Should I start teaching English?

[TerryLH]

It's not difficult to change the reason for your extension.

"There is a way around it.... if you are married to a Thai or have a Thai colleague who is ostensibly the teacher. It's extremely unlikely there would ever be any comeback especially in a rural area and technically you're in the clear anyway."

Can you explain that? Especially the second underlined part.

Thanks.

[callcharlie2001]

I hope this is not too far off topic, but what is the education requirement for a Thai to teach English in a government school in a poor rural Isaan village? Someone told me a Masters Degree was needed, but that would seem to be over qualified to me. Are there an excess of college graduates who can not find employment as teachers who would jump at any teaching opening?

[dotpoom]

I'm surprised at you Costas for not knowing that voluntary work needs a work permit. I have seen your contributions a lot on this forum and if I'v learned anything on here it is that very fact.

[Scott]

There have been other reports of people on retirement visas being granted work permits. I do not know how this happens and I know it is not common, but it has been reported from credible sources.

I also met someone who had been in Thailand for a number of years and he had a work permit which allowed him to work anywhere. They were apparently granted a long time ago, but not any more, but his was still valid.

[Costas2008]

There have been other reports of people on retirement visas being granted work permits. I do not know how this happens and I know it is not common, but it has been reported from credible sources.

I also met someone who had been in Thailand for a number of years and he had a work permit which allowed him to work anywhere. They were apparently granted a long time ago, but not any more, but his was still valid.

I posted a question on TV , Ask a lawyer Forum, about my eligibility as a retirement visa holder to obtain a work permit.

They diverted me to the Visa forum, where I got an answer from Ubonjoe and I quote:

"There have been a few and far between posts of people getting a work permit with on a retirement extension. It depends entirely upon the local work permit office whether it can be done or not. All you can do is try."

This matches your post, Scott.

I appreciate your efforts and answers, but I have to rant about this called "Ask a Lawyer" forum.

Do they ever deal with a question submitted or they just divert you to other forums?

I asked for a specific question, waiting for a specific answer from a lawyer.

In return I got a vague answer about other peoples posts and go and do it yourself.

No offence to Ubonjoe.

Sorry, but if this is the service the Ask a lawyer forum is offering to TVF members, then I'm totally disappointed.

Rant ended......thank you for listening.

[ukguyinthai]

Without getting into the legalities of visas and work permits, he is not on a huge step in the right direction. Unless the right direction is going back to his own country. I agree the kids would benefit and he would enjoy it but that’s not the point.

The point is everything he has worked for to enjoy his retirement in Thailand, could be taken away in an instant because of bad advice from a lying head teacher. I cannot see why anyone should be encouraging him to compromise his life here.

Talk to the employment dept, don’t talk to the head teacher, and don’t listen to people telling you to just do it.

Enjoy your retirement, find a new hobby.There is lots of ways to integrate with the community.

Rose-tinted glasses alert!!

Can you name one or two of those 'ways' cause I haven't found any yet.

...and that includes churches <deleted>!!

yes I can, this guy has integrated himself in many ways

and I don't wear rose-tinted glasses,except when I look in the mirror.

[Costas2008]

I assist a local school near Nong Khai as they have limited resources and I am the only access these rural children get to a native English speaker. No pay, no work permit, no problems. The Thai teachers at the school (government school) have no issues as I also provide help for them.

Pretty basic stuff but there are plenty of websites with good information;

www.mes-english.com has plenty of useful flash cards and print outs to help

www.busyteacher.org also has plenty of info but you need to sign up with them and contribute ideas (which is very useful for other teachers)

www.onestopenglish.com also offers some decent lesson plans for conversation

If it is very basic, early stage learners the best thing you can bring is a sense of humor, be lively (it can be exhausting so if you are not in very good shape health wise perhaps you may want to think twice about doing this), sing songs, tell stories etc.....

If you have ever been a parent (and an active one participating in the child rearing) then do what you did with your own children.

I use age appropriate songs, stories (disney stuff is always great), movies (again age appropriate), cartoons, music.

As for the other stuff (work permits, pay, etc). I do not think there is an immigration officer or local police person who does not know what I (and several others) are doing. I doubt a foreigner in this country could flush their own toilet without someone knowing.........are they looking to arrest and detain you the moment you open your mouth to teach a couple of 6 year olds English.....?? IMO, no, but as they say......up to you.

The most informative and encouraging post up to know.

Thank you, thank you very much for sharing it with us.

I will follow you, soon.

[Scott]

Costas, I will bring your concerns about the 'Ask a Lawyer' section of the forum to the powers that be for their consideration. The problem is that nothing is as it seems in Thailand. There are laws, then there is how they are implemented and this varies greatly.

Legally, you should not be able to get a work permit on a retirement visa, but they are on rare occasions granted.

[puchooay]

Costas.....you are going around in circles.

If you really want to do this then:

1) Go and see the headmaster now.

2) Explain to him what you have said on here.

3) Tell him you are raring to go but need to sort out the paper work first.

4) Suggest that you both go to the labour department.

5) If he refuses, make your apologies and retreat.

Simple.

Good Luck.

[Costas2008]

Costas.....you are going around in circles.

If you really want to do this then:

1) Go and see the headmaster now.

2) Explain to him what you have said on here.

3) Tell him you are raring to go but need to sort out the paper work first.

4) Suggest that you both go to the labour department.

5) If he refuses, make your apologies and retreat.

Simple.

Good Luck.

Thanks, He is away, back on Monday.

I will keep you informed.

[brucetefl]

I couldn't bother to review this entire thread. Everyone going on about how he won't have a work permit and might be deported.

Do you live in the same country that I do people?

He would be volunteering at a small rural school. Is likely that a few policeman have their kids attending school. He's not getting paid.

Yes, technically he should have a work permit.

But I simply can't imagine any circumstance where the Department of immigration is going to come in and arrest this guy because he's volunteer teaching at a small rural school where the other teachers can't speak any English at the request of the director.

This is just absolutely silly. No one is going to give this guy a hard time. He's likely going to become a very well-respected member of the community for assisting at the school.

Voluntary work requires a work permit.

Yes, you could be doing one of those Thai English teachers out of a job! ha!

I've been to a few ASEAN countries, and Thailand would have to have the least number of English speakers I've come across.

Do it! Even with a Greek accent, it's better than nothing at all.

Do it without work permit?

Benefits? None.

Risk? Deportation.

Um.....

[ukguyinthai]

Hi Costas

Every poster is either saying do it there is no risk about work permits or don't do it its not worth the risk without a permit.

Does anyone know how many people in the last 3 years got deported fined or jailed for working for free in a school, unqualified.Just to put some facts on the table. We know its against the law ,but just how much of a risk is it.

You mentioned you wont do it without a work permit. If that's the case whats stopping you from getting one. And what form of "loop hole"are you trying to find. I would like to help you but now I'm not clear what it is you want to know next.

[brucetefl]

I'll go one better. In 18 years in Thailand I've never heard of any English teacher being deported or even fined for teaching without a work permit. I know of one school that was fined, but the teachers weren't given any penalty at all.

In your situation I cannot imagine immigration giving you any kind of difficulty. If they did, the director of the school along with a lot of the parents would probably go down and visit that director of immigration and let them know how they felt about them being complete jerks and harassing A nice person who was helping their kids learn English.

There are so many people who like to throw out the threat of deportation. In fact, it just never happens.

Hi Costas

Every poster is either saying do it there is no risk about work permits or don't do it its not worth the risk without a permit

Does anyone know how many people in the last 3 years got deported fined or jailed for working for free in a school, unqualified.Just to put some facts on the table .We know its against the law ,but just how much of a risk is it.

You mentioned you wont do it without a work permit. If that's the case whats stopping you from getting one. And what form of "loop hole"are you trying to find.

I would like to help you but now I'm not clear what it is you want to know next.

[up-country_sinclair]

You have a retirement visa, you are not allowed to work.

You're taking great risks for absolutely nothing.

This sums it up really.

Some may not agree with the laws of this country, but that doesn't mean people are free to break them without facing consequences.

[GoNavy]

Costa,

I had breakfast with my 2 friends today teaching. The one who has no work permit said that his headmaster said he could get one if he wanted. But, it really was not necessary. As many others have written here, yes it is written down as law to get one. But, very few do. And they are just not bothered as it is a big push for their citizens to learn English. There are NOT enough teachers. The issue I wrote about on the American who started a private English school who was caught by immigration..w.as because he started a business competing with a Thai citizen who happened to be his daughter. Your situation is much much different.

Then as I recall, you are going to a rural area. Far far different then a city.......aka Bangkok, Pattaya, Hua Hin, Chang Mai or even Chang Rai. There are very few farangs living in the hinterlands of Thailand who want to teach. So, whatever concerns you have are just being built up I suspect with all this advice.

If you really want to do this, then just do it. I suspect that the powers that be in your community will protect and save you from the hierachy as you are helping their kids. If worse comes to worse, I suspect all you would get due to volutnerring to teach their children without the law is a slap on the wrist. Then they would smile, give you one probably and you can carry on. Just my thoughts.

[Costas2008]

Costa,

I had breakfast with my 2 friends today teaching. The one who has no work permit said that his headmaster said he could get one if he wanted. But, it really was not necessary. As many others have written here, yes it is written down as law to get one. But, very few do. And they are just not bothered as it is a big push for their citizens to learn English. There are NOT enough teachers. The issue I wrote about on the American who started a private English school who was caught by immigration..w.as because he started a business competing with a Thai citizen who happened to be his daughter. Your situation is much much different.

Then as I recall, you are going to a rural area. Far far different then a city.......aka Bangkok, Pattaya, Hua Hin, Chang Mai or even Chang Rai. There are very few farangs living in the hinterlands of Thailand who want to teach. So, whatever concerns you have are just being built up I suspect with all this advice.

If you really want to do this, then just do it. I suspect that the powers that be in your community will protect and save you from the hierachy as you are helping their kids. If worse comes to worse, I suspect all you would get due to volutnerring to teach their children without the law is a slap on the wrist. Then they would smile, give you one probably and you can carry on. Just my thoughts.

GoNavy, Thank you very much for your efforts and advice.

As I said before, I am seeing the headmaster on Monday morning.

I will put to him my concerns and see what comes out.

After your post and many other posts from good members, I have already decided to assist in the school.

Keep my fingers crossed, that nothing bad will happen to me.

Many thanks again.

[Thighlander]

http://www.scmp.com/article/583825/foreign-teachers-learn-tough-lesson-thai-crackdown

As soon as people stop working illegally; the Thai government will finally streamline the process to teach legally. Working illegally make the water muddy for everyone. I don't have much respect for some of the farangs that hire unlicensed tutors to teach their kids, either. They know damn well it's illegal, and they know that for a few baht more; they could hire someone from a language school, who is fully legal.

[brucetefl]

Thailander, I fail to see any correlation here.

The guy in the article was arrested for using fake documents to apply for his work permit.

Apples and hand grenades.

http://www.scmp.com/article/583825/foreign-teachers-learn-tough-lesson-thai-crackdown

As soon as people stop working illegally; the Thai government will finally streamline the process to teach legally. Working illegally make the water muddy for everyone. I don't have much respect for some of the farangs that hire unlicensed tutors to teach their kids, either. They know damn well it's illegal, and they know that for a few baht more; they could hire someone from a language school, who is fully legal.

[up-country_sinclair]

After your post and many other posts from good members, I have already decided to assist in the school.

Keep my fingers crossed, that nothing bad will happen to me.

So you've made the conscious decision to break the law.

Do you support immigrants coming into your home country and flaunting the laws and doing as they please?

[brucetefl]

Up country.. do you ever cook your own food? Wash your own dishes? Do your own laundry?

Its all against the law if you read it.

Quit being so pretentious.

After your post and many other posts from good members, I have already decided to assist in the school.

Keep my fingers crossed, that nothing bad will happen to me.

So you've made the conscious decision to break the law.

Do you support immigrants coming into your home country and flaunting the laws and doing as they please?

Edited July 5, 2014 by brucetefl

[tubby johnson]

@upcountry_sinclair

Context, please!

Any angry finger wagging that "laws are sacred and therefore must be obeyed" is for the spineless sheep among us.

And this has nothing to do with bearded immigrants on welfare, etc. It is our duty to blissfully ignore nonsensical laws and to do the right thing for our fellow human beings. Teaching grateful children for free is not a felony and no reason to call the immigration cops.

Sent from my GT-I9500 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[brucetefl]

Its not just us. The local police, immigration police and Labor would certainly ignore this "lawbreaker".

@upcountry_sinclair

Context, please!

Any angry finger wagging that "laws are sacred and therefore must be obeyed" is for the spineless sheep among us.

And this has nothing to do with bearded immigrants on welfare, etc. It is our duty to blissfully ignore nonsensical laws and to do the right thing for our fellow human beings. Teaching grateful children for free is not a felony and no reason to call the immigration cops.

Sent from my GT-I9500 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[GoNavy]

http://www.scmp.com/article/583825/foreign-teachers-learn-tough-lesson-thai-crackdown

As soon as people stop working illegally; the Thai government will finally streamline the process to teach legally. Working illegally make the water muddy for everyone. I don't have much respect for some of the farangs that hire unlicensed tutors to teach their kids, either. They know damn well it's illegal, and they know that for a few baht more; they could hire someone from a language school, who is fully legal.

My O my, are't we full of it. You sure get your undies in bundle over something as so minor as a ticket for teaching for free. What would you do when it is something really important. Lay in the street, kick your heels and moan? If you follow a column and they jump over a cliff, I suppose you would do the same because it is the rule of some dingbat. Get a life my friend. Or experience life more then behind your keyboard. You willl be surprised.

[tubby johnson]

Nothing gets the TV community more bitter and envious than a fellow farang who enjoys living in Thailand and earns a bit of money on the side or volunteers for the local community, all without a work permit. Sad. Especially when there's so much in life to be pleased about. Stop being a plague to your fellow human beings; stop this helpless moaning and griping. It's pathetic.

[Thighlander]

Let me see.....800K in a Thai bank, a paid for condo, a somewhat hard to get long stay visa that says in bold letters "Employment Prohibited"; kind of makes getting deported a bigger deal. Backpackers with tattoos that cost more than their net worth........proceed at your own risk. Last time I checked, Immigration had English website to turn in violators, as well as a hotline. The Thais are mostly snitches, especially when a farang is involved. Why not just work legally, and donate your pay back to the school?

My link to the Canadians did involve fake documents....but it was a classic case of "everyone is doing it," except the admins that told them to get the fakes, didn't get a slap on the wrist. Nic Brown was likely working illegally. Where is his insurance from his job? Perhaps illegals don't get coverage.

[Scott]

Off-topic posts and replies deleted. Please address the OP and not each other.

[Costas2008]

I would like to inform you, that I will start assisting the Thai teachers, in my local school from tomorrow morning.

Also, I would like to thank, each one of you for your answers and contribution on my thread.

Especially the ones that helped me to make the decision and start teaching English.

At the beginning it will be for 2 hours a day, and we will see how things are going and if I can contribute more in the future.

Many Thanks again.

[Scott]

Best of luck Costas.

[Costas2008]

Best of luck Costas.

Thank you Scott.

You have been a great help to my decision making and also you always give good and sensible advice to other members.

Keep up the good work

Edited July 14, 2014 by Costas2008

[whitethai]

My brother is Teacher

Salary is far too low here

They should pay $2000 to $3000 a month

By the way what is the easiest degree to get?