1400 children sexually exploited in UK town Rotherham: report

[Bangkok Herps]

We are endlessly told on here to respect Thai values and culture and we are not even residents.

What is so controversial about stating the same for immigrants to the UK?

Australia has quite plainly stated the same and if immigrants can't do that, they should leave.

Frankly, a minority of Muslims use the very freedoms offered by democracy to stifle criticism and if criticism is forthcoming, they play the racism card.

The reason that this atrocity went on so long, was the fear of offending the Muslim community.

You endlessly hear it told both in Thailand and in the UK.

You endlessly watch it being violated, both by immigrants in the UK and by people from the UK when they go to other counties. I doubt you can spend 30 minutes in a public place in Bangkok without seeing a British person disrespecting Thai values, and in places where lots of foreigners congregate, it only gets worse.

Anyone who says, "foreigners always respect Thai values while in Thailand" is a jokester.

The truth is, the welcoming of foreigners and the assimilation of immigrants is always a two-way road. Some degree of assimilation (though by no means total), is always a good thing. Some degree of positively welcoming and flexibly accommodating people different than yourself is always a good thing. Some immigrants are better at assimilating than others, and some communities/states are better at welcoming immigrants than others. In the places where it's failing, both sides should be working on improving the process and the relationship. When you see one side just shouting at and blaming the other, it becomes unsurprising that the situation has deteriorated to the point that it's at.

[Scott]

Please stay on topic. We are beginning to move a little far afield.

[Grouse]

I grew up in Rotherham (I am now almost shamed to admit). In those days, most men were miners or steel workers. Neighbourhoods an villages were almost self policing! No need to lock doors and kids could "play out" without fear. As a teenager, you would not want face someone's dad coming out!

Now, following Thatcher, "no such thing as society" and mass unemployment, lawlessness took over and civic pride vanished.

I can not imagine what would have happened in those days, if a paki***** stepped out of line with a local teenage girl. However I'm pretty sure it would involve eating chapatis through a straw for weeks!

[Grouse]

I grew up in Rotherham (I am now almost shamed to admit). In those days, most men were miners or steel workers. Neighbourhoods an villages were almost self policing! No need to lock doors and kids could "play out" without fear. As a teenager, you would not want face someone's dad coming out!

Now, following Thatcher, "no such thing as society" and mass unemployment, lawlessness took over and civic pride vanished.

I can not imagine what would have happened in those days, if a paki***** stepped out of line with a local teenage girl. However I'm pretty sure it would involve eating chapatis through a straw for weeks!

[nontabury]

We are endlessly told on here to respect Thai values and culture and we are not even residents.

What is so controversial about stating the same for immigrants to the UK?

Australia has quite plainly stated the same and if immigrants can't do that, they should leave.

Frankly, a minority of Muslims use the very freedoms offered by democracy to stifle criticism and if criticism is forthcoming, they play the racism card.

The reason that this atrocity went on so long, was the fear of offending the Muslim community.

You endlessly hear it told both in Thailand and in the UK.

You endlessly watch it being violated, both by immigrants in the UK and by people from the UK when they go to other counties. I doubt you can spend 30 minutes in a public place in Bangkok without seeing a British person disrespecting Thai values, and in places where lots of foreigners congregate, it only gets worse.

Anyone who says, "foreigners always respect Thai values while in Thailand" is a jokester.

The truth is, the welcoming of foreigners and the assimilation of immigrants is always a two-way road. Some degree of assimilation (though by no means total), is always a good thing. Some degree of positively welcoming and flexibly accommodating people different than yourself is always a good thing. Some immigrants are better at assimilating than others, and some communities/states are better at welcoming immigrants than others. In the places where it's failing, both sides should be working on improving the process and the relationship. When you see one side just shouting at and blaming the other, it becomes unsurprising that the situation has deteriorated to the point that it's at.

Strange that! In 26yrs of coming and living in Thailand, the number of times I have over heard a Brit disrespecting Thai values are very few and far between.

P.s I used to live in Rotherham, absolutely no comparison, except for the sex tourist, the Pakistanis in Rotherham are on a completely different level to most ex-pats here. Can I invite you to visit Rotherham and stand up in All Saints Square and make you apologetic remarks, just make sure that your well insured before hand.

[Grouse]

We are endlessly told on here to respect Thai values and culture and we are not even residents.

What is so controversial about stating the same for immigrants to the UK?

Australia has quite plainly stated the same and if immigrants can't do that, they should leave.

Frankly, a minority of Muslims use the very freedoms offered by democracy to stifle criticism and if criticism is forthcoming, they play the racism card.

The reason that this atrocity went on so long, was the fear of offending the Muslim community.

You endlessly hear it told both in Thailand and in the UK.

You endlessly watch it being violated, both by immigrants in the UK and by people from the UK when they go to other counties. I doubt you can spend 30 minutes in a public place in Bangkok without seeing a British person disrespecting Thai values, and in places where lots of foreigners congregate, it only gets worse.

Anyone who says, "foreigners always respect Thai values while in Thailand" is a jokester.

The truth is, the welcoming of foreigners and the assimilation of immigrants is always a two-way road. Some degree of assimilation (though by no means total), is always a good thing. Some degree of positively welcoming and flexibly accommodating people different than yourself is always a good thing. Some immigrants are better at assimilating than others, and some communities/states are better at welcoming immigrants than others. In the places where it's failing, both sides should be working on improving the process and the relationship. When you see one side just shouting at and blaming the other, it becomes unsurprising that the situation has deteriorated to the point that it's at.

Strange that! In 26yrs of coming and living in Thailand, the number of times I have over heard a Brit disrespecting Thai values are very few and far between.

P.s I used to live in Rotherham, absolutely no comparison, except for the sex tourist, the Pakistanis in Rotherham are on a completely different level to most ex-pats here. Can I invite you to visit Rotherham and stand up in All Saints Square and make you apologetic remarks, just make sure that your well insured before hand.

Sorry, I don't understand your point. Please explain

I was just saying that 35 years ago, there was a much stronger civil society in S Yorkshire and people kept an eye open.

I can't imagine 1400 girls being abused at that time

I wanted to extend the debate to how such things can be avoided

In my opinion "multiculturalism" has not worker

[Mosha]

I grew up in Rotherham (I am now almost shamed to admit). In those days, most men were miners or steel workers. Neighbourhoods an villages were almost self policing! No need to lock doors and kids could "play out" without fear. As a teenager, you would not want face someone's dad coming out!

Now, following Thatcher, "no such thing as society" and mass unemployment, lawlessness took over and civic pride vanished.

I can not imagine what would have happened in those days, if a paki***** stepped out of line with a local teenage girl. However I'm pretty sure it would involve eating chapatis through a straw for weeks!

Growing up a bit north of you, I can imagine what would have happened. He'd have had the living daylights kicked out of him, and bugger calling the police. We were not shackled with pc BS then.

[JockPieandBeans]

Another 3 arrested, and amazingly granted bail.

Three men arrested on suspicion of sexually abusing underage girls in Rotherham and Sheffield between 2005 and 2009 have been released on bail.

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-south-yorkshire-31640875

[Mosha]

Another 3 arrested, and amazingly granted bail.

Three men arrested on suspicion of sexually abusing underage girls in Rotherham and Sheffield between 2005 and 2009 have been released on bail.

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-south-yorkshire-31640875

You would have thought they would be banged up for their own protection.

[JockPieandBeans]

Another 3 arrested, and amazingly granted bail.

Three men arrested on suspicion of sexually abusing underage girls in Rotherham and Sheffield between 2005 and 2009 have been released on bail.

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-south-yorkshire-31640875

You would have thought they would be banged up for their own protection.

The media refusing to publish names is their protection I'm afraid.

Without names it would be hard to pinpoint them in Rotherham or Sheffield.

[smotherb]

Suradit, this is not Thai related, cut out your Thai apologist rantings.

Sounds more like TV poster damning than Thai apologist. It should indeed be Brit-authority damning.

[Grouse]

Please release the names

Then there would be satisfying reaction I am sure

[7by7]

The law in England and Wales bans the police from releasing identity of suspects until they have been formally charged with an offence.

Unless it is in the public interest to do so; for example to aid in the apprehension of a suspect.

But the media discover and publish the identity of a suspect prior to the police releasing it, then the police may confirm that identity.

Similar laws apply in Scotland and Northern Ireland.

This is to prevent, among other things, the kind of vigilante actions implied in the above post against the innocent who may have been arrested and then released without charge.

BTW, in what some posters seem to be calling the good old days, many Pakistanis and other Asians did have the living daylights kicked out of them merely for being Asian!

Edited February 28, 2015 by 7by7

[JockPieandBeans]

The law in England and Wales bans the police from releasing identity of suspects until they have been formally charged with an offence.

Unless it is in the public interest to do so; for example to aid in the apprehension of a suspect.

But the media discover and publish the identity of a suspect prior to the police releasing it, then the police may confirm that identity.

Similar laws apply in Scotland and Northern Ireland.

This is to prevent, among other things, the kind of vigilante actions implied in the above post against the innocent who may have been arrested and then released without charge.

BTW, in what some posters seem to be calling the good old days, many Pakistanis and other Asians did have the living daylights kicked out of them merely for being Asian!

Try reading

Three men arrested on suspicion of sexually abusing underage girls in Rotherham and Sheffield between 2005 and 2009 have been released on bail.

It seems some are very good at quoting laws when it suits them.

Have you forgotten the media circus around Cliff Richards house when the police conducted a search.

Have you forgotten the numerous TV personalities that were named in supposed historic sex cases and never faced charges ? That does not include the ones that were actually taken to court and found not guilty.

Would that be the same vigilantes that a couple of months ago you insisted were law abiding citizens that took the law into their own hands.

Talk about double standards.

[Mosha]

BTW, in what some posters seem to be calling the good old days, many Pakistanis and other Asians did have the living daylights kicked out of them merely for being Asian!

Now it's the other way round, but police refuse to call them racist attacks.

[7by7]

jpb; arrested and bailed does not mean charged.

As said; if the media discover the identity of an arrested person or suspect and publish it, then the police may confirm that identity.

Maybe you should try reading!

I have never, to the best of my recollection, ever condoned any vigilante action nor referred to any vigilante as a law abiding citizen who took the law into their own hands.

If my recollection is incorrect then no doubt you will correct my memory by linking to the relevant post.

Mosha, the police do treat attacks by Asians on other racial groups as racist attacks.

But, Asians are more often the victim than the perpetrator.

From The Institute of Race Relations. The second paragraph in the quote is based on figures taken from the British Crime Survey.

A racist incident, according to the police, is any incident, including any crime, which is perceived by the victim or any other person to be motivated by a hostility or prejudice based on a person’s ‘race’ or perceived ‘race’. In 2011/12, there were 47,678 ‘racist incidents’ recorded by the police in England and Wales. On average, that is about 130 incidents per day.......


.........The proportion of adults who had been a victim of racially motivated hate crime varied by ethnic group, with white adults the least likely to have been a victim and Asian (or Asian British) adults the most likely.

Edited February 28, 2015 by 7by7

[Grouse]

That's absolutely tragic.....

Anybody got 500 Baht spare?

[Mosha]

jpb; arrested and bailed does not mean charged.

As said; if the media discover the identity of an arrested person or suspect and publish it, then the police may confirm that identity.

Maybe you should try reading!

I have never, to the best of my recollection, ever condoned any vigilante action nor referred to any vigilante as a law abiding citizen who took the law into their own hands.

If my recollection is incorrect then no doubt you will correct my memory by linking to the relevant post.

Mosha, the police do treat attacks by Asians on other racial groups as racist attacks.

But, Asians are more often the victim than the perpetrator.

From The Institute of Race Relations. The second paragraph in the quote is based on figures taken from the British Crime Survey.

A racist incident, according to the police, is any incident, including any crime, which is perceived by the victim or any other person to be motivated by a hostility or prejudice based on a person’s ‘race’ or perceived ‘race’. In 2011/12, there were 47,678 ‘racist incidents’ recorded by the police in England and Wales. On average, that is about 130 incidents per day.......

.........The proportion of adults who had been a victim of racially motivated hate crime varied by ethnic group, with white adults the least likely to have been a victim and Asian (or Asian British) adults the most likely.

http://www.thepressnews.co.uk/press-news/teen-badly-hurt-in-racist-attack/

The case collapsed, he was too scared to give evidence.

[Mossfinn]

Those 100+ active investigations are now starting to put scumbags in jail.

Esmatullah Haidaree, 46, of Farm Crescent, Slough, and Azim Ahmed, 23, of Diamond Road, Slough, were convicted at Reading Crown Court, in December.

Haidaree was found guilty of two counts of inciting a child to engage in sexual activity and four counts of sexual assault and Ahmed was convicted of five counts of sexual activity with a child.

The Slough Mayor has just resigned, apparently he made a serious error of misjudgement.

Slough's mayor has resigned after attending a court sentencing to support the family of a child sex offender

His current replacement.

Deputy Mohammed Rasib will take over his duties until an election in May

Outstanding.

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-berkshire-31553767

And your point is?

He has a non English name, well......... he has just gotta be be guilty of some crime then.

Or please relate your meaning, in relation to your post of course.............

[JockPieandBeans]

jpb; arrested and bailed does not mean charged.

As said; if the media discover the identity of an arrested person or suspect and publish it, then the police may confirm that identity.

Maybe you should try reading!

Just too funny. I did notice that not one comment on:

'' Have you forgotten the media circus around Cliff Richards house when the police conducted a search.

Have you forgotten the numerous TV personalities that were named in supposed historic sex cases and never faced charges ? That does not include the ones that were actually taken to court and found not guilty ''

As I said double standards or what.

I have never, to the best of my recollection, ever condoned any vigilante action nor referred to any vigilante as a law abiding citizen who took the law into their own hands.

If my recollection is incorrect then no doubt you will correct my memory by linking to the relevant post.

Try re-reading the No-Go area thread. If I could be @rsed I would dig it out for you.

[JockPieandBeans]

And your point is?

He has a non English name, well......... he has just gotta be be guilty of some crime then.

Or please relate your meaning, in relation to your post of course.............

If you cannot work out my point, by reading the topic name, and having just a little understanding of the topic.

Then there is absolutely no point in me trying to relate the meaning of my post.

[7by7]

jpb, in all the cases you mention, the media discovered the names, they were not officially released by the police.

In Richard's case, there have been complaints and questions raised about how the BBC managed to find out about the raid on his house before the police arrived and broadcast the raid live: Live raid 'breached Cliff privacy'. I make no comment on his guilt or innocence as that is for the courts to decide; if charges are ever laid against him.

As you don't believe me, see 3.5 Personal information from the College of Policing's Guidance on Relationships with the Media

I have never, to the best of my recollection, ever condoned any vigilante action nor referred to any vigilante as a law abiding citizen who took the law into their own hands.

If my recollection is incorrect then no doubt you will correct my memory by linking to the relevant post.

Try re-reading the No-Go area thread. If I could be @rsed I would dig it out for you.

Not the first time I have been accused of saying something I have not said, and probably wont be the last. As always, when challenged to provide the post(s) concerned, my accuser makes a feeble excuse for not doing so.

[JockPieandBeans]

jpb, in all the cases you mention, the media discovered the names, they were not officially released by the police.

In Richard's case, there have been complaints and questions raised about how the BBC managed to find out about the raid on his house before the police arrived and broadcast the raid live: Live raid 'breached Cliff privacy'. I make no comment on his guilt or innocence as that is for the courts to decide; if charges are ever laid against him.

As you don't believe me, see 3.5 Personal information from the College of Policing's Guidance on Relationships with the Media

I have never, to the best of my recollection, ever condoned any vigilante action nor referred to any vigilante as a law abiding citizen who took the law into their own hands.

If my recollection is incorrect then no doubt you will correct my memory by linking to the relevant post.

Try re-reading the No-Go area thread. If I could be @rsed I would dig it out for you.

Not the first time I have been accused of saying something I have not said, and probably wont be the last. As always, when challenged to provide the post(s) concerned, my accuser makes a feeble excuse for not doing so.

Did you, or did you not make a post along the following lines.

'' In some areas, Law Abiding citizens do not call the Police, but deal with things themselves '' ?

To which NeverSure and others replied '' They would be called vigilantes and as such cannot be called Law Abiding Citizens ''

So dry your eyes and take responsibility for the things that you post.

If I could remember the thread, I certainly would dig it out for you.

[7by7]

Did you, or did you not make a post along the following lines.

'' In some areas, Law Abiding citizens do not call the Police, but deal with things themselves '' ?

To which NeverSure and others replied '' They would be called vigilantes and as such cannot be called Law Abiding Citizens ''

I did not make any such post nor anything remotely similar.

I do recall someone, can't remember who, posting a link to a newspaper article which contained a comment along those lines.

So dry your eyes and take responsibility for the things that you post.

If I could remember the thread, I certainly would dig it out for you.

Maybe it's about time you took responsibility for what you post and for once in your posting career admit that you were wrong.

[Pete Beale]

Another day another case http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-31695832

[JockPieandBeans]

Did you, or did you not make a post along the following lines.

'' In some areas, Law Abiding citizens do not call the Police, but deal with things themselves '' ?

To which NeverSure and others replied '' They would be called vigilantes and as such cannot be called Law Abiding Citizens ''

I did not make any such post nor anything remotely similar.

I do recall someone, can't remember who, posting a link to a newspaper article which contained a comment along those lines.

So dry your eyes and take responsibility for the things that you post.

If I could remember the thread, I certainly would dig it out for you.

Maybe it's about time you took responsibility for what you post and for once in your posting career admit that you were wrong.

I take full responsibility for everything that I post. I make no apologies for what I post and I stand by what I post.

It was you who made that post. It was also you that made a post insinuating that I threatened you. Like I said, if I could be @rsed I would dig them out.

Just to get back on topic.

10 men charged by police investigating child sexual exploitation in Rochdale, Greater Manchester

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-manchester-31695832

I wonder how many of those active 100+ investigations are centred around Rochdale ?

Perhaps I should start a sweep on how many are called '' John ''

Edited March 2, 2015 by JockPieandBeans

[JockPieandBeans]

Sorry Pete.

Did not see your post before posting.

[7by7]

It was you who made that post. It was also you that made a post insinuating that I threatened you. Like I said, if I could be @rsed I would dig them out.

Neither of those accusations are true.

You can't produce the posts concerned because they do not exist; and you know it.

[JockPieandBeans]

It was you who made that post. It was also you that made a post insinuating that I threatened you. Like I said, if I could be @rsed I would dig them out.

Neither of those accusations are true.

You can't produce the posts concerned because they do not exist; and you know it.

Sure, whatever you say. They will be brought to the fore soon enough.

Meanwhile, over in good old Rochdale. It seems that some outlets are no longer afraid to name names.

The suspects are:

Shayfur Rahman, 31, Prestwich, charged with one count of rape.

Kutab Miah, 34, Rochdale, charged with three counts of sexual activity and one count of rape.

Rehan Ali, 26, Manchester, charged with one count of rape, three counts of sexual activity with a child when the offender was over 18 and three counts of sexual activity with a child when the offender was between 15 and 17.

Iklaq Choudhry Hussain, 37, Rochdale, charged with three counts of sexual activity with a child and two counts of rape.

David Law, 45, Derbyshire, charged with three counts of conspiracy to commit rape.

Mahfus Rahman, 28, of HMP Garth, charged with three counts of rape and three counts of sexual activity with a child.

Ashfaq Yousaf, 28, of HMP Forest Bank, charged with one count of aiding and abetting rape against one victim. He has also been charged with one count of rape against a further victim.

Afraz Ahmed, 32, Rochdale, charged with two counts of conspiracy to commit rape and one count of rape against one victim. He also faces two counts of inciting a child to engage in sexual activity, relating to offences against to girls. He has also been charged with one count of rape against a further victim.

Mohammed Davood, 37, Burnley, charged with one count of assault occasioning actual bodily harm against one victim. He has also been charged with three counts of rape, one count of sexual activity with a child and one count of sexual assault against a further victim.

Mohammed Miah, 39, of HMP Moorland, charged with three counts of sexual activity and one count of rape against one victim. He has also been charged with one count of rape against a further victim

http://news.sky.com/story/1436969/men-charged-with-abusing-rochdale-teens

Notice how many times the word '' Child '' is used.

There was also a '' David '' in there. I wonder if he was a convert to Islam ?

[soihok]

Very sad and shocking.