Yingluck urged to defy courts, independent agencies

[webfact]

NATION ANALYSIS
Yingluck urged to defy courts, independent agencies
Opas Boonlom
The Nation

BANGKOK: -- With several corruption cases and petitions involving claims that Premier Yingluck Shinawatra violated the constitution, it is perhaps not surprising that the red shirts have suggested she should exercise civil disobedience against court rulings or decisions by independent agencies that go against the caretaker government.

Yingluck's back is against the wall after many weeks of anti-government protests led by the People's Democratic Reform Committee, which is pressuring her to stand down to make way for reforms.

Not only does she have to brave her biggest ever political storm, she will also have to fight court cases to remain as PM.

The United Front for Democracy against Dictatorship (UDD) believes that Yingluck has only a slim chance of surviving the court cases.

The UDD has accused the judiciary of political favouritism and included them among four targets it is battling.
To keep her seat, the UDD said Yingluck had to be defiant.

The case that has rocked her administration to the core is the rice-pledging scheme.

Dereliction of duty

The National Anti-Corruption Commission has summoned Yingluck to hear charges of dereliction of duty tomorrow for her alleged failure to stop the graft-plagued scheme.

But the PM accused the NACC of discrimination, saying that the agency had not made any progress with a corruption case against the Abhisit government, whereas it took only 21 days to investigate and press charges against her.

If the NCCC rules that she is guilty as charged, Yingluck will be suspended from duty unless the Senate or the Supreme Court's Division for Political Office Holders rules otherwise.

Other cases that could cost Yingluck her job are alleged corruption in the Bt350-billion water management scheme and constitutional cases involving the Bt2-trillion-loan project. Judges in the Constitutional Court have completed witness examination in the latter case and may issue a verdict on it shortly.

Former National Security Council chief Thawil Pliansri, who accused Yingluck of unfairly transferring him, has also brought another significant case against the PM in the Administrative Court. Thawil is awaiting a ruling by the Supreme Administrative Court. The latter is expected to uphold a lower court ruling that the transfer was illegal.


-- The Nation 2014-02-26

[Thai at Heart]

They haven't convicted ANYONE for corruption or graft on the rice scheme yet.

I think even I as a non lawyer could defend her against this accusation. Is there one single proven complaint of corruption in the rice scheme nationwide?

So m'lord, there is no corruption.

[djjamie]

They haven't convicted ANYONE for corruption or graft on the rice scheme yet.

I think even I as a non lawyer could defend her against this accusation. Is there one single proven complaint of corruption in the rice scheme nationwide?

So m'lord, there is no corruption.

Of course they haven't convicted anyone yet. No cases have gone through the court system yet and been judged.

It has been proved the DEM's have complained.

It has been proven Supa has complained.

It has been proven the IMF suggested restructuring the scheme due to corruption.

The list goes on.

As for proven corruption. There is ample evidence to suggest corruption and that is what the courts have to prove. It sounds like even if she is found guilty it won't matter. She will defy the courts due to no respect for the law. (Surprise surprise - A principle of democracy)

If there is anything else m'lord I suggest you refer to the below.

Edited February 26, 2014 by djjamie

[NongKhaiKid]

Ignore the courts ?

Doesn't PTP have a track record of such ?

[binjalin]

They haven't convicted ANYONE for corruption or graft on the rice scheme yet.

I think even I as a non lawyer could defend her against this accusation. Is there one single proven complaint of corruption in the rice scheme nationwide?

So m'lord, there is no corruption.

Of course they haven't convicted anyone yet. No cases have gone through the court system yet and been judged.

It has been proved the DEM's have complained.

It has been proven Supa has complained.

It has been proven the IMF suggested restructuring the scheme due to corruption.

The list goes on.

As for proven corruption. There is ample evidence to suggest corruption and that is what the courts have to prove. It sounds like even if she is found guilty it won't matter. She will defy the courts due to no respect for the law. (Surprise surprise - A principle of democracy)

If there is anything else m'lord I suggest you refer to the below.

The Dems would complain about anything

she used the wrong toilet - file a complaint!

she used wrong brand of toothpaste - file a complaint

she went to a province - file a complaint!

they are a pathetic opposition who cannot get their act together to even fight an election!

[ikurauni]

Yingluck has a slim chance to survive the legal issue. It is already a public knowledge that the government screwed the farmers and they are suffering from the broken promises by the government. I am sure that she was aware of the problem but did nothing about it. I think most people agree that she didn't do the job. It is her fault.

<the red shirts have suggested she should exercise civil disobedience against court rulings or decisions by independent agencies that go against the caretaker government.>

The reds are suggesting the PM?? Wow, they got so much power now after telling the Navy chief what to do.

We all know that the PM screwed up big time. But there is nothing for her to lose if she screws up again. If she wants to take this option, she can do whatever she wants.

We will watch the show. Someone should make a movie from the crisis.

[djjamie]

Are murder charges going to be filed on lingluck for childerns deaths?

Yes. Protestors have filed murder charges against yingluck, tarit, adul and…one more (I forget who)?

Edited February 26, 2014 by djjamie

[djjamie]

They haven't convicted ANYONE for corruption or graft on the rice scheme yet.

I think even I as a non lawyer could defend her against this accusation. Is there one single proven complaint of corruption in the rice scheme nationwide?

So m'lord, there is no corruption.

Of course they haven't convicted anyone yet. No cases have gone through the court system yet and been judged.

It has been proved the DEM's have complained.

It has been proven Supa has complained.

It has been proven the IMF suggested restructuring the scheme due to corruption.

The list goes on.

As for proven corruption. There is ample evidence to suggest corruption and that is what the courts have to prove. It sounds like even if she is found guilty it won't matter. She will defy the courts due to no respect for the law. (Surprise surprise - A principle of democracy)

If there is anything else m'lord I suggest you refer to the below.

The Dems would complain about anything

she used the wrong toilet - file a complaint!

she used wrong brand of toothpaste - file a complaint

she went to a province - file a complaint!

they are a pathetic opposition who cannot get their act together to even fight an election!

ONly little things heay;

she oversaw a scheme that cost 770 billion off which 400 billion is suspected of going to corruption.

Refer to my picture.

Elections have nothing to do with this. We are talking about corruption.

DEMs are pathetic because the rice scheme is corrupt.

Refer to my picture.

DEM's are pathetic yet it will be yingluck defying a principle of democracy called "respect for the law"

Refer to my picture.

But yeah, PTP won an election so that makes it all OK.

Edited February 26, 2014 by djjamie

[virtualtraveller]

In order to show fairly to the country whether or not the scheme was proven to be corrupt in a significant way and whether she was aware of it, we need a trial, it may well vindicate her if her defence is good. The question is; has the NACC got sufficient grounds to indict? They have been investigating this for more than 2 years, not 21 days. We can't deny the scheme is controversial, causing great trouble and prone to numerous complaints and public revelations of corruption from people within the system. Once indicted Yingluck has to step aside to avoid influencing the trial. It's a serious case at the highest level of govt. Sure you can call it a 'judicial coup' but Peua Thai can just as easily nominate another leader who is free of any scandal while this plays out.

As to the red shirts, as always their actions defy logic. If they can't respect the due process of law then the law ceases to become a validation of the election of their govt. What if everyone urged civil disobedience of the election result, citing it as fraudulent from vote buying.

Let's hear Yingluck's defence in a court of law rather than via Facebook.

Only other thing to say is when is the NACC going to rule on a charges brought agains the Dem govt for corruption and are they sufficient enough to warrant an indictment. Problem with red-logic in these parallel cases is they seem to always compare apples with oranges. Courts are deemed unfair because they seem to always find real fault in Peau Thai's actions, while the Dems faults are debatable at best. Not saying the Dems are angels nor the courts entirely non-partisan but PT have a history of blatantly flouting the law, feeling that they should be above it when elected to govern.

[Mario2008]

3 posts removed.

The head of state is His Majesty the King, which we don't dicuss.

Lets convine the discussion to the government.

[ratcatcher]

In order to show fairly to the country whether or not the scheme was proven to be corrupt in a significant way and whether she was aware of it, we need a trial, it may well vindicate her if her defence is good. The question is; has the NACC got sufficient grounds to indict? They have been investigating this for more than 2 years, not 21 days. We can't deny the scheme is controversial, causing great trouble and prone to numerous complaints and public revelations of corruption from people within the system. Once indicted Yingluck has to step aside to avoid influencing the trial. It's a serious case at the highest level of govt. Sure you can call it a 'judicial coup' but Peua Thai can just as easily nominate another leader who is free of any scandal while this plays out.

As to the red shirts, as always their actions defy logic. If they can't respect the due process of law then the law ceases to become a validation of the election of their govt. What if everyone urged civil disobedience of the election result, citing it as fraudulent from vote buying.

Let's hear Yingluck's defence in a court of law rather than via Facebook.

Only other thing to say is when is the NACC going to rule on a charges brought agains the Dem govt for corruption and are they sufficient enough to warrant an indictment. Problem with red-logic in these parallel cases is they seem to always compare apples with oranges. Courts are deemed unfair because they seem to always find real fault in Peau Thai's actions, while the Dems faults are debatable at best. Not saying the Dems are angels nor the courts entirely non-partisan but PT have a history of blatantly flouting the law, feeling that they should be above it when elected to govern.

"....but Peua Thai can just as easily nominate another leader who is free of any scandal while this plays out."

A bit like looking for a needle in a haystack.

[fab4]

Will someone please point out to me just exactly where and when the UDD "urged Yingluck to defy the courts"?

Nowhere in this crappy article is there anything of substance. It's all supposition of the "journalist" and a few obvious statements. Nowhere is there any link or statement wrt this supposed statement from the UDD unless someone can tell me otherwise.

Of course, this is par for the course with The Nation, and sutheps sad followers lap it up.

[mca]

Will someone please point out to me just exactly where and when the UDD "urged Yingluck to defy the courts"?

Nowhere in this crappy article is there anything of substance. It's all supposition of the "journalist" and a few obvious statements. Nowhere is there any link or statement wrt this supposed statement from the UDD unless someone can tell me otherwise.

Have to agree this article is somewhat lacking in the who, what, when, where and why dept.

[aussieinthailand]

Can I ask all Suthep supporters to answer this openly and honestly,

If YL openly called on people to detain Suthep and his members and tell them to make arrangements for their wives and kids in case of trouble,

I wonder if he was tried in an international court would the outcome be the same? and how Suthep's supporters would react and complain?

as it stands at the moment the CC has decided in their wisdom that Suthep has done no wrong and no case to answer, &lt;deleted&gt;???

Ever heard of a Judicial coup?

[Brevity]

I don't think Yingluck needed the Red Shirts or anybody to advise her about ignoring the courts. The Shinawatras have shown very clearly that they have nothing but contempt for Thailand and its legal system. This country is nothing but a cash cow for that greedy family. It's only about money and egos for them.

[djjamie]

Will someone please point out to me just exactly where and when the UDD "urged Yingluck to defy the courts"?

Nowhere in this crappy article is there anything of substance. It's all supposition of the "journalist" and a few obvious statements. Nowhere is there any link or statement wrt this supposed statement from the UDD unless someone can tell me otherwise.

Of course, this is par for the course with The Nation, and sutheps sad followers lap it up.

The UDD said it.

http://thairedshirts.org/2014/02/25/udd-proposals-and-objectives-from-the-sounding-of-the-battle-drum-congress-in-korat/

4. The caretaker PM should not acknowledge the charge against her by the Office of the National Counter Corruption Commission because it was a double standard practiced

You should have stopped at "will someone point out to me just….."

The rest just makes you look silly now.

Edited February 26, 2014 by djjamie

[AleG]

Will someone please point out to me just exactly where and when the UDD "urged Yingluck to defy the courts"?

Nowhere in this crappy article is there anything of substance. It's all supposition of the "journalist" and a few obvious statements. Nowhere is there any link or statement wrt this supposed statement from the UDD unless someone can tell me otherwise.

Of course, this is par for the course with The Nation, and sutheps sad followers lap it up.

Happy to oblige:

At the rally stage of the red-shirt rally in Nakhon Rathasima under the theme “Beating the War Drum”, the ruling Pheu Thai party leader Charupong Ruangsuwan , the caretaker interior minister, and Nattawut Saikua, the caretaker deputy commerce minister, were seen addressing a few thousand of supporters, and announcing a 11-point demand for the caretaker government to implement.

They included no resignation in any case of caretaker prime minister, speedy payment to rice farmers, refusal to acknowledge the corruption charges to be brought against the caretaker prime minister by the National Anti Corruption Commission on the rice deal, civil disobedience of the caretaker government against all unfair independent organization

Of course now, being a man of impeccable intellectual honesty, you will apologize for comments like: this is par for the course with The Nation, and sutheps sad followers lap it up.

[tomyummer]

Yup. Who needs laws and courts in Thailand when anyone feels they can just break laws including lawmakers themselves? So easy for Thais to give up and give lip service as they please.

[Crushdepth]

They haven't convicted ANYONE for corruption or graft on the rice scheme yet.

I think even I as a non lawyer could defend her against this accusation. Is there one single proven complaint of corruption in the rice scheme nationwide?

So m'lord, there is no corruption.

She's charged with negligence, not corruption (although graft may follow). I don't think there's a lawyer on the planet that's going to be able save her from that.

[Crushdepth]

Ever heard of a Judicial coup?

Only in Thailand. I've always found that not breaking laws is a good way to stay out of jail.

[JRSoul]

They haven't convicted ANYONE for corruption or graft on the rice scheme yet.

I think even I as a non lawyer could defend her against this accusation. Is there one single proven complaint of corruption in the rice scheme nationwide?

So m'lord, there is no corruption.

Shut your eyes and it isn't there?

[Local Drunk]

Ever heard of a Judicial coup?

Only in Thailand. I've always found that not breaking laws is a good way to stay out of jail.

Got to agree with ya CD... I've only hear that expression here. In other countries it's called a balance of power.

[JRSoul]

Ever heard of a Judicial coup?

Yes, it is a red shirt expression for "Bugger, we got caught again!"

[fab4]

Will someone please point out to me just exactly where and when the UDD "urged Yingluck to defy the courts"?

Nowhere in this crappy article is there anything of substance. It's all supposition of the "journalist" and a few obvious statements. Nowhere is there any link or statement wrt this supposed statement from the UDD unless someone can tell me otherwise.

Of course, this is par for the course with The Nation, and sutheps sad followers lap it up.

The UDD said it.

http://thairedshirts.org/2014/02/25/udd-proposals-and-objectives-from-the-sounding-of-the-battle-drum-congress-in-korat/

4. The caretaker PM should not acknowledge the charge against her by the Office of the National Counter Corruption Commission because it was a double standard practiced

You should have stopped at "will someone point out to me just.."

The rest just makes you look silly now.

Thank you for providing that link. I stand corrected, I was wrong.

See, it is possible to admit being wrong with good grace. Something you appear not to acknowledge,

"the rest just makes you look silly"

Mmm, OK.

[tezzainoz]

You can hold your horses, guys. Thaksin's buddies haven't gotten out of bed yet and aren't ready to spread their verbal manure until later. Maybe they are only paid to debate in the afternoon...

I suppose it leads one to think that most of them are posting from the European or (at night) North American time zones. Funny little pattern they have for their posting times, ain't it?

I have noticed my self , those who are living in Thailand want a better country

and those that want to keep the fighting going do not

Just my calculations, I may be wrong

[chainarong]

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NongKhaiKid, on 26 Feb 2014 - 08:20, said:

Ignore the courts ?

Doesn't PTP have a track record of such ?

Unless it is inline with their thoughts, Nkk, It is okay, when they get questioned they don't like it , so much for them having a seat at the democratic reform council.

Edited February 26, 2014 by chainarong

[JRSoul]

Thank you for providing that link. I stand corrected, I was wrong.

See, it is possible to admit being wrong with good grace. Something you appear not to acknowledge,

"the rest just makes you look silly"

Mmm, OK.

You should cut and save that apology, it could save you a lot of time.

[djjamie]

Ever heard of a Judicial coup?

Only in Thailand. I've always found that not breaking laws is a good way to stay out of jail.

Imagine if the US public held the same twisted ideals as the UDD did.

Bill Clinton would have been a judicial coup as well.

If Richard Nixon didn't resign that too would have been a judicial coup.

Judicial coup = Unaccountability for your actions.

[djjamie]

Will someone please point out to me just exactly where and when the UDD "urged Yingluck to defy the courts"?

Nowhere in this crappy article is there anything of substance. It's all supposition of the "journalist" and a few obvious statements. Nowhere is there any link or statement wrt this supposed statement from the UDD unless someone can tell me otherwise.

Of course, this is par for the course with The Nation, and sutheps sad followers lap it up.

The UDD said it.

http://thairedshirts.org/2014/02/25/udd-proposals-and-objectives-from-the-sounding-of-the-battle-drum-congress-in-korat/

4. The caretaker PM should not acknowledge the charge against her by the Office of the National Counter Corruption Commission because it was a double standard practiced

You should have stopped at "will someone point out to me just.."

The rest just makes you look silly now.

Thank you for providing that link. I stand corrected, I was wrong.

See, it is possible to admit being wrong with good grace. Something you appear not to acknowledge,

"the rest just makes you look silly"

Mmm, OK.

Maybe keep that apology up your sleeve for next time.

[blaze]

Another thread, urging media reform, deserves to be re-read in light of this piece of crap 'journalism'.

I see NOWHERE in the article that someone - a person- with a name=- urged YL to defy the courts,

despite the headline and the allegation that the UDD urged her to do so. (Organizations don't urge- people do!)

Still, it serves to further demonize the enemy-- and that's what is needed if we are going to stand by our guns (literally).

Edited February 26, 2014 by blaze