Passport theft prompts Thai rethink on new passport database

[borisloosebrain]

LOL Surapong - when the FM in Thailand gives a passport to person who is on the run it's no surprise that others might engage in such nefarious activities.

[JRSoul]

Possible. In fact. Maybe they all had valid visas for coming to Thailand and picked up and used the passport once in Malaysia.

No need for any fake visas. The Malays aren't going to look to find the exit stamp on a passport with many exit stamps. My current passport has maybe 40 exit stamps for thailand.

At the Sadao crossing Malaysian immigration look for a valid exit stamp with today's date. A couple of friends, well lubricated arrived at the Sadao crossing, stamped out to avoid overstay, and then decided to not go to Malaysia until the next day. They went back to their hotel, slept it off, and then tried to enter Malaysia the next day, but were sent back.

They then had to pay a substantial "fine" to get the date stamp altered or be charged with illegal entry.

BTW somebody had to use the passports to enter Malaysia or they would not be logged into the system when they tried to exit at the airport. EU citizens will get a Malaysian visa on arrival without any drama.

Edited March 10, 2014 by JRSoul

[Thai at Heart]

Possible. In fact. Maybe they all had valid visas for coming to Thailand and picked up and used the passport once in Malaysia.

No need for any fake visas. The Malays aren't going to look to find the exit stamp on a passport with many exit stamps. My current passport has maybe 40 exit stamps for thailand.

At the Sadao crossing Malaysian immigration look for a valid exit stamp with today's date. A couple of friends, well lubricated arrived at the Sadao crossing, stamped out to avoid overstay, and then decided to not go to Malaysia until the next day. They went back to their hotel, slept it off, and then tried to enter Malaysia the next day, but were sent back.

They then had to pay a substantial "fine" to get the date stamp altered or be charged with illegal entry.

BTW somebody had to use the passports to enter Malaysia or they would not be logged into the system when they tried to exit at the airport. EU citizens will get a Malaysian visa on arrival without any drama.

Leave thailand on any passport. Enter Malaysia on a European one. They could easily miss the exit stamps.

U are just a bloke entering Malaysia with a foreign european passport. They don't care from where you are coming. Immigration I. Thailand is basically bent it you have contacts.

People who can get hold of stolen passports with intent to do bad things can bribe people. A thai immigration officer wouldn't care why you want to exit. He just wants his wonga.

Anyway, it is possible this was something terrorist, but as yet no claim of responsibility. I'm not sure which is more worrying. Knowing nothing is not good for the travel business. Chinese to Malaysia and thailand are going to plummet.

What the hell happened?

Edited March 10, 2014 by Thai at Heart

[MAJIC]

National Security Council secretary-general Lt Gen Paradorn Pattanatabut said that more investigation will be conducted as it tarnished the country's image.

Saved the gist for the last sentence.

May be misinformed but verging on an oxymoron?

After the

"don't Thai me -Lie to me"

Welcome to the International home of Ladyboy scams,jetski scams,forged document scams,coups a veritable hub of dissimiltude with armed gangs unaccosted in the capital it is hard to imagine how one could lower the image any further.

They would really have to scrape the barrel.perhaps the chamber of commerce could orgainise an International showcase dragging police officers to their death across the globe.A wanted criminal too busy to attend murder charges,another in self imposed on the lam issued a new passport.

For anyone new to the land of lies a quick study of the rice pledge.flood scams the endangered wildlife the adulterated food the fake products,whoring ,fake goods fake degrees illegal casinos,airport mafias,and utter immunity impunity.

If I were to cite the almost endless list of igmony one of us would be dead before we could fit it all in.Fortunately such sordid behaviour is better concealed by old Etonians

I would agree with most of your post,except most Etonions are playing their own games and unfortunately Rubba,you would never in your wildest dreams gain acceptance,to the Eton debating society! You know very well,they don't like to discuss the truth,but how to manipulate the truth into control! for their own ends!

Edited March 10, 2014 by MAJIC

[tx22cb]

I have not seen an explanation of how those two men departed Thailand and arrived in Malaysia.

It was reported that there wasn't any record of their entry into Malaysia.

If that is correct, how were they able to clear immigration in Malaysia without an entry stamp?

Did they use other passports, perhaps their own to depart Thailand?

Were their tickets from KL or with a transfer from Bangkok?

Entry stamps are easy to counterfeit, or they may even entered Malasya with counterfeit Thai exit stamps.

It is much more complicated than a rubber stamp. There is the complication with Immigration recording entry and exit info on their computers. Also arrival and departure cards with a serial number. How did they exit Thailand? The passports were reported as stolen in Thailand so probably were on the Thai computer system. Malaysia doesn't have any record of entry, so how did they get in?

the tickets were bought less than 24 hrs before the flight departure time in pattaya ,i dont think they could have made the journey to kuala lumpar airport in a van ,more likely they flew there if the posted times are correct

either on the stolen passposts or their own ones

The tickets were bought in Pattaya, but they were printed off the web in Malaysia. You do not need physical tickets these days.

The whole point of the China Southern Airline tickets is that they were the cheapest tickets from KL to Europe. The passengers were not in Thailand. It makes no sense to buy the cheapest tickets from KL and then pay extra for the BKK-KL journey.

[digibum]

No Thai authority has any idea how to manage passport theft in Thailand...I doubt many reported thefts go further than the local cop shop.

As to follow up and investigation....never happens to my knowledge...I don't remember them ever returning a lost passport......until something such as the Malaysian plane mystery.....once the international agencies start to get involved, as they now have, then the back pedalling starts....simply smearing more egg on Thai faces!

Well considering the Passports were on the Interpol stolen list it's obvious that it does go further than the local cop shop

Thailand's Police/Government/Immigration are not at fault here as the Passports theft was on the Interpol database

But hey let's not let the facts get in the way of a good old bit of Thai Bashing

Ignoring the Thai bashing part, one needs a police report to obtain a replacement passport (if stolen). I believe that the issuing country would then inform Interpol that the passport has been stolen when issuing the new passport.

In other words, the fact that the passports were listed as stolen does not mean that the Thai police did the reporting. Perhaps they actually did report it but I don't think one can infer that because the passport was listed in the Inerpol database as stolen that it was reported by Thai authorities. The issuing nation has a greater interest and is probably the originator of the Interpol listing.

[digibum]

Thai authorities struggle to track thousands of lost or stolen passports each year

Lost my passport also once, had a hard time to convince the local police to make a report for me. So actually I was "struggling", I doubt the police report ever left that station. And I don't believe I am the only case.

I lost mine somewhere in Sukhumvit. Someone handed it in and the police went to great trouble to get it back to me. I was very, very impressed with their efforts. Getting a new passport is, not unreasonably, a major pain. The only time I have lost one in 50 years.

Lost mine in BKK once. I think it fell out of my pocket in a taxi.

Went to the Thai police station, reported it lost or stolen. They have a person there who fills out the form for you (since the police report is in Thai) and they charge you something like 200 or 300 baht for the translation services. Got a copy of my report, went to the embassy and applied for a new visa. When the visa was ready to pick up, went back and they handed me both the new passport and my invalidated lost passport. Someone had found it and turned it in. Almost wish I had waited another day or two before reporting it. Would have saved me the new passport fee plus the hassle of getting all of my visas re-issued.

[godden]

I once found a US passport on the side of a path in BKK (Bang Lampu)... I called the US Embassy with the info and offered to hand the passport in to the police....... the embassy pleaded with me not to, but rather hang on to it and give it to the embassy personally.......they hinted why....... but i won't say it here ........

An American friend had his PP stolen in Pattaya 3 yrs ago, reported theft to police, 3 days later had a call they had his PP, should have gone and collected pronto but went next morning to be greeted with no PP here' 3 months later received a call from the American embassy his PP was found being used to gain entry into Singapore

[Dogmatix]

Rethink on passport database? So what was the original thought? Just ignore the problem and not bother to even try to link in with Interpol's database?

Now there is a great excuse for allocating a massive budget to a simple job of providing Interpol's pre-existing content to immigration officers' terminals. Most of the budget will go to layers of consulting companies that are related to politicians and government officials and the system probably won't work properly.

There is probably not even any linkage the police's own reports of passports stolen in Thailand.

[DrTuner]

Immigration and IT .. talk about a blast from the past.

[Dogmatix]

Hotel make copies of passports, I have never had any hotel in Thailand hold my passport, maybe time to make it illegal for anyone to hold a passport as security.

Thai law requires you to have your passport with you at all times. So any Thai business that asks

to keep your passport as security is making you break the law , so they are a party to a crime...

Police are also party to the crime because they fail to prevent rental businesses from taking passports and also them to rent motor bikes to tourists without licences who have often never even ridden a motor bike before.

[Bkkbound]

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/mar/10/thailand-trade-fake-passports-crime-gangs-world

[Mario2008]

1 post removed as non-English.

[NeilSA1]

Thai authorities struggle to track thousands of lost or stolen passports each year

Lost my passport also once, had a hard time to convince the local police to make a report for me. So actually I was "struggling", I doubt the police report ever left that station. And I don't believe I am the only case.

I lost mine somewhere in Sukhumvit. Someone handed it in and the police went to great trouble to get it back to me. I was very, very impressed with their efforts. Getting a new passport is, not unreasonably, a major pain. The only time I have lost one in 50 years.

Lost mine in BKK once. I think it fell out of my pocket in a taxi.

Went to the Thai police station, reported it lost or stolen. They have a person there who fills out the form for you (since the police report is in Thai) and they charge you something like 200 or 300 baht for the translation services. Got a copy of my report, went to the embassy and applied for a new visa. When the visa was ready to pick up, went back and they handed me both the new passport and my invalidated lost passport. Someone had found it and turned it in. Almost wish I had waited another day or two before reporting it. Would have saved me the new passport fee plus the hassle of getting all of my visas re-issued.

Its a pity the authorities don't also look at amending their rules enforcing foreigners to carry their original passports with them at all time. I feel certain that this has also been a contributing reason for passport losses.

Edited March 11, 2014 by NeilSA1

[toooa]

So the general thesis seems to be that the 2 stolen passports are what bought the plane down? Oooooh let's all get on the "terrorism" bandwagon and have fantasies about masked terrorists with exploding dental fillings, all made possible by the magical acquisition of stolen passports....lets all lobby for beefed up security to keep us safe. Let me tell you something pendejos, you never have been safe. You get robbed and pushed about every day, and you believe it's to keep you safe, cause that's what you're told. Forget about the phantom of terrorism, that ain't the threat my friends, that's the decoy. You'd have to be pretty darn unlucky. Ok, could happen....small possibility....but the sparcity of empirical instances doesn't warrant such paranoia...not considering the stuff that goes on right in front of your faces.

[Thai at Heart]

So the general thesis seems to be that the 2 stolen passports are what bought the plane down? Oooooh let's all get on the "terrorism" bandwagon and have fantasies about masked terrorists with exploding dental fillings, all made possible by the magical acquisition of stolen passports....lets all lobby for beefed up security to keep us safe. Let me tell you something pendejos, you never have been safe. You get robbed and pushed about every day, and you believe it's to keep you safe, cause that's what you're told. Forget about the phantom of terrorism, that ain't the threat my friends, that's the decoy. You'd have to be pretty darn unlucky. Ok, could happen....small possibility....but the sparcity of empirical instances doesn't warrant such paranoia...not considering the stuff that goes on right in front of your faces.

Which then begs the question what on earth is the point in ANY type of immigration control whatsoever. Forget about being safe, why on earth do they even need to check me, or my family for anything? By being a good little boy it appears that I have in no way made it any easier for the authorities to catch or prevent anyone from impersonating anyone. So stuff it. Why bother to even try to comply?

[paz]

So the general thesis seems to be that the 2 stolen passports are what bought the plane down? Oooooh let's all get on the "terrorism" bandwagon and have fantasies about masked terrorists with exploding dental fillings, all made possible by the magical acquisition of stolen passports....lets all lobby for beefed up security to keep us safe. Let me tell you something pendejos, you never have been safe. You get robbed and pushed about every day, and you believe it's to keep you safe, cause that's what you're told. Forget about the phantom of terrorism, that ain't the threat my friends, that's the decoy. You'd have to be pretty darn unlucky. Ok, could happen....small possibility....but the sparcity of empirical instances doesn't warrant such paranoia...not considering the stuff that goes on right in front of your faces.

What is that, a short version of "all what you have been told is a lie" with a lick of Argentinean lingo for good effect?

The Interpol news conference, that is mainstream thinking at its best, is dismissing terrorism and passport stuff as related or causing the disappearing. But they what to exploit the occasion to get the "lazy countries" on the global database checking program..

So it seems to me, that your elaborate prose is nothing but barking up the wrong tree.

Edited March 11, 2014 by paz

[kingalfred]

So the general thesis seems to be that the 2 stolen passports are what bought the plane down? Oooooh let's all get on the "terrorism" bandwagon and have fantasies about masked terrorists with exploding dental fillings, all made possible by the magical acquisition of stolen passports....lets all lobby for beefed up security to keep us safe. Let me tell you something pendejos, you never have been safe. You get robbed and pushed about every day, and you believe it's to keep you safe, cause that's what you're told. Forget about the phantom of terrorism, that ain't the threat my friends, that's the decoy. You'd have to be pretty darn unlucky. Ok, could happen....small possibility....but the sparcity of empirical instances doesn't warrant such paranoia...not considering the stuff that goes on right in front of your faces.

knocked your dislike of conspiracy theories, now the airline are looking at possibility of personal or criminal events causing the airline to dissappear eg an insurance fraud

http://www.theguardian.com/world/blog/2014/mar/11/malaysia-airlines-mh370-search-refocused-on-malacca-straits-live-updates

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Edited March 11, 2014 by kingalfred

[toooa]

How does that make me wrong? I only suggested that the tone of the article and some replies suggested (between the lines), that the passport issue was of key importance by association with the mystery flight...which of course becomes a big security threat which then invokes the spectres of masked evil doers with fake passports. Maybe I extrapolated too far, but I do tire of the constant BS we all have to put up with and pay for in the name of security. To say everything you've been told is a lie, is maybe a tad too dramatic, but yes, there are lots of lies embedded in society. I'd rather say you're being misled on a pretty constant basis. Of course they want to exploit the lazy countries, the only antidote for not enough control is more control...and too much is never enough. Enough already.

Why should kids have to grow up in a bubble-wrapped 1984 world when most of the threats and violence come from those we beg for protection?

[toooa]

And I'm glad you enjoyed my prose....

[Theoutsider]

National Security Council secretary-general Lt Gen Paradorn Pattanatabut said that more investigation will be conducted as it tarnished the country's image.

Saved the gist for the last sentence.

May be misinformed but verging on an oxymoron?

After the

"don't Thai me -Lie to me"

Welcome to the International home of Ladyboy scams,jetski scams,forged document scams,coups a veritable hub of dissimiltude with armed gangs unaccosted in the capital it is hard to imagine how one could lower the image any further.

They would really have to scrape the barrel.perhaps the chamber of commerce could orgainise an International showcase dragging police officers to their death across the globe.A wanted criminal too busy to attend murder charges,another in self imposed on the lam issued a new passport.

For anyone new to the land of lies a quick study of the rice pledge.flood scams the endangered wildlife the adulterated food the fake products,whoring ,fake goods fake degrees illegal casinos,airport mafias,and utter immunity impunity.

If I were to cite the almost endless list of igmony one of us would be dead before we could fit it all in.Fortunately such sordid behaviour is better concealed by old Etonians

It's happening again.

It's happening again.

[lockman]

No Thai authority has any idea how to manage passport theft in Thailand...I doubt many reported thefts go further than the local cop shop.

As to follow up and investigation....never happens to my knowledge...I don't remember them ever returning a lost passport......until something such as the Malaysian plane mystery.....once the international agencies start to get involved, as they now have, then the back pedalling starts....simply smearing more egg on Thai faces!

Well considering the Passports were on the Interpol stolen list it's obvious that it does go further than the local cop shop

Thailand's Police/Government/Immigration are not at fault here as the Passports theft was on the Interpol database

But hey let's not let the facts get in the way of a good old bit of Thai Bashing

Ignoring the Thai bashing part, one needs a police report to obtain a replacement passport (if stolen). I believe that the issuing country would then inform Interpol that the passport has been stolen when issuing the new passport.

In other words, the fact that the passports were listed as stolen does not mean that the Thai police did the reporting. Perhaps they actually did report it but I don't think one can infer that because the passport was listed in the Inerpol database as stolen that it was reported by Thai authorities. The issuing nation has a greater interest and is probably the originator of the Interpol listing.

Don't really understand all the Thai bashing here as the passports WERE reported AND in the database as stolen. How about instead bashing all but 3 countries who actually check the database, USA, UK, and UAE. That's the actual problem.

[Thai at Heart]

No Thai authority has any idea how to manage passport theft in Thailand...I doubt many reported thefts go further than the local cop shop.

As to follow up and investigation....never happens to my knowledge...I don't remember them ever returning a lost passport......until something such as the Malaysian plane mystery.....once the international agencies start to get involved, as they now have, then the back pedalling starts....simply smearing more egg on Thai faces!

Well considering the Passports were on the Interpol stolen list it's obvious that it does go further than the local cop shop

Thailand's Police/Government/Immigration are not at fault here as the Passports theft was on the Interpol database

But hey let's not let the facts get in the way of a good old bit of Thai Bashing

Ignoring the Thai bashing part, one needs a police report to obtain a replacement passport (if stolen). I believe that the issuing country would then inform Interpol that the passport has been stolen when issuing the new passport.

In other words, the fact that the passports were listed as stolen does not mean that the Thai police did the reporting. Perhaps they actually did report it but I don't think one can infer that because the passport was listed in the Inerpol database as stolen that it was reported by Thai authorities. The issuing nation has a greater interest and is probably the originator of the Interpol listing.

Don't really understand all the Thai bashing here as the passports WERE reported AND in the database as stolen. How about instead bashing all but 3 countries who actually check the database, USA, UK, and UAE. That's the actual problem.

Do the Thais or the Embassy place the document into the Interpol database. Surely the embassies have to.

The Thais would be responsible for updating their immigration database and visas etc. That is probably where the issue comes to a head. Anyone know where the great warehouse of Bangkok storing all those TM numbers stands. I didn't leave Thailand for the last few years, but kept reknewing visas for work. I think NONE of that was logged into an immigration computer. TM cards get lost, and the list goes on. It strikes me, that instead of creating a ton of unecessary work by making people flit in and out of the country for nonsense overland visas, and hundreds of people sit around just to collect tons of paper for 90 day reports, they should first put some money into

a. Passport readers so that the info can't be keyed in manually. Typos alone mean that 20% of the entries are probably nonsense.

b. Rationaliseing the whole visa malarky for long term stayers.

c. Catching people who are long overstayed and conducting fraudulant stays.

Because what they have now is so easy to fraudulently jig and so customer unfriendly, it is a mess. Just imagine where all of that data for every nights stay in a hotel goes? I guess it doesn't flush very well. THe only thing its good for is AA paper.

Edited March 11, 2014 by Thai at Heart