Missing Malaysia Airlines jet carrying 239 triggers Southeast Asia search

[NanLaew]

Perhaps a solution for future disappearances ....

Rapid decompression or an exposive noise should trigger an external box containing flight data recordings to eject from the airplane, and immediately turn on (battery), emitting a location signal, time of ejection, elevation, wind direction. It should be small and light enough to decend without creating great damage, and deploy a parachute (when it reaches the lowest possible elevation that a parachute would still be effective).

This device should also contain a video recording of the cockpit...(remote camera).

Another idea....this data could be collected, and the device, as a drone, could detach, emit a signal of distress, and hone in on the nearest airport (eventually being externally controlled)

Far fetched? Maybe. But maybe could get things rolling in the right direction.

Good idea, parachutes are too unreliable though but it's not difficult to engineer a ball that can survive impact at terminal velocity and in using solid state data storage the internals could survive impact too.

This however could not be achieved with proven technology 5 years ago (they aren't going to use technology which hasn't been proven reliable on a plane) so don't expect this to be introduced any time soon.

I was also thinking... how much will be spent in man hours, fuel, logistics and investigation. It would certainly be more than development of such a device. Last idea.... make it float!!!

So, what you're suggesting is an airborne version of the emergency transponder bouy fitted to submarines, that is an awesome idea. The tech is basically available now, automatically deployable wings as per the range of cruise missiles available for the past 20+ years, self inflating bouyancy bags as developed for the Gemini program in the '60's, a medium range coded transponder similar to maritime EPIRBs. Yep, that could work a treat, and recess it into the belly behind the aft cargo space.

All very well but unless such life/time-saving gadgetry is federally mandated, the airlines will more likely be pondering reducing the Coach class seat pitch to 30" so that a few more <deleted> can be shoehorned into the additional seats.

BTW, it would be better located topsides near the tail where it would eject upwards and clear of the distressed aircraft, much like a pilots ejector seat. No point in burying a drone-like gadget in the bowels of the aircraft.

[Solditallandmovedhere]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

Some posters definitely need to wear their tinfoil hats more regularly....20 pages of speculation, random guesses and nonsense, yet not one scrap of actual valid and corroborated information.

Condolences to the victims, their families and friends. I hope that the families' agony is soon eased and they can find out the truth.

Tinfoil hats or not, something just doesn't gel. Since 9/11 all planes on international routes have upgraded their cockpit security but this plane just stopped sending any sort of signal. Doesn't that seem strange?

No beacon after the crash and supposedly off course. Nothing to see hear, move on and stop asking questions.

Do you know what doesn't gel? No one is talking about this: http://beforeitsnews.com/events/2014/03/malaysia-plane-crash-20-all-electric-car-linked-green-tech-passengers-on-board-names-released-2432738.html

[neverdie]

I believe the Austrian's passport was stolen 2 years ago, but as earlier noted the Malaysians refuse to use Interpol's database of stolen and forged passports when processing passengers. The Italian guy appeared on Oz TV this morning, flanked by two of Thailand's finest, laughing about the fact that his friends had contacted him via Facebook after seeing his name on the published passenger manifest. The BiB seemed to find it equally humorous that a passport stolen on Phuket would turn up in the hands of a potential terrorist in KL a short time later - I guess it makes a change from drug and people smugglers.

Saw that on Aussie T.V also. It appeared to just be a photo opportunity for the BIB, arms around him and the room full of BIB. They probably didn't give a &lt;deleted&gt; about him when he 1st reported his passport stolen back in August

Well Chooka,

You're probably right they couldn't give a &lt;deleted&gt; about yet another tourist losing or having his passport stolen, no doubt they see it dozens of times per week. I remember myself as,a young Plodda taking numerous reports of lost and stolen passport, we use to whack out on the old manual type writer and a pro forma form in triplicate or quadriplicate and then drop it into the D's tray and they'd come in and file it in a box, nobody gave much time to that we were busy dealing with Murders, fatals, violent assaults and robberies, I'm sure you know what I'm talking about and the old care factor was just not there. I don't know if the Police followed proper protocol for a stolen passport when it happened, but I hope they did and in any such case it didn't seem to make a difference. Sadly, Thailand has featured again and not in a good way.

Having said that, a lot of water has passed under the bridge and there should be one simple system that's used world wide at airports and should instantly pick up issues such as these.

Also, if it turns out to be something along the terrorist lines then either the terrorists looked like the Europeans or the person checking them in and through the various immigration points has failed to notice it's not the same person, I wonder why?

Perhaps the passports had been tampered with, I don't know but what a sad state of affairs. Even if this doesn't turn out to be terrorist related, this is still a serious issue, people riding internationally on stolen passports....&lt;deleted&gt;?

Surely in this day and age passports could be linked with eye retina technology or something like that. It always comes down to funding and whose going to pay.Anyway, perhaps something else happened here, I guess we won't know until everything is found and an extensive investigation is carried, even then there's no guarantees.

This is as serious as it gets, there's hundreds of thousands of people boarding 777 's every day any many more than that flying in total and answers need to be obtained so it can be established what the world may be facing with this.

Many families are suffering at this point and if this turns out to be related to this passport issue, it's a bloody disgrace and deeply troubling.

[DekDaeng]

Solution might be for 'civilised' countries to not accept flights / airlines that do not confirm passports are not listed as stolen / lost / missing.

[EyesWideOpen]

Perhaps a solution for future disappearances ....

Rapid decompression or an exposive noise should trigger an external box containing flight data recordings to eject from the airplane, and immediately turn on (battery), emitting a location signal, time of ejection, elevation, wind direction. It should be small and light enough to decend without creating great damage, and deploy a parachute (when it reaches the lowest possible elevation that a parachute would still be effective).

This device should also contain a video recording of the cockpit...(remote camera).

Another idea....this data could be collected, and the device, as a drone, could detach, emit a signal of distress, and hone in on the nearest airport (eventually being externally controlled)

Far fetched? Maybe. But maybe could get things rolling in the right direction.

Good idea, parachutes are too unreliable though but it's not difficult to engineer a ball that can survive impact at terminal velocity and in using solid state data storage the internals could survive impact too.

This however could not be achieved with proven technology 5 years ago (they aren't going to use technology which hasn't been proven reliable on a plane) so don't expect this to be introduced any time soon.

I was also thinking... how much will be spent in man hours, fuel, logistics and investigation. It would certainly be more than development of such a device. Last idea.... make it float!!!

So, what you're suggesting is an airborne version of the emergency transponder bouy fitted to submarines, that is an awesome idea. The tech is basically available now, automatically deployable wings as per the range of cruise missiles available for the past 20+ years, self inflating bouyancy bags as developed for the Gemini program in the '60's, a medium range coded transponder similar to maritime EPIRBs. Yep, that could work a treat, and recess it into the belly behind the aft cargo space.

I am somewhat astounded that aircraft do not use GPS tracking. Bus and trucking companies

use it in Thailand, so at the home office they can see exactly where all their vehicles are.

This is basic and extremely cheap tech. Has to be a bit embarrassing for Malaysian Airlines

to say they do not know where their 300 million dollar plane full of people is , when a simple

tracking device would show exactly where it was up to the point of catastrophic failure..

[Solditallandmovedhere]

Disintegrated? http://news.yahoo.com/missing-malaysian-jet-may-disintegrated-mid-air-source-002831393--sector.html

[Solditallandmovedhere]

U-turn? Something is not adding up! http://news.yahoo.com/why-malaysia-airlines-jet-might-disappeared-213133681.html

[Bung]

I flew out of the LCCT terminal in KL the night before this flight and along with the usual immigration checks they had army looking guys checking passports (quite thoroughly looking at my picture and then me) as well as scanners for carry on bags to pass before boarding. I had to re check my bags there and cleared immigration, they had finger print scanners at the immigration booth but I wasn't asked to use it. No photo taken either like the Thais do either.

[UP2013]

It would be very difficult to have left Malaysia without an entry stamp, secondly there was a risk of passport control checking the Interpol database (especially sans entry stamp).

[Tayida]

After all those days,no signal from Elt.Remember also in 2010 the india flight.

[phuketrichard]

on CNN there saying their expanding the search to the Andaman sea>

but wouldn't thai radar have detected the plane or Malaysian radar??

[chooka]

News reports that two men using the stolen passports were of "Asian" appearance.

http://www.smh.com.au/world/missing-malaysia-airlines-plane-what-happened-to-mh370-20140309-34fqa.html

Malaysia’s Home Minister Ahmad Zahid Hamidi said the passengers were of Asian appearance and criticised border officials for allowing them through security check-points.

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/world/fake-passports-on-malaysia-airlines-flight-reveal-flaw-in-airline-safety-20140310-hvgv0.html#ixzz2vWvuQK7R

[Solditallandmovedhere]

on CNN there saying their expanding the search to the Andaman sea>

but wouldn't thai radar have detected the plane or Malaysian radar??

Someone may have been nodding off or spending quality time with thier gig so admitting that it was caught by these radars may in fact not be in anyone's interest at all. Saving face!

[chooka]

It would be very difficult to have left Malaysia without an entry stamp, secondly there was a risk of passport control checking the Interpol database (especially sans entry stamp).

Malaysia’s Home Minister Ahmad Zahid Hamidi said the passengers were of Asian appearance and criticised border officials for allowing them through security check-points.

http://www.smh.com.a...l#ixzz2vWvuQK7R

[Tayida]

on CNN there saying their expanding the search to the Andaman sea>

but wouldn't thai radar have detected the plane or Malaysian radar??

Excatly and the 777 is equipped with a Kannad 406as,but have to be in armed position and manually set.Most of the new elt are satellitte connected and connect automatically.Does Malaysian Airlines knew about that?

[EyesWideOpen]

Here is the flight track. Looks like they can see exactly where the plane went down...

[atyclb]

@krisb - lighten up. I was responding to Crib's assertion that some of the claims here were straight out of Hollywood with an image of outback Australia that is similarly fanciful. The idea that the pilot could somehow have landed in Oz undetected is right up there with anything I've seen on the Bermuda Triangle, but the person who typed it obviously didn't think so. TV's lunatic fringe.

If you believe I take any joy in the fate of the passengers and crew on this flight, think again - 6 weeks from now, I get on an overnight flight to KL and have a connecting flight to Penang : I suspect that I have a much more immediate stake in KLIA authorities improving their security procedures than anyone else in this thread - happy to hear otherwise.

It's called black humor, and I'll leave it to the mods to decide if I've stepped over the mark.

Worldwide you managed to do it again, stuck your big size 12 right in it. Their is NO room for humour in any variety on this thread. Krisb +1. Incoming.

Anyhow, let's move foward. I'm flying to Bkk via KL in 2 weeks. Can't help but feel very nervous. My wife looks pale at the thought of it. Nearly flew with Malaysia but booked with Air Asia instead. Hearts pumping faster just thinking about it.

reportedly airasia has notified all non malay pilots of their termination as malaysians only will fly for them in the near future. airasia own a flight school and apparently graduating ample numbers. in the meanwhile the experienced pilots are asked to provide real inflight training to the new grads. there are stories of clipped wings etc etc as the newbies get their "crash course" no pun intended. it is not clear if the new malay pilots salaries will be lower than their experienced non malay pilots.

[atyclb]

The apparent lack of any radio signal or automatic transmission from the highly sophisticated plane make one wonder if an EMR device could cause such an event???

Could an EMR device in checked luggage or perhaps an EMR device externally that targeted the plane or was being tested have done this?

Any physicists or other qualified people that could reflect on this?

Edited March 10, 2014 by atyclb

[laolover88]

Guardian reporting Press Conference Live

" 5 Passengers checked in but did not board" I know this happens but 5 people?

[EyesWideOpen]

@krisb - lighten up. I was responding to Crib's assertion that some of the claims here were straight out of Hollywood with an image of outback Australia that is similarly fanciful. The idea that the pilot could somehow have landed in Oz undetected is right up there with anything I've seen on the Bermuda Triangle, but the person who typed it obviously didn't think so. TV's lunatic fringe.

If you believe I take any joy in the fate of the passengers and crew on this flight, think again - 6 weeks from now, I get on an overnight flight to KL and have a connecting flight to Penang : I suspect that I have a much more immediate stake in KLIA authorities improving their security procedures than anyone else in this thread - happy to hear otherwise.

It's called black humor, and I'll leave it to the mods to decide if I've stepped over the mark.

Worldwide you managed to do it again, stuck your big size 12 right in it. Their is NO room for humour in any variety on this thread. Krisb +1. Incoming.

Anyhow, let's move foward. I'm flying to Bkk via KL in 2 weeks. Can't help but feel very nervous. My wife looks pale at the thought of it. Nearly flew with Malaysia but booked with Air Asia instead. Hearts pumping faster just thinking about it.

reportedly airasia has notified all non malay pilots of their termination as malaysians only will fly for them in the near future. airasia own a flight school and apparently graduating ample numbers. in the meanwhile the experienced pilots are asked to provide real inflight training to the new grads. there are stories of clipped wings etc etc as the newbies get their "crash course" no pun intended. it is not clear if the new malay pilots salaries will be lower than their experienced non malay pilots.

Maybe I am a closet racist, or I have an irrational fear of the pilot in command being the idiot

third cousin of a company board director, or am overly spooked by the terrible piloting of the

Asiana pilots who crashed into the seawall at SF. But in any event I am always reassured

by the sound of a farang voice coming over the intercom prior to take off......

In the case of this incident, however, it seems that the pilot was very well regarded.

[RedNIvar]

@krisb - lighten up. I was responding to Crib's assertion that some of the claims here were straight out of Hollywood with an image of outback Australia that is similarly fanciful. The idea that the pilot could somehow have landed in Oz undetected is right up there with anything I've seen on the Bermuda Triangle, but the person who typed it obviously didn't think so. TV's lunatic fringe.

If you believe I take any joy in the fate of the passengers and crew on this flight, think again - 6 weeks from now, I get on an overnight flight to KL and have a connecting flight to Penang : I suspect that I have a much more immediate stake in KLIA authorities improving their security procedures than anyone else in this thread - happy to hear otherwise.

It's called black humor, and I'll leave it to the mods to decide if I've stepped over the mark.

Worldwide you managed to do it again, stuck your big size 12 right in it. Their is NO room for humour in any variety on this thread. Krisb +1. Incoming.

Anyhow, let's move foward. I'm flying to Bkk via KL in 2 weeks. Can't help but feel very nervous. My wife looks pale at the thought of it. Nearly flew with Malaysia but booked with Air Asia instead. Hearts pumping faster just thinking about it.

reportedly airasia has notified all non malay pilots of their termination as malaysians only will fly for them in the near future. airasia own a flight school and apparently graduating ample numbers. in the meanwhile the experienced pilots are asked to provide real inflight training to the new grads. there are stories of clipped wings etc etc as the newbies get their "crash course" no pun intended. it is not clear if the new malay pilots salaries will be lower than their experienced non malay pilots.

When you say Malay, do you mean Malaysian or Malaysians with Malay ethnicity? A person from Malaysia is Malaysian not Malay. FYI

[MrWorldwide]

Anyhow, let's move foward. I'm flying to Bkk via KL in 2 weeks. Can't help but feel very nervous. My wife looks pale at the thought of it. Nearly flew with Malaysia but booked with Air Asia instead. Hearts pumping faster just thinking about it.

I dont feel at all nervous - every time I climb into a plane I just accept that it's potentially a dangerous undertaking, but the statistics are still much better than road travel. As for changing airlines, I dont see how that's warranted - MAS has a good safety record in recent years and the 777 is still regarded by pilots as a very well designed aircraft. If there was a failure here, it would appear to be security at KLIA, not the way MAS operates its fleet. For a pilot with 18,000 flying hours to put an aircraft into the sea (again, speculation at this stage) with zero warning seems to support the theory that there was an explosion - hopefully we'll find out soon enough.

FWIW, AA seems to cop more flak on TV than any other airline in the region - that hasnt worried me in the past and it wont worry me in April when I get on the plane.

[MrWorldwide]

Any physicists or other qualified people that could reflect on this?

You're new here, aren't you ?

[Radar501]

As much as we all want to be optimistic about the outcome, is there anyone on this board who realistically thinks that the authorities are still conducting a search and rescue, and not a search and recovery?

[draftvader]

Anyhow, let's move foward. I'm flying to Bkk via KL in 2 weeks. Can't help but feel very nervous. My wife looks pale at the thought of it. Nearly flew with Malaysia but booked with Air Asia instead. Hearts pumping faster just thinking about it.

I dont feel at all nervous - every time I climb into a plane I just accept that it's potentially a dangerous undertaking, but the statistics are still much better than road travel. As for changing airlines, I dont see how that's warranted - MAS has a good safety record in recent years and the 777 is still regarded by pilots as a very well designed aircraft. If there was a failure here, it would appear to be security at KLIA, not the way MAS operates its fleet. For a pilot with 18,000 flying hours to put an aircraft into the sea (again, speculation at this stage) with zero warning seems to support the theory that there was an explosion - hopefully we'll find out soon enough.

FWIW, AA seems to cop more flak on TV than any other airline in the region - that hasnt worried me in the past and it wont worry me in April when I get on the plane.

In fact statistics will now point to MAS being FAR safer. Very simply put statistics (in particular ratios) are based on "x" per "y" number of repeats. The event has happened meaning that, statistically, MAS now has to fly "y" again to experience "x". Sadly statistics don't work like that BUT having just had a major event take place you can GUARANTEE that the engineering department is on overtime and people are doing their jobs properly just in case the finger gets pointed in that direction (the wing tip issue or other unknown engineering issue). A little bit of horses and gates but we all know the local servicing mentality of "if it ain't broke don't fix". This one is broken and now they'll be fixing all the others!!

[quagmirefg]

A few things about these suspicious unknown travelers should just jump right off the page.

Other than the Stolen Passports:

1. They bought One Way Tickets in Pattaya, Thailand on 6, March for a flight from Kuala Lumphur less than 24 hours prior to the scheduled flight departure at about 12:30 am 7, March. It is also been reported that 2 other Travelers on this ill fated flight bought tickets jointly, or at the same time in Pattaya with these 2 Suspicious Persons.

2. They did not buy tickets on Malaysian Airlines from Bangkok to Kuala Lumphur as part of their ticket itinerary. It is often the same price or cheaper to include the flight from BKK to KL when traveling on a Long Distance International journey to Europe, the US, and parts of Asia with MAL.

3. How did these "Suspicious Travelers" travel from Thailand to KL in such a short time if not booked on the connecting MAL flight from BKK.

And why would they pay more to travel another way other than fly MAL from BKK to KL with such a short time from ticketing to departure from KL ?

4. How did they get from Pattaya to KL in such a short period of time ?

5. Their ticketed layover in China to Europe is reported to have been 10 hours.

Why would anyone traveling such a long journey within a short time of ticketing book a flight with a 10 hour layover ? There are definitely different decent priced tickets available with a better routing and layover schedule. I agree, this is subjective, but a fact to look at. Most travelers would not opt for this routing schedule unless significantly cheaper than all alternatives.

There are a lot more questions to be answered about these "Suspicious Travelers". They could have been used by others to carry items onto the flight(s) or traveled for a variety of other improper purposes.

[sirchai]

Failed to board

Four passengers on flight 370 failed to board after checking in their luggage, which raised further suspicion about the passengers after the plane disappeared.

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/world/no-wreckage-of-malaysia-flight-mh370-found-says-airline-20140310-hvgs6.html#ixzz2vXElXuYr

So four passengers "failed" to board, while two boarded with other guy's passports. I'm wondering what's going on since two days.

Edited March 10, 2014 by sirchai

[orosee]

Agreed. Normally Muslim country nationals hand out terrorism on the international stage ,they

are generally not on the receiving end. There could possibly be an angle of Chinese terrorism

with the Uyghur separatists from the Xinjiang area.

It will be interesting to see what really happened to this plane. I personally think the wing failed that was involved in the accident two years earlier. Other than the idiotic Asiana Airlines flying the plane into the seawall at San Francisco, I believe this plane had a perfect safety record.......It is also my favorite plane to fly on.

Just read about the latest bombing of a marketplace in Iraq which killed many Muslims. As I suggested earlier, Muslims probably get 90% or more of "the receiving end" of Islamic terrorism, but we (Whites, non-muslims) ignore that for some dark reason. So your statement above confuses me, did I misread?

Would agree with the first part about Islamic terror being up top, now that IRA and ETA are mostly history.

[harrry]

Failed to board

Four passengers on flight 370 failed to board after checking in their luggage, which raised further suspicion about the passengers after the plane disappeared.

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/world/no-wreckage-of-malaysia-flight-mh370-found-says-airline-20140310-hvgs6.html#ixzz2vXElXuYr

Where in this link does it say anything about passengers failing to board?

[Tywais]

Failed to board

Four passengers on flight 370 failed to board after checking in their luggage, which raised further suspicion about the passengers after the plane disappeared.

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/world/no-wreckage-of-malaysia-flight-mh370-found-says-airline-20140310-hvgs6.html#ixzz2vXElXuYr

Where in this link does it say anything about passengers failing to board?

1/3 of the way down the page.

Failed to board

Four passengers on flight 370 failed to board after checking in their luggage, which raised further suspicion about the passengers after the plane disappeared.

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/world/no-wreckage-of-malaysia-flight-mh370-found-says-airline-20140310-hvgs6.html#ixzz2vXIDmkni