A few language translations if anyone can help

[james24]

Ive been watching a few Thai films recently and there are some phrases I have heard but am unsure what they mean.

I have looked them up but can find them...

If anyone recognises any of these please help.

ong aeng

aeng

tao toh wee

nae bang ka

Clam clam

From Naresuan so might be old Thai

Sing chang,

gohn hang,

nor nuang,

pai ahm,

prachadipadai,

goh kwaer,

dang bow,

pa torp,

kor wah aeht.

If there is a chance anyone knows what these are in Northern Thai or/aswell that would be so great.

[siamtwin]

"Clam clam" = bearded clam

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

[AyG]

prachadipadai = pràˑ​chaaˑ​thípˑ​pàˑ​tay = democracy

sing chang = sǐŋ cháaŋ = lion elephant ?

gohn hang = khonhǎaŋ = hair of the tail

aeng = eeŋ = self;

[Mole]

King Naresuan contains a lot of old Thai phrases as well as so called "racha sap" which are royal vocabulary which you would normally never find anywhere nowadays. There are no northern Thai spoken in the Naresuan movies.

Also, the way you've transcribed the words makes it really difficult to even comprehend exactly what you mean, since they lack tone and is written not following any established convention such as RTGS and they may also be fragment of longer words.

The only one recognizably is as AyG (using his own phonetic transcription) pointed out, prachadipadai = democracy

Also there's no such thing as "lion elephant", so "sing chang" must be something else.

[AyG]

I agree that the transcription makes it nigh on impossible to recognise what the words might be.

Technically it's not my "own phonetic transcription" - it's the standard Mary Haas/AUA system which I used since I presume the OP doesn't read Thai.

I wouldn't be so quick to say there's no such thing as "lion elephant". Searching Google for "สิงห์ช้าง" (with quotes) brings back 17,000 results.

[AyG]

Just a second thought about "sing chang" could it be sɔ̌ɔŋ cháaŋ (two Royal elephants) which are referred to several times in Naresuan? The classifier for Royal elephants is cháaŋ not the more usual chʉ̂ak.

[Mole]

If you look at the result on "สิงห์ช้าง" you'll see that it's about สิงห์ ช้าง and สิงห์-ช้าง and nearly all the results are about Singha and Chang beer.

So, instead of just blindly looking at number of results in google, it may be a good idea to examine the results as well.

I happen to have the English subs as well as Thai subs for Naresuan 1 & 2 and there aren't actually so many instances of "elephant". (Sadly there's no subs for Naresuan 3 & 4)

In N.1 there's 5 and in N.2 there's only 2 instances of elephant.

Only one line in the English subs for N.1, is there mention of "two white elephants", but in the Thai subs, the word used is "เศวตกุญชรชาติช้าง". In the Thai subs (which I presume is a transcription of what is said in the movie), contrary to the English subs, there's actually no mention of the number of white elephants.

Only in N.1 there's a phrase which may remotely resemble "sing chang" เสียช้าง

This would assume that "chang" is actually "elephant" but it could be something else badly transcribed.

I presume OP would already have some elementary knowledge in Thai, so a simple word such as elephant ช้าง (chang) or เอง (aeng) I assume he's already familiar with.

For all we know, his transcription of "chang" may be anything:

ch = ช ฉ จ

a = อา แอ ออ

So with this in mind, it could be lots of Thai words.

For the record, this is the line in the English and Thai subs:

I once sent word requesting both friendship and two white elephants for my kingdom.

เดิมเรามีราชสาส์นเจริญทางไมตรีลงพระทัยว่าจะขอเศวตกุญชรชาติช้างเอาไว้ประดับกรุงหงสา

You can see just how complex the Thai is.

Edited March 25, 2014 by Mole

[james24]

Whoa just got that lol

Thanks guys, perhaps I heard some of the phrases wrong

However this has been really helpful.

What Im starting to notice is that alot of the words I dont know but sound familiar are actually Northern Thai words when I find out their meaning. Makes sense since I used to live up there.

Thanks again

[kriswillems]

deleted

Edited March 25, 2014 by kriswillems

[Aforek]

I agree that the transcription makes it nigh on impossible to recognise what the words might be.

Technically it's not my "own phonetic transcription" - it's the standard Mary Haas/AUA system which I used since I presume the OP doesn't read Thai.

I wouldn't be so quick to say there's no such thing as "lion elephant". Searching Google for "สิงห์ช้าง" (with quotes) brings back 17,000 results.

It shows again that nothing is better than the thai script: when I see something in thai, I know instantly the meaning ( or I look in my dictionary ) : phonetics is imprecise, depends of the locutor ear and of his nationality;

personally, I am not at ease with english phonetics, it's not my language, which has a very different phonetics .

please, learn how to write in thai, it's a so beautiful writing !

[AyG]

I agree that the transcription makes it nigh on impossible to recognise what the words might be.

Technically it's not my "own phonetic transcription" - it's the standard Mary Haas/AUA system which I used since I presume the OP doesn't read Thai.

I wouldn't be so quick to say there's no such thing as "lion elephant". Searching Google for "สิงห์ช้าง" (with quotes) brings back 17,000 results.

It shows again that nothing is better than the thai script: when I see something in thai, I know instantly the meaning ( or I look in my dictionary ) : phonetics is imprecise, depends of the locutor ear and of his nationality;

personally, I am not at ease with english phonetics, it's not my language, which has a very different phonetics .

please, learn how to write in thai, it's a so beautiful writing !

Actually, the Mary Haas system is better at representing Thai than the Thai alphabet since it doesn't have any irregularities. (You can't always know the correct pronunciation of a Thai word from its spelling in Thai.) Even phonemic spelling in Thai script isn't 100% accurate since it misrepresents the tone of unwritten sara a.

I'd also add that the Haas system can represent stressed/unstressed syllables (but nobody seems to do this). As far as I know, phonemic Thai doesn't have a way of representing this.

[Aforek]

I understand your point of view, as an english speaking man; but for, me, French, the " dictionnaire phonétique thaï-français " of Charles Degnau is much more accurate than your Mary Haas system . I am sorry, my ear is not English, but for me, anyway, thai script has no equivalent .

I know the differences between the thai script and the real pronouciation, but if you say that Mary Haas system is good, ok for english speaking students of thai language.

[AyG]

I understand your point of view, as an english speaking man; but for, me, French, the " dictionnaire phonétique thaï-français " of Charles Degnau is much more accurate than your Mary Haas system . I am sorry, my ear is not English, but for me, anyway, thai script has no equivalent .

I know the differences between the thai script and the real pronouciation, but if you say that Mary Haas system is good, ok for english speaking students of thai language.

The Haas system really has nothing to do with the English language or English pronunciation. It's based upon IPA - the International Phonetic Alphabet. Native English speakers still need to learn the symbols and the sounds associated with them. It would be just the same for a speaker of any language. English speakers don't pronounce c as จ, th as ท, or ph as ผ.

That said, I can see how the Degnau system would be easier for French speakers - particularly with the vowels. (It's also a lot easier to type.) There are similar English-based, non-technical systems (e.g. thailanguage website, Teach Yourself Thai) intended to make it easy and without the need for special characters, but they struggle because of the different ways different native English speakers pronounce different vowels, plus the absence from English of certain sounds. They also lack the logical simplicity of the Haas system.