Pheu Thai Party urges Democrat Party to enter the election

[webfact]

Pheu Thai Party urges Democrat Party to enter the election



BANGKOK, 8 April 2014 (NNT) – The Pheu Thai Party has urged the Democrat Party to enter the new round of the general election should the latter is sincere about solving the ongoing political turmoil as it claims.

The comment was made by Mr. Noppadon Pattama, legal adviser of former Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra. Mr. Noppadon implored the Democrat Party and Secretary General of the People’s Democratic Reform Committee (PDRC) Suthep Thaugsuban to participate in the upcoming national poll.

The lawyer quoted Democrat Party Leader Abhisit Vejjajiva’s speech given during the party’s recent 68th anniversary that the oldest political party is ready to be a part of the solution to the current political deadlock. Mr. Noppadon said if the party intends to be true to its words, it should support and enter the race, not boycotting it.

Pheu Thai’s legal adviser also expressed his disagreement with the PDRC’s protesting approach, blaming the group is creating rifts and hatred among Thais by advocating people to go against the opposite side.

Meanwhile, Pheu Thai Spokesperson Prompong Nopparit echoed Mr. Noppadon, speculating that the Democrat Party avoids the election in order to evade a defeat. He also urged Mr. Abhisit to show his support to the election if the latter is sincere about mending the prolonged political crisis.


-- NNT 2014-04-08

[WoopyDoo]

The democrats have already declared that they will run again as long as their are at a minimum 'electoral reforms' before the ballot.

They have no desire to run in an undemocratic election like the last several.

What part of that do PTP not understand?

Of course PT want elections, they know that in 80% of the country, the Dems are no allowed to campaign for fear of being shot dead by PT's red shirt terrorist unit. Along with all the voter intimidation (and yes it exists), and buying off village chiefs to force their villagers to vote Thaksin.

If I was leader of the Dems, I would refuse as well, and in every civilized democracy, all parties would also refuse if one party was producing elections like this for the rest of their competition.

FREE AND FAIR.... OR NOT AT ALL!!!!!!!!!

[bigbamboo]

The Dems have made their point and exposed the PT for what they are. Open support for Suthep is waning but that is even more the case with the redshirts. Now it's up to the people to decide.

PT say they want the Dems to take part but in a contest you should always do what your opponent least wants you to do. So should the Dems decline PT's wishes or is it all a double bluff?

IMO despite the fact that Suthep's megalomania is almost reaching Thaksin proportions the election will be a lot closer than many on here think.

[fab4]

The democrats have already declared that they will run again as long as their are at a minimum 'electoral reforms' before the ballot.

They have no desire to run in an undemocratic election like the last several.

What part of that do PTP not understand?

Of course PT want elections, they know that in 80% of the country, the Dems are no allowed to campaign for fear of being shot dead by PT's red shirt terrorist unit. Along with all the voter intimidation (and yes it exists), and buying off village chiefs to force their villagers to vote Thaksin.

If I was leader of the Dems, I would refuse as well, and in every civilized democracy, all parties would also refuse if one party was producing elections like this for the rest of their competition.

FREE AND FAIR.... OR NOT AT ALL!!!!!!!!!

More hyperbole. ANFREL found that the 2011 Election was free and fair and the only thing not free and fair about the February 2nd Election was suthep and his goons disrupting it. abhisit was just trotting out the usual excuse for the dems being unelectable.

A point of interest, the last political person to be shot dead was a PTP official who was shot dead by the democrat MP Khanchit Thabsuwan in 2012. Of course, the murderer is on bail.

[than]

Thai people urged PT to obey of the rule of law, to accept courts ruling, and accept fair and free election............................

[antimedia]

Please, please, please my good friends the Democrats. If you don't let us win another corrupt election the world will find out how we screwed Thailand and it's people, we will loose face and Thais should not let that happen to one another. And what about our bank balances you forgot about that, many have already been promised their cut of the 2 trillion plus. Don't worry about the people they will get over it; what has it got to do with them anyway. Both sides of politics have been screwing them for years, keeping them uneducated, poor and uniformed so we have it all. Tell you what we will promise to give you a higher share of the spoils or even contemplate a term of government in the future if you agree. Come on be good sports, just drop Suthep in it and come back on side.

Edited April 8, 2014 by antimedia

[marcusd]

Just go back to the KING. get rid of these parties as no,one in,this country has enough education or even really cares. Unless there is a spare 2000baht in it...

And then with no,political,parties ripping out 60% of everything, the country might see something better.

It seems there is no real democracy here and an absolute monarchy as they had in the past and seem to still adore is the next best thing to get rid of the many evils

Marcusd. Via tapatalk

Edited April 8, 2014 by marcusd

[winstonc]

Please, please, please my good friends the Democrats. If you don't let us win another corrupt election the world will find out how we screwed Thailand and it's people, we will loose face and Thais should not let that happen to one another. And what about our bank balances you forgot about that, many have already been promised their cut of the 2 trillion plus. Don't worry about the people they will get over it, any way what has it got to do with them anyway. Both sides of politics have been screwing them for years, keeping them uneducated, poor and uniformed so we have it all. Tell you what we will promise to give you a higher share of the spoils or even contemplate a term of government in the future if you agree. Come on be good sports, just drop Suthep in it and come back on side.

i bet your not a million miles off the mark unfortunatly...

[GeckosDiving]

Thai people urged PT to obey of the rule of law, to accept courts ruling, and accept fair and free election............................

But we all know this will not happen !! They follow only their dear leader that camel turd jockey in Dubai All the red shirt flag wavers believe is that by burning down building, Intimation, Thuggery and killing children that that is the way to True Democracy and they work very hard at this

[Scamper]

Only Phue Thai could somehow manage to " reach out " to a political party while deriding them at the same time. Some outreach. Pheu Thai is essentially incapable of talking to anyone. They have no talent for it. They won't talk to the EC, and they won't listen to judicial rulings. It's a perfect track record of non-receptiveness. They seem to have the idea that the optics of having the spokesman of your party be Thaksin's lawyer is the winner they've all been looking for. No one in Pheu Thai ever smiles. It's starting to get kind of creepy. Pheu Thai has always been Rod Serling material - grist for the Twilight Zone or the Outer Limits. Yingluck smiles - but it's still too close to the Stepford Wives for comfort. Every time we see a spokesman for Pheu Thai, or from the DSI, or from the surreal Mr. Surapong - the expressions seem only just north of indicating their alive. Dour expressions abound. Protecting democracy appears to be a humourless business. No laughs to spare there. Without an election there is no end game for Pheu Thai. Without the participation of the Democratic party there is no end game for Pheu Thai. Pheu Thai - knock off the dour expressions, knock off the slights, and put a little sugar in your outreach.

[CWMcMurray]

Although the reality is that it will be up to the smaller parties on who they decide to form a coalition government ...

I can't ever remember either side actually getting a real majority (over 50%)

So the issue in who will be the next government will not be decided on by the election , but will be based on back rooms deals ... Who is willing to give more to the little parties to get behind them.

So how do the Democrats out bid the other side... That is the real question they have to be asking themselves.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[ramrod711]

Meanwhile, Pheu Thai Spokesperson Prompong Nopparit echoed Mr. Noppadon, speculating that the Democrat Party avoids the election in order to evade a defeat. He also urged Mr. Abhisit to show his support to the election if the latter is sincere about mending the prolonged political crisis.

Prompong Nopparit echoed Mr. Noppadon, I wouldn't believe either of these guys if they recommended breathing to sustain life.

They are the hired help, the bootlickers and toadies that hang on Thaksins every word like a distant relative waiting for a rich uncle to pass. They are, in a word, pathetic.

[djjamie]

The democrats have already declared that they will run again as long as their are at a minimum 'electoral reforms' before the ballot.

They have no desire to run in an undemocratic election like the last several.

What part of that do PTP not understand?

Of course PT want elections, they know that in 80% of the country, the Dems are no allowed to campaign for fear of being shot dead by PT's red shirt terrorist unit. Along with all the voter intimidation (and yes it exists), and buying off village chiefs to force their villagers to vote Thaksin.

If I was leader of the Dems, I would refuse as well, and in every civilized democracy, all parties would also refuse if one party was producing elections like this for the rest of their competition.

FREE AND FAIR.... OR NOT AT ALL!!!!!!!!!

That is quite right.

In fact the DEM's would have won the 2014 elections had they not held reform above personal gain. What a sacrifice heay? Knowing full well you would win an election, but holding off for the sake of installing a better future for the majority by reforming the country. That is a sacrifice the supporter of only 1 principle of democracy, the accused terrorist Jaturporn would never understand.

Holding off on 1 principle of democracy to allow the other principles to be reformed and flourish should be of paramount importance and embraced if you're democratic. The majority embrace it. The 2014 election and the subsequent polls showed that. However a small minority that is garnering a 200 000 fully armed armed militia is against it. One may suggest they are the ones benefiting from this corruption and lack of transparency. Maybe they are used to going against the majority grain as they did with the amnesty, the 2007 constitution and now the reform ideology the country thirst for. If they do hold another election and they loose one can surmise they wont respect that result either. They have proven through actions they have not respected anything that goes against their agenda. The majority included.

The 2011 elections and the 2014 elections were not free and fair. Even before 2011 there was no chance of DEM's staging rallies in Red Shirt heart lands without intimidation or violence being present from the armed militia. The reason the PDRC blocked elections was because they were not free and fair. In fact Thailand is ranked 58th on the democracy index in 2011 with a reflecting "free and fair" election rating in a class of "Hybrid Regimes" along side Liberia, Sierra Leone and Pakistan. Not very good. One can understand when trying to attend a DEM rally in Udon Thani and the Red Shirts blocked the entrance and intimidated me and my family with my children in tears from the experience. That IS more akin to Sierra Leone (Which, yes I have seen first hand too having worked there) So the Democracy index is pretty spot on with this regime's love for intimidation of voters. Look no further than the public intimidation of farmers that only wanted to voice their democratic right to protest. This was open and public intimidation so you can only imagine what happens on polling day and the days in between. Just look at a PTP official that was shot and killed by Khanchit Thabsuwan as well that was highlighted by another esteemed forum member. He is also highlighting why reform is needed. A true sense of were a parties morales lie is with reactions to these incidents though. Ahbisit denounced Khanchit and distanced himself and the DEM party from him. What does Nattawut do in the capacity of the PTP leader when his red shirts commit crimes or bombings or intimidation. Nothing. He does not distance himself or the PTP from this violence. That is why reform is needed. To make parties accountable for and to stop them being the fire that fuels the violence.

The DEM's are by name as they are in there actions. They are not 1/15th democratic like the other guys that hide behind a 200 000 armed street gang. They hide behind all the principles of democracy and something special, something that stops a country turning into an Anarchist state. That something being the rule of law.

Edited April 8, 2014 by djjamie

[gabruce]

The democrats have already declared that they will run again as long as their are at a minimum 'electoral reforms' before the ballot.

They have no desire to run in an undemocratic election like the last several.

What part of that do PTP not understand?

Of course PT want elections, they know that in 80% of the country, the Dems are no allowed to campaign for fear of being shot dead by PT's red shirt terrorist unit. Along with all the voter intimidation (and yes it exists), and buying off village chiefs to force their villagers to vote Thaksin.

If I was leader of the Dems, I would refuse as well, and in every civilized democracy, all parties would also refuse if one party was producing elections like this for the rest of their competition.

FREE AND FAIR.... OR NOT AT ALL!!!!!!!!!

You make a very valid point here about safety in campaigning, however surely 80% of the country is an exaggeration. Reform of the police to provide even-handed protection is essential.

[ianf]

The democrats have already declared that they will run again as long as their are at a minimum 'electoral reforms' before the ballot.

They have no desire to run in an undemocratic election like the last several.

What part of that do PTP not understand?

Of course PT want elections, they know that in 80% of the country, the Dems are no allowed to campaign for fear of being shot dead by PT's red shirt terrorist unit. Along with all the voter intimidation (and yes it exists), and buying off village chiefs to force their villagers to vote Thaksin.

If I was leader of the Dems, I would refuse as well, and in every civilized democracy, all parties would also refuse if one party was producing elections like this for the rest of their competition.

FREE AND FAIR.... OR NOT AT ALL!!!!!!!!!

More hyperbole. ANFREL found that the 2011 Election was free and fair and the only thing not free and fair about the February 2nd Election was suthep and his goons disrupting it. abhisit was just trotting out the usual excuse for the dems being unelectable.

A point of interest, the last political person to be shot dead was a PTP official who was shot dead by the democrat MP Khanchit Thabsuwan in 2012. Of course, the murderer is on bail.

Absolutely incorrect. The last full election was not free and fair:

1. Democrat Posters throughout Thailand were defaced by tearing out the face of Abhisit in an attempt to demonise him. During this election I saw hundreds of these defaced posters as I travelled the country and I also had a letter in the national press about this. Just for a bit of balance here, I saw two, yes 2, defaced PTP posters.

2. Village chiefs were ensuring that people voted for PTP by intimidating villagers and spelling out the consequences if they did not vote for PTP. This was reported around the northern part of the country and the consequences included not allowing anyone to access village loans if they were not PTP voters; intimidating locals voters with the threat of violence and in one case that I know about, waving guns (hand guns) at one family.

3. Creating "policies" that were carefully designed to "buy" votes without exchanging cash. These promises, which were akin to major bribes, proved to be impossible to maintain (ie Rice, auto credit, computers for kids and so on).

4. Creating red villages and whole areas where Democrat and other opposition parties were not allowed to canvass. (I witnessed one such incident where a pick up with posters was stoned on a country road near Chiang Mai and people stood in the road forcing this vehicle to turn back. I was cycling. When I found someone to question about this I was threatened.

And so on.

Fair elections are about creating an atmosphere conducive to fairness so that everyone can have a voice and a free choice. We have seen the tactics time and time again from the Thaksin people which do not allow people to question, express an opinion or to make a free choice. There are many ways of intimidating people and forcing them to vote Thaksin because, at the end of the day, people want peace in their lives and to be able to live in their village without being a so cial outcast. So whatever ANFREL found, I am sure they only looked at the surface. Send them to me at the next election and I'll take them to families in the villages around Chiang Mai who live in fear of the Thaksinites.

As for the murder you refer to, one such incident does not create a general rule. If this guy actually carried out this shoo ting then he has to face justice. Unfortunately your hero, Thaksin, ordered the extra-judicial killings of almost 3000 people in the so-called drug war. Some of those murdered on Thaksin's instruction were political opponents. Then there was the suffocation of some 80 young people ........ Thaksin has never been charged and your cowardly hero ran away from justice. So your point is not well made.

[diehard60]

The democrats have already declared that they will run again as long as their are at a minimum 'electoral reforms' before the ballot.

They have no desire to run in an undemocratic election like the last several.

What part of that do PTP not understand?

Of course PT want elections, they know that in 80% of the country, the Dems are no allowed to campaign for fear of being shot dead by PT's red shirt terrorist unit. Along with all the voter intimidation (and yes it exists), and buying off village chiefs to force their villagers to vote Thaksin.

If I was leader of the Dems, I would refuse as well, and in every civilized democracy, all parties would also refuse if one party was producing elections like this for the rest of their competition.

FREE AND FAIR.... OR NOT AT ALL!!!!!!!!!

The last electiom was free and fair except for sutheps thugs beating up poeple so they could not vote.

[diehard60]

The democrats have already declared that they will run again as long as their are at a minimum 'electoral reforms' before the ballot.

They have no desire to run in an undemocratic election like the last several.

What part of that do PTP not understand?

Of course PT want elections, they know that in 80% of the country, the Dems are no allowed to campaign for fear of being shot dead by PT's red shirt terrorist unit. Along with all the voter intimidation (and yes it exists), and buying off village chiefs to force their villagers to vote Thaksin.

If I was leader of the Dems, I would refuse as well, and in every civilized democracy, all parties would also refuse if one party was producing elections like this for the rest of their competition.

FREE AND FAIR.... OR NOT AT ALL!!!!!!!!!

More hyperbole. ANFREL found that the 2011 Election was free and fair and the only thing not free and fair about the February 2nd Election was suthep and his goons disrupting it. abhisit was just trotting out the usual excuse for the dems being unelectable.

A point of interest, the last political person to be shot dead was a PTP official who was shot dead by the democrat MP Khanchit Thabsuwan in 2012. Of course, the murderer is on bail.

Absolutely incorrect. The last full election was not free and fair:

1. Democrat Posters throughout Thailand were defaced by tearing out the face of Abhisit in an attempt to demonise him. During this election I saw hundreds of these defaced posters as I travelled the country and I also had a letter in the national press about this. Just for a bit of balance here, I saw two, yes 2, defaced PTP posters.

2. Village chiefs were ensuring that people voted for PTP by intimidating villagers and spelling out the consequences if they did not vote for PTP. This was reported around the northern part of the country and the consequences included not allowing anyone to access village loans if they were not PTP voters; intimidating locals voters with the threat of violence and in one case that I know about, waving guns (hand guns) at one family.

3. Creating "policies" that were carefully designed to "buy" votes without exchanging cash. These promises, which were akin to major bribes, proved to be impossible to maintain (ie Rice, auto credit, computers for kids and so on).

4. Creating red villages and whole areas where Democrat and other opposition parties were not allowed to canvass. (I witnessed one such incident where a pick up with posters was stoned on a country road near Chiang Mai and people stood in the road forcing this vehicle to turn back. I was cycling. When I found someone to question about this I was threatened.

And so on.

Fair elections are about creating an atmosphere conducive to fairness so that everyone can have a voice and a free choice. We have seen the tactics time and time again from the Thaksin people which do not allow people to question, express an opinion or to make a free choice. There are many ways of intimidating people and forcing them to vote Thaksin because, at the end of the day, people want peace in their lives and to be able to live in their village without being a so cial outcast. So whatever ANFREL found, I am sure they only looked at the surface. Send them to me at the next election and I'll take them to families in the villages around Chiang Mai who live in fear of the Thaksinites.

As for the murder you refer to, one such incident does not create a general rule. If this guy actually carried out this shoo ting then he has to face justice. Unfortunately your hero, Thaksin, ordered the extra-judicial killings of almost 3000 people in the so-called drug war. Some of those murdered on Thaksin's instruction were political opponents. Then there was the suffocation of some 80 young people ........ Thaksin has never been charged and your cowardly hero ran away from justice. So your point is not well made.

Where is your proof???? If you had it why did you NOT take it to the elction commission??????? Instead of complaining after the fact.

[Nickymaster]

Another statement by the Shin clan purely out of desperation.

[diehard60]

The democrats have already declared that they will run again as long as their are at a minimum 'electoral reforms' before the ballot.

They have no desire to run in an undemocratic election like the last several.

What part of that do PTP not understand?

Of course PT want elections, they know that in 80% of the country, the Dems are no allowed to campaign for fear of being shot dead by PT's red shirt terrorist unit. Along with all the voter intimidation (and yes it exists), and buying off village chiefs to force their villagers to vote Thaksin.

If I was leader of the Dems, I would refuse as well, and in every civilized democracy, all parties would also refuse if one party was producing elections like this for the rest of their competition.

FREE AND FAIR.... OR NOT AT ALL!!!!!!!!!

You make a very valid point here about safety in campaigning, however surely 80% of the country is an exaggeration. Reform of the police to provide even-handed protection is essential.

80%?????? you are so wromng. They came and canvessed up here in the NE. In big time. Maybe it was your own little village but no where near 80%

Edited April 8, 2014 by diehard60

[fab4]

The democrats have already declared that they will run again as long as their are at a minimum 'electoral reforms' before the ballot.

They have no desire to run in an undemocratic election like the last several.

What part of that do PTP not understand?

Of course PT want elections, they know that in 80% of the country, the Dems are no allowed to campaign for fear of being shot dead by PT's red shirt terrorist unit. Along with all the voter intimidation (and yes it exists), and buying off village chiefs to force their villagers to vote Thaksin.

If I was leader of the Dems, I would refuse as well, and in every civilized democracy, all parties would also refuse if one party was producing elections like this for the rest of their competition.

FREE AND FAIR.... OR NOT AT ALL!!!!!!!!!

More hyperbole. ANFREL found that the 2011 Election was free and fair and the only thing not free and fair about the February 2nd Election was suthep and his goons disrupting it. abhisit was just trotting out the usual excuse for the dems being unelectable.

A point of interest, the last political person to be shot dead was a PTP official who was shot dead by the democrat MP Khanchit Thabsuwan in 2012. Of course, the murderer is on bail.

Absolutely incorrect. The last full election was not free and fair:

1. Democrat Posters throughout Thailand were defaced by tearing out the face of Abhisit in an attempt to demonise him. During this election I saw hundreds of these defaced posters as I travelled the country and I also had a letter in the national press about this. Just for a bit of balance here, I saw two, yes 2, defaced PTP posters.

2. Village chiefs were ensuring that people voted for PTP by intimidating villagers and spelling out the consequences if they did not vote for PTP. This was reported around the northern part of the country and the consequences included not allowing anyone to access village loans if they were not PTP voters; intimidating locals voters with the threat of violence and in one case that I know about, waving guns (hand guns) at one family.

3. Creating "policies" that were carefully designed to "buy" votes without exchanging cash. These promises, which were akin to major bribes, proved to be impossible to maintain (ie Rice, auto credit, computers for kids and so on).

4. Creating red villages and whole areas where Democrat and other opposition parties were not allowed to canvass. (I witnessed one such incident where a pick up with posters was stoned on a country road near Chiang Mai and people stood in the road forcing this vehicle to turn back. I was cycling. When I found someone to question about this I was threatened.

And so on.

Fair elections are about creating an atmosphere conducive to fairness so that everyone can have a voice and a free choice. We have seen the tactics time and time again from the Thaksin people which do not allow people to question, express an opinion or to make a free choice. There are many ways of intimidating people and forcing them to vote Thaksin because, at the end of the day, people want peace in their lives and to be able to live in their village without being a so cial outcast. So whatever ANFREL found, I am sure they only looked at the surface. Send them to me at the next election and I'll take them to families in the villages around Chiang Mai who live in fear of the Thaksinites.

As for the murder you refer to, one such incident does not create a general rule. If this guy actually carried out this shoo ting then he has to face justice. Unfortunately your hero, Thaksin, ordered the extra-judicial killings of almost 3000 people in the so-called drug war. Some of those murdered on Thaksin's instruction were political opponents. Then there was the suffocation of some 80 young people ........ Thaksin has never been charged and your cowardly hero ran away from justice. So your point is not well made.

I do believe you're wrong but I really can't be bothered correcting you - oh, the hyperbole thing, have a think about that 3000 number you're quoting....................

[ianf]

The democrats have already declared that they will run again as long as their are at a minimum 'electoral reforms' before the ballot.

They have no desire to run in an undemocratic election like the last several.

What part of that do PTP not understand?

Of course PT want elections, they know that in 80% of the country, the Dems are no allowed to campaign for fear of being shot dead by PT's red shirt terrorist unit. Along with all the voter intimidation (and yes it exists), and buying off village chiefs to force their villagers to vote Thaksin.

If I was leader of the Dems, I would refuse as well, and in every civilized democracy, all parties would also refuse if one party was producing elections like this for the rest of their competition.

FREE AND FAIR.... OR NOT AT ALL!!!!!!!!!

More hyperbole. ANFREL found that the 2011 Election was free and fair and the only thing not free and fair about the February 2nd Election was suthep and his goons disrupting it. abhisit was just trotting out the usual excuse for the dems being unelectable.

A point of interest, the last political person to be shot dead was a PTP official who was shot dead by the democrat MP Khanchit Thabsuwan in 2012. Of course, the murderer is on bail.

Absolutely incorrect. The last full election was not free and fair:

1. Democrat Posters throughout Thailand were defaced by tearing out the face of Abhisit in an attempt to demonise him. During this election I saw hundreds of these defaced posters as I travelled the country and I also had a letter in the national press about this. Just for a bit of balance here, I saw two, yes 2, defaced PTP posters.

2. Village chiefs were ensuring that people voted for PTP by intimidating villagers and spelling out the consequences if they did not vote for PTP. This was reported around the northern part of the country and the consequences included not allowing anyone to access village loans if they were not PTP voters; intimidating locals voters with the threat of violence and in one case that I know about, waving guns (hand guns) at one family.

3. Creating "policies" that were carefully designed to "buy" votes without exchanging cash. These promises, which were akin to major bribes, proved to be impossible to maintain (ie Rice, auto credit, computers for kids and so on).

4. Creating red villages and whole areas where Democrat and other opposition parties were not allowed to canvass. (I witnessed one such incident where a pick up with posters was stoned on a country road near Chiang Mai and people stood in the road forcing this vehicle to turn back. I was cycling. When I found someone to question about this I was threatened.

And so on.

Fair elections are about creating an atmosphere conducive to fairness so that everyone can have a voice and a free choice. We have seen the tactics time and time again from the Thaksin people which do not allow people to question, express an opinion or to make a free choice. There are many ways of intimidating people and forcing them to vote Thaksin because, at the end of the day, people want peace in their lives and to be able to live in their village without being a so cial outcast. So whatever ANFREL found, I am sure they only looked at the surface. Send them to me at the next election and I'll take them to families in the villages around Chiang Mai who live in fear of the Thaksinites.

As for the murder you refer to, one such incident does not create a general rule. If this guy actually carried out this shoo ting then he has to face justice. Unfortunately your hero, Thaksin, ordered the extra-judicial killings of almost 3000 people in the so-called drug war. Some of those murdered on Thaksin's instruction were political opponents. Then there was the suffocation of some 80 young people ........ Thaksin has never been charged and your cowardly hero ran away from justice. So your point is not well made.

I do believe you're wrong but I really can't be bothered correcting you - oh, the hyperbole thing, have a think about that 3000 number you're quoting....................

You and your ilk can believe what you want. Throughout history we have seen sycophants support the nasty rich elite and you are no exception. They/You do this for many reasons but Reich, in his opus: The Mass Psychology of Fascism, pointed out that people need to support dictators, torturers and so on because of their own inadequacies. Anyone, and I mean anyone with any intelligence, any understanding of the world, any interest in human rights will fully understand the path travelled by Thaksin along which he has dragged his supporters. Oh yes! History repeats itself, sadly. And those of us who have spent a lifetime trying to promote human rights, campaign against human rights abusers and get people/corporations in power to behave with some responsibility towards their fellow man are sickened by the farang acolytes. I feel very strongly about this. Amnesty International, an impartial international human rights organisation, has recorded 18 cases of gross human rights abuses by Thaksin against human rights activists who were trying to shed light on his systematic abuses: they were either murdered or have disappeared. Amnesty does not get it's facts wrong.

Thaksin has accumulated the worst human rights record in recent Thai history. You or one of your mates, is asking for proof that he killed nearly 3,000 people in 90 days during a botched “War on Drugs” in 2003. In a single day during 2004 his actions resulted in the deaths of 85 protestors. How dare you question these facts and support this tyrant? Do you not care about your fellow man?

Edited April 8, 2014 by ianf

[rubl]

Surprisingly Thaksin's legal representative Noppadon didn't get the message about reforms first it would seem.

[djjamie]

More hyperbole. ANFREL found that the 2011 Election was free and fair and the only thing not free and fair about the February 2nd Election was suthep and his goons disrupting it. abhisit was just trotting out the usual excuse for the dems being unelectable.

A point of interest, the last political person to be shot dead was a PTP official who was shot dead by the democrat MP Khanchit Thabsuwan in 2012. Of course, the murderer is on bail.

Absolutely incorrect. The last full election was not free and fair:

1. Democrat Posters throughout Thailand were defaced by tearing out the face of Abhisit in an attempt to demonise him. During this election I saw hundreds of these defaced posters as I travelled the country and I also had a letter in the national press about this. Just for a bit of balance here, I saw two, yes 2, defaced PTP posters.

2. Village chiefs were ensuring that people voted for PTP by intimidating villagers and spelling out the consequences if they did not vote for PTP. This was reported around the northern part of the country and the consequences included not allowing anyone to access village loans if they were not PTP voters; intimidating locals voters with the threat of violence and in one case that I know about, waving guns (hand guns) at one family.

3. Creating "policies" that were carefully designed to "buy" votes without exchanging cash. These promises, which were akin to major bribes, proved to be impossible to maintain (ie Rice, auto credit, computers for kids and so on).

4. Creating red villages and whole areas where Democrat and other opposition parties were not allowed to canvass. (I witnessed one such incident where a pick up with posters was stoned on a country road near Chiang Mai and people stood in the road forcing this vehicle to turn back. I was cycling. When I found someone to question about this I was threatened.

And so on.

Fair elections are about creating an atmosphere conducive to fairness so that everyone can have a voice and a free choice. We have seen the tactics time and time again from the Thaksin people which do not allow people to question, express an opinion or to make a free choice. There are many ways of intimidating people and forcing them to vote Thaksin because, at the end of the day, people want peace in their lives and to be able to live in their village without being a so cial outcast. So whatever ANFREL found, I am sure they only looked at the surface. Send them to me at the next election and I'll take them to families in the villages around Chiang Mai who live in fear of the Thaksinites.

As for the murder you refer to, one such incident does not create a general rule. If this guy actually carried out this shoo ting then he has to face justice. Unfortunately your hero, Thaksin, ordered the extra-judicial killings of almost 3000 people in the so-called drug war. Some of those murdered on Thaksin's instruction were political opponents. Then there was the suffocation of some 80 young people ........ Thaksin has never been charged and your cowardly hero ran away from justice. So your point is not well made.

I do believe you're wrong but I really can't be bothered correcting you - oh, the hyperbole thing, have a think about that 3000 number you're quoting....................

You and your ilk can believe what you want. Throughout history we have seen sycophants support the nasty rich elite and you are no exception. They/You do this for many reasons but Reich, in his opus: The Mass Psychology of Fascism, pointed out that people need to support dictators, torturers and so on because of their own inadequacies. Anyone, and I mean anyone with any intelligence, any understanding of the world, any interest in human rights will fully understand the path travelled by Thaksin along which he has dragged his supporters. Oh yes! History repeats itself, sadly. And those of us who have spent a lifetime trying to promote human rights, campaign against human rights abusers and get people/corporations in power to behave with some responsibility towards their fellow man are sickened by the farang acolytes. I feel very strongly about this. Amnesty International, an impartial international human rights organisation, has recorded 18 cases of gross human rights abuses by Thaksin against human rights activists who were trying to shed light on his systematic abuses: they were either murdered or have disappeared. Amnesty does not get it's facts wrong.

Thaksin has accumulated the worst human rights record in recent Thai history. You or one of your mates, is asking for proof that he killed nearly 3,000 people in 90 days during a botched “War on Drugs” in 2003. In a single day during 2004 his actions resulted in the deaths of 85 protestors. How dare you question these facts and support this tyrant? Do you not care about your fellow man?

When you get a reply like "I really can't be bothered correcting you" it is called shutting down the debate. It is their way of saying, I can't win this debate so I will shut it down.

I get it a lot from UDD supporters which is a shame because when the shutdown happened that is at the equinox of the truth being revealed. They simply cannot handle the truth.

In reply to your comment, yes, I saw the defaced posters too, like I said I say the intimidation of my family first hand, my eldest who was 4 at the time still remembers it, the farmers saw the intimidation first hand too when it went against the PTP agenda. This lack of democracy is literally in our face and when one understates it or denies it happens it is equivalent to supporters saying the rice scheme is not corrupt.

One could say they have their head in a bucket of sand, but with more rice in Thailand than sand currently I would have to say they have their head in a bucket of rice.

A shame because it is to the majorities detriment. I pity the majority. They are not getting heard. They tried through boycotting elections, but alas it fell on deaf ears as did the amnesty majority, the 20007 constitution majority and the water scheme majority.

The only time the majority will be heard is when it suits the PTP agenda.

Shame really. I respect the majority voice. It is called democracy

Edited April 8, 2014 by djjamie

[mercman24]

one burning question been bugging me, when a thai votes, does he/she put their name and address on the voting forms, surely not, so how the hell does the "village boss" know who a.b.c. or d. voted for confused ! perhaps someone can enlighten me ??

[firestar]

Surprisingly Thaksin's legal representative Noppadon didn't get the message about reforms first it would seem.

Surprisingly nobody else got it either, not a message that contained any content anyway.

We all read the pretty title but when trying to open the message it reads "unable to open Mr Suthep refuses to compromise, discuss or divulge the nature of his "reforms"."

Or is Suthep's Lumpini speech where he suggests installing himself as "sovereign body" and rule by ""Revolutionary Decrees" the reform? Please tell me it isn't so?

.

Edited April 8, 2014 by firestar

[michaelscottfan]

The democrats have already declared that they will run again as long as their are at a minimum 'electoral reforms' before the ballot.

They have no desire to run in an undemocratic election like the last several.

What part of that do PTP not understand?

Of course PT want elections, they know that in 80% of the country, the Dems are no allowed to campaign for fear of being shot dead by PT's red shirt terrorist unit. Along with all the voter intimidation (and yes it exists), and buying off village chiefs to force their villagers to vote Thaksin.

If I was leader of the Dems, I would refuse as well, and in every civilized democracy, all parties would also refuse if one party was producing elections like this for the rest of their competition.

FREE AND FAIR.... OR NOT AT ALL!!!!!!!!!

Give me a break, you know as well as anyone here that vote buying has nothing to do with why the North votes Red, and that the Democrats are as guilty as anyone of vote buying. The whole reason they brought Chidchob into their coaltion was because of his expertise in this field and it ended in a miserable failure in the 2011 election. And moreover if there was any actual evidence of vote buying the election commision would've used it against PTP by now.

[MickGC]

one burning question been bugging me, when a thai votes, does he/she put their name and address on the voting forms, surely not, so how the hell does the "village boss" know who a.b.c. or d. voted for confused ! perhaps someone can enlighten me ??

Don't let the facts get in the way of a good story.

[wolfmanjack]

one burning question been bugging me, when a thai votes, does he/she put their name and address on the voting forms, surely not, so how the hell does the "village boss" know who a.b.c. or d. voted for confused ! perhaps someone can enlighten me ??

The village boss does not have to be able to know.

He only needs to convince the villagers that it is possible for him to know.

Perception is more important than reality.

[GunterChiangMai]

The democrats have already declared that they will run again as long as their are at a minimum 'electoral reforms' before the ballot.

They have no desire to run in an undemocratic election like the last several.

What part of that do PTP not understand?

Of course PT want elections, they know that in 80% of the country, the Dems are no allowed to campaign for fear of being shot dead by PT's red shirt terrorist unit. Along with all the voter intimidation (and yes it exists), and buying off village chiefs to force their villagers to vote Thaksin.

If I was leader of the Dems, I would refuse as well, and in every civilized democracy, all parties would also refuse if one party was producing elections like this for the rest of their competition.

FREE AND FAIR.... OR NOT AT ALL!!!!!!!!!

If I could, I surely would....

Vote for you!

Between your lines I can feel your great compashion for all the people and you really did understand what this country needs......

[tomhell]

The so called "Democrats" belong to the corrupted old elites of Thailand and they probably would not win the next election. (when they won the last election?)

I think many Thais are fed up with all the parties because most of all politicians are self-serving and corrupt.

Thailand needs a new socialdemocratic/socialist/labour party without any influence of Thaksin´s family clan.

I am optimistic Thailand can develope from a feudalistic system to a modern democracy.

Best wishes

Tom

The democrats have already declared that they will run again as long as their are at a minimum 'electoral reforms' before the ballot.

They have no desire to run in an undemocratic election like the last several.

What part of that do PTP not understand?

Of course PT want elections, they know that in 80% of the country, the Dems are no allowed to campaign for fear of being shot dead by PT's red shirt terrorist unit. Along with all the voter intimidation (and yes it exists), and buying off village chiefs to force their villagers to vote Thaksin.

If I was leader of the Dems, I would refuse as well, and in every civilized democracy, all parties would also refuse if one party was producing elections like this for the rest of their competition.

FREE AND FAIR.... OR NOT AT ALL!!!!!!!!!