Teacher Hitting Kids!

[junglechef]

My 10 yr old son came home from school yesterday, Gowitamlung School near Tanin Market, and said that after class when the kids line up outside to listen to the Kings Anthem ect. a few of the boys, incl. mine, were fooling around a bit while waiting for it to start (boys being boys after a longday of school). Thier homeroom teacher, a youg man in his twenties, made all the boys in the class, around 28, line up and he hit each one on the palm/wrist area with a 30 cm aluminum ruler, which had sharp edges, leaving some with welts and others bleeding oh so slightly (mine had a slight discoloration if you looked hard).

Luckily there is a parent/teacher day tomorrow with the principle also being there so it's a prefect time to address the issue.

Interested in opinions on how to deal with this. The following is a little more backround and some more details incl. some of my personal attutude.

My Thai GF, the boys mother (he's not my biological son,100% Thai, but that has nothing to do with it) is totaly on board with me that this is totaly not acceptable and also want to speak to all concerned parties. Of course my gut reaction is to tell the teacher that next time he touches my son in any way I'll come and punch him in the face. I am a totaly peaceful person having never been in a fight in my life, I avoid idiots and stupid situations, but lift wieghts often and have for 35 yrs and am not too old so I think it could be quite scary for him which I am fine with. I have never hit my son as I have never found it necessary to but would if I felt it was after explaing why, but it would have to be for something he did very bad and we teach him right from wrong, morals etc so hopefully it never will happen but that is our business in our home, not for a young teacher who is probably just a bully. He is also known to pinch the kids necks.

We have before this happend already decide to change schools after this semeseter as the number of students in the classroom doubled with year but figured since we already payed and school has started it would be ok for a few more months.

One last point is I dont think my boy is in any real danger and he told us very matter a factly and said he wasnt bothered by it and seemed not to be either. He's a real good kid and just told us as we have dinner everynight the whole family together and all talk about our day around the dining room table. We take parenting seriously and put lots of thought and effort into our three childrens education and upbringing.

Also I belive hitting in school is not allowed, by the book at least, in Thailand anymore.

First time parent in different land wants to be the best Dad I can while not making more trouble or negleting my duties. I'm not afraid to do what's necessary but not sure what is.

Thanks in advance!

JC

Edited June 14, 2014 by junglechef

[krisb]

I'd take a steel ruler to that meeting tomorrow.

[332]

Record the meeting, tell them that is it being recorded, tell them that you will be filing charges of child abuse abuse against the teacher with the police.

Be very calm about it all.

At the meeting bring a ruler and during the discussion insist that the teacher demonstrates on you what he did. At that point hand him the ruler in front of everybody and bare your wrist.

Point out that this is being video recorded by someone with you, as evidence for the police for charges of child abuse against the teacher.

I'd be surprised if it happened again.

Edited June 14, 2014 by 332

[willfreeman]

a Thai friends son copped a 'clip round the ear' from his teacher, they told me about it and didnt seem bothered at all that it had happened, i was left with the impression it still happens here.

[AnotherOneAmerican]

It's against the law.

Make a complaint against teacher to the police at your local police station.

[junglechef]

Thanks 332 sounds like rational thinking but as a realtist I can easily see the teacher not cooperating. Always good to go in with a good plan, and that sounds like one, but previosuly weve tried to speak to the Principle and she just hid and when we refused to let her avoid us, like happens too often when there is a problem here, she just got defensive (we came to the shcool to give our kids thier lunch money I forgot to give them and they couldnt find one of them!). Unfortuneatly being calm doesn't get any results as afterwards it's all like nothing ever happened.

[Oscar2]

these things happen often in Asian countries. in China they whack the kids knuckles with a bamboo cane.

[junglechef]

I know they happen as I have posted in detail about one instance . Two wrongs don't make a right and all that kind of thing as well as a good lesson for my children as what is accepetable behaviour, one that many need, and what's not plus how to deal with an issue if necessary. We have a no hitting policy between the kids, even my 2 yr old, unless it's rough house fun and we often play really hard incl. no pad full tackle Amercian football in the yard. Believe me when I say when Thai's see us they cant believe it! The boys don't cry unless they are hurt so they are building character too. I don't buy toy guns nor donwload violent video games for them. In turn I will be calm, at least in front of them, tomorrow.

As I'm sure I'll need the teachers info to file any kind of complaint so I'll get it tomorrrow from both him and the administration with the intenention of filing a police report, if I do so or not is another matter as I feel a stern warning might be appropraite at this time (thanks AnotherOneAmerican).

Sorry if I'm going on alot about this but I'm just a concern parent and trying to be culturally sensitve while at the same time not taking any bullhsit!

[Dante99]

You would be in a much better position if you had Thai parents join you in your efforts, if they won't that is a message.

Alternatively think about how you might address the problem from a different angle rather than head on.

[junglechef]

Yes hopefully the mothers will get together (not to be a sexist but just can see it more likely) if my GF initates the process. I'll suggest she talk to the other Mom of the boys my son tells us it happended to and the marks should still be visable on some if they are present.

I'm looking for suggestions of how to deal with it from different angles but as of now since some adult laid thier hands on my son with violent intent I think heads on approach is approraite (and that's he's lucky that I leave his head on!). I'm a man of conviction not always to my benefit, but I sleep well with not having to wonder about the what ifs and I should of - could of thoughts.

[Oscar2]

You would be in a much better position if you had Thai parents join you in your efforts, if they won't that is a message.

Alternatively think about how you might address the problem from a different angle rather than head on.

agreed. the Thai father (or mother, or both) should be the one making a complaint. if you don't have a document from the court giving you parental rights then under Thai law you can't even address the issue. i would not get involved if i were you.

[masuk]

I don't believe in kids being bullied by teachers. We had our fair share of it when we were kids in Oz, 50 - 60 years ago.

I'm sure one ear is stretched, the bruises where the blackboard duster got me on the head, the welts on the back of my legs, and once we'd survived this and into high school, they used a bamboo cane on rear end and hands.

The exception was our old Tech. Drawing teacher. When in trouble, we were invited to the front of the class room, and to bring our tee-squares with us.

I don't blame the teachers! If the parents asked about a new bruise, they said 'probably your fault anyway'. YEAH.

Somehow, we survived and I know this is a different era and different traditions in Thailand.

[AnotherOneAmerican]

Yes hopefully the mothers will get together (not to be a sexist but just can see it more likely) if my GF initates the process. I'll suggest she talk to the other Mom of the boys my son tells us it happended to and the marks should still be visable on some if they are present.

I'm looking for suggestions of how to deal with it from different angles but as of now since some adult laid thier hands on my son with violent intent I think heads on approach is approraite (and that's he's lucky that I leave his head on!). I'm a man of conviction not always to my benefit, but I sleep well with not having to wonder about the what ifs and I should of - could of thoughts.

It's unlikely any Thai mothers will face down authority, police or threat of police is YOUR best option.

Go and see the headmaster YOURSELF, your child has been assaulted in school and you are considering reporting it to the police.

I've been there, done that, and the teacher almost pooped their pants when called in by headmaster to apologise.

No repeat incidents either.

If you want something done about this, you have to do it (a foreigner), Thais will not challenge authority (school, headmaster, teacher).

Edited June 14, 2014 by AnotherOneAmerican

[stubuzz]

Take a photo of the boys' wrists as evidence and show the director, before informing the police. He may dismiss the teacher. If you are not satisfied with his actions, contact the police.

Edited June 14, 2014 by stubuzz

[ClutchClark]

Two sides to every situation.

Even good kids are known to tell a white lie about events they may get in trouble for.

Before huffing and puffing it might be a good idea to ask the school's side of events and the school policy.

It might also be a good idea to not display your disregard for the childs teacher in front of the child since there needs to be a respect for this educator if your son is going to gain any knowledge from this school year.

Also, I read your post but don't see the part where you admonish your son for his misbehavior...I only see the part where you make excuses for him.

As a parent, your role is not to be the child's friend. It is your role to instill the positive habits that will remain with the child and benefit him throughout his life. That means being firm when its required.

As for the bravado of lifting weights and all that chest beating...please act your age and be a role model to your child.

You say you don't get in fights so that is obviously a priority to you. Why are you shoeing your child a path that you yourself don't live by?

[ClutchClark]

I don't believe in kids being bullied by teachers. We had our fair share of it when we were kids in Oz, 50 - 60 years ago.

I'm sure one ear is stretched, the bruises where the blackboard duster got me on the head, the welts on the back of my legs, and once we'd survived this and into high school, they used a bamboo cane on rear end and hands.

The exception was our old Tech. Drawing teacher. When in trouble, we were invited to the front of the class room, and to bring our tee-squares with us.

I don't blame the teachers! If the parents asked about a new bruise, they said 'probably your fault anyway'. YEAH.

Somehow, we survived and I know this is a different era and different traditions in Thailand.

Boys will be boys...listen to the teachers side before placing foot in mouth.

You survived it. I survived it.

Take a breather, OP.

[Oscar2]

Yes hopefully the mothers will get together (not to be a sexist but just can see it more likely) if my GF initates the process. I'll suggest she talk to the other Mom of the boys my son tells us it happended to and the marks should still be visable on some if they are present.

I'm looking for suggestions of how to deal with it from different angles but as of now since some adult laid thier hands on my son with violent intent I think heads on approach is approraite (and that's he's lucky that I leave his head on!). I'm a man of conviction not always to my benefit, but I sleep well with not having to wonder about the what ifs and I should of - could of thoughts.

It's unlikely any Thai mothers will face down authority, police or threat of police is YOUR best option.

Go and see the headmaster YOURSELF, your child has been assaulted in school and you are considering reporting it to the police.

I've been there, done that, and the teacher almost pooped their pants when called in by headmaster to apologise.

No repeat incidents either.

If you want something done about this, you have to do it (a foreigner), Thais will not challenge authority (school, headmaster, teacher).

right. teachers and doctors are seen almost as god-like in Thailand.

[332]

Get the parents together.

Forget going to the school.

All go to the police with the evidence of the child abuse.

Get the police to then go to the school.

[PlanetX]

I don't believe in kids being bullied by teachers. We had our fair share of it when we were kids in Oz, 50 - 60 years ago.

I'm sure one ear is stretched, the bruises where the blackboard duster got me on the head, the welts on the back of my legs, and once we'd survived this and into high school, they used a bamboo cane on rear end and hands.

The exception was our old Tech. Drawing teacher. When in trouble, we were invited to the front of the class room, and to bring our tee-squares with us.

I don't blame the teachers! If the parents asked about a new bruise, they said 'probably your fault anyway'. YEAH.

Somehow, we survived and I know this is a different era and different traditions in Thailand.

Boys will be boys...listen to the teachers side before placing foot in mouth.

You survived it. I survived it.

Take a breather, OP.

+1

Definitely talk to the teacher first before coming to any conclusions. I completely understand your initial reactions and they are very fair, but they are just that - initial reactions.

Take a moment and calmly speak with the teacher and ask what happened. If the teacher can not/ does not have an answer to your liking then request a formal meeting with the teacher and principal. If during the formal meeting you do not get an acceptable resolution - CHANGE SCHOOLS.

All of the rest of the extra stuff will not get you anywhere,

Coming from direct experience.

[332]

Amazing the people who support the abuse of children by people who are employed to care for them.

Sure glad they weren't my parents.

[scotinsiam]

I think a good beating from a teacher is a healthy thing - did me no harm. I often laugh now about the teachers at my school kicking me in the face for being late for class and punching me in the stomach for spilling school lunch. Nothing wrong with it at all, It is charachter building and it serves me well now in prison where I am doing time for assault.

Edited June 14, 2014 by scotinsiam

[worgeordie]

That was almost a daily occurrence for me when i was at school,

and it was a thin bamboo cane,either across the hand or arse,up to 6,

yes it hurt like hell, but i don't think it did me any harm,maybe a bit of

good,as i did not turn into a serial killer,shoot school kids,become a

bank robber or anything like that.

So they stopped all the corporal punishment what happen,the kids

don't respect the teachers or anything else really,society as a whole

is in a right mess,thats the view i get of whats happening in the UK,

i expect the same is happening in other Western countries,and could

happen here. theres too much PC and human rights for people that

don't deserve it i.e.prisoners,terrorists,and criminals.

regards Worgeordie

[junglechef]

I have taken pic of my boys arm and will have my GF sugggest it to the other mothers but I expect to go at this alone.

If I formal complaint is filed of course I'll let the legal mother sign it but if you think I'm just going to sit this one out you've seriusoly misjudged my character.

masuk so what. I was beaten by Baptist nuns in school in the 60's in Japan and I climbed out the window never to return, I survived it but even knew better then.

I might be surprised and see some Thai moms getting invovled, I'll report back tomorrow night. I do plan on meeting the principal and the teacher with my GF tomorow.

As for ClutchClark your pretty much wrong on all accounts. Do you think the school is going to say it's thier policy to hit the students? My son has been raised to tell me the truth and know he can without worry. He also has enough sense not to repsect that teacher anymore on his on. I never made an excuse, just honestly said boys will be boys and since I dont think it's that big of a deal what he did that it. If I did the teacher still has no right to ever touch him like that. The rest of our post makes no sense, how do I teach my child to be violent? You have no idea how i parent and you insulting me and my partenting skills is unnecesary. But if a grown man bullies my young boy perhaps the only way to deal with it is scaring him not to do it again. I said I wouldnt do it in front of him but I'm man enough to protect my family.

Oscar I have said many times I'm planning on talking with everone there, I conduct myslef in a very civilized manner, and of course they will have a chance to explain, but I have reason to think they will not want to nor really partake in an aduclt conversation.

PlanentX changing schools in high on the list but would just liek not to make too big a deal out of it and have time to find a better alternative for next semester. I also agree that police etc isnt really going to do much if the school doesnt care, what I am I going to do sue?

worgeordie would you like soe random kid (teacher is in his 20's) hitting your kid?

[ClutchClark]

I have taken pic of my boys arm and will have my GF sugggest it to the other mothers but I expect to go at this alone.

If I formal complaint is filed of course I'll let the legal mother sign it but if you think I'm just going to sit this one out you've seriusoly misjudged my character.

masuk so what. I was beaten by Baptist nuns in school in the 60's in Japan and I climbed out the window never to return, I survived it but even knew better then.

I might be surprised and see some Thai moms getting invovled, I'll report back tomorrow night. I do plan on meeting the principal and the teacher with my GF tomorow.

As for ClutchClark your pretty much wrong on all accounts. Do you think the school is going to say it's thier policy to hit the students? My son has been raised to tell me the truth and know he can without worry. He also has enough sense not to repsect that teacher anymore on his on. I never made an excuse, just honestly said boys will be boys and since I dont think it's that big of a deal what he did that it. If I did the teacher still has no right to ever touch him like that. The rest of our post makes no sense, how do I teach my child to be violent? You have no idea how i parent and you insulting me and my partenting skills is unnecesary. But if a grown man bullies my young boy perhaps the only way to deal with it is scaring him not to do it again. I said I wouldnt do it in front of him but I'm man enough to protect my family.

Oscar I have said many times I'm planning on talking with everone there, I conduct myslef in a very civilized manner, and of course they will have a chance to explain, but I have reason to think they will not want to nor really partake in an aduclt conversation.

PlanentX changing schools in high on the list but would just liek not to make too big a deal out of it and have time to find a better alternative for next semester. I also agree that police etc isnt really going to do much if the school doesnt care, what I am I going to do sue?

worgeordie would you like soe random kid (teacher is in his 20's) hitting your kid?

Ah, yes, the innocent naivety of the new parent.

You asked for opinions on a public forum and I gave mine.

I have raised a family and I now even have great-grandchildren. They are all productive members of their community so the angst of a new parent is nothing to worry me.

But one last observation is that you are very emotional at the moment. Perhaps you are always like this, I don't know, but you might want to try and calm down a day before you go into that school. You will have a better chance of a positive outcome if you act mature and respectful.

[junglechef]

As I've said it's barely visible on my boy and it's not that big if a deal to get the police involved here (but the threat of thier involvement might make it stop).

My point is simply this is not acceptable to me and I am going to be sure it stops. No I won't shoot anybody butvI'm amazed on the character assassination I'm getting about my child being hit by a bully guy in his 20s.

[daveAustin]

I've had this. Best bet is to take teacher aside and politely but firmly inform that you don't want him administering corporal punishment and that it is now against the law in Thailand. It's wrong and you want to pan the teacher, I know, but Thai being Thai, best to keep face loss to a minimum. As stated, if teacher digs heals in and comes up with excuses then take it further, just be prepared to move schools as it's likely the kid will be singled out/downgraded etc. Pathetic, yes, but it happens.

[junglechef]

Thanks that's the kind of sensible advice I was looking for

[ClutchClark]

I've had this. Best bet is to take teacher aside and politely but firmly inform that you don't want him administering corporal punishment and that it is now against the law in Thailand. It's wrong and you want to pan the teacher, I know, but Thai being Thai, best to keep face loss to a minimum. As stated, if teacher digs heals in and comes up with excuses then take it further, just be prepared to move schools as it's likely the kid will be singled out/downgraded etc. Pathetic, yes, but it happens.

Response below to the OP:

So the OP is actually prepared to create a negative learning environment for his son for the remainder of the year, including the possibility of moving the child to a new school because this happened one time.

And it happened to how many other students and their parents are reacting how?

They are not reacting?

And the OP thinks this is the most reasonable course of action?

You are right, OP, I was wrong about you on all counts. I thought you were a mature and rational man.

[PlanetX]

I've had this. Best bet is to take teacher aside and politely but firmly inform that you don't want him administering corporal punishment and that it is now against the law in Thailand. It's wrong and you want to pan the teacher, I know, but Thai being Thai, best to keep face loss to a minimum. As stated, if teacher digs heals in and comes up with excuses then take it further, just be prepared to move schools as it's likely the kid will be singled out/downgraded etc. Pathetic, yes, but it happens.

Response below to the OP:

So the OP is actually prepared to create a negative learning environment for his son for the remainder of the year, including the possibility of moving the child to a new school because this happened one time.

And it happened to how many other students and their parents are reacting how?

They are not reacting?

And the OP thinks this is the most reasonable course of action?

You are right, OP, I was wrong about you on all counts. I thought you were a mature and rational man.

Lets not all jump on each other and criticize one another. It is a very tough and emotional situation.

We are not condoning child abuse - we are simply saying its best to speak with the teacher in a calm and rational way.

There is no suggestion your son is lying - of course not! As adults, we are able to look at a situation rationally and acknowledge all the actors involved before making a rational decision based on the evidence and testimonies.

Talk to the teacher. He teaches and spends time with your child on a daily basis.

OP: I wish you nothing but the best and its great to have a father that loves his child deeply and is always willing to stand up and protect him. Protecting him also means getting all the facts.

Best of luck buddy.

[ClutchClark]

Its only an accusation by the child and all sides should be heard but the OP is talking about physically fighting the teacher. The OP states he is a new father--a first time father. The OP is very emotional at the moment and I suggested he calm down and think this through.

My posts have simply asked him to consider possible repercussions of actions made in the heat of the moment and consider the repercussions on the child of any consequences.

My only concern is for the child.

Edited June 14, 2014 by ClutchClark
deleted a removed post