Australian couple abandon Down syndrome baby with Thai surrogate mother

[h90]

What I find unique is that, as you can't abort one baby from twins, the Aussies may have planned this path from as early as 3 months into the pregnancy, (when doctors were aware that 1 child had Downs.) In which case it is pretty "jai dam" I'd reckon. (And ostensibly persuaded the mother accordingly).

 

Can you abort just one? I don't know.

But you could also abort both and just start new.

[nodomino]

Surrogacy is a method by which middle class or wealthy couples are allowed to commodify babies. In a world that is awash in needful and parentless children, surrogacy is a selfish and socially useless practice.

[VincentRJ]

 

What I find unique is that, as you can't abort one baby from twins, the Aussies may have planned this path from as early as 3 months into the pregnancy, (when doctors were aware that 1 child had Downs.) In which case it is pretty "jai dam" I'd reckon. (And ostensibly persuaded the mother accordingly).

 

Can you abort just one? I don't know.

 

 

 Yes, but there are risks.

 

"The reduction procedure is generally carried out during the first trimester of pregnancy. The most common method is to inject potassium chloride into the fetus's heart; the heart stops and the fetus dies as a result. Generally, the fetal material is reabsorbed into the woman's body. While the procedure generally reduces the over-all risk level for the remaining fetus or fetuses, reduction does have its own risks, including the possibility that one or more of the remaining fetuses will also die.

Dr. Mark Evans, a New York City-based obstetrician-geneticist, and a group of doctors, developed the procedure for selective reduction in the 1980s."

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Selective_reduction

[mojorison]

 

What I find unique is that, as you can't abort one baby from twins, the Aussies may have planned this path from as early as 3 months into the pregnancy, (when doctors were aware that 1 child had Downs.) In which case it is pretty "jai dam" I'd reckon. (And ostensibly persuaded the mother accordingly).

 

Can you abort just one? I don't know.

But you could also abort both and just start new.

 

Murky murky stuff. A lot of exploitation, lies, deceit and money going around.

[BangkokHank]

Commercial surrogacy is supposedly illegal in Thailand. 

 

So is prostitution, which I guess explains why it doesn't exist.

[Waldemar]

“But I think this is not a bad karma ... it’s good karma that make us be together,” she says from her village in Chonburi province in northern Thailand.“

 

Seriously? Never knew it's in the north =)

[Roadman]

Surrogacy is a method by which middle class or wealthy couples are allowed to commodify babies. In a world that is awash in needful and parentless children, surrogacy is a selfish and socially useless practice.

Can agree with the world being awash with children needing caring parents but do not see surrogacy as being selfish when it can deliver at least one of the parents genes. Can see that as being a reason why couples would choose surrogacy over adoption. Like it or not it is just another of the ways of the modern world. And that is reason enough to find solutions rather than head banging against the practice.
As to the nuts and bolts of this surrogacy it seems from the limited information available that all eventualities of the process were not fully understood, or if they were then they were not held to. If one were to remove the emotive humanity from the equation then it would seem that the terms of the contract if indeed one was in place, unraveled at the point where the child was diagnosed with Downs and an abortion was called for. Have to agree with another poster with the observation that if the terms of the contract called for abortion to be an option regardless of the laws of Thailand then there is culpability with the surrogate mother and more importantly those Thai lawyers and doctors who were assisting her. Cross border laws and enforcement, and full awareness of contract obligations under all possible eventualites would go a long way to improving the process whether one agrees with it or not or agrees or disagrees with the dehumanising of the process.

[FM505]

The Australian couple shall now hide behind anonymity laws designed to protect the identity of children in cases of high news interest.

 

 

They need to be named, and to be bought before a court in order to be forced to accept the full consequences of the choices they made. 

 

Oh yes, they should be pursued aggressively as if they left that baby in the forest alone... (extended profane rant).

[Baerboxer]

 

What I find unique is that, as you can't abort one baby from twins, the Aussies may have planned this path from as early as 3 months into the pregnancy, (when doctors were aware that 1 child had Downs.) In which case it is pretty "jai dam" I'd reckon. (And ostensibly persuaded the mother accordingly).

 

Can you abort just one? I don't know.

But you could also abort both and just start new.

 

 

Or maybe they could genetically modify them - choose sex, hair color, eye color etc etc. Would be a good money spinner in some countries eh? Bugger the ethics.

 

Didn't a group of scientists and politicians in the 30's/40's seem keen on this sort of thing? Mass abortions and removal of "imperfections"? 

 

Baby factoring and trafficking - unless very strictly controlled and the profits and middlemen removed.

[61guitarman61]

It seems to me that the wanna-be parents are the ones who should have not entered into this arrangement. They are the ones who opted out due to imperfection. Pretty slimy if you ask me. And you fault the surrogate because she didn't murder the babies in her womb? Regardless of your own personal belief pertaining to  abortion and when life begins, the Buddhist lady cannot be faulted for her own belief and refusal based on said belief to have the abortiion. This is 100% on the Aussies who wanted to go cheap rather than hiring an Aussie surrogate. I label this Auusie couple as scum.

She wants to have her cake and eat it too, should never have entered into surrogacy arrangement.
 

Four months into the pregnancy, doctors doing routine checks discovered one of the babies had Down syndrome. They told the Australian parents, who said they did not want to take the boy, according to a source familiar with the case.

They told me to have an abortion but I didnt agree because I am afraid of sin, Ms Pattharamon says, referring to her Buddhist beliefs.

 

 

[61guitarman61]

 

 

What I find unique is that, as you can't abort one baby from twins, the Aussies may have planned this path from as early as 3 months into the pregnancy, (when doctors were aware that 1 child had Downs.) In which case it is pretty "jai dam" I'd reckon. (And ostensibly persuaded the mother accordingly).

 

Can you abort just one? I don't know.

But you could also abort both and just start new.

 

 

Or maybe they could genetically modify them - choose sex, hair color, eye color etc etc. Would be a good money spinner in some countries eh? Bugger the ethics.

 

Didn't a group of scientists and politicians in the 30's/40's seem keen on this sort of thing? Mass abortions and removal of "imperfections"? 

 

Baby factoring and trafficking - unless very strictly controlled and the profits and middlemen removed.

 

Having chosen a surrogate with a religious belief that does not allow for abortion, it is really not even relevant whether only one could have been aborted leaving the other to be born. Skinflint Aussie wanna-be parents went a direction that protected their identities, relieved them of any obligation in the event of a health problem with the baby, opened the door for them to walk away leaving all their responsibility for having created this life behind. Pretty slimy........

[WhamBam]

Shameful in so many ways and shameful for those involved.

BUT what about the baby? He did not ask to be born in this way. No way should that baby be made to suffer because of this.

The Aussie parents, surrogate agency and the natural birth mother should all be contributing to this childs welfare.

[csabo]

This is gonna be hard to explain to the twin when she stumbles across this one day. "Well honey, you were the good baby so we just took you home, just like when we buy fruits at the market." There is no way they can escape this karma.

[csabo]

Shameful in so many ways and shameful for those involved.
BUT what about the baby? He did not ask to be born in this way. No way should that baby be made to suffer because of this.
The Aussie parents, surrogate agency and the natural birth mother should all be contributing to this childs welfare.

Why are the faulty genes of the Australian couple the responsibility of the surrogate? Are you aware how Down's syndrome occurs?

[Banzai99]

I think all parties carry guilt in this case, the childless couple who would do anything to have a (healthy) child, the baby dealing agents and the greedy couple who believe this to be a good way to earn money.

Yeah blame the poor people, how dare they be poor in the face of wealthy Farangs ?

[chooka]

$70K AUD raised yesterday alone, the tally now sits at around 110K and rising.  Lets hope all the money goes to the child and not every corrupt lowlife takes their share of the pie.

[noddy77]

Is there any proof to the Aussie parents that the surrogate Mother did indeed have twins?

Be a great way of getting a sick baby in to the right hands.

 

Is it medically possible to have 2 twins from 1 egg and they be so different?

Obviously I am no Doctor but I am sure there is an expert, (eggspurt), here somewhere.

Edited August 1, 2014 by noddy77

[BadBouy]

 

Being a surrogate mother is not a evil thing, and bring compensated for it is not evil either.
The only evil part of this story is this couple dumping the twin with Down's syndrome. They were the driving force in the child's birth and should have accepted the responsibility for their actions bringing the child into the world. I feel sorry for the twin they took being raised but such an amoral couple of human effluence. Name them, shame them, and make them stand up and do what they agreed to do! And the the Australian authorities should monitor them for 21 years.

The saddest part is Down's syndrome children are usually totally good natured,
friendly and loving children. Who try hard to be a credit to their families.

 

My feeling is that you have been told one side of the story by the media whose only interest is sensationalism. 

In reality, it probably went like this. The Aussie couple visited thai clinic about a surrogate baby. The Thai doctor promised, yes yes new healthy baby, just pay.

Then later they were told it was in fact twins - when they only wanted one. The Thai doctor then not wanting to lose face informed them the baby is healthy, but the second baby could be put for adoption if they did not want the one with down syndrome.

 

Ultimately, it was the Thai clinic that facilitated this.

 

 

It is the parents wanting to have a child and not being able to or wanting to produce a child on their own that facilitated this. You can not lay blame on others for the out come of your desires and you should not be able to escape responsibility for the children you create. I hope thoughts of Gammy haunt them enough to stand up and accept their responsibility.

[AGareth2]

Fathers should be responsible for their children

[harrycallahan]

What does her Buddhism say about flogging off offspring people in lab coats have stuck inside her?

It seems to me that the wanna-be parents are the ones who should have not entered into this arrangement. They are the ones who opted out due to imperfection. Pretty slimy if you ask me. And you fault the surrogate because she didn't murder the babies in her womb? Regardless of your own personal belief pertaining to  abortion and when life begins, the Buddhist lady cannot be faulted for her own belief and refusal based on said belief to have the abortiion. This is 100% on the Aussies who wanted to go cheap rather than hiring an Aussie surrogate. I label this Auusie couple as scum.

She wants to have her cake and eat it too, should never have entered into surrogacy arrangement.
 

Four months into the pregnancy, doctors doing routine checks discovered one of the babies had Down syndrome. They told the Australian parents, who said they did not want to take the boy, according to a source familiar with the case.

They told me to have an abortion but I didnt agree because I am afraid of sin, Ms Pattharamon says, referring to her Buddhist beliefs.

 

 

[chooka]

Abandoned baby Gammy rushed to hospital in Thailand

 

A baby boy abandoned by his Australian parents is so gravely ill in a Thai hospital his surrogate mother believes his death is imminent.

 

Six-month-old Gammy has been rushed to hospital with a lung infection, as Australians raised tens of thousands of dollars to get him medical care.

 

But his 21-year-old mother, Pattharamon Janbua, told a Thai reporter at the hospital: "I think the baby will not make it because his lung infection is too serious."

 

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/national/abandoned-baby-gammy-rushed-to-hospital-in-thailand-20140801-zzj76.html#ixzz39C8lePW8
 

[geodesic]

Apparently, there is an article in the Thai Rath about this incident as well.

 

Does anyone have a link to that?

 

 

http://www.thairath.co.th/content/439598

 

Here is the Thai article. It gives a little more information. Apparently, the father is Australian and the mother is Chinese (possibly Chinese-Australian...my Thai isn't good enough to know if they make a distinction like this), and the couple has refused to pay the surrogate the final 70,000 baht of the money they promised her. I can just imagine the argument leading up to that.

 

I truly hope someone investigates them. I feel very bad for the little girl and the kind of environment she might be raised in. The actions they have taken don't make them sound like they are ready to be parents and are treating their children more like commodities than people.

 

One can only hope that at some point in the future the Australian couple realizes the gravity of what they have done and comes to regret their incredibly selfish actions.

 

Gammy is better off without them.

[AGareth2]

BBC headline story

[chuang]

The couple have a heart of coal....

[Basil B]

Just heard on Australian T.V news that the couple come from Perth in Western Australia.  No names given.  The Australian Government is also in talks with Thailand to bring the surrogate mother and the little boy to Australia for treatment.  Apparently nearly 150K has been raised in Australia alone.

 

Well at least the Australian Government is doing the decent thing...

 

Though why bring them to Australia? is the Australian health service that much better or is it just a good PR thing?

 

Now hit the UK news http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-28617912

[Basil B]

 

Apparently, there is an article in the Thai Rath about this incident as well.

 

Does anyone have a link to that?

 

 

http://www.thairath.co.th/content/439598

 

Here is the Thai article. It gives a little more information. Apparently, the father is Australian and the mother is Chinese (possibly Chinese-Australian...my Thai isn't good enough to know if they make a distinction like this), and the couple has refused to pay the surrogate the final 70,000 baht of the money they promised her. I can just imagine the argument leading up to that.

 

I truly hope someone investigates them. I feel very bad for the little girl and the kind of environment she might be raised in. The actions they have taken don't make them sound like they are ready to be parents and are treating their children more like commodities than people.

 

One can only hope that at some point in the future the Australian couple realizes the gravity of what they have done and comes to regret their incredibly selfish actions.

 

Gammy is better off without them.

 

 

One must question the suitability as parents and remove the other child from their care.

[h90]

 

 

 

What I find unique is that, as you can't abort one baby from twins, the Aussies may have planned this path from as early as 3 months into the pregnancy, (when doctors were aware that 1 child had Downs.) In which case it is pretty "jai dam" I'd reckon. (And ostensibly persuaded the mother accordingly).

 

Can you abort just one? I don't know.

But you could also abort both and just start new.

 

 

Or maybe they could genetically modify them - choose sex, hair color, eye color etc etc. Would be a good money spinner in some countries eh? Bugger the ethics.

 

Didn't a group of scientists and politicians in the 30's/40's seem keen on this sort of thing? Mass abortions and removal of "imperfections"? 

 

Baby factoring and trafficking - unless very strictly controlled and the profits and middlemen removed.

 

Having chosen a surrogate with a religious belief that does not allow for abortion, it is really not even relevant whether only one could have been aborted leaving the other to be born. Skinflint Aussie wanna-be parents went a direction that protected their identities, relieved them of any obligation in the event of a health problem with the baby, opened the door for them to walk away leaving all their responsibility for having created this life behind. Pretty slimy........

 

 

Well we don't know the full story. It COULD be that the Australians didn't know that the woman is a religious extreme. It COULD be also that the Australians urged her to abort but she refused. Sad as it is, in this case (IF it happened that way) the Australians wouldn't be wrong.

I don't like the idea of surrogate at all. But I see most of the fault here in her being a religious fanatic.

[Basil B]

 

 

Having chosen a surrogate with a religious belief that does not allow for abortion, it is really not even relevant whether only one could have been aborted leaving the other to be born. Skinflint Aussie wanna-be parents went a direction that protected their identities, relieved them of any obligation in the event of a health problem with the baby, opened the door for them to walk away leaving all their responsibility for having created this life behind. Pretty slimy........

 

 

Well we don't know the full story. It COULD be that the Australians didn't know that the woman is a religious extreme. It COULD be also that the Australians urged her to abort but she refused. Sad as it is, in this case (IF it happened that way) the Australians wouldn't be wrong.

I don't like the idea of surrogate at all. But I see most of the fault here in her being a religious fanatic.

 

1. Is not abortion illegal in Thailand?
2. Twins, is it possible just to abort one? what are the chances of aborting the wrong one?

More holes than a Swiss cheese...

[WhamBam]

 

Shameful in so many ways and shameful for those involved.
BUT what about the baby? He did not ask to be born in this way. No way should that baby be made to suffer because of this.
The Aussie parents, surrogate agency and the natural birth mother should all be contributing to this childs welfare.

Why are the faulty genes of the Australian couple the responsibility of the surrogate? Are you aware how Down's syndrome occurs?

 

 

I did not mention faulty genes from anyone. Re-read my post.

 

Have you got your posts mixed up?
 

[h90]

 

 

 

Having chosen a surrogate with a religious belief that does not allow for abortion, it is really not even relevant whether only one could have been aborted leaving the other to be born. Skinflint Aussie wanna-be parents went a direction that protected their identities, relieved them of any obligation in the event of a health problem with the baby, opened the door for them to walk away leaving all their responsibility for having created this life behind. Pretty slimy........

 

 

Well we don't know the full story. It COULD be that the Australians didn't know that the woman is a religious extreme. It COULD be also that the Australians urged her to abort but she refused. Sad as it is, in this case (IF it happened that way) the Australians wouldn't be wrong.

I don't like the idea of surrogate at all. But I see most of the fault here in her being a religious fanatic.

 

1. Is not abortion illegal in Thailand?
2. Twins, is it possible just to abort one? what are the chances of aborting the wrong one?

More holes than a Swiss cheese...

 

 

1) While abortion is illegal in Thailand, it is very common.

It is comparable with prostitution is illegal in Thailand....Almost openly done.

2) If it was known very early the solution would be to abort both. Sounds cruel, but consider the huge amounts of abortions in Thailand and having a child with Down Syndrome is also hard. And think how that kid lives if the mother dies (say car accident).