Would Ebola Make You Leave Chiang Mai

[Chicog]

I was watching channel news asia yesterday and they had a brief item from England. The commentator said that one of the English officials had said "if Ebola no wait when Ebola comes to England".

It came to England in August.

[Chiengmaijoe]

So my view is that you should look at Ebola similar as when SARS happened

Do not look similar to me.

In about 9 months SARS had about 8,000 cases and 7-800 deaths. Ebola already has 4,000 deaths in how many months?

For all the panic that ensued over SARS it turned out to be a pretty mild type of flu. Just over 8,000 infections worldwide, with only 775 deaths, 685 of which were in China. A regular flu kills about 35,000 people a year in the US, a few hundred thousand a year worldwide, mostly very young and the elderly. Ebola fatality rate is about 50%.-70%!

In the four main countries in Afrca that have Ebola, 13 a day are dying of Ebola, 404 a day die of diarrhoea, 552 of malaria, and 685 die each day from HIV/AIDS.

Nothing to with Chiang Mai, of course.

[Chiengmaijoe]

That's the point, can it be escaped from?

The likelihood of ebola reaching every country on the planet is 100% unless harsh immigration and screening processes are implemented, which doesn't seem to be on the agenda for western countries... Major population areas will be the first effected, suffering the highest mortality rates... The further away from large population zones you are, the better...

I think you've been reading too many comics. The likelihood of Ebola reaching every country on this planet is 0%. Screening or no screening.

Ebola has been around for a while, yet even without harsh immigration screening very few countries were ever affected. These viruses eventually peter out, and when it's all over and done with, far fewer people will have died of Ebola than will have died of diarrhoea, malaria or HIV/AIDS in the same period. HIV/AIDS is not news any more (people got bored of it) and malaria never will be in the news because it doesn't affect Europe or the US. As for diarrhoea ........ no one gives a sh#t.

Nothing to do with Chiang Mai, of course.

[Jaggg88]

No way. Thailand has already invented a cure.

Safest place in the world now Thailand has a cure - although once the news gets out all the infected ppl may flock here

[MW72]

So my view is that you should look at Ebola similar as when SARS happened

Do not look similar to me.

In about 9 months SARS had about 8,000 cases and 7-800 deaths. Ebola already has 4,000 deaths in how many months?

For all the panic that ensued over SARS it turned out to be a pretty mild type of flu. Just over 8,000 infections worldwide, with only 775 deaths, 685 of which were in China. A regular flu kills about 35,000 people a year in the US, a few hundred thousand a year worldwide, mostly very young and the elderly. Ebola fatality rate is about 50%.-70%!

In the four main countries in Afrca that have Ebola, 13 a day are dying of Ebola, 404 a day die of diarrhoea, 552 of malaria, and 685 die each day from HIV/AIDS.

Nothing to with Chiang Mai, of course.

It's nice to read a measured post with a bit of perspective. There are a lot of other things out there that are more likely to kill you. There are thousands of people dying from preventable diseases yet we don't seem to spend too much money trying to help these people. Because of the high mortality rate and horrific way in which victims die there is a lot of sensationalism and media attention and governments are reacting. We should be kicking up a stink about how many children die each year from preventable things like diarrhoea or starvation and not worrying too much about Ebola. Some good info on the NHS web site.

http://www.nhs.uk/conditions/ebola-virus/pages/ebola-virus.aspx

Carry on and don't panic. Take sensible precautions.

[Konini]

The Ebola outbreak appears to be a hoax and if that is the case, is of no concern.

http://www.vaccinationinformationnetwork.com/ebola-hoax-busted/

Of very great concern are however possible government measures in response to the outbreak!

http://www.vaccinationinformationnetwork.com/the-shape-of-things-to-come/

All these things are part of the psychopathic elites' genocidal agenda: real or fake diseases (HIV/AIDS, bird flu, swine flu, SARS, and now Ebola); chemtrails (they spray virtually every day - often in the morning and again in the evening near Hua Hin where I live), fluoride in school children's school milk to impair fertility) and vaccination programmes (vaccines are also laced with infertility-promoting substances such as polysorbate 80). Look up Kevin Galalae on Facebook.

They ought to get sacked - the whole lot of them! I mean, they haven't been very good at it have they? What, with some of those viruses, and with pretty much everybody in the whole world being vaccinated against something or the other, what a bunch of incompetents they must be, if their success rate is anything to go by.

If I were in charge of it, things would have been very different, you mark my words. The whole human race would be gone by now - totally and completely wiped out. All they've ever needed is someone who can actually do the job they get paid for being in control.

Gone, I tell you. Gone.

[Konini]

It's just been on Radio Tees that people coming into UK from West Africa direct or via other EU ports are to be screened effective Heathrow terminal 1 immediately, others as soon as.

As the incubation period is 3 weeks, and the carrier is only infectious when the symptoms actually appear, this would seem to be a more public-calming measure than anything else, or am I under-estimating the threat. I know the threat is real, but I've followed ebola with some kind of morbid interest since first reading about it during a fairly bit outbreak years and years ago, not because I was afraid that it would wipe out the human race, but more from the car-crash type fascination with it being such a gruesome way to die - I normally steer well away from anything even slighty gruesome, there are plenty of other people out there obsessed with gory details, my gentle brain doesn't need to be concerned with such things.

I was talking to Mr K about this earlier today, he's been talking to someone who may just be our new friend Sugarcane24 from my last post earlier today. The biggest difference I see between this and other outbreaks is that this seems to be the first time it has come to a major city (Lagos), which has seemingly had no major overall effects, it seems to have lasted longer than any of the previous outbreaks and it seems to be the first time that aid workers from outside the area have been infected (2 Americans last month who had both been working in-country, and a priest working in-country who returned home to Spain).

The man who died over the weekend in Dallas had recently been back home to see his family (in a village in western Africa), where he came into contact with an infected pregnant woman. I took my eye off the ball a bit, but I'm sure I read that he went to Accident and Emergency and was sent home even though staff knew of his recent travels. I think I read somewhere that he hadn't informed them inititally, his bad, although we don't know just how ill (fever, delirium, etc) he was so was he really well-placed to answer questions, but I'm sure that prior to him being discharged they (or someone at the hospital) was made aware of it.

There are two really good things about this outbreak of ebola; it isn't terribly easy to contract (in relation to airborne infections) and the mortality rate is much lower than it could be - I remember the first time I read about it and this awful but almost compulsive interest started, there was either a 92 or 93% chance of it killing you, while still horribly high, this particular strain has a much lower rate.

I'm no expert, I have no medical knowledge or anything similar, I just use the same common sense approach to this as I have done to everything else over the years, and have this quite shameful obsession with ebola.

I really can't see this being the bubonic plague of our times, although I'll keep a healthily open mind. And this has been another really good thread.

[CobraSnakeNecktie]

The fascinating aspect is how the virus is mutating. A decade ago it was too fast acting and would burn it self out easily.

Now it appears to be learning.

No doubt Thailand is a heck of a good petrie dish for such a virus. This scientist thinks the key vector is still animals such as fruit bats etc.

But for how long?

http://www.vox.com/2014/10/13/6959087/ebola-outbreak-virus-mutated-airborne

BTW Thailand has an enormous amount of bats.

If I ride my bicycle at night in the countryside with a headlight then swarms of them fly inches away from me to pick off insects in the lights beam.

The critical part of a sh$t storm Ebola scenario in Thailand would be passing the virus to critters in or near Thailand..

Edited October 14, 2014 by CobraSnakeNecktie

[Chicog]

The Ebola outbreak appears to be a hoax and if that is the case, is of no concern.

http://www.vaccinationinformationnetwork.com/ebola-hoax-busted/

Of very great concern are however possible government measures in response to the outbreak!

http://www.vaccinationinformationnetwork.com/the-shape-of-things-to-come/

All these things are part of the psychopathic elites' genocidal agenda: real or fake diseases (HIV/AIDS, bird flu, swine flu, SARS, and now Ebola); chemtrails (they spray virtually every day - often in the morning and again in the evening near Hua Hin where I live), fluoride in school children's school milk to impair fertility) and vaccination programmes (vaccines are also laced with infertility-promoting substances such as polysorbate 80). Look up Kevin Galalae on Facebook.

Don't forget to take your meds before the Alex Jones show, will you?

[Chicog]

The fascinating aspect is how the virus is mutating. A decade ago it was too fast acting and would burn it self out easily.

Now it appears to be learning.

No doubt Thailand is a heck of a good petrie dish for such a virus. This scientist thinks the key vector is still animals such as fruit bats etc.

But for how long?

http://www.vox.com/2014/10/13/6959087/ebola-outbreak-virus-mutated-airborne

BTW Thailand has an enormous amount of bats.

If I ride my bicycle at night in the countryside with a headlight then swarms of them fly inches away from me to pick off insects in the lights beam.

The critical part of a sh$t storm Ebola scenario in Thailand would be passing the virus to critters in or near Thailand..

Mosquitoes. Now *that* would be a problem.

[uptheos]

A lot of useful contributions, despite Joe saying it's nothing to do with Chiang Mai.

Some of the contributions are going into more detail of the ebola virus, which has been covered quite a lot on other threads.

Looking at a possible solitary 'Chiang Mai' scenario, where a person who is now a known carrier, has wandered around the city and finished up in one of the hospitals here.

Would you stay and would you carry on your 'normal' routine?

Would you go and where would you go to?

Could you go, even if you wanted or are you stuck?

Do you think there would be major panic as some posters have suggested?

Then thinking about your answer.......what if a second case turned up?

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

I was reading some mainstream U.S. medical journal and reports this morning on Ebola. A couple of interesting things:

1. there was a mention about the Texas authorities now having to figure out how to quarantine the DOG that belongs to the hospital worker who's now become infected, since animals apparently also can catch/spread the disease.

2. There was a statement at a big conference of U.S. pediatricians noting that while there have been official hospital isolation protocols well-established, there hasn't really been the same kind of attention given to lesser health care access points, like individual doctor's offices, clinics, etc. -- which aren't usually equipped with bio hazard suits and isolation wards. What are THEY supposed to do if someone comes in with a high fever, etc???

The suggestion was, to put the patient in an isolated room with water-proof bed covers, etc. and close the door. Then, the doctor is supposed to interview the patient from standing in the doorway, staying at least 3 feet away, to inquire about recent travel and other potential risk indicators. And then if approaching the patient, to only do so with full face mask and other protective gear -- until the medical status is clarified.

3. It was interesting to read all the teeth gnashing going on about HOW the health care worker at the Texas hospital became infected, and to read how the hospital had essentially closed its emergency department for the time being while re-evaluating its procedures and having to monitor/test a lot of potentially exposed personnel.

I have the impression of having read not too long back from the U.S. authorities of how their (my country's) health care system (unlike Africa) is capable of dealing with such outbreaks. But you begin to look at the tumult that just one, and now two cases have caused in the U.S., and things begin to look not quite so rosy.

[CobraSnakeNecktie]

^^ the answer is that narrow "hypothetical" scenario completely depends on other variables

Is there less ebola in other places? In other parts of SEA?

Are there new disturbing revelations about the virus?

What choices are available to the reader for places to flee?

What is the current delusional state of Thai govt?

What is N. John planning on doing?

Edited October 14, 2014 by CobraSnakeNecktie

[uptheos]

I was reading some mainstream U.S. medical journal and reports this morning on Ebola. A couple of interesting things: 1. there was a mention about the Texas authorities now having to figure out how to quarantine the DOG that belongs to the hospital worker who's now become infected, since animals apparently also can catch/spread the disease. 2. There was a statement at a big conference of U.S. pediatricians noting that while there have been official hospital isolation protocols well-established, there hasn't really been the same kind of attention given to lesser health care access points, like individual doctor's offices, clinics, etc. -- which aren't usually equipped with bio hazard suits and isolation wards. What are THEY supposed to do if someone comes in with a high fever, etc??? The suggestion was, to put the patient in an isolated room with water-proof bed covers, etc. and close the door. Then, the doctor is supposed to interview the patient from standing in the doorway, staying at least 3 feet away, to inquire about recent travel and other potential risk indicators. And then if approaching the patient, to only do so with full face mask and other protective gear -- until the medical status is clarified. 3. It was interesting to read all the teeth gnashing going on about HOW the health care worker at the Texas hospital became infected, and to read how the hospital had essentially closed its emergency department for the time being while re-evaluating its procedures and having to monitor/test a lot of potentially exposed personnel. I have the impression of having read not too long back from the U.S. authorities of how their (my country's) health care system (unlike Africa) is capable of dealing with such outbreaks. But you begin to look at the tumult that just one, and now two cases have caused in the U.S., and things begin to look not quite so rosy.

A very big point.

[harryfrompattaya]

Not sure why this question should be limited to Chiang Mai.

If it makes it there, it's in Thailand ...

It seems likely it will make it here so the question is how will this country DEAL with it.

If Ebola is here tell me how we can get back to America at that time their will be quarantines and remember we as America Citizens will be subject to them

[CobraSnakeNecktie]

There would be nothing more motivating than seeing normally calm and reserved Thai's shifting into in full blown panic mode

That would take steel nerves to stay put in Chiang Mai

[uptheos]

Not sure why this question should be limited to Chiang Mai.

If it makes it there, it's in Thailand ...

It seems likely it will make it here so the question is how will this country DEAL with it.

If Ebola is here tell me how we can get back to America at that time their will be quarantines and remember we as America Citizens will be subject to them

Good point harry, it's all very well saying we would leave, but will where we want to leave to, take us?

How restrictive would airlines out of Chiang Mai be?

Anyone feel that those protective suits, might not be in fashion in the hospitals?

[Jingthing]

Not sure why this question should be limited to Chiang Mai.

If it makes it there, it's in Thailand ...

It seems likely it will make it here so the question is how will this country DEAL with it.

If Ebola is here tell me how we can get back to America at that time their will be quarantines and remember we as America Citizens will be subject to them

I can't tell you anything.

It depends on how bad it might become in Thailand, in connecting countries, and in the USA.

If it starts to get bad, likely there would be a panic and people would try to rush out while they can.

I am not saying panic now but I am also not saying that some people who may do things that seem "paranoid" now may not turn out later to be seen as smart.

There is no big brother telling you what do to now (if anything) and who can really predict the future.

Edited October 14, 2014 by Jingthing

[uptheos]

There would be nothing more motivating than seeing normally calm and reserved Thai's shifting into in full blown panic mode

That would take steel nerves to stay put in Chiang Mai

Indeed anyone who has flown or been in a crowded elevator knows how panicky they can be just to get off.

IF ebola were brought into Chiang mai by a caucasian, would there be a backlash?

[CobraSnakeNecktie]

^^ if that happened Expedia would crash

[harryfrompattaya]

Just looking for visibly sick people hardly covers it. As said, people can enter without symptoms and get sick later.

I think the cost in Private Hospital could run at 30 million Baht up front or you died for sure

[uptheos]

^^ if that happened Expedia would crash

Tend to agree

[mesquite]

I was reading some mainstream U.S. medical journal and reports this morning on Ebola. A couple of interesting things: 1. there was a mention about the Texas authorities now having to figure out how to quarantine the DOG that belongs to the hospital worker who's now become infected, since animals apparently also can catch/spread the disease. 2. There was a statement at a big conference of U.S. pediatricians noting that while there have been official hospital isolation protocols well-established, there hasn't really been the same kind of attention given to lesser health care access points, like individual doctor's offices, clinics, etc. -- which aren't usually equipped with bio hazard suits and isolation wards. What are THEY supposed to do if someone comes in with a high fever, etc??? The suggestion was, to put the patient in an isolated room with water-proof bed covers, etc. and close the door. Then, the doctor is supposed to interview the patient from standing in the doorway, staying at least 3 feet away, to inquire about recent travel and other potential risk indicators. And then if approaching the patient, to only do so with full face mask and other protective gear -- until the medical status is clarified. 3. It was interesting to read all the teeth gnashing going on about HOW the health care worker at the Texas hospital became infected, and to read how the hospital had essentially closed its emergency department for the time being while re-evaluating its procedures and having to monitor/test a lot of potentially exposed personnel. I have the impression of having read not too long back from the U.S. authorities of how their (my country's) health care system (unlike Africa) is capable of dealing with such outbreaks. But you begin to look at the tumult that just one, and now two cases have caused in the U.S., and things begin to look not quite so rosy.

A very big point.

I think it's good that Ebola has arrived in the US and the general public is scared.. That may motivate the US medical community, probably the best in the world, to find a cure and vaccine. As long as Ebola is outside the US borders, the US public within doesn't really care much

Edited October 14, 2014 by mesquite

[Konini]

I'd still stick with hunkering down, watching and seeing.

Any transport hubs would surely be the most dangerous places to be in any infectious disease outbreak wouldn't they? And that's if travel were allowed. Should it be one case or two case, I don't really care (apart from having sympathy for the victims and those who are charged with treating them and disposing of the bodies should they die). If it became a large outbreak, I would hope that the governments of all countries would have a way of isolating the town or city in question, at least initially to assess the facts and options, which would effectively take our choice away from us.

TallGuyJohninBkk made an excellent point in his last sentence. It would appear that what happened in Dallas is totally appalling and unacceptable - the emergency precautions and drills in place for this kind of thing seem to have been totally ignored. The article I read (I'm sorry, I don't have a source, but I know I read it) said that they were aware he had been in west Africa when they sent him home, then a nurse of all people in full haz mat gear - the only way she could possibly have contracted it was when disrobing, unless there is something far more disturbing about ebola that we aren't being told about. I'm not a conspiracy theorist, and I certainly believe that there are some things the general public should never be made aware of, and note that this is an outside possibility of this.

All we can hope is that this whole strain of the virus peters out, like all of the others before. The big difference is in cases outside of Africa. A couple of months ago, I think pretty much everybody had heard of ebola and had a general idea what it was, but now they know much more about it. It's going to be a fairly big job for governments to prevent panic outbreaking along with the virus.

Should there be a massive worldwide outbreak of it, and really the only way it's going to be in Chiang Mai is if that's the case, then here will be just as safe as anywhere else. Or not. It all depends on the Big Fella Upstairs and if he has your name on the clipboard for today.

The real worry is the long incubation time - up to 3 weeks. That means for 3 weeks you are in perfect health, no different from any other day, except that the virus is incubating inside you. Then in, say 2 weeks you start feeling a bit off and go to the doctor or a hospital (if you didn't just assume it was the flu, or if it lasted a few more days then dengue) and that's where it will start. As soon as you show symptoms, you are infectious, and whilst being infectious (that's why you're seeking help) you've just travelled from your home, maybe on public transport, to seek medical attention. By the time you finally get to see a doctor, how many people will you have come into contact with? How many surfaces did you touch with your sweaty palms (you would have a fever, remember), how many people may you have infected without anyone knowing. Can the health care provider guarantee that they can recall to their premises every single person who was in the clinic or hospital at the same time as you and for a couple of hours after you were whisked away into isolation, in order to have them put on high alert for symptoms over the next 3 weeks?

If handled well, it shouldn't be a problem, but of course we know that it won't be handled well, not here, not anywhere. Well, perhaps in Japan because they are very good at doing this kind of thing and the population listen to and strictly follow government announcements. But, and in these circumstances I always think back to the people sitting around me at school as being the general public, many people won't get the government message to stay home and phone for help rather than venturing outside and risking spreading it, and then there will be those who deliberately go to the doctor's surgery or hospital because they are special and deserve special treatment (we all know people like that), and there will be those who, in delirium, aren't thinking straight and just know that they need medical help so stumble their way out for it, or those who just panic and don't think about what the government has told them to do if they have any symptoms. I could pretty much tell you who from my classmates would do what, and it's a scary picture.

I don't know if you need a blood sample or if you can do it by a bit of spit to do the test for ebola. If there is a major outbreak, the authorities will have to have teams to travel to the home of the person affected and take a sample, give them information and tell them to lock the door and not open it to anyone unless they are in full haz mat gear.

I really can't see there being an outbreak here and nowhere else, but it is possible with the long incubation period and the high number of backpackers who, by their nature, are sociable and are used to coming down with a bit of a fever when travelling so may not do anything about it immediately (remember when you were that age and going out and having a good time was more important than staying in bed, even if you are a bit sick) and unintentionally infect several others before seeking help. So easy to do, and this will be a big risk particularly with the young and invincible and those who drag themselves out of bed and go to work because they can't afford to do otherwise. I used to send people home and tell them to stay there for a few days rather than have them spreading their germs around and consequently having half of the office out of action, but the people I worked with had a nice snuggly bed to go home to and weren't going to starve if they didn't go to work. And I wouldn't take no for an answer. (Unfortunately, apart from myself I'm pretty sure I'd be on the mark to say that nobody in my class turned into a workaholic)

But all in all, having considered all of the options available, I'm still sticking with staying here. And hoping that my name isn't on the clipboard.

[CobraSnakeNecktie]

So many unknown variables

Let's say your an American and the S really hits the proverbial fan.

Just wait it out and there will be a C-130 at CNX to whisk you away.

and good point by Mesquite... Once again the arguably flawed USA and CDC are probably going to quietly save humanity.

[Chicog]

It would be quite amusing to walk around Chiang Mai in an NBC suit at the moment just to see the reaction.

I'm just amazed Thailand hasn't had it's first "Ebola victim" yet.

Someone must have had a fever and the squirts by now?

[cloudhopper]

If there ever is a true pandemic the best strategy will be to stay as autonomous as possible until it burns out. There will be nowhere to go.

[CobraSnakeNecktie]

^^ would probably still want to avoid hot pockets of outbreak

If I was in West Africa I would want to get the flock out of there.

One of the few circumstances that I would consider traveling to North Korea.

Edited October 14, 2014 by CobraSnakeNecktie

[Ulysses G.]

I think it's good that Ebola has arrived in the US and the general public is scared..

That is probably because you are over here.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

If the epidemiological sh ever hits the fan here in Thailand, I seriously doubt the U.S. or (insert name of other country) would likely be evacuating its expats back to home terrain.

They'd likely be freaked out enough already domestically at that point, and the last thing they'd be anxious to do would be to import a lot of folks (albeit their own countrymen) from another country where Ebola had run amok.