Suthep insists no election until reform starts

[webfact]

Suthep insists no election until reform starts



BANGKOK: -- People’s Democratic Reform Committee (PDRC) secretary-general Suthep Thaugsuban declared last night that no new election is to be called again unless the caretaker prime minister steps down to allow the national reform to start.

Making clear of the PDRC’s stance to obstruct the new general election under the same environment in which nothing was changed and corruption and vote buying expected to become even more rampant, Suthep said “We will say no to new election unless these evil things would be removed and eradicated.”

He said the entire people will never accept such election held under the same environment which Pheu Thai dominates and controls.

He said election will be acceptable only when caretaker Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawtra steps down to pave the way for a new non-partisan prime minister to take control and form a new government and pave the way for reform.

After all these processes have finished, then election could then start, he said.

He said the PDRC would look to it that the election will be held under the clean and clear environment where the evil influence of the Thaksin regime has been eliminated from the country.

He again offered to negotiate with Ms Yingluck but that on a face-to-face meeting and must be televised live.

It must be between him and Yingluck and nobody else, Suthep said.

Mr Suthep also said that the PDRC planned what could be the biggest ever demonstration of the people on March 29 to show Ms Yingluck that the majority of the people do not want election unless reform takes place first.

If she or her caretaker government chose to stubbornly go ahead with the issuance of royal decree to hold general election, she will expect even more protest by the people, and this will bring the end to her regime faster, Suthep said.

Source: http://englishnews.thaipbs.or.th/suthep-insists-election-reform-starts/


-- Thai PBS 2014-03-26

[Snig27]

As one of Thailand's most notoriously corrupt politicians I guess he knows a thing or two about it.

[sweatalot]

As one of Thailand's most notoriously corrupt politicians I guess he knows a thing or two about it.

If this is true, than he will have a clue how to end corruption. It is not important what he did (or is blamed for) in the past.

What he does now is what counts.

BTW I think PTP, Yingluck and their cronies know at least much more

[Costas2008]

Is this woman deaf?

I know she is dumb, but she should be able to understand what is good for her country.

Step down, Yingluck.

Edited March 26, 2014 by Costas2008

[ThailandNoob]

"Mr Suthep also said that the PDRC planned what could be the biggest ever demonstration of the people on March 29 to show Ms Yingluck that the majority of the people do not want election unless reform takes place first."

If the majority of Thai people wanted to be ruled by a group pushing a yellow agenda, then wouldn't the simplest thing be to push for an election as soon as possible?

The fact that the "Democrats" are boycotting elections and that Suthep is trying to shut them down suggests to me that even they themselves know the majority of Thai people aren't on board with their plans to install dictatorship.

Sent from my IS11T using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Edited March 26, 2014 by ThailandNoob

[PREM-R]

Is this woman deaf?

I know she is dumb, but she should be able to understand what is good for her country.

Step down, Yingluck.

Step down so that the country can ben manipulated by "good people" for who knows how long without a firm date for elections? Who is going to be able to remove these 'good people' if they choose not to hold elections "when the time is right"? Be careful what you wish for Costas, my old potato

[Fat Haggis]

Is this woman deaf?

I know she is dumb, but she should be able to understand what is good for her country.

Step down, Yingluck.

You're another one who likes to throw around words like constitution, well under the constitution she can't step down, she has to be remain in position until after the new PM has been appointed THROUGH Elections.

Why would she step down because others want her to, it's like asking you to quit your TVF account and stop posting here

[h90]

As one of Thailand's most notoriously corrupt politicians I guess he knows a thing or two about it.

Where is any evidence, beside empty blabla from PTP (or their previous parties) for his corruption?

On the land reform, it is already clear that there is no trace of corruption.

I doubt that any politician in Thailand is free of corruption, so I am sure there is something with Suthep, but nothing was ever found so far and by now Thaksins layer surely check everything. That almost daily they go to court with some new charges about murder in 2010, but can't find a single case of corruption to bring to court says a lot.

[h90]

Is this woman deaf?

I know she is dumb, but she should be able to understand what is good for her country.

Step down, Yingluck.

Step down so that the country can ben manipulated by "good people" for who knows how long without a firm date for elections? Who is going to be able to remove these 'good people' if they choose not to hold elections "when the time is right"? Be careful what you wish for Costas, my old potato

12-14 month was the time frame.....If they wouldn't hold election they would get ousted like the Shinawatras. But if you have any better idea to reform Thailand, please tell. The Shinawatras are as far from being "good people" as you can find in Thailand and surely won't make any reforms to cut themself off the feeding trough.

[h90]

Is this woman deaf?

I know she is dumb, but she should be able to understand what is good for her country.

Step down, Yingluck.

You're another one who likes to throw around words like constitution, well under the constitution she can't step down, she has to be remain in position until after the new PM has been appointed THROUGH Elections.

Why would she step down because others want her to, it's like asking you to quit your TVF account and stop posting here

She broke already numerous other parts in the constitution. If you can't hold an election within the required time frame, she must step back. You can't be caretaker PM without election forever just because the constitution doesn't allow you to step back.

[patjem]

Is this woman deaf?

I know she is dumb, but she should be able to understand what is good for her country.

Step down, Yingluck.

You're another one who likes to throw around words like constitution, well under the constitution she can't step down, she has to be remain in position until after the new PM has been appointed THROUGH Elections.

Why would she step down because others want her to, it's like asking you to quit your TVF account and stop posting here

According to PTP's own interpretation (agenda/ rhetoric) only. Where does it state that in the Constitution ? didn't the CC or EC already confirm that stepping down is a legitimate option?

Likewise, on your second point, I could give up my TVF account, and there would be no legal issue in me doing so, so if your attempt at comparison makes any sense at all, then you would mean YL could also step down..... the point is, that she will cling on regardless, anyway.

[Robby nz]

Would appear to be a softening of the stance.

Reform must START before an election.

Exactly correct and it must be electoral reform that take place before an election, everything else can come after.

However electoral reforms can never be done by politicians for there is to much vested interest.

True electoral reforms must start with eligibility to stand for both parliament and the senate and include cabinet positions.

The idea being to keep politicians as clean as possible starting with "No person who has been convicted of a criminal offense can stand"

"Anyone who is waiting (whether or on bail or not) for a criminal charge to be heard against them shall be suspended from standing"

Should they be found not guilty the suspension is lifted.

"No one has ever been banned from politics can stand."

That would eliminate most of the ones we have now.

Also hefty jail terms for vote buying, rigging or intimidation of voters.

[Fat Haggis]

Is this woman deaf?

I know she is dumb, but she should be able to understand what is good for her country.

Step down, Yingluck.

Step down so that the country can ben manipulated by "good people" for who knows how long without a firm date for elections? Who is going to be able to remove these 'good people' if they choose not to hold elections "when the time is right"? Be careful what you wish for Costas, my old potato

12-14 month was the time frame.....If they wouldn't hold election they would get ousted like the Shinawatras. But if you have any better idea to reform Thailand, please tell. The Shinawatras are as far from being "good people" as you can find in Thailand and surely won't make any reforms to cut themself off the feeding trough.

I don't particularly care for the woman, I'd much prefer is she was replaced by the electorate, and not through a judicial or Military Coup.

There have been other suggestions, hold a referendum and let the people, not the minority but the majority decide if they'll accept the reforms first, Suthep is as stubborn as they come, as to whether he's right or not that's down to time, as to whether he'll be revered as a National Hero ( I highly doubt the Issan people would ever look upon him as such) that's again open to debate, but the truth is, many of his initial followers are sick of it all now, they've not progressed, sure they've had some forums, but stop pushing forwards ideals that are unacceptable to the majority, the PDRC movement has also dwindled, same as the support for the PTP/UDD so put it to the vote, it really doesn't get any simpler.

Let the elections run, stop acting like a spoilt child, give the current administration, IF they win, the same 12-14 months in which the reforms you so desire have to happen, or they're out on their ass.. yes, we all know they didn't do a great job, in fact it was abysmal, but they have no choice now, let the public determine who should run the country, who ever it is has 12 months to get their act together.. simple, and if they fail, then the Military step in, and have 6 months control, so that the future ruling party can have everything in place..

[stickyrice2000]

The only way for her to step down is by election. I don't want Suthep to think he has the will to place anyone he wants to run the country. I want to see the people voting that individual in the office.

[sweatalot]

"Mr Suthep also said that the PDRC planned what could be the biggest ever demonstration of the people on March 29 to show Ms Yingluck that the majority of the people do not want election unless reform takes place first."

If the majority of Thai people wanted to be ruled by a group pushing a yellow agenda, then wouldn't the simplest thing be to push for an election as soon as possible?

The fact that the "Democrats" are boycotting elections and that Suthep is trying to shut them down suggests to me that even they themselves know the majority of Thai people aren't on board with their plans to install dictatorship.

Sent from my IS11T using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

"install dictatorship"? (ridiculous)

proof?

and what is a yellow agenda?

[Fat Haggis]

Is this woman deaf?

I know she is dumb, but she should be able to understand what is good for her country.

Step down, Yingluck.

You're another one who likes to throw around words like constitution, well under the constitution she can't step down, she has to be remain in position until after the new PM has been appointed THROUGH Elections.

Why would she step down because others want her to, it's like asking you to quit your TVF account and stop posting here

She broke already numerous other parts in the constitution. If you can't hold an election within the required time frame, she must step back. You can't be caretaker PM without election forever just because the constitution doesn't allow you to step back.

I will be totally honest, I know NOTHING of the constitution, it's one of these documents that is open to interpretation as to how you read it, based on all the constitutional "experts" here..

So she failed to hold the elections within the 60 days, but the EC themselves said they were not prepared and they advised it was too soon? Surely they're both in breach of the constitution? ( think she was actually 4 days over the 60 days??)

Seems to be that everyone, including the protesters broke the same constitution by blocking the votes, and intimidating those who desired to vote..

It is very apparent that the very constitution has been blatantly disregarded by all parties, and do what they want.. I'd go as far as saying that the first reform would be sweeping changes to that very constitution would you not agree?

Suthep and Yingluck keep telling everyone it's about the people, well let the people decide, that's everyone that has a vote and a voice, let them decide.

[DirtFarmer]

"If she or her caretaker government chose to stubbornly go ahead with the issuance of royal decree to hold general election, she will expect even more protest by the people, and this will bring the end to her regime faster," Suthep said.

faster than what...? All your failed deadlines ..for toppling her..?...

Suthep you have already created the single worst precedent ever... you have showed every Thai that their opinion and/or vote means nothing.as long as you can muster the back room deals required to manage a judicial/non-military coup...and any Tom Dick and Harry can now follow your blueprint to anarchy and as others have said "hold the Thai people hostage" till they grow tired of the fight and acquiesce...which is your end game... that blueprint works both ways...or does it...? Perhaps you have guarantees that it only works for you.....uber Democracy ..eh? ...you are counting on the fact that memories are short and that the people do not have the stomach for the long haul...... I do believe you will see there are some who will not fade away from your gauntlet... this does not bode well for Thailand be they your supporters or anyone else's supporters.. Hen-gaa-tua...very very selfish to continue to propagate such destructive policies...very very sad......and to think you have the right to demand anything is truly unbelievable

[Dogmatix]

If she or her caretaker government chose to stubbornly go ahead with the issuance of royal decree to hold general election, she will expect even more protest by the people...

And Friday's Constitutional Court decision appears to mean that it is probably now only necessary to prevent candidate registration in one constituency, rather than 26+, as previously believed by the PDRC. Failure to have candidates in one or more constituencies is likely to result in the EC postponing elections and repeating candidate registrations across the entire country, rather than wasting time and money on elections that will be annulled because they cannot take place all on one day.

[harada]

Sorry I've been out of touch for a couple of weeks,is another PDRC picnic to be held on 29/3, I'll dust off my Kevlar vest.

[Fat Haggis]

He said the entire people will never accept such election held under the same environment which Pheu Thai dominates and controls.

How the <deleted> would he know this when he's doing all he can to stop them from voting?

He doesn't speak for the entire people, as he's silenced their rights to either agree, or disagree with this comment!!!

[Tywais]

The only way for her to step down is by election.

Not the only way, the courts may have a say about it in the near future.

[WhizBang]

<snip> it's like asking you to quit your TVF account and stop posting here

For many, that would actually be a good idea.

[Scamper]

Suthep is right in that a new election would simply cement things as they are, with Thaksin's grip firmly in place, unchanged, undeterred, and with reform being quickly discarded, as before. Everybody knows that. Thaksin knows that too, which is why he wants it. With a new election, nothing changes. Except that in power, Thaksin would be then free to pursue all the things he pursued in the last two and a half years - changes in the charter that benefit him, including an amnesty, as well as an opportunity to really clamp down on the independent agencies, which Pheu Thai have consistently wanted to do. So not only would a new election enable Thaksin's grip to remain exactly the same, but in fact it would be a whole lot worse, because Pheu Thai, Thaksin, and the UDD would set their sights on focusing their attention on the " reform " - as they see it - of the system of the legal checks and balances.

The efforts to cool this crisis have so far not worked. The idea of a televised debate between Yingluck and Suthep is a very positive step, and would likely be positively received nationally. Pheu Thai will reject it. Abhisit's " middle road " solution - a referendum that gives the green light to reform discussions before an election - is the clear solution, that ought to be embraced by all. It remains the key proposition that actually brings the two sides together and would also defuse the crisis peacefully as well as set a path forward. Yet Thaksin will certainly reject it. Because it threatens him. He is not interested in reform. He never was.

So the ensuing stalemate continues. But the courts are proceeding, as they should. The NACC will likely deliver a ruling next month. The law will ultimately be the vehicle for the path forward. As it should.

Edited March 26, 2014 by Scamper

[DirtFarmer]

" Abhisit's " middle road " solution - a referendum that gives the green light to reform discussions before an election - is the clear solution, that ought to be embraced by all. It remains the key proposition that actually brings the two sides together and would also defuse the crisis peacefully as well as set a path forward. "

Talk shcmaock! Reforms here will take years if not decades....have no idea how one cannot see that... we are not talking about bringing the dog in and putting the cat out... we are talking about reforms in every aspect of social structure hierarchy et al.. With the misers holding on to the old ways for dear life and until they no longer are beings... ...sure the court may rule... but it will not be the beginning of reform...it will usher out one party and bring another group into the same trough...get a clue...this is a decades long reform that is necessary... no simplistic three paragraph summation is gonna dispatch it

Edited March 26, 2014 by DirtFarmer

[Thailand]

Yet again he is threatening intimidation, insurrection etc. He is a very dangerous man continually getting away it with thanks to his overlords..

Reform sure, but after elections which are now essential to stabilise the country.

Each party can campaign including a stone cold promise to include reform within a certain period as part of their manifesto. Both of the main parties have had the chance in the past neither has taken it. Yes of course it's only words but it is now very important and whoever wins the election would ignore it at their peril.

What else they put in their manifestos it is up to them and then sell it to the people, let them choose.

Free unhindered elections and may the best team win.

[Local Drunk]

Yet again he is threatening intimidation, insurrection etc. He is a very dangerous man continually getting away it with thanks to his overlords..

Reform sure, but after elections which are now essential to stabilise the country.

Each party can campaign including a stone cold promise to include reform within a certain period as part of their manifesto. Both of the main parties have had the chance in the past neither has taken it. Yes of course it's only words but it is now very important and whoever wins the election would ignore it at their peril.

What else they put in their manifestos it is up to them and then sell it to the people, let them choose.

Free unhindered elections and may the best team win.

That won't change anything.

Edited March 26, 2014 by Local Drunk

[kriswillems]

This guy is full of contradictions.

- If the majority of the people is with him he should join the elections and win them. It's as easy as that.

- He doesn't want to join the elections, because within the current constitution he can never win.

He want to reform the constitution in such a way that only he can win the elections.

In his system not every vote will have the same weight. People of the North and Isaan will have to loose the biggest part of their political right.

That's why this reform has to be done without holding elections : people would not approve it.

- Further on he sees himself as the big leader of the reform. He opposes all ideas of a neutral person leading the country. Why? He want to be the leader.

- He refuses to appear before court (on murder charges), yet he uses the court when it serve him.

- He blames the government for corruption, but he was one of the most corrupted politicians in Thai history. In 1995 he had to go to court for corruption, so he planned to organize a march to/in BKK. New election were held and corruption charges were dropped. Now he's to go to court for murder, and again he's having his march in BKK.

- He calls his group democratic, yet refuses to use any of the democratic tools available to organize his reform.

- He blames the government for not paying the rice farmers as promised (and even said he would pay them when he'll become the new great leader), yet he does everything to make sure the government can not borrow the money to make these payments.

- He claims protests are without violence, yet time after time people get beaten up during his protests. He prevents elections by using violence - you risk to get beaten up when you go to vote. And his unarmed guards are more than once caught carrying weapons. Further on he occupied the main police office of the country.

- He blames that the Taksin family used politics to increase their family fortune, yet he's a milti-millionaire himself and his family members has been involved in many corruption cases.

Edited March 26, 2014 by kriswillems

[climbertrev1]

Is this woman deaf?

I know she is dumb, but she should be able to understand what is good for her country.

Step down, Yingluck.

Suthep and his friends in the Democratic party could have contested the election and when they won, Yingluck would have been history.

Of course they would have had to have gained a majority like Yingluck did in 2010. The reason Suthep and Abahsit didn't contest the election is they know that they cannot gain a majority and a mandate to rule through democratic means. The Democratic party should rename it'self something along the lines of the UPR (Unreformed Nepotists and proud.)

Dumb or not the people have the right to choose. Respect the peoples vote.

[ThailandNoob]

"Mr Suthep also said that the PDRC planned what could be the biggest ever demonstration of the people on March 29 to show Ms Yingluck that the majority of the people do not want election unless reform takes place first."

If the majority of Thai people wanted to be ruled by a group pushing a yellow agenda, then wouldn't the simplest thing be to push for an election as soon as possible?

The fact that the "Democrats" are boycotting elections and that Suthep is trying to shut them down suggests to me that even they themselves know the majority of Thai people aren't on board with their plans to install dictatorship.

Sent from my IS11T using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

"install dictatorship"? (ridiculous)

proof?

and what is a yellow agenda?

Suthep himself has said I don't know how many times that he would never accept elections until Thailand is free from all Shinawatra influence. This will never be in our lifetimes becuase it will take longer than that for people in the North and NE to lose their loyalty to them.

If that isn't enough for you, let's look at their track record of the yellows (call them what you will, PAD, Pitak Siam, PDRC, the names change but it's the same bloc of people thinking the same things). First they launched a military coup, and only gave power back with a half appointed senate. And I would argue that they never believed that a pro Thaksin party would win another election, and therefore doubt that they will ever willingly give power back to an electorate that they now know will vote in a pro Red government. A certain beer heiress has admitted as much herself.

Then they launched a judicial coup to oust the Prime Minister for appearing on a cooking show (hardly the height of skullduggery).

In 2010 Abhisit claimed that he would hold elections (if he had actually cared about democracy, he would have held them the previous year to legitimise his mandate), in a ruse to get the Red Shirts to go home. When they called asked him to prove his sincerity by taking steps to do this, he showed that it was all a lie from the start, sent in the troops and then claimed that "tensions were too high to have an election" (when elections were the one thing that would have calmed the situation down).

After this time I stopped speaking to the yellow Hi So types that I had previously thought of as friends. But even then they were privately saying things like "democracy is not appropriate for Thailand because people here are too stupid to vote for the right person". Now many people at the demonstrations are publicly saying the same thing. I remember one being quoted in a newspaper as saying "I'm not really for democracy, what I want is a kind of dictatorship".

Further evidence for their contempt for democracy can be seen from their recent poll boycotts, not to mention their violent disruptions of the election.

Contempt for democracy implies a desire for dictatorship. This is what the "yellow agenda" is.

Sent from my IS11T using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[ThailandNoob]

Is this woman deaf?

I know she is dumb, but she should be able to understand what is good for her country.

Step down, Yingluck.

Step down so that the country can ben manipulated by "good people" for who knows how long without a firm date for elections? Who is going to be able to remove these 'good people' if they choose not to hold elections "when the time is right"? Be careful what you wish for Costas, my old potato

12-14 month was the time frame.....If they wouldn't hold election they would get ousted like the Shinawatras. But if you have any better idea to reform Thailand, please tell. The Shinawatras are as far from being "good people" as you can find in Thailand and surely won't make any reforms to cut themself off the feeding trough.

If they don't hold an election then what is stopping them from using the army to stay in power?

Sent from my IS11T using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app