Another one bites the dust...

[wym]

Another great (and super useful) post thanks!

No worries, hope it helps.

Move quickly while she's (mostly likely) on the back foot ATM, part of your offer now is to not pursue the embezzlement rap, later on she'll know you're just bluffing.

[DGIE]

People here are talking as if it's the money that's important.

Or FEELINGS fucrissakes!

No - it's the KIDS. OP, please do make a plan and start to execute ASAP to get 100% full custody of the kids, and if you think it necessary a back-home TPR as I outlined earlier.

Kids seem to do pretty well on their own in Thailand.

Many people claim to care about "kids", very few go out of their way for them (me included).

you are honest

[DGIE]

Offering my wife a pay-off for custody is something I am thinking about, but she hasn't asked me for a divorce yet and I am not in a position to offer her much anyway so that might need to wait, especially as it could compromise another option, which is just to take them back to the UK.

I am now considering the logic of such a move - I need to think about the strategy/logistics/legalities of how I would get them out of Thailand and (more importantly) how I would properly take care of them (and continue to oversee the restructuring of the business) from back home.

You will not be allowed to leave for the UK with your kids without her permission, which of course you will have to pay for one way or the other.

If you do find a way to do so, it is very likely the UK authorities would consider it a case of parental kidnapping which would VERY much count against you in any custody proceedings in a western jurisdiction.

No such thing as parental kidnapping here within Asia BTW, which of course cuts both ways.

You need to do the simple Amphur/Khaet style divorce as I outlined earlier, that is technically enough if it states even handwritten by the registrar there that she agrees the kids are in your care, but for belt-and-suspenders get her to sign an explicit permission to take them out of the country before you head for the airport.

Many TG in this position will accept what you would think is a relatively small sum for this, as most mothers want what's best for the kids and she's most likely not interested in taking responsibility for them anyway.

You might also offer her an additional payout over time, even if she doesn't trust your word you can make an official contract enforceable with penalties etc.

Don't set foot in a western jurisdiction until you have this resolved, since her "natural rights as the birth mother" will give her enormous power to make your life miserable, to the point where you have to get permission from a court to move to a different location.

Realise if she's motivated she can get another sponsor to bring her over and pay for lawyers.

I speak from experience here.

I wonder if UK authorities will file a case against you in having/taking your children with you, without any complaint they received from the mother.

Will they question you why you have your children without a mother?

[farang000999]

So your wife stole 20m baht from the company and your business is so profitable that you intend to pay back all of these loans? Isn't your wife going to go to prison? All the other managing members are fine paying back the loans your wife took out and letting her get away with all the money without any consequence and now instead of starting a new corporation they want to pay back all of the debts she took out and stole?

[Showbags]

Offering my wife a pay-off for custody is something I am thinking about, but she hasn't asked me for a divorce yet and I am not in a position to offer her much anyway so that might need to wait, especially as it could compromise another option, which is just to take them back to the UK.

I am now considering the logic of such a move - I need to think about the strategy/logistics/legalities of how I would get them out of Thailand and (more importantly) how I would properly take care of them (and continue to oversee the restructuring of the business) from back home.

You will not be allowed to leave for the UK with your kids without her permission, which of course you will have to pay for one way or the other.

If you do find a way to do so, it is very likely the UK authorities would consider it a case of parental kidnapping which would VERY much count against you in any custody proceedings in a western jurisdiction.

No such thing as parental kidnapping here within Asia BTW, which of course cuts both ways.

You need to do the simple Amphur/Khaet style divorce as I outlined earlier, that is technically enough if it states even handwritten by the registrar there that she agrees the kids are in your care, but for belt-and-suspenders get her to sign an explicit permission to take them out of the country before you head for the airport.

Many TG in this position will accept what you would think is a relatively small sum for this, as most mothers want what's best for the kids and she's most likely not interested in taking responsibility for them anyway.

You might also offer her an additional payout over time, even if she doesn't trust your word you can make an official contract enforceable with penalties etc.

Don't set foot in a western jurisdiction until you have this resolved, since her "natural rights as the birth mother" will give her enormous power to make your life miserable, to the point where you have to get permission from a court to move to a different location.

Realise if she's motivated she can get another sponsor to bring her over and pay for lawyers.

I speak from experience here.

Which post did you write that other stuff in...cannot find it now.....maybe to early

[wym]

Which post did you write that other stuff in...cannot find it now.....maybe to early

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/699596-another-one-bites-the-dust/?p=7350132

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/699596-another-one-bites-the-dust/?p=7350224

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/699596-another-one-bites-the-dust/?p=7355338

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/699596-another-one-bites-the-dust/?p=7359952

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/699596-another-one-bites-the-dust/?p=7360970

[wym]

Some UK resources to start with

http://www.cafcass.gov.uk/

http://www.reunite.org/

http://www.dawsoncornwell.com/en/about_amh.html

[Showbags]

Which post did you write that other stuff in...cannot find it now.....maybe to early

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/699596-another-one-bites-the-dust/?p=7350132

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/699596-another-one-bites-the-dust/?p=7350224

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/699596-another-one-bites-the-dust/?p=7355338

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/699596-another-one-bites-the-dust/?p=7359952

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/699596-another-one-bites-the-dust/?p=7360970

Ta.

Concise, short, to the point reply....no fluffly stuff.

Twas the first link I wanted...thanks

[harryfrompattaya]

Could anyone tell me what the business did except look for investors

It seems to me that was the business

[farang000999]

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/692255-looking-for-spa-owner-wannabe-spa-owner-partners/#entry7212757

[billSMITH]

Don't marry the first Thai bird you meet in a bar.

Sent from my GT-I9152 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Dirty little secret. Guys not meeting girls anywhere other than the bar. exceptions noted!

[billSMITH]

People here are talking as if it's the money that's important.

Or FEELINGS fucrissakes!

No - it's the KIDS. OP, please do make a plan and start to execute ASAP to get 100% full custody of the kids, and if you think it necessary a back-home TPR as I outlined earlier.

Yes you may need to go further into hock.

If you can build a case for prosecuting her for embezzlement - I'm not advising actually getting her jailed, just use it as a bargaining chip to get her to sign.

The other posters are right in that it is very likely she will be able to get custody, and even if she doesn't give a hoot about the kids themselves as people, she'll realize that's a way to guarantee an income stream for life from you.

Easiest is to just pay her off, in effect buy the kids from her.

Be prepared too that you may need to build a case for her being unfit, dealing drugs etc - do whatever it takes given what's at stake the ends justify the means.

Once you have 100% legal control anywhere in the world, only THEN can you relax and focus on the less important stuff like rebuilding the business and a new life. Keep your priorities straight. . .

Thai kids- no one give a shit. Lot of luk kruengs working the bkk nightlife lately. The 1st generation i pressume

[brit1984]

So your wife stole 20m baht from the company and your business is so profitable that you intend to pay back all of these loans? Isn't your wife going to go to prison? All the other managing members are fine paying back the loans your wife took out and letting her get away with all the money without any consequence and now instead of starting a new corporation they want to pay back all of the debts she took out and stole?

The loans are nearly all to friends (mostly mutual) or family so we will repay them regardless of forming a new entity. We will also pay trade creditors from the old company as they are mostly the landlords we need to sign new contracts with to stay in the properties.

The total debt is around 20MB but it doesn't exactly mean she stole 20MB but she certainly stole alot and legal action is something we are preparing in case she tries to disrupt our restructuring efforts.

[brit1984]

Another great (and super useful) post thanks!

No worries, hope it helps.

Move quickly while she's (mostly likely) on the back foot ATM, part of your offer now is to not pursue the embezzlement rap, later on she'll know you're just bluffing.

The idea of my wife being on the back foot is hard to imagine. As of now she has not said sorry (even to her parents). Also I'm not sure it would be a good tactic with her as she has the potebtial to do something very crazy even if it hurts herself just as much. I will try to do it in a way that seems positive for her but with the most subtle hint that my way is the only way.

[brit1984]

Could anyone tell me what the business did except look for investors

It seems to me that was the business

The original business was operating spas.

Going forward we will remodel the strategy more as a management/consultancy so that we don't have to invest (because we have no money) or pay so much expenses (try to de-risk and simplify the business).

Mostly we will offer help with marketing to any spa/hotel/restaurant starting for free (already started helping 1 spa and 1 hotel on this basis) until they see the results.

[brit1984]

People here are talking as if it's the money that's important.

Or FEELINGS fucrissakes!

No - it's the KIDS. OP, please do make a plan and start to execute ASAP to get 100% full custody of the kids, and if you think it necessary a back-home TPR as I outlined earlier.

Yes you may need to go further into hock.

If you can build a case for prosecuting her for embezzlement - I'm not advising actually getting her jailed, just use it as a bargaining chip to get her to sign.

The other posters are right in that it is very likely she will be able to get custody, and even if she doesn't give a hoot about the kids themselves as people, she'll realize that's a way to guarantee an income stream for life from you.

Easiest is to just pay her off, in effect buy the kids from her.

Be prepared too that you may need to build a case for her being unfit, dealing drugs etc - do whatever it takes given what's at stake the ends justify the means.

Once you have 100% legal control anywhere in the world, only THEN can you relax and focus on the less important stuff like rebuilding the business and a new life. Keep your priorities straight. . .

Thai kids- no one give a shit. Lot of luk kruengs working the bkk nightlife lately. The 1st generation i pressume

Thanks for the completely irrelevant and slightly inappropriate, but in some way quite interesting/disturbing insight into the racial mix of Bangkok's sex workers.

[brit1984]

Some UK resources to start with

http://www.cafcass.gov.uk/

http://www.reunite.org/

http://www.dawsoncornwell.com/en/about_amh.html

Thanks alot!

[belg]

so people with a business will pay you or your company a fee to do what ? bring more customers to their own shop ?

they are paying fixed fees every month for your SERVICE

or how else will you get them to share profits with you, let you see in their books, check if they made new customers

oh i forgot, you dont check books or accountants...

seems a very dodgy

and

maybe a job for LABOR department, to check how this all fits in your well or not excisting WORKPERMIT

[brit1984]

Any opinions on an idea suggested by a (non-forum) friend of mine?... go back to UK together as a family with the kids AND wife (she will definitely be up for that) and then divorce over there, or just let her drift away (which is inevitable if i go to live in the countryside away from the money/fun of london)... any thoughts?

[brit1984]

so people with a business will buy you or your company a fee to do what? bring more customers to their own shop ?

if thai people are smart, they will just say: MY customer, not yours and pay nothing

except you have them paying fixed fees every month for your SERVICE

maybe a job for LABOR department, to checl how this all fits in your well or not excisting WORKPERMIT

Just like any agency business there is always a risk the 2 parties which you are connecting will deal directly if you are not providing extra value.

As many Thai service sector businesses rely on walk-in customers rather than online, there is an opportunity to help (or completely do) the latter.

The revenue model is commission on bookings like agoda but obviously we are tiny and therefore able to offer a more bespoke service, including making a website for businesses that don't have one.

[brit1984]

so people with a business will pay you or your company a fee to do what ? bring more customers to their own shop ?

they are paying fixed fees every month for your SERVICE

or how else will you get them to share profits with you, let you see in their books, check if they made new customers

oh i forgot, you dont check books or accountants...

seems a very dodgy

and

maybe a job for LABOR department, to check how this all fits in your well or not excisting WORKPERMIT

PS: I will need a new work permit due to the old company entity being replaced by newco. I don't think the nature of the adjusted business strategy will be an issue as long as my job title / position remains senior enough.

[arthurwait]

Sorry about this fella, haven't read the whole thread, but just sorry that all this happened , though it looks like you've adopted the right attitude to recover from it all.

Best of luck.

[benalibina]

Any opinions on an idea suggested by a (non-forum) friend of mine?... go back to UK together as a family with the kids AND wife (she will definitely be up for that) and then divorce over there, or just let her drift away (which is inevitable if i go to live in the countryside away from the money/fun of london)... any thoughts?

As long as u have proof of her wrongdoings here it would seem that unlikely that in case of divorce there she would become the primary caretaker of your kids. Assets....prenuptual...etc....at least u, and ur familymembers are in control of the kids....how about repaying ur debts in los ?

[FiftyTwo]

Any opinions on an idea suggested by a (non-forum) friend of mine?... go back to UK together as a family with the kids AND wife (she will definitely be up for that) and then divorce over there, or just let her drift away (which is inevitable if i go to live in the countryside away from the money/fun of london)... any thoughts?

no way

she would get 100 percent custody and citizenship with a few easy lies.

grab the kids, return without her, and she has no access to the uk legal system

uk isnt interested in rights for women with no access or right to reside in uk.

they pretend they are, but they just give them the run around.

feel free to pm me, if you cant work out how to do it on your own.

[harryfrompattaya]

Could anyone tell me what the business did except look for investors

It seems to me that was the business

The original business was operating spas.

Going forward we will remodel the strategy more as a management/consultancy so that we don't have to invest (because we have no money) or pay so much expenses (try to de-risk and simplify the business).

Mostly we will offer help with marketing to any spa/hotel/restaurant starting for free (already started helping 1 spa and 1 hotel on this basis) until they see the results.

Management/consultancy I think that is what you need to get back your money from wife

Hire Le Roy and I no fee up front just 30 per cent of what we recover in the six months

We left America because we were so good

You said you gave up getting any back

It will be hard to get Management/consultancy work when you could not manage you own company

[Showbags]

so people with a business will pay you or your company a fee to do what ? bring more customers to their own shop ?

they are paying fixed fees every month for your SERVICE

or how else will you get them to share profits with you, let you see in their books, check if they made new customers

oh i forgot, you dont check books or accountants...

seems a very dodgy

and

maybe a job for LABOR department, to check how this all fits in your well or not excisting WORKPERMIT

What an obnoxious plick you are.

[harryfrompattaya]

so people with a business will pay you or your company a fee to do what ? bring more customers to their own shop ?

they are paying fixed fees every month for your SERVICE

or how else will you get them to share profits with you, let you see in their books, check if they made new customers

oh i forgot, you dont check books or accountants...

seems a very dodgy

and

maybe a job for LABOR department, to check how this all fits in your well or not excisting WORKPERMIT

What an obnoxious plick you are.

Belg speaks the truth and is very smart

would you hire a person over looked his money and investors money

He is lucky Le Roy and I never Invested a penny

You sound like you work with him

[Showbags]

Any opinions on an idea suggested by a (non-forum) friend of mine?... go back to UK together as a family with the kids AND wife (she will definitely be up for that) and then divorce over there, or just let her drift away (which is inevitable if i go to live in the countryside away from the money/fun of london)... any thoughts?

As long as u have proof of her wrongdoings here it would seem that unlikely that in case of divorce there she would become the primary caretaker of your kids. Assets....prenuptual...etc....at least u, and ur familymembers are in control of the kids....how about repaying ur debts in los ?

Do not go western...she only has to lie somewhat, accuse you of beating her, assault etc, perhaps make a false report here to prove it later etc etc. She then also has access to legal aid no doubt.

Big recipe for disaster.

You have little income by the sounds for awhile, why contemplate going to an expensive country?

[harrry]

I will just say this, The UK courts will not take kindly to your claim to custody as you have sent them to live with your inlaws. Only two people have rights to retain kids here in Thailand you and youur wife. I suggest picking up your children from the inlaws (Take a policeman with you if you wish) and looking after them youself.

[harryfrompattaya]

I and Le Roy will be glad to go with you to get your kids Le Roy also knows the way to talk to the Police

The Police all like old Le Roy he was a Song and Dance Man a Tall Sammy Davis Jr