Buying property in Koh Tao- Thailand

[KohTaoAllTheWay]

Awesome Amitsch I will do that now!

[Showbags]

Do you mind telling us how much money is involved in this little venture...ball park is fine....just to gain an idea of what is being put at risk...peanuts or macadamias etc.

[yankee99]

Awesome found it! The way to get hold of property in Koh Tao, it is close enough to buying it and it is legal if done the right way ...

The island of Koh Tao is owned by the government of Thailand, who assigned lifelong land papers to the local community around 50 years ago. These land papers are called Por Bor Tor 5 and they give the Thai owner a lifelong title lease to either keep the land or sell it to any other Thai National. Over time, it has been demonstrated that 95 per cent of locals holding their Por Bor Tor 5 land title consider that the land is their own do not accept the claim of government ownership.It is possible for a Non-Thai national to obtain these land papers legally by registering a Thai Limited company. These companies must be 51 per cent Thai-owned, however, so you should al always be extremely certain who you are entering into agreement with. It is also strongly advised that an experienced local lawyer when buying property in Koh Tao as certain irregularities can sometimes arise.

But there is a solution to this issue. When any company purchases Koh Tao real estate and obtain the original Por Bor Tor 5 land-title paper, the owner can return it to the Thai government and receive an official updated lease from the Surat Thani Treasury Office.

A token fee and tax per rai (40m2) must then be paid annually, and when this is carried out correctly the lease is automatically renewable every 15 to 30 years depending on the size and location of your land.

There we have it people! I am very please with myself

.....Yes what you say is possible but you need to be reminded it is not legal to use a company to own land.....that said many people do it without any issues.

[KohTaoAllTheWay]

Do you mind telling us how much money is involved in this little venture...ball park is fine....just to gain an idea of what is being put at risk...peanuts or macadamias etc.

No, I am not comfortable doing that at all. I don't see the relevance?? You do understand the second company that I would start from scratch with no other farang shareholders is to actually run a genuine business with and the current company we are buying into is also a real investment that is apart of a bigger picture. 10% of the right business can actually be a worthy investment, particularly if you are using it as an opportunity to discover other future investment opportunities and make some cash on the side. How would one learn about the island and the people that live on it if they do not actually work in a business first? It is not just about money, it is about creating an opportunity to meet like minded people and learn from those who have done well and know the island. It also happens to be the type of business I have 11yrs experience running and owning in the western World. I am also very familiar with Thai culture having lived in Bangkok for some time, however I have always found the Koh Tao culture to be a little different.

I really get the sense you have jumped to a lot of conclusions. I am aware I could fall flat on my ass here, but I am trying to be as smart as I can be and put as little money at risk as possible. Whether it be peanuts or macadamias- Your macadamias could be peanuts to me and vice versa. We are a young couple who can afford to take a calculated risk. I am not too worried about the decision to buy the 10% of this business and run it. I was worried about buying a property and doing it as safely as we could, hence the reason I posted the question in search of some genuine information from real people. I was hoping residents of koh tao would be on the forum. Property buying is on the agenda but it certainly isn't the be all and end all. It would just be a major major bonus.

[iancnx]

It would seem most resident on Koh Tao are not participants of TV; I wonder is there some reason for that?

There was a mention of moving away from the 'established' law firm. Tread carefully..... Perhaps.

[taninthai]

all you need to know and remember is that ferang cannot own land here.por bor tor 5 run run run

[GOLDBUGGY]

1. You or a company can NOT own land on Koh Tao ! [period]

2. Ownership rights are traded on Koh Tao and NOT the land itself.

3. Buying anything without having full controll over it is simply naive [if not outright stupid]

4. When money gets involved, friends are usually the worst partners for business.

This is not meant personal or rude ... it's a simple truth that could keep people out of a lot of trouble and hassle.

Sadly people stop being rational when falling in love.

I agree!

When money is involved, I might add that I think Family might be a bit worst than Friends, as partners.

[mmh8]

the illegal builds have been in place for many years and it will go on for many years to come. Just hope one day they actually return islands to a decent state

[PattayaPhom]

Chase after a dream and believe whatever makes that achievable, just dont go crying when it turns sour. I work in real estate and recommend buying but what you are venturing on really isnt advisable. Por Bor Tor 5 gives you no rights of ownership whatsoever and the land is for agriculture use only, what will you be growing on Koh Tao?

I know of two cases in Sattahip area where land has been reclaimed after issuance of Por Bor Tor 5. Go ahead and listen to the locals, especially those that will profit form the "purchase"

Quoting information from a real estate company that sells property on Koh Tao in your last post is hardly a green light to go ahead.

Good Luck

Edited February 13, 2014 by PattayaPhom

[CWMcMurray]

If the below is correct, then seems no reason or benefit to trying to "buy" the land

As wouldn't a Usfruct be a better or cheaper way to go?

Or depending on the age of the couple a 30 yr lease?

Of course that assumes that the current "owner" would be interested in either of the above senarios

1. You or a company can NOT own land on Koh Tao ! [period]

2. Ownership rights are traded on Koh Tao and NOT the land itself.

3. Buying anything without having full controll over it is simply naive [if not outright stupid]

4. When money gets involved, friends are usually the worst partners for business.

This is not meant personal or rude ... it's a simple truth that could keep people out of a lot of trouble and hassle.

Sadly people stop being rational when falling in love.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[KittenKong]

As wouldn't a Usfruct be a better or cheaper way to go?

Or depending on the age of the couple a 30 yr lease?

Could you get either from an "owner" who doesn't actually own anything? And even if you can get it, can it be enforced in law?

I suspect not.

[Khun Jean]

Now that you know everything is tor bot tor 5 you know the risk concerning the land.

That 'paper' is proof that tax has been paid by a person who occupies the land, nothing else.

It can not be sold, leased out etc. It can be upgraded to Sor Kor 1, that gives rights to farm it.

This can also not be sold only transferred through inheritance. This Sor Kor 1 however can be upgraded to Nor Sor 3 or a chanot.

This means every structure, lease, company etc on Koh Tao is illegal, but allowed.

Everyone is hoping that the same will happen as on Samui and that is that land will be upgraded to Nor Sor 3 or a chanot.

As the whole island is categorized as a national park it would first have to loose that status before upgrading of the land is possible.

That can take decades, however meanwhile every illegal entity is making money and doing good business.

If your investment is in proportion of what you can earn it is a calculated risk, as is any business.

It all depends with what kind of risk you are comfortable and what percentage of your money is involved.

For some 10.000$ is their live savings, for another it is a weekly income.

[stiggy]

Have a property on Tao and lived there 15 years.

No Chanotes, although constant rumours they are coming.

My current house I'm the director of a company , the co leases the property to me for 30 years.Paperwork is in place, if my thai partners move on or die, and its split amongst 3 Thais

My previous houses there sold easily, with no problems

Every year we pay land tax, a very small amount but necessary

The house has a registered address with the land office

Yes Its risky, but I have also owned houses in Bangkok, Phuket and Samui, all with different papers etc.All with more headaches then Tao.But that is the cost of living in Thailand,and having a property.

You will never own a property in Thailand (condos on leasehold being the exception)

The plus side is that its cheap , the same property on Samui for e.g. would be upwards of 10 mill Bht on tao its just 3-4

Depends what you want, like any property in Thailand if you can afford to loose it don't stress.The actual chances of that happening are very slim.

The property on Tao has risen significantly in perceived value, and paid back for it self many times over.Rental yields on tao are fantastic

Edited February 13, 2014 by stiggy

[KittenKong]

Yes Its risky, but I have also owned houses in Bangkok, Phuket and Samui, all with different papers etc.All with more headaches then Tao.But that is the cost of living in Thailand,and having a property.

You will never own a property in Thailand (condos on leasehold being the exception)

How do you work that one out? A farang name condo will have your name on the chanote and you will own it outright. A leasehold property you dont own at all; you lease it. The clue is in the name.

The reason all your property ventures have had different paperwork and assorted headaches is probably because you are trying to buy things that you cant legally own. Limit yourself to a property that you can legally own and you will have just one bit of paper with your name on it and no hassle.

[stiggy]

I accept that I will never fully own property and land in Thailand. My post is simply stating my experiences with the different papers, properties, and means of deemed purchase.

You're correct of course, it should read "condos on chanote being the exception"

As for the condo experience mine was chanote and fairly easy to set up,with the use all broken promises/delays when brought of plan. But the CAM fees where a different matter, effectively changing after 2 years to a total rip off, a majority of the units where owed by the developer and his cronies and they basically sold to each other, then done as they wished.

For property that is meant to be owned 100% outright legally, It's the one I ended up having least control over, and the most problems.However saying that I didnt lose money just hair through pulling it out with frustration.

For me the properties on Tao, where/are the easiest to sort out, and give the best yield by far.What the future hold's though is anyones guess till then Ill carry on.

Edited February 16, 2014 by stiggy