Thailand colonized

[JusMe]

Yes, but understand that the average Joe on here, myself included, is not going to dedicate time to in depth studies of this topic and Wiki is the best go-to reference we have. If you feel some of the info is in error, please enlighten us... or point us in the direction of some available references on line.

I feel the Wiki article was quite well done.

And there's one of the problems. Not referring to you specifically or even at all, that average Joe wants to spout without dedicating time to some in depth study. Wiki can be a good introduction, but always approach their articles sceptically.

Take a look at some of what is written there about subjects relating to Thailand that we cannot discuss here on TV. Then try to add or make adjustments to them! Horror and banishment! There are definite agendas behind much of what is written about Thailand on Wiki. Information relating to its wartime record, the activities of Seri Thai, the October incidents, are all carefully vetted and protected.

Not all information can be encapsulated on a web page, and might require downloading something more extensive.

[7by7]

In Thai accounts of the war the alliance with the Japanese is depicted

The crux of the presentation is in those first three words. We all know just how knowledgeable and respectful Thais are about history, particularly but not exclusively, their own.

Ah, isn't quoting out of context wonderful; perhaps you should go back and read the whole paragraph again.

While you're at it, read the whole website; remembering that it is written from the view point of Australian prisoners of war who worked on the railway and contains many quotes from accounts by those POWs about how the Thai people helped them.

Perhaps the most famous example being Boonpong Sirivejaphan.

From the Australian embassy 2012 ANZAC day press release.

Ambassador Wise also praised humanitarian acts of Thais who helped the PoWs during the construction of the Death Railway, sometimes at great personal risk.

One such individual, Mr Boonpong Sirivejjabhandu smuggled food and medicines to PoWs working on the Death Railway and saved thousands of lives. Thirty years after his death, relatives of former PoWs still visit Boonpong and Brothers Store to express their gratitude for his humanitarian acts. His sister-in-law, Mrs Lumyai Sirivejjabhandu, welcomes these Australians and is happy to share Boonpong’s story.

After the war Boonpong was awarded the highest British civilian medal for bravery; the George Cross; the civilian equivalent of a Victoria Cross. His bravery was similarly recognised by the Dutch and Australian governments.

POW accounts show that many, unrecognised Thai civilians acted in similar ways.

Don't confuse the pragmatic decision of a military dictatorship with the thoughts and desires of the actual Thai people.

[simple1]

Any knowledge of how the barbarity and cruelty of the Japanese in Korea, Manchuria and China influenced the decision making of the Thai government?

There was little outside knowledge of the Japanese activities in Manchuria (other than it had become Manchukuo) or the rest of China, particularly before 1941. And the Japanese colonization of Korea was generally ignored.

The Thai government was impressed by the Japanese economy and growing military power. There were Japanese settlers, including spies, throughout Thailand. In one twisted kind of way, one could say they were adding to the Thai economy by their business links.

Are you sure? I find it difficult to believe that the executive decision making level within the Thai government were unaware of the Japanese atrocities in China and elsewhere. The mass killings of civilians in China and other activities were reported in the USA and were a contributing factor to US policy towards Japan; at the very least the Thai Embassy must have briefed the government.

[wolf5370]

I guess Siam colonized the Kingdom of Lanna (Chiang Mai not becoming officially Siamese until 1939 when Siam became Thailand) in 1768.

Thailand has only existed since the beginning of World War 2 (or two years before if you are American or Russian ) - before that it was Siam.

So, Thailand has never been colonized as it is too young for all that malarkey. Siam colonized Lanna. Burma colonized Siam a couple of times - the biggest was the sacking of Ayutthaya. The Khmer nation stretch right across Thailand except for the very bottom few provinces. Siam once reached right down the trunk that is now Burma and Malaysia, and also the ears at the back - much of Laos and Cambodia.

The original (possibly) Tai and Mon Dvaravadi people were colonized by the Chinese around the 7th century - other peoples inhabiting the area which is Thailand now were Malay and Mon-Khmer - and perhaps the Symies (Brown People - as discovered in writing found at the Ankor Wat).

Land was also later ceded to the Brits and the French.

It is ridiculous really - as humans (homo-sapiens) we all originally came from southern Africa - this has been proved. The earliest movement of our ancestors actually is as a (now extinct) squirrel like mammal which migrated from what is now the Northern USA. We dispersed around the world and colonized and recolonized the land over and over.

[TheNativeSon]

No no no. Thailand was never colonized by anyone.

Read the book "Asian Godfathers" by Joe Studwell. You'll definitely change you mindset on the topic.

[Stradavarius37]

For a good overview - read "Thailand: A Short History" by David Wyatt - Ignore the barstool historians on TV.

Better yet get a degree in Asian studies from Oxford but hardly the accepted method of debate on TV. Did you think it would pass instead of linking information on the INTERNET?

If you want me to comment, you better string your random thoughts together into one coherent phrase with a point. That last sentence has no point. What is "it" that you are referring too? Barstool is calling you....

[TheNativeSon]

Any knowledge of how the barbarity and cruelty of the Japanese in Korea, Manchuria and China influenced the decision making of the Thai government?

There was little outside knowledge of the Japanese activities in Manchuria (other than it had become Manchukuo) or the rest of China, particularly before 1941. And the Japanese colonization of Korea was generally ignored.

The Thai government was impressed by the Japanese economy and growing military power. There were Japanese settlers, including spies, throughout Thailand. In one twisted kind of way, one could say they were adding to the Thai economy by their business links.

Are you sure? I find it difficult to believe that the executive decision making level within the Thai government were unaware of the Japanese atrocities in China and elsewhere. The mass killings of civilians in China and other activities were reported in the USA and were a contributing factor to US policy towards Japan; at the very least the Thai Embassy must have briefed the government.

Sir, are you just sleep-walking through this sojourn known as the "farang" experience in Thailand? Have you not learned anything about Thai "cultural" values? Huh?

[TheNativeSon]

You are wrong on the occupation by Japanese. It's a negotiation between the ruling powers. Japs get "free passage way" to go thru Thailand to invade Malaysia and then Singapore. In return, Thailand will be left untouched.

In other words - Collaborators - but what about 'The Bridge over the River Qwai??'

You seem to be basing your opinion on the book and the film. Both works of fiction which bear absolutely no relationship with actual events!

From the Thai-Burma Railway and Hellfire Pass website.

When the Japanese launched their attack on Malaya on 7–8 December 1941 they demanded that the Thai government grant them free passage for their troops through Thailand. Since it was clear that the British and the United States, from whom Thailand had sought assurances of support in the months before war, had no capacity to assist Thailand, the government of Phibun Songkram capitulated. Thai troops resisted the landing of Japanese troops on Thai territory for only a matter of hours.

In late December 1941 Thailand signed an agreement with the Japanese and then on 25 January 1942 declared war on Britain and the United States. It was a decision which split the government with the Thai foreign minister Direk Chaiyanam and the liberal leader Pridi Phanomyong advocating resistance against the Japanese. Overseas Thai diplomats and ex-patriots also opposed what they saw as a Japanese occupation of Thailand and formed the Seri Thai (Free Thai) movement.

In Thai accounts of the war the alliance with the Japanese is depicted — not unreasonably — as a pragmatic accommodation to the realities of power balances in the Asia-Pacific. It was a ‘devil’s choice’ in which the only option available to the Thais, if they wished to preserve their sovereignty and some semblance of independence, was to collaborate with the Japanese. Indeed when the war ended Thailand, which installed a more liberal government with Seri Thai connections, in 1944, was ‘cleared of any war guilt’ and moved quickly into the US sphere of influence.

Personally, I don't blame the Thais for making that collaborative move. The Americans were too far away, and the British Empire was already on the threshold of disintegration, in1941.

[thailiketoo]

For a good overview - read "Thailand: A Short History" by David Wyatt - Ignore the barstool historians on TV.

Better yet get a degree in Asian studies from Oxford but hardly the accepted method of debate on TV. Did you think it would pass instead of linking information on the INTERNET?

If you want me to comment, you better string your random thoughts together into one coherent phrase with a point. That last sentence has no point. What is "it" that you are referring too? Barstool is calling you....

Nonsense flame. 1. Barstool comment. 2. Obvious reference ignored. 3. Coherent phrase with a point.

I will not dignify your flaming nonsense with a reply. Ah heck, yes I will. Read a book on INTERNET ETIQUETTE. Suggesting posters read a book instead of quoting the book or thought or argument is not polite or reasonable. If you want to participate in a debate back up your points with words or quotes not suggestions to read a book. Do you really expect I will pop out to a book store, buy a book, read it and come back and reply to you?

Quote the book and suggest reading it for further information. And stop with the kindergarten flaming. It serves no purpose except to show off your immaturity.

If you want to correct my grammar there are Thai Visa rules to assist you. From posting rules, " Don't waste space correcting other members' grammar and spelling."

[sms747]

The Americans were too far away, and the British Empire was already on the threshold of disintegration, in1941.

British Empire still ruled a fifth of the world in 1941, nobody knew it would 'disintegrate' at the time, hind site is a wonderful thing, but no excuse for Thai cowardice.

[StreetCowboy]

For a good overview - read "Thailand: A Short History" by David Wyatt - Ignore the barstool historians on TV.

Better yet get a degree in Asian studies from Oxford but hardly the accepted method of debate on TV. Did you think it would pass instead of linking information on the INTERNET?

If you want me to comment, you better string your random thoughts together into one coherent phrase with a point. That last sentence has no point. What is "it" that you are referring too? Barstool is calling you....

Nonsense flame. 1. Barstool comment. 2. Obvious reference ignored. 3. Coherent phrase with a point.

I will not dignify your flaming nonsense with a reply. Ah heck, yes I will. Read a book on INTERNET ETIQUETTE. Suggesting posters read a book instead of quoting the book or thought or argument is not polite or reasonable. If you want to participate in a debate back up your points with words or quotes not suggestions to read a book. Do you really expect I will pop out to a book store, buy a book, read it and come back and reply to you?

Quote the book and suggest reading it for further information. And stop with the kindergarten flaming. It serves no purpose except to show off your immaturity.

If you want to correct my grammar there are Thai Visa rules to assist you. From posting rules, " Don't waste space correcting other members' grammar and spelling."

Well, I appreciate references for further reading, and might possibly follow them up in some cases, It would be interesting to have a brief precis of the way in which the referenced text differed from the barstool experts' version of history, but if I was really interested, I might be tempted to try and read the book myself, or at least do my own internet research on the book. I know doing work yourself is less entertaining than whinging about other people not doing work, but generally, and particularly in the field of education, I often find the effort worthwhile

SC

[ultimate weapon]

You are wrong on the occupation by Japanese. It's a negotiation between the ruling powers. Japs get "free passage way" to go thru Thailand to invade Malaysia and then Singapore. In return, Thailand will be left untouched.

This is nothing to be proud of. Yes in theory they weren't invaded by the japs and didn't fight them but it was rather cowardly of them to do that.

Thais are rather proud of the fact they were never a western colony but it's not because they actually successfully fought off the western powers but tried to sneak their way around it like how they ceded portions of north malaysia to the brits cause the brits were more powerful than them so there is nothing to feel proud of. Burma in contrast looks like a stronger country even today thais are rather awed by the burmese.

[thailiketoo]

The Americans were too far away, and the British Empire was already on the threshold of disintegration, in1941.

British Empire still ruled a fifth of the world in 1941, nobody knew it would 'disintegrate' at the time, hind site is a wonderful thing, but no excuse for Thai cowardice.

What does the fact that there was a British Empire (almost in total revolt; Burma, India, Malaysia etc...). Didn't everyone know that the British Empire was a thing of the past in 1941? Atlantic Charter 1941 Third, they respect the right of all peoples to choose the form of government under which they will live; and they wish to see sovereign rights and self government restored to those who have been forcibly deprived of them. What does that have to do with Thailand not being colonized or cowardice, where does that come from?

[ultimate weapon]

Any knowledge of how the barbarity and cruelty of the Japanese in Korea, Manchuria and China influenced the decision making of the Thai government?

There was little outside knowledge of the Japanese activities in Manchuria (other than it had become Manchukuo) or the rest of China, particularly before 1941. And the Japanese colonization of Korea was generally ignored.

The Thai government was impressed by the Japanese economy and growing military power. There were Japanese settlers, including spies, throughout Thailand. In one twisted kind of way, one could say they were adding to the Thai economy by their business links.

The thais and japs have a rather interesting relationship. Take the thai japan friendship bridge and also one movie starring a japanese historical figure that became an important member of thai society in the 18th century i think. There was a movie made about this and it starred buakaw

Ok found the name of the movie. Yamada: The Samurai of Ayothay

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yamada:_The_Samurai_of_Ayothaya

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yamada_Nagamasa

Yamada Nagamasa (山田 長政?, 1590 1630) was a Japanese adventurer who gained considerable influence in the Ayutthaya Kingdom at the beginning of the 17th century and became the governor of Nakhon Si Thammarat province, which is located on the Malay Peninsula in present-day southern Thailand.

[thailiketoo]

You are wrong on the occupation by Japanese. It's a negotiation between the ruling powers. Japs get "free passage way" to go thru Thailand to invade Malaysia and then Singapore. In return, Thailand will be left untouched.

This is nothing to be proud of. Yes in theory they weren't invaded by the japs and didn't fight them but it was rather cowardly of them to do that.

Thais are rather proud of the fact they were never a western colony but it's not because they actually successfully fought off the western powers but tried to sneak their way around it like how they ceded portions of north malaysia to the brits cause the brits were more powerful than them so there is nothing to feel proud of. Burma in contrast looks like a stronger country even today thais are rather awed by the burmese.

I don't think the Thais were afraid of anyone. They had just beaten France and had an up to date army, air force and navy. They made a deal with the Japanese because they thought Japan would win the war and they wanted the Burmese Opium which they got to the tune of 32 tons or something like that. And 32 tons of opium even back then was a lot of cash.

[ultimate weapon]

You are wrong on the occupation by Japanese. It's a negotiation between the ruling powers. Japs get "free passage way" to go thru Thailand to invade Malaysia and then Singapore. In return, Thailand will be left untouched.

This is nothing to be proud of. Yes in theory they weren't invaded by the japs and didn't fight them but it was rather cowardly of them to do that.

Thais are rather proud of the fact they were never a western colony but it's not because they actually successfully fought off the western powers but tried to sneak their way around it like how they ceded portions of north malaysia to the brits cause the brits were more powerful than them so there is nothing to feel proud of. Burma in contrast looks like a stronger country even today thais are rather awed by the burmese.

I don't think the Thais were afraid of anyone. They had just beaten France and had an up to date army, air force and navy. They made a deal with the Japanese because they thought Japan would win the war and they wanted the Burmese Opium which they got to the tune of 32 tons or something like that. And 32 tons of opium even back then was a lot of cash.

I didn't know thailand beat the french. Then again the viets beat the french and the french are known to be wussies. Take a look at haiti. Do you know which european power colonized haiti and then got beaten by them and beacame the 1st free black nation in the western hemisphere? Suffice to say if even slaves can beat their better armed masters and become free of them and mind you the haitian slaves didn't have anyone else to aid them it was just themselves while french colonists had france and other western powers to aid it and still lost haiti this shows that anyone can beat the french so thailand beating france doesn't mean anything.

Up to date army, airforce? You sure? Why did they give up northern malaysia to the brits?

[sustento]

You are wrong on the occupation by Japanese. It's a negotiation between the ruling powers. Japs get "free passage way" to go thru Thailand to invade Malaysia and then Singapore. In return, Thailand will be left untouched.

This is nothing to be proud of. Yes in theory they weren't invaded by the japs and didn't fight them but it was rather cowardly of them to do that.

Thais are rather proud of the fact they were never a western colony but it's not because they actually successfully fought off the western powers but tried to sneak their way around it like how they ceded portions of north malaysia to the brits cause the brits were more powerful than them so there is nothing to feel proud of. Burma in contrast looks like a stronger country even today thais are rather awed by the burmese.

I don't think the Thais were afraid of anyone. They had just beaten France and had an up to date army, air force and navy. They made a deal with the Japanese because they thought Japan would win the war and they wanted the Burmese Opium which they got to the tune of 32 tons or something like that. And 32 tons of opium even back then was a lot of cash.

I didn't know thailand beat the french. Then again the viets beat the french and the french are known to be wussies. Take a look at haiti. Do you know which european power colonized haiti and then got beaten by them and beacame the 1st free black nation in the western hemisphere? Suffice to say if even slaves can beat their better armed masters and become free of them and mind you the haitian slaves didn't have anyone else to aid them it was just themselves while french colonists had france and other western powers to aid it and still lost haiti this shows that anyone can beat the french so thailand beating france doesn't mean anything.

Up to date army, airforce? You sure? Why did they give up northern malaysia to the brits?

Tell that to Napoleon...

[thailiketoo]

You are wrong on the occupation by Japanese. It's a negotiation between the ruling powers. Japs get "free passage way" to go thru Thailand to invade Malaysia and then Singapore. In return, Thailand will be left untouched.

This is nothing to be proud of. Yes in theory they weren't invaded by the japs and didn't fight them but it was rather cowardly of them to do that.

Thais are rather proud of the fact they were never a western colony but it's not because they actually successfully fought off the western powers but tried to sneak their way around it like how they ceded portions of north malaysia to the brits cause the brits were more powerful than them so there is nothing to feel proud of. Burma in contrast looks like a stronger country even today thais are rather awed by the burmese.

I don't think the Thais were afraid of anyone. They had just beaten France and had an up to date army, air force and navy. They made a deal with the Japanese because they thought Japan would win the war and they wanted the Burmese Opium which they got to the tune of 32 tons or something like that. And 32 tons of opium even back then was a lot of cash.

I didn't know thailand beat the french. Then again the viets beat the french and the french are known to be wussies. Take a look at haiti. Do you know which european power colonized haiti and then got beaten by them and beacame the 1st free black nation in the western hemisphere? Suffice to say if even slaves can beat their better armed masters and become free of them and mind you the haitian slaves didn't have anyone else to aid them it was just themselves while french colonists had france and other western powers to aid it and still lost haiti this shows that anyone can beat the french so thailand beating france doesn't mean anything.

Up to date army, airforce? You sure? Why did they give up northern malaysia to the brits?

Google Franco Thai war 1940. Thailand defeats the French Army. They had planes from the US and Japan.

Interesting that a Thai Fighter (made in America) shot down an American bomber over Thailand. Thailand had a 50,000 man combat experienced army ready to go. After WWII Thailand surrendered the possessions they had acquired by force or treaty during the war as part of the surrender.

Edited November 24, 2013 by thailiketoo

[ultimate weapon]

Tell that to Napoleon...

Oh yeah the one whoose name is forever linked to the stereotype of the angry overachieving short man syndrome.

Let's ask the US how brave the french are losing vietnam and losing haiti and losing to thailand. OMG.

[StreetCowboy]

Tell that to Napoleon...

Oh yeah the one whoose name is forever linked to the stereotype of the angry overachieving short man syndrome.

Let's ask the US how brave the french are losing vietnam and losing haiti and losing to thailand. OMG.

Let's ask the USA how bave the French are, losing to Vietnam... Did I hear that correctly?

[ultimate weapon]

Google Franco Thai war 1940. Thailand defeats the French Army. They had planes from the US and Japan.

Interesting that a Thai Fighter (made in America) shot down an American bomber over Thailand. Thailand had a 50,000 man combat experienced army ready to go. After WWII Thailand surrendered the possessions they had acquired by force or treaty during the war as part of the surrender.

I read thru it. Thailand beat france cos france got invaded and occupied by germany. It's not a fair fight is it? Read this: The German occupation of metropolitan France made France's hold on its overseas possessions, including Indochina, tenuous. The isolated colonial administration was cut off from outside help and outside supplies.

Also i read thru the earlier war

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Franco-Siamese_War

This happened during chualalongkorn's reign and they gave up territories to the french so they the war in 1940 was them taking back lands they lost earlier due to a lucky break cos france got invaded by germany and the overseas colonies got cut off from outside support and help.

[ultimate weapon]

Tell that to Napoleon...

Oh yeah the one whoose name is forever linked to the stereotype of the angry overachieving short man syndrome.

Let's ask the US how brave the french are losing vietnam and losing haiti and losing to thailand. OMG.

Let's ask the USA how bave the French are, losing to Vietnam... Did I hear that correctly?

Yes the US also lost the vietnam war but the french lost to the viets as a colonial possession.

[Stradavarius37]

 

 

For a good overview - read "Thailand: A Short History" by David Wyatt - Ignore the barstool historians on TV.  

Better yet get a degree in Asian studies from Oxford but hardly the accepted method of debate on TV.  Did you think it would pass instead of linking information on the INTERNET?

 

 

If you want me to comment, you better string your random thoughts together into one coherent phrase with a point.  That last sentence has no point.  What is "it" that you are referring too?  Barstool is calling you....

Nonsense flame.  1.  Barstool comment.  2. Obvious reference ignored.  3.  Coherent phrase with a point.

 

I will not dignify your flaming nonsense with a reply.  Ah heck, yes I will.  Read a book on INTERNET ETIQUETTE.  Suggesting posters read a book instead of quoting the book or thought or argument is not polite or reasonable.  If you want to participate in a debate back up your points with words or quotes not suggestions to read a book.  Do you really  expect I will pop out to a book store, buy a book, read it and come back and reply to you? 

 

Quote the book and suggest reading it for further information.  And stop with the kindergarten flaming.  It serves no purpose except to show off your immaturity. 

 

If you want to correct my grammar there are Thai Visa rules to assist you. From posting rules, " Don't waste space correcting other members' grammar and spelling."

Sent from my iPhone using ThaiVisa app

[AYJAYDEE]

Either they were opportunistic collaborators with the Japanese, or they surrendered and were colonised. Either way the Thais did nothing to be proud of in ww2.

what would you expect they should do? side with european colonial powers,who had forceably taken asian lands, over another asian nation? why the hell would they?

Any knowledge of how the barbarity and cruelty of the Japanese in Korea, Manchuria and China influenced the decision making of the Thai government?

they also had knowledge of european barbarity in indo china burma, india africa and indonesia. why would they side with them to maintain those colonies?

[internationallawreview]

WHAT REALLY HAPPENED IN WWII IN THAILAND - ON THE GROUND ?

Does anyone have any well referenced historical knowledge on what happened to the Thais during WWII ? Was is more of a "pass through" in Swiss terms, a non-antagonist stance and even turning a blind eye to the more disagreeable Japanese actions? And in doing so did they keep their basic sovereignty - independent control of their own land, and by implication the people also. Or were the Thai subjected to having their land used in ways which went against the Thais, or their citizens forced into combat, labor, or otherwise used, jailed, raped or harmed?

[simple1]

Either they were opportunistic collaborators with the Japanese, or they surrendered and were colonised. Either way the Thais did nothing to be proud of in ww2.

what would you expect they should do? side with european colonial powers,who had forceably taken asian lands, over another asian nation? why the hell would they?

Any knowledge of how the barbarity and cruelty of the Japanese in Korea, Manchuria and China influenced the decision making of the Thai government?

they also had knowledge of european barbarity in indo china burma, india africa and indonesia. why would they side with them to maintain those colonies?

I am assuming that at the time the Thai decision makers were primarily Thai Chinese and therefore curious what if any influence this has on negotiations/talks with the Japanese taking into consideration the extreme violence of the Japanese against the Chinese population.

As you know after the capture of Hong Kong, Malaya and Singapore thousands of Chinese civilians were murdered, I do not believe the same happened in Thailand, so why not?

[simple1]

Any knowledge of how the barbarity and cruelty of the Japanese in Korea, Manchuria and China influenced the decision making of the Thai government?

There was little outside knowledge of the Japanese activities in Manchuria (other than it had become Manchukuo) or the rest of China, particularly before 1941. And the Japanese colonization of Korea was generally ignored.

The Thai government was impressed by the Japanese economy and growing military power. There were Japanese settlers, including spies, throughout Thailand. In one twisted kind of way, one could say they were adding to the Thai economy by their business links.

Are you sure? I find it difficult to believe that the executive decision making level within the Thai government were unaware of the Japanese atrocities in China and elsewhere. The mass killings of civilians in China and other activities were reported in the USA and were a contributing factor to US policy towards Japan; at the very least the Thai Embassy must have briefed the government.

Sir, are you just sleep-walking through this sojourn known as the "farang" experience in Thailand? Have you not learned anything about Thai "cultural" values? Huh?

Nope, no idea how Thai cultural values dictated their response to the Japanese in 1941, please explain specifics/examples

Edited November 25, 2013 by simple1

[sms747]

] They made a deal with the Japanese because they thought Japan would win the war and they wanted the Burmese Opium which they got to the tune of 32 tons or something like that. And 32 tons of opium even back then was a lot of cash.

so they were opportunistic would be drug dealers then, sod being occupied if there were 32 big ones of opium in the offing, did they ever get it. or were they ripped off?

[thailiketoo]

Any knowledge of how the barbarity and cruelty of the Japanese in Korea, Manchuria and China influenced the decision making of the Thai government?

they also had knowledge of european barbarity in indo china burma, india africa and indonesia. why would they side with them to maintain those colonies?

I am assuming that at the time the Thai decision makers were primarily Thai Chinese and therefore curious what if any influence this has on negotiations/talks with the Japanese taking into consideration the extreme violence of the Japanese against the Chinese population.

As you know after the capture of Hong Kong, Malaya and Singapore thousands of Chinese civilians were murdered, I do not believe the same happened in Thailand, so why not?

Thailand at the time was very anti Chinese.

"Thailand joined the Japanese because of anti Chinese sentiment of the PM. On 5 August 1941, Thailand joined a group of nations that recognized the Japanese puppet state of Manchukuo. His (Phibunsongkhram) administration also encouraged economic nationalism. Anti-Chinese policies were imposed, and the Thai people were to purchase as many Thai products as possible and therefore destroy the Chinese proportion in markets. In a speech in 1938, Luang Wichitwathakan, himself of Chinese ancestry, compared the Chinese in Siam to the Jews in Germany."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plaek_Phibunsongkhram

[thailiketoo]

One could say the country is controlled by the Japanese right now.

and "One" would be very very wrong!

For those that are interested in the topic I suggest reading up on the Seri Thai from as many different sources as possible. They did a very good job of rescuing allied airmen that were downed over Thailand (including in US bombing runs over BKK.)

Those that think there was little resistance to what indeed did become a de facto occupation by the Japanese need only look at the Seri Thai movement and the fall of Phibun.

The fall of Phibun eh? Which fall? The guy had more lives than a cat.

"On June 29, 1951, Phibunsongkhram was attending a ceremony aboard the Manhattan dredge when he was taken hostage by a group of naval officers, who then quickly confined him on board the warship Sri Ayutthaya. Negotiations between the government and the coup organizers swiftly broke down, leading to violent street fighting in Bangkok between the navy and the army, which was supported by the air force. Phibunsongkhram was able to swim back ashore when the Sri Ayutthaya was bombed by the air force. With their hostage gone, the sailors and marines were forced to lay down their arms."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plaek_Phibunsongkhram

The Americans liked Phibun because even though he was a fascist and fought with the Japanese during WWII he was a rabid anti Chinese leader that also led Thailand into the Korean war on the Allied side.

But all things must come to an end.

"Suspicions of fraudulent practices during an election emerged. The American-equipped Thai army played a major role in the coup d'état of 1957, and the United States was "deeply involved" The resulting unrest led to a second coup in October 1958 by Field Marshal Sarit Dhanaraj, who had earlier sworn to be Phibun's most loyal subordinate. Sarit was supported by many royalists who wanted to regain a foothold. Phibunsongkhram was then forced into exile in Japan, where he lived until his death in 1964."

He was quite a guy. Don't really know if I liked him or hated him but certainly he was the most interesting figure in the history of Thailand.