Chicog Posted April 6, 2014 Share Posted April 6, 2014 P45 I agree but it will be an issue of contention if the NTSB is given the ball. Sent from my SM-N9005 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app Some will never be satisfied no matter what just as some will apparently believe that Chinese dumped a box full of parts and the boxes into the ocean if boxes are found off of Perrh. The world cannot reshape its principles and compromise important task because of the outliers who will never be satisfied. Agreed, but the AAIB will be seen as being more impartial and they are just as capable. Sent from my SM-N9005 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicog Posted April 6, 2014 Share Posted April 6, 2014 2 points. 1. NTSB is US Federal Agency. What is standard investigational procedure for international incidents like this one? Malaysian plane flying from KL to PRC nowhere near US air space. 2. Who would investigate if the plane had been an Illyushin for example? (1) Malaysia would have been responsible for lead in investigation, but did they not request assistance from NTSB and FAA or from other countries. Resources are just not there otherwise.(2). Are you making a funny. Russian aviation safety is not too good and they don't really do a great job investigating incidents in their own country. In short, they really don't care and good luck suing their airlines. You jest. The NTSB flew to Malaysia on Mar 8th. Almost SOP if it's an American-built aircraft and, as you say they are among the best in the world. Sent from my SM-N9005 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canman Posted April 6, 2014 Share Posted April 6, 2014 Fine. Who opens the black box and does the analysis IF they find it? By convention it should be malaysia. If a chinese registered vessel recovers it, no way will they turn it over to the malaysians until they have down loaded the data, any one who believes otherwise is fooling themselves. In reality if the US or Australia recover it they would be remiss in not doing the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P45Mustang Posted April 6, 2014 Share Posted April 6, 2014 Fine. Who opens the black box and does the analysis IF they find it? By convention it should be malaysia. If a chinese registered vessel recovers it, no way will they turn it over to the malaysians until they have down loaded the data, any one who believes otherwise is fooling themselves. In reality if the US or Australia recover it they would be remiss in not doing the same. Cheers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F430murci Posted April 6, 2014 Share Posted April 6, 2014 (edited) 2 points. 1. NTSB is US Federal Agency. What is standard investigational procedure for international incidents like this one? Malaysian plane flying from KL to PRC nowhere near US air space. 2. Who would investigate if the plane had been an Illyushin for example? (1) Malaysia would have been responsible for lead in investigation, but did they not request assistance from NTSB and FAA or from other countries. Resources are just not there otherwise.(2). Are you making a funny. Russian aviation safety is not too good and they don't really do a great job investigating incidents in their own country. In short, they really don't care and good luck suing their airlines. You jest. The NTSB flew to Malaysia on Mar 8th. Almost SOP if it's an American-built aircraft and, as you say they are among the best in the world.Sent from my SM-N9005 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app Flew 3 people from the NTSB to Malaysia. This is hardly a full invesgation team looking to take over and force everyone else out. Why is sending 3 NTSB reps bad? Why would you expect NTSB not to be concerned or want to look into matters when a US airliner goes down. They have the responsibility to make sure it does not happen again if it is a design defect. You imply NTSB will cover up real causes. Until Malaysian and Australian authoritiesstate the NTSB took over and kept them from imvestigating, criticizing the NTSB as covering up matters is unwarranted. This article appeared 17 days after your March 8 date. ---------- Three people are representing the NTSB in Kuala Lumpur . . . We really are deferring to Malaysians, he said. They (the Boeing team) would be providing their expertise to the Malaysians through the NTSB, which would be an accredited representative to this accident investigation. And will the NTSB team, and Boeing, move to Perth if any Flight 370 wreckage is found? That would be up to Malaysians. If they requested our expertise, its something we would consider, Knudson said. "Malaysians would need to request our assistance, and we would then coordinate with Boeing. Edited April 6, 2014 by F430murci Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicog Posted April 6, 2014 Share Posted April 6, 2014 What ARE you reading? Where did I say it was bad? Sent from my SM-N9005 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F430murci Posted April 6, 2014 Share Posted April 6, 2014 (edited) What ARE you reading? Where did I say it was bad? Sent from my SM-N9005 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app You said this: "But Boeing and the NTSB are in bed together, so the Malaysians will not necessarily want to hear the truth. The UK has no dog in this fight." ----------- And you said this: "The NTSB basically answers to Boeing, it is not the right team for the job. And please take your ridiculous jingoism elsewhere, it does not belong here." ---------- And then this: "Ridiculous theories? The NTSB is noted for bowing to lobbying and political pressure rather than doing its job. TWA800 is a prime example. As is the DC10 cargo door I mentioned earlier. The worst example is UA811. If you don't agree that, even if the NTSB did an impartial report, it would not be trusted, then I think perhaps you are a little biased." Edited April 6, 2014 by F430murci Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicog Posted April 6, 2014 Share Posted April 6, 2014 Yes I did. If you don't want Malaysia blaming the aircraft like the Egyptians did, you shouldn't let the NTSB carry the can. Why do you find that so hard to understand? Sent from my SM-N9005 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P45Mustang Posted April 6, 2014 Share Posted April 6, 2014 Yes I did. If you don't want Malaysia blaming the aircraft like the Egyptians did, you shouldn't let the NTSB carry the can. Why do you find that so hard to understand? Sent from my SM-N9005 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app You've lost me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicog Posted April 6, 2014 Share Posted April 6, 2014 Look up the reports on the EgyptAir pilot suicide. Sent from my SM-N9005 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F430murci Posted April 6, 2014 Share Posted April 6, 2014 (edited) Yes I did. If you don't want Malaysia blaming the aircraft like the Egyptians did, you shouldn't let the NTSB carry the can. Why do you find that so hard to understand? Sent from my SM-N9005 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app Can't argue with that logical . . ., but then again I have no idea what you are saying. As initial matter, I don't care if "aircraft" is blamed if there is a design defect . . . assuming you mean blame Boeing not the aircraft here. Edited April 6, 2014 by F430murci Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P45Mustang Posted April 6, 2014 Share Posted April 6, 2014 If the Malaysians have an axe to grind, better the NTSB open the box I would have thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicog Posted April 6, 2014 Share Posted April 6, 2014 But then Malaysia can throw around the same accusations the Egyptians did. Sent from my SM-N9005 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F430murci Posted April 6, 2014 Share Posted April 6, 2014 Yes I did. If you don't want Malaysia blaming the aircraft like the Egyptians did, you shouldn't let the NTSB carry the can. Why do you find that so hard to understand? Sent from my SM-N9005 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app So let me get this straight, Malaysia won't blame the "aircraft" if NTSB stays home and butts out of the investigation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P45Mustang Posted April 6, 2014 Share Posted April 6, 2014 State your position more clearly please Chicog 370. You are breaking up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicog Posted April 6, 2014 Share Posted April 6, 2014 They can't accuse the AAIB of being politically motivated can they? Sent from my SM-N9005 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P45Mustang Posted April 6, 2014 Share Posted April 6, 2014 Circle completed Chicog370. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicog Posted April 6, 2014 Share Posted April 6, 2014 Bear in mind I believe it's pilot suicide. Malaysia are sure to try what the Egyptians did in my book. Sent from my SM-N9005 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F430murci Posted April 6, 2014 Share Posted April 6, 2014 But then Malaysia can throw around the same accusations the Egyptians did. Sent from my SM-N9005 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app Kind of hard to get around that Allah reference that insane Egypt Air pilot blurted before disengaging auto pilot and diving plane into the ocean. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicog Posted April 6, 2014 Share Posted April 6, 2014 The Egyptians claimed it was a natural reaction to know a defective aircraft was doomed. Feasible if there was any evidence of a catastrophic failure... Sent from my SM-N9005 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P45Mustang Posted April 6, 2014 Share Posted April 6, 2014 Tell you what though. Pilot suicide may be the best 'verdict' for everybody in this. That includes Malaysia, PRC and Boeing. Win win win. Cos other verdicts could look very nasty and have BIG consequences. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicog Posted April 6, 2014 Share Posted April 6, 2014 Any sniff of a cover up would be bad I agree. There's enough talk of it now. Sent from my SM-N9005 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F430murci Posted April 6, 2014 Share Posted April 6, 2014 They can't accuse the AAIB of being politically motivated can they? Sent from my SM-N9005 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app Haha, now you shifted gears from NTSB is in bed with Boeing to Boeing needs another country to investigate so they won't get blamed. Malaysia can accuse anyone of anything. Whether anyone believed them is a different story. Regardless who investigates, there are going to be some that have their wild theories just like 911 conspiracy nutzos. This investigation appears to be heading toward a collaborative effort on the part of several countries. NTSB expertise may come in handy. The point of NTSB involvement is not to satisfy the nut jobs. NTSB is there to rule out design issues and make sure not happen again if a design flaw. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicog Posted April 6, 2014 Share Posted April 6, 2014 Yeah they have a great track record in that dept. (See above). Sent from my SM-N9005 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F430murci Posted April 6, 2014 Share Posted April 6, 2014 Tell you what though. Pilot suicide may be the best 'verdict' for everybody in this. That includes Malaysia, PRC and Boeing. Win win win. Cos other verdicts could look very nasty and have BIG consequences. Nope, bad for MAS, but insurance coverage would kick in. Good for Boeing. What does China have to do with liability issues? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canman Posted April 6, 2014 Share Posted April 6, 2014 They can't accuse the AAIB of being politically motivated can they? Sent from my SM-N9005 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app Haha, now you shifted gears from NTSB is in bed with Boeing to Boeing needs another country to investigate so they won't get blamed. Malaysia can accuse anyone of anything. Whether anyone believed them is a different story. Regardless who investigates, there are going to be some that have their wild theories just like 911 conspiracy nutzos. This investigation appears to be heading toward a collaborative effort on the part of several countries. NTSB expertise may come in handy. The point of NTSB involvement is not to satisfy the nut jobs. NTSB is there to rule out design issues and make sure not happen again if a design flaw. Not taking sides here guys but try and google NTSB charter. they don't seem to have a poicy statement other then: Maintaining our congressionally mandated independence and objectivity; Conducting objective, precise accident investigations and safety studies; Performing fair and objective airman and mariner certification appeals; Advocating and promoting safety recommendation; Assisting victims of transportation accidents and their families. The National Transportation Safety Board is an independent Federal agency charged by Congress with investigating every civil aviation accident the United States and significant accidents in other modes of transportation – railroad, highway, marine and pipeline. The NTSB determines the probable cause of the accidents and issues safety recommendations aimed at preventing future accidents. In addition, the NTSB carries out special studies concerning transportation safety and coordinates the resources of the Federal Government and other organizations to provide assistance to victims and their family members impacted by major transportation disasters. Read more about the NTSB in the 2013 to 2016 Strategic Plan http://www.ntsb.gov/about/index.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F430murci Posted April 6, 2014 Share Posted April 6, 2014 The Egyptians claimed it was a natural reaction to know a defective aircraft was doomed. Feasible if there was any evidence of a catastrophic failure... Sent from my SM-N9005 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app What is a natural reaction? Wait for shift change, state some Allah phrase, them disengage auto pilot and hit elevator to put plane in a dive during pilot change out? After putting in a dive, he say Allah phrase again. Natural if trying to kill self. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicog Posted April 6, 2014 Share Posted April 6, 2014 Notice that I said 'If'. You should stop trying to speed read. Sent from my SM-N9005 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3NUMBAS Posted April 6, 2014 Share Posted April 6, 2014 Australia's HMAS Ocean Shield has also reported a separate "acoustic event" some 345 miles (555km) away. But marine salvage expert Captain John Noble said the pings detected by the Australian vessel were not likely linked to the Chinese detection. "It's almost certain it cannot be the same source. They will be testing the reliability of the signals from the Australian ship and the Chinese ship," he said. Despite what could be the breakthrough in the search for the Malaysia Airlines jet, Professor Bellamy stressed pinpointing the black box and wreckage from the Boeing 777 could still take some time as the ocean floor is "mountainous". "The black box could be in a ravine or something like that which might cause refraction of the sound," he said. If the pings detected are an echo, the source could be located further away then what they think. "Things rebound, echoes happen under the water as they do in the air," Professor Bellamy said. https://uk.news.yahoo.com/mh370-pings-must-plane-black-box-100813619.html#L0IAQqz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P45Mustang Posted April 6, 2014 Share Posted April 6, 2014 Tell you what though. Pilot suicide may be the best 'verdict' for everybody in this. That includes Malaysia, PRC and Boeing. Win win win. Cos other verdicts could look very nasty and have BIG consequences. Nope, bad for MAS, but insurance coverage would kick in. Good for Boeing. What does China have to do with liability issues? Reduce speed F430. Think about some other possible 'verdicts'. Then. Think about the consequences of such 'verdicts' being made. No need to reply tonight. Goodnight F430. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.png.3b3332cc2256ad0edbc2fe9404feeef0.png)
Recommended Posts