Children

[naboo]

Wife's stepfather? Or husband?

[kalasin1969]

UNICEF has written up the child protection act which was signed by the King of Thailand 2003. It is the law in Thailand

that no marriages are allowed under 15. Only over 15 and with the consent of the parents a girl/boy can get married-

All Thai citizens regardless of gender are considered a child up to the age of 18.

I had the same case just recently in our village (boy 16 girl 13 ) and I called CHILDLINE Hotlinenbr 1387 (during the day they have English speaking personell) see

http://childlinethailand.org/home.html

You can read a lot of information there about it.

The response of this organisation is impressive. The same day they filed an official request for an investigation home visit to the Social Welfare Department. A few days later a report came back acknowledging the underage marriage attempt and

they opend a case ... result: no marriage

[recycler]

UNICEF has written up the child protection act which was signed by the King of Thailand 2003. It is the law in Thailand

that no marriages are allowed under 15. Only over 15 and with the consent of the parents a girl/boy can get married-

All Thai citizens regardless of gender are considered a child up to the age of 18.

I had the same case just recently in our village (boy 16 girl 13 ) and I called CHILDLINE Hotlinenbr 1387 (during the day they have English speaking personell) see

http://childlinethailand.org/home.html

You can read a lot of information there about it.

The response of this organisation is impressive. The same day they filed an official request for an investigation home visit to the Social Welfare Department. A few days later a report came back acknowledging the underage marriage attempt and

they opend a case ... result: no marriage

Interesting, never heard about this Childline, they should promote themselves more.

Most of these weddings are not prevented and result in Thailand's very high score of teenage mums and kids growing up in flocks around parents homes and the mothers working (often still under age) in bars and karaokes.

If a marriage like this and any other is taken place the first question is... "teng taurai" for how much did they marry! Culture and Baht are very closely related in Thailand.

[Mario2008]

UNICEF has written up the child protection act which was signed by the King of Thailand 2003. It is the law in Thailand

that no marriages are allowed under 15. Only over 15 and with the consent of the parents a girl/boy can get married-

All Thai citizens regardless of gender are considered a child up to the age of 18.

I had the same case just recently in our village (boy 16 girl 13 ) and I called CHILDLINE Hotlinenbr 1387 (during the day they have English speaking personell) see

http://childlinethailand.org/home.html

You can read a lot of information there about it.

The response of this organisation is impressive. The same day they filed an official request for an investigation home visit to the Social Welfare Department. A few days later a report came back acknowledging the underage marriage attempt and

they opend a case ... result: no marriage

Interesiting organisation to elarn about and good of you to act.

On a side note: in Thailand persons under the age of 20 are considered minors (unless married). It is the NGO itself that uses the age of 18 as criteria, as many western countries now use that criteria.

[ingvar]

This is the first time ever that I hear about arranged marriage in Thailand (been here for 20 years). Guess it must be something they do in Isan small villages? Never been there but I live in the central countryside in Thailand and as far as I know around here it is not how they do it.

I would send the son away to a boarding school or university in BKK or Chiengmai so he can see the real world around him and then it will probably change by itself somehow?

I'm guessing you don't speak enough Thai to understand their conversations.

And nobody bothers to talk to you about much in English.

Loads of guys living like that.

Or you don't appear to have enough money to get any offers.

As I read this forum at work I was surprised and asked around among my Thai co-workers sitting around me in the office of varying ages both older and younger than me and they all concurred, arranged marriages is not part of Thai tradition or culture. Period. Illegal!

apart from that I do not see how the above quoted in depth analysis of my complete life situation in Thailand has anything to do with the topic?

[cup-O-coffee]

donnyhaus, I am going to be frank with you and tell you exactly how I think about this situation. Yes! It is indeed a situation. For you. Not them. For them, it is a dream come true, with the only nuisances being that they must put up with your presence in order to cash in.

Please forgive my frankness. Here it goes...:

You are no longer working. You are probably living off the proceeds of everything you worked for during your entire life, and now here is what you are doing with your life savings and any income you are being afforded...

You are now paying exorbitant rent, plus all maintenance fees, to live in a house that is owned and occupied by your Thai landlord and her step father and her 3 son's, and the Thai landlord's soon to be daughter-in-law and her soon-to-be two or three children.

You happen to have consensual sexual relations with your Thai landlord. Beyond that... what???

You, as a stranger... a renter... paid for the full construction of this house (and the property?) and handed the title and deed over to the Thai landlord, and now - as expected - your Thai landlord owns and runs it the way she wants to run it, without consideration towards your consent or involvement.

You, as a stranger... a renter... paid for all the furnishings that are in the house that your Thai landlord owns.

You, as a stranger... a renter... pay all the bills to run this house that your Thai landlord owns.

-------------------------------------------------------

You make the following clear to me:

The Thai landlord, who own everything you paid for, and are paying for, along with her step father and her 3 son's and future step daughter and all her friends simply do not give a dam_n that you have a problem

The Thai landlord, who own everything you paid for, and are paying for, along with her step father and her 3 son's and future step daughter and all her friends simply do not give a dam_n about your moral judgment

The Thai landlord, who own everything you paid for, and are paying for, along with her step father and her 3 son's and future step daughter and all her friends simply do not give a dam_n about including you in their traditions

The Thai landlord, who own everything you paid for, and are paying for, along with her step father and her 3 son's and future step daughter and all her friends simply do not give a dam_n about informing you of their decisions

The Thai landlord, who own everything you paid for, and are paying for, along with her step father and her 3 son's and future step daughter and all her friends simply do not give a dam_n about your moral judgment

The girl, who has been promised to another person's son, comes and goes from her house (not yours) whenever she wants to, because you are simply a renter in her soon-to-be house, where she will shortly be raising her two or three children.

The girl, who has been promised to another person's son, brings friends to her house (not yours) whenever she wants to, because you are simply a renter in her soon-to-be house, where she will shortly be raising her two or three children.

The girl, who has been promised to another person's son, goes into any room in her house (not yours) she wishes at will, because you are simply a renter in her soon-to-be house, where she will shortly be raising her two or three children.

The girl who has been promised to another person's son, ignores you, because you are simply a renter in her soon-to-be house, where she will shortly be raising her two or three children.
--------------------------------------

Somewhere... somehow... in the deep dark recesses of the back of your mind, you begin to realize the lunacy of what you are doing, and how utter gullible you are, and how low your self-esteem and self-image is...

...and here is how you react:

You feel the responsibility, as a stranger... a renter... to continue in this lunacy

You, as a stranger... a renter... feel guilty to talk with the landlord (whom you stubbornly insist on labeling as your Western idealistic wife) about something you are not involved in and you have no control over

You, as a stranger... a renter... have decided that you will "help" with the wedding, not fully realizing that you will pay for it all if you want to maintain your status of acceptance and approval on their terms.

You, as a stranger... a renter... express guilt in growing some balls and leaving, yet rather instead choose to keep banging your head against a dead end brick wall and questioning whether you should, as a stranger... a renter... lay down some ground rules when it comes to... how did you put it... "our" house.

DUMB! You do not have anything to do with that house without the express decision of your Thai landlord and her step father and her 3 son's, and the future step-daughter of your Thai landlord; ...all of whom have more right to THEIR house than you do, as a stranger... a renter... a fool.

Then you ask if this is common practice in Thailand!!!!

I am beggared!

[maake55555]

Sounds normal to me, my girl friend of 8 years has her family visit and they wonder in and out and they never look at me, just sort of bow when walking in front of me. As far as the wedding goes my girl friends sisters daughter has a 14 year old who is promised to a 15 year old and they live together in the mothers house. They had a little ceremony with both families and my girl friend who is the family matriarch was there for family support. All went well and every thing is going along very smoothly. Her and his friends wonder in and out of the house and no one pays them any mind. Trying to change things on moral or any other grounds will not go over well for you, but you have to do what you have to do even if it doesn't work out. It is how things are.

In my girl friends village a farang caused a real problem when he went against the village culture and now they all want him out of their area. He has a new house that he just built, so is pretty much stuck. Don't know how he gets out of this problem, only his wife is sticking by him, her mother and father is not nor is any other members of the family. Bad situation to be in.

Edited January 22, 2014 by maake55555

[recycler]

Sounds normal to me, my girl friend of 8 years has her family visit and they wonder in and out and they never look at me, just sort of bow when walking in front of me. As far as the wedding goes my girl friends sisters daughter has a 14 year old who is promised to a 15 year old and they live together in the mothers house. They had a little ceremony with both families and my girl friend who is the family matriarch was there for family support. All went well and every thing is going along very smoothly. Her and his friends wonder in and out of the house and no one pays them any mind. Trying to change things on moral or any other grounds will not go over well for you, but you have to do what you have to do even if it doesn't work out. It is how things are.

In my girl friends village a farang caused a real problem when he went against the village culture and now they all want him out of their area. He has a new house that he just built, so is pretty much stuck. Don't know how he gets out of this problem, only his wife is sticking by him, her mother and father is not nor is any other members of the family. Bad situation to be in.

So you are another doormat accepting all things around you and people treating you like you don't exist.

My wife is certainly not from a hiso background, but all her family greets me, talks to me and share food and drinks with me. No matter if it's our house, the family's home upcountry or their rented rooms. Also almost all Thais that I meet greet me and talk with me. So this is not normal and simply rude.

I personally don't think it's good idea to go and live in your wife's village, but do know people who are happy doing so. I would become bored the hell out of me up there, a few days is more than enough!

Yes they call selling your daughters culture but no matter how you call it it's bad and it puts woman in a bad position. How can you accept kids to be "promised to each other" at an age where they have no idea about the consequences?

Don't tell that you also pay for the show...

[cup-O-coffee]

Sounds normal to me, my girl friend of 8 years has her family visit and they wonder in and out and they never look at me, just sort of bow when walking in front of me. As far as the wedding goes my girl friends sisters daughter has a 14 year old who is promised to a 15 year old and they live together in the mothers house. They had a little ceremony with both families and my girl friend who is the family matriarch was there for family support. All went well and every thing is going along very smoothly. Her and his friends wonder in and out of the house and no one pays them any mind. Trying to change things on moral or any other grounds will not go over well for you, but you have to do what you have to do even if it doesn't work out. It is how things are.

In my girl friends village a farang caused a real problem when he went against the village culture and now they all want him out of their area. He has a new house that he just built, so is pretty much stuck. Don't know how he gets out of this problem, only his wife is sticking by him, her mother and father is not nor is any other members of the family. Bad situation to be in.

I would argue with your choice of calling this "normal". "Acceptable to you"... perhaps?

All went well... everything is smooth... the women-folk are all for it and assisting... lots of support... little quaint ceremonies... event the matriarch blessed everyone with her "auspicious" presence and approval ("Oh my!")... everyone shacks up with everyone... dogs and cats are sleeping together now... and on and on ad-nauseum.

About the only thing you said which makes any sense out of this abnormal behavior is "Trying to change things on moral or any other grounds will not go over well for you...". Yeah! I get that part. Take putting a feral soi dog out of its flea-bitten, rabies infected misery, for example. I suspect I'd have problems about that one as well... here in this last bastion of all-knowing and all-accepting land.

The reason I protest about this is that everything these people are doing is corrosive to the development of a healthy human being. Self-actualization, well-being, responsibility, self-discipline, self-restraint, constitution, self-will, etc. etc. are all out the window.

These kids are being brain-washed and groomed to be nothing more than the mirror images of the adults who surround them and indoctrinate them with this dead-end excuse of culture.

No way the girl or boy will grow up to have their own identity if the adults oversee every single little aspect of their lives. The only other thing I see is that they will indeed develop their own identity, but at the cost of being civilized, and rather instead feral, simply because they will wake up one day and reject everything that has been forced upon them. Yes... forced!

There are too many things which are wrong on so many levels about this mentality to go into. It has nothing to do with morals, ethics, religion, politics. It has everything to do with a scientifically proven, healthy human development, and the suggestions which have come out of that proven research which point towards a healthy and well-developed human being (who has a snowball's chance in Hell to self-actualize). Anything less is simply to have one exist throughout one's life for no other purpose than to serve and suit the purpose of someone else who is controlling and manipulative.

These kids don't stand a chance. They are nothing more than tools to perpetuate the existence of the village and to bring about a sense of self-importance to a bunch of degenerates.

Not trying to argue, mate. Just my take on things.

Respect...

[amykat]

Dear Donnyhaus/OP,

I hope you aren't totally offended and shocked by what posters have said to you here! I read a lot of web forums about various subjects and TV is seriously the roughest one I have yet to find! And by leaps and bounds. However, it is good training for living here and a good relief too.

I just want to say that I think many posters above are correct, even Cup-O-coffee's first post (or first post on this page) could be totally correct. Hopefully, your family just has a total lack of civilized manners, and not much more, more sinister than that. However, that is probably unlikely.

I do think though, that being so new here, you cannot possibly imagine and take on all this negative information. We all had to learn, and we hope to save others from some suffering we have been through, and it comes off badly, probably! A normal, nice, Western person, just cannot imagine, in their wildest dreams, what CAN be real life here for some people. I personally, could NEVER imagine the situation, of Thai men living with their "wife" or whatever, while also living with the "wife's" foreign husband and pretending to be the brother, gardener, son, or whatever! When I started to learn about that, I was shocked that more (or any?) farangs didn't just go crazy and commit mass murder! And frankly I could not imagine that there were men in the world who would do that, and not want to kill themselves too! But I guess I have "high" standards??

Anyway, you will probably have to go through the whole deal here, negotiating over and over, thinking that you just aren't communicating properly, you just need a translator, then a BETTER translator ...I had to go through this for years, just over my hair cuts!! Then you gradually start to realize ....this and that, and this and that, and get angry, and more angry, and hate it here, etc.

What I wish for you, is the most easy transition into this new life, figuring out what is really going on, staying on TV and learning from it, and learn to laugh a lot about it, and not feel too offended ... and I hope you have enough money to get a new house, and leave this one, if you need to. Don't stay a slave to this house, and that investment. Start saving or making changes now that will give you a better choice, in case you need it and/or WANT it.

[kalasin1969]

UNICEF has written up the child protection act which was signed by the King of Thailand 2003. It is the law in Thailand

that no marriages are allowed under 15. Only over 15 and with the consent of the parents a girl/boy can get married-

All Thai citizens regardless of gender are considered a child up to the age of 18.

I had the same case just recently in our village (boy 16 girl 13 ) and I called CHILDLINE Hotlinenbr 1387 (during the day they have English speaking personell) see

http://childlinethailand.org/home.html

You can read a lot of information there about it.

The response of this organisation is impressive. The same day they filed an official request for an investigation home visit to the Social Welfare Department. A few days later a report came back acknowledging the underage marriage attempt and

they opend a case ... result: no marriage

Interesiting organisation to elarn about and good of you to act.

On a side note: in Thailand persons under the age of 20 are considered minors (unless married). It is the NGO itself that uses the age of 18 as criteria, as many western countries now use that criteria.

Thank's for your comment. Concerning age limits ... maybe a correction is necessary at Wiki:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ages_of_consent_in_Asia#Thailand

But I have the impression I misunderstood the purpose of this discussion thread:

'Somebody has a strong moral concern that the underage son is suppose to marry an underage girl.'

The Ministry of Social Development and Human Security is strongly committed to forbid underage marriages.

But they need the cases brought up to them and Childline helps to do that.

[eezergood]

any update from the OP?

[Mario2008]

UNICEF has written up the child protection act which was signed by the King of Thailand 2003. It is the law in Thailand

that no marriages are allowed under 15. Only over 15 and with the consent of the parents a girl/boy can get married-

All Thai citizens regardless of gender are considered a child up to the age of 18.

I had the same case just recently in our village (boy 16 girl 13 ) and I called CHILDLINE Hotlinenbr 1387 (during the day they have English speaking personell) see

http://childlinethailand.org/home.html

You can read a lot of information there about it.

The response of this organisation is impressive. The same day they filed an official request for an investigation home visit to the Social Welfare Department. A few days later a report came back acknowledging the underage marriage attempt and

they opend a case ... result: no marriage

Interesiting organisation to elarn about and good of you to act.

On a side note: in Thailand persons under the age of 20 are considered minors (unless married). It is the NGO itself that uses the age of 18 as criteria, as many western countries now use that criteria.

Thank's for your comment. Concerning age limits ... maybe a correction is necessary at Wiki:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ages_of_consent_in_Asia#Thailand

But I have the impression I misunderstood the purpose of this discussion thread:

'Somebody has a strong moral concern that the underage son is suppose to marry an underage girl.'

The Ministry of Social Development and Human Security is strongly committed to forbid underage marriages.

But they need the cases brought up to them and Childline helps to do that.

Regarding the age limit, you quote an article about the age of sexual consent I was talking about the age one becomes an adult. That is not the same.

Yes, underage marriages are discouraged, but are very common. Of course it is a traditional marriage and not a legal marriage. But the effects are the same and schools will send a girl that is either married or pregnant away from school.

My wife as a teacher sometimes get invited to such "marriages" and then tells them to keep quiet about it, or they will be expelled. Now we have a girl in class 6 that is clearly pregnant. With the cold weather everybody pretends to see nothing, so she can finish school next month.

That is the trap, if you do something officially they will be expelled.

I once told the director of a school about a student just having an abortion, because I wanted to be sure the student got some help. The director promptly send her away from school, as the girl was a bad example. (He did organize a different school for her, in another district).