Pregnant girl advice - pt 2. no illegal stuff

[razorramone]

My last thread got locked, but in among all the abuse and jokes I got some helpful stuff. So I hope the mods don't mind me restarting it, minus any illegal discussion, I understand abortion is illegal here and don't want to talk about it.

I saw the girl tonight, and found out:

-She is definitely pregnant, I made her take two tests right here.

-It is 99% likely to be mine, because I know she was a virgin before me.

-She is only 15 days pregnant. It's nothing right now. BUT... after talking to her friend, she wants to keep it. So all that stuff in the last thread, forget it. She is big into Buddhism.

Well I made it clear there is no chance of us being together, and that I likely wont even be here when it is born. I've got my plans and will stick to them. I'll be in the planes of Africa.

She wanted me to meet her parents for when she tells them what has happened. Is this some kind of trick? It smelled like one to me, so I said hell no.

She asked me to help pay hospital bills, which i'll do. Just wondering how much all that will cost over the next 8 months?

She was kind of scary.. twitching, looking crazy in the eyes, crying for one second then stopping... any advice on how to protect myself? She knows where I live and where I work.

Anyway its sad. Nice girl, with a good career, now she wants to fk it all up over a 2 week old pin prick.

Edited November 27, 2013 by razorramone

[HardenedSoul]

Well in that case, bro, it's time to man up and handle yo' bidness, not panic like some teenager who's been caught raiding Daddy's drinks cabinet.

The girl's understandably terrified and your puerile, knee jerk reaction when she mentioned meeting her parents most definitely didn't help, hence her crying.

Go meet the folks and show some freakin' respect.

This is Thailand, not a backwater council estate in Hull, <deleted>.

Things work differently here . . .

or didn't you know?

Edited November 27, 2013 by HardenedSoul

[wooloomooloo]

Grow up, razor. You might qualify beyond an imbecile, if you're lucky.

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[ProblemSolver3]

Ramone,

I havent read the thread that was shut down for some time. But i assume you got teased along the lines of:

. Now u know why (if u can understnd thai) Thai men will tell u "never let a girl know where u really live or work...ever."

. And the "sad story" of it is that, yeah, her life is all upside down bcoz she took the risk of unprotected (more fun/intimate but more risks) sex.

So especially with young (not finished with education goals) girls, you learned two lessons the hard way. (lol as did I have my own 'misfire' here as well with an export manager)

4 yrs ago When my exwife was pregnant here, it was 20,000 Baht for the "McValue Preganacy Pack" (fāhk.tong or fāhk.khan) at Lad Plao hospital in BKK (good reputation with a mod-market pricetag). McValue means there r services bundled at a discount from were u to buy each service seperately over 9months.

There were two ultrasounds one at mid and one late term.

All scheduled doctors consults, labs & vitamins, etc

The cost of a standard delivery is also included.

I u want i can find the female MD we used there. As i am a PhD biochemist, she is 1 of only 3 Thai MDs that i have ever been impressed with (other two work at Mayo).

In closing, u r making the right decision now. And u r technically correct that she was the one who had last-say on the "condom or no condom" decision.

But if u really felt pity for the panicked young woman, then next time, put on the rubber even if she is too horny/shy/inexperienced or culturally-conditioned to not insist on one (professional girls r never shy to insist...then insult...then assault if u dont yield to their condom 'request' bcuz they arent naive. They know the risks (both babies n diseases).

So respect the fact that such girls are "good girls"=prob. naïve since shes a virgin & not a "working girl", by thinking ahead to this eventuality when u its time 4 u to decide "should i put on the "jimmy-hat" or not???"

- M

PS

Child support upcountry is 5-10k these days depending on family's socio/economic ranking. Probably 8-15k in BKK, Phuket per month.

What will u be doing on The plains of Africa when u go back?

Take care R.

[wooloomooloo]

ProblemSolver, you're just as dim as the OP.

This is serious business, mate. Grow up.

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[razorramone]

Thanks for the tips. I'll be switching jobs and doing some conservation work, getting back with nature after 18 months surrounded by concrete in BKK. It will be nice.

I can pay all that pregnancy package. But long term... no. I could pay for her to fly somewhere and get rid of it. If she refuses, that's her choice, her personal responsibility for not accepting my offer. I'm not going to pay her long term support just because she believes in spirits and ghosts.

I did the maths, we hooked up 17 days ago. Is this long enough for tests to be accurate? I am a little suspicious now... especially how she is pushing for me to meet her parents and has started mentioning money.

Edited November 27, 2013 by razorramone

[wooloomooloo]

You want to be concentrating on some conservation work closer to home you idiot.

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[David48]

She asked me to help pay hospital bills, which i'll do. Just wondering how much all that will cost over the next 8 months?

A question better asked in another Forum here.

[David48]

Thanks for the tips.

Hey OP ... are you in Thailand at the Moment?

Just thought that you must be because you talked with your lady last night ... ???

If so, this must be weighing heavily on your mind and you can't sleep.

It's 2.40 am there ...

Man ... get some rest ...

[falkan]

she just won the jackpot on the lottery!

you better change name and delete all social media networks you have and leave the country!

[bellboy]

The fact is you you will soon. Be a father. Wether you like it or not.!

Walking a way.and letting it live a life off poverty. Because it does not suit. Your life style. "sounds selfish to me "

At the end of the day. You had sex with out protection. Man up and except your responsable for a baby.

And stop crying like a child. Because things are not. Going the way you want

Edited November 27, 2013 by bellboy

[wellred]

Do yourself a favour man. Just go and don't look back. I'll get slated for this but whatever.

[DarloKnight]

15 days pregnant and been together 17 days ?? I thought you dated pregnancy from your last period? Been a long time since I was pregnant so forgive me if I'm wrong !

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[NeverSure]

OP, what the hell is wrong with you? You had unprotected sex with a virgin and now you are a father. The baby will be your child.

If you can run away and leave that child to poverty - your own child - you aren't much of a man.

It's bad enough that you won't stick around and raise it and teach it as a father should, but if you can sleep at night knowing your own child is in poverty because you don't send it a lousy $US300 (10,000 baht) per month until it's grown you are are lower than a skunk.

Grow up.

[shaggy1969]

Had your fun,took her virginity,made her pregnant and now your planning on doing a runner.

My advice would be to the young lady and try and get a discreet abortion....being a single young mother in Thailand

is probably one of the worst things that could happen to her.Or man up and do what is right.

[NeverSure]

15 days pregnant and been together 17 days ?? I thought you dated pregnancy from your last period? Been a long time since I was pregnant so forgive me if I'm wrong !

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I'm no expert, but 15 days is probably long enough for a urine test.

[Jasun]

She asked me to help pay hospital bills, which i'll do. Just wondering how much all that will cost over the next 8 months?

Anything from around 5K in govt to over 100K in a flash western hospital. If you're going to be involved but you don't want to break the bank, budget for around 20-30k through a moderately priced private hospital in Bangkok.

[wellred]

People can talk about being a man this and that. But if 2 people are not ready to bring a kid into this world, then actually going through with that can be just as bad to the kid as they will not have a proper upbringing. Your 2 options are either convince her to have a something or tell her she's on her own.

[farang000999]

The total cost of all doctor trips and c-section pregnancy was probably in the range of 100k at a mid range private Bangkok hospital with 2 days hospitalization in private room for us this was without any complications. Those ultrasound printouts can get VERY expensive and your lady will probably want some of those even though they won't mean anything the moment the baby was born.

OP, let's hope you grow up and stop acting like a child yourself. You have responsibilities now.

[farang000999]

People can talk about being a man this and that. But if 2 people are not ready to bring a kid into this world, then actually going through with that can be just as bad to the kid as they will not have a proper upbringing. Your 2 options are either convince her to have a something or tell her she's on her own.

Its amazing the shit people tell themselves. Once you have sex, it is your responsibility to take care of the child if the woman becomes pregnant. If you don't like that fact then maybe you should abstain from vaginal intercourse.

[DarloKnight]

15 days pregnant and been together 17 days ?? I thought you dated pregnancy from your last period? Been a long time since I was pregnant so forgive me if I'm wrong !

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I'm no expert, but 15 days is probably long enough for a urine test.

 

It was the 15 days pregnant I don't understand how it can tell u that?

Anyway he won't be the first or the last. I was left a single mum and it was the best thing that happened or I would not have met my now hubby!! I know I am probably one if the lucky ones.

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[Jasun]

If you're going along with it, pay for things in stages. I wouldn't hand over 20K and watch her disappear. Also keep in mind if she foes through with it and has the kid, you might have a change of heart and want to be involved in your child's life.

[NeverSure]

Where are you guys coming from? She's Buddhist. She'll have the baby and then be in a world of hurts. So will the child.

His only two moral options, taking responsibility for what he did, is to stick around and raise the child or send support money after he pays for the birth.

He has a child and if he can run away and forget that, he's sub-human.

[wellred]

People can talk about being a man this and that. But if 2 people are not ready to bring a kid into this world, then actually going through with that can be just as bad to the kid as they will not have a proper upbringing. Your 2 options are either convince her to have a something or tell her she's on her own.

Its amazing the shit people tell themselves. Once you have sex, it is your responsibility to take care of the child if the woman becomes pregnant. If you don't like that fact then maybe you should abstain from vaginal intercourse.

Mistakes happen and that's why man invented the morning after pill or abortions. If the OP is not happy having the child then the mother should not just go and have it anyway. It should be a joint decision. Yes it takes 2 to tango but it also takes 2 to raise a child.

[Thai at Heart]

I would get moving quick before her old man finds out,,because if you were messing with my daughters life like this.....

[ProblemSolver3]

Dear Ramone,

Now i see this topic has some heated-ness following it from last thread.

Errand first:

You are starting to come off as cad in your last post. As:

The girl is talking money bcuz babies need to eat and while she knows that cant force u to marry her just b'cuz she chose *not* to insist in a condom, she also knows that she didnt get impregnated alone.

So please dont play the "Oh shit!! she is one of those Thai gold-diggers i was warned about" card if you would like *neutral*/balanced advice from one who speaks from experience (8yrs living among thais, not in sukhumvit/phuket) and who made the choice to "do the right thing" in thailand (which despite Ramone's potential character flaws, you are dead right to be concerned about meeting the parents. Both for any potential violent reactions (some girls' dads are racist, the world over) and because:

. While It may be look worse on the surface to refuse a mtg, if u would meet them it sends the wrong message: false hope to the family. A groom only meets the bride's family as a step in the courtship/eventual marriage. So of i were the family i would prefer a cad being str8, than a gentleman leading me on.

But i can tell u that child-support laws ARE on the books here & all she must do us file (not yet prove) a police complaint that u r a father shirking child support and it will likely affect the outcome of your Visa request if someday i want another holiday in The Kingdom.

About the tests:

as a PhD Biochemist, I can tell u all about pregnant tests.

They test for HGH-antibodies, meaning the presence of "hunan gonadotropin" hormone which begins to be released from the egg, into the bloodstream upon implanting into the uterine wall and builds to detectable serum concentrations within the first 7-12 days of preg. (Google 'preg test kit human gonadotropin to find exact minimum time to test effectiveness)

But all antibody (from preg to hiv) can give false positives but "never" give false negatives.

So, "she is only 2wks pregnant" is inaccurate. U have only for 2 wks but there is NO accurate way to determine length of time since egg-fertilization. If there was an accurate test, MDs would be able to schedule most deliveries much more accurately)

With that finished, Regarding comments on my initial post:

As my ID suggests, i am here to help people find workable solutions to problems in an unfair/imperfect world. so I dont generally follow up to posts made by other than the topic's initiator.

But i will state my experiences that led me to say that u r making the best long term decision for everyone, even the baby (by not marrying her, child support is another issue.)

1. Dad doesnt want kids

2. Dad doesnt want a wife

(ok so then to be sure he doesnt get one on accident, he must use a condom. but that didnt happen...imperfect world rears its head, so now what to do?)

My father admitted that he didnt love mum when they married. It was taking the good catch off the market, as was popular culture when he was 25. Stupid or not, whatever. But mom not being an idiot, likely put that disappointing fact together all on her own shortly after the honeymoon. Hence the start of a 50 yr-long war of nerves.

So the practical result of "staying together 4 the kids" included a constant background of tension, screaming matches and drinking to escape the reality of a bad marriage.

...kids are damaged rather than helped by "mommy n daddy MUST live together" (an opinion that too often stems from worrying about neighbors calling daughter a slut rather than long term psycho-social impacts on daughter and kid/s.

During my formative yrs, I often suggested they throw in the towel for the sake of a peaceful home even if required making 2 separate homes ..peace for all 4 of us not just my own.

But u cant fight City Hall (culture), so they are still together, forcing smiles while bitterly grinding their teeth, after 50yrs. I know it is "the right thing to do" but my experience says different.

Lastly, i will put my hat in the ring this much:

i dont support "abortion is only option" that u will accept bcuz I saw no mention of broken condoms nor ineffective 'morning after pill'

-u didnt think ahead and do what u could have done to prevent it-

so it is unfair* to dump more than 1/2 the financial responsibility onto her/family. When birth controls fail, i cant blame folks for abortion even if i dont support it. (But there is that unfortunate fact of "unfair world"/free-will coming up again... :-/ )

Child support is so very low here, do u feel ok about tacitly pressuring her into an abortion with economics (since 2 ppl required to make baby, neither one can usurp authority for what do to about it. She cant *force* u to pay nor stay. likewise u cant force her hand either. U can try to coerce her ('talk her into it') into an abortion by using the unfair economic situation currently extant in our imperfect world, by saying u wont pay for any support, but would that be cool with u if u were on the receiving end of it?

let me offer this from a 40 year old's perspective who has learned *a lot* about life in the last 10yrs:

Life's hardships over the long-haul have a Way of softening the "dead certainties" and other stubbornnesses/recklessness of youth.

Trust me, In 5-10 yrs u might look back on all this with bad feelings about your decisions. It can be wrenching to face oneself in the mirror when such shifts in personal-philosophy occur.

Additionally, it is often better to compromise a little to preserve a workable (not necessarily 'great') relationships with people. Such a person is always welcome back (dont underestimate Biological urge to successfully reproduce...15 yrs ago, i was dead-sure i would never have kids even if i was to marry. So, in 8 yrs u might *want* to see the fruit of your loins) But burning bridges will eliminate that future option. It will makes 'friends' into enemies ... and life has enough burdens without adding the need to 'look over one's shoulder' too?

(To be clear: "Over shoulder" is metaphorical. i dont imply she has an avenue to pursue damages or potential revenge outside of thailand)

In the end, my advice is:

You're doubtlessly operating atleast partly in "fight or flight" mode = stressed about this mess.

So plz consider the words of a calm voice of reason. After all i have nothing invested in this. I just hate seeing situations compounded by 'panic and/or (culturally) ill-informed decisions.

Switch off thai.visa and

take a big step back from all that's going on within this situation and picture your reaction to it as if your own sister was the preg. girl in the scenario. Then let your own personal conscience guide you through the decisions you'll have to make before all this is settled.

Because i dont generally follow threads, I request that u PM if you have follow up questions, esp regarding longer-term legal/Immigration impacts of current decisions.

Best wishes to all,

M

Thanks for the tips. I'll be switching jobs and doing some conservation work, getting back with nature after 18 months surrounded by concrete in BKK. It will be nice.

I can pay all that pregnancy package. But long term... no. I could pay for her to fly somewhere and get rid of it. If she refuses, that's her choice, her personal responsibility for not accepting my offer. I'm not going to pay her long term support just because she believes in spirits and ghosts.

I did the maths, we hooked up 17 days ago.

(Not being a lady, i am curious: Do adult virgins typically decide to finally lose their virginity with a 'hookup'?)

Is this long enough for tests to be accurate? I am a little suspicious now... especially how she is pushing for me to meet her parents and has started mentioning money.

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[Forethat]

15 days pregnant and been together 17 days ?? I thought you dated pregnancy from your last period? Been a long time since I was pregnant so forgive me if I'm wrong !

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I'm no expert, but 15 days is probably long enough for a urine test.

Most over-the-counter HPT are not able to pick up the small levels of hormone until after 10-14 days of pregnancy, but there are examples of HPTs that detect pregnancy sooner than that. First Response can detect much sooner than 10 days, probably earlier than 5 days.

[Johnjc]

You could go for a prenatal DNA test - which would cost between 25 - 50,000 Baht plus certain charges or once the child is born go for a DNA test to make sure you are not paying for a cuckoo.

[ProblemSolver3]

Hate to be the fly in the ointment cuz i know no one, male/female alike, likes them But rubbers do eliminate the need to trust that she is faithfully taking her pills.

. And unlike abortions or 'oops pills', condoms prevent oozing pus, scary warts & scabby sores (herpes/syph) on your 'happy parts'.

;-) food for thought

People can talk about being a man this and that. But if 2 people are not ready to bring a kid into this world, then actually going through with that can be just as bad to the kid as they will not have a proper upbringing. Your 2 options are either convince her to have a something or tell her she's on her own.

Its amazing the shit people tell themselves. Once you have sex, it is your responsibility to take care of the child if the woman becomes pregnant. If you don't like that fact then maybe you should abstain from vaginal intercourse.

Mistakes happen and that's why man invented the morning after pill or abortions. If the OP is not happy having the child then the mother should not just go and have it anyway. It should be a joint decision. Yes it takes 2 to tango but it also takes 2 to raise a child.

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[Forethat]

And unlike abortions or 'oops pills', condoms prevent oozing pus, scary warts & scabby sores (herpes/syph) on your 'happy parts'.

That description alone should help raising condom sales....eeeiiiihhhh <deleted>!!!