I have stuck with them but going to have to look at other options now.

[mogandave]

If I fly United from BKK to LAX and have to code share on the NRT BKK segment (my knees hurt just thinking about it) would ANA give me my three-bag allowance?

Regardless, bringing three bags back should not be an issue when checking in at LAX, correct?

Seems like Delta has a nice schedule, but I hate having to start the frequent flyer thing over.

[BKKdreaming]

If I fly United from BKK to LAX and have to code share on the NRT BKK segment (my knees hurt just thinking about it) would ANA give me my three-bag allowance?

Regardless, bringing three bags back should not be an issue when checking in at LAX, correct?

Seems like Delta has a nice schedule, but I hate having to start the frequent flyer thing over.

United just changed the baggage limits, so you need to be UNITED Gold for the 3 bags , not any other star alliance carrier which only gets 2 bags

so I am Gold on Aegean air but only get 2 bags on a United flight , but 3 bags on a Thai air flight

United have really devalued the FF program in the last month with a lot of other "suprises"

[JepSoDii]

I will miss my ritual plane change at NRT where I grab a shower and a draft from the beer machine and then look forward to landing somewhere warm and friendly in a few hours...

I had--end enjoyed--that ritual as well. Hopefully future flying will still be through NRT and that terminal since they have showers (not sure about other terminals). Only other place I know to get a cheap shower is Osaka and haven't been able to route that way in years. Hopefully someone will chime in with other cheap transit shower options. But the Tokyo one was gold. Was like 300 yen for ages. Might be 500-600 now. Can't remember, but I used it in July this year.

[lomatopo]

Given that UA and NH have a Joint Venture (which allows collusion) to share revenue/costs on transPAC but which is epcted to extend to intra-Asia as well (anti-trust immunity granted - which amazingly is allowed to stand - used to be illegal), one hopes that UA would treat BKK-NRT on a UA code-share operated by NH, sold on 016 stock, as if it were UA metal.

So FFP benies, bags, elite bonus, MM accrual, et al., would carry-over. But we'll have to wait and see. Given SMI/J 's (d*uche) track record, expect him to benefit from the JV but not share any benefits with UA pond-scum ("over-entitled" "customers").

Now we have to bend over even if there is no emergency landing expected.

United Continental Holdings and ANA Launch Trans-Pacific Joint Venture

CARRIERS OFFERING BROADER SELECTION OF FLIGHTS & FARES, MILEAGE BONUS

CHICAGO and LOS ANGELES, April 1, 2011 /PRNewswire/ -- United Continental Holdings, Inc. (NYSE: UAL) and ANA today announced the launch of their trans-Pacific joint venture, through which United Airlines and Continental Airlines may coordinate sales and marketing with ANA and improve benefits offered to each airline's frequent flyers.

Through the joint venture, enabled by the U.S.-Japan Open Skies agreement and antitrust immunity granted by U.S. and Japanese regulators, the airlines can align* schedules, fares, and terms and conditions for itineraries beginning April 1.

"We are pleased to launch our joint venture with ANA, as it will offer travelers greater choices, convenience and flexibility for their trans-Pacific travels," said Jeff Smisek, president and chief executive officer of United Continental Holdings.

"By forging this closer cooperation with our partner airlines in the Star Alliance, we will significantly enhance our ability to serve trans-Pacific customers and offer new choice and convenience for passengers," said Shinichiro Ito, president and CEO of ANA.

http://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/united-continental-holdings-and-ana-launch-trans-pacific-joint-venture-119064409.html

* "align" means collude on prices.

[grin]

I was a 1K flyer with UA for many years up to the merger. After that I only flew UA on SFO-NRT-BKK due to change in upgrades.

Without this route I won't be flying UA anymore so all of my miles will expire. I guess I will have to use them up on other Star Alliance flights.

Also two more RTs from SFO-BKK and I would have been a million miler on UA, guess I'll never make it now, what a waste.

Grin

[lomatopo]

I guess I will have to use them up on other Star Alliance flights

Best to book/ticket before 1 Feb 2014!

http://boardingarea.com/onemileatatime/2013/11/01/united-mileageplus-award-chart-devaluation/

MM (1 MM) used to be valuable; now it's nearly worthless. 2 MM is not even equal to the old 1 MM.

[IMA_FARANG]

This doesn't have a lot to do with the topic .... but I just read (in the "other" English language newspaper in Thailand) that Singapore airlines announced they will be ending their flight from Singapore to New York next year.

I believe it is that 19 hour flight frpm Singapore through Frankfurt to New York flight (refueling stop only, same plane all the way) they are referring to ... the article wan't to clear about it.

O took that flight one time....cattle class .... and even though it was Singapore Air I said never again.

19 hours in the air is just to long, even on Singapore Airlines.

For the record, the laast time I flew back to the U.S. I did it on United Airlines, BKK to Narita to SFO ... then on to Boston on United also.

[grin]

Yep, MM is practically worthless now unless it gets you into a special security line. Same for any of their FF tiers.

Website is still showing UA837 in May. Guess they will let you book and later move you over to ANA for the NRT-BKK leg. Nice trick.

Grin

[JepSoDii]

I was a 1K flyer with UA for many years up to the merger. After that I only flew UA on SFO-NRT-BKK due to change in upgrades.

Without this route I won't be flying UA anymore so all of my miles will expire. I guess I will have to use them up on other Star Alliance flights.

Also two more RTs from SFO-BKK and I would have been a million miler on UA, guess I'll never make it now, what a waste.

Grin

Whatever you do, don't let your miles expire. Remember all you have to do to avoid expiration is have some activity in the account in any form, every 18 months. Use them slowly if you have to (25k round trip economy within SE Asia, though this may have risen with the recent devaluation). The point is, use every last point! United made money on you for years. They owe you. Don't let em off the hook. Burn burn burn baby burn (those miles).

[lomatopo]

I believe it is that 19 hour flight frpm Singapore through Frankfurt to New York flight (refueling stop only, same plane all the way)

Nope, you are confused.

Believe SQ are cancelling the direct, non-stop (polar route, A340-500 all J) SIN-EWR service (SQ21/22).

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/singapore-airlines-krisflyer/1524863-sqs-super-long-haul-sin-ewr-terminated.html

SQ 25/26 SIN-FRA-JFK remains; sold as SIN-FRA, or FRA-JFK, or SIN-(FRA)-JFK, so not just a refueling stop in FRA per se. Also agree it's off-topic.

Edited November 26, 2013 by lomatopo

[grin]

I sure wasn't planning on letting the miles expire. Even using 120K miles for biz class to Asia on Star Alliance I have enough for 6 RTs.

Due to award restrictions I doubt that I will use that many in time so I will have to take one short haul UA flight right before March, 2015.

So it looks like I will be flying here free about twice a year for around the next 3 years.

I really won't miss UA that much as I've been stuck in Economy Plus most of the time since the merger.

Also when UA changed to the 180 degree reclining seats in biz class they severely reduced the number of biz class seats and that didn't help upgrades at all.

Grin

[Sam Drucker]

United just changed the baggage limits, so you need to be UNITED Gold for the 3 bags , not any other star alliance carrier which only gets 2 bags

so I am Gold on Aegean air but only get 2 bags on a United flight , but 3 bags on a Thai air flight

United have really devalued the FF program in the last month with a lot of other "suprises"

Thank you for mentioning this! I was not aware of this game-changing move by United. I typically loaded up with supplies and some unavailable foods in the US, bringing back three bags to Thailand with me every time.

As a Star Gold via the THAI program, I have used THAI for flights to/from LAX for years, with United or US Airways to do my substantial domestic US travel. United always had the higher free baggage limits for Star Golds (3 bags @ up to 70 lbs each), although their fares that are eligible for mileage-earning with THAI (non- G,L,S,T,W) are higher. US Airways has 3 bags @ up to 50 pounds each, and mileage-earning fares with THAI on practically all fares offered.

Now United is only offering Star Golds 2 free bags @ 50 pounds for international trips, and 1 free bag @ 50 pounds for domestic. I have far less compelling reasons now to use United for anything.

Unfortunately, US Airways will be leaving Star Alliance sometime soon (probably early 2014) due to their merger with American.

Sure would be nice if Southwest Airlines joined Star Alliance after US Airways exits.

[GinBoy2]

I miss the ThaiAirways non-stop BKK to JFK 18 hours polar route A340.

Not one airline ever made money flying the A340-500. The last numbers I saw said to to break even it would need to be loaded at 120%

[GinBoy2]

I stopped using both UA & Thai several years ago for flights to California. Thai, waaaaaay too expensive, especially after they cancelled the non stop to LAX. UA, the layover in NRT is far too long. China Airlines has a decent flight connecting through Taipei, good pricing and quick connection.

For connecting flights to SFO the layover us usually 2 hours; and it's 2 or 4 on the return. That's long?

It is for me, CI is roughly an hour layover in Taipei each way

[lomatopo]

Now United is only offering Star Golds 2 free bags @ 50 pounds for international trips

But...if you are *G with UA/MP (Premier Gold/Platinum/1K) you still get 3 bags at 70 lbs (32 Kg).

[JLCrab]

I miss the ThaiAirways non-stop BKK to JFK 18 hours polar route A340.

Not one airline ever made money flying the A340-500. The last numbers I saw said to to break even it would need to be loaded at 120%

3 round trips on the BKK - JFK - BKK and they never asked me to make up the difference. These days I don't fly enough to worry about it. Looks like it'll be Japan Airlines / American for me as I need to get to Florida.

[BKKdreaming]

Now United is only offering Star Golds 2 free bags @ 50 pounds for international trips

But...if you are *G with UA/MP (Premier Gold/Platinum/1K) you still get 3 bags at 70 lbs (32 Kg).

True if you are a UNITED Star Gold , but not other Star gold like Thai , Singapore , Lufthansa etc

[lomatopo]

I sure wasn't planning on letting the miles expire.

There is a significant mileage devaluation coming February 1, 2014 so it might be beneficial to use at least some of your miles before that date. This is the ticket by date, not the travel by date, so you could book travel through to Dec. 31, 2014. Further, depending on your status, changes/re-deposits are free. I just used 140,000 miles for a round-trip BKK-BOS-BKK in first class on several carriers; the total taxes and fees was $76.10 as we still do not have to pay YQ (fuel surcharges) - this latter point could also change at any point in time.

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/united-mileageplus-consolidated/1517647-changes-mileageplus-award-upgrade-policies-eff-feb-2014-a.html

For those holding ticketed reservations beyond March 30, 2014 you may wish to get ahead of the curve and work your changes now. UA Res. are aware of the changes but any systematic re-booking may not happen until Dec. 10, 2013. I wouldn't necessarily count on NH pulling in their departure time, so you may not be able to make a connection. You may be forced to overnight (or red-eye) in NRT, or at least change your NRT-USA flight to and earlier departure. UA waived any re-issue/change fees for me, as they are required to do per the CoC when there is a change in ticketed operating carriers.

Edited November 29, 2013 by lomatopo

[grin]

Thanks for the heads up on the further devaluation of UA's miles. Guess it's time to start making reservations.

Grin

[GinBoy2]

Hilarious, within 1 hour from me receiving an email from UA Mileage Plus informing me that United is cancelling the BKK flights, I watch a United commercial on hulu, featuring taxi drivers, one being a tuk tuk driver speaking thai. There's irony