UDD plans another mass rally in Bangkok

[rametindallas]

" The United Front for Democracy against Dictatorship or the red-shirt movement"

Tippy-toe'ing about...Trying really, really hard to avoid political realities.

It wouldn't do to characterize these people for what they are, in contrast to their opposites.......One of being pro- electoral and Parliamentary Democrats and anti-Coup vs. coup advocacy and pro-establishment of a "Civilian Dictatorship"

This anti-UDD/RS/PTP media would be embarrassed by that.

Best to use their affinity clothing color descriptions, in order to avoid calling them what they are....If one calls them a pro-Democracy Movement suggests there must be one against it.....The coup advocates want to avoid and hide that fact...Heavens, what would an International audience think if they knew that.....Best to call themselves anti-Govt. and protesters, when knowledgeable people know they are neither...Coup advocacy is not that.......Normalizing their abnormal judiciary and Ind. Org's certainly blows enough smoke that International audiences will be unable to penetrate.

Lest PAD-Dem's are again moved to diminish rallies of this nature, they need to simply get themselves beyond the fact these people represent an electoral majority......And that majority is "ON" to all this deviousness noted above....They know a coup when they see one...Creeping, Judicial or whatever......Any...ANY...move to base Governance and the selection of a Prime Minister on less than an electoral foundation, is effectively a coup...No-one is fooling anyone by trying to make it appear otherwise......Certainly these people at this upcoming rally are not fooled by this coup advocacy chicanery of the Const. Court.

It is why Amsterdam indicated this CC does not have the legitimacy to call itself a "court".......The people attending this rally representing millions, agree with that, and show it by their attendance at this gatherings.

The UDD is NOT pro-democracy unless democracy means Thaksin dictatorship. They are massing in Bangkok to support Yingluck, not democracy. They support Thaksin, as you have stated many times, and not democracy. The UDD is a armed wing of Thaksin's PTP puppet government and used to intimidate the courts. (publishing judges phone numbers and addresses, blockading courts and threatening to arrest judges, launching grenades at the NACC, etc.). If the rural people of the north and northeast weren't so wedded to the personality cult of Thaksin, they would see how he uses/abuses them. Until the rural people create their own, grass-roots political organization and leaders, they will be exploited by either the old amart or the new amart (Thaksin). Why don't you support the rural people instead of the corrupt, megalomaniac Thaksin? Why, in your opinion, is Thaksin the only route to empowerment for the rural people? You talk about the 'chicanery' of the courts, what about the chicanery of the PTP and the heavy-handed way they govern? Why, even when they have no real opposition, can't they follow the rules/laws? Why do they follow, in lockstep, the bidding of a fugitive felon who doesn't even live in Thailand? You talk about blowing smoke. There's not enough smoke in the world to hide the misdeeds, incompetence, and larceny of Thaksin and his PTP puppet government. And now that the government is having to answer for its behavior, people like you, and Thaksin's UDD, are running around with your hair on fire as if the world is ending. I, for one can hardly wait for that world to end so Thailand can live up to its name, 'Land of the Free'.

It is why Amsterdam indicated this CC does not have the legitimacy to call itself a "court".

If Amsterdam weren't on Thaksin's payroll and were a fair man, he would say the PTP government does not have the legitimacy to call itself a "government".

I've asked you five questions. Your history shows you will not answer any of them but you WILL bluster on about Suthep, judicial coup, disrespecting the will of the majority, etc.

I would agree with you post on all except one point.

Isaan is starting to fracture - don't just take my word and that of my Isaan family and friends

If you reread the dummy spit by FB mate Ko Tee - he said that there were all sorts of people within the "reds", UDD and PTY that were positioning themselves for the changes that were happening. Don't let the understandable aversion for FB friends distract you from hearing the truth when they spit the dummy.

PTP need the perception that the unity of past years continues - both to be able to threaten and intimidate the people of Thailand generally and oppressed those in their non democratically created feudal estates. This is why the stoped so many of the farmers protesting in BKK over the rice. They did not want to be questioned by those who they consider the own - nor did they want to see the emergence of grass root politicians that would represent the farmer and poor rather than the Shin dynasty.

There concerns are well founded look at the turn out for both the votes that were cast on Feb 2 and the senate vote.

In previous posts, I have written about the UDD's suppression of any competition to their 'exclusive representation' of the rural NE and Northern people. They use intimidation and violence to maintain that exclusivity. Thaksin is paying for this UDD control (where else could they get their funding?). Blocking farmers from traveling to Bangkok has been reported numerous times. Those rural people have been governed/controlled by local 'bosses' for decades and if they want any public services, they have to go, hat in hand, and ask, the Pu Yai Bahn or Kamnan or PAO for that service and are then indebted to that official. It's called a clien/patron state. The amart in Bangkok cannot possibly reach the rural poor to exploit them the way their own kind can. Add in the local mafia bosses and the 'regular' people don't have any power or even the freedom to voice their opinion. Everyone knows everyone in the village and all are easily controlled. The 'Red Village' is a fiction used to keep the people in line and is not a representation of the wants and needs of the rural poor. Thaksin was clever to buy off those in authority in the rural NE and North so the system stayed in place only this time, the beneficiary was Thaksin.

Wouldn't it be great if the rural NE and North could be free to create their own power structure and political base and elect the people THEY WANT to represent them!?! Unfortunately, the system is so ingrained and strongly enforced that I don't have much hope.

[Scamper]

For those who are quoting Robert Amsterdam's statement that the Constitutional Court does not have the legitimacy to consider itself a court - should be reminded that that is a criminal statement, should be reminded that that is a criminal point of view, and should be reminded that that is a flagrantly undemocratic point of view. Thaksin would have us believe that democracy would thrive without a judiciary, but everyone who is familiar with history knows that the first sign of an authoritarian inclination is to go after the judiciary - which Thaksin and the UDD have unceasingly done. Thaksin and the UDD have therefore nothing in common with democracy. Nothing whatsoever. Concerning the UDD's planned rally in Bangkok - when Jatuporn says they will not leave until the battle is over, one wonders what battle he is referring to. He had better not be referring to the legitimacy of the court. This is exactly where the words of Robert Amsterdam can lead. Rhetoric that challenges the legitimacy of the judiciary is dangerous. That is what the UDD is engaged in.

[Fryslan boppe]

" The United Front for Democracy against Dictatorship or the red-shirt movement"

Tippy-toe'ing about...Trying really, really hard to avoid political realities.

It wouldn't do to characterize these people for what they are, in contrast to their opposites.......One of being pro- electoral and Parliamentary Democrats and anti-Coup vs. coup advocacy and pro-establishment of a "Civilian Dictatorship"

This anti-UDD/RS/PTP media would be embarrassed by that.

Best to use their affinity clothing color descriptions, in order to avoid calling them what they are....If one calls them a pro-Democracy Movement suggests there must be one against it.....The coup advocates want to avoid and hide that fact...Heavens, what would an International audience think if they knew that.....Best to call themselves anti-Govt. and protesters, when knowledgeable people know they are neither...Coup advocacy is not that.......Normalizing their abnormal judiciary and Ind. Org's certainly blows enough smoke that International audiences will be unable to penetrate.

Lest PAD-Dem's are again moved to diminish rallies of this nature, they need to simply get themselves beyond the fact these people represent an electoral majority......And that majority is "ON" to all this deviousness noted above....They know a coup when they see one...Creeping, Judicial or whatever......Any...ANY...move to base Governance and the selection of a Prime Minister on less than an electoral foundation, is effectively a coup...No-one is fooling anyone by trying to make it appear otherwise......Certainly these people at this upcoming rally are not fooled by this coup advocacy chicanery of the Const. Court.

It is why Amsterdam indicated this CC does not have the legitimacy to call itself a "court".......The people attending this rally representing millions, agree with that, and show it by their attendance at this gatherings.

The UDD is NOT pro-democracy unless democracy means Thaksin dictatorship. They are massing in Bangkok to support Yingluck, not democracy. They support Thaksin, as you have stated many times, and not democracy. The UDD is a armed wing of Thaksin's PTP puppet government and used to intimidate the courts. (publishing judges phone numbers and addresses, blockading courts and threatening to arrest judges, launching grenades at the NACC, etc.). If the rural people of the north and northeast weren't so wedded to the personality cult of Thaksin, they would see how he uses/abuses them. Until the rural people create their own, grass-roots political organization and leaders, they will be exploited by either the old amart or the new amart (Thaksin). Why don't you support the rural people instead of the corrupt, megalomaniac Thaksin? Why, in your opinion, is Thaksin the only route to empowerment for the rural people? You talk about the 'chicanery' of the courts, what about the chicanery of the PTP and the heavy-handed way they govern? Why, even when they have no real opposition, can't they follow the rules/laws? Why do they follow, in lockstep, the bidding of a fugitive felon who doesn't even live in Thailand? You talk about blowing smoke. There's not enough smoke in the world to hide the misdeeds, incompetence, and larceny of Thaksin and his PTP puppet government. And now that the government is having to answer for its behavior, people like you, and Thaksin's UDD, are running around with your hair on fire as if the world is ending. I, for one can hardly wait for that world to end so Thailand can live up to its name, 'Land of the Free'.

It is why Amsterdam indicated this CC does not have the legitimacy to call itself a "court".

If Amsterdam weren't on Thaksin's payroll and were a fair man, he would say the PTP government does not have the legitimacy to call itself a "government".

I've asked you five questions. Your history shows you will not answer any of them but you WILL bluster on about Suthep, judicial coup, disrespecting the will of the majority, etc.

"I've asked you five questions. Your history shows you will not answer any of them"

• Why don't you support the rural people instead of the corrupt, megalomaniac Thaksin?

PAD-Dem coup-makers characterizations of Thaksin as in this quote, is self-serving propaganda trying to justify their non-electoral power-grab...Something they are trying to do all over again......

If such characterizations were anything more than Opposition, coup-maker self-serving folderol, do you honestly believe an entire Thai Electorate could be so blind as to vote for someone like that...both before the 2006 coup, and the last election where he was transparently front-and-center? Don't believe all the unelectable, coup-advocacy stuff for heaven's sake....Be reasonable.

I support and respect the rural people same as all the Thai electorate....The fact they voted for Thaksin and his post-2006 coup political elements have solid reasons....too voluminous to get into here...but believe me, there are many reasons why they voted as they have, and relegated the PAD-Dem's to their minority role.

• Why, in your opinion, is Thaksin the only route to empowerment for the rural people?

A short answer...Because he introduced political programs that reflected their needs......Something i wish the DP would do in order to bring about a competitive electoral situation, and by extension, a balance of power in Parliament.

The reason he and his current political elements seem to be the only route of "empowerment for the rural people" is because the DP is not offering it....All they hear from them is how stupid they are, how politically uni-dimensional they are (Thaksin), how they are politicized to such a low level as to only be motivated by money......None of that is true, but it sure demonizes the DP in the eyes of the electoral majority, and deprives them of any chance at electoral success....By appeasing their own narrow political base, they are alienating themselves from a majority electorate they need in the future.....Very, very stupid.

• You talk about the 'chicanery' of the courts, what about the chicanery of the PTP and the heavy-handed way they govern?

They are not governing heavy-handedly.....They are not governing any differently than any other Parliamentary majority elsewhere......Don't let that idiot mantra of the unelectables regarding "Parliamentary Dictatorship" fool you....In fact, I would argue that the PTP have not been heavy-handed enough...There are a number of electoral planks on the basis of which they were elected, that they have allowed Opposition noise to intimidate them away from....Just one case in point, is Constitutional Reform....I could cite many more...the UDD/RS have been quite critically vocal about the non-aggressive approach by the PTP when they have an electoral mandate to deliver......Bitching about Parliamentray procedural stuff by the PAD-Dem's, are typical complaints from all parliamentary minorities....If the don't like it, win a d... election.

• Why, even when they have no real opposition, can't they follow the rules/laws?

The politicized abnormality of the judiciary and Ind. Org's.....That is why....It is in the interest of the Opposition to characterize these things as normal. Thereby painting resistance to that politicized opposition via non-parliamentary sources, as being unlawful....Standing up to the Elitist and 2006 coup-rooted CC, NACC, anti-election election commission, etc, etc is not seen as unlawful by the electoral majority....Only by the self-serving Elitist side of the political divide. They also know the truth about this, but phonily paint their opposition as being unlawful.

• Why do they follow, in lockstep, the bidding of a fugitive felon who doesn't even live in Thailand?

They don't, but Opposition PAD-dem's like to paint them as such.....It is this uni-dimensional denigration they like to foist on their political opposites....It is their way of showing how stupid the voters are who don't vote for them...Totally being unaware of how politicized these people are.

That said, it is undeniable that he exercises influence...as he should.....The 2006 Coup-makers did not deprive him of electoral legitimacy. Instead it was them, who were summarily dismissed by the electorate. Most Prime Ministerial offices are collegial in approach, with advisors of various strengths contributing.....

He is not a fugitive felon....Coup-maker victors-justice does not a fugitive felon make...It is just PAD-Dem demagoguery trying to diminish their electoral nemesis...Don't be fooled by that idiocy....He is a self-exiled from politically motivated vendettas, via those politicized entities I referenced above....It is not by accident the anti-UDD/RS/PTP media cannot reference Thaksin without using the derogatory 'fugitive' label.....it is just more manifestation of their anti-UDD/RS/PTP orientation....But some believe that s...t as being gospel....And I suppose one cannot blame them, if that is all they read day-after-day over their coffee at Starbucks.

Phew...enough already.

Edited April 16, 2014 by Fryslan boppe

[fab4]

Doesn't Jutaporn have a date with the court in 2 days time to explain why he has breached his bail conditions ?

Suthep has been avoiding the courts for ages and he has arrest warrants for murder and insurrection against him, yet you neglect to mention this, I wonder why................

[nottocus]

The farce on the streets goes round and round....all day long.

[rametindallas]

" The United Front for Democracy against Dictatorship or the red-shirt movement"

Tippy-toe'ing about...Trying really, really hard to avoid political realities.

It wouldn't do to characterize these people for what they are, in contrast to their opposites.......One of being pro- electoral and Parliamentary Democrats and anti-Coup vs. coup advocacy and pro-establishment of a "Civilian Dictatorship"

This anti-UDD/RS/PTP media would be embarrassed by that.

Best to use their affinity clothing color descriptions, in order to avoid calling them what they are....If one calls them a pro-Democracy Movement suggests there must be one against it.....The coup advocates want to avoid and hide that fact...Heavens, what would an International audience think if they knew that.....Best to call themselves anti-Govt. and protesters, when knowledgeable people know they are neither...Coup advocacy is not that.......Normalizing their abnormal judiciary and Ind. Org's certainly blows enough smoke that International audiences will be unable to penetrate.

Lest PAD-Dem's are again moved to diminish rallies of this nature, they need to simply get themselves beyond the fact these people represent an electoral majority......And that majority is "ON" to all this deviousness noted above....They know a coup when they see one...Creeping, Judicial or whatever......Any...ANY...move to base Governance and the selection of a Prime Minister on less than an electoral foundation, is effectively a coup...No-one is fooling anyone by trying to make it appear otherwise......Certainly these people at this upcoming rally are not fooled by this coup advocacy chicanery of the Const. Court.

It is why Amsterdam indicated this CC does not have the legitimacy to call itself a "court".......The people attending this rally representing millions, agree with that, and show it by their attendance at this gatherings.

The UDD is NOT pro-democracy unless democracy means Thaksin dictatorship. They are massing in Bangkok to support Yingluck, not democracy. They support Thaksin, as you have stated many times, and not democracy. The UDD is a armed wing of Thaksin's PTP puppet government and used to intimidate the courts. (publishing judges phone numbers and addresses, blockading courts and threatening to arrest judges, launching grenades at the NACC, etc.). If the rural people of the north and northeast weren't so wedded to the personality cult of Thaksin, they would see how he uses/abuses them. Until the rural people create their own, grass-roots political organization and leaders, they will be exploited by either the old amart or the new amart (Thaksin). Why don't you support the rural people instead of the corrupt, megalomaniac Thaksin? Why, in your opinion, is Thaksin the only route to empowerment for the rural people? You talk about the 'chicanery' of the courts, what about the chicanery of the PTP and the heavy-handed way they govern? Why, even when they have no real opposition, can't they follow the rules/laws? Why do they follow, in lockstep, the bidding of a fugitive felon who doesn't even live in Thailand? You talk about blowing smoke. There's not enough smoke in the world to hide the misdeeds, incompetence, and larceny of Thaksin and his PTP puppet government. And now that the government is having to answer for its behavior, people like you, and Thaksin's UDD, are running around with your hair on fire as if the world is ending. I, for one can hardly wait for that world to end so Thailand can live up to its name, 'Land of the Free'.

It is why Amsterdam indicated this CC does not have the legitimacy to call itself a "court".

If Amsterdam weren't on Thaksin's payroll and were a fair man, he would say the PTP government does not have the legitimacy to call itself a "government".

I've asked you five questions. Your history shows you will not answer any of them but you WILL bluster on about Suthep, judicial coup, disrespecting the will of the majority, etc.

"I've asked you five questions. Your history shows you will not answer any of them"

• Why don't you support the rural people instead of the corrupt, megalomaniac Thaksin?

PAD-Dem coup-makers characterizations of Thaksin as in this quote, is self-serving propaganda trying to justify their non-electoral power-grab...Something they are trying to do all over again......

If such characterizations were anything more than Opposition, coup-maker self-serving folderol, do you honestly believe an entire Thai Electorate could be so blind as to vote for someone like that...both before the 2006 coup, and the last election where he was transparently front-and-center? Don't believe all the unelectable, coup-advocacy stuff for heaven's sake....Be reasonable.

I support and respect the rural people same as all the Thai electorate....The fact they voted for Thaksin and his post-2006 coup political elements have solid reasons....too voluminous to get into here...but believe me, there are many reasons why they voted as they have, and relegated the PAD-Dem's to their minority role.

• Why, in your opinion, is Thaksin the only route to empowerment for the rural people?

A short answer...Because he introduced political programs that reflected their needs......Something i wish the DP would do in order to bring about a competitive electoral situation, and by extension, a balance of power in Parliament.

The reason he and his current political elements seem to be the only route of "empowerment for the rural people" is because the DP is not offering it....All they hear from them is how stupid they are, how politically uni-dimensional they are (Thaksin), how they are politicized to such a low level as to only be motivated by money......None of that is true, but it sure demonizes the DP in the eyes of the electoral majority, and deprives them of any chance at electoral success....By appeasing their own narrow political base, they are alienating themselves from a majority electorate they need in the future.....Very, very stupid.

• You talk about the 'chicanery' of the courts, what about the chicanery of the PTP and the heavy-handed way they govern?

They are not governing heavy-handedly.....They are not governing any differently than any other Parliamentary majority elsewhere......Don't let that idiot mantra of the unelectables regarding "Parliamentary Dictatorship" fool you....In fact, I would argue that the PTP have not been heavy-handed enough...There are a number of electoral planks on the basis of which they were elected, that they have allowed Opposition noise to intimidate them away from....Just one case in point, is Constitutional Reform....I could cite many more...the UDD/RS have been quite critically vocal about the non-aggressive approach by the PTP when they have an electoral mandate to deliver......Bitching about Parliamentray procedural stuff by the PAD-Dem's, are typical complaints from all parliamentary minorities....If the don't like it, win a d... election.

• Why, even when they have no real opposition, can't they follow the rules/laws?

The politicized abnormality of the judiciary and Ind. Org's.....That is why....It is in the interest of the Opposition to characterize these things as normal. Thereby painting resistance to that politicized opposition via non-parliamentary sources, as being unlawful....Standing up to the Elitist and 2006 coup-rooted CC, NACC, anti-election election commission, etc, etc is not seen as unlawful by the electoral majority....Only by the self-serving Elitist side of the political divide. They also know the truth about this, but phonily paint their opposition as being unlawful.

• Why do they follow, in lockstep, the bidding of a fugitive felon who doesn't even live in Thailand?

They don't, but Opposition PAD-dem's like to paint them as such.....It is this uni-dimensional denigration they like to foist on their political opposites....It is their way of showing how stupid the voters are who don't vote for them...Totally being unaware of how politicized these people are.

That said, it is undeniable that he exercises influence...as he should.....The 2006 Coup-makers did not deprive him of electoral legitimacy. Instead it was them, who were summarily dismissed by the electorate. Most Prime Ministerial offices are collegial in approach, with advisors of various strengths contributing.....

He is not a fugitive felon....Coup-maker victors-justice does not a fugitive felon make...It is just PAD-Dem demagoguery trying to diminish their electoral nemesis...Don't be fooled by that idiocy....He is a self-exiled from politically motivated vendettas, via those politicized entities I referenced above....It is not by accident the anti-UDD/RS/PTP media cannot reference Thaksin without using the derogatory 'fugitive' label.....it is just more manifestation of their anti-UDD/RS/PTP orientation....But some believe that s...t as being gospel....And I suppose one cannot blame them, if that is all they read day-after-day over their coffee at Starbucks.

Phew...enough already.

Thank you, Fb, for responding to my post. I offer you kudos though you may not value them coming from me. I would love to debate those items individually but, from your. "Phew... enough already" comment, I will have to be satisfied that you responded. Baby steps. I look forward to more focused discussions with you that have a topic instead of just repeating talking points. You have read posts of mine that excoriate Thaksin, the PTP, and the UDD, but you have never read a post of mine that puts down the country people of Isaan in any way. My first wife is from Yasothon and I have many good but poor friends in Nong Khai, Buri Ram, and Yasothon. The Isaan people remind me so much of the Cajun people of south Louisiana that I grew up near. Salt of the Earth, have a distinct dialect, music, culture, dance and will take you in and treat you better than family. They deserve better than the Thai governments of the past and present. If we agree that the people come first, then we disagree only on who best will serve them. I may refer to your responses above as debate topics in the future if you are amenable.

[dinooz]

Doesn't Jutaporn have a date with the court in 2 days time to explain why he has breached his bail conditions ?

Suthep has been avoiding the courts for ages and he has arrest warrants for murder and insurrection against him, yet you neglect to mention this, I wonder why................

Suthep hasn't been arrested Why not? One would think the Red cops would jump at the chance to arrest him,he hasn't threatened civil war if he is arrested, then he can go before the courts,get off on bail with the stipulation he doesn't incite unrest,if he does he will be breaking his bail conditions and straight to jail just like your mate Jataporn.

[scorecard]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

" The United Front for Democracy against Dictatorship or the red-shirt movement"

Tippy-toe'ing about...Trying really, really hard to avoid political realities.

It wouldn't do to characterize these people for what they are, in contrast to their opposites.......One of being pro- electoral and Parliamentary Democrats and anti-Coup vs. coup advocacy and pro-establishment of a "Civilian Dictatorship"

This anti-UDD/RS/PTP media would be embarrassed by that.

Best to use their affinity clothing color descriptions, in order to avoid calling them what they are....If one calls them a pro-Democracy Movement suggests there must be one against it.....The coup advocates want to avoid and hide that fact...Heavens, what would an International audience think if they knew that.....Best to call themselves anti-Govt. and protesters, when knowledgeable people know they are neither...Coup advocacy is not that.......Normalizing their abnormal judiciary and Ind. Org's certainly blows enough smoke that International audiences will be unable to penetrate.

Lest PAD-Dem's are again moved to diminish rallies of this nature, they need to simply get themselves beyond the fact these people represent an electoral majority......And that majority is "ON" to all this deviousness noted above....They know a coup when they see one...Creeping, Judicial or whatever......Any...ANY...move to base Governance and the selection of a Prime Minister on less than an electoral foundation, is effectively a coup...No-one is fooling anyone by trying to make it appear otherwise......Certainly these people at this upcoming rally are not fooled by this coup advocacy chicanery of the Const. Court.

It is why Amsterdam indicated this CC does not have the legitimacy to call itself a "court".......The people attending this rally representing millions, agree with that, and show it by their attendance at this gatherings.

The UDD is NOT pro-democracy unless democracy means Thaksin dictatorship. They are massing in Bangkok to support Yingluck, not democracy. They support Thaksin, as you have stated many times, and not democracy. The UDD is a armed wing of Thaksin's PTP puppet government and used to intimidate the courts. (publishing judges phone numbers and addresses, blockading courts and threatening to arrest judges, launching grenades at the NACC, etc.). If the rural people of the north and northeast weren't so wedded to the personality cult of Thaksin, they would see how he uses/abuses them. Until the rural people create their own, grass-roots political organization and leaders, they will be exploited by either the old amart or the new amart (Thaksin). Why don't you support the rural people instead of the corrupt, megalomaniac Thaksin? Why, in your opinion, is Thaksin the only route to empowerment for the rural people? You talk about the 'chicanery' of the courts, what about the chicanery of the PTP and the heavy-handed way they govern? Why, even when they have no real opposition, can't they follow the rules/laws? Why do they follow, in lockstep, the bidding of a fugitive felon who doesn't even live in Thailand? You talk about blowing smoke. There's not enough smoke in the world to hide the misdeeds, incompetence, and larceny of Thaksin and his PTP puppet government. And now that the government is having to answer for its behavior, people like you, and Thaksin's UDD, are running around with your hair on fire as if the world is ending. I, for one can hardly wait for that world to end so Thailand can live up to its name, 'Land of the Free'.

It is why Amsterdam indicated this CC does not have the legitimacy to call itself a "court".

If Amsterdam weren't on Thaksin's payroll and were a fair man, he would say the PTP government does not have the legitimacy to call itself a "government".

I've asked you five questions. Your history shows you will not answer any of them but you WILL bluster on about Suthep, judicial coup, disrespecting the will of the majority, etc.

"I've asked you five questions. Your history shows you will not answer any of them"

• Why don't you support the rural people instead of the corrupt, megalomaniac Thaksin?

PAD-Dem coup-makers characterizations of Thaksin as in this quote, is self-serving propaganda trying to justify their non-electoral power-grab...Something they are trying to do all over again......

If such characterizations were anything more than Opposition, coup-maker self-serving folderol, do you honestly believe an entire Thai Electorate could be so blind as to vote for someone like that...both before the 2006 coup, and the last election where he was transparently front-and-center? Don't believe all the unelectable, coup-advocacy stuff for heaven's sake....Be reasonable.

I support and respect the rural people same as all the Thai electorate....The fact they voted for Thaksin and his post-2006 coup political elements have solid reasons....too voluminous to get into here...but believe me, there are many reasons why they voted as they have, and relegated the PAD-Dem's to their minority role.

• Why, in your opinion, is Thaksin the only route to empowerment for the rural people?

A short answer...Because he introduced political programs that reflected their needs......Something i wish the DP would do in order to bring about a competitive electoral situation, and by extension, a balance of power in Parliament.

The reason he and his current political elements seem to be the only route of "empowerment for the rural people" is because the DP is not offering it....All they hear from them is how stupid they are, how politically uni-dimensional they are (Thaksin), how they are politicized to such a low level as to only be motivated by money......None of that is true, but it sure demonizes the DP in the eyes of the electoral majority, and deprives them of any chance at electoral success....By appeasing their own narrow political base, they are alienating themselves from a majority electorate they need in the future.....Very, very stupid.

• You talk about the 'chicanery' of the courts, what about the chicanery of the PTP and the heavy-handed way they govern?

They are not governing heavy-handedly.....They are not governing any differently than any other Parliamentary majority elsewhere......Don't let that idiot mantra of the unelectables regarding "Parliamentary Dictatorship" fool you....In fact, I would argue that the PTP have not been heavy-handed enough...There are a number of electoral planks on the basis of which they were elected, that they have allowed Opposition noise to intimidate them away from....Just one case in point, is Constitutional Reform....I could cite many more...the UDD/RS have been quite critically vocal about the non-aggressive approach by the PTP when they have an electoral mandate to deliver......Bitching about Parliamentray procedural stuff by the PAD-Dem's, are typical complaints from all parliamentary minorities....If the don't like it, win a d... election.

• Why, even when they have no real opposition, can't they follow the rules/laws?

The politicized abnormality of the judiciary and Ind. Org's.....That is why....It is in the interest of the Opposition to characterize these things as normal. Thereby painting resistance to that politicized opposition via non-parliamentary sources, as being unlawful....Standing up to the Elitist and 2006 coup-rooted CC, NACC, anti-election election commission, etc, etc is not seen as unlawful by the electoral majority....Only by the self-serving Elitist side of the political divide. They also know the truth about this, but phonily paint their opposition as being unlawful.

• Why do they follow, in lockstep, the bidding of a fugitive felon who doesn't even live in Thailand?

They don't, but Opposition PAD-dem's like to paint them as such.....It is this uni-dimensional denigration they like to foist on their political opposites....It is their way of showing how stupid the voters are who don't vote for them...Totally being unaware of how politicized these people are.

That said, it is undeniable that he exercises influence...as he should.....The 2006 Coup-makers did not deprive him of electoral legitimacy. Instead it was them, who were summarily dismissed by the electorate. Most Prime Ministerial offices are collegial in approach, with advisors of various strengths contributing.....

He is not a fugitive felon....Coup-maker victors-justice does not a fugitive felon make...It is just PAD-Dem demagoguery trying to diminish their electoral nemesis...Don't be fooled by that idiocy....He is a self-exiled from politically motivated vendettas, via those politicized entities I referenced above....It is not by accident the anti-UDD/RS/PTP media cannot reference Thaksin without using the derogatory 'fugitive' label.....it is just more manifestation of their anti-UDD/RS/PTP orientation....But some believe that s...t as being gospel....And I suppose one cannot blame them, if that is all they read day-after-day over their coffee at Starbucks.

Phew...enough already.

Well it should be that all citizens have an equal voice. No argument with that whatever.

You say:

"

• Why, in your opinion, is Thaksin the only route to empowerment for the rural people?

A short answer...Because he introduced political programs that reflected their needs......Something i wish the DP would do in order to bring about a competitive electoral situation, and by extension, a balance of power in Parliament."

I see you spin skills along with comments which are lacking in full truth are alive and well.

"Because he introduced political programs that reflected their needs......" And please note they haven't been paid, some now 6 months overdue and no ongoing substantive comments from the ministers involved, and even worse somehow they have been silenced. What a great example of the democracy you and the fake puppet claim you are protecting.

Your last paragraph is just blatantly untrue. Shame on you.

Edited April 16, 2014 by scorecard

[Nickymaster]

Doesn't Jutaporn have a date with the court in 2 days time to explain why he has breached his bail conditions ?

Suthep has been avoiding the courts for ages and he has arrest warrants for murder and insurrection against him, yet you neglect to mention this, I wonder why................

Wonder why??? Uuhh what's the topic called again?

[issanaus]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

" The United Front for Democracy against Dictatorship or the red-shirt movement"

Tippy-toe'ing about...Trying really, really hard to avoid political realities.

It wouldn't do to characterize these people for what they are, in contrast to their opposites.......One of being pro- electoral and Parliamentary Democrats and anti-Coup vs. coup advocacy and pro-establishment of a "Civilian Dictatorship"

This anti-UDD/RS/PTP media would be embarrassed by that.

Best to use their affinity clothing color descriptions, in order to avoid calling them what they are....If one calls them a pro-Democracy Movement suggests there must be one against it.....The coup advocates want to avoid and hide that fact...Heavens, what would an International audience think if they knew that.....Best to call themselves anti-Govt. and protesters, when knowledgeable people know they are neither...Coup advocacy is not that.......Normalizing their abnormal judiciary and Ind. Org's certainly blows enough smoke that International audiences will be unable to penetrate.

Lest PAD-Dem's are again moved to diminish rallies of this nature, they need to simply get themselves beyond the fact these people represent an electoral majority......And that majority is "ON" to all this deviousness noted above....They know a coup when they see one...Creeping, Judicial or whatever......Any...ANY...move to base Governance and the selection of a Prime Minister on less than an electoral foundation, is effectively a coup...No-one is fooling anyone by trying to make it appear otherwise......Certainly these people at this upcoming rally are not fooled by this coup advocacy chicanery of the Const. Court.

It is why Amsterdam indicated this CC does not have the legitimacy to call itself a "court".......The people attending this rally representing millions, agree with that, and show it by their attendance at this gatherings.

The UDD is NOT pro-democracy unless democracy means Thaksin dictatorship. They are massing in Bangkok to support Yingluck, not democracy. They support Thaksin, as you have stated many times, and not democracy. The UDD is a armed wing of Thaksin's PTP puppet government and used to intimidate the courts. (publishing judges phone numbers and addresses, blockading courts and threatening to arrest judges, launching grenades at the NACC, etc.). If the rural people of the north and northeast weren't so wedded to the personality cult of Thaksin, they would see how he uses/abuses them. Until the rural people create their own, grass-roots political organization and leaders, they will be exploited by either the old amart or the new amart (Thaksin). Why don't you support the rural people instead of the corrupt, megalomaniac Thaksin? Why, in your opinion, is Thaksin the only route to empowerment for the rural people? You talk about the 'chicanery' of the courts, what about the chicanery of the PTP and the heavy-handed way they govern? Why, even when they have no real opposition, can't they follow the rules/laws? Why do they follow, in lockstep, the bidding of a fugitive felon who doesn't even live in Thailand? You talk about blowing smoke. There's not enough smoke in the world to hide the misdeeds, incompetence, and larceny of Thaksin and his PTP puppet government. And now that the government is having to answer for its behavior, people like you, and Thaksin's UDD, are running around with your hair on fire as if the world is ending. I, for one can hardly wait for that world to end so Thailand can live up to its name, 'Land of the Free'.

It is why Amsterdam indicated this CC does not have the legitimacy to call itself a "court".

If Amsterdam weren't on Thaksin's payroll and were a fair man, he would say the PTP government does not have the legitimacy to call itself a "government".

I've asked you five questions. Your history shows you will not answer any of them but you WILL bluster on about Suthep, judicial coup, disrespecting the will of the majority, etc.

"I've asked you five questions. Your history shows you will not answer any of them"

• Why don't you support the rural people instead of the corrupt, megalomaniac Thaksin?

PAD-Dem coup-makers characterizations of Thaksin as in this quote, is self-serving propaganda trying to justify their non-electoral power-grab...Something they are trying to do all over again......

If such characterizations were anything more than Opposition, coup-maker self-serving folderol, do you honestly believe an entire Thai Electorate could be so blind as to vote for someone like that...both before the 2006 coup, and the last election where he was transparently front-and-center? Don't believe all the unelectable, coup-advocacy stuff for heaven's sake....Be reasonable.

I support and respect the rural people same as all the Thai electorate....The fact they voted for Thaksin and his post-2006 coup political elements have solid reasons....too voluminous to get into here...but believe me, there are many reasons why they voted as they have, and relegated the PAD-Dem's to their minority role.

• Why, in your opinion, is Thaksin the only route to empowerment for the rural people?

A short answer...Because he introduced political programs that reflected their needs......Something i wish the DP would do in order to bring about a competitive electoral situation, and by extension, a balance of power in Parliament.

The reason he and his current political elements seem to be the only route of "empowerment for the rural people" is because the DP is not offering it....All they hear from them is how stupid they are, how politically uni-dimensional they are (Thaksin), how they are politicized to such a low level as to only be motivated by money......None of that is true, but it sure demonizes the DP in the eyes of the electoral majority, and deprives them of any chance at electoral success....By appeasing their own narrow political base, they are alienating themselves from a majority electorate they need in the future.....Very, very stupid.

• You talk about the 'chicanery' of the courts, what about the chicanery of the PTP and the heavy-handed way they govern?

They are not governing heavy-handedly.....They are not governing any differently than any other Parliamentary majority elsewhere......Don't let that idiot mantra of the unelectables regarding "Parliamentary Dictatorship" fool you....In fact, I would argue that the PTP have not been heavy-handed enough...There are a number of electoral planks on the basis of which they were elected, that they have allowed Opposition noise to intimidate them away from....Just one case in point, is Constitutional Reform....I could cite many more...the UDD/RS have been quite critically vocal about the non-aggressive approach by the PTP when they have an electoral mandate to deliver......Bitching about Parliamentray procedural stuff by the PAD-Dem's, are typical complaints from all parliamentary minorities....If the don't like it, win a d... election.

• Why, even when they have no real opposition, can't they follow the rules/laws?

The politicized abnormality of the judiciary and Ind. Org's.....That is why....It is in the interest of the Opposition to characterize these things as normal. Thereby painting resistance to that politicized opposition via non-parliamentary sources, as being unlawful....Standing up to the Elitist and 2006 coup-rooted CC, NACC, anti-election election commission, etc, etc is not seen as unlawful by the electoral majority....Only by the self-serving Elitist side of the political divide. They also know the truth about this, but phonily paint their opposition as being unlawful.

• Why do they follow, in lockstep, the bidding of a fugitive felon who doesn't even live in Thailand?

They don't, but Opposition PAD-dem's like to paint them as such.....It is this uni-dimensional denigration they like to foist on their political opposites....It is their way of showing how stupid the voters are who don't vote for them...Totally being unaware of how politicized these people are.

That said, it is undeniable that he exercises influence...as he should.....The 2006 Coup-makers did not deprive him of electoral legitimacy. Instead it was them, who were summarily dismissed by the electorate. Most Prime Ministerial offices are collegial in approach, with advisors of various strengths contributing.....

He is not a fugitive felon....Coup-maker victors-justice does not a fugitive felon make...It is just PAD-Dem demagoguery trying to diminish their electoral nemesis...Don't be fooled by that idiocy....He is a self-exiled from politically motivated vendettas, via those politicized entities I referenced above....It is not by accident the anti-UDD/RS/PTP media cannot reference Thaksin without using the derogatory 'fugitive' label.....it is just more manifestation of their anti-UDD/RS/PTP orientation....But some believe that s...t as being gospel....And I suppose one cannot blame them, if that is all they read day-after-day over their coffee at Starbucks.

Phew...enough already.

Well it should be that all citizens have an equal voice. No argument with that whatever.

You say:

"

• Why, in your opinion, is Thaksin the only route to empowerment for the rural people?

A short answer...Because he introduced political programs that reflected their needs......Something i wish the DP would do in order to bring about a competitive electoral situation, and by extension, a balance of power in Parliament."

I see you spin skills along with comments which are lacking in full truth are alive and well.

"Because he introduced political programs that reflected their needs......" And please note they haven't been paid, some now 6 months overdue and no ongoing substantive comments from the ministers involved, and even worse somehow they have been silenced. What a great example of the democracy you and the fake puppet claim you are protecting.

Your last paragraph is just blatantly untrue. Same on you.

Please be fair to FB, Taksin did introduce some programs - its just that they were not seen through - normally cause the money had disappeared into some one pocket or there was chronic mismanagement.

[djjamie]

“If our numbers are more than those of the People’s Democratic Reform Committee, it will demonstrate to Suthep Thaugsuban, the PDRC secretary-general, so that he will not become so arrogant,”

​I refute that argument. Protest numbers mean nothing as to who holds the majority. The PDRC know that. The UDD know that and one can only assume the UDD supporters know that though with some of the logic exuded by them one may be forgiven for hypothesizing that might not be the case.

You know the best way to judge a majority. That's right, with elections. The 2014 elections however did not suit the PTP agenda so we won't look at that election failure. The 1992 coup monger, Thaksin has learnt from his coup monger friends to bend results, demonize results and plain out make up results to suit the Shin agenda. So if we can't use the 2014 election failure as a bench mark we can only go back to 2011. Next election that is tabulated and the PTP don't win then don't expect them to go as gracefully as the DEM's did in 2011. Don't expect them to accept the results. Give me one example of the PTP accepting anything, ANYTHING, that went against them. Nothing so election results will be no different. The majority is just a convenience they can use after the 2011 election to support any argument. When they lose that majority and can't use it in the argument they will fall back onto their other argument and say the electoral system is DEM rooted. The DEM's cheated, the PDRC intimidated the red shirts. The list will be as long as the movie "Titanic"

So rest assured they love to say majority now with their only gauge to that being 3 years ago, but rest assured when they lose the majority it will be inconsequential to their argument. As it stands today they ignore all indications that they don't have the majority and pretend they still do. That is the coup mongers logic right there.

Coup Mongers? Uhhh? Are you crazy djjamie? If we call supporter numbers a majority of the country one can also use that same logic to dictate who the true coup mongers are by tallying results. In the last 20 years thaksin has denounced one coup (because it removed his ability to create personal wealth) and openly supported another coup (because it gave him the ability to create personal wealth). Ahbisit denounced 2 coups. So the results are in on coup support, Shin - 1 DEM -0.

So bring 1 million protestors into the street UDD. Heck, bring 2 million. In the words of the UDD supporters on TVF though "2 million is not a majority".

[Fryslan boppe]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

" The United Front for Democracy against Dictatorship or the red-shirt movement"

Tippy-toe'ing about...Trying really, really hard to avoid political realities.

It wouldn't do to characterize these people for what they are, in contrast to their opposites.......One of being pro- electoral and Parliamentary Democrats and anti-Coup vs. coup advocacy and pro-establishment of a "Civilian Dictatorship"

This anti-UDD/RS/PTP media would be embarrassed by that.

Best to use their affinity clothing color descriptions, in order to avoid calling them what they are....If one calls them a pro-Democracy Movement suggests there must be one against it.....The coup advocates want to avoid and hide that fact...Heavens, what would an International audience think if they knew that.....Best to call themselves anti-Govt. and protesters, when knowledgeable people know they are neither...Coup advocacy is not that.......Normalizing their abnormal judiciary and Ind. Org's certainly blows enough smoke that International audiences will be unable to penetrate.

Lest PAD-Dem's are again moved to diminish rallies of this nature, they need to simply get themselves beyond the fact these people represent an electoral majority......And that majority is "ON" to all this deviousness noted above....They know a coup when they see one...Creeping, Judicial or whatever......Any...ANY...move to base Governance and the selection of a Prime Minister on less than an electoral foundation, is effectively a coup...No-one is fooling anyone by trying to make it appear otherwise......Certainly these people at this upcoming rally are not fooled by this coup advocacy chicanery of the Const. Court.

It is why Amsterdam indicated this CC does not have the legitimacy to call itself a "court".......The people attending this rally representing millions, agree with that, and show it by their attendance at this gatherings.

The UDD is NOT pro-democracy unless democracy means Thaksin dictatorship. They are massing in Bangkok to support Yingluck, not democracy. They support Thaksin, as you have stated many times, and not democracy. The UDD is a armed wing of Thaksin's PTP puppet government and used to intimidate the courts. (publishing judges phone numbers and addresses, blockading courts and threatening to arrest judges, launching grenades at the NACC, etc.). If the rural people of the north and northeast weren't so wedded to the personality cult of Thaksin, they would see how he uses/abuses them. Until the rural people create their own, grass-roots political organization and leaders, they will be exploited by either the old amart or the new amart (Thaksin). Why don't you support the rural people instead of the corrupt, megalomaniac Thaksin? Why, in your opinion, is Thaksin the only route to empowerment for the rural people? You talk about the 'chicanery' of the courts, what about the chicanery of the PTP and the heavy-handed way they govern? Why, even when they have no real opposition, can't they follow the rules/laws? Why do they follow, in lockstep, the bidding of a fugitive felon who doesn't even live in Thailand? You talk about blowing smoke. There's not enough smoke in the world to hide the misdeeds, incompetence, and larceny of Thaksin and his PTP puppet government. And now that the government is having to answer for its behavior, people like you, and Thaksin's UDD, are running around with your hair on fire as if the world is ending. I, for one can hardly wait for that world to end so Thailand can live up to its name, 'Land of the Free'.

It is why Amsterdam indicated this CC does not have the legitimacy to call itself a "court".

If Amsterdam weren't on Thaksin's payroll and were a fair man, he would say the PTP government does not have the legitimacy to call itself a "government".

I've asked you five questions. Your history shows you will not answer any of them but you WILL bluster on about Suthep, judicial coup, disrespecting the will of the majority, etc.

"I've asked you five questions. Your history shows you will not answer any of them"

• Why don't you support the rural people instead of the corrupt, megalomaniac Thaksin?

PAD-Dem coup-makers characterizations of Thaksin as in this quote, is self-serving propaganda trying to justify their non-electoral power-grab...Something they are trying to do all over again......

If such characterizations were anything more than Opposition, coup-maker self-serving folderol, do you honestly believe an entire Thai Electorate could be so blind as to vote for someone like that...both before the 2006 coup, and the last election where he was transparently front-and-center? Don't believe all the unelectable, coup-advocacy stuff for heaven's sake....Be reasonable.

I support and respect the rural people same as all the Thai electorate....The fact they voted for Thaksin and his post-2006 coup political elements have solid reasons....too voluminous to get into here...but believe me, there are many reasons why they voted as they have, and relegated the PAD-Dem's to their minority role.

• Why, in your opinion, is Thaksin the only route to empowerment for the rural people?

A short answer...Because he introduced political programs that reflected their needs......Something i wish the DP would do in order to bring about a competitive electoral situation, and by extension, a balance of power in Parliament.

The reason he and his current political elements seem to be the only route of "empowerment for the rural people" is because the DP is not offering it....All they hear from them is how stupid they are, how politically uni-dimensional they are (Thaksin), how they are politicized to such a low level as to only be motivated by money......None of that is true, but it sure demonizes the DP in the eyes of the electoral majority, and deprives them of any chance at electoral success....By appeasing their own narrow political base, they are alienating themselves from a majority electorate they need in the future.....Very, very stupid.

• You talk about the 'chicanery' of the courts, what about the chicanery of the PTP and the heavy-handed way they govern?

They are not governing heavy-handedly.....They are not governing any differently than any other Parliamentary majority elsewhere......Don't let that idiot mantra of the unelectables regarding "Parliamentary Dictatorship" fool you....In fact, I would argue that the PTP have not been heavy-handed enough...There are a number of electoral planks on the basis of which they were elected, that they have allowed Opposition noise to intimidate them away from....Just one case in point, is Constitutional Reform....I could cite many more...the UDD/RS have been quite critically vocal about the non-aggressive approach by the PTP when they have an electoral mandate to deliver......Bitching about Parliamentray procedural stuff by the PAD-Dem's, are typical complaints from all parliamentary minorities....If the don't like it, win a d... election.

• Why, even when they have no real opposition, can't they follow the rules/laws?

The politicized abnormality of the judiciary and Ind. Org's.....That is why....It is in the interest of the Opposition to characterize these things as normal. Thereby painting resistance to that politicized opposition via non-parliamentary sources, as being unlawful....Standing up to the Elitist and 2006 coup-rooted CC, NACC, anti-election election commission, etc, etc is not seen as unlawful by the electoral majority....Only by the self-serving Elitist side of the political divide. They also know the truth about this, but phonily paint their opposition as being unlawful.

• Why do they follow, in lockstep, the bidding of a fugitive felon who doesn't even live in Thailand?

They don't, but Opposition PAD-dem's like to paint them as such.....It is this uni-dimensional denigration they like to foist on their political opposites....It is their way of showing how stupid the voters are who don't vote for them...Totally being unaware of how politicized these people are.

That said, it is undeniable that he exercises influence...as he should.....The 2006 Coup-makers did not deprive him of electoral legitimacy. Instead it was them, who were summarily dismissed by the electorate. Most Prime Ministerial offices are collegial in approach, with advisors of various strengths contributing.....

He is not a fugitive felon....Coup-maker victors-justice does not a fugitive felon make...It is just PAD-Dem demagoguery trying to diminish their electoral nemesis...Don't be fooled by that idiocy....He is a self-exiled from politically motivated vendettas, via those politicized entities I referenced above....It is not by accident the anti-UDD/RS/PTP media cannot reference Thaksin without using the derogatory 'fugitive' label.....it is just more manifestation of their anti-UDD/RS/PTP orientation....But some believe that s...t as being gospel....And I suppose one cannot blame them, if that is all they read day-after-day over their coffee at Starbucks.

Phew...enough already.

Well it should be that all citizens have an equal voice. No argument with that whatever.

You say:

"

• Why, in your opinion, is Thaksin the only route to empowerment for the rural people?

A short answer...Because he introduced political programs that reflected their needs......Something i wish the DP would do in order to bring about a competitive electoral situation, and by extension, a balance of power in Parliament."

I see you spin skills along with comments which are lacking in full truth are alive and well.

"Because he introduced political programs that reflected their needs......" And please note they haven't been paid, some now 6 months overdue and no ongoing substantive comments from the ministers involved, and even worse somehow they have been silenced. What a great example of the democracy you and the fake puppet claim you are protecting.

Your last paragraph is just blatantly untrue. Same on you.

"I see you spin skills along with comments which are lacking in full truth are alive and well.

Your last paragraph is just blatantly untrue. Same on you".

I think it would be to everyone's advantage to have competitive elections and a balance of power in parliament.

It could be argued that all of this political noise of late has its' ultimate roots in that lack of a balance of power in parliament.

If there were competitive elections with a change in Government regularly, and a balance of power in parliament where the minority didn't feel irrelevant because of their perpetual minority status, many political problems would evaporate.

IMHO

Edited April 16, 2014 by Fryslan boppe

[rametindallas]

This refers to Red Shirt protest outside of Bangkok on April 5. Over the past months calls from Red Shirt supporters have grown for a new state to be formed in the north to protect the Yingluck government.
The joke is that the army checkpoints in Bangkok really scare the separatist Red Shirts who wish to occupy Bangkok like they did in 2009 and 2010

[northernjohn]

Two side playing ego trips, double or nothing, stakes - the people of Thailand

Both of these character are choosing to be part of the problem rather than part of the solution

Well you have a point there.

But at what point does the anti government protestors cross the line between pointing out the corruption in the existing regime and giving good suggestions to solving the problem and becoming a part of the problem.

Where would you put that line.

We know that if the anti government demonstrators go home the whole thing will be relegated to the not important files in the present government.

Don't forget you said part of the solution. That requires a continued knowledge of the problem. Where is that line?

[northernjohn]

Get the photoshop ready.... the millions of reds are about to descend on BKK again.

Hope they bring plenty of bin liners this time, surely they must be feeling a bit embarrassed that the country are all calling them filthy scumbags.

Most of them don't know what that is.

[northernjohn]

"of" or "for" democracy? It looks like they've misprinted another one of their signs.

good eye

“If our numbers are more than those of the People’s Democratic Reform Committee, it will demonstrate to Suthep Thaugsuban, the PDRC secretary-general, so that he will not become so arrogant,” said Mrs Thida, adding that this would be an appropriate time for all red shirts to come out.

UDD chairman Jatuporn Promphan, meanwhile, vowed that the red-shirt followers would not return unless they win the battle.

So now they have a leader who is a communist step down and become their advisor?

What battle is Jatuporn referring to?

Just because a couple of unemployable red shirts come to turn part of Bangkok into a pig sty the court is not going to be influenced one bit.

They are operating based on the law not money from a foreign land.

[Baerboxer]

" The United Front for Democracy against Dictatorship or the red-shirt movement"

Tippy-toe'ing about...Trying really, really hard to avoid political realities.

It wouldn't do to characterize these people for what they are, in contrast to their opposites.......One of being pro- electoral and Parliamentary Democrats and anti-Coup vs. coup advocacy and pro-establishment of a "Civilian Dictatorship"

This anti-UDD/RS/PTP media would be embarrassed by that.

Best to use their affinity clothing color descriptions, in order to avoid calling them what they are....If one calls them a pro-Democracy Movement suggests there must be one against it.....The coup advocates want to avoid and hide that fact...Heavens, what would an International audience think if they knew that.....Best to call themselves anti-Govt. and protesters, when knowledgeable people know they are neither...Coup advocacy is not that.......Normalizing their abnormal judiciary and Ind. Org's certainly blows enough smoke that International audiences will be unable to penetrate.

Lest PAD-Dem's are again moved to diminish rallies of this nature, they need to simply get themselves beyond the fact these people represent an electoral majority......And that majority is "ON" to all this deviousness noted above....They know a coup when they see one...Creeping, Judicial or whatever......Any...ANY...move to base Governance and the selection of a Prime Minister on less than an electoral foundation, is effectively a coup...No-one is fooling anyone by trying to make it appear otherwise......Certainly these people at this upcoming rally are not fooled by this coup advocacy chicanery of the Const. Court.

It is why Amsterdam indicated this CC does not have the legitimacy to call itself a "court".......The people attending this rally representing millions, agree with that, and show it by their attendance at this gatherings.

Gibberish nonsense.

The UDD/Red shirt/PTP Thaksin dictatorship faction are, if anything, less inclined towards real democratic principles than their opponents. Neither is pro-democracy in the real sense. Both want full unbridled and unaccountable power. Thaksin's parties are greedier, more inept, and more arrogantly in your face. That's the main difference.

You can pretend otherwise and join the Thaksin PR machine in trying to pretend this is a "people's crusade" for democracy, rather than the removal of a very corrupt regime if you wish.

Who cares what Amsterdam thinks, indicates or says on Skype? He's a paid lackey of Thaksin and says what he'e paid to say. Bringing Thai courts into disrepute and appearing, albeit via Skype like his boss, at political rallies will hopefully lead to his arrest should he ever be brave enough to visit Thailand in person.

[Melyn]

The red shirts came in two by two

To call the court a kangaroo

They all were there except for Poo

Now they number just a few

The end is now in sight

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[than]

PT/ Red never adhere to democracy rules. Because they never accept check of balance . For them, Government must control Judiciary and election system like other "great democracy" in Africa (Mozambique, Chad, Sudan....). 2007 charter give Thailand a real checking system independent from power like all real Democracy in Europe and US. In these countries all politicians could be investigate by judge without pressure from their partisan (like UDD). All accept separation of power.

This control permit to fight corruption and prevent government to become dictatorial.

Since case erupt against YL, reds followers lose a lot of partisans because a lot of them saw that PT/YL put themselves in this delicate situation. A lot of them are farmer and they saw the promise failure of YL administration with rice scheme, how many of them live in extreme poverty after believe the liar of this administration. How many of them commit suicide or attempt because their lose their money for this scheme ? PT/UDD know their lose a base in northern province last election result show this. Last demonstration show this too... UDD largely fail to reach the numbers of protester that they claimed before this.....

And now some of their leader are discredit UDD in eyes of more thai people with their action or support to violence.

In conclusion, PT/Taksin are afraid by democracy.

[Morch]

" The United Front for Democracy against Dictatorship or the red-shirt movement"

Tippy-toe'ing about...Trying really, really hard to avoid political realities.

It wouldn't do to characterize these people for what they are, in contrast to their opposites.......One of being pro- electoral and Parliamentary Democrats and anti-Coup vs. coup advocacy and pro-establishment of a "Civilian Dictatorship"

This anti-UDD/RS/PTP media would be embarrassed by that.

Best to use their affinity clothing color descriptions, in order to avoid calling them what they are....If one calls them a pro-Democracy Movement suggests there must be one against it.....The coup advocates want to avoid and hide that fact...Heavens, what would an International audience think if they knew that.....Best to call themselves anti-Govt. and protesters, when knowledgeable people know they are neither...Coup advocacy is not that.......Normalizing their abnormal judiciary and Ind. Org's certainly blows enough smoke that International audiences will be unable to penetrate.

Lest PAD-Dem's are again moved to diminish rallies of this nature, they need to simply get themselves beyond the fact these people represent an electoral majority......And that majority is "ON" to all this deviousness noted above....They know a coup when they see one...Creeping, Judicial or whatever......Any...ANY...move to base Governance and the selection of a Prime Minister on less than an electoral foundation, is effectively a coup...No-one is fooling anyone by trying to make it appear otherwise......Certainly these people at this upcoming rally are not fooled by this coup advocacy chicanery of the Const. Court.

It is why Amsterdam indicated this CC does not have the legitimacy to call itself a "court".......The people attending this rally representing millions, agree with that, and show it by their attendance at this gatherings.

Aren't the UDD in the habit of referring to themselves as red-shirts?

[Morch]

“If our numbers are more than those of the People’s Democratic Reform Committee, it will demonstrate to Suthep Thaugsuban, the PDRC secretary-general, so that he will not become so arrogant,”

​I refute that argument. Protest numbers mean nothing as to who holds the majority. The PDRC know that. The UDD know that and one can only assume the UDD supporters know that though with some of the logic exuded by them one may be forgiven for hypothesizing that might not be the case.

You know the best way to judge a majority. That's right, with elections. The 2014 elections however did not suit the PTP agenda so we won't look at that election failure. The 1992 coup monger, Thaksin has learnt from his coup monger friends to bend results, demonize results and plain out make up results to suit the Shin agenda. So if we can't use the 2014 election failure as a bench mark we can only go back to 2011. Next election that is tabulated and the PTP don't win then don't expect them to go as gracefully as the DEM's did in 2011. Don't expect them to accept the results. Give me one example of the PTP accepting anything, ANYTHING, that went against them. Nothing so election results will be no different. The majority is just a convenience they can use after the 2011 election to support any argument. When they lose that majority and can't use it in the argument they will fall back onto their other argument and say the electoral system is DEM rooted. The DEM's cheated, the PDRC intimidated the red shirts. The list will be as long as the movie "Titanic"

So rest assured they love to say majority now with their only gauge to that being 3 years ago, but rest assured when they lose the majority it will be inconsequential to their argument. As it stands today they ignore all indications that they don't have the majority and pretend they still do. That is the coup mongers logic right there.

Coup Mongers? Uhhh? Are you crazy djjamie? If we call supporter numbers a majority of the country one can also use that same logic to dictate who the true coup mongers are by tallying results. In the last 20 years thaksin has denounced one coup (because it removed his ability to create personal wealth) and openly supported another coup (because it gave him the ability to create personal wealth). Ahbisit denounced 2 coups. So the results are in on coup support, Shin - 1 DEM -0.

So bring 1 million protestors into the street UDD. Heck, bring 2 million. In the words of the UDD supporters on TVF though "2 million is not a majority".

Could you please post the 2014 elections results, then?

[The stuttering parrot]

I can't work some of these posts out.

The red shorts announce they are going to march or protest and the yellow shirts say they are going to March or protest and the the tv posters come on here and write the same lines over and over again day after day month after month year after year.

I think most of you guys just get off by winding each other up which is ok but how about some new material.

Jeez it was reported yesterday that yingluck went to a temple and bang of we go again.

It pretty much boils down to what I said yesterday that sutep and co are afraid of the ballot box so on it goes until the next election and we all know the result.

[issanaus]

Two side playing ego trips, double or nothing, stakes - the people of Thailand

Both of these character are choosing to be part of the problem rather than part of the solution

Well you have a point there.

But at what point does the anti government protestors cross the line between pointing out the corruption in the existing regime and giving good suggestions to solving the problem and becoming a part of the problem.

Where would you put that line.

We know that if the anti government demonstrators go home the whole thing will be relegated to the not important files in the present government.

Don't forget you said part of the solution. That requires a continued knowledge of the problem. Where is that line?

Yes it has to be kept in the spotlight

My concern is that the issue is far more than the personal ambition of anyone (or any family for that matter)

In relation to the reform side of the divide I see far to much denigration of rural people and a failure to give recognition that those opposed the amnesty bill and the PTP government is far wider than the democrats or BKK residents. For the reforms to succeed the country (not just some geographical section) needs to go along with the process. The perception in some parts of the country is that they no longer have a part to play.

In my view taking the bait to see who can organise the biggest rally was a very bad mistake. I have no doubt that the reform movement can get more people to a protest but the protest / showing support for the CC will potential cause more problems.

My guess is that if (as would appear likely) the CC rules against Yinluck/PTP - the radicals within the red movement will seek to engineer an over reaction from the security forces. A perception of an over reaction might help them to regain some of the support that they have lost by the many betrayals of those who had voted them into power in the last election. Having to deal with both protests will make the job of security harder and increase the case of success in what can only be described as terrorists tactics

[barnsleyman]

It's getting tedious,& quite frankly,boring, reading the comments & threads being posted on here about Thailand,it's politicians,of both parties by Farangs.

It's about time that the Farangs realised that we chose to come here,& many of us chose to get married to Thai Ladies/ Males stay & live here, & abide with this countries Laws.

Any person who is not a Thai national is a Farang, & therefore we cannot vote,or have any say in how the country is run, so it amazes me why Farangs are constantly critising this country,it's people, the Goverment & the opposition party.

Get real,we are Guests & always will be in this wonderful,& beautiful country,& consequently have no say whatsoever in how it's governed & run.

Please try to keep your thoughts to yourself because constantly whinging & moaning doesn't matter one little bit, if you don't like what's happening here in Thailand, then leave & go home to your Mother country, nobody is forcing you to stay.

Edited April 16, 2014 by barnsleyman

[Fryslan boppe]

It's getting tedious,& quite frankly,boring, reading the comments & threads being posted on here about Thailand,it's politicians,of both parties by Farangs.

It's about time that the Farangs realised that we chose to come here,& many of us chose to get married to Thai Ladies/ Males stay & live here, & abide with this countries Laws.

Any person who is not a Thai national is a Farang, & therefore we cannot vote,or have any say in how the country is run, so it amazes me why Farangs are constantly critising this country,it's people, the Goverment & the opposition party.

Get real,we are Guests & always will be in this wonderful,& beautiful country,& consequently have no say whatsoever in how it's governed & run.

Please try to keep your thoughts to yourself because constantly whinging & moaning doesn't matter one little bit, if you don't like what's happening here in Thailand, then leave & go home to your Mother country, nobody is forcing you to say.

It is what Political junkies do....opinionate, bloviate, pontificate about Politics....Is that a problem?....

Would you rather Political Junkies on this Board wax loud and long about Ukraine, American, Canadian, or Frisian Politics?

We know we are inconsequential.....The UDD/Red Shirts know we are inconsequential and don't give a rats ass about what we think, given their unilingual approach.

If Political Junkie hot air bothers someone, why would they be on these political dicussion Boards....Go discuss the intricacies of marrying Thai ladies on some other thread instead.

[outsider]

Another case of looking over to the next stall to see who has the biggest. Really curious when Thailand will grow up and handle situations and issues in a matured and diplomatic way. Too much to ask for, I presume...

[barnsleyman]

Fryslan boppe

We know we are inconsequential.....The UDD/Red Shirts know we are inconsequential and don't give a rats ass about what we think, given their unilingual approach.

You said it, so stop being a sad person, posting about something you can't do anything about,

Find something less boring to do...............................like watching a nettle grow in your garden.

Grow up, act your age,not your hat size

[tingtongteesood]

I wonder how many Burmese will be 'rented' this time ? When their rally site is named, the BMA should take 8 tons of litter ( like the reds left behind them last time ) and dump it at the new rally site...mwuhahahahaha!!