Lao children are better educated than Thai kids

[dazzz]

Year after year after year...we hear the same old tune about the education system here. Its funny in a sad kind of way. Thais love to call anyting they consider unfashionable or stupid as being 'Laos'......How ironic this is then.....

This REALLY needs to be sorted out NOW! I am working at a government school at the moment......not for much longer because I have had it! Thai schools are, in the main a joke. Thai teachers are dinosaurs that are still using teaching techniques that come from 1937. I often walk past the Thai teachers classes and more often than not they are sitting on their backsides with NO interaction with students! They simply write a load of info on the board and the kids copy it.....after that thier job is done!!!! I would be ashamed to teach in such a way. I feel it is my job to try and engage the students, interact with them, get them questioning me. I am the odd one out it seems.

The head of English at my school is a lovely lady that has a Masters degree in English. I often have to speak Thai with her as, if I dont, she wont understand what I am on about! Unfortunately this is common here. I have only met a handful of Thai English teachers that can actually have a conversation past the level of a 5 or 6 year old. I have to 'teach the teachers' sometimes and guess who are the ones that dont show up???!!!! You guessed it....the Thai English teachers!!! Why? Because its such a MASSIVE loss of face for them to be in a room with a native speaker.....I mean, what if I ask them a question? If I do everyone will see that the reality is that they CANNOT speak English!!! They are the teachers that most need to be there when I am 'teaching the teachers' What hope do the kids have? They see me once a week, twice if they are lucky. The rest of their exposure to English is through these numpties that cannot do their jobs properly.

I am looking forward to AEC opening. Thailand is slowly but surely starting to wake up to the fact that its not the centre of the universe. Its starting to realise that its not looking too good in comparision to its other ASEAN friends. It could go either way, but I am a bit cynical. I think Thailand will do what it always does, it will sweep things under the carpet, it will withdraw from a fight on a level playing field, a fight in which it will most surely ge a very bloody nose. AEC will be just a name, the Thais will find a way to get around all the horrible new rules that will show them up. It will be AEC on paper only. In reality nothing will change. The nepotism that is the cause of so much incomptence here will stay. The sad thing for Thailand is that talented people get cast aside by others with connections, or money. I have so many lovely and smart students in my classes....but so what? The system is against them. I just cannot see this place doing what is required to enable it to really, I mean really compete with places like Singapore. I hope I am wrong.

Am I being cynical? After reading headlines for years and years about how the educations system needs to change...and nothing happening...yes I am being cynical. I think the answer to the problem is clear. If you want an education.....go to Laos!

So most Thais cant speak English beyond the level of a 5 or six year old?? So let me ask you this..How many people in the UK can speak French or German or any other language beyond the level of a six year old?? I don't speak Thai beyond the level of a six year old but its not from lack of trying!

While the Thai educational system has many shortcomings, these type of surveys need to be taken with a pinch of salt!!

Many of us on this forum are married to Thais. If the education system is producing such robotic people incapable of critical thought then we need to ask the question why so many'educated' westerners marry Thais?????

The perfect educational system doesn't exist. We need to be culturally aware when analyzing the Thai system and remember that its developed from a different way of thinking. Let's not be arrogant and assume that Western systems are the best. I've just returned here from the UK. People are miserable there and struggling to survive. Compare that with the vibrancy and positive outlook of Thai's. Maybe we are the ones who have it all wrong????

Can you <deleted> read better than a 6 yr old !!!!!! yooyung said that thai ENGLISH TEACHERS !!!!! cannot speak beyond the level of a 6 yr old not all thais . I was teaching some pupils to speak thai for free in my house on weekends and the local school english teacher stopped me because i was teaching them to write the alphabet wrong ie not the same as a 1950`s scripted typewriter. Went to see him ,showed me his degree but could not speak a word of english

[mumjokmok]

"Yeah but the Lao kids are still from Laos" says the Thai student.

Canadians generally seem pretty sharp compared to their neighbours....... might have something to do with where you source your syllabus from......

Edited September 11, 2014 by mumjokmok

[metisdead]

An inflammatory post has been removed as well as the warranted replies.

[hotsoup]

I think many members are a bit confused about the 'purpose' of schooling in Thailand. We tend to think in the 'West'. wherever that might be, that the purpose of going to school is to learn what has been scooped up into subjects which are then examined and on the basis of gaining good grades in those exams we establish our place in the academic and occupational hierarchy. I believe it is called 'credentialing'!!In the best places competence in things like critical thinking and problem solving has been promoted.

Many thinkers, from Aristotle to Mao have described the purpose of education quite differently' ie. its primary purpose is to prepare students to live pragmatically and immediately in their current environment and to prepare individuals to live as members of a society. In other words, theorists such as Adler and Counts felt the role of schooling was to equip individuals with the skills necessary to participate in the social life of their community. That is what Thai schools aim to do. The fetishes around personal appearance, singing songs, saluting, etc. are critical skills for managing daily life. It is of course, unfortunate that little intellectual learning and the acquisition of other competences does not take place

Edited September 11, 2014 by hotsoup

[Jim walker]

Is this all down to corruption once again buying your child’s educational results resulting in many stupid children. Or is it just the poor Thai education curriculum

[HiSoLowSoNoSo]

My kid was spanked by the teacher because she thought that his hair was too long (not longer then half inch) and my son is in a private school. So far he has not had any lesson in geography at all, so I have to teach him that myself after school. The English teacher is from the Philippines and it's easier to understand a guy with heavy Scottish accent then her. And for this shit I have to pay for! I don't even want to think about how it is in the free government schools in Thailand, I fell very sad for the kids in this country for the shitty school system they got.

[lovelaos]

My kid was spanked by the teacher because she thought that his hair was too long (not longer then half inch) and my son is in a private school. So far he has not had any lesson in geography at all, so I have to teach him that myself after school. The English teacher is from the Philippines and it's easier to understand a guy with heavy Scottish accent then her. And for this shit I have to pay for! I don't even want to think about how it is in the free government schools in Thailand, I fell very sad for the kids in this country for the shitty school system they got.

And you didn't take your kid out of the school? Or report the teacher?

[trogers]

Is this all down to corruption once again buying your childs educational results resulting in many stupid children. Or is it just the poor Thai education curriculum

Both. Read further on Homework/Assignments Services being advertised on the internet.

[wilcopops]

Unleash the "educational experts"!

[rubl]

This cannot possibly be correct as the Laotians are inferior to Thais and here in Isan most definitely looked down on.

Rumour has it that they don't even speak Thai, imagine

In a discussion on languages with one of my former uni classes in rural Issan I was advised that the Issan dialect didn't derive from the Lao language bur rather it was the other way round. !

The interesting part is that Thailand has many different groups which are all Thai Nationals. Some may speak a non-Thai language as first language in the first few years of their life before they get dumped in the 'educational system'.

At times people from Isaan call themselves as from Lao rather than being Thai. Now if I would call those 'upcountry' Lao I would probably be virtually 'hung, drawn and quartered' for being so insensitive.

No idea how Thai with more Khmer roots look upon their brethren in Campuchia. Do those down South look down on their brethren on the other side of the border?

[rubl]

The interesting part is being in a meeting and upon not understanding I start to ask questions. Following I can see many around me real happy I did ask, because they just couldn't even if they didn't understand either.

Mind you, the younger collegues are getting more inquisitive.There seems to be progress although at glacial pace.

[tonbridgebrit]

Yes, but GDP per person in Laos is considerably lower than Thailand.

And even if GDP per person in Laos is growing quicker than Thailand, it will take them decades to catch up with Thailand. And it's not going to happen.

Just as absurd as being scared that GDP per person in places like Bulgaria, Romania and Poland, that they will catch up with Britain !

No idea what that has got to do with education

Laotians have been better English speakers than Thais for a very long time, and now it seems are overtaking in general education.

Nothing new here.

"No idea what that has got to do with education "

Well, surely, the main point of a country using tax money to finance education (schools and colleges) is, is that education equips young people with the skills they need for work ?

Yes, all this talk about Thai people being not as good in English as their neighbours, yes, it's a problem. Thailand's neighbours might be able to speak English better, and this means that they produce better workers for the tourist industry. Saying that, Thailand's neighbours don't want to set up big red light districts for foreigners, that's why Thailand attracts more foreigners DESPITE being poorer when it comes to speaking English.

Back home in England, I think they've been saying this for decades. Basically, schools are churning out young people who are simply not equipped for the work place. I think the engineering industry has been saying for ages "the system is not producing enough engineers, and the students coming out with engineering qualifications are mostly not good enough to be a trainee engineer, we really wonder what they actually teach on engineering courses".

Yes, a load of young people not equipped for the work place, this holds back economic growth, this reduces growth in GDP per person. Singapore (as everybody loves to point out) and Hong Kong have higher levels of education (and more quality education), that's suppose to be part of the reason why they have greater GDP per person.

[Thai at Heart]

Yes, but GDP per person in Laos is considerably lower than Thailand.

And even if GDP per person in Laos is growing quicker than Thailand, it will take them decades to catch up with Thailand. And it's not going to happen.

Just as absurd as being scared that GDP per person in places like Bulgaria, Romania and Poland, that they will catch up with Britain !

No idea what that has got to do with education

Laotians have been better English speakers than Thais for a very long time, and now it seems are overtaking in general education.

Nothing new here.

"No idea what that has got to do with education "

Well, surely, the main point of a country using tax money to finance education (schools and colleges) is, is that education equips young people with the skills they need for work ?

Yes, all this talk about Thai people being not as good in English as their neighbours, yes, it's a problem. Thailand's neighbours might be able to speak English better, and this means that they produce better workers for the tourist industry. Saying that, Thailand's neighbours don't want to set up big red light districts for foreigners, that's why Thailand attracts more foreigners DESPITE being poorer when it comes to speaking English.

Back home in England, I think they've been saying this for decades. Basically, schools are churning out young people who are simply not equipped for the work place. I think the engineering industry has been saying for ages "the system is not producing enough engineers, and the students coming out with engineering qualifications are mostly not good enough to be a trainee engineer, we really wonder what they actually teach on engineering courses".

Yes, a load of young people not equipped for the work place, this holds back economic growth, this reduces growth in GDP per person. Singapore (as everybody loves to point out) and Hong Kong have higher levels of education (and more quality education), that's suppose to be part of the reason why they have greater GDP per person.

That goes waaaaay beyond the ability to support a tourist industry.

Just look at how many advertisements for general workers is in English. People to deal with clients, people to interact with head office, people to do the bookds for an MNC, people to even work on the shop floor and interpret work instructions from a manager.

The first time I worked in Thailand, I was in a factory with 700 labour and one translator. The translator was a godsend, but eventually I learnt pretty good Thai and could take care of myself. What was the first thing we worked out once I could speak enough Thai? That the Thai management were skimming about 10% on everything.

As for back home, there are shortages in all sorts of businesses and there are a glut of underqualifed young people. It really is tragic,but the effort to put extra bums on seats in University was matched with letting them study media studies with low grades which no one wants. In the company we can't get enough software developers. We are crying out for them.

Singaporean and Hong Kong GDP is skewed by being an invoicing entity for exports from China and South East Asia.

Edited September 11, 2014 by Thai at Heart

[MrBrad]

.....

Also Thai's not being so amazing at English, well we all know why that is don't we. Those amazing English teachers that have been working here have been doing wonders for all these years, it really shows.

I think that just another part of the problem here is that the curriculum is decided by the department heads or even someone higher up the chain of command.

I'm sponsoring a Thai student at a private academy. His competence in English is probably 3 grades higher than where he is placed in the class. He is not allowed to advance to study at a higher level of English. I've asked, and they told me that it would cause too much confusion. Personally, I think there are other reasons, but the point is they're keeping him from studying at the level he is capable of.

But, as I started to say in the first paragraph, the books that are used by the native English speakers (from abroad) are so basic and simple. And one book of 10 chapters is used for the whole school year. If the book says Level 3, it's used for 3rd graders only. They cannot advance to Level 4 until the following year. [You can find this series and other similar texts at any good bookstore here.] This is much too slow for learning how to use the language properly; one level in these books could easily be completed in half or even one-third of the time. Nonetheless, the teachers do augment the lesson plans with language games and reading and other techniques.

I sat in on the English class recently, and as a whole the students were inattentive and bored. The classroom is quite chaotic with students arriving late and leaving the room without permission. Lots of talking Thai amongst the students. In short, the teacher had little control; I don't know what form of discipline would have been appropriate and acceptable, but it was nuts.

And, as is commonly known, even the students who should fail the course are simply passed on to the next grade. The school wouldn't want to experience the ire and indignation of the parents of the kid who should be held back. Actually, it's probably more like not getting the kid to attend the next term, and the money that the school receives for the privilege of babysitting for another year.

In short, it's a sad situation for the kids. Schools here are primarily for fun and entertainment. Acquiring knowledge is further down on the list of priorities.

[penkrew]

I wouldn't disagree with any of the comments about the poor state of the Thai educational system. I would point out, though, that the survey simply asked businesses what their opinion was of each education system, so the results are based on pretty subjective data. They didn't go and check assessment levels, count the number of computers and books or monitor teaching. It just asked non-teachers what they thought of their country's schools. Still pretty embarrassing to be behind Laos in anything, though...

[kingalfred]

Year after year after year...we hear the same old tune about the education system here. Its funny in a sad kind of way. Thais love to call anyting they consider unfashionable or stupid as being 'Laos'......How ironic this is then.....

This REALLY needs to be sorted out NOW! I am working at a government school at the moment......not for much longer because I have had it! Thai schools are, in the main a joke. Thai teachers are dinosaurs that are still using teaching techniques that come from 1937. I often walk past the Thai teachers classes and more often than not they are sitting on their backsides with NO interaction with students! They simply write a load of info on the board and the kids copy it.....after that thier job is done!!!! I would be ashamed to teach in such a way. I feel it is my job to try and engage the students, interact with them, get them questioning me. I am the odd one out it seems.

The head of English at my school is a lovely lady that has a Masters degree in English. I often have to speak Thai with her as, if I dont, she wont understand what I am on about! Unfortunately this is common here. I have only met a handful of Thai English teachers that can actually have a conversation past the level of a 5 or 6 year old. I have to 'teach the teachers' sometimes and guess who are the ones that dont show up???!!!! You guessed it....the Thai English teachers!!! Why? Because its such a MASSIVE loss of face for them to be in a room with a native speaker.....I mean, what if I ask them a question? If I do everyone will see that the reality is that they CANNOT speak English!!! They are the teachers that most need to be there when I am 'teaching the teachers' What hope do the kids have? They see me once a week, twice if they are lucky. The rest of their exposure to English is through these numpties that cannot do their jobs properly.

I am looking forward to AEC opening. Thailand is slowly but surely starting to wake up to the fact that its not the centre of the universe. Its starting to realise that its not looking too good in comparision to its other ASEAN friends. It could go either way, but I am a bit cynical. I think Thailand will do what it always does, it will sweep things under the carpet, it will withdraw from a fight on a level playing field, a fight in which it will most surely ge a very bloody nose. AEC will be just a name, the Thais will find a way to get around all the horrible new rules that will show them up. It will be AEC on paper only. In reality nothing will change. The nepotism that is the cause of so much incomptence here will stay. The sad thing for Thailand is that talented people get cast aside by others with connections, or money. I have so many lovely and smart students in my classes....but so what? The system is against them. I just cannot see this place doing what is required to enable it to really, I mean really compete with places like Singapore. I hope I am wrong.

Am I being cynical? After reading headlines for years and years about how the educations system needs to change...and nothing happening...yes I am being cynical. I think the answer to the problem is clear. If you want an education.....go to Laos!

So most Thais cant speak English beyond the level of a 5 or six year old?? So let me ask you this..How many people in the UK can speak French or German or any other language beyond the level of a six year old?? I don't speak Thai beyond the level of a six year old but its not from lack of trying!

While the Thai educational system has many shortcomings, these type of surveys need to be taken with a pinch of salt!!

Many of us on this forum are married to Thais. If the education system is producing such robotic people incapable of critical thought then we need to ask the question why so many'educated' westerners marry Thais?????

The perfect educational system doesn't exist. We need to be culturally aware when analyzing the Thai system and remember that its developed from a different way of thinking. Let's not be arrogant and assume that Western systems are the best. I've just returned here from the UK. People are miserable there and struggling to survive. Compare that with the vibrancy and positive outlook of Thai's. Maybe we are the ones who have it all wrong????

what nonsense, its not about "language learning" in thailand ,its the standards across all subjects and syllabus,which is appalling and the worst in SE asia. Edited September 11, 2014 by kingalfred

[tonbridgebrit]

Yes, but GDP per person in Laos is considerably lower than Thailand.

And even if GDP per person in Laos is growing quicker than Thailand, it will take them decades to catch up with Thailand. And it's not going to happen.

Just as absurd as being scared that GDP per person in places like Bulgaria, Romania and Poland, that they will catch up with Britain !

No idea what that has got to do with education

Laotians have been better English speakers than Thais for a very long time, and now it seems are overtaking in general education.

Nothing new here.

"No idea what that has got to do with education "

Well, surely, the main point of a country using tax money to finance education (schools and colleges) is, is that education equips young people with the skills they need for work ?

Yes, all this talk about Thai people being not as good in English as their neighbours, yes, it's a problem. Thailand's neighbours might be able to speak English better, and this means that they produce better workers for the tourist industry. Saying that, Thailand's neighbours don't want to set up big red light districts for foreigners, that's why Thailand attracts more foreigners DESPITE being poorer when it comes to speaking English.

Back home in England, I think they've been saying this for decades. Basically, schools are churning out young people who are simply not equipped for the work place. I think the engineering industry has been saying for ages "the system is not producing enough engineers, and the students coming out with engineering qualifications are mostly not good enough to be a trainee engineer, we really wonder what they actually teach on engineering courses".

Yes, a load of young people not equipped for the work place, this holds back economic growth, this reduces growth in GDP per person. Singapore (as everybody loves to point out) and Hong Kong have higher levels of education (and more quality education), that's suppose to be part of the reason why they have greater GDP per person.

That goes waaaaay beyond the ability to support a tourist industry.

Just look at how many advertisements for general workers is in English. People to deal with clients, people to interact with head office, people to do the bookds for an MNC, people to even work on the shop floor and interpret work instructions from a manager.

The first time I worked in Thailand, I was in a factory with 700 labour and one translator. The translator was a godsend, but eventually I learnt pretty good Thai and could take care of myself. What was the first thing we worked out once I could speak enough Thai? That the Thai management were skimming about 10% on everything.

As for back home, there are shortages in all sorts of businesses and there are a glut of underqualifed young people. It really is tragic,but the effort to put extra bums on seats in University was matched with letting them study media studies with low grades which no one wants. In the company we can't get enough software developers. We are crying out for them.

Singaporean and Hong Kong GDP is skewed by being an invoicing entity for exports from China and South East Asia.

Yes, Thai at Heart, I didn't mean teaching English was good PURELY for equipping Thai youngsters to work in tourism. They need English for other industries as well. Thai management skimming 10 per cent of everything ? Well, that's NOT going to be cured by more schools and better colleges, right ?

Yes, the system in England produces lots of youngsters with qualifications that are simply useless for the work place. Is it also true in Thailand ?

As for "Singaporean and Hong Kong GDP is skewed by being an invoicing entity for exports from China and South East Asia", well, yes, I totally agree. I was trying to make this point last time, when the talk was about getting Thailand to become a "high income nation" !!

[Expat Girl]

This actually surprised me, i have always held the Thai education in fairly high esteem, mostly based on the universities, more so Chulalongkorn, guess i based that as the bench mark and placed other educational establishments on a similar level. I must admit i have no idea of the quality of the secondary schools, but still a little disappointed with this information.

[Artisi]

.....

Also Thai's not being so amazing at English, well we all know why that is don't we. Those amazing English teachers that have been working here have been doing wonders for all these years, it really shows.

I think that just another part of the problem here is that the curriculum is decided by the department heads or even someone higher up the chain of command.

I'm sponsoring a Thai student at a private academy. His competence in English is probably 3 grades higher than where he is placed in the class. He is not allowed to advance to study at a higher level of English. I've asked, and they told me that it would cause too much confusion. Personally, I think there are other reasons, but the point is they're keeping him from studying at the level he is capable of.

But, as I started to say in the first paragraph, the books that are used by the native English speakers (from abroad) are so basic and simple. And one book of 10 chapters is used for the whole school year. If the book says Level 3, it's used for 3rd graders only. They cannot advance to Level 4 until the following year. [You can find this series and other similar texts at any good bookstore here.] This is much too slow for learning how to use the language properly; one level in these books could easily be completed in half or even one-third of the time. Nonetheless, the teachers do augment the lesson plans with language games and reading and other techniques.

I sat in on the English class recently, and as a whole the students were inattentive and bored. The classroom is quite chaotic with students arriving late and leaving the room without permission. Lots of talking Thai amongst the students. In short, the teacher had little control; I don't know what form of discipline would have been appropriate and acceptable, but it was nuts.

And, as is commonly known, even the students who should fail the course are simply passed on to the next grade. The school wouldn't want to experience the ire and indignation of the parents of the kid who should be held back. Actually, it's probably more like not getting the kid to attend the next term, and the money that the school receives for the privilege of babysitting for another year.

In short, it's a sad situation for the kids. Schools here are primarily for fun and entertainment. Acquiring knowledge is further down on the list of priorities.

Don't expect Thai teachers to teach advanced rocket science when many are lucky to being paid more than Bht 6000 / month, this doesn't attract the right people to become teachers.

You will find many Thai teachers are very dedicated to their students but unfortunately lack the skills needed to be educators, which will always be problem until wages are dramatically increased to the level where well qualified people are attracted and want to become teachers, also the non-educational nonsense they need to participate in needs to be curtailed and farmed off to TA's and being pseudo full-time parents to many of the students needs to be stopped.

Yes the education system is poor for a reason and needs an urgent review and something positive undertaken in its rectification, not cheap talk and not pie-in-the-sky quick fixes, promises etc.

Edited September 11, 2014 by Artisi

[Lee4Life]

Please don't believed in such polls, it's not true and fake. I born in Malaysia the education systems are bad the University place only reserved for 75-80 % Malays the rest of the races have to go overseas or private . Compare with Thailand where everybody have a opportunity to study for University with affordable price.

The survey maybe rank on English, that is undeniable but the rest Thailand are still the best.

Are you really trying to advocate that they based the comparative study on the students English abilities? The excuses you make illustrate the worldwide problem of failing to accept blame and admit that improvement is needed.

[TPI]

Please don't believed in such polls, it's not true and fake. I born in Malaysia the education systems are bad the University place only reserved for 75-80 % Malays the rest of the races have to go overseas or private . Compare with Thailand where everybody have a opportunity to study for University with affordable price.

The survey maybe rank on English, that is undeniable but the rest Thailand are still the best.

Sorry my friend, that's a fail! In Malaysia there are Chinese, Indian and farang who all get a chance at university. The standards are very high and if you fail your exams, you fail! The price or quota of education has nothing to do with the quality, 200 students in a lecture is crazy, students made into teams and the team shares the results makes for very lazy students! Cut and paste on reports teaches nothing!

If you want a good education go overseas.....Thailand doesn't have a university in the top 100, Australia, with less than a third of the population, has 5 universities in the top 100! You figure it out!

[Thai at Heart]

Yes, Thai at Heart, I didn't mean teaching English was good PURELY for equipping Thai youngsters to work in tourism. They need English for other industries as well. Thai management skimming 10 per cent of everything ? Well, that's NOT going to be cured by more schools and better colleges, right ?

Yes, the system in England produces lots of youngsters with qualifications that are simply useless for the work place. Is it also true in Thailand ?

As for "Singaporean and Hong Kong GDP is skewed by being an invoicing entity for exports from China and South East Asia", well, yes, I totally agree. I was trying to make this point last time, when the talk was about getting Thailand to become a "high income nation" !!

The whole point of useless qualifications is an interesting one. 40 years ago, people got free fees and those that qualified got a grant to go to university which was barely enough to live. A pretty selected bunch attended.

Then they wanted to get more into university becuse it looked good on numbers, so they opened it up, but now everyone has to pay, and it produces a much broader amount of subjects with quite a few copletely useless ones. University shouldn't be for everyone that is for sure. As for thai universities, I don't know if they have degrees that no one wants. Do they have graduates that anyone wants. My niece is now working for Siam City Cement with a law degree. 12k per month. Thanks for coming.

[TPI]

This actually surprised me, i have always held the Thai education in fairly high esteem, mostly based on the universities, more so Chulalongkorn, guess i based that as the bench mark and placed other educational establishments on a similar level. I must admit i have no idea of the quality of the secondary schools, but still a little disappointed with this information.

I think it's time you got on your bicycle and had a good look around. Thailand is the place that created the trueism "failure to plan is to plan for failure", The Education Ministry is famous for coming up with amazing ideas and following through with none of them! (There's no money to be made from "amazing ideas")

[tonbridgebrit]

Yes, Thai at Heart, I didn't mean teaching English was good PURELY for equipping Thai youngsters to work in tourism. They need English for other industries as well. Thai management skimming 10 per cent of everything ? Well, that's NOT going to be cured by more schools and better colleges, right ?

Yes, the system in England produces lots of youngsters with qualifications that are simply useless for the work place. Is it also true in Thailand ?

As for "Singaporean and Hong Kong GDP is skewed by being an invoicing entity for exports from China and South East Asia", well, yes, I totally agree. I was trying to make this point last time, when the talk was about getting Thailand to become a "high income nation" !!

The whole point of useless qualifications is an interesting one. 40 years ago, people got free fees and those that qualified got a grant to go to university which was barely enough to live. A pretty selected bunch attended.

Then they wanted to get more into university becuse it looked good on numbers, so they opened it up, but now everyone has to pay, and it produces a much broader amount of subjects with quite a few copletely useless ones. University shouldn't be for everyone that is for sure. As for thai universities, I don't know if they have degrees that no one wants. Do they have graduates that anyone wants. My niece is now working for Siam City Cement with a law degree. 12k per month. Thanks for coming.

12 K a month, and that's for a young person with a degree in law, at Siam City Cement ?? Is the job based in Bangkok ?

I can hardly believe this. How much are the people who work at those Japanese car plants on ? What about the staff at the future VW car plant ?

Sorry to hear this, man.

[Thai at Heart]

Yes, Thai at Heart, I didn't mean teaching English was good PURELY for equipping Thai youngsters to work in tourism. They need English for other industries as well. Thai management skimming 10 per cent of everything ? Well, that's NOT going to be cured by more schools and better colleges, right ?

Yes, the system in England produces lots of youngsters with qualifications that are simply useless for the work place. Is it also true in Thailand ?

As for "Singaporean and Hong Kong GDP is skewed by being an invoicing entity for exports from China and South East Asia", well, yes, I totally agree. I was trying to make this point last time, when the talk was about getting Thailand to become a "high income nation" !!

The whole point of useless qualifications is an interesting one. 40 years ago, people got free fees and those that qualified got a grant to go to university which was barely enough to live. A pretty selected bunch attended.

Then they wanted to get more into university becuse it looked good on numbers, so they opened it up, but now everyone has to pay, and it produces a much broader amount of subjects with quite a few copletely useless ones. University shouldn't be for everyone that is for sure. As for thai universities, I don't know if they have degrees that no one wants. Do they have graduates that anyone wants. My niece is now working for Siam City Cement with a law degree. 12k per month. Thanks for coming.

12 K a month, and that's for a young person with a degree in law, at Siam City Cement ?? Is the job based in Bangkok ?

I can hardly believe this. How much are the people who work at those Japanese car plants on ? What about the staff at the future VW car plant ?

Sorry to hear this, man.

Not based in Bangkok.

Her elder brother who has a masters in law from chula was offered 19k by CP as an in house lawyer, only because his uncle is country manager for Myanmar for CP.

He will take more exams to become a judge. Then watch the wonga role in. What do you reckon graduates get?

12 to 20k

And people wonder why I got my kids out of it

Car plants 20 to 40k and good bonuses

Edited September 11, 2014 by Thai at Heart

[paymaster]

It is difficult to see this scandalous set of statistics as anything else but SEDITION. While ever teachers and schools are rated by the good results they produce for all students, especially the slow witted, seeds for this sedition will continue to be sown.

[timewilltell]

Please don't believed in such polls, it's not true and fake. I born in Malaysia the education systems are bad the University place only reserved for 75-80 % Malays the rest of the races have to go overseas or private . Compare with Thailand where everybody have a opportunity to study for University with affordable price.

The survey maybe rank on English, that is undeniable but the rest Thailand are still the best.

Delusional.

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[timewilltell]

Year after year after year...we hear the same old tune about the education system here. Its funny in a sad kind of way. Thais love to call anyting they consider unfashionable or stupid as being 'Laos'......How ironic this is then.....

This REALLY needs to be sorted out NOW! I am working at a government school at the moment......not for much longer because I have had it! Thai schools are, in the main a joke. Thai teachers are dinosaurs that are still using teaching techniques that come from 1937. I often walk past the Thai teachers classes and more often than not they are sitting on their backsides with NO interaction with students! They simply write a load of info on the board and the kids copy it.....after that thier job is done!!!! I would be ashamed to teach in such a way. I feel it is my job to try and engage the students, interact with them, get them questioning me. I am the odd one out it seems.

The head of English at my school is a lovely lady that has a Masters degree in English. I often have to speak Thai with her as, if I dont, she wont understand what I am on about! Unfortunately this is common here. I have only met a handful of Thai English teachers that can actually have a conversation past the level of a 5 or 6 year old. I have to 'teach the teachers' sometimes and guess who are the ones that dont show up???!!!! You guessed it....the Thai English teachers!!! Why? Because its such a MASSIVE loss of face for them to be in a room with a native speaker.....I mean, what if I ask them a question? If I do everyone will see that the reality is that they CANNOT speak English!!! They are the teachers that most need to be there when I am 'teaching the teachers' What hope do the kids have? They see me once a week, twice if they are lucky. The rest of their exposure to English is through these numpties that cannot do their jobs properly.

I am looking forward to AEC opening. Thailand is slowly but surely starting to wake up to the fact that its not the centre of the universe. Its starting to realise that its not looking too good in comparision to its other ASEAN friends. It could go either way, but I am a bit cynical. I think Thailand will do what it always does, it will sweep things under the carpet, it will withdraw from a fight on a level playing field, a fight in which it will most surely ge a very bloody nose. AEC will be just a name, the Thais will find a way to get around all the horrible new rules that will show them up. It will be AEC on paper only. In reality nothing will change. The nepotism that is the cause of so much incomptence here will stay. The sad thing for Thailand is that talented people get cast aside by others with connections, or money. I have so many lovely and smart students in my classes....but so what? The system is against them. I just cannot see this place doing what is required to enable it to really, I mean really compete with places like Singapore. I hope I am wrong.

Am I being cynical? After reading headlines for years and years about how the educations system needs to change...and nothing happening...yes I am being cynical. I think the answer to the problem is clear. If you want an education.....go to Laos!

So most Thais cant speak English beyond the level of a 5 or six year old?? So let me ask you this..How many people in the UK can speak French or German or any other language beyond the level of a six year old?? I don't speak Thai beyond the level of a six year old but its not from lack of trying!

While the Thai educational system has many shortcomings, these type of surveys need to be taken with a pinch of salt!!

Many of us on this forum are married to Thais. If the education system is producing such robotic people incapable of critical thought then we need to ask the question why so many'educated' westerners marry Thais?????

The perfect educational system doesn't exist. We need to be culturally aware when analyzing the Thai system and remember that its developed from a different way of thinking. Let's not be arrogant and assume that Western systems are the best. I've just returned here from the UK. People are miserable there and struggling to survive. Compare that with the vibrancy and positive outlook of Thai's. Maybe we are the ones who have it all wrong????

I don't think many foreigners here marry Thai women for their astoundingly brilliant education. The survey doesn't say Thai's are robotic nor that they are stupid. It says that the Thai education system is at the bottom end of the scale. English speaking people have no need, on the whole, to speak French or German though quite a few learn the basics at school. It isn't necessary because English is the language of business across most of the developed world. Thai is spoken in ....... Thailand which is not renowned as being the center of the business world so English and Chinese become hugely more important as a medium of cross communication between its neighbors.

The OP is not talking about the happiness scale nor about Thai society nor does it say a Western systems are the best. However if knowledge is the end result of education I think on a general basis you will have a hard time persuading most people that a the Thai system is effective. The seasoning the Thai education system needs is not salt!

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa app

[timewilltell]

Year after year after year...we hear the same old tune about the education system here. Its funny in a sad kind of way. Thais love to call anyting they consider unfashionable or stupid as being 'Laos'......How ironic this is then.....

This REALLY needs to be sorted out NOW! I am working at a government school at the moment......not for much longer because I have had it! Thai schools are, in the main a joke. Thai teachers are dinosaurs that are still using teaching techniques that come from 1937. I often walk past the Thai teachers classes and more often than not they are sitting on their backsides with NO interaction with students! They simply write a load of info on the board and the kids copy it.....after that thier job is done!!!! I would be ashamed to teach in such a way. I feel it is my job to try and engage the students, interact with them, get them questioning me. I am the odd one out it seems.

The head of English at my school is a lovely lady that has a Masters degree in English. I often have to speak Thai with her as, if I dont, she wont understand what I am on about! Unfortunately this is common here. I have only met a handful of Thai English teachers that can actually have a conversation past the level of a 5 or 6 year old. I have to 'teach the teachers' sometimes and guess who are the ones that dont show up???!!!! You guessed it....the Thai English teachers!!! Why? Because its such a MASSIVE loss of face for them to be in a room with a native speaker.....I mean, what if I ask them a question? If I do everyone will see that the reality is that they CANNOT speak English!!! They are the teachers that most need to be there when I am 'teaching the teachers' What hope do the kids have? They see me once a week, twice if they are lucky. The rest of their exposure to English is through these numpties that cannot do their jobs properly.

I am looking forward to AEC opening. Thailand is slowly but surely starting to wake up to the fact that its not the centre of the universe. Its starting to realise that its not looking too good in comparision to its other ASEAN friends. It could go either way, but I am a bit cynical. I think Thailand will do what it always does, it will sweep things under the carpet, it will withdraw from a fight on a level playing field, a fight in which it will most surely ge a very bloody nose. AEC will be just a name, the Thais will find a way to get around all the horrible new rules that will show them up. It will be AEC on paper only. In reality nothing will change. The nepotism that is the cause of so much incomptence here will stay. The sad thing for Thailand is that talented people get cast aside by others with connections, or money. I have so many lovely and smart students in my classes....but so what? The system is against them. I just cannot see this place doing what is required to enable it to really, I mean really compete with places like Singapore. I hope I am wrong.

Am I being cynical? After reading headlines for years and years about how the educations system needs to change...and nothing happening...yes I am being cynical. I think the answer to the problem is clear. If you want an education.....go to Laos!

So most Thais cant speak English beyond the level of a 5 or six year old?? So let me ask you this..How many people in the UK can speak French or German or any other language beyond the level of a six year old?? I don't speak Thai beyond the level of a six year old but its not from lack of trying!

While the Thai educational system has many shortcomings, these type of surveys need to be taken with a pinch of salt!!

Many of us on this forum are married to Thais. If the education system is producing such robotic people incapable of critical thought then we need to ask the question why so many'educated' westerners marry Thais?????

The perfect educational system doesn't exist. We need to be culturally aware when analyzing the Thai system and remember that its developed from a different way of thinking. Let's not be arrogant and assume that Western systems are the best. I've just returned here from the UK. People are miserable there and struggling to survive. Compare that with the vibrancy and positive outlook of Thai's. Maybe we are the ones who have it all wrong????

If you had read my post properly you would have see that I was referring to THAI ENGLISH TEACHERS!!!!Is that hard for you to grasp? What? Its ok for teachers of language to not actually be able to speak that language?? And by the way, I am married to a Thai lady, she is smart and we have a son.....he is smart as well! I am NOT talking about the average Joe Thai......get it?

Oops! I don't have all day to read your novel about the Thai education system. Lighten up a bit!!Jai Yen!!

My post did move beyond that part of your 'article'. I was just making the point that sometimes westerners are arrogant and attempt to impose their values and systems on the rest of the world. Thailand has survived on its own for centuries so they must be doing something right!

Hmmm..... Somalia has also survived!

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[timewilltell]

Whilst getting bogged down in the semantics of being rated lowed than Laos.

Can Thailand change their system to become rated number 1 in the region and 10 in the world?

Well they could ..... But not in our lifetimes.

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