We deserve better: it's time to restart Thailand

[iancnx]

Instead of demonizing the man try to READ the article and see why he removed himself from the democratic process. READ the article and understand the points he is making.

All that is ever spouted is elections, elections, elections. Democracy is not just elections. Yet people refuse too admit it. The UDD supporters on this site cannot even tell me what the principles of democracy are. Not one. They change the subject, demonize me or argue an unrelated fact. All great traits of a demagogue, but unfortunately not a trait of someone that yearns for democracy.

Abhisit has made it pretty clear the abuses under the current structure. Do the people want abuse of power, corruption, failed policies and a govt that said "if you don't vote for us we refuse you our services". When people vote for abuse of power, corruption, failed policies and a govt that said "if you don't vote for us we refuse you our services" they are voting for a failed state. Even though there was an election, that is not a democracy. It will eventually be a failed state. Reform is needed to ensure any future government cannot do the abuse whether it be PTP or DEM's or any sitting government.

Abhisit can be called a street thug or any other demonizing word that makes you feel that your supporting a righteous "team" while the opposition are evil and fascist, but at the end of the day that street thug is a citizen of Thailand that makes a dam_n factual point that opposition in their arrogance and holier than thou attitude dismiss as it does the overwhelming majority of Thailand which was shown in the last election to not support the PTP. Without extrapolating the figures and juggling numbers an overwhelming majority do want reform. An overwhelming majority do want free and fair elections. An overwhelming majority understand that voting is a gateway of the democratic process that allows a government to prove to the people it is democratic. An overwhelming majority DO NOT think that abuse of power, corruption and a govt that says "if you don't vote for us we refuse you our services". Obviously you do because you defend it no, you ignore it and spout elections.

If I had to chose a repressive regime with dictatorial tendencies or a democratic street thug. I will choose the latter any day.

The crux of your whole abhisit hagiography above is in your last paragraph which begins

"If I had to choose"

This Oxford educated hyper intelligent best thing to hit Thailand since marmite became available, "politician" (I'm joking about abhisit but not the marmite) is responsible for denying the Thai citizen that choice.

He has taken his party out of the democratic election process with his petulant boycott thus denying dem party supporters their choice and is actively supporting his former deputy who is frantically trying to stop anybody from voting and therefore taking away their choice.

This failed politician does not deserve to have a platform for his myopic vision of what is best for Thailand.

Before I comment Fab, would you grant us an answer to one question. Do you agree with the underhand tactics adopted to push through the Amnesty Bill?

[fab4]

The crux of your whole abhisit hagiography above is in your last paragraph which begins

"If I had to choose"

This Oxford educated hyper intelligent best thing to hit Thailand since marmite became available, "politician" (I'm joking about abhisit but not the marmite) is responsible for denying the Thai citizen that choice.

He has taken his party out of the democratic election process with his petulant boycott thus denying dem party supporters their choice and is actively supporting his former deputy who is frantically trying to stop anybody from voting and therefore taking away their choice.

This failed politician does not deserve to have a platform for his myopic vision of what is best for Thailand.

Before I comment Fab, would you grant us an answer to one question. Do you agree with the underhand tactics adopted to push through the Amnesty Bill?

Read my posting history. I said at the time I disagreed with the amnesty bill.

But that is not what this protest is about. That was abhisits deceit at the beginning of the protests when he said that it was.

If that was the case why is the protest still going on. The amnesty bill has stopped, why hasn't the protest?

Because it has been hijacked by those who want to ensure that the "right" people are in "charge" when "something" happens.

Edited February 20, 2014 by fab4

[LomSak27]

Once more the world watches Thailand

No, lots of peope are rewatching the Squawks thump the Broncos as Sochi gets tedious

[focus27]

Can't restart Thailand until the rule of law is enforced. From petty crime to government. corruption.

Reform the police and the rest should fall into place.

Abhisit like Thainess apparently. Isn't red bull daddy a big pro-democrat. Says it all really.

No spine. No principles. No willingness to embrace change or.movement. Were all right luv. Just lovely jubbly as we are. Thainess.

Marvellous old boy.

Before blaming the law enforcers I'd reform the law makers.

Corrupt judges make corrupt decisions that corrupt laws that encourage corrupt practices.

Breaking that cycle would be a start.

[noitom]

This from the Thai democrat party leader who voted "no" in an election. He showed the Thai nation that voting is not important. Now all of a sudden he is front and center with editorial space.

[focus27]

This article first appeared in The Financial Times.

When ? I'm a subscriber to the FT and havn't seen that article there.

Our country has tremendous potential. With our unique history in Southeast Asia as being a country that was never colonised, we have undergone a revolution of development, teetering on the edge of being a "developed market". The second largest economy in Asean after Indonesia and geographically at the centre of continental Asean, we have much to gain from the establishment of the Asean economic community next year.

Modesty would be a good start Mark .... interesting that hes citing much to gain from rather than much to give the Asean economic community as a partner.Teetering on the edge is a good description of where the country is at the moment though, but its on the edge of stability rather than a developed market right now.

We have an educated, professional workforce. Our country is a hub for automotive manufacturing, technology, services, leisure and the creative industries. It is an agricultural tour de force. Behind our famous Thai smile, there is a strong sense of national pride, a determination to succeed, a passion to preserve what we call "Thai-ness", and the will and ability to continue to grow, develop and perform, both nationally and globally

Such a hub of everything here wow,the passion of preserving Thai-ness part is interesting, just what could that mean i wonder ?

Using Google I see that this article was an opinion piece in the Bangkok Post today. It does not refer to the financial times.

At least it's written in English - not the Nation's mangled Thailish.

[attento]

Throwing BrickBats is relatively easy and sometimes amusing, however, the real question to ponder is where is the next generation of politicians to lead the country out of this mess ? Are there any? and is it an achievable goal ?

[rijb]

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An excellent and timely article by Abhisit. For those who are skeptical about his motives, be aware that in this article he explicitly takes himself and his party out of the political equation. He feels - as do likely a consensus of Thais - that someone needs to oversee a period of reform, and he specifically points out that neither the current members of the government, nor the leaders of the PDRC, nor the Democratic party and himself should do that. And he is right. For this to succeed, it has to be above politics, and it has to have credibility in all sectors and regions of the country.

" ... the new-found energy and unprecedented level of political awareness and engagement ... "

Abhisit - in these well-chosen words - is describing this period in Thai political history most aptly. Indeed, the lethargy has been followed by a clear awakening. Never have Thais from so many walks of life and encompassing all regions of the country been so actively conscious of their power to mold their own destiny. That path is now inevitable. And the people will be up to the task.

I think you need ‘a clear awakening’. Who do you, and the ‘actively conscious of their power’ Thais, think this ‘period of reform’ overseer should be? And who gets to appoint this overseer?

But, lets ignore the pesky details and see who’s available for the job as overseer:

Buddha - not a citizen

Santa Claus - doesn’t understand ‘Thainess’

a ThaiVisa member - no work permit

Thai army general - maybe (would have to take a cut in pay)

Abhisit - maybe (attempting reincarnation) Hare Krishna! Abhisit!

The point is there is no miracle performer/overseer waiting in the wings to help Thais ‘mold their own destiny’.

Thailand has to fix this the hard way. That means dialogue, law enforcement, voter rights, and the end of feudalism.

[englishoak]

An excellent and timely article by Abhisit. For those who are skeptical about his motives, be aware that in this article he explicitly takes himself and his party out of the political equation. He feels - as do likely a consensus of Thais - that someone needs to oversee a period of reform, and he specifically points out that neither the current members of the government, nor the leaders of the PDRC, nor the Democratic party and himself should do that. And he is right. For this to succeed, it has to be above politics, and it has to have credibility in all sectors and regions of the country.

" ... the new-found energy and unprecedented level of political awareness and engagement ... "

Abhisit - in these well-chosen words - is describing this period in Thai political history most aptly. Indeed, the lethargy has been followed by a clear awakening. Never have Thais from so many walks of life and encompassing all regions of the country been so actively conscious of their power to mold their own destiny. That path is now inevitable. And the people will be up to the task.

Whilst I agree fully with the latter underlined part I do not think this at all what Abhisit has in mind or wants.... indeed this is exactly imo what the Dems and PRDC are trying so hard to avoid. PTP too but in a different way.

IMO you are saying is about as far from what Abhisit wishes as Thaksin is honest. Id be very happy if it were to go that way but do not think for a moment that is what the "reforms" have in mind.

[ianf]

Generally a pretty good screed from Abhisit, showing the benefits of his Eton - Oxford education and political nous on the international front. Where he fails, is pushing the right buttons on the domestic front to rise above the fray and show himself to be a statesman who can heal over the festering sores that have formed in Thailand these past few years. The partial use of Lincoln's address on "government of the people, for the people, by the people" rings kind of hollow in this case, especially given his mention in the first paragraph that "our future lies in the hands of the few" and the Democrats continual defence of a system of governance that benefits the few and at the expense of the masses. All the same, he is streaks ahead Thaksin (and entire PTP party) in terms of demonstrating intelligence and insight through his writing (surely they would have to rely on the paid services of Robert Amsterdam to come up with a similar opinion piece), and in an unedifying field, he still stands out as the only respectable candidate for future PM. Would that there be someone better standing up to the plate, but there ain't, so Abhisit scrapes through by default.

Its such a shame he lacks any political principles whatsoever. Although its good to see that he has been laid bare for all to see.

He is the worst type of politician. The flip flopper, the wolf in lambs clothing, the fibber. He has no idea what he wants Thailand to become, other than he knows that Thaksin threatens him and his position.

He is the champagne socialist, the compassionate conservative, the undemocratic democrat. All ghastly concepts.

I don't know where he learnt to behave like this, but Eton would probably like to disown him.

You people are too quick to condemn. And you condemn from a prejudiced point of view. If you studied this man a little bit more and opened your heart to different possibilities and got rid of your inner prejudices and ideology then you would probably see that Abhisit is a good man who has been demonised by the self-exiled sociopaths in order to serve his own interests. You've got to hand it Abhisit - all the sh"" he has been put through by the Shins and their reds - and he i still willing to stand up and be counted. This man needs support, not stupid, blind criticism.

[ianf]

This from the Thai democrat party leader who voted "no" in an election. He showed the Thai nation that voting is not important. Now all of a sudden he is front and center with editorial space.

Voting 'no' is part of a democratic process: I wish we had that option on the ballots back home (wherever that is)/

[JiveTalker]

Funny how he didn't feel the need to overhaul the democratic system when he was Prime Minister.

[kikoman]

The Democrat party are not part of the Solution, They are the problem,

"No one can hide from that fact"!

1- All the original protest leaders are DEMOCRAT politicians,

2-The Democrats are the only political party that boycotted the election causing the problems that exist today,

3-The only consistencies to block the election completely were those that were in traditional Democrats stronghold

4-The run on the banks were again from Traditional Democrat dominated South and Bangkok

5-The Democrats actively participated in the street protest, and the illegal take over of state offices

The Democrats are in no position to point their finger at anyone else but themselves,

Abhisit has yet to face the corruption changes brought against him and his government!

Cheers

[ggt]

^{"someone credible and accepted by all sides can lead the reform process"}

^{Herein...lies the problem...there is no one in this country that has not been touched by corruption...so finding someone "credible" is a tall order...}

^{Finding one person who is acceptable to all sides...will be even harder to accomplish...everyone wants to own the pie...slice it up to suit them and their cronies...and give the crumbs to the opposition...}

^{It may take intervention...by the UN...as mediator...to get back on track again....}

[Just1Voice]

Actually, I can think of one man who is qualified for the position. Politically neutral, well educated, teacher, media columnist, sought after speaker, and not afraid to call it like it is, which worked well enough to get him kicked off his weekly television show. Unfortunately, the majority of his following are English speaking foreigners, and he really doesn't have the exposure to enough Thai to put himself in position.

I'm talking about Vorani Vanajaki. Those of you who follow BK Post know who I mean. His political columns and comments are timely, direct, and hit the nail on the head with a consistency unmatched by anyone else I know of. He understands what the problems are, and what needs to be done to fix them, but, unfortunately, doesn't have the backing he needs, or wants, to project him to the forefront of the national consciousness.

[smileydude]

Abhisit has his strong points:

Intellectual capacity (degree in PPE from Oxford)

Relatively clean image.

Oratory and debating skills

and his weak points:

unable to connect to grass roots people

rather aloof image

one man think tank

not wealthy enough to get everyone to toe the line

not senior or respected enough to get everyone to toe the line

negotiating skills

Leaders to run the country in theory should have the attributes Abhisit has but they also need to have the ones he doesn't have. No single person can have every skill thats why you need a combination of good advisors and skilled politicians.

Problem is skilled politicians usually have their hands down the honey pot.

How about the Singapore model where politicians and government officials are paid as well or better then in the private sector so they stop wanting for more plus the strong anti-corruption laws. Or is it impossible to satisfy Thai politician's greed?

[Patpending]

what we've said all along Op Ed from nation/Abhisit. Press in league with them once more.

OT. thailand gets the politicians and government it deserves. the population on both sides never engage in politics, they just jump up and down, march clap, whistle when they are not in power.

it is all negative on both sides and until they grow up (another generation) this will continue.

meanwhile, the country is becoming top heavy with elites, amart etc. and until somebody addresses this, politics in thailand will just be the pawns (poor people) behaving in the way they always have.

They allow decisions to be made for them, and never question anything. Hence you have poor marchers and the leaders at the front end in mercs. porches and limos staying in 5 star hotels.

None of the mobs on either side ever question this, so the problems are the making of the majority of the population!!

[I knew this would happen]

We deserve better? The saying goes, you get what you deserve!

Thailand needs to change, but I cannot imagine who and how can achieve this gigantic task. All fights and clashe in Thailand only had one target: Money and power for ME. Noone has ever thought what will happen to the beloved??!! country. As long as everyone is just selfish, you don´t deserve better!

Edited February 20, 2014 by I knew this would happen

[Bocking]

Firstly, I’m no fan of Abhisit or the Democrats. Also, I personally believe that Suthep is a blustering fool who’s enjoying his time in the spotlight, perhaps quite dangerously, but it’s a spotlight that ought to have been extinguished following the demise of the Amnesty Bill back in 2013. Politically speaking, I dress to the left and would naturally gravitate towards the principles of the Pheu Thai Party, BUT, it’s the details within their final policies, and their unguarded execution, that disgusts me. At almost every turn, the current Pheu Thai government has somehow managed to transform the potentially beneficial into the totally disastrous: Flood response, first car scheme, one tablet per child, rice pledging scheme, amnesty bill.

It’s not an enviable record, and of course there’s more mud to sling at PTP because they’ve been the party in power, but what really disturbs me and makes me hope for a third and better way forward, is their constant barrage of lies and denial of responsibility and accountability.

I fully understand that Thailand’s political and social problems didn’t begin with Thaksin Shinawatra, but I also now believe that real progress will not happen until the Shinawatra Family and Friends are gone from Thai politics for ever.

What I do respect about Abhisit’s article, is a move towards an admission of failure. He seems to admit that at this present time, the Democrats are not the answer, and while it’s a small step that he seems to have taken, in comparison to PTP’s avoidance of ALL responsibility and denial of obvious facts, I see it as a giant leap in the right direction for Thailand.

In response to his/her own question in post #33: ‘The amnesty bill has stopped, why hasn’t the protest’, Fab4 answers: “because it has been hijacked by those who want to ensure that the ‘right’ people are in ‘charge’ when ‘something’ happens’’. Personally, I think it’s more that the protesters don’t want the ‘wrong’ people in charge.

As a former passive supporter of PHP principles, I’ll actually raise a Leo when the Shinawatra family are finally divorced from politics in Thailand. The subsequent healing process will be slow and painful, and the country will probably heal in a very tenuous ‘Thai way’, but if Abhisit can become a catalyst for the beginning of that process, then I for one will vicariously support him.

[Suriya4]

One correction. I don't think the world is watching. It's barely noticing. Turn on the news, and it's all Ukraine and Olympics. Whatever happens, here, goes right under the radar, for the most part.

You are 100% correct.

Who cares if Thailand is split into two (North & South).

Join rank with Sudan, Korea, Vietnam, Pakistan, Timor, Yugoslavian, Czechoslovakia, Germany, USSR, New Zealand, etc.

[soalbundy]

I disagree with kuhn Abhisit. According to a poll taken sometime ago Thais find nothing wrong with corruption as long as they benefit.Thailand deserves what its got, a parliament full of corrupt self serving politicians.

That Thailand was never colonized is probably a disadvantage,in the long run they would have learnt good governance. When the British ruled Hong kong corruption was minimal as soon as they left, it soared. Just as honesty is a trait of the Nordic countries so is corruption a trait of Asian countries,it defines them,it forms them in every aspect of their being,it wont alter because of a new set of rules placed on the table. In the western democracies corruption also exists but the people practicing corruption are looked down upon, here they are admired because of their wealth.

Two years ago a young Thai man that i know entered the Temple as a monk for three months. A lost mobile was found on the Temple grounds by a monk. I asked the young man if they had tried to find the owner he replied no,the monk who found it used it himself,the Abbot of the Temple warned him it would be better if he changed the sim card so that he couldn't be traced,so much for the much respected religion here.

[fab4]

At least it's written in English - not the Nation's mangled Thailish.

Which is rather unfortunate as you would have thought he would want to aim his propoganda at all Thais, not just those who can read English.

Still, it does expose both his target base and the sheer arrogance of the man.

[I knew this would happen]

I disagree with kuhn Abhisit. According to a poll taken sometime ago Thais find nothing wrong with corruption as long as they benefit.Thailand deserves what its got, a parliament full of corrupt self serving politicians.

That Thailand was never colonized is probably a disadvantage,in the long run they would have learnt good governance. When the British ruled Hong kong corruption was minimal as soon as they left, it soared. Just as honesty is a trait of the Nordic countries so is corruption a trait of Asian countries,it defines them,it forms them in every aspect of their being,it wont alter because of a new set of rules placed on the table. In the western democracies corruption also exists but the people practicing corruption are looked down upon, here they are admired because of their wealth.

Two years ago a young Thai man that i know entered the Temple as a monk for three months. A lost mobile was found on the Temple grounds by a monk. I asked the young man if they had tried to find the owner he replied no,the monk who found it used it himself,the Abbot of the Temple warned him it would be better if he changed the sim card so that he couldn't be traced,so much for the much respected religion here.

But they DESERVE better!? As long and 95% of Thais seem to have a wired view of rights, law, orders, do´s and dont´s it will stay the same forever.

[kennypowers]

Generally a pretty good screed from Abhisit, showing the benefits of his Eton - Oxford education and political nous on the international front. Where he fails, is pushing the right buttons on the domestic front to rise above the fray and show himself to be a statesman who can heal over the festering sores that have formed in Thailand these past few years. The partial use of Lincoln's address on "government of the people, for the people, by the people" rings kind of hollow in this case, especially given his mention in the first paragraph that "our future lies in the hands of the few" and the Democrats continual defence of a system of governance that benefits the few and at the expense of the masses. All the same, he is streaks ahead Thaksin (and entire PTP party) in terms of demonstrating intelligence and insight through his writing (surely they would have to rely on the paid services of Robert Amsterdam to come up with a similar opinion piece), and in an unedifying field, he still stands out as the only respectable candidate for future PM. Would that there be someone better standing up to the plate, but there ain't, so Abhisit scrapes through by default.

Its such a shame he lacks any political principles whatsoever. Although its good to see that he has been laid bare for all to see.

He is the worst type of politician. The flip flopper, the wolf in lambs clothing, the fibber. He has no idea what he wants Thailand to become, other than he knows that Thaksin threatens him and his position.

He is the champagne socialist, the compassionate conservative, the undemocratic democrat. All ghastly concepts.

I don't know where he learnt to behave like this, but Eton would probably like to disown him.

Absolutely. He did nothing when he was in power expect grease the palms of big business owners financing his party. He made one loose promise of a welfare state to be implemented by 2017, which was never mentioned again. Thai people won't vote for Abhisit because they see straight through his rhetoric.

[nottocus]

The only way I can see Thailand restarting is when one side wipes the other out (whatever those sides may be). Until then, the problems will just go on and on and on.

[DrTuner]

Clearly, the only way to fix this is colonization. (ducking)

The Chinese haven't managed to fix it. Maybe us TV readers should take the helm.

[iancnx]

The crux of your whole abhisit hagiography above is in your last paragraph which begins

"If I had to choose"

This Oxford educated hyper intelligent best thing to hit Thailand since marmite became available, "politician" (I'm joking about abhisit but not the marmite) is responsible for denying the Thai citizen that choice.

He has taken his party out of the democratic election process with his petulant boycott thus denying dem party supporters their choice and is actively supporting his former deputy who is frantically trying to stop anybody from voting and therefore taking away their choice.

This failed politician does not deserve to have a platform for his myopic vision of what is best for Thailand.

Before I comment Fab, would you grant us an answer to one question. Do you agree with the underhand tactics adopted to push through the Amnesty Bill?

Read my posting history. I said at the time I disagreed with the amnesty bill.

But that is not what this protest is about. That was abhisits deceit at the beginning of the protests when he said that it was.

If that was the case why is the protest still going on. The amnesty bill has stopped, why hasn't the protest?

Because it has been hijacked by those who want to ensure that the "right" people are in "charge" when "something" happens.

Great to see you disagreed with the amnesty bill. Unfortunate to see you are so forgiving after the event. The fact of the matter is if the government had been left to their own corrupt devices they would certainly have dreamt up other equally preposterous plans to exonerate the fugitive in Dubai and return his billions from the public purse. It is for THIS VERY CLEAR reason that the protests started and have continued to this day, and it will continue until the root cause has been removed!

There is no room for your or others forgiveness of such dastardly deeds to rape this country until all are truly on their knees.

Edited February 20, 2014 by iancnx

[soalbundy]

One correction. I don't think the world is watching. It's barely noticing. Turn on the news, and it's all Ukraine and Olympics. Whatever happens, here, goes right under the radar, for the most part.

You are 100% correct.

Who cares if Thailand is split into two (North & South).

Join rank with Sudan, Korea, Vietnam, Pakistan, Timor, Yugoslavian, Czechoslovakia, Germany, USSR, New Zealand, etc.

But then we would have two corrupt countries instead of just one

[iancnx]

One correction. I don't think the world is watching. It's barely noticing. Turn on the news, and it's all Ukraine and Olympics. Whatever happens, here, goes right under the radar, for the most part.

You are 100% correct.

Who cares if Thailand is split into two (North & South).

Join rank with Sudan, Korea, Vietnam, Pakistan, Timor, Yugoslavian, Czechoslovakia, Germany, USSR, New Zealand, etc.

The people who will be affected will care, whereas you will most likely have moved on to pastures new as soon as the going gets tough, oblivious to those who will suffer. This is your prerogative. But kindly keep your stupid 'who cares' throw away remarks to yourself. There are many expats here who have either retired, or who are married with families, who love this fine country, and are here for the full innings, not just a couple of overs! I care about the future of my young son more than anything in the world!

I CARE !

Edited February 20, 2014 by iancnx

[soalbundy]

I disagree with kuhn Abhisit. According to a poll taken sometime ago Thais find nothing wrong with corruption as long as they benefit.Thailand deserves what its got, a parliament full of corrupt self serving politicians.

That Thailand was never colonized is probably a disadvantage,in the long run they would have learnt good governance. When the British ruled Hong kong corruption was minimal as soon as they left, it soared. Just as honesty is a trait of the Nordic countries so is corruption a trait of Asian countries,it defines them,it forms them in every aspect of their being,it wont alter because of a new set of rules placed on the table. In the western democracies corruption also exists but the people practicing corruption are looked down upon, here they are admired because of their wealth.

Two years ago a young Thai man that i know entered the Temple as a monk for three months. A lost mobile was found on the Temple grounds by a monk. I asked the young man if they had tried to find the owner he replied no,the monk who found it used it himself,the Abbot of the Temple warned him it would be better if he changed the sim card so that he couldn't be traced,so much for the much respected religion here.

But they DESERVE better!? As long and 95% of Thais seem to have a wired view of rights, law, orders, do´s and dont´s it will stay the same forever.

As you say,they are wired that way,its their much vaunted "Thainess" they are even proud of it.That's OK they are happy that way,it defines them, they should just stop whining about the consequences of being corrupt untrustworthy liars.